Controller SCOLDS PILOTS after Dangerous Action at Toronto Pearson
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- Опубликовано: 12 апр 2024
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How could they think that switching to Ground without instruction and that earlier before crossing the (departing) runway was a good idea?
Sometimes people do things out of habit. e.g., hence checklists.
It wasn't a conscious decision. A busy human brain is so good at anticipating the next steps that it may do steps ahead of time. Falling behind is a terrible feeling.
Exhaustion leads to automatic behaviors.
It does NOT help that the entire aviation industry loves changing flight numbers … remembering your own flight number on the 7th leg of the day is hard enough
@@MomedicsChannelNot a pilot but I've thought the same thing many times, that I'd have to have an index card or something with my number in big Sharpie or else I'd have very little chance of getting it right. "American, uh, something with a 7 and maybe a 4, tower?"
The seriousness of the situation comes into clearer focus when it's seen as what it is on the pilot's part - a loss of situational awareness. Situational awareness is crucial to aviation safety, and I hope Air Canada has a rigourous, though constructive, discussion with the pilot about that.
Before continuing to their gate, Jazz 7738 was instructed to hold in the corner of the apron for 10 minutes to think about what they did. 😉
A truly Canadian punishment if I ever heard one!
In order to be properly Canadian, I think they'd need to send them to the penalty box.
As a funny aside, O'Hare actually had one of their holding areas (mainly used for aircraft waiting for their gate to be available) that was named and charted as "penalty box." - haha - I don't see one labeled that on their current airport diagram, though.
@@vbscript2yea they got rid of the penalty box but some ops and pilots still refer to it as the penalty box. It’s called the Alpha or Bravo Pad now.
Im sure the passengers deserved that.
wdym?
That's a right proper Canadian scolding if I've ever seen one.
hahahahahaha
That's just Canadian facts 😂
That’s aboot enough out of you me buddy!
@@georgewillis8258I'm not your buddy, guy!!
holy moly
The controllers were very polite. Kennedy Steve would've ripped them a new one. 🤣
I really miss hearing Steve. He was firm, but always professional.
@@kcgunesqhe had a great sense of very dry humor.
Everyone loves Kennedy Steve like you stated earlier he’ll rip them a new one but these Canadian ground controllers giving them a proper spanking
That's because Kennedy steve was an embarrassment to our profession.
People think it's all fun and games, but the number of incidents in the US that happen due to the terrible phraseology is shocking. Everyone laughing until the controller messes up, then it's all complaints.
@@MW-zm8sd no need for agenda but I have to give props for Canada ground control for speaking out to air Canada jazz regional aircraft for changing frequency they were right on point it’s dangerous to change frequency while taxiing
It took me a few listenings to figured out whats wrong so here's the recap if anyone is confused as well.
Jazz 7738 was cleared by tower to cross 06L, they are supposed to cross, and wait for instruction before switching to ground.
Jazz switched to ground (the wrong ground, there's multiple ground frequencies) and informed them that they are crossing, while still on the runway. You're supposed to be on tower frequencies while on the runway unless given other instructions.
Since it's the wrong ground controller Jazz is talking to, they are not expecting any runway crossing. Upon hearing that the controller issued a hold short, which is the right thing to do since he's not sure who's crossing what. When he finds out through talking to his colleagues, he let Jazz continue while switching them to the correct frequency.
The issue here is not Jazz crossing the runway without instruction like most runway incursions. This is a case of the plane being on a runway and unexpectedly going to a wrong frequency talking to the wrong person.
Amateur pilot here. I figured they switched frequency after being cleared to cross the RWY. Idk much about big airports procedure but I’d rather wait. I guess the pilot in this aircraft flew a lot to Pearson and might be used to switching frequency on certain airport ground.
That’s one of the differences between the US and everywhere else I see. In the US people switch from Ground to Tower and from Tower to Ground at will unless instructed otherwise. The ICAO way makes sense but the FAA does these things to prioritize speed.
Pilot just forgot they’re not in Kansas anymore.
@@xplayman BS
@@xplayman No
@@MjixaAfter landing you should never switch frequency until told by the tower even after you exited the runway.
Looked like everyone had their Timmies this morning, and any accidents were caught before something bad happened. 👍
Well done, controllers!
Are you referring to Tim Horton's coffee? I drink it everyday.
@@sarahalbers5555I work in the US and we just got Tim Hortons. We do “Timmy Tuesdays” at work, every week. 🇨🇦
Switching to the wrong frequency for ground without telling anyone while crossing an active runway. What could possibly go wrong?
Don't forget they were told to expedite, so you REALLY want to be aware.
Too much maple syrup this morning eh?
Tower cleared them to cross. Ground didn’t know anything about them because tower hasn’t transferred them to him. Ground’s response was based on that he didn’t remember giving anyone a crossing clearance so he told them to stop until he can figure it out.
@@Jopanaguiton needless to say when the other controller was expecting them to expedite across the runway, and the new surprised controller's first action is to panic stop them on the runway... they created a very unsafe operation.
One thing I absolutely hate at some airports, tower DOES NOT switch us to ground frequency. We know we need to go to ground but the controller just goes quiet. Meanwhile we're rolling off the runway unsure of exactly where to go and what to do (without a proper clearance). If you know, you know, it creates this weird gray area when rolling off the runway and going a direction without a clearance.
Throw a wrench in the mix, some airports you switch frequency without anyone telling you to. Some airports you wait for tower to call you... Try going to Chicago O'Hare and trying to make the first call to ground or tower (on departure).
I think all parties involved including the pilots handled this professionally and as it should.
Well switching frequencies without instruction ( to the wrong one ..) before crossing an active runway should be in the textbooks as a prime example of professionalism.. 🤦🏻 are you guys for real ?? 🤦🏻🤦🏻
Loving the polite Canadian scold. You guys are the best!
they were going to put American subtitles... but decided that it was far to foul to translate.
Kudos to the ground controller for the way he managed that interaction. That type of safety issue cannot be overlooked, but the secondary scolding was handled with finesse.
Yet in YVR you're expected to switch ground frequencies without a prompt. Not usually one to come to the defence of team hat, but it's the inconsistencies across the country that cause something like this.
I think ground contact instructions should be mandatory. I do at my airport and we have one runway and one taxiway. It's been a few years since I"ve worked YVR tower, but pretty sure I did it there too.
The difference is that in YVR, you aren’t crossing a runway when you switch. Toronto is one of many airports that have airplanes remain on tower frequency to cross active runways. JFK, LAX, LAS, SEA, SFO to name a few. This specific scenario seems like inexperience. They also didn’t expedite like requested.
Remaining on tower frequency until clear of the inner runwat for clise parallel runways is procedure everywhere. YVR doesn't have close parallels.
Yesterday I flew on an Air Canada Flight operated by Jazz.
Thankfully I waited until today to get caught up on watching VASAviation videos!
ATC & Ground were good sports about it
Ground is also ATC btw. Same license, in fact.
At least she took it like an adult and didn’t argue.
This reminds me of Air Canada 781 at SFO where the crew inadvertently changed frequency from tower to ground after getting their clearance to land. Tower then told them to go around but since they changed frequency, they didn’t hear them.
Is that the one wherein the tower also flashed lights on the aircraft to go-around?
@@aleccross3535Yep, I believe that’s the same one
Controllers handled this well. Didn’t fully berate the pilots but made their feelings clear. Bravo.
There must have been some kind of experience or complacency here. My feeling is the plane is under control of the captain. Q400 nose wheel steering is on the left. That would make the first officer the pilot monitoring, doing all the comms. The captain might’ve told her to switch over and she didn’t question it like she should have. Or this is just bad decision making. I did think though that was an interesting possibility.
Someone in the comments said this could be habit from the US. If thats how the US works, using ground while still having to cross runways, thats a bad procedure. In my eyes every aircraft should be on tower until they are clear of however many runways they need to cross. Like in this situation.
Just going by memory, I recall examples of (US) tower keeping the plane on tower frequency to cross active runways. I do not recall examples of the plane being switched to ground and then crossing, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen that way either.
Jazz is a Canadian carrier. In the US, ground only handles runway crossings when local has delegated that to them. Normally, local does it
Flown into Toronto multiple times. Honestly really nice controllers there at least from my experience!
That’s the most vicious Canadian scolding I’ve ever heard.
I worked here for 20yrs (up to 2018). This was somewhat common. Clearly a new pilot, possibly first time landing on 06R and crossing 06L. No other action would have been taken, lesson learned (they were not sent to think for 10min, we don't do that anymore). We have had aircraft read back the hold short and not stop, that was way more an issue, especially that we would have the stop bars on strength 5 until the crossing was issued. She just switched early and to the wrong ground (N Gnd), and the receiving N Gnd controller, was understandably confused (N Gnd deals with Rwy 05 in this operation so would have to physically turn around to see the aircraft, save from looking at the ASDE). The procedure we use is the Landing Tower controller for 06R (who is also the inboard 06L departing controller) is to retain ownership of the crossing aircraft until switched to ground (issuing the freq in the switch) mid way across the inboard runway 06L. She just switched early and to the wrong freq. We used to say "remain with tower", but dropped that when crews gained experience, but clearly COVID and new pilots in the system we will need to reintroduce that phraseology again for a while.
In Canada, correct me if I’m wrong, they give you an address to send a letter to.. somewhere in Kitchener I think.
Hey VASAviation, I don't know a better way to send the info, but there might be some interesting audio from AA3361 leaving MCI yesterday. Mid-air lightning strike, caused a return to MCI. Don't know where to find audio.
That was the nicest scolding I’ve ever heard
I don't know how it is over in the states, but at least in Europe some airports have automatic frequency change to ground, and some other don't. It's quite inconsistent therefore also quite easy to miss in the airport ref pages.
What are you talking about? Can you give an example? As convenient as auto switching would be, there still seems to be a lot of possible issues that could come from that. In this video as an example, the pilots "auto changed" without being told to do so.
@@davidfrank5227 landing EHAM for example. Then you should automatically switch to the respective ground frequency without tower asking you after vacating.
Toronto is not in the states
@@OntarioTrafficMan sorry, my bad.
Could you cover ATC from the massive storm that was in Dubai yesterday and today? They had to close airport ops due to flooding and had multiple heavies landing in the storm, diversions, etc. it was chaos
Was waiting for... "Ope, sorry aboot that" 😂
It’s funny enough that their callsign is Jizz. Or Jazz. But jazz isn’t from Canada and never was.
Toronto Pearson video, time to listen to some Rush
About the "unprofessional" comment from the tower...
Are there a lot more people with autism around or has 24/7 internet use seriously stunted basic humour and sacrasm receptors in people? The controller was lightening the mood and letting the pilots know that, despite a potentially serious infraction, they were getting let off with a warning. The comment was to make it memorable, communicate the severity of the situation, but also limit the punishment to a small roast. This was unambiguously a favour to the pilots and an expression of friendliness.
It's also the Canadian way, speaking as an American who's lived in Canada for 15 years. There were no raised voices, just a professional scolding. You even hear "For future reference...do this".
I think a lot of people communicate only in writing now, and they've lost the ability to understand spoken tone.
Yep I am a controller and the translation of that comment is "We arent reporting this, so you dont need to". Obviously its not ideal to say that explicitly so it usually gets said in a roundabout way.
That's scary
In the US we have 3 words that prevent this from happening: “Remain this frequency”
Really!? You say that with each transmission?
@@edgarwideman737In instances like this where a pilot is expecting a frequency change, yes. We say it hundreds of times a day at ORD.
I have heard that at a Canadian airport controlled by military ATC but not Nav Canada, interesting point.
You have MANY more issues in the US though, shall we speak about them? 😂
That south side of the airfield is a disaster waiting to happen
I guess the Canadians were too busy watching hockey to give a number to call 😂😂😂 (it's a joke. Not meant literally) 😅😂😂😂 🇨🇦 🇺🇸 ❤️
As a Canadian, I approve of @JordanHourGlassDJ 's message!
@@MaltaMcMurchy Thank you 😎😉🙏🏻
Here in Canada, I don't think there is or has ever been a number to call; what you heard on the radio may be the last of it, unless a letter arrives in the mail. I never got either of these, so I don't know for sure. Our local tower had a TV in the break room, nothing (am/fm or TV) in the cab.
They just put you against a wall and start chucking hockey pucks at you until you learn your lesson.
Well the playoffs are days away....
Controllers only have to know the rules for one airport. Pilots have to know the rules for dozens of different airports. And they are all different.
I just scolded a pilot for that yesterday. 😂
That's my biggest pet peeve.
The only time I automatically switch frequencies on the ground without being told is when I'm number 1 holding short of a runway and wanting to take off on that runway... I go from ground to tower and let them know I'm good to go.
Brutal. Student pilot level.
that's dei for ya.
Sounds like she is pretty new and inexperienced. She learned the hard way, that was a serious beating!
Toronto is the San Francisco of Canada.
“That’s incredibly dangerous.”
Why would we need to shout or pound on someone? The words are extremely clear to me.
Vive le Canada 🇨🇦 😂
That was the most canadian beating by an ATC that I've heard.
What day did this happen?
Hello! it would be interesting to hear the conversation beetween flight Ryanair FR8780 and Turin ATC. Unfortunately today a passenger had a stroke and pilots, in origin headed to Lamezia Terme, had to immediately return back to Turin Airport. Thank you!
For those who don't know, Jazz is essentially the regional division of Air Canada. They operate through Pearson YYZ frequently and as such even though I'm not a pilot it seems logical to me that anyone piloting a Jazz aircraft should be familiar with operating procedures & controller expectations at YYZ.
I understand that this is not just YYZ procedure; a pilot shouldn't switch from a frequency until instructed. Im just a bit dumbfounded how such a break in procedure happened at what is essential their main airport. Complacency is the only thing that comes to mind.
Yes but no. At many airports you are also expected to switch to ground/tower without being instructed. Every airport has its own procedures and expectations.
Yeah, but like he said, this is their home airport. Procedures there should be rock solid!
@@TangoDelta8111they could have also been YUL, YYC, or YVR based.
They are a daily Toronto customer but also they spend a lot of time at airports where Tower is just one person....also they have a lot of very low hour pilots right now who have most of their experience at small airports. Auto-switching is quite common among inexperienced pilots in northern Ontario...even in enroute. Perhaps I should make it a habit when controlling to tell them not to....up north it rarely matters and we get lazy so the pilots get this habit.
"I'm Sorry"...YUP.
Ya bud, that's dangerous but all good, eh! Enjoy some timmies this mornin'!
I can certainly see where force of habit, like others are saying, would be the problem here. At airports in the US, generally if the tower doesn’t tell you to switch, you’d get off the runway, hold, switch to ground, and then request taxi. Then again, they were still rolling and they needed to cross a fairly close parallel so I can also see where they should not have switched to ground at all.
My home airport out of which I operate has parallel runways and any “taxi across” or “hold short of” instructions are given by tower. They tell you to contact Ground once across both runways. I feel like that’s pretty standard, though knowing how atrocious ATC standardization is across the United States that’s anyone’s guess.
If thats how it works in the US it needs to change. That is absolutely ridiculous and is a total disgrace to make it that obscure. One of the many reasons the US is going to have a runway incursion accident if they don’t make policy changes.
@@UpAndReady Everything you said made sense until you started talking about ATC in the U.S. Jazz airline, a subsidiary of Air Canada and airport with IATA code XYZ, Toronto Pearson International Airport, were the only three voices I heard in this video. What does the US have to do with this one?
@@beachbum77979 I only say that because the home airport of mine I mentioned is in the U.S.
@@cfairfull8030 I agree. Even if it’s just “N123AB Vacate Echo and contact ground” or “123AB stay with me, taxi via…” from tower, I would be totally ok with that being incorporated into regulated phraseology. Does not leave a space for questioning.
Wow. That was very dangerous. I’m surprised they didn’t get a “number to call” from the tower.
In Canada, genrally ATC just files paperwork, and Transport Canada can take care of the phone calls.
@@arcticaircraftsame here in the UK.
The calling a number is a US thing, I think. I am a controller in Canada and Ive only been asked to give a pilot the managers number one time in my whole career. Their response was "can we call collect?" XD
This wasn't dangerous. Improper procedure for this airport yes. Pilots were cleared to cross. They verified the runway was clear and crossed. The JFK incident yesterday was dangerous.
The fact that that they weren't given a number to call tells you how Canadian this whole thing is! 😅
Jazz, we need to talk about your TPS reports
last year after the JFK incident where AAL 777 crossed a runway, after doing the same uncommanded frequency shift, one of the JFK tower controllers absolutely unloaded on pilots who do this sort of thing in the NTSB report. spent several paragraphs complaining about hotshot pilots who switch frequencies way too early lol
Always stay on tower until you’re clear of all the runways, or told to switch.
He's got her there. I can appreciate having the next frequency tuned and ready to go, but you can't switch without being told because different controllers have different areas of responsibility, and they might not have talked about you yet. My last go around was because someone switched to ground while they were still on the runway and couldn't hear the tower yelling at them on the radio to expedite off. Details matter, kiddos.
Not entirely true. This is what the 7110.65 states
In situations where the controller does not want the pilot to change frequency but the pilot is expecting or
may want a frequency change, use the following phraseology.
PHRASEOLOGY−
REMAIN THIS FREQUENCY.
Just heads up, brother, always a great show. Just heads up an aircraft, just crashed. They are looking for survivors
There's a joke about the TPS reports in here somewhere. Jazz 7738 apparently didn't get the memo.
Not enough coffee!
I wonder why you get the subtitling wrong when I'm talking in your vids (tower)...
Hardly dangerous
I'm not gonna lie. I'm sick and tired of my FOs switching to ground when still on a runway being crossed. They will be getting a briefing from now on not to do that, period. Not until we are truly across.
On the flip side, and I truly hope that will get resolved quickly: when we cross a runway we need more than just crossing instructions. Which taxiway you want me to turn onto? Maybe give me the crossing AND the subsequent taxiway so I don't have to stop and make an aircraft behind me stop on the runway? "Aircraft XYZ, turn right at taxiway A, cross runway XY at intersection B" - you are leaving absolutely no chance for there to be any confusion as opposed to "Aircraft XYZ, cross runway XY at B" - they switch, jammed up and busy frequency - and now we gotta stop and the aircraft behind us gets screwed. I'm talking to you, LAX 25R and MCO 35L and all other towers that can get jammed by this. Its not entirely safe not giving us a taxiway to turn onto after crossing. One day - it'll cause a big problem.
Is this what Canadian scolding sounds like?
For me, this ATC was just trying to lighten the mood for the newly erring female pilot with some playful banter. I don't understand why so many people find his words so offensive... There were no personal attacks, no irrational insults, just a clear pointing out of the mistake and suggestions for improvement. Can that really be considered offensive? I thought pilots were a profession known for their resilience to pressure.
So many people? Where are they? Don't make problems up when there are none. People are pretty relaxed about it.
Why did you feel the need to bring her gender into it? No one ever says 'male pilot' in these comments sections do they? (my @s are off)
@@SewingandSnakes Because she is a female?
I've only seen one comment that seemed to think ATC was too harsh, so I think the consensus is that ATC didn't do anything wrong here. Personally, I think this is about as professional of a scolding as one could expect for what could have turned into a serious incident. Lest we forget that lives are on the line.
The dash-8 is a two crew aircraft. The voice we heard is of the pilot monitoring, not the pilot flying.
Cross 06L, no hold short, no EXPEDITE!!!
What
@@VASAviation Tower said to cross the runway. Then after Jazz switched freq, ground said hold short of runway but changed it to expedite crossing. Pilot in the wrong, just found it funny how quickly the instructions changed.
Nah don't this on an active runway, you're not only messing with the tower's plans,but also the next arrival which I'm assuming was on a short final (hearing the panic in the controller's voice), they would have had to go around for no reason
I'd expect 06L to be used (with 05) for departures, arrivals are 06R (and 05).
No arrivals on 06L
@@VASAviation Which is why they don't get switched. If there is no arriving traffic on the Runway you are crossing it makes little sense to go to tower.
@@Quotenwagnerianer there are departures on that runway
@@VASAviation You are right of course.
I misunderstood the situation anyway. I thought they were taxiing out. But they already were on tower because they had just landed and switched over to ground prematurely.
That's why the controller didn't switch them. D'oh...
If they landed 6R... 6L would NEVER be used... and they were given permission to cross. Although she fucked up there was -0 % danger here.
Must have been some danger, they were told to expidite the crossing!
It was being used for takeoff
Controller: "Taxi to taxiway A, eh? "
Pilot: "Taxiway AA?"
Controller: "Not taxiway AA, eh? I said taxiway A, eh?"
Hoser.
Beauty
This is private pilot knowledge. I don’t know what she was thinking.
“she”
The probable cause is right there in your own words.
It's extremely common to switch to ground frequency without being instructed. It's not common at this airport though.
@@troybaxter2916 That’s something you do when you’ve arrived to your departure runway.
@@mjo3275 It can be yes. But there are also many airports where you are expected to switch to ground after landing.
@@troybaxter2916 I would understand if she wasn’t cleared to cross and called when she got there but She was cleared for an expedited taxi across the runway and read it back
I'm in the minority camp I'm sure, but I think the controller bears a large part of the responsibility here. 2-1-17 in the 7110.65:
In situations where the controller does not want the pilot to change frequency but the pilot is expecting or
may want a frequency change, use the following phraseology.
PHRASEOLOGY−
REMAIN THIS FREQUENCY.
I don't know if it was just the graphic, but I didn't see any "expedite" in there at all. I was expecting a landing aircraft while she was (edit: not her) tip-toeing across the runway.
She wasn't controlling the aircraft. She was handling RTs while the captain was doing the taxiing.
And yes, one can't be sure that the graphics are entirely accurate.
@@BlueSkyUp_EU Understood, but I never blamed her for it. If the captain didn't hear the instructions or heard them and ignored them, that's a much bigger problem. The tower said 'expedite' twice and she didn't even acknowledge it the first time.
@@easternpa2Yeah, I noticed that too. But that it's also on ATC. They are supposed to catch incomplete readbacks and make the pilot repeat full instruction.
oops
moral of this story, dont call early. if they had called after crossing as they were expected to they would have just got a polite you are on the wrong frequency eh
Never heard someone announcing they’re crossing a runway after getting clearance, this is a weird one.
This is what 300 hr flight instructors in the seats of dash 8s and RJs looks like, and unfortunately it's going to only get worse with the "Jazz (Missed) Approach" program.
Couldn't ATC just use the "All Call" feature of the radio console to transmit on all frequencies? Sure they likely will step of people but being a rare occurrence they could alert the ATC room so they can hold off for a few seconds and blast a "Jazz 7738 return to Ground Frequency".
"Exit there at D3..." Not expedite.
ah nice, asking for consent to give redundant shaming, then doing it after the person said don't. Go men
The Captain of Jazz 7738 is a Real
Little John Notionless !
ATC Asked TWICE to EXPEDITE !🙄
Glorious & Pacient CoPilot Girl !
Handled the Situation Gracefully and Politely !
Kudos For Her Professionalism !
Ah yes, yet another potential fatal accident due to antiquated 100+ yr old mode of communication.
Simplex AM voice comms are barely adequate to hold a conversation between two people. Why does the aviation community accept this as their primary and only form of communication? It's ludicrous.
That’s what happens with a 250 hour on the right seat and still learning.
She hardly expedited, slow as a week in the jail
How do you know what the captain, who is not the one on the radio, is doing? That is just a computer generated graphic, not an actual trace of the aircraft's real-time movement.
as PM (Pilot Monitoring) she ain't flying/taxiing the aircraft. The one one the radio doesn't drive! Its called CRM
Controllers asking pilots if they got enough of a beating or want more is telling of the power complex that is so pervasive in the minds of so many in the field. It's beyond unprofessional and probably even pathological
Naa it's not that field specifically. The world is full of losers with massive egos, some just happen to be in this field.
That said, to be fair the controllers were in the right here.
Jon Doe can't take authority or simple instructions I guess. Judging by other sexist comments he's made, I know who he voted for 😂
Jazz possible pilot deviation. I have an Email for you to copy...we dont ise phone numbers up in errrr.
Jazz is a professional commercial passenger airline. Yikes.
It's Air Canada's regional feeder. Lots of young pilots.
Some controllers were born to be HOA presidents.
There was no "Sorry"?
Yes, there was
@@VASAviation Oops. Sorry (yes I'm Canadian)
Yet another example of why I do not fly AC. DEI at its finest.
I see the pilot DEI hires are starting to show.
🇨🇦 🍁 🏒
They got the scolding the 1st time. Second controller, a jack ass
you're simply a moron if you think the controller was the problem here
This seems like a case of ATC getting mad the pilot wasn't apologetic enough. Hate to see their parenting skills.
No, the pilot should've never switched. Pilots do that when they get complacent.
@@mistahshade pilot did wrong, fine. That's a nasty controller right there too. Both things can be true.
@@rsybing there is never enough caution... they didn't give them a number so imo they weren't nasty
@@giftmorzel6318 nah, they were looking for more contrition than they were trying to educate. After the third or fourth scolding, you got to wonder if they were more on tilt than anything else.
@@rsybing I'm guessing you're not a pilot.
BACK GROUND - YYZ (toronto) is having too many close calls with runway incursions (due for a hull loss at this rate) and the controllers are being told to keep their language as CLEAR and CONCISE and possible - thats why canadian controllers speak CLEAR eng, vs the ATC dummies in america, who mutter, sutter and flutter their language to the point of speaking so fast, and unclear, that its causing issues.
Sounds like a sour Canadian. Think I read somewhere that the United States handles over 12 times the amount of traffic as Canada?
@@Quatermain98526 why is it sour if its the truth ???? america does almost everyting better than canada, this is one of the few exceptions were faa is a joke
@@Quatermain98526 Pre COVID YYZ was the 9th busiest for traffic in North America. so we do move traffic
@@donwhitton7791 not saying it's NOT busy, but YYZ is equal to Boston in the number of operations that they handle daily, second is Vancouver which is equal to Raleigh Durham, and the you had YUL which is equal to Chicago Midway, which is the 29th busiest airport in the US. It's not even close. O'Hare, LA, Atlanta and Dallas all handle double YYZ traffic on a daily basis.
@@Quatermain98526 agreed, that why I said 9th, not 3rd busiest. Im out of the busimess after 30yrs and back to flying so care factor pretty low
I get what she did was dangerous, I understand. But at the end of the day, we're only human. Humans make mistakes from time to time. I actually found it worse that controller said "did you get enough of a beating, or did you want some more?" That was just outright unprofessional.
Actually I think he was trying to lighten the mood
That's called humor, try it sometime
@@HarshL gold
@@HarshL If that's your definition of "humour" then I worry for you as a person.
@notleks2411 Do you need a joke to be completely in your face or can you understand implied humor? If I made that mistake, and I've made mistakes on the radio like any other pilot, that would atleast make me feel a bit relieved.
Incredibly dangerous? I call bs on that as 06L isn’t in use (as usual) Yes, it’s a mistake to switch but they’re the ones that use this arrangement that shouldn’t be used in the first place. They’re essentially suggesting that a blocked radio frequency (which happens) could result in disaster. Then the guys asks them if they’ve had enough to which they reply yes and then he gives it to them again. Toronto to should look inwards and reflect on how they operate rather than berating crews like this. Yes. a mistake but a highly unprofessional response to it.
Complacency about runways not typically in use is a recipe for a runway incursion accident. A runway is a runway.
Then stop using a runway, 06R that is shorter than a perfectly good (and longer) adjacent runway, 06L. Risk management. Not to mention, “cleared across 06L, stay with me” isn’t that difficult to say.
yes, it's incredibly dangerous. Not knowing that .65 is the North ground frequency is simply inexcusable. She needs to be retrained or fired. You're simply a taking her side because you're a simp and afraid to call out her ridiculously poor airmanship because she's a woman.
Incredibly dangerous? What is incredibly dangerous is having this non-operational conversation that is distracting the Flight crew and the controller during a critical phase of crossing a runway. There be plenty of time once clear of the runway for the controller to chastise the pilots. Highly unprofessional to pick this moment in time.
Am I the only one who gonna mention this was literally the opposite of “expediting?!?”
I caught that too. As one of my previous instructors once said " don't fuck around crossing a runway"
But she didnt meeeeean it
More brave and stunning dei hires
Just save us all the trouble and say you hate minorities and women
You going to far with this nonsense. People like you that start crying "DEI" for even the tiniest mistake a woman does, yet stay silent when a man does the same mistake, are nothing more than misogynists in disquise.
@@seann4678Nah we just hate how airline companies are openly saying they are hiring based on race and gender as a primary factor. Real women's rights activists of 100 years ago and MLK would be disappointed. Go ahead and go mask off though, just tell us you are racist and sexist.
Another day, another female pilot doing something wrong
Why didn’t she get a number to call? Female privilege?
YES
How do you know the gender of the other pilot onboard?
Trump voter 101 🧐
Terrible controllers. Just tell her without the nerdy attitude.
No, terrible pilot. What the hell is wrong with you? Whoever hired her needs to be fired along with her. She doesn't even know what frequency to be on.
RUclips beating: DEI hiring 😂?
my first thought...
@@CraZy291 ok boomer
Wimmen
boomer