Hey GrayFurnace. Excellent tutorial video. I have a Rheem two stage furnace. I decided to go with two stage for several different reasons One was the guy who installed it did a load calculation on my house. You don’t see to many doing that. He also indicated that it’s better to have a furnace run longer than short bursts. I had just gutted my house and redid plumbing, electrical and HVAC. I thought it was highly efficient. I also installed new high efficiency windows and insulation. I’m very mechanical and get involved in all aspects of repair work. I have personally seen bad HVAC people just slap a 180,000 btu furnace in a house that would be better with a 90,000 btu.
Planning to replace my Honeywell with a control pad that has swing control, which allows you to program +/- degrees for any set temperature, making the AC/Heater less sensitive to temperature fluctuations, thus reducing the number of cycles per hour. LuxPRO PSP511LC 5-2 Day Deluxe Programmable Thermostat
Thanks for the information you are posting. We have a modern furnace for quite sometime now that replaced an old furnace with the old-style thermostat. I always struggled to agree with the new electronic thermostats way of timing a furnace-on cycle. I also disagree that the manual instructs to set mine to six cycles per hour. I dislike so much hearing the gas valve go on and off during a heating cycle. I have set mine over a long period of time from six cycles, to five, four, three, two and finally back to three cycles per hour. I have also done extensive time research with a stopwatch during all this time. What I found, is that the new electronic thermostats artificially control the furnace on cycle; let me explain. For example, for a particular cold day of 15°F ambient temperature, when it is set at three cycles per hour the gas on time is about 14-17 minutes long. When it is set up two cycles per hour, The furnace gas valve on time may be from 21 to 24 minutes long with AN obvious longer temperature gap between the on and off cycle. In my experience, I keep three cycles in temperatures above ambient 20°F and two cycles if it is below this and it works fine. But I always wonder if I had an old style mechanical thermostat I wouldn’t have to mess with all this. Just my two cents.
So for a given situation, the cycling quantity is determined by the range between on and off in the thermostat. The thermostat can be adjusted for a wider temp drop before it switches the furnace back on. I never knew that.
In refrigeration, we used to refer to this as the "differential." Most consumer refrigerators don't have an adjustable differential on the thermostat as far as I know. It's usually what we called a "fixed" differential. I just learned that my battery operated digital thermostat for my house furnace has an adjustable differential. It's done by adjusting numbers 1 - 9, and on the documentation it's described as the "Swing." "1" is the shortest cycle, and 9 is the longest. Mine was set to 4, and I felt my furnace was running far too long. My furnace would stay on for around 30 minutes or more, running 20 minutes in Stage I and then maybe another 10 minutes in Stage II. I changed the number to 2, and that improved the cycling by having a shorter run time. I have a two stage furnace, and I'm trying to get it to run in Stage I most of the time, and switch into Stage II only on really cold days where I believe the heat loss from within the house would be greatest. Today I've moved the "Swing" number to 1. It will be interesting to see how this changes the cycling. There's a lot to tweaking the various heat settings, fan speeds, run times in various stages, and the thermostat cycling period. As always your discussion and commentary on these subjects is most helpful. I'm so glad you are sharing your experience with others.
Where i live the average temperature is 32 Celsius(90F) so we don’t use heat at all. It’s not even considered or exist in the unit. Which CPH configuration would you recommend for my needs in order to get a good cooling feel and protect my unit from wear? Thanks
I have both heat and AC set to 1 cycle per hour but it still cycles more like 2-3 times per hour. I think our systems are 2x oversized. Honeywell thermostat.
I set up all my systems with 1 CPH compressor (mostly heat pumps) and 2 CPH for furnaces for the very reason you state. The swing is not noticeable IMO. I'm using Honeywell.
I recently purchased a Lux Thermostat that allows you to set the temperature differential at .25 degrees resolution. I think the range can be set from .25 to 3.25 degrees. My air conditioner was cycling too much and I was able to fine tune it to around 4 cycles per hour with a temp differential of 1.25.
It's the Lux Products TX9600TS Universal 7-Day Programmable Touch Screen Thermostat. I purchased it from Amazon for about $60 and have been very happy with it.
I agree but I am interested in AC cycles. My HW Energy Star seems to cycle two much---I think but this is Arizona. With ceiling fans on it still feels cool after the AC goes off. Thought of the cycle was diminished the AC would use less energy to start and stop.
I have an old Burnham P204W boiler with a return pump and large cast iron radiators. I'm currently using 1 CPH and it keeps the house comfortable. Would it be more efficient to use 2 or 3 so the water doesn't cool down as much and have to reheat between cycles? I'm in and old 1925 house with not a lot of insulation in MN were the average winter temp is probably below 20.
My home is an end unit 1st floor condo concrete floor above unheated garage and concrete ceiling and it's an end unit.cold exterior wall on half length of the home.built in 75.the furnace isn't old and it's cycling every 5 to 6 mins since my mom wanted it warmer will it stabilize in a few hours and not cycle as much.it is 20 degrees outside rt now. Please help
Here's what I see as the benefit of reducing the CPH both for single stage heating and single stage cooling, with single stage being the most common for the vast majority of people. Firstly, reduced wear and tear on the heating and cooling systems, improving longevity, possibly to double or triple its life span. The components that extend their longevity and maintenance interval include furnace burner due to carbon buildup, A/C compressor by reduced starting/stopping, relays, reduced A/C evaporator coil thermal stress due to swinging between 40F and 75F which often causes leaks. If cycles per hour can be reduced to 1 CPH instead of 3 or more CPH using a thermostat that support this, long term repairs, maintenance and replacement costs will typically be reduced significantly. Also efficiency will be increased, as it often take up to 10 minutes before both the heating and especially the A/C reach optimal efficiency in a given cycle. This is particularly the case if one's system is oversized which is usually the case in most homes. A low CPH value (i.e. 1) can offset the disadvantage of an oversized system. Lower CPH value means less short cycling. If one's home is well insulated and south and west facing windows are shaded in summer then it is likely a CPH of 1 for both A/C and furnace will also be easy to become accustomed to comfort wise. This could also eliminate the need to purchase an expensive 2 stage or variable A/C and/or furnace which have worse reliability histories. Basically it's like increasing the observed SEER of basic your single stage A/C a few digits and increasing the efficiency of your furnace a few %. If one is smart, one can wire a relay for specific ceiling fans to come on 15 minutes after the blower goes off to even out the variances in temperature due to stratification and switch off ceiling fans when blower turns back on (remembering to reverse fan direction when heating). Otherwise if you have money to burn don't worry about the above.
One CPH, especially with an oversized unit, would be a service tech's worst nightmare. Consider a unit running at 45F outside ambient in an area that requires a 10F design temp. The temp swing would be enormous. A -10 to +10F would be the result. That is not acceptable to virtually any customer. Even the "increased efficiency" would be reduced by the increased temp split between inside and outside temps. Now, lets try to do this right. If its a heat pump, a 2 to 3 CPH may be effective as the heat pump has far less BTU output. If the home is new or very well insulated, you will have better luck with lower CPH. Older homes will lose heat too fast for the lower CPH. GFM
We have a pro 1 thermostat in our house and it also has an adjustment for cooling swing so is there any recommendation on setting that also the model number is T701
Nice video, is cycles per hour the same as swing? and if not, which one would be better for my 1930s house that has some blown in insulation and gets a little uncomfortable between cycles. I have a lux thermometer which has adjustable swing and I'm thinking about replacing it.
I did not see a video on oil fired boiler. I have an older home w/plaster lathe walls, I'm thinking that on my oil fired boiler (baseboard radiator) needs to cycle the 6 times an hour. My Lux thermostat has a swing setting of 1 to 9. What setting is right for my situation?
Thanks for your reply. I have a stacked combo AC/Furnace Arcoaire installed in a single family 2000 sq ft house installed in the garage in 2003.I change the return filters inside the home regularly . is there a filter inside the combo AC/ Heating unit to change also? I don't see any door to replace a filter. Never had the unit serviced.
Had to replace my thermostat so bought a Honeywell. Even when I set it to the longest setting possible it still cycles too often. The old thermostat didn't do that so it's not the location. Can you recommend a brand/model that allows longer cycle times than Honeywell?
I got sick of hearing mine on and off all the time also,and noise eeee. So i wired a timer control into power supply . NOW IT ONLY RUNS WHEN I Want it to !!
TYVM. Had a new furnace put in 6 years ago and It was cycling 6 times an hour. I asked the tech and he said the digital stat is trying to keep temp within .5 degrees. I put in a Honeywell T87 and adjusted the Heat Anticipator and now i get about a 2 degree swing and about 3 cycles per hr. when real cold. Obviously less with warmer OA temps. I love it but was just wondering when this t 87 dies, if ever ha, can I put in a Delay on make timer with a digital stat and still be able to run the fan independently like when we want to just circulate air.. Thanks again!!
There area number of ways to keep temps as we want. Anticipation, swing, hysteresis, cycling are some of the descriptions. Then there are PIDs, sometimes called ramp controllers. Many commercial refrigeration systems use a form of ramp controllers. GFM
so if my room temp. is 70 and my set temp. is 75. doesn't the furnace supposed to run continuously until the temp. is 75 and only stops until temp. is 75? or does it stops around 73 and does its 5/6 cycles per hour until it gets to temp. 75? i am a little confused. thank you Gray.
We just moved into an old mobile home and the electric furnace is running a total of 2 hours out of 3, shutting on and off for various time cycles. We have the thermostat, which has been replaced, at 70. The furnace elements have been checked and they are working as they should. It's 35 degrees out, the last cycle ran for 45 minutes. Is this normal and what could we possibly expect when it gets well below freezing? Our last electric bill was over $300. We both choked. The times that the furnace is running are getting longer. Started at 2 minutes and increased dramatically through 9 cycles (4 hours) up to the 45 minute one. We're going to set the thermostat to about 68 degrees and dress better. We live in Toledo Ohio which does have high electric rates. Are the extremely high electric bills going to be the norm?
The reason for the long cycles is probably due to one or more of the elements are not energizing. Check all breakers by shutting them off, then turning them back on. If it continues, you may have burned wires, control failures or elements failed. The long cycles usually will not increase the electric bill, as and element that is not on uses no power. One other thing to check is the crossover pipe if it is a double wide. They can break loose. Hope this helps. GFM
Thank you so much for answering. I've got another call into the park manager for a fourth visit from the maintenance guys. It's weird because the cycles started short and just continuously got longer throughout the day yesterday until it's now been running for almost 24 hours. One of the visits was from a supposed "expert". Somehow I don't think he wanted to deal with it. Thanks again Patty
I have a white Roger’s thermostat the heat setting option is slow or fast I set it to slow does that waste more fuel or will it not make a difference I don’t like having it on fast because I noticed the boiler comes on way to quick and I feel that puts more wear and tear
My furnace is 2 stage heat will come 5 mins. Then shuts off for 5 mins. It do this 24/7..it doesn't stop this cycle . Our house has good insulation. I didn't get any sleep because of this on and off cycle..any clue what is going on?
This is the problem i am having with brand new Rinnai wall furnace. It has a built in t-stat that is located behind the wall heater and 2 inches off the floor. I raised it up 12 inches and off to the side of the unit but it still makes no difference. It keeps me awake all night - firing up, shutting down and then firing up again. An again and again.
Hello GFM I was wondering what would be the ideal swing setting for a thermostat to help with energy/money savings. Mine right now is set to 0.5 degrees. Thank you.
I would be setting it at 1 degree F. The furnace cycles long enough to be at its highest efficiency but not so long that you are under and over shooting the temp. GFM
hi gary i have a question i am trying to find out why my furnace runs a full cycle and when it shuts down it comes right back on over and over can you steer me in the right direction..Thank you
If the burner comes on each time, and you have a mechanical thermostat, you could have an incorrect setting on your thermostat anticipator. Let me know if this is your problem. GFM
Heat pumps runs for extended times compared to fossil fuel appliances. Especially at lower temps. I would expect 2 or maybe 3 CPH unless temps are below 30F. GFM
@@grayfurnaceman gotcha but my only confusion is how and when to calculate cycles per hour. For example, right now it's 92 degrees and my heat pump was cooling my house for 45 minutes, then shutting down for 15 minutes, then another 45 etc. Repeat until the evening when it cooled down. Yesterday was a similarly hot day, and from 12PM to 12AM it cycled on and off in the same manner 13 times. What kind of CPH am I getting? Sorry for the redundant question, I'm just a bit confused on how to calculate if my cycles are ok, or if I need to enable the system to engage stage 2 in order to cool faster or if this is fine. I'm lucky enough to be able to tweak my bosch 2.0 IDS air handler speeds, and also able to lock out stage 2 entirely through my ecobee stat to essentially customize my runtimes.Thank you for your guidance!!
The cycle rate has little effect on fuel usage. Just because the furnace runs longer less often, does not mean more fuel is used. There is an argument that shorter cycles may, in fact, use a little more fuel because there is some inefficiency on startup. GFM
I ordered Rinnai's 24v transformer to set up a remote t-stat 20 feet away from my EX38 CT wall furnace. Rinnai's video for the install is confusing as the wiring schematic and what the guy on the video says is unclear. Can you view this and givie me your opinion? Here's their link : ruclips.net/video/X_aOnLu0XsE/видео.html
Good info but boring, I wanted to know how to adjust. According to description that's what I thought this video was. Almost 7 minutes of listening and I have to watch another video. I'll look somewhere else.
You are too damn confusing in your presentation. Shut up, get paper and pencil and write out an outline of what is important then present it off the outline. Become a teacher, starting with the basics, then go forward. Keep it simple, direct and to the point of the presentation, your integrity is real and sincere, I want your videos to reflect that in a concise manner.
Хобби
Great videos by the way, I look forward to watching them so thanks for making them.
Excellent Material - Thank you for sharing your knowledge and information!
Welcome
GFM
Another excellent topic GFM!
Very interesting. I cant wait for the discussion on heat pumps.
Hey GrayFurnace. Excellent tutorial video. I have a Rheem two stage furnace. I decided to go with two stage for several different reasons One was the guy who installed it did a load calculation on my house. You don’t see to many doing that. He also indicated that it’s better to have a furnace run longer than short bursts. I had just gutted my house and redid plumbing, electrical and HVAC. I thought it was highly efficient. I also installed new high efficiency windows and insulation. I’m very mechanical and get involved in all aspects of repair work. I have personally seen bad HVAC people just slap a 180,000 btu furnace in a house that would be better with a 90,000 btu.
So true.
GFM
Thanks for your expertise !
Welcome
GFM
Great information!! Thank you Sir~~~ 😄
Great video. Very informative. Looking forward to your next video on cycles per hour for gas furnaces and heat pumps especially. Thanks.
Excellent video GFM..........keep teaching Brother..........
I could listen to your videos all day. Very interesting
One of the reasons I always liked two stage furnaces.
Yes, but they also need to have right cycles per hour.
GFM
good information, thank you ...
Planning to replace my Honeywell with a control pad that has swing control, which allows you to program +/- degrees for any set temperature, making the AC/Heater less sensitive to temperature fluctuations, thus reducing the number of cycles per hour. LuxPRO PSP511LC 5-2 Day Deluxe Programmable Thermostat
nice video. I like the hat! I worked for Reddaway for 5 years doing P&D and dock work.
Yeah, that is my mountain climbing hat. Notice the fading.
GFM
Cool GFM I'm very interested in this topic we all pay the bills that run this stuff! 👍👍
Thanks for the information you are posting. We have a modern furnace for quite sometime now that replaced an old furnace with the old-style thermostat. I always struggled to agree with the new electronic thermostats way of timing a furnace-on cycle. I also disagree that the manual instructs to set mine to six cycles per hour. I dislike so much hearing the gas valve go on and off during a heating cycle. I have set mine over a long period of time from six cycles, to five, four, three, two and finally back to three cycles per hour. I have also done extensive time research with a stopwatch during all this time. What I found, is that the new electronic thermostats artificially control the furnace on cycle; let me explain. For example, for a particular cold day of 15°F ambient temperature, when it is set at three cycles per hour the gas on time is about 14-17 minutes long. When it is set up two cycles per hour, The furnace gas valve on time may be from 21 to 24 minutes long with AN obvious longer temperature gap between the on and off cycle. In my experience, I keep three cycles in temperatures above ambient 20°F and two cycles if it is below this and it works fine. But I always wonder if I had an old style mechanical thermostat I wouldn’t have to mess with all this. Just my two cents.
Great info
So for a given situation, the cycling quantity is determined by the range between on and off in the thermostat. The thermostat can be adjusted for a wider temp drop before it switches the furnace back on. I never knew that.
You got it.
GFM
In refrigeration, we used to refer to this as the "differential." Most consumer refrigerators don't have an adjustable differential on the thermostat as far as I know. It's usually what we called a "fixed" differential. I just learned that my battery operated digital thermostat for my house furnace has an adjustable differential. It's done by adjusting numbers 1 - 9, and on the documentation it's described as the "Swing." "1" is the shortest cycle, and 9 is the longest. Mine was set to 4, and I felt my furnace was running far too long. My furnace would stay on for around 30 minutes or more, running 20 minutes in Stage I and then maybe another 10 minutes in Stage II. I changed the number to 2, and that improved the cycling by having a shorter run time.
I have a two stage furnace, and I'm trying to get it to run in Stage I most of the time, and switch into Stage II only on really cold days where I believe the heat loss from within the house would be greatest.
Today I've moved the "Swing" number to 1. It will be interesting to see how this changes the cycling. There's a lot to tweaking the various heat settings, fan speeds, run times in various stages, and the thermostat cycling period.
As always your discussion and commentary on these subjects is most helpful. I'm so glad you are sharing your experience with others.
Where i live the average temperature is 32 Celsius(90F) so we don’t use heat at all. It’s not even considered or exist in the unit. Which CPH configuration would you recommend for my needs in order to get a good cooling feel and protect my unit from wear? Thanks
Sir, I set my Honeywell RTH7600 Cph to 3 , does tht mean my pulse 21 will run less every hour, which I want less running time per hour.thks
I have both heat and AC set to 1 cycle per hour but it still cycles more like 2-3 times per hour. I think our systems are 2x oversized. Honeywell thermostat.
I set up all my systems with 1 CPH compressor (mostly heat pumps) and 2 CPH for furnaces for the very reason you state. The swing is not noticeable IMO. I'm using Honeywell.
Thanks for sll the videos, I hope you're teaching HVAC classes somewhere too. It takes talent to teach HVAC, and you, sir, have it. 👌
Thanks for the support. I am a retired teacher and serviceman.
GFM
What is the correct CPH for an amp draw of 1?
hi Mr
if u please help me with heatpump
superheat stop at 35 and doesn't drop down I add r22 and still the same reading?
thanks
Looking forward to the future videos. We do a ton of steam and need to set for much less than the 6 cph.
Can't reach full steam on a short cycle. 👍
I recently purchased a Lux Thermostat that allows you to set the temperature differential at .25 degrees resolution. I think the range can be set from .25 to 3.25 degrees. My air conditioner was cycling too much and I was able to fine tune it to around 4 cycles per hour with a temp differential of 1.25.
What is the model #. I would like get one.
It's the Lux Products TX9600TS Universal 7-Day Programmable Touch Screen Thermostat. I purchased it from Amazon for about $60 and have been very happy with it.
i did the same. i also put a delay on my off cycle to let let me ac run longer with less cycles.
I agree but I am interested in AC cycles. My HW Energy Star seems to cycle two much---I think but this is Arizona. With ceiling fans on it still feels cool after the AC goes off. Thought of the cycle was diminished the AC would use less energy to start and stop.
I would check the installer setup. Many of them have a cycling rate for A/C.
GFM
I have an old Burnham P204W boiler with a return pump and large cast iron radiators. I'm currently using 1 CPH and it keeps the house comfortable. Would it be more efficient to use 2 or 3 so the water doesn't cool down as much and have to reheat between cycles? I'm in and old 1925 house with not a lot of insulation in MN were the average winter temp is probably below 20.
With boilers on older houses I would recommend 2 or 3 CPH.
GFM
Is this normal for a gas furnace. Heater runs for 13mins straight then shuts off for 4mins. Then repeats.
nice video thank's GFM!!!
Welcome
GFM
+grayfurnaceman. thanks GFM.
My home is an end unit 1st floor condo concrete floor above unheated garage and concrete ceiling and it's an end unit.cold exterior wall on half length of the home.built in 75.the furnace isn't old and it's cycling every 5 to 6 mins since my mom wanted it warmer will it stabilize in a few hours and not cycle as much.it is 20 degrees outside rt now. Please help
Here's what I see as the benefit of reducing the CPH both for single stage heating and single stage cooling, with single stage being the most common for the vast majority of people. Firstly, reduced wear and tear on the heating and cooling systems, improving longevity, possibly to double or triple its life span. The components that extend their longevity and maintenance interval include furnace burner due to carbon buildup, A/C compressor by reduced starting/stopping, relays, reduced A/C evaporator coil thermal stress due to swinging between 40F and 75F which often causes leaks. If cycles per hour can be reduced to 1 CPH instead of 3 or more CPH using a thermostat that support this, long term repairs, maintenance and replacement costs will typically be reduced significantly. Also efficiency will be increased, as it often take up to 10 minutes before both the heating and especially the A/C reach optimal efficiency in a given cycle. This is particularly the case if one's system is oversized which is usually the case in most homes. A low CPH value (i.e. 1) can offset the disadvantage of an oversized system. Lower CPH value means less short cycling. If one's home is well insulated and south and west facing windows are shaded in summer then it is likely a CPH of 1 for both A/C and furnace will also be easy to become accustomed to comfort wise. This could also eliminate the need to purchase an expensive 2 stage or variable A/C and/or furnace which have worse reliability histories. Basically it's like increasing the observed SEER of basic your single stage A/C a few digits and increasing the efficiency of your furnace a few %. If one is smart, one can wire a relay for specific ceiling fans to come on 15 minutes after the blower goes off to even out the variances in temperature due to stratification and switch off ceiling fans when blower turns back on (remembering to reverse fan direction when heating). Otherwise if you have money to burn don't worry about the above.
One CPH, especially with an oversized unit, would be a service tech's worst nightmare. Consider a unit running at 45F outside ambient in an area that requires a 10F design temp.
The temp swing would be enormous. A -10 to +10F would be the result.
That is not acceptable to virtually any customer. Even the "increased efficiency" would be reduced by the increased temp split between inside and outside temps.
Now, lets try to do this right.
If its a heat pump, a 2 to 3 CPH may be effective as the heat pump has far less BTU output.
If the home is new or very well insulated, you will have better luck with lower CPH.
Older homes will lose heat too fast for the lower CPH.
GFM
We have a pro 1 thermostat in our house and it also has an adjustment for cooling swing so is there any recommendation on setting that also the model number is T701
Generally, no more than 3 CPH.
GFM
Nice video, is cycles per hour the same as swing? and if not, which one would be better for my 1930s house that has some blown in insulation and gets a little uncomfortable between cycles. I have a lux thermometer which has adjustable swing and I'm thinking about replacing it.
Pretty much, yes. You may need 6 or 9 CPH to avoid temp swings.
GFM
@@grayfurnaceman thank you very much for the information!!!
I did not see a video on oil fired boiler. I have an older home w/plaster lathe walls, I'm thinking that on my oil fired boiler (baseboard radiator) needs to cycle the 6 times an hour. My Lux thermostat has a swing setting of 1 to 9. What setting is right for my situation?
Most boiler systems should cycle about 3 CPH.
GFM
Thanks for your reply. I have a stacked combo AC/Furnace Arcoaire installed in a single family 2000 sq ft house installed in the garage in 2003.I change the return filters inside the home regularly . is there a filter inside the combo AC/ Heating unit to change also? I don't see any door to replace a filter. Never had the unit serviced.
If there is filter at the return, there will be none in the unit.
GFM
Had to replace my thermostat so bought a Honeywell. Even when I set it to the longest setting possible it still cycles too often. The old thermostat didn't do that so it's not the location. Can you recommend a brand/model that allows longer cycle times than Honeywell?
You probably have the best one now.
GFM
I got sick of hearing mine on and off all the time also,and noise eeee. So i wired a timer control into power supply . NOW IT ONLY RUNS WHEN I Want it to !!
@@rottenkernel7822 thats primitive but dang smart ! lol
TYVM. Had a new furnace put in 6 years ago and It was cycling 6 times an hour. I asked the tech and he said the digital stat is trying to keep temp within .5 degrees. I put in a Honeywell T87 and adjusted the Heat Anticipator and now i get about a 2 degree swing and about 3 cycles per hr. when real cold. Obviously less with warmer OA temps. I love it but was just wondering when this t 87 dies, if ever ha, can I put in a Delay on make timer with a digital stat and still be able to run the fan independently like when we want to just circulate air.. Thanks again!!
Many of the digital thermostats have an installer setup that allows you to control the cycles per hour to as little as 3 CPH.
GFM
@@grayfurnaceman TYVM I will check into that, but for now my old reliable is doing great!!!!
Thanks, GFM
Welcome
GFM
There area number of ways to keep temps as we want. Anticipation, swing, hysteresis, cycling are some of the descriptions. Then there are PIDs, sometimes called ramp controllers. Many commercial refrigeration systems use a form of ramp controllers.
GFM
Great video, I installed new Honeywell thermostats on my pulse 21, and it cycles every 7 mins , can I adjust how many Clydes per Hr, Thks
If the thermostat has an installer setup, you can change CPH in there.
GFM
so if my room temp. is 70 and my set temp. is 75. doesn't the furnace supposed to run continuously until the temp. is 75 and only stops until temp. is 75? or does it stops around 73 and does its 5/6 cycles per hour until it gets to temp. 75? i am a little confused. thank you Gray.
mark.r hvac the cycles per hr as he said is once set point is reached. So once 75 is reached the cph is then in play
@@jeffb8437 when i set to 75 degrees it runs until 75. Then it runs again when it drop to 71 or 72, why it happens?
We just moved into an old mobile home and the electric furnace is running a total of 2 hours out of 3, shutting on and off for various time cycles. We have the thermostat, which has been replaced, at 70. The furnace elements have been checked and they are working as they should. It's 35 degrees out, the last cycle ran for 45 minutes. Is this normal and what could we possibly expect when it gets well below freezing? Our last electric bill was over $300. We both choked. The times that the furnace is running are getting longer. Started at 2 minutes and increased dramatically through 9 cycles (4 hours) up to the 45 minute one. We're going to set the thermostat to about 68 degrees and dress better. We live in Toledo Ohio which does have high electric rates.
Are the extremely high electric bills going to be the norm?
The reason for the long cycles is probably due to one or more of the elements are not energizing. Check all breakers by shutting them off, then turning them back on. If it continues, you may have burned wires, control failures or elements failed. The long cycles usually will not increase the electric bill, as and element that is not on uses no power. One other thing to check is the crossover pipe if it is a double wide. They can break loose. Hope this helps.
GFM
Thank you so much for answering. I've got another call into the park manager for a fourth visit from the maintenance guys. It's weird because the cycles started short and just continuously got longer throughout the day yesterday until it's now been running for almost 24 hours.
One of the visits was from a supposed "expert". Somehow I don't think he wanted to deal with it.
Thanks again
Patty
What's the suggested cph setting for heat and cool on the t5 lyric I'm in a1,094 sq condo it's an electric furnace
I don't know what t5 lyric is. An electric furnace will work with 3 to 6 cycles per hour. Probably 3 with a well insulated home.
GFM
grayfurnaceman thank you
I have a white Roger’s thermostat the heat setting option is slow or fast I set it to slow does that waste more fuel or will it not make a difference I don’t like having it on fast because I noticed the boiler comes on way to quick and I feel that puts more wear and tear
When using a boiler, the cycles should be longer. It takes more time for the boiler to warm and to get to efficient operation. Leave it longer.
GFM
@@grayfurnacemanso I should keep it set to slow correct?
Yes
GFM@@CloroxWipes
@@grayfurnaceman thank you I appreciate you for replying
My furnace is 2 stage heat will come 5 mins. Then shuts off for 5 mins. It do this 24/7..it doesn't stop this cycle . Our house has good insulation.
I didn't get any sleep because of this on and off cycle..any clue what is going on?
This is the problem i am having with brand new Rinnai wall furnace. It has a built in t-stat that is located behind the wall heater and 2 inches off the floor. I raised it up 12 inches and off to the side of the unit but it still makes no difference. It keeps me awake all night - firing up, shutting down and then firing up again. An again and again.
Hello GFM I was wondering what would be the ideal swing setting for a thermostat to help with energy/money savings. Mine right now is set to 0.5 degrees. Thank you.
I would be setting it at 1 degree F. The furnace cycles long enough to be at its highest efficiency but not so long that you are under and over shooting the temp.
GFM
@@grayfurnaceman thank you I will set it to 1 degree. Should I set the AC to 1 degree also?
Yes
GFM@@Jasonmcdougal1987
hi gary i have a question i am trying to find out why my furnace runs a full cycle and when it shuts down it comes right back on over and over can you steer me in the right direction..Thank you
If the burner comes on each time, and you have a mechanical thermostat, you could have an incorrect setting on your thermostat anticipator. Let me know if this is your problem.
GFM
@@grayfurnaceman Thank you Gary i am gonna work on that tomorrow its late and time for bed but i will let you know thanks again
Some days our Furnace Doesn't shut off..When I reboot it then it works properly
It's a 40 year old Airco.
Does the furnace overheat the conditioned space or does the fan just run?
GFM
Question... if my heat pump runs for 45 mintues and then only stays off for 15 minutes, how do I calculate the CPH? Thanks!
Heat pumps runs for extended times compared to fossil fuel appliances. Especially at lower temps. I would expect 2 or maybe 3 CPH unless temps are below 30F.
GFM
@@grayfurnaceman gotcha but my only confusion is how and when to calculate cycles per hour. For example, right now it's 92 degrees and my heat pump was cooling my house for 45 minutes, then shutting down for 15 minutes, then another 45 etc. Repeat until the evening when it cooled down. Yesterday was a similarly hot day, and from 12PM to 12AM it cycled on and off in the same manner 13 times. What kind of CPH am I getting? Sorry for the redundant question, I'm just a bit confused on how to calculate if my cycles are ok, or if I need to enable the system to engage stage 2 in order to cool faster or if this is fine. I'm lucky enough to be able to tweak my bosch 2.0 IDS air handler speeds, and also able to lock out stage 2 entirely through my ecobee stat to essentially customize my runtimes.Thank you for your guidance!!
Doesn't longer cycling use more fuel?
The cycle rate has little effect on fuel usage. Just because the furnace runs longer less often, does not mean more fuel is used. There is an argument that shorter cycles may, in fact, use a little more fuel because there is some inefficiency on startup.
GFM
The HVAC Techs that installed my new AC and thermostat set both the AC and Furnace on 6.
IMO that's too many cycles.
GFM
@@grayfurnaceman What's your suggestion? I live in South Florida in case location is a factor.
I would use 3 CPH. Especially for cooling.
GFM
grayfurnaceman for both cooling and heating 3 cph? I’ll change it this evening. Thank you
If you live in Florida you probably never use heat, but unless you notice large temp swings in heat, 3 CPH should be fine.
GFM
My electric furnace is running for 7m straight and off for 13m then on for 7m.
That's probably about right.
GFM
Is it bad to make my ac run 10 cycles per hour
Yes. Never more than 3.
GFM
What about steam boiler system
I would set a steam boiler the same as a hot water boiler to start. It may need a little shorter cycling.
GFM
grayfurnaceman thx gray
I ordered Rinnai's 24v transformer to set up a remote t-stat 20 feet away from my EX38 CT wall furnace. Rinnai's video for the install is confusing as the wiring schematic and what the guy on the video says is unclear. Can you view this and givie me your opinion? Here's their link : ruclips.net/video/X_aOnLu0XsE/видео.html
Good info but boring, I wanted to know how to adjust. According to description that's what I thought this video was. Almost 7 minutes of listening and I have to watch another video. I'll look somewhere else.
You are too damn confusing in your presentation. Shut up, get paper and pencil and write out an outline of what is important then present it off the outline. Become a teacher, starting with the basics, then go forward. Keep it simple, direct and to the point of the presentation, your integrity is real and sincere, I want your videos to reflect that in a concise manner.
Have you watched the other videos in this series? They are linked at the end of each video.
GFM
Hey, mine runs for a hour then shuts down for a hour in 25 F type of weather. I'm assuming that this means it's just running efficiently?
Sir, I set my Honeywell RTH7600 Cph to 3 , does tht mean my pulse 21 will run less every hour, which I want less running time per hour.thks
Yes, if everything else is cycling normally.
GFM