The Spirituality Of Addiction
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- Опубликовано: 11 фев 2024
- One of the more controversial topics around the field of addiction treatment and recovery is spirituality. In this video we take a deep dive into examining what is meant by terms such as "spiritual experience." You'll learn about Carl Jung's fascinating perspective on the relationship between alcoholism and spirituality, why alcohol is actually referred to as "spirits," and the unique contribution Carl Jung made to the formation of Alcoholics Anonymous.
Sobriety Doesn't Have To Suck: A Guide To Finding Excitement, Renewal, ANs Spiritual Fulfillment In Recovery www.jimsavage.net/sobrietyebook
0:00: Intro
3:42: Carl Jung's Contribution To Alcoholics Anonymous
4:05: AA Not The Only Way
6:23: Jung's Alcoholic Patient
7:17: The Spiritual Experience
19:31: Spiritus Contra Spiritum
20:59: Innate Desire To Alter Consciousness
23:20: Transcendent Function
29:07: Musical Portrayal Of Hitting Bottom
34:09: Step 12: "Having Had A Spiritual Experience"
#alcoholism #carljung #addictionrecovery #spirituality #12steps #spiritualexperience 
Развлечения
In response to @shaneross7428 comment below I posted this short today. He raised such a great point. ruclips.net/user/shortsX1_nH58m74g?si=7_gt1I43ZtYZK6EY
Thanks Jim. Now I understand why I loved smoking marijuana for so many years and went to AA to make those around me leave me alone and it was never plesant. Last year I went back to AA and after getting halfway through the steps my life got better and my ego took over and I went back out. Today I have 33 days of sobriety and am attending an a meeting called Newcomers-Slippers Workshop. It's like an AA 101 class. The coordinator runs it based on what the first 100 AAs who got sober. We work through the steps in a group, have reading written assignments related to the steps and the best part is that it's fun🎉. So thanks for your video and I'm interested in learning more about having fun in sobriety. Stay loose and stay of the juice! In my personal case I'm staying off the pipe and the smoke. 😅
Romans 12:1-2 we are transformed by the renewal of our mind.
Very relatable. Why do so many writers like to/ drink? To enter a state of altered consciousness and feel unshackled from the human dilemma, free flowing into the oblivion and helping to unleash all that is within.
Here's a short I did n the topic of artistic creativity and and substance use: ruclips.net/user/shortsq546I2WmuiI
I really enjoyed this video. You said something so profound that I never thought about. Whatever addictions we have we do them because we think they'll make us feel whole. That really sheds light and makes it easier to say no to them because I know they will not make me whole.
Thanks so much for saying that. Your comment actually reiterates to me the value of having a greater understanding about what we're trying to achieve for providing a solution to avoiding the negative results of addiction. Really insightful comment. Thanks!
Check this short I posted today in response to your comment! ruclips.net/user/shortsX1_nH58m74g?si=7_gt1I43ZtYZK6EY
I got a lot out of this! Watched your shorter video on this topic, then decided to stay up a bit later to watch this too! I love this topic. I'm 7 years sober with AA. I've liked and subscribed. 😊🙏
Thanks so much! I'm glad you found it helpful. And congratulations, and thanks so much for sharing your sobriety. I am a big advocate for "recovering out loud" to inspire others, let people who are suffering they're not alone, and there is definitely hope!
Thank you for this. Much appreciated.
You're ver y welcome! Thanks so much for the comment.
I used to be anti-12-step back in the days. But after having had a spiritual crisis/bottom last fall after nearly 5 years of sobriety, I am now all about following the steps as outlined in the Big Book. So I appreciated your comment at 4:05 about options for a more secular approach to recovery for some. It seems to me that going to 12-step looking for secular recovery is part of the reason that the recovery rates have drastically declined since the Bill W / Dr. Bob days. Yes, lots of people get sobriety out of going to meetings and getting a sponsor, but many (most?) don't actually get the promises of the BB/12 steps if they try to avoid the spiritual aspect. And despite what Ebby told Bill, the BB as written doesn't tell people to come up with their own concept of God; steps 3 and 11 refer to "God as we understood Him." We can never truly understand God (or the many different ways the BB refers to the Higher Power, like Creative Intelligence, Great Reality, Spirit of the Universe etc) which is why we don't have to do the steps with a specific understanding ... just be willing to be open We Agnostics (BB chapter 4). And this doesn't mean, like I heard recently, having your HP be cheese!
Anyone who needs more info on just how spiritual the 12 step program is (at least as written in the Big Book) should look into AA's early history, and especially how the program was informed by the Oxford Group. That's how both Bill W and Dr. Bob got sober!
One quibble with the talk: I think your paraphrase of Jimmy Stewart and It's a Wonderful Life at 8:36 left a little to be desired. His character was actually a very nice guy who was pushed to the edge after a long life of giving to others at his own expense. And he didn't change after jumping into the river, he changed after Clarence (the angel) granted his wish and saw how life would be if he'd never been born. And he's taken through a fairly longish "spiritual experience" where he finds out how just how wonderful his life had been. Just sayin' ... not a big huge deal in terms of the point of your talk, but it's a classic movie. Had to comment. 😊
Hey, thanks for all the various elements you touch on. I can go on, right there with you on all the defining of God, etc. But the Jimmy Stewart point-lol, look at the comments below. Someone else already pointed that out and he explained my faulty (made up) memory of the details. I totally stand corrected ont hat one. Again, thanks for the comments!
Excellent presentation
Jim, I just went through detoxing alcohol withdrawal. The nightmares were the worst. It felt like evil coming out of my mind. I stayed up all night just to avoid them. It's now day 6 , my dreams are peaceful and I sleep well. I have my own philosophy I guess. But I do feel that I achieved some kind of different consciousness. My path is one of creativity, that's my motivation and.....I like who I am. Very good video and I took notes to further understanding. Thanks Jim!
Sorry, thought I had replied to this sooner. Thanks for the comment. How you doing on the detox? From a certain perspective, I actually think our ultimate purpose is to be "creative." That can get sort of deep; but along the lines of being part of, or participating in "creation." Best wishes.
Awesome thank you 🙏
Thank you so much!
Hello Jim, and thank you for your experienced based presentation. I have completely removed the word "opinion" from my vocabulary and thinking when it comes to recovery. Nobody wants to hear what I "think" about sobriety, rather that which I have actually practiced in my day to day living. It's much more palatable to not only the newcomer, but others in the fellowship.
I relate easily to those who use themselves as an example of what or what NOT to do a day at a time, instead of trying to beat someone over the head with cliche's.
Your point about the mere mention of a "spiritual condition" as being a "turn off to them" would be absolutely hilarious, if we were not talking about the fatal behemoth, alcoholism!
I hear people on a regular basis talk about the negative consequences in their lives like, health, relationships, employment, financial, and legal issues they are facing, but downplay the seriousness of those things, when confronted with the possibility of adopting a different way of living. They may not say it out loud, but inside they are screaming, "I CAN'T HAVE ANY OF THAT IN MY LIFE TOO, WHAT WOULD THE NEIGHBORS THINK"?
In most cases the neighbors, family, employers, and legal system already know that you're a train wreck...and I was one of them. Two things happened to me, I surrendered, and started moving my feet differently. From that moment forward, my life has never been the same, and it has been an adventure beyond my wildest hopes! All the best...Mark 5/8/1994
Thanks so much for the thoughtful comments. I got sober in May also, 5/2/88.
Thanks for this, very good on spirituality and an open mind, plus there's many paths to recovery. The only bit you were wrong on was your 'wonderful life' analogy....Jimmy wasn't an 'asshole' in the film....he'd been kind thought on others all his life....
Thanks again
Oh no! I guess I better watch the movie again! Guess I’m conflating it with The Christmas Carol. Thanks so much for the response
2 more things @willmurphy6663 1) So what was the significance of him going in the river? Was there not some critical plot twist related to that? Just a greater appreciation for lif? And 2) Are you familiar with Willie Murphy (RIP) , musician from Minneapolis? He was sort of my musical idol/mentor growing up playing music there.
Hi Jim
The story goes in flashback, he's running his fathers 'kind local bank' his 'alcoholic friend' loses the years profits from the bank on the way to deposit them. Jimmy becomes desperate suicidal...the river scene is him intending to commit suicide.
But in flashback you can see he's been kind and put others before himself. The angel sent to help him, shows him how the lives of others have been changed by his actions. In some ways it's a Charles Dickens Scrooge story but in this case Jimmy needs to understand how his kindness has had a massive effect on others. He does have a complete transformation of perception....
But like I say the video was great thanks again
@@willmurphy6663 wow! Thanks so much. Fascinating. The ultimate point when I talk about any of these kind of transformational experiences is the 'dark night of the soul" being the catalyst that opens the door for the spiritual experience. I guess the lesson is even good guys can have a dark night of the soul. Interesting little fact in there about how alcoholism "dissolves" as I talk about in the video. Thanks again. Important for me to know, as I ve been using that reference lately...
@@JimSavageRecovery
Ok great, storys on transformation:
Charles Dickens Scrooge
St Paul: road to Damascus
In general: the Chinese character for crises': an opportunity for change
It's the whole story and we deep down know this the word recovery says it all recover are God given self that's the whole story
Excellent point. I actually say that same thing in one of my workbooks. I point out "recover" implies getting something back. What is it we're "getting back" when we recovery? Perhaps our original spiritual connection.
Here are some secrets: There is but ONE Spirit. And it is good, because it is "GOD." But in this illusory world, there are many and "evil" spirits. However, these are nothing more than IRRATIONAL THOUGHTS, irrational ideas that all spring from the ORIGINAL irrational idea, which we call "the devil" and "satan." And "evil" is nothing more than IGNORANCE...
The biblical prophet Elijah has returned, as prophesied, and testifies:
I was raised in the Catholic Church and went to Catholic schools, and that was a very good foundation for understanding that there is much more to life than this limited world. But it eventually became clear to me that too much of it didn't make sense. For example, a schizophrenic GOD who is angry, jealous and wrathful in the Old Testament, but "is love" in the New Testament - and the insane belief that GOD's Son had to die as a "sacrifice for our sins." And so I became agnostic for many years - until GOD made Itself known to me directly.
As it turns, my becoming agnostic was due to WISDOM. Because, FEAR causes people to cling to beliefs that don't make sense. And wisdom automatically comes as fear is overcome. Wisdom and fear are inversely proportional. And the Bible serves many purposes, including a fear/wisdom test that doesn't give you Truth until you're ready for it! (Prioritize "the words in red" and discount conflicting statements and you'll get it!)
Few know where AA truly originated, like I do. It originated from a particular channel, one of two that were invaluable in my own GOD-given education. AA wasn't the brain-child of some man or men. It came from THE Higher Power Itself - The Mind That is GOD - through a channel named Edgar Cayce. The work of Edgar Cayce and Helen Schucman ("A Course in Miracles") are two bona-fide works of GOD given through the Holy Spirit in the 20th Century and stand apart from all other channeled works.
When you discover what GOD is and what Jesus Christ ACTUALLY teaches, you discover that the organized religions have butchered the "good news" of Jesus Christ ("The Kingdom of GOD is within you") beyond recognition, into its OPPOSITE (judgment and sacrifice for "sin"). And that's why I was sent as GOD's witness at the end of this cycle of time, to re-state and clarify the "good news" that Jesus Christ brought some 2000 years ago.
Can you see that the Book of Revelation is currently being fulfilled before your eyes? It will get very bad in the short term. But the "good news" is that it will get very good in the long term! "In this world you will have trouble, but be of good cheer, for I have overcome the world." "He who overcomes will inherit all things." - JC
The fact is that EVERYONE will overcome, in time, for that is time's GOD-given purpose and guarantee! "GOD our Savior...will have all men to be saved and come unto knowledge of the truth." (1Timothy 2:3-4)
When you learn exactly what GOD is (The limitless Mind that is ALL), exactly what YOU are ( the "son" of GOD, a limitless Thought in the Mind that is GOD, given the ability to think WITH that Mind), exactly what satan is (the selfish human ego), and exactly why you are here (we partook of an irrational idea, symbolized by the "tree of knowledge of Go(o)d and (d)evil"), and how we will get back Home (by rejecting that irrational idea and overcoming the ego) THEN EVERYTHING MAKES PERFECT RATIONAL SENSE! As Max Planck indicated in his 1944 Florence Italy speech ("On the Nature of Matter"), scientists who pay attention to the quantum physics data can see that this world (of limitation) is a simulation in A Great Mind. GOD has revealed to me WHY we are experiencing it. And Jesus Christ tells you how to leave it behind, and guarantees that you will succeed!
"Judge not and you will not be judged, condemn not and you will not be condemned, forgive and you are forgiven." By forgiving others we effectively forgive ourselves and free ourselves from our prison of ignorance, guilt and fear. THIS IS WHAT SALVATION IS. And this is why it is KEY to know that GOD is the Mind that is ALL Because, it is then possible to forgive others as well as yourself, because you know that all is of GOD and all is for good...and the evil devil is just an irrational idea!
Want to know more? Seek and ye shall find...
Jung did not believe in God, he believed consciousness. The psychic change is being delivered from darkness by God. He restores you back to sanity and the “spirits” flee. Hey will come back if you let them in.
I can relate to this.
That's not true jung says he doesn't believe in God because he knows there's a.god.
You sound allot like Sandy Beach to me
That’s hilarious. I don’t know if that was meant as a compliment but I certainly will take it as one. One of my favorite speakers, and I know that I can sometimes get into flow that sort of emulates him. “…fall by the ‘wayside.’ Ever think about the ‘wayside’? I don’t know where that is, but I don’t think I want to be there.”