Drilling Hardened Steel With Masonry Bits
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- Опубликовано: 5 сен 2015
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The tile cutting blade I used is not ideal for this, since the diamond particles are too large to give a clean cutting edge, but it was good enough for this quick test. 
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Years ago when I worked for a oil well pumping unit shop we drilled bearing races for stop pins to keep the race from spinning in the mounting bracket. We used these masonry bits to accomplish this task on a regular basis. The machinist sharpened the bits and drilled at a low rpm using cutting oil to keep the bit cool.
My old man drilled car leaf springs making gate hinges. He used cutting fluid and a hand brace/ sell. Took a while but back in the day you never had money but you had time
Your technique works. Thank you for the useful advice.
My need was to install and new S.R. Smith diving board on one of their rusting existing jump stands. The manufacturer had changed the specs on the bolts that hold the leaf springs in place from 1/2" to 5/8". Before I found your article, I wrecked two $90 cobalt Silver & Deming bits trying to enlarge the hole in the springs. The cheapest carbibe masonry bit was a Bosch 5/8" with an SDS+ shank from the Depot. The SDS part of the shank was cut off to allow the bit to fit the 1/2" drill press chuck. Lennox Protool Lube did a good job keeping the bit cool and reduce chatter. I ended up with fairly nice holes that I cleaned up with a Dremel Moto-Tool and a grindstone; both sides of the hold were given a modest chamfer, and the cut line in the bores smoothed and polished. The end result took on a professional looking power coat finish.
WOW! It really worked! I had a stubborn broken head bolt that I needed to extract from the iron block and went through so many different drill bits with no luck. This did the trick in less than 10 minutes! Thank you for posting this.
Thank you soooo much!!! I am working on a homemade framelock knife, I spent literally an hour and a half trying to drill some simple holes. I watched your video found an old masonry bit and sharpened by hand on a angle grinder. I thought even if this works my sharpening was probably horrible, but low and behold it cut the three holes I needed like a hot knife thru butter. this works!!! I started to wonder about the drill speed but I took the top off my used ryobi drill press and said forget that I'm not messing with belts to change the speed... but it worked!!! thank you soooo much!!
Nicely done. I might just have to try that trick with the masonry bit.
Thanks for sharing
Roy
Very cool trick. I'll remember that one for sure!
I just found this video because I needed to drill through a piece of Chrome vanadium steel. Never thought it would work as my cobalt drill wouldn't touch it!. Sharpened a 4mm masonry drill and it worked, I got the job finished and I didn't waste the time I'd already spent. THANK YOU :-)
Fifty years ago, I was using masonry bits to drill out Allen screws.
The joys of rounded grub screws
@Yard Sale Dale about $3.50
Good video John. I have used carbide masonry bits to drill through the hard plate of safes many times with a drill rig attached to apply pressure, it does work well.
Wow! This is an awesome tip. I especially love the use of old bits!
You should find that commenter and thank him/her. This is a good idea and I'm very glad you tried it out for us. So many people around the world to share ideas, trials and tribulations. I would not have thought masonry bits would cut hardened steel.
There used to be a company that sold a hybrid drill bit that had carbide tips. They were called Rodman drillbits. I saw a guy demonstrate them at Oshkosh about 20 years ago and I eventually bought a set. The key with those was drill speed. For drilling through hardened metals you used really fast speeds, 3000+RPM. The tip would heat up the metal almost to its melting point and then would drill the hole like butter. They worked great in a drill press.
Friction drilling...search it...or EDM drilling is super cool
.....GREAT VIDEO!!!!!! PLEASE DO A "SHOP TOUR"!!! I ALWAYS LIKE TO SEE HOW OTHER CRAFTSMEN HAVE SET UP THEIR WORK SPACES, WHAT TOOLS THEY PRIZE, AND SOME OF THEIR WORK! AWESOME!!!! THANKS!!!
I've tried drilling wrenches and pliers before and couldn't create more than a small simple. This is a great tip!
+Steve French Thanks Steve. I watched your "Stool Sample" video earlier - good one :D
Sk did it work
Absolutely worked, I had lost hope trying to drill into a friggin thinset trowel, Yes those things are freaking tough to drill, believe it or not and this worked like cutting butter... Thanks for the tip.
I came across your video looking for a way to drill holes into an old planer/thicknesser blade. I eventually did it drilling at 640rpm+oil with a newly sharpened but used masonry 6mm drill bit. It was successful for the two holes I drilled and it may drill another one only. It only takes a minute to sharpen the bit so if I need to make more holes it will not be a problem. Thank you Sir for your advice.
This really opens the door to a lot of ideas, thanks for this one.
Graphics and Sound effects. almost though I was watching network TV. Fun video!
Thank you for doing this I was skeptical that it wouldn't work but you proved me wrong. Now to the hardwear store to get some masonry bits.
Thank you for the video! This absolutely works. I work maintenance at an apartment complex and stumbled across a few cheap chinese made katanas in a move out I was flipping. I figured cool, I can take these long blades and cut some little tanto knives out of the them, mainly to practice different paracord wraps then give them away. Well the cutting and shaping went easy enough with a sawzall and a bench grinder, but when it came to drilling a 1/4 inch hole in the hilts bottom that was another story. Who would have figured that a $10 katana had bulletproof steel for the blades. No drill press so I used a cordless with the blade clamped to my balconys hand rail. After using all my 3 in 1 and smoking out bits from cheap to cobalt ect I had accomplished a dimple maybe 1/32 deep. Watched this video, dug out an OLD black & decker 1/4 masonary bit, sharpened it on a bench grinder and went to work. I had to stop 2 or 3 times per hole to re-sharpen the bit but it worked well enough to drill 9 holes in that steel. Not enough meat left on the bit to sharpen it again but it diffenatly worked. Thanks again for the video.
Good tip for those that have not been stuck before as I have and used this to get me out of the dilemma. One other thing I will suggest is a firm base under the piece being drilled as Carbide is brittle and when the breakthrough happens then support in the form of a bit of scrap metal can save agony. Cheers from John.
I would have never thought of that. Nice job.
Nice to know about the masonry bit. I didn't thing of that. I've ruined so many standard bits trying to drill hardened steel.
That trick with a carbide bit will also work with stainless steel. I had a instance once where I needed to drill several holes through a sheet of stainless with ceramic tile directly behind it. I tried it with a cobalt twist bit but as soon as it broke through, the ceramic completely dulled the bit. On the rest of the holes I used a carbide bit and drilled through everything in one shot. It wasnt the best but it worked.
Thanks for the idea! I needed something like that a few weeks ago.
I may not be as informed as some of your commenters but I have spent 28 years in an industrial toolroom of a Fortune 500 company as a machinist/ toolmaker/tool designer. Your use of a tile cutting wheel( diamonds in a matrix) is probably the best tool to sharpen a carbide cutter. The masonry bit you've chosen is not all carbide but again tungsten carbide in a matrix that is cemented to a HSS shank. A sharp cutting edge is not preferable for carbide as you know it is very brittle but with a Rockwell approaching 90. A suggestion that might work is to soften the actual area that you want to drill (the shank) by direct heat from a torch maybe. You will not be altering the blade hardness if you keep the direct away from the blade, only heat the area to be drilled. But the masonry bit should work. Maybe cut in the 400 to 600 rpm range.
SuperSaltydog77 hey they question for you, I am very inexperienced with hardened steel or steel in general but what is the easiest way to drill through a caliper bolt?
Christian Thomassen replacing the caliper bracket.
Worked well...I used a new bit that I had, saved me a lot of time! Thanks!
2 very good tips. Have a use for the drill bit.
I found that a bit of old thick glass and carborundum valve grinding paste recovered worn stones. I changed direction and kept paste well topped up and results were as good as new.
I have used a glass drill to do that, just use a lot of lubrication or a cutting wax. Also had a SDS bit break the tip off in the hole. Just kept on using it, with no tip. Only needed to do around 5 more holes, and this bit had done a lot of work already. Turned it into a punch afterwards.
Thank you sir for the tip! I'm trying to drill a hole in an old wrench to mount it to a wall. Thanks again!
I came up with this solution on my own... but i just didn't thought to sharpen the masonry Bits! Thx for this video :)
Thanks for the tips! Cant wait to try it on some large bolts iuse for retaining pins!
For steel I use Bosch Multiconstruction bits - the carbide on them is shaped like in regular metal bits and drills like crazy. Regular concrete bits without modification work quite well to enlarge the hole previously drilled by smaller bit. Only drawback is You won't be able to get accurate hole - for example 6 mm drills are in fact bigger, 6,2- 6,5 even. Still I find them ok for my knifemaking uses.
Yes, i did it too- driled the handle of a forged scythe with Bosch multiconstruction, very fast - beat the milwaukee Tin drill bits..
So cheers to you 👍
Good tip!
+Applied Science Thanks :)
Heh. I see what you did there
As you say, that's a nice one-time solution to have in your back pocket, if needed.
Ive been using masonary drills here in the U.K. for drilling hardened steels for decades, they work really well. The only thing i would suggest when sharpening them is sharpen as you have but then grind the cutting face along the drills axis, this gives the cutting edge much more strength as the rake is reduced and the cutting edge is more 'buttressed'. you will find the drill bit will take a lot more punishment then before loosing its edge.
Good info John. I don't usually drill metal but I'll keep that in mind.
looks like the stone repair worked well, thanks for the tip
Had to drill some cast iron gutters a while back which were overly hard. It was blunting drills and hardly making an impact. Masonry drills turned out to be the solution for that too.
Which one did you use? Name and brand
I sharpened a masonary bit to use for drilling holes where I might encounter nails during a renovation. I also use it when drilling holes through stucco and plaster. I have been using that bit for the last five years.
I've heard that bits would work for this use but never tried it, good job! Surprised that epoxy adhered to oily stone also.
very nice work! I love your wood vice on your workbench
Handy Tip, thanks John
That’s a really good tip, thanks!
Love that wooden vice. Going to have to make one.
You can sharp a widia drill bit (masonry bit, or tungsten carbide bit) using a cheap flat diamond masonry cutting disc. Grinder stones for widia are a bit expensive.
Love your experiments
You can also use arc drilling to make holes in any conductive material. Simply uses high frequency high current discharge through a hollow drill bit, with a water injection inside the bit. Material is also immersed in water. Pretty straight forward but requires special electronics and tooling.
Jake Britton soooooo, not that straight forward.
nice video , i seen a germin do this a long time ago . in germany they actualy sell a bit set for hard steel and they look like black gold masonry bits . he also pointed out that you must expect the need to push the bit into the work with twice the force you would on other jobs
WOW THAT'S SUPER AWESOME! thanks for sharing that.
You have a lotta courage just holding that by hand !
The guy is a fool, he could have lost a couple of fingers.
this helped me soo much bcs i every time while i was making some knife from old saw blade i had to do hole with metal cuter and it damaged the handle... this will help me and work with that steel will be soo easy now
Awesome tip. It worked like a champ when cobalt tipped bits wouldn't
LOVE the idea I must try it.
Thank you so much I was struggling with us until I watched your video
Wow. That's quite amazing. I would have never believed it!
+TheGeekPub Thanks. I just watched a couple of your videos - good stuff :)
Nice video, as always!
I seen a drill bit set for sale at the Oshkosh air show for $80 . sales man dilled through a flat file with a hand drill like it was mild steel. I regret not buying a set.
I've wondered the same, thanks for testing it!
Very handy idea thanks for sharing. I do feel the metal should have been clamped down so you can continue to make great videos with all your fingers. - Thanks again.
just tried, ..... awesome!!!! you are a legend!!!
You saved me. Cheers from Brazil!
Bought a Norton 4000/8000 wet stone (originally to sharpen my straight razor), also had a really nice 1000 grit diamond plate (forgot the brand), I lost the damn diamond plate. The diamond plate was really how I got the Norton perfectly flat, and it did an incredible job sharpening EVERYTHING. Loooved that sharpening plate, I'm still mad at myself for loosing it.
This worked for me. Thank you.
I'd also consider reducing the distance from drill tip to chuck. The long shank on the bit seems to be wobbling. This would reduce the cutting action. Also, the carbide wont mind the heat up, but the work piece could work harden. That could get exciting during or after drilling.
Wow..never knew this! I had a hard time drilling a t-post (spring steel) ...even with a new specialty drill bit made for metal.
good tip. i have ran into that problem before. i don't drill a lot of hardened steel, but good to know if i only have 1 or 2 holes to drill. thanks
I need to drill out a deep down stuck bit in impact driver anvil. I'll try. Thanks for the idea.
When I was a kid I dropped my dad's sharpening stone and it broke in two. I put it back on the bench with the two pieces pushed together hoping he wouldn't notice, (silly me). He chiseled a hole the same size as the stone in a block and glued it in place. That was over 30 years ago and he still uses it today.
Awesome. Love your channel
Very informative! I suscribed to this channel
GREAT TIP FOR DRILLING HARD STEEL. THANKS
Before actually watching this video I could not think of any reason to drill holes in my tools. Now I have a good reason. Now I have to do it to all of them. 😄
This will also make it easier for me to bolt my tools down to something solid so that people won't steal them.
Excellent tip. I can actually use that immediately to drill a hole in a broken bolt for extraction.
I noticed your wood vice, do you happen to have a video for building that?
Thx
I strongly recommend getting a good cross vice and or using clamps to hold your work while drilling anything, but especially hard steel.
That was my thought. If the bit sticks in the metal bar it will become a spinning blade.
He did it on purpose, he hates to have 5 fingers in each hand.
at my old work every now and then we would have to drill a hole in something thats already been hardened, long story short the drill was to grab a handfull of masonry bits and just burn them out until you made it through, we never used lube or coolant either, not saying it was the best method but its what i was taught. one tip you may not of heard though is to grind them kinda like you would a twist drill for brass, but where the cutting edge actually has positive rake, just at the edge. a couple guys actually used them for bronze instead of hss because then they didnt have to screw around with geometry and resharpening their drills all the time
Check out the channel AvE, he uses your idea to remove a broken hardened tap with a 'burr' bit, worked a treat.
BEST tip I've seen in a long time , How @#$%ng usefull
I know when drilling stainless its important to lower the rpms. So try drilling the holes at the lowest speed available on your drill press because high speed creates heat and work hardens the metal. use more cutting fluid, that does help, you need to keep the bit cool as possible to avoid work hardening. CRC cutting fluid or Tap Magic is a good cutting oil, worst case scenario is to dip the drill bit in cold water over and over I guess. plus there are charts available to show you exactly what feed speeds to drill stainless for different thicknesses.
most folks think you need a carbide bit or a cobalt bit to drill stainless but any standard high speed steel HSS bits will do. but if all you have is a masonry bit this does work! but as I said, use more cutting fluid and lower the speed.
Awesome!! Going to try this on a file. Thanks!!!!
Thanks, I learnt something today...
Well, that's very useful info, as I need to drill through 6 spanners!
It is sort if like a boring bar, I guess.
For applications like this my favorite cutting fluid is actually crisco or a similar (read: inexpensive) vegetable shortening. It tends to float the chips out effectively due to the viscosity, and has to absorb a bit of heat in order to melt, so it carries it away when it heats up, liquifies, and runs away.
Those bits might work to widen the indexing holes on your planer knives. I've tried this in the past with no luck. The blades are case hardened.
+GarageWoodworks Interesting idea, I'll give that a try when I pull the current set out again.
+I Build It When I tried it, I screwed the knife to a board through a couple holes to keep it from spinning and chopping my hand off. None if the bits I had would do the job. This looks promising. Then you'd just need to design a knife setting jig, which I am sure you'd come up with something cool.
@@GarageWoodworks if they are case hardened all you need to do is remove the case hardened outside layer then you should be able to drill fine. Grinder or abrasives work to get through top layer. The material underneath is usually half as hard or less in some instances
Thanks for the tips
Ill be dammed ! I didnt think that would work As well as it did Thanks
Interesting information!
Very good. Hadn't thought of that, but it makes total sense! I used Carbide tipped cutting tools on my lathe, and carbide milling cutters in my Milling machine, so why not convert those masonry drill bits! As long as they have enough clearance on the cutting angle, they should work just fine :)
A Drill Doctor works great to put a sharp and centered edge on a masonry bit. Also, keep the speed down when using carbide bits to reduce heat build up.
Love the new outro
my first indication that something was amiss, was the sounds that were coming from the bit. feeds and speeds for carbide on different materials are far more different than for hss. if your trying to drill a hole in something like tool steel, lots of lube. start very small and step up slowly. if you try to take a big bite the tool will break/dull. the other suggestion I have is allow the tool to do the work and try not to force it. last suggestion is as the Dia of the tool gets bigger the rpm should go down. I could go into great detail about feeds and speeds, but that would be counter productive. especially with a hand fed drill press.
Forged in Fire guys need to see this . . . .pretty cool to know thanks. . . i would have been a skeptic as well
Wow! That is too cool!
Thats a really cool wooden bench vise! Did you make that?
If I remember correctly from my die making friends said that concrete bits are sharpened when they get them at 118 degrees, and I hope that is cutting fluid that you are spraying on there and not just normal oil or you are just reversing the sharpening and only polishing your bit.
thanks, it really works well!
You really should use a solid carbide straight flute drill. I use those in my machine shop and they will drill a broken tap for example. Your second video you are drilling a file, the file is about 60 rockwell hardness. The drills you were using MIGHT drill it, but the flutes are chipping on the serrations of the file, so its breaking the cutting edges before it gets a chance to drill. The problem with the masonry bit is getting it to start, and my next paragraph covers an issue with drilling the serrations of the file.
You would need about 1100 rpm to run a .25" dia hole with a straight flute carbide drill, with some type of lubrication preferred, we use a water/mineral oil based coolant/lubricant so even tap magic would work, just dont overload the drill let it work, and also maybe pregrind the serrations off in a small area to start the drill in a file for example. Carbide is very brittle, chatter and "snagging" are its enemies.
You may already know all of this, but just sharing what works for me. Obviously the rpm would have to be adjusted with different diameters as well.
Here is a link to purchasing the drills, for a large hole they get pricey, up to about 1/4 they are not too bad approximately 40.00 or less and would be used multiple times. They will typically drill 65 rockwell (we drill bearing races and thats the hardness range they work in)
Again my.02 only, drill on and have fun
Keep the drill bit cool by using clay to make a circular dam on the workpiece around the location of the hole to be drilled. Fill the dam with water. The water will hold the bit temperature down as it will boil off at 212 degrees F. Replenish as needed.I once used a variation of this method to repair a clevis on a clutch cable. To prevent heating the cable, I ran the clevis end up though a hole in a tuna can, sealed around the cable with clay and filled the can with water. This allowed me to deposit weld on the clevis to repair where it had worn through.
Ive got to drill through 1/4" hardened steel angle iron used for channel for grates in a driveway. Then 5"" deep into concrete to apply sleeved anchors. Every bit I've used to try to go through steel channel is done soon as tip hits concrete. My hammer drill with concrete bits fine once holes big enough to get to concrete. But every steel bit Ive tryed dulls and cant get through. Trying to drill 1/2" hole for 1/2" sleeved anchor. Hole in angle has to be a little bigger to fit concrete bit.