DnD Races are Losing What Makes Them Unique! WotC Removes Weakness from All Races.
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They stripped down all the classes already. Everyone does magic, everyone uses all the weapons…. Poison doesn’t do poison things and dragons are basically just giant kobolds
This is absolutely a case of character races being turned into cosmetic skins, and it has the opposite effect of what I imagine was intended. Instead of valuing individuals for their own strengths and weaknesses, everyone is now "normal," which of course means they're just like the standard middle of the road human. Characters with disabilities are not allowed, because it's "not fun" and those with advantages are not allowed because it's "not fair." Homogenization is the opposite of diversity, and diversity must include abilities as well as superficial appearance, otherwise it's just shallow self-serving virtue signalling. Hasbro's idea that diversity only means having a different superficial appearance shows just how deep inside their echo chamber the people behind the company are, and how little they understand the problems they claim they are solving.
The people who made these decisions have a profoundly stunted view of reality. All their terrible choices and reasoning trickles down from there.
Especially ironic since the shift from race to species. All human races can be considered equivalent, but that extending to literally different species is bizarre and breaks any kind of verisimilitude or connection with fantasy myths and legends. Dwarves are cool because they’re short, stout, tough, bearded, slower but hardier - Gimli in PJ’s tLotR for example.
@@mystopianAnd their response will continue to be, "But there are exceptions and adventurers are exceptional!" Thus justify removing the rule entirely. At least in their minds. "What if I'm just a particularly fast and light dwarf?"
@@HSuper_Lee When is a Dwarf not a Dwarf…? 😁
Agreed, the way that Elves are written is a great example: Humans with long ears.
Intrinsically they are not, when your retirement age is 600-700 years old and your culture dictates that your "training" for a task isn't done until you've finished a decade in that singular goal... changes the way that they view not just people, but the passage of time and the depth of a relationship drastically differently.
That singular aspect would make someone different, but stack on the fact that they don't sleep, their perceptions are different, inherently they're more graceful, their family structures are extremely tightly bound and that they're both patient and chaotic by nature... you can't just throw a human attitude on them and go.
That's what makes ROLEPLAYING fun, you're trying to act differently from yourself.
Lately the only thing I've been playing is stereotypes of Races, be the classic Dwarf, Elf or Lizardfolk.
Extremely liberating and difficult, it's an actual challenge.
The 'restrictions' was never a problem when I played older editions, and never stopped me from making characters of those races. My first character ever was a drow in AD&D (based off of Pirotess of Lodoss War), where sunlight sensitivity was substantially harsher and affected more than just the drow but also their native equipment. The part notion stems from people wanting to play certain classes but not being able to play them as certain races. This, I feel, is buckus. Nothing stopped them from doing that, absolutely nothing, except their own shallow preconceptions. I played a lizardfolk rogue in a Phandelver game and had alot of fun with it, she was a peach. And my most successful character was a kobold warlord during 4th's first Encounter of the Week campaign at my local game store. Our table dominated the challenge dungeons. We are only limited by our preconceptions and if we don't bind ourselves to them then we can make any character work.
Maybe having generic PCs are easier to program into the VTT.
You nailed it!! As a software developer who dabbles in video game design (nothing published) the new rules would be SUPER easy to code as opposed to having to code around all of the racial restrictions/bonuses. This makes a lot of sense.
Because everyone knows a one meter tall gnome is going to be as strong and fast as a three meter tall Goliath. It just makes sense! I see no problem here! Everything is all the same, don’t you know.
Watching a bunch of modern atheists turn against evolutionary biology and Darwinism is so ironic that I can’t even.
Well that's an odd concluding sentence.
It is not odd at all if you even just passed history class in high school.
It IS the ultimate irony.
They act the exact same way the Church did from the late middle ages thru to the Industrial Revolution. They act JUST like the peeps that locked Galileo up...
how is odd? It's obviously happening. Odd that it is a thing, but the comment is not odd whatsoever.
The answer is obviously yes. In fantasy the races are literally different species.
Technically they are magical or mythological archetypes of human traits or concepts. WOTC couldn't handle that they are fantasy people (or just the use of the word "race"), so they decided to call them species. This doesn't make sense because different species can't sexually reproduce, which is maybe why they got rid of half-elves and half-orcs (although Crawford said it was an "anti-racist" measure (!)). Anyway, whether they are different biological species or fantastical creatures, they are still different.
@@cowpercoles1194 Ever heard of a Liger? Or a Mule? (Or Spock?) Different species that are sufficiently genetically similar _can_ reproduce, and once in a while the children are not sterile. Also magic.
In some settings, they are certainly _just_ subspecies (e.g. Shadowrun, where they all arise from human parents). In other settings, they are clearly _not_ the same species, ability to interbreed or not.
Regardless, moving to "they are different species and cannot interbreed" at the same time as saying "they are all exactly the same except minor superficialities" _is_ rather mixed messaging...
@@cowpercoles1194 No, they are just literally different species, if that is what the book defines them as. You can't assume our worlds history and point of view for every fantasy or fictional element. Of course, when you run your own game, you're free to say that is what they are and then redefine anything and everything to your own taste, but as a default they aren't writing the book with "just archetypes" in mind.
Wotc is ruining the game 🙄
"Their" they are ruining their game. My games are dope.
Fortunately for the gamers, there are far more games out there than D&D.
you spelt hasbro wrong
@@slaapliedje Or, like my husband and me, you could stay with 3.5 and home-brew it to heck.
@martabachynsky8545 From my youth, I really started being a GM with a game called Powers & Perils, but my brain grew too soft for the math... so I then ran AD&D 2nd edition, but so many of the rules irritated me. I then switched to GURPS, which is still my favorite. I tried running Abomination Vaults in PF2e, but my players were irritated at that for it being too randomly swingy, and murdering them (my rolls are crazy good). We ended up going back to GURPS.
When you fire your creatives and move the marketing department into game design, when you are a publicly traded company run by empty suits who don't understand that you can't turn a TTRPG into a live-service like 'the video games are', when you subsequently design a game around the Twitter crusader's outrage, this is exactly what you end up with.
Having worked in design, the moment you start trying to make anything for 'everyone' it becomes water. All meaning, fun, and nuance are taken out because the brand needs family friendly entertainment products that won't have any angry parents throwing backlash to drop the stock prices. The only difference is that the companies I've worked for didn't hire the Pinkertons and paid me a generally comparative wage.
The changing times. Thankfully WoTC isn't required to play D&D anymore. Lots of material out there that's better written by people who were allowed to give a damn about their product.
This started with Tasha’s, which is why many if not most good DMs ban the use of that book at their tables.
Mine definitely did
Bonuses and penalties go hand in hand. It's okay to have one race that has no exceptional bonuses but no penalties like the Human. But yeah, you do gotta have options that are more powerful in some ways and weaker in others, even if you get to choose how those weaknesses play out.
That's why I like having special Bleed Feats that people can pick for extra bonuses, in exchange for penalties.
So they dod remove all weaknesses from the species. But they gave every one unique abilities that define them really well. I still like races having stat bonuses personally, but they didnt remove the mechanical differences between races/species.
The epic failures in our game sessions are talked about MUCH more often than successes.
This is TOO TRUE!!!
I guess everyone's group is different. We (my group) tend to avoid talking about our failures, it evokes a lot anger and frustration. I'm sure that's because I game with a group of people who, like myself, have massive self esteem issues, and any reminder of being a loser in the fantasy is just too much like real life. We prefer to game larger than life stuff as we don't want to be reminded of our sad little lives. None of this is sarcasm, I've just legitimately thought about it for a long time, and seen how this group I've been gaming with for 15+ years tends to be. Not a one of us has any success in our real lives, we're all struggling, barely surviving, social outcasts, all in our mid 40s now, each and every one of us afflicted by one or more serious health and/or mental health conditions. I personally had to stop playing characters and stick to only game mastering due to my own fragile ego and desperate need to feel in control of something. I think there are a lot of folks out there like us sadly, although I wouldn't wish that on anyone. I wouldn't be surprised if the immediate response to anyone reading this is complete disgust and disdain, to which I say: That's fair.
Well-- if they could ever get the balance right and they could make all attributes useful to all classes, that would be one thing. Make being a high Intelligence but low Strength Fighter or a low Dexterity, high Charisma Rogue be an actual usable, valid options and we can talk about having racial options assign attribute bonuses. Make every class get some significant bonus from every attribute so that min/maxing would be shooting yourself in the foot. But so long as the classes are built entirely around exploiting a single attribute and utterly ignoring others-- that's not really something we can do.
Furthermore-- the balance between races has been utter trash in all editions. Particularly when it comes to the most common non-standard races like goblins, hobgoblins, orcs, etc. Those have basically always been handed utter garbage racial abilities because the designers refuse to actually think them through and make them interesting.
So while it would be great if races could more meaningfully impact the character, doing so would also require massively overhauling how classes and a bunch of other mechanics worked.
Because there shouldn't be any reason an Orc Warlock isn't as badass as a Gnome Warlock-- they ought to just be badass in different ways. The Orc focusing raw fury into offensive attacks and shrugging off damage while the Gnome would have a better understanding of how the powers worked and how to best exploit them while utilizing being a smaller target to its advantage. But-- having such options would need to be encoded into the options of the Warlock class.
In D&D 6E all races are human cosplaying races 🤣🤣
It bothers me that Tieflings are viewed as "Normal" now.
My first Planescape character was a Tiefling and the DM did a great job of making it feel completely normal in Sigil... and then we went to a prime plane and he had to run for his life as people just saw him as a demon... because... he looked like a typical Tiefling.
AND
Demons are scary, evil, murderous things... so yeah... villagers justified.
(Back in MY day, LOL) Dwarves and Gnomes received the benefit of inflicting -4 vs. certain opponents, chiefly some combination of the following creatures:
Orcs, Gnolls, Bugbears, Trolls, Ogres, Ogre Magi, Titans, and Giants.
I would take a -1 to my Dexterity and a +1 to my Constitution in exchange for the ability to sense direction underground and in caves, and be immune to Toxins.
Sounds like a good trade off to me.
Those were the good ol' days. (Except for THAC0; I'm terrible at math).
What's worse is that Ghostfire Gaming, a company I highly respected for its awesome Dark Fantasy D&D settings like Grim Hollow and Dungeons of Drakkenheim, is adamant on going right down this exact same route, replacing the races of their first edition Grim Hollow with a Gurps-esque "pick and match" style 'Heritages' system.
@@MrNetWraith That is so sad. I had hoped that other, smaller companies wouldn't follow this BS path.
If you need a new home, try the OSR.
Doesn't sound bad, just different
Oh, I love that, thanks for the info! I had heard of them, but I didn't know much about them. There should be more Gurps-esque products made for use with a d20 system. I've wanted a GURPS d20 for at least twenty years...if not more. Never happened sadly.
I don't mind weaknesses. Im not even a grognard. When I play drow, yes I take the sensitivity. Also, I've played a goblin that was wheelchair bound. So as an artificar, he rides his archane turret, not a combat wheelchair.
I think it's ok for races to have different walking speeds, or to have stat penalties as well as buffs. They took away penalties when 5e started, so you don't have uncharismatic Dwarves, or weak Halflings, or sickly Elves. Now they've given everyone a speed of 30. Except Goliaths are 35, so they're special.
Back when I was a kid, our Narrator for Vampire the Masquerade also dabbled in DnD 3E and I remember that one time he showed me his homebrew notes in which he removed half-elves, half orcs, assimar, genasi and whatnot, and replaced them with these templates called bloodlines that could be applied to the four core races (no, gnomes went out the window as well). And these templates came with both merits and drawbacks that also granted good moments for roleplaying. Fiend blood, if I remember the name correctly allowed limited access to the powers of the hellish parent, but at the same time, the character was sometimes compelled to do evil.
Obviously this would be conceptually the best way to handle races breeding with other races rather than always assuming one parent was human-- the trick though is to balance out the benefits and drawbacks to the point that one isn't handicapping themselves by not taking such a template.
Restrictions encourage creativity, at least, that's the way I've always heard it.
So... if you are an Orc then you get a +5+% chance to hit and +10% damage increase with every swing of your weapon. If you are a Halfling you have an automatic -15% damage decrease to every attack... How does this inspire creativity again?
@@TheHobgoblyn By figuring out other ways to defeat the opposition! And letting the big and strong in the group be the tanks and brute fighters.
@@TheHobgoblyn Maybe they could I don't know design dungeons and such to make racial size differences matter more? That hit/damage increase won't matter as much if you can't get close enough to actually hit the Halfling.... I also like the idea of maybe giving nearly anything with dark-vision sunlight sensitivity.... (You can see good in the dark but the tradeoff is that bright light hurts your eyes.) Also I like the idea of being small making it possible to hitch a ride on medium sized creatures, making mounted combat a bit more viable for small creatures in your standard dungeon than it is for medium sized creatures.....
I prefer to have some variance of movement abilities among the different races, especially ones of different sizes.... If you want to be fast for your race they have feats for that. Being small or tiny means being "slower" but also means fitting places where larger creatures can't, which should be factored into exploration in terms of adventure design. I also like there to be size variance between the different races being allowed... (If you're worried about players "feeling bad" because they can't go everywhere the smaller characters can't, well that's a level/dungeon design issue not a "bigotry" issue. Shrink spells and polymorphs exist and can be used by the players if they really want to explore places they normally can't.)
Reminds me of the CGL removing the essence cost of cyber junk because they didn’t want to give the impression of trans people being less human. Ignoring what statement that makes about people with prosthetics.
I played a drow that, naturally, was a 'night owl' whenever possible, staying inside and or resting during the day. Sunlight sensitivity was one of the things that helped define the character.
groups I was in always had fun with that. It was cool to have to slowly get used to the sun, over years and many levels. Or never, if your character was a night owl. 😊
I tried to go your route with Mt first drow. But once the party got a Galleon at level 12 or whatnot, my drow was obsessed and had to give up his "I only come out at night" ways. It was fun. The other drow pcs had no issues but I still did because it took me til level 12 to even find a reason to want to be out and about during the day.
are they removing sunlight sensitivity from underdark races now? I hope not.
Which apparently you couldn't come up with something yourself and need a rule to do it for you, I guess if you can't come up with something then this is what you need.
Not specifically a weakness that was given by the race, however I had made a character with a sweet tooth. In that one shot we played we were in an amusement park organised by hags. there was this candy, the more you ate the younger you become. So I just obsessively ate the candy which, I the player, knew 100% that that was a bad idea. But the character didn't. It was a fun time with other players also just having fun. It was one of the things that really characterized that character to play to the weaknesses/flaws, so pulling those away from the game is a mistake in my opinion.
Next from WoTC "We find that dice rolls can be problematic, and unfair. Thus you no longer have to roll dice you just decide if your character succeeds or fails on your own."
When you pay attention to the statements Wotc and DnD have put out over the past few years it becomes starkly apparent that they do indeed what to make races nothing more than skins. They have also changed the terminology of race to species... meaning they are all human? Species refers to a subset of the same creature, so species is wildly inaccurate. We do the same thing in the real world though. We are the human race while we have distinct country based species, yet we still call them races, however it's still more accurate than the choice DnD has made because despite having this knowledge they have deliberately used the wrong noun in place of where they previously used the correct one.
20 years ago in 3.5 I had a halfing rogue that took extra penalties for dual wielding. His hits were very weak, but his stealth and acrobatics were OBSCENE. He was ridiculously hard to hit being small and he could flank for back stabbing like Yoda from Attack of the Clones. But the trade off was that if he did get hit, he got hit hard. The 5e, and now 5.5e mechanics destroyed the restrictions and buffs that made that character so much fun to play.
I couldn't agree more. Have you seen the builds they're coming out with now? The players are so overpowered
I stopped playing 5e because I saw the direction they were heading a couple of years ago. I now play Savage Worlds -- in that game system, EVERY character MUST have either 2 major or 1 major and 2 minor "Hindrances" - negatives to the character. Phobias, Quirks, Habits, Addictions, Overconfidence, Impulsiveness, Code of Honor, etc. They realize that having drawbacks makes a character interesting, and in my Deadlands game (a Savage Worlds setting) we have had the most fun with Hindrances... like the one character who has a Phobia of mice and ran screaming out of a saloon when she saw a mouse hole with a little whiskered nose poking out. We were all roaring with laughter and it is one of the most memorable moments of that adventure. It's FUN to RP the negatives -- experienced gamers and good RPers realize that.
You might want to look into the OSR.
Yes, they have just made races skins now. The reason, I believe, is because they don't want to demand roleplaying from RPG players. They want to just give them fashion rather than substance.
Disadvantages breed the most interesting roleplay elements. I'll homebrew the old disadvantages right back into the game. I brought infravision to 5e because I thought darkvision was too much.
Edit: I kept hearing discord notifications, do you have a community discord? If so, I'm interested.
Ultravision would allow sight outdoors, yet sunlight blinds those using it.
We have a discord but have not pushed it yet. Will let everyone know if/when that happens
Hasbro has ruined the game. All the angst is pointless. They are fussing with a corpse. It doesn't matter what the 2024 books have changed, the game IS dead. There isn't a slew of competing designs for no small reason. Pathfinder proved you screw up the game, people leave. The barrage of old school demonstrates the game didn't need all the dumb changes, people liked the way it was just fine.
They are getting rid of handicaps because they think it's a bad thing to have a bad thing offset the good but that's the best thing about it. It's fun to work around a handicap and it gives players reason to change up their playstyle. The thing is that people don't want to admit they have flaws so their DnD character can't have flaws either. That's pretty dumb
Yes, there is no racial differences in 6E as they wrote the game, removing flavor from game, making it samey and boring. Essentially WotC is putting out bad game design for politics. A good game has asymmetric play, a bad game can't come up with systems that offer variations on play. Wotc simply is a poor ideological game company that can't make a product that appeals to its customers. See Disney.
I once played a Dragonborn Warlock with the Great Old One pact. I worked with my DM to create a deity of constant, ravenous hunger who gave me my powers on the condition that I would feast upon the flesh of those I slew, thereby feeding its own starvation. However, because of this, my own character couldn't have a strength above 10 because he was constantly malnourished, and any time I failed to consume the flesh of my enemies I would lose 1d6 HP permanently until I next ate as my god consumed my own flesh in place of my failure. It was awesome, one of my favorite characters to date. Negative traits and weaknesses are some of the best part of character design in a TTRPG like Dungeons & Dragons. I think one of the problems that leads to the philosophy Wizards currently has stems from video games, which don't get me wrong, I absolutely adore. But in video game design it's much harder to work negative traits into positive player experiences in the way that you can in a free form narrative like D&D. Especially when something like D&D allows for so much experience just beyond combat in ways it's really difficult to translate into a video game sphere. The code necessarily has limitations and it's cheaper and easier to simply count weakness as a pure negative. This is one of the reasons that I find the push towards virtual table top a little sad because the limitations of code simply can't compete with the infinite possibilities of the human mind. You want your dungeon walls to suddenly start bleeding and singing soprano? Wordsmith that on the spot with pen and paper, a VTT though, you can still describe it but the system will likely not be able to reflect it visually and the visual dissonance will be all the more noticeable. Personally, D&D has, for me, lived in the homebrew and Kickstarter spheres for the last few years. Unofficial player content has blown official content away by miles time and again and it's because of dedicated player content that I'll never stop playing D&D, even if I never buy an official product again.
See I would do this this stuff all the time. Taking a race that was not known for being X class and playing it. The best was in 3.0 when I was a Halfling Barbarian and my buddy was a Drow Paladin
This is just the logical progression of the concept of so-called "inclusivity".
No. It is not. Dont bring your hate into this.
Not really. Being inclusive means being alright with certain differences, and understanding that one size doesn't fit all. This decision by WotC is likely motivated by a desire to appease shareholders with a "safer" product.
Are we not doing diversity anymore? I'm pretty sure we were supposed to be embracing diversity. Is that over now?
One version of diversity is that anyone should get the chance to do anything regardless of skin color or what genitals they have between their legs. Every human society that survived to the modern day has people who needed to specialize in both athletic and intellectual pursuits after all.
But then doing things the classic way-- why would we ever see a Gnome Paladin? Within the story of the world, that's absolutely a thing. But to actually make that character is to handicap yourself pretty severely. Therefore-- Gnome Paladins are in practice a non-existent element of the world.
Or how about Dwarfs who specialize in picking locks and disarming traps? If we acknowledge that some Dwarfs are mechanically-inclined, that shouldn't be so strange. But the way the rules work-- Wood Elves are automatically better at doing these things even though they should have no familiarity with mechanical objects. Because for some dumb reason all interaction with mechanical objects was governed solely by Dexterity. Actually having the Intelligence to understand the mechanics did not factor in at all.
So the rules didn't really reflect diversity, did they? They forced every race into being a particular set of classes even though other classes were perfectly easy to conceptualize and absolutely made sense within the world.
@@TheHobgoblyn Not really forced though. It's more that power gamers tend towards choosing race based on the metagame as opposed the lore....
I get the impression that these redesigners don’t understand the expression “play to your strengths”.
Implying strength is rascist, misogynistic or some other meaningless word
Someone was trying to explain to me that the novels have made Forgotten Realms drow no longer impared by sunlight, but I couldn't find a very satisfactory explanation on wikis.
Honestly, that has been a thing since the 1990s because having one good Drow in Drizzt somehow rolled over into having entire good Drow societies and good Drow gods and naturally those good Drow lived on the surface and didn't seem to be bothered by sunlight because Drizzt was hardly ever impaired by it being daytime.
@@TheHobgoblynbro, you are clueless. Those were all in there from the start. Everything you mentioned was in there from the start. They never said Drizzt was rhe only good drow.
Eilistraee and Vhaerauns dogma and churches were well detailed from the beginning....
OP I am.not sure where that came from. If you meant drow equipment that was quasi magical rather than magical or just mundane no longer disintegrating, that was Lireal Baenre conducting a ritual at the world tree (with help from Eiliatraee and apparently also Lolth). She did this so she could still use her sword and spell loke abilities. It ended up affecting everyone tho, not just her. It was right after the Time of Troubles I think, around 1360 DR.
Sunlight adaption was always a thing, if you're talking about the Drow and not their quasi magical irradiated weapons and armor. Drizzt got used to it. All drow could.
In third edition you could even take Daylight Adaption as a background feat at level 1 if you were surface drow from Cormanthor or the High Forest (or wherever with DM approval).
I totally agree. In the Obama era of politics, I considered myself a liberal. Not anymore. The blue guy holding a rope represents modern hyperliberals dragging society down.
Grow up. This has nothing to do with politics.
@@scotgarcia9255this has everything to do with political ideologies
It feels like far too many hobbies have been pulled into the political battlefield these days.
@@leonelegender What is political about this?
@@scotgarcia9255 wotc are self proclaimed leftists, they thought that the term "race" was racist, and all current changes is following critical race theory thinking. They thought that races having inherited disadvantages and differences were also racist, so now all races are the same mush, or like everyone says, humans in cosplay.
Back in 3.X/4E the decreased speed for small creatures, where it was 20 not 25, used to be to be offset by the fact that they received a +1 size bonus to their armor class. 5e stripped out so much already, like touch AC and Incorporeal monsters.
Between 5.5 and Pathfinder 2E and its remaster the big players in fantasy seem to want to strip all the individuality and customisation crunch out of their games, we need a new player on the board who'll bring back a rules heavy high fantasy game.
At least Pathfinder 2E has more variety of racial size differences and some unique feats for them to help them feel different.... Being a tiny doll that needs to move an extra five feet to be close enough to stab the enemy with their knife, or a large menotaur that has to squeeze to go through a normal sized hallway does a lot to add flavor to the experience. (That and I appreciate that Pathfinder kept the healing magic hurts undead as a thing, and has an undead race as a player option....) Granted it's not perfect and there are aspects that could be improved to make races feel even more different than they do already, but just in my experience it does seem like there is more mechanical variance there....
Lets throw reason and accountability out the window.
Halflings having the same strength range as a goliath is incredibly ridiculous. The differences should be emphasized more.
I Agree. I rather resent played a game where I was a halfling with 17 in STR (he was random generated for fun). But I found out that I was the second strongest person in the group (there where a Human Warrior with 18). But there was other races, a Wolfkin, and a dwarf i think, but here I was the 2nd strongest, and also among the toughest and beefiest (High CON). It felt so awkward (silly even) that my little halfling could carry the bigger load of the loot in our group! ;)
@@jadedlotuz5095 - yep, and I understand it's a game, but I don't like that in my D&D game. I want it based in realism.
Restrictions in class/level or negative stats and effects, were a result of balancing the race to humans in the older editions. It solved the issue of, "Why would you play a human?" WotC clearly did not understand this when they removed it and gave humans what, a single extra feat? (Whoop-de-*bleep*-do)
They might as well just remove "race" (or any idiotic language they use to represent what species you play) all together. But hey, if it makes money what do they care.
So easy to fall into the hate mob. This is a game design issue. It makes the game boring - and for what? Why do players even feel the need to optimize? Why are different stats so bad? I dislike it, but I also really dislike some of the comments in here.
Be careful what kind of audience you are cultivating here.
OSR is the way to go!
Especially OSR products by RPGpundit, the final boss in internet shitlords!
Sure-- because "save vs. spell" and "save vs. staff" and "save vs. dragon breath" is just the most logical way to do things since people who have one foot in the grave already and keep worshipping a guy who by all accounts was a total asshole rather than accepting that any idea created since it worth adapting.
I think what happened is that the people at WotC noticed a large part of their playerbase are progressive, so in an attempt to appeal to them, incentivize buying the new book, they made changes to make "race" more of a cosmetic trait. Anyone playing the game would know that racial differences are not stereotyping fantasy people, it's about highlighting abilities (strengths/weaknesses) of groups of people, including those that are without a doubt not human, but another sentient race.
Ya'll summed it up so well - homogonization makes everything bland.
Welcome back Drakoya (is that what you spell?) we miss you.
Now all races are humans with merely cosmetic details. If everyone is special, anyone is special.
Thx for the video!
@@israelmorales4249 🥰🥰 Thank you. It's good to be back with you.
I'm happy to say that my party and I have no desire to lose the pros and cons perspective of races in 5e and older editions.
I feel like if any character can have any desired traits, you lead very quickly into a boring and monotonous game where everybody winds up getting everything they want and thusly ruining the whole point of designing characters and playing the game in the first place.
I could rant forever about it being purely to introduce sociopathic control freaks into the game because they'll buy all the meaningless trash that wotc puts out to support their "not a new edition" rewrite nonsense.
The way I see it, we're all playing the game to make a crowdsourced story, if we're all the same overpowered, nondescript character, then what is the point of playing the game with friends?
Or a DM?
Why let someone else intrude on your echo chamber?
I play with a group of people that I can love and appreciate regardless of our differences in opinions, and that leads us all to have vastly different characters even if we have more than one of the same class or race.
And just like in real life, the game we play allows us all to help each other. Where one of us may be weak, another of us is strong.
That's how I think a societal dynamic should be, not lowering the bar to suit the lowest common denominator type people because they yell the loudest.
What's the con of playing a high elf? What's the con of playing a human? What's the con of playing a dragonborn? The second half of your comment is half baked parallelisms that have no bearing on the gameplay and attempt to force your own perspective of it onto others because I'm pretty sure we can all guess which half of your analogy you think you lie on.
@@scotgarcia9255 luckily for all every species has its own amazing abilities now. So the con is not getting the abilities of the others.
My friend has been play for 48 years. And we trying to get his son to used play balance in our game. He alway want to have the most powerful charature in the game. He tried to make charature class called Hunter. He use some of albilties of the Ranger like favord enemy ttacking and so on.He would have skills point as a ranger, but hit points as fighter and bonus feats. And added some of other feast he made up. My friend its not balance ,this class has no disadvanies. Soon he drop it. He always try to rule over the game. We old school plays . We are 3.5e. And he wants play 5e now.
I made the swap to 5e from 3.5e in 2016 and initially liked it. However, books like Tasha's and Witchlight blew open the player power and made 5e no fun to DM. I think the son would LOVE 5e! lol
I do not like the "every species is the same" idea. Species are separated by the fact that they cannot inter-breed, meaning they are different enough that there could, and should, be both physical and mental differences. This could mean there would be mental and physical advantages and disadvantages. I dislike that all of them are all positives in the upcoming version of the game. For this reason, and a few others, I will not be purchasing any of the new material and will not be playing the new version of the game either. I have a few groups that play other games but I also have a group that loves 4E D&D and we'll play that when we want a bit of over-the-top fantasy super hero action.
The problem with sunlight sensitivity and slower movement speeds is specifically a 5e thing. It was balanced fine in older editions like 3.5e. It only became an issue once they removed modifiers and introduced the advantage system. Small races were slower but they had their size modifiers that made them harder to hit as a tradoff. Size modifiers are no longer a thing so it's just a straight nerf which isn't impossible to play around but it's less interesting and makes it feel unnecessary unless you want that challenge. Sunlight sensitivity used to just be a -1 to your rolls (Personally I think it could've been -3 and been just fine. -1 is a little light). The disadvantage system makes it unrealistically inconsistent and far more of a nerf by comparison. I can live with 25ft movement speed but not randomly getting what is effectively a -19 on a roll that used to be -1 just because 5e's systems are poorly thought out. That's a load of crap and if they're not altering it then removing it is a smart thing whether it's for political pandering or not.
Buy old copies. Pirate copies online. Why would anyone want to pay for less content. Removing things from a game as old as DnD instead of adding to the experience is wild.
I find this funny cause while I understood people's frustration I kinda wanna just say "don't follow the rule then"
"Oh weaknesses suck and are dumb" just dont follow the rules
"oh without weaknesses everyones the same" just dont follow the rules
Didn't Tasha's just let you pick, so you can just give yourself a weakness ?
in some way I kinda agree if my goblins been hitting the gym why should I get minus strength , why cause the rest of goblins are weak ? idk in some ways I get the anger but in others feels like it gives better player agency. I would force negative tho so you can choose but you must take a negative"
I mean and I mean no disrespect you argue its lame all races are the same now but counterargument isn't all individual of a race being the same also lame ? And in each world creatures have different lore history ect. goblins from Eberron may be different from goblins in a different book ect.
again im not saying people cant be upset at this. I just seem to have a different opinion and I think the anger is more so on WHY and WHO is making changes rather than if the changes in a vacuum are bad.
WotC has rendered races as non-sequitur. They simply do not bring anything terribly relevant to the character and therefore they just don't matter. Just make a character, add whatever flavor you want, pointy ears, giant mustachio, sombreros, purple skin, be two feet tall, and forget about race. Our DEI masters have spoken.
They've been moving that direction for awhile. I was annoyed when they removed the negative ability adjustments.
What is this Goliath on the bottom left hand corner ? What is she doing ? Telling all the men what they are doing wrong? Sheesh…
Edit: lol I posted this before you even talked about it. IMO the two in the background were added in after some consultant said the picture needed more representation. Guarantee it!
And this to me is the issue about the woke. They want boring uncreative stories. They refuse to think anyone, or anything can be unique.
Yep, because "unique" isn't "inclusive". 🤦🏼♀️
The races still have their advantages, and are different enough to be separate species, so I don't think this is about "the woke." This is about catering to players who can't handle playing a character with any weakness or flaws. No weaknesses, no stat penalties, and the "standard array" means no character is below average in any way. The kids just can't cope with a roleplaying challenge.
Define “woke”.
No. This is the issue with a conservative acting like they understand progressives.
@@JustinTotinothe belief that all inequality is socially constructed.
D&D is a terrible game, there. I said it. I stand by it. 5e brought me back to role-playing, and im thankful for it. I'm glad I moved on. This game is just becoming too homogeneous. Like you said. BTW, does that giant have glasses?😅
Weaknesses should be embraced, it builds and bonds you to the character! Dragonbane actually rewards you for your weakness, if you play off it in the session you get an upgrade point at the end of the session which can help boost a skill.
D&D is being defined by social media and real life culture wars. I just don't understand their thinking.
It’s wholly political, it truly is.
Everything woke is trash.
Hasbro’s woke nonsense was the trash in BG3.
Every fantasy race needs an African version. Every relationship needs to be gay😂
Immersion breaking garbage.
What killed EverQuest? Remember EverQuest?
They melded every race into a big happy city where everyone just got along, boring as Hell.
You used to stumble into a troll camp in the swamps and it was scary!
They turned every race into a skin (well said) and the game was a snooze fest.
I'm guessing that they are anarcho-syndicalists and they just tore down a monument. The lady in the back is trying to get their attention, because she has their door dash order.
Haha! Love it!
😂😂 that's hilarious
I’m just going to have to homebrew that aspect of the game too
the only reason you even want the mechanical difference is so you can MIn/MAX powergame, if it was truly about being different such mechanical elements would not even matter to you.
I think these new changes are stupid and make the game bland. I'll stick to previous editions. If i ever do get the new edition, I'll buy them second hand to avoid giving Wizards of the Coast the profits. I already do the same with Warhammer.
The female goliath is wearing modern eyeglasses. What are we even doing here?
Grievance-based social theory apparently doesn’t make very good stories. 😄
On the one hand, you can be very creative in designing your personal player species, if that is your thing. Being a 1/4 Orc, 1/4 Dwarf, 1/4 Elf, and 1/4 Halfling - now you can. But on the other hand, characters without flaws have no "character". What would make the "mute" race I mentioned interesting would be its handicaps and unique talents. Not having a system for flaws and talents tied to your race (Ancestry in PF, Species in 5.1e) eliminates the specialness of the PCs genetics. Your just a "digital skin" that has no bearing on the "game" mechanics. Game mechanics are how that unique PC interacts with the game world, not just role play.
Didn't WotC eliminate Half-Elves and Half-Orcs because they were racist?
You always could make custom races. The trouble with the way these new rules do it is that you do it by just...saying that's what your generic stat blob is.
"Now you can play a fire wizard or an arcane archer even if those classes don't exist! Just play the Ranged Damager, and claim your ranged damage that is exactly the same as every other Ranged Damager is fire or magic arrows or even not magical arrows if you want to play a regular archer!"
Did you know you can build a character to have any weaknesses you want? Just talk to your DM 🤯
Weaknesses should be a choice and not hard coded into a character because you wanted to play something that isn't human. Overall I think it's better game design to not force negative penalties in character creation by default. If you want certain races to have specific weaknesses then set up that expectation with your players and go for it.
Why have dwarves? Why not make them 6 foot… no 18 feet tall? Why stop there? Turtle Barbarian? That’s boring! Make my character a fighting Aamoeba…. Two AAs cos fantasy!!! Single and Multicellular organisms have rights, too!!! How can we leave they/them/its out!!!???Sheeessssshhhh
Lady in the back is from HR...
Is anyone surprised? Even if you wanted to play bloated shiiite made by a Seattle Corp, I dont know why youd choose Wizbro. If you wanted a giant, convoluted ruleset, PF is far better at it. If you want something fast and fun, there are a dozen better choices.
I miss Specialty Priests of Kazuth. 😒
Give us some and we can do a video
I’ve seen this coming for almost a decade now. Race has been reduced to just being a skin.
That is called game balance.
I liked the flaws of different races
Yes, yes they are.
I guess people can't role play with out rules telling them what to do. Do people not roll stats? Because not all characters are the same. Nothing stops you from putting the stats you rolled where you want to make a character you want. I think people need help and need rules written to give them ideas since they are bereft of their own.
I like it. Racial feats are more tailored to the up-sides of races and stats are less based on what your bloodline is and more based on what your own character's upbringing is. I was able to play a wise old storied orc in my last campaign because of Tasha's innovations and it was fun doing a warcraft-style orc voice while singing and playing guitar. I could still pick up and carry heavy things and was loyal to Grumpsh One-Eye's philosophy of eternal vigilance. But because I was older, well traveled, and well read I was able to work the Orc's short lifespan into his lore bard pursuit of trying to not only hear as many great stories as possible but to hopefully live well enough to have someone tell his story too. I didn't see that as a skin at all.
Drow are no longer light sensitive!? Halflings move at full speed??! The fuck is wrong with wotc?
dnd is set on the path of blobification, being melting pot/whatever fantasy is the whole marketing strategy.
interesting stuff is in other games.
I wonder if this simplification is because of the vtt. Programming stuff is hard, so why not simplify everything to make it easier on you! Who cares if it fundamentally changes the game!
It's possible. I sense its also a way of distancing the game from any possible controversy over "race".
@thepickleddragon8590
Most certainly. They've been angling in that direction since the whole "orcs are black people" thing after all.
None of the changes they've introduced will have any meaningful impact on the development of their VTT. Programming is hard, but variables like these is not the source of difficulty.
Are they doing it? No.
They already did it; where have you been?
I mean you can make your own rules
Pathfinder 2e is a MUCH BETTER system.
even if it has no mechanics it's not meaningless, the story of being an elf is very different than the story of being a human.
That image is so directionless and uninspired. I really reminds me of the AI stuff that Dall•E generates: relatively well executed but with no intention behind it.
It is the natural result of a workforce who ascribed to the CRT mindset. They can't admit that restrictions that result from generic makeup are a real thing. Shorter legs mean you are slower. Greater muscle mass and denser bones mean you are stronger. Heaven forbid some species might be statistically smarter or more mentally flexible. We've seen almost nothing about characteristics other than ability bonuses for species. Most of the really interesting species, Harrigan, tortals, etc. are not even in the book.
Dungeons & DEI. Yippee
Clickbait title. Boring, thoughtless criticisms. Whines about being "attacked" by people who will disagree with him, then spends 2 minutes attacking the art as if it's relevant to the topic at hand. In another comment, makes baseless, fearmongering claims about the reasoning behind WotC's decisions. Just the absolute epitome of an obstinate, dogmatic, borderline hateful TTRPG player. Completely incapable of being constructive in any way that is healthy for the hobby.
The reason why WotC normalized speed and removed weaknesses is because not every race suffered from them. They standardized ability scores because surprise surprise, all it did was limit options for certain classes without any upside. Want to play a Forest Gnome paladin? Well, you sacrifice a feat and delay reaching 20 CHA or STR until much later into the average 5e game, reduce your mobility by 20% (furthering limiting your options, and genuinely hampering to a melee oriented class), all so you can...have dark vision (which is common among a lot of races), cast the minor illusion cantrip, and can talk to squirrels as if you were talking to your Barbarian? And that's not to say that people can't want those features. But there's no reason to make people sacrifice character building options simply for flavor. Dracoya gave some great flavorful examples of how have fun with character identity without limiting their other choices, so it's really ironic that you both lost the plot so hard on this.
Movement speed and sunlight sensitivity aren't the only things that differentiate classes. And if that's all you're capable of focusing on, maybe you should ask what you care about more, people having fun, or your limp interpretation of identity.