Angel Hernandez makes MLB's worst call in four years
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- Опубликовано: 29 апр 2024
- #mlb #talkinbaseball #baseball #angelhernandez #texas #rangers #houston #astros
0:00 Intro
1:32 Worst calls
21:10 Minor leagues
26:49 Twin pitches
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I’m a simple man. I see Angel Hernandez being called out for his unsatisfactory performance, I click. (Also, Jimmy looking well!)
Hahahaha same 😂
Do you think MLB is keeping him around just for rage bait?
@@ConnorGlass121I feel like the mlb did something to angel and he told them if he doesn’t get fired he won’t tell. That’s why he just trolls the game when he’s umping
KNOWING that MLB's umpire association cannot get rid of OR terminate him, Angel Hernandez is in my opinion actually doing all these bad calls on PURPOSE!!!!.........C'MON, I understand missing one call, maybe two...........but missing all three is absolutely either stupid or purposely!!!!!!
Ong😅
Ah yes, another Jomboy episode of "How much does Angel Hernandez suck at his job today?"
My favorite show.
My favorite show, that I hope gets cancelled, not Jomboy, but the Angel part.
This will run longer than The Simpsons.
New episodes weekly
There should be an affiliate channel. Angel Hernandez Today by Jomboy. The offseason may not be that great but I am sure there would be some video somewhere of Angel on vacation
The answer is, more than yesterday.
Dear Jomboy,
When discussing these Angel calls, Passan said on ESPN that “Angel is not worst” and that “there are umps who are worse at balls & strikes.”
CB Bucknor came to mind. But I’d love to see a deep dive of which umpires are the worst at balls and strikes.
I’m a pro-labor guy, but these umpires make me blame the union. So many dudes umping in AAA who have worked hard and deserve a chance to work in the bigs. But these old dudes won’t get out of their way.
There needs to be a mechanism by which low performing umps can be sent down and successful minor league umps can be promoted.
Thanks for your work. You are great at your job.
There needs to be a mechanism to fire bad umpires…… it’s called tearing up the ‘union’ nonsense
Honestly, the league should just tell.the umpires union that they have a choice. They can allow bad umpires to be sent down or they can not have their contract renewed once it expires. We don't NEED umpires. Everything they do can be done by a computer and one person to switch the baseball now and then.
Make it clear that the decision is to lose the bad umps or for all the umps to be out of work.
How much of the crap Angel Hernandez gets is because he isn't a good communicator and doesn't handle criticism well?
@@lakingsgeekI think he’s just the easy example when saying “Bad Umpire”. He became a household name after the fan called him out during the game on the mic and then he became the scapegoat when he missed I think 6 calls that got overturned at 1st in an ALDS game.
I don't care what anyone says....UNIONS suck.
The same reason Congress sucks. Bunch of old people who are inefficient and won't retire
I love how major league pitchers see an umpire is absolutely favoring a location, and then they abuse it. 😂
It’s almost a thing of manipulative beauty. 😂
It’s not abuse. It’s playing the game as it is. You may not be getting strike calls on the inside. You have to take advantage
You should be pulled if you didn't do it. Also in a vacuum of a single game all I want is for the ump to call the game fair for both sides. If Angel is calling a pitch a foot off the base a strike it should be called all game for all 51/54outs.
Then fire the ump if that bad trend continues
I think it’s actually neat looking at all the ways they try and play the field in that regard. That’s why I love jomboy he does such a good job at breaking it all down for the casual fan
It's part of the game for sure but it's usually nowhere near this egregious
Kyle Schwarber going off on Angel Hernandez is still one my favorite moments in baseball history.
One of the all-time greatest vents.
For both sides!
The commentary makes it great 😁
It's just bad Angel
@@ronmo671 You have to be better, you have to
Dude... "You're not professional"???? Are you kidding? Your absolutely killing it. I've learned more about baseball in the last 3 years from your videos than the previous 37 just watching the game and listening to professional commentary.
You're not wrong the only reason I came back to baseball cause of jomboy lol
Humor is next level as well. Narrates himself... "I'm gonna take a sip of my coffee."
The 1.4 means 1.4 feet from the middle of the plate
Unless my math is wrong, that's 8 inches outside. Unacceptable.
@@pierrelevasseur2701yep. By my count that's 8.3 inches outside of the zone
@@Felix.Dragon. a little less cuz you’d have the radius of the ball to take into account. Unless that’s already accounted for idk. But either way it’s baffling how this is allowed to continue when you look at the tech they have in cricket, football, tennis etc
@@dabearsfan9 you're right I hadn't considered the ball.
@@pierrelevasseur2701 it's 8.3 inches at the center of the ball, 6.8 from the inside edge of the ball (what umpire auditor reported)
Home plate is 17” wide, to be off by 6.78” gives you an error of 39.88%. Tell me another job that lets you have nearly 40% error, 3 times in a row?
Welcome to the Union!
Politics
Weather forecasters
Crypto trader
I'd go so far as to argue that measuring from the centerline, your max acceptable strike distance would be 8.5" out so if you call one 6.78" off the edge (or 8.5 + 6.78 = 15.28" off centerline), you can up that error % to:
(Estimated - Actual) / Actual = (15.28 - 8.5) / 8.5 = 6.78 / 8.5 = 79.8%
Just my two cents on the whole monopoly thing:
What is happening is what always happens when these sorts of acquisitions are made / empires are built. It starts with some positive stories about "Oh, they're being so nice and improving things", but then when the job is done that turns quickly. It becomes obvious that those positives were there to facilitate a means to an end. A very pre-determined end.
Monopolies are always a bad thing, and the whole "one baseball" thing is pretty scary and not good.
Otherwise... pitch challenge needs to be implemented in MLB ASAP exactly as it is in the minors, and your point about the umpire adjustment is super valid and great forward thinking.
It will absolutely be used to crush the union and return things to the way they were, but possibly worse, with even less competition between minor league clubs. It can't be good for the major league affiliates for all of their farm teams to be owned by the same people as their competitors', either.
The enshittification of the minor leagues.
I see Angel Hernandez performance and think maybe I could be an umpire too like Leslie Neilson in the naked gun when he was undercover just making calls up to make the crowd cheer.
I think the ultimate irony will be branding the robo umps as, “Angels,” come to save baseball.
Sport media goofball-ish guy by day, hardcore baseball data analyst by night. I like it
The only fucking explanation for this is that Angel is only looking at where the catchers glove is after he makes the catch. Theres no way hes watching the ball and missing them THIS badly
He just doesn't pay attention during the game.
He's like a thumb headed cop on a power trip..Can't ever admit wrongdoing
He flinches at the pitches. Previous jomboy videos have pointed out him closing his eyes.
Angel: Uhhh duh? That's where the ball ends up, soooo....
Only if you're being kind. Let's be real, Angel is probably high and guessing.
We need a Jomboy HotOnes episode. 🙏
I think that would be one of their worst performing videos for views...
@@karlcarlsburg9641 ok... good talk. Have a great day.
Nahhh Jomboy's best at being a conduit between sports and the "at least semi interested in sports" crowd. He is a beautiful lens through which to view sports events; not something we need to inspect on its own (imo)
As much as I'd poop myself and immediately watch if one did come out lol
@@xhappybunnyx I was mostly kidding, but would 💯 watch that episode
Crazy how there are at least 28 home plate umpires, yet it's the same 2 or 3 (typically Angel) that are constantly blowing game changing calls
at least 28? I guess that's right. MLB has 70 umpires and it really is just a few outliers.
Don't forget about cb Buckner he isn't far behind angel
@@stevenlindberg8347 wow, he's still around? How?! He was a known for being a terrible ump when I was a kid and now my kids are adults.
@@JihadMeAtHelllo oh yeah just saw him making bad calls a couple days ago got to see him take a pitch off the face mask that dazed him normally I wouldn't wish that to happen to someone but have heard at least angel is a nice guy but Buckner has a history of also being an asshole
Maybe both teams for angel Hernández games when he’s the home plate umpire, both teams refuse to take the field and protest the game because he’s terrible. Maybe it’ll work. Maybe not. Might as well try. The worst you’ll get is maybe a forfeit the game.
Sounds like a dumb idea to me but why not.
@@wyomingptt it’s basically the same thing as a worker strike. Game starts both managers go out together and protest the game. We aren’t playing with no ump.
Early enough in the season might not matter in the long run, might be worth it.
You don't have enough faith in Angel. He can make game-ruining calls from every umping position, not just behind the plate.
@@thepaperbowser you’re not wrong there lol but at least it wouldn’t be every single pitch
Really enjoyed the live use of stats here. Would love to see some more dedicated content in the same vein as your "Worst Calls" segment.
I'm happy to chat with y'all about Diamond Baseball Holdings, "One Baseball", and the sketchy stuff MLB has been doing all the way into the indy ball aka Partner League area, I've been telling this story for a couple years now. Happy to give y'all some background.
you got a video about it on your channel? im fascinated.
Replying to boost. Would love to get some insider info.
@@FaustoTheBoozehound same man. I never knew about this and I can only suspect an end game that’s less than altruistic
@@n_a8917RUclipsr "The Touchback" has a series on the MiLB takeover.
@@n_a8917 Hey! I haven't posted on my own channel about it yet, since it only recently started overlapping with what I actually cover, but this channel I found called The Touchback just did a video that's the best I've seen on the issue to this point: ruclips.net/video/3JbrJSt7EZA/видео.htmlsi=wgAwUAH9eYViB1xp Diamond Baseball Holdings comes in during the latter half of the video
Channeling his inner Eric Gregg on those calls
PLEASE just put a green light/red light indicator in the umps' masks to get balls and strikes right. It really impacts the game and the best pitchers/best hitters shouldn't be hurt because of good control or a good eye.
I still want the ump to convey balls and strikes, just with the level of accuracy modern technology already gives me on TV.
Jimmy, you're looking happy and healthy, brother. 1:20 dude Conan killed hot ones.
How would Jimmy (and/or Jake) do on Hot Ones, I wonder?
"Did they play a home and away?"
Yeah, for some reason MLB decided that the Rangers and Astros should play each other SEVEN TIMES in the first fifteen games on the season.
I absolutely love these "how I find out stuff" videos.
The system shown in AAA is awesome, exactly like pro tennis! Pivotal questions are answered within seconds
During the statcast era,
Which pitchers has gotten the most strikes called, when it's actually a ball.
Which Batter has gotten the most strikes called, it's actually a ball.
Which pitcher has gotten the most balls called, when it was actually a strike
Which batter has gotten the most balls called, when it was actually a strike.
I think the answer to the second one is Aaron Judge, Foolish Bailey did a video on this on his channel a while back. Umps struggle to adjust to his height and make wrong calls on low pitches to him a lot. I'd be curious about the first one though.
Oh nice, you showed a sample of the ABS/challenge system. I think it's great. Doesn't take much time, and you often see how close some of the calls are. When the pitch misses, it even shows everyone by how much. The fun part is that we get a spoiler in the press box since the Hawkeye graphic shows up in real time. (We can also see the times when they should have challenged.)
Also, whenever a call is upheld, I always want the umpire to do some little Frank Drebin/Savannah Bananas thing. "The strike call is upheld... IN YO' FACE!"
I love and fully support your twin pitches hobby. Also, thank you so much for walking us through how to use baseball savant. You should produce a tutorial series.
Jimmy!! Congratulations to all of you on the new partnership! I'm not sure why this is, but i may never have watched talkin' baseball before even though I've seen everything else you do. (baggage breakdowns and geoguessr baby!!) But sometimes with sports, because I'm still learning, I look for the sports people who chit chat one on one with me and examine situations with curiosity. Just a chit chat about Angel and doing a bunch of different "tests" on the internet. If the new partnership made it so that this talkin baseball and podcast "format" was my first recommendation on my home feed suddenly, that's a good partnership.
Can we get fans league wide to protest Angel Hernandez please ?
That may be the only way to ditch him, as sadly you can't boycott his games as they don't announce what games an umpire calls pregame do to gambling issues.
“I’m bad at math.”
3:45 “An *eighth* of a…. 🤷🏻♂️”
You gotta respect a man who recognizes his weaknesses openly lol, love Jomboy
These have become my favorite thing Jomboy Media has been putting out recently. These are so informational and entertaining!
I love “jimmy’s 3 things”. Keep it up man it’s one of my favorites
it’s NEVER a good thing when a single entity owns all of a specific thing. that’s my philosophy
I'm shocked to hear that Angel Hernandez is bad at calling balls and strikes. Shocked I say.
My Favorite Jomboy stuff is pitch analysis. Comparing pitches, pitch sequences, etc. Great stuff!
The Palencia high pitch you have to remember was after hours of a rain delay on a Sunday night in an 8-1 game with 1 out in the 9th. That ump clearly just wanted to go home and was calling anything close a strike.
That Peterson to Maile one might be the worst I've seen even though it statistically isn't. The ump was legit closer to the batters ass than the plate with a lefty pitcher lmao you legit can't get any further away from the pitch than that ump
Nice shout out to Conan that was an amazing ep
The outro question of "is this happening more to my team than other teams" really resonates with me as a Mariners fan...
The Event in Question : Consistently losing games we should be winning on paper.
The Answer After Analysis : Yes.
Jomboy- “my job is evaluating video/stats all day so to break the monotony, in my spare time I search for video/stat profiles that are doppelgängers of each other but have different names.” God bless ya, Jomboy.
That pitch challenge will be the best thing that would happen to the MLB, it will negate outrageous calls and frustration from batters
For sure. I think batters (and probably hitting coaches and fans, for that matter) forget how large the strike zone actually is. People think it's the size of the plate, but it's actually about three inches larger because the center of the ball can be outside the zone and still be a strike.
Never gonna happen because seeing a manager/player tossed is something everyone wants to see. They already eliminated human error for double plays, fair balls etc. They know sports fans thrive on the rage that umps ignite. Hernandez is probably just a patsy in a bigger scheme given his tenure.
Could cut ejections down quite a bit too.
It’s ridiculous. Just use robo-calls and skip the middle step.
Wyatt Langford has been getting calls like this all year. It’s like the umps never give the benefit of the doubt to rookies
Seems that way. He also takes them fairly well also.
I was planning on skimming thru this episode, and before I knew it, it was over...Good stuff jomboy, keep up the good work.
Love your work, Jimmy!!
I interviewed for a data tracking job for the former Rome Braves affiliate (they rebranded to the Emperors) and they wanted to pay me $10hr. Idk if fair pay is something that can be validated past that article.
I think the Angel Hernandez decades long shit show is baseball’s biggest unsolved mystery. There has to be something else that we just don’t know about this guy.
he has the pee tape
He's actually Kennesaw Mountain Landis's long-lost grandson
*spongebob rainbow handwave* unionssss
At this point he has to be doing it on purpose.
Its called a Union
We need something like this show on JM Football.
I went to see my local triple A team twice last week and there were a couple of challenges to pitches, the system worked amazingly fast and really helped make it feel like all the calls were fair and correct. I’ve been a fan of robo umps in the past but the challenge system feels like the best way to do it. It keeps the spirit of the game and helps make everything more accurate
Angle finally did it. He got his name and incredible in the same sentence.
The new Robo umpire system should be called.
A - Autonomous
N - Neutral
G - Game
E - Enhancement
L - Logic
Or
A - Accurate
N - Networked
G - Geometric
E - Evaluation
L - Lens
oh shit! it's been a long time since I've seen any Jomboy video. Just been on audio. Lookin good Jimmy!
These analytics breakdowns you're doing every week are awesome.
Jimmy coming to the realization that Wyatt got fucked on almost the same pitch a week prior was a cathartic experience as a Rangers fan. I feel like I've been going crazy, kid has been getting fucked by the umps all year, it's so weird to watch. His zone just seems bigger than everyone else in the lineup.
Why do most umps insist on setting up pre-pitch anywhere but over the middle of the plate? It drives me nuts.
You're new to officiating aren't you. So here's some help. Umpires are trained to work from the slot because one can see the ball better. Also, foul balls that go straight back will not hit them. Go ahead and umpire directly over the catcher's head if he's set up over the middle of the plate and see how well that goes.
@@willowbrook2717: Well, okay. I guess you told me, didn't you?
@@willowbrook2717Google Pat Hoberg. He does literally exactly what you are describing right now and guess what? He’s the best ump in the game. You old head dipshits are ruining the sport and it’ll be a blessing when the automated ball/strike system fixes this.
@@willowbrook2717 Verticality of calls might be worse, but horizontally it should be much better if umpires consistently set up in the middle of the plate.
@@brianwilson73 get rekt
Love this series
Really cool analysis, Jomboy. Question (maybe someone knows): would this analysis only show outside pitches to RH batters ? I guess to add worst call on outside pitches to LH batters , need to do repeat exercise w min_plate < .8 etc ?
Angel is great for baseball, just as Joe West was. Fans and teams need a common enemy
Oddly I agree with this sentiment. The human element in baseball is why makes it great. Whether good or bad characters…
No way. Umpires should umpire, not make themselves into the story. There are plenty of stories about players out there for people to root for or against.
A bot reposted your comment (@ aliceholmes4952)
Not huge into baseball but love stats and this is fascinating. Subbed
Check Game 6 of The 1997 NLCS between The Braves and Marlins...where home plate umpire Eric 'Im in a hurry to hit The Hometown Buffet' Gregg basically gifted Marlins' pitcher Livan Hernandez 16 strikeouts. Some of those pitches were literally a foot off the plate.
Gregg and Angel H. are indeed two of The Worst Umps in the history of MLB.
The chalk of the batters box is part of the strike zone
😁
You may be able to find isolated examples of umpires making worse calls than Angel, but how many of them do it as consistently as Angel?
Regarding the first part:
1.4 would presumably feet be off the center of the plate. Strike zone was calculated at
Absolutely love Adam getting a shoutout on Jomboy
@9:38 Something that I've noticed about Francisco Alvarez since he got called up, the dude is a master at stealing strikes.
No matter how far out of the zone he catches the ball, he will quickly move his glove back over the plate to fool the umpire. More often than not, he gets that strike called.
Angel just out there guessing. I should set up a petition for a live stream eye exam on Angel hernandez 😂😂
The minor league thing is weird because some people have no issue but diamond holdings literally stole my local Mississippi braves and moved them to Georgia, while still being named the Mississippi braves.
Very interesting video. Please keep up your good work.
Thank God there isnt video replay of my work and someone like jomboy analyzing it. lol.
Rizzo: *walking to first after HBP*
Angel: "Strike!"
Jimmy riffing on baseball is just a good watch every time. No matter the subject, it's just cool to see how people watch and react to the little things in the game that a lot of people miss.
EDIT: Riffin' Baseball: Jimmy's Three Things
Jimmy, this is why my love for baseball shines above the others. This wealth of data and you also appreciating why it’s so amazing.
Not defending Angel but I haven’t seen one person mention this fact since this game. The strike zone is 3-D. We’re only seeing and measuring the ball distance from home plate AFTER it hits the catchers glove. This pitcher is throwing a pitch that is going right to left. Maybe from Angel’s perspective it’s catching the front corner of the strike zone as it doesn’t matter where the pitch ends up. Same is true for example, a curveball that gets buried in the dirt by the time it gets to the catcher. It can still be a strike as long it passed through the zone. These pitches look awful though for sure and likely still missed the zone based on how far they ended up outside but likely not as much as what’s being measured and put out publicly.
I’m all for the pitch challenge being implemented immediately and for long term sake not renewing ump’s contracts until the union concedes to some sort of system of sending these bad umps down and calling up younger umps to give them a chance
One thing statcast can do that Jimmy doesn't show here is that it does track the entire trajectory of the pitch. I looked that Langford pitch up that night and checked out the 3d track. That pitch was a cutter, so a fastball with a little movement away from the hitter. I agree with you regarding what Angel might have *thought* he saw, but a more active umpire would have seen that ball left the strike zone before it was even over the dirt around home plate, let alone at the strike zone.
nobody is mentioning the 3D zone because it's so far off the plate it never sniffed the zone. Weak excuse for the worst ump in history who somehow has tenure.
You are correct sir. Very late break and 2 of those 3 pitches may have caught the plate
The measurement is from when it hits the front plane of the plate, not when it reaches the cather's mitt.
Game 2 of Braves Phillies this season. Max fried threw strike 3 damn near down the middle of the box and umpire called it a ball…. He didn’t make it threw the first inning after that
When a pitch comes across home plate at an angle the way these do, should the graphic on the screen light up before it hits the catchers glove? Isn't a ball or strike determined by where the ball crosses the front plane of homeplate? Not back where the ball is caught??
Hey giving Adam a shoutout.(MLB the show streamer) He's the one who asked for the Rizzo overlay.
Jomboy, Have they changed the strike zone? It use to be be at the letters of the shirt, and now it looks like it is just above the belt. Did I miss something? Just asking. Love your page. Bill.
Something you touched on before that I'd love to see a deeper dive into is pitches seen per at-bat. Is there a correlation to batting success there? What sort of value does an at-bat grinder create?
Angel Hernandez/CB Buckner are by far the worst umpires in decades. But the worst call? I know hyperbole works to get clicks, but Eric Gregg’s entire 1997 NLCS Game 5 was the worst called game ever, with strike calls individually being worse than Angel’s calls behind the plate. Worst individual call ever that had actual consequences (not an 8-1 game in April), is Don Denkinger safe call at first base that would have rightly won the 85 World Series for the Cardinals. As a result it led to the Royals coming back to win Game 6 and then winning the series in seven.
Regardless of hyperbole, keep up the great analysis Jomboy. Love your baseball content.
Glad someone else remembers Eric Greg’s performance. Angel has nothing on that.
Jimmy really briefly mentioned old school umps basing their ball/strike calls on everything but the actual pitch, I would love to see that explored more. I recently went back and watched a bunch of games from the late 2000s and definitely got this impression. Basically if the pitcher hit the glove where the catcher was set up, youre getting a strike no matter what. Jonathan Lucroy gamed this for like an entire season, where he would just set up 6 inches outside the strike zone and as a result steal strikes at a huge rate. Same thing but in reverse for when they miss their spot, you could miss dead center in the strike zone, but if the catcher had to reach for it, ball.
Eric Gregg in the playoffs vs the Braves has at least 7 of the top 10 worst punch outs of all time.
17" plate + 2.92" diameter baseball = 19.92" wide strike zone
19.92"/12 = 1.66'
1.66'/2 = 0.83' (which means strike zone is + or - 0.83' from plate center)
1.4'-0.83' = 0.57'
0.57'*12 = 6.84" outside strike zone
20:32 "That crew..." 😆
Jomboy: “i’m bad at math”. spends first 5 minutes of the episode doing math 😂
Was clicking around on baseball reference and found an interesting stat that I feel like you could could do an interesting deep dive on and find others easily and make it fun. Fact the last HR that Jake Arrieta gave up was the last HR that Buster Posey on the same pitch
I don't understand why people dismiss automation calls. Computers in real time can call a pitch perfect every time letting the umps keep an eye on other things
Totally thought that said "twin pitchers with different names" and I'm like "yeah, that's how names work"
Watched this live and instantly thought jomboy lol
Curious - Is there a limit to the amount of challenges a team/pitcher gets on the ABS?
Great show Jomboy!!! Loved it! 🔝
I think it's his depth perception. He is mentally placing the zone a foot or so in front of where it is, so he sees a pitch being in the "zone" in front of the batter, and then breaks outside so that it's truly a ball.
is there a noticeable difference in how catchers frame pitches when the umps have the traditional over shoulder stance vs when it’s the modern era move with the catcher stance?
Very happy to hear your voice after years of absentia relevence!
I have had several coaches and umpires state that positioning - like Angel and others do - over the catcher's shoulder nearest the batter decreases their accuracy in calling the outside pitch. can you research that on the stats machine?
That +/- 0.83 is the lateral position from the center of the plate, in feet. The plate is 17 inches wide, and a baseball has a radius of about 1.5 inches. Since only a tiny edge of the baseball has to clip the edge of the plate for it to be a strike, that means there's a 20 inch wide swath where the ball can be considered a strike. Statcast position logs the position of the center of the baseball. 20 inches / 12 inches = 1.6666 feet. Divide that by 2 to get your ~0.83 feet since they consider 0 to be the center.
On April 17, Jay’s vs New York. There were multiple pitches that were almost 7” off the plate.
I absolutely love this show.
Topic idea - Labatt Park is the "oldest continually operating baseball grounds in the world", with a history dating back to 1877. Since December 31, 1936, Labatt Park has been owned by the City of London.
As an engineer when he said .4 I was like 4-3/4”! Haha
For the twin pitches, I wonder how much of that is an overlap in the respective break ranges of the pitches more than the actual pitches being the same. One pitcher's cutter may have a median break of a certain value, and another's slider may have a very different median break, but those two may overlap on opposite sides of their respective ranges. So when you find "twin pitches", it would be interesting to then compare all of the cutters from that one pitcher to all of the sliders from the other one to see what the break distributions look like. Are they really always similar, or are they mostly different with rare cases of overlap?
This explains why I suck at that pitch recognition game on savant