I believe the notion of US troops being outgunned by 7mm is largely a myth perpetrated by the poor military leadership during the SpanAm war - #1) many of the troops were still armed with trap doors firing BP ammunition, including soldiers on the front line during San Juan Hill - #2) the commanders routinely ordered troops to assault elevated fortified positions across large expenses of open ground, or through marshy terrain that drastically slowed troops assault, giving literally any competent marksman armed with any kind of rifle time to shoot them - #3) if you compare like projectiles (heavy round nose) instead of erroneously comparing WW1 era spritzer 7mm, you see the actual drop at distance is comparable between the two cartridges The Krag was a scape goat for poor leadership.
I think you’re salty and sore. 7mm is a nice flat shooter, and stripper clips make it easy and quick to reload. Roosevelts roughriders said themselves that they dropped more ammunition than they shit trying to take San Juan. Loose loading is bad.
My dad would lead you to believe that he and his brothers wouldve starved if it want for grandpas "punkin roller" krag keeping them fed. Allegedly bought as a surplus from the Denver PD. I found one at a show a few years ago. Someone made a nice walnut monte carlo stock for it, but the barrel is terribly pitted. Ive never fired it.
Doesn't mean that it won't shoot well. Might be finicky for load ( they all can be) IMR - 4350 AND Speer 180g flat bass with some time should produce atleast a proper hunting load accuracy. 2" - 3" group at 100yds. My father's 1899 carbine would and the bbl was so bad you could literally shake a bullet out of the bbl. 2" group at 100yds however change the powder charge by 1/4 grain or less and now you have 6" at 25yds.
I have a "Sporterized" Krag, I love it, it was Bubbaed, but Bubbaed well, The barrel is freefloating and glass bedded, she was rusty when I got her, but a lot of wire brush and oil and she runs smooth. While there is some exterior pitting, the bore is shiny bright. I had to get another bolt, because whoever bubbaed it cut the cocking knob from the end of the bolt, I have no idea why. To shoot it, one must reload these days, because 30-40 Krag rounds are $3 apiece!
That is indeed a much better caliber, unfortunately it had not been developed yet when the Americans adopted their version of the Krag in 1892. The 6.5x55 cartridge design was sort of in development at the time, but only got finalised in 1893 for adoption in the Norwegian Krag model 1894 and the Swedish Mauser rifles. The US simply jumped in a tiny bit too early to get the more refined and much flatter shooting Norwegian version. But the conservative powers that be probably wouldn't have accepted anything smaller than .30 anyway.
I mean, that caliber only makes sense if you have some sort of automatic mechanism, because recoil management kinda only becomes important when you're firing in quick succession.
Reloading the Krag's magazine was simple and effective for hunters and field shooters, but loose rounds were a liability for the military, in the beginning of the Age of Stripper clips that Mauser introduced. It was just faster, and more controlled. Jeff Cooper praised the slick operating of the Krag over all other bolt guns, as well. Good job, Karl!
@@gregb6469 None of the Norwegian Krag-Jørgensen rifles take stripper clips. The closest thing would be the speed loaders (most common being the Andersen & Braathen). They became very popular in competition circles, but was never adopted militarily
My Grandfathers oldest brother had a Krag Carbine that he used for hunting for many decades. I remember thinking how handy, balanced and smooth it was. I wish I could have bought it off him but its long gone.
One great in-combat advantage of the Krag was the ability to reload/top off the mag with a round in the chamber and the bolt closed (meaning it is still in battery), something which can not be done with Mauser-style rifles, which have to be taken out of battery to reload or top off.
@@LokiOdinson-fz8ps -- That is a problem that can be at least partially mitigated by proper training, but no amount of training will make it possible to reload/top off a Mauser with the bolt closed.
I have a Norwegian 1894 in 6.5x55. It is an absolute joy to shoot, smooth, mild, and accurate. The magazine is a curious, kinesthetic joy to operate. Frankly, the fact that it was ever a military rifle feels strange when you handle it, as it is so narrow and refined in the hand. Really fascinating rifle, and my favourite in my collection. Greetings from the UK.
I have an original carbine Krag. Super smooth bolt action and love the side loading hopper. Very handy gun. You would think they would have just started making it with 2 or 3 bolt locking lugs if that was needed.
The Krag made it into at least one movie that I know for certain. In To Kill a Mockingbird. Atticus Finch (Gregory Peck) shoots a rabid dog in the street with one.
I've always marveled at the Krag's loading method: Chuck in a fistful of bullets, close it, and magic sorts out the mess. I never quite understood how the relatively small motion of opening and closing was enough to put sufficient spring pressure on five rounds to operate.
Through a very clever camming mechanism yes. And that spring does double duty; it also holds the loading gate biased to either fully open or fully closed as required, by the cam snapping over center.
I now have a Krag but it needs a deep cleaning. It is still in its original military configuration. With that I have every single center fire rifle the US used from the Krag to the M-16. Two of them are a M1903 and M1917 my dad sportarized decades ago. I wish they were still in military configuration but back when he did that every body did it. If I ever can I will look into getting them restored.
The 1927 "Bannerman Catalogue of Military Goods" has, on page 54: "U.S.A. Krag Jorgensen rifles, calibre 30-40, as used by the U.S. Army and Militia before the change to Springfield calibre .30 rifle. These rifles have been used but are in good condition WITHOUT EXTRAS at $12.50 each." They also offered Krag rifles "in fine order", with bayonet, sling, web cartridge belt, and 20 rounds of ball ammo for $20. That same page has surplus, refinished 1903 Springfield rifles for $19.50 each; and Canadian Ross rifles in .303 for $8.50 each. Next page has: "Krag Sporter, caliber 30/40 with 22 inch barrel, five shot. Military sights for 2000 yards. All in good condition. Special price $11.85 each." A box of 20 new .30-40 cartridges, hard or soft nose, cost $1.70. And same page, Model 1917 military rifles, refinished with new barrels, at $12.50. Ball .30-06 cartridges are $3.50 per 100 (not on stripper clips).
Brass can be reformed from 303 British failry easily. The neck will be short, but doesn't effect how it shoots. Fun fact, the 303 brit was the parent case of the 30 40 army. I use brass fired once from a lee enfield, a heavy 308 bullet and Varget to great effect. Note that hollow and flat points can jamb before the chamber as there os no real feed ramp......more like a feed director....ish.....lol Side note.....PPU brass has been great. S&B has experienced cracking......I believe "softer" brass to be better in this case.
Instead of upping the powder charge of the .30-40 round, why didn't they just reduce the weight of the bullet from 220 grains to 150 (or fewer) grains? That would have significantly raised the velocity, without damaging the lug.
Interestingly, you typically put more powder in for a lighter bullet(counterintuitive to me, but so it goes...it takes more powder to create the initial pressure that starts the bullet moving) so while the initial pressure isn't any higher, there is more powder being burnt, and my conjecture is that this would lead to a hotter barrel, thus faster wear. This isn't as much of an issue with today's modern powders, or with modern bullet tech....remember that although Spitzers were used back then, they weren't understood to the degree that they are today, so there would probably have been flight stabilization issues in a barrel with a 1:10 twist rate ( I know alot of modern 308s are the same two rate and start at around 147 grains.....but again, we understand Spitzer bullet tech alot better now....and still use more than one lug nearly always!) This was a military rifle first.....and longevity had to be balanced with efficiency.
Honestly, I find myself wondering how things might've changed if instead of dropping the Krag for the 1903, they had simply reworked it to add a second locking lug to the bolt. I doubt they could've loaded it up to .30-06 levels because of the case capacity, but surely they could've at least gotten it to match 7mm Mauser. I don't have sufficient experience to know, but does anyone have any insight if the side-loading was better, worse, or about the same as using a clip from the top? One obvious advantage I could see to it would be if you attach a scope, it won't get in the way of loading (but how much of an advantage that really is, who knows?).
Fantastic rifle, one of my "favorites from a far" never having handled one. Seems like a nice, soft shooting rifle round. The 1920s matches seem like a great idea, I'm staying tuned for more related gun and match videos!!
Honestly, for hunting purposes, if someone had a trapdoor in the 1920s for hunting, there really wouldnt be much reason to get a Krag, considering most people dont shoot past 200 yards If you shoot beyond 200, you are the exception compared to the average person, who seems to be pie plate accuracy at 25 yards.
I love the Krag, the loading system seems genius to me. Easily my favorite US issued bolt action. Its a shame that loading system didn't catch on with more modern guns, its definitely useful at the range where often loading is so fiddly with other guns of that era.
Why am I feeling the desire to tune up my 94 and through back on the tang sight. Yeah 30-30 is a little challenging, but it and my model 10 are screaming for some fun.
Thank you for the review sir. I had the good fortune to own a Krag many years ago. I look forward to your reviews of firearms for these matches. I hope to see some revolvers. The old Smith and Wesson hand ejector s, Colt New services. Thanks again.
I have a Ruger No 3 in 30-40 Krag and the great part about that is since the No 1 and No 3 system are so rock solid, you can get 30-40 ammo loaded up to 30-06 velocities and the rifle easily eats it. I load my 30-40 with 150 Grain bullets I use for my M1 Garand Loads and 3031 pushing about 2700 FPS. Absolute laser of a cartridge out to about 300 yards. My issue with 30-40 Krag is the same issue I have with 22-250, that being brass right now is basically unobtanium levels. You can make 30-40 brass with 303 Brit but 30-40 Brass when you can find it and 303 go for the same price and are at about the same level of availability.
I bought one just like this, except the stock was original and they got rid of the rear right in favor of a quick reset peep sight. Got it for $250, my dad loved it and always wanted one, so I sold it to him for what I paid. It's a great rifle, better than my 30-30, but the ammo can be hard to find and not cheap. I think the front sight on mine was for a Springfield 1903, and I took it hunting once, but didn't get anything. Mine was also missing the cutoff, which really sucked. I was also lucky to find an old style sling for it as well.
I’ve had a Kraig for right at 50 years , beautifully sporterized , walnut stock , kept the infantry rifle length , accurate , got my first elk with it . The magazine cut off caused a bit of a laugh at a DOW officers expense , I had stopped at a friends camp on my way to the area I was licensed in , and while at his camp a game warden came in checking license’s , and if the rifles that were in the vehicals had empty chambers . The officer informed me that I wasn’t in my area and could not hunt where I was , i agreed , but stopped to have a cup of coffee and shoot the breeze with a couple of my friends , she wanted to check my rifle which was cased , so I uncased it and opened the bolt for her to see ithe chamber was empty , the magazine was full , I closed the bolt and she said I had chambered a round , of course I said no , she had me work the bolt again , again empty chamber , we did this a third time , she gave me a puzzled look , I simply said it was hell on follow up shots , recased the rifle and left , laughing once I was out of sight , never did show her the cut off , my friends later told me it was all they could do not to laugh outright at her
My dream milsurp is a Norwegian Krag in 6.5x55. If someone told me I could have one in mint condition in exchange for a kidney, I'd *really* have to think about it.
My first hunting rifle rifle was a sporterized Krag. So many things I absolutely love about the Krag. Sure, the magazine system poses problems in combat, but when hunting I actually prefer it to a Mauser-derived action and similar. The only complaint is the single lug bolt which limits what can fired through it. A modernized Krag with an improved locking bolt chambered for a modern cartridge would be an amazing hunting gun, in my opinion.
There's something about the way the Krag and Mosin handle rimmed rounds. The US Krag-Jorgensen was arguably the weakest of the Krags. The Danes used theirs until WW2, chambered for the more potent 8x58R Danish Krag round that outclasses the .30-40 by any measure (initially 237-grain roundnose, then 196-grain spitzer at 2,500fps).
Have two sporterized Krags, one in a Bishop stock with a side mounted scope for hunting. The second is a rifle turned into a carbine with the rear sight removed and replaced with a peep.
After WWII a lot of American Legion posts had these for ceremonies. During hunting season the local one here would rent you the gun for $1 per day. And yes, I have a Krag that still get shot.
I wonder what the weapon of choice would have been for the Wobblies (IWW members, my union) in the 20s. The General Defense Committee was very active in defending workers against both the Feds and non State reactionaries
Any discussion about the Krag rifle and the transmission on to the 1903 and then the Garand is fascinating. Thanks for that and the shooting demonstration. I love how the spent casings dance through the air during ejection.
Me too, its a really nice non-scoped hunting rifle for my purposes. If these were made nowadays, it would cost 2K+. One day, I'm hoping to get another that was sporterized & has a pitted bore and rechamber it to 7MM Mauser, seems like a great host for it. if these were just rechambered to 7mm Mauser the military would've probably still used it through WW2 tbh.
@@kjellrogerjgensen60 This is a long answer, and difficult to explain, but here: Maybe if you get a modern fast burning 7MM Mauser loading, but if you use loadings based around the original military powder loadings then it should have zero problems. There is at least one you can find on the interwebs of someone with a 7mm chambered Krag, I assume it has been shot a bit so it shouldn't break in your hands. Also the difference between 6.5 Swede and 7MM Mauser is not extraordinarily different. Some more gunsmiths knowledge for you, the PSI ratings on 6.5 Swede is ~55,000 PSI and 7MM Mauser is ~51,000 PSI. The rifles originally chambered in 6.5 Swede probably were shot with a proof round making ~66,000 PSI. With the less metal in the chamber I wouldn't load a round making more than ~56,000 PSI, and would load using a slow burning powder to assist in safety. That said it should be fine even if I shot a +P equivalent round so long as it had slow burning powder.
Even in the 50s and 70s this was considered an excellent deer rifle when used with soft point loads. I have been tempted to buy one a few times, but never did. They are beautiful rifles.
Mine's a keeper. Somebody did a REALLY nice job on it, ca. 1940s - new 18.5" barrel, full length stock with schnabel tip, three leaf sight, reblue, correct barrel banding, etc etc etc. Very fun, useful, and elegant rifle!
Mine is an 1898 NRA carbine passed down from my grandfather and is the first centerfire rifle I ever fired. I fired sub MOA grops wit it after changing to a Redfield peep sight...and with much younger eyes! They are a wonderful rifle and ballistically would have matched the 7x57 Mauser if they had loaded 180 grain bullets.It's also nice to be able to load the magazine while still having a shootable rifle in your hands. The Norwegians came up with an ingenious speed loader for it also!
Good morning sir. This is Ted from Texas. I definitely enjoyed your video. Just wanted to let you know I actually have an 1892 model dated 1894 with a Cartouche of 1895. I plan on taking it to Rock Island auction next month in Texas. I have done a video of my Krag and it is on RUclips now . Just either look up Krag 1892 or use my name and you can check it out. I have owned my Krag for probably 30 plus years. Now it's time to move it on. I know it's worth a good deal of money. Thanks for the information
The Krag system is the best bolt-action rifle system ever made. I saw one of these in a gun store a while back, but they wanted far more for it than I could afford, so I had to pass on it. :(
I had one and like a jackass sold it for some stupid reason. With a Lyman front ramp and rear peep it would shoot sub 2" groups at 100 yards with Winchester 180 gr Silvertips. The action of the rifle was one of the smoothest bolt actions I've ever owned and the 2 stage trigger was more than up to the test. If I cold find one in decent condition today I would buy it in a split second. the only short fall of these guns is that they fired black powder rounds and you rarely find one without severe bore pitting though it didn't effect the accuracy of mine. Glad to see an old war horse get it's due.
I would eye on the idea of purchasing a beat up Krag with a terrible bore and get a gunsmith to convert it to 7MM Mauser, 444 Marlin or 6.5 Swedish, or just outright buy a Norwegian Krag in 6.5x55 Swedish. These would probably be fun options to run through a Krag. I have heard of some 7mm Krag conversions throughout the years, mainly already done conversions of krag rifles in the late 40s and rifles being bought down the line. A friend of mine has a 444 Marlin chambered Krag he got from his grandpa. Probably one of the most nicest converted guns I have shot, and ammo isnt too difficult to get, nor ridiculously expensive, I am pretty sure that It requires no modification besides a new bore.
Just for fun because I am bored, I measured the rear aperture on a Krag. It measured at .067 (#51 drill bit). On a Stevens boys pocket rifle the rear aperture is .0225 (#74 drill bit). The Stevens aperture is .33% of the Krag. The Stevens wont shoot as far (.32 rimfire vs .30-40 Krag). The smallest aperture on a Hadley disk for vernier tang sight, think Quigley, is .021. They must have had better eyesight in the past.
In Norway, Kongsberg Våpenfabrikk who built the Norwegian Krag Jørgensen. After ww2, there was little of everything, the germans had taken all the guns. So people needed hunting rifles. Kongsberg rebuilt some Krags to hunting rifles. Basically by changing the barrels with some German mashine gun barrels they had. So they made 500 rifles in 8x57IS. Named M48. I have one, all original.
Snagged one like that for 350 a year or so ago. 1896 pattern, manufactured 1898. The peephole sights are poorly done unfortunately but its fun to mess with
For a sporting rifle, I really like the dump loading. It is easy and handy to use. As a martial rifle, not so much. I find it likely if someone is shooting back at me, I am likely to dump half my rounds on the ground trying to reload. If you have a firearm that was avvalible during the 20s but your particular example was produced later, is it still okay to use at the match? For example, I have a Remington bolt action sporting rifle that started production in 1910, but this particular one was made in the late 1930s. Same with this old Sears shotgun that was made in the 1940s, but was a model available in the mid 40s. Knowing you, I would guess as long as it does not have newer features, the exact date of manufacturing is not important...but I am open to correction on that.
I have a sporterized 1898 Mauser and one of the early 94's Best I can tell they were sporterized by big wholesale gun stores in the 1960s ? and done as cheaply as possible main thing they did have in common is the shortened barrel and new front band type sight silver soldered on. next the wood was original but cut and shaped to a more 'sporting' look and feel. Both rear sights are early side mount marbles peeps. I got both cheap cause... well... they were 'ruined' value wise. The 98 had swastikas' markings and would be very valuable in original configuration. but now? the old sporters are starting to gain value rapidly. They were originally bought by the 'everyman' hunter on a budget. and they did the job.
The Krag was the issued rifle during the Moro Rebellion in the Phillipines where the 38 pistols were having so much trouble anchoring the bad guys that they reintroduced the 45 Colt and thus the legend of what inspired the 1911 was born. What isn't often talked about is that the 30-40 Krag's were also having trouble stopping these guys and anyone who thinks the 45 Colt comes anywhere near the power of the admittedly less than modern full power rifle cartridge don't have an appreciation of the difference between rifle and pistol ammo. The Moro's often wrapped themselves with thick vines which did a pretty good job of slowing down bullets as well as they were reported to have taken drugs that gave them inspiration while also dulling pain. Tough customers they were for sure! But any stopping issues of the rifles were down mostly to shot placement where the 38's were a pretty dismal handgun cartridge for combat use that did need an upgrade. The other lacking part of the story was that the reintroduced 45 Colt's struggled with these guys too...but that doesn't fit with the Legend of the 1911 so is conveniently omitted.
Weird thing to notice but the table has become so recognizable it's practically an in range host in itself. Wouldn't be the same without it. 😂
This feels like an old InrangeTV Video. I hope you upload more videos like this.
It was a sporterized Krag that Gregory Peck used in "To Kill a Mockingbird".
8:33 turns out the hat came in handy
Yes love it and iam sure Carl didnt notice that too.
I believe the notion of US troops being outgunned by 7mm is largely a myth perpetrated by the poor military leadership during the SpanAm war - #1) many of the troops were still armed with trap doors firing BP ammunition, including soldiers on the front line during San Juan Hill - #2) the commanders routinely ordered troops to assault elevated fortified positions across large expenses of open ground, or through marshy terrain that drastically slowed troops assault, giving literally any competent marksman armed with any kind of rifle time to shoot them - #3) if you compare like projectiles (heavy round nose) instead of erroneously comparing WW1 era spritzer 7mm, you see the actual drop at distance is comparable between the two cartridges
The Krag was a scape goat for poor leadership.
Read “The Little War of Private Post”, a first hand memoir of the war by an enlisted soldier. The Mauser situation is clearly described.
I think you’re salty and sore. 7mm is a nice flat shooter, and stripper clips make it easy and quick to reload. Roosevelts roughriders said themselves that they dropped more ammunition than they shit trying to take San Juan. Loose loading is bad.
@@hanisk2 The book I cited was a first hand account and has nothing to do with Roosevelt.
My dad would lead you to believe that he and his brothers wouldve starved if it want for grandpas "punkin roller" krag keeping them fed. Allegedly bought as a surplus from the Denver PD. I found one at a show a few years ago. Someone made a nice walnut monte carlo stock for it, but the barrel is terribly pitted. Ive never fired it.
Doesn't mean that it won't shoot well. Might be finicky for load ( they all can be) IMR - 4350 AND Speer 180g flat bass with some time should produce atleast a proper hunting load accuracy. 2" - 3" group at 100yds. My father's 1899 carbine would and the bbl was so bad you could literally shake a bullet out of the bbl. 2" group at 100yds however change the powder charge by 1/4 grain or less and now you have 6" at 25yds.
Criterion makes match barrels in 4150 for the krag. If you would like to use yours.
@@alt5494that is actually really nice to know
I have a "Sporterized" Krag, I love it, it was Bubbaed, but Bubbaed well, The barrel is freefloating and glass bedded, she was rusty when I got her, but a lot of wire brush and oil and she runs smooth. While there is some exterior pitting, the bore is shiny bright. I had to get another bolt, because whoever bubbaed it cut the cocking knob from the end of the bolt, I have no idea why. To shoot it, one must reload these days, because 30-40 Krag rounds are $3 apiece!
The US failed by not adopting it in 6,5x55.
That is indeed a much better caliber, unfortunately it had not been developed yet when the Americans adopted their version of the Krag in 1892.
The 6.5x55 cartridge design was sort of in development at the time, but only got finalised in 1893 for adoption in the Norwegian Krag model 1894 and the Swedish Mauser rifles. The US simply jumped in a tiny bit too early to get the more refined and much flatter shooting Norwegian version. But the conservative powers that be probably wouldn't have accepted anything smaller than .30 anyway.
I mean, that caliber only makes sense if you have some sort of automatic mechanism, because recoil management kinda only becomes important when you're firing in quick succession.
Yeah check your facts tater tot.
Reloading the Krag's magazine was simple and effective for hunters and field shooters, but loose rounds were a liability for the military, in the beginning of the Age of Stripper clips that Mauser introduced. It was just faster, and more controlled. Jeff Cooper praised the slick operating of the Krag over all other bolt guns, as well. Good job, Karl!
The Norwegian Army (which used the Krag through WWII) developed a stripper clip for the Krag.
@@gregb6469 None of the Norwegian Krag-Jørgensen rifles take stripper clips. The closest thing would be the speed loaders (most common being the Andersen & Braathen). They became very popular in competition circles, but was never adopted militarily
My Grandfathers oldest brother had a Krag Carbine that he used for hunting for many decades. I remember thinking how handy, balanced and smooth it was. I wish I could have bought it off him but its long gone.
One great in-combat advantage of the Krag was the ability to reload/top off the mag with a round in the chamber and the bolt closed (meaning it is still in battery), something which can not be done with Mauser-style rifles, which have to be taken out of battery to reload or top off.
Yep, I was gonna post that.
Except loose ammo is always a problem in combat.
@@LokiOdinson-fz8ps -- That is a problem that can be at least partially mitigated by proper training, but no amount of training will make it possible to reload/top off a Mauser with the bolt closed.
I have a Norwegian 1894 in 6.5x55.
It is an absolute joy to shoot, smooth, mild, and accurate.
The magazine is a curious, kinesthetic joy to operate. Frankly, the fact that it was ever a military rifle feels strange when you handle it, as it is so narrow and refined in the hand.
Really fascinating rifle, and my favourite in my collection. Greetings from the UK.
I have an original carbine Krag. Super smooth bolt action and love the side loading hopper. Very handy gun. You would think they would have just started making it with 2 or 3 bolt locking lugs if that was needed.
The Krag made it into at least one movie that I know for certain. In To Kill a Mockingbird. Atticus Finch (Gregory Peck) shoots a rabid dog in the street with one.
I've seen a casing catch before but not quite like that. I think you are *ahead* of the trends! And damn. That is one cool rifle.
I've always marveled at the Krag's loading method: Chuck in a fistful of bullets, close it, and magic sorts out the mess. I never quite understood how the relatively small motion of opening and closing was enough to put sufficient spring pressure on five rounds to operate.
There's a follower and spring that folds out when the door is closed
The magic is the follower and spring. They get retracted into the underside of that door. Truly maddening engineering at work
Through a very clever camming mechanism yes. And that spring does double duty; it also holds the loading gate biased to either fully open or fully closed as required, by the cam snapping over center.
I now have a Krag but it needs a deep cleaning. It is still in its original military configuration. With that I have every single center fire rifle the US used from the Krag to the M-16. Two of them are a M1903 and M1917 my dad sportarized decades ago. I wish they were still in military configuration but back when he did that every body did it. If I ever can I will look into getting them restored.
The 1927 "Bannerman Catalogue of Military Goods" has, on page 54: "U.S.A. Krag Jorgensen rifles, calibre 30-40, as used by the U.S. Army and Militia before the change to Springfield calibre .30 rifle. These rifles have been used but are in good condition WITHOUT EXTRAS at $12.50 each." They also offered Krag rifles "in fine order", with bayonet, sling, web cartridge belt, and 20 rounds of ball ammo for $20. That same page has surplus, refinished 1903 Springfield rifles for $19.50 each; and Canadian Ross rifles in .303 for $8.50 each. Next page has: "Krag Sporter, caliber 30/40 with 22 inch barrel, five shot. Military sights for 2000 yards. All in good condition. Special price $11.85 each." A box of 20 new .30-40 cartridges, hard or soft nose, cost $1.70. And same page, Model 1917 military rifles, refinished with new barrels, at $12.50. Ball .30-06 cartridges are $3.50 per 100 (not on stripper clips).
They are often used by VFW and American Leogon honor guards.
A friend of mine, who raises Bison, has photos of an Island buffalo hunt from I believe 1920. All of the hunters are using surplus Krag rifles.
i hope to god that you kept that brass…. they only run the 30-40 line every 10 years
Remington seems to be selling it in droves but the price is…😬
Brass can be reformed from 303 British failry easily. The neck will be short, but doesn't effect how it shoots. Fun fact, the 303 brit was the parent case of the 30 40 army.
I use brass fired once from a lee enfield, a heavy 308 bullet and Varget to great effect.
Note that hollow and flat points can jamb before the chamber as there os no real feed ramp......more like a feed director....ish.....lol
Side note.....PPU brass has been great. S&B has experienced cracking......I believe "softer" brass to be better in this case.
Man I love the sound of the 1920's style match!
The brass in your Hat at the end was perfect!!
I have a really nice service grade 30-40 Krag and a sporterized model that was totally reblued at some point in time. Both are excellent shooters.
Instead of upping the powder charge of the .30-40 round, why didn't they just reduce the weight of the bullet from 220 grains to 150 (or fewer) grains? That would have significantly raised the velocity, without damaging the lug.
Interestingly, you typically put more powder in for a lighter bullet(counterintuitive to me, but so it goes...it takes more powder to create the initial pressure that starts the bullet moving) so while the initial pressure isn't any higher, there is more powder being burnt, and my conjecture is that this would lead to a hotter barrel, thus faster wear.
This isn't as much of an issue with today's modern powders, or with modern bullet tech....remember that although Spitzers were used back then, they weren't understood to the degree that they are today, so there would probably have been flight stabilization issues in a barrel with a 1:10 twist rate ( I know alot of modern 308s are the same two rate and start at around 147 grains.....but again, we understand Spitzer bullet tech alot better now....and still use more than one lug nearly always!)
This was a military rifle first.....and longevity had to be balanced with efficiency.
Honestly, I find myself wondering how things might've changed if instead of dropping the Krag for the 1903, they had simply reworked it to add a second locking lug to the bolt. I doubt they could've loaded it up to .30-06 levels because of the case capacity, but surely they could've at least gotten it to match 7mm Mauser.
I don't have sufficient experience to know, but does anyone have any insight if the side-loading was better, worse, or about the same as using a clip from the top? One obvious advantage I could see to it would be if you attach a scope, it won't get in the way of loading (but how much of an advantage that really is, who knows?).
The whole idea of the magazine being "first in, first out" has always appealed to me and you can top it off with the bolt closed.
Fantastic rifle, one of my "favorites from a far" never having handled one. Seems like a nice, soft shooting rifle round. The 1920s matches seem like a great idea, I'm staying tuned for more related gun and match videos!!
It may be conjecture, but from a ballistics standpoint it looks like a hopped up 30-30 with a better bullet. 30-30+p? Great content Karl.
Honestly, for hunting purposes, if someone had a trapdoor in the 1920s for hunting, there really wouldnt be much reason to get a Krag, considering most people dont shoot past 200 yards
If you shoot beyond 200, you are the exception compared to the average person, who seems to be pie plate accuracy at 25 yards.
The bigger picture that 30-06 replaced is a rimless cartridge for repeating arms. That's an accidental step forward that the US made.
I never cared about the Krag until I noticed that they were often used as props in place of Mausers on Hogan's Heros.
Not strictly inaccurate since the German used captured Krags as a weapon for rear area troops.
@@AtlatlMan the Shultz Kraig sure looked like a Springfield made one tome!❤
I remember Schultz carrying a Krag in ‘Hogan’s Heroes’.
Love mine. The bolt is soooo smooth and the recoil is very light.
I love the Krag, the loading system seems genius to me. Easily my favorite US issued bolt action. Its a shame that loading system didn't catch on with more modern guns, its definitely useful at the range where often loading is so fiddly with other guns of that era.
Why am I feeling the desire to tune up my 94 and through back on the tang sight. Yeah 30-30 is a little challenging, but it and my model 10 are screaming for some fun.
I bought mine when 15 years old....65 now....still own and use it.
Thank you for the review sir. I had the good fortune to own a Krag many years ago. I look forward to your reviews of firearms for these matches. I hope to see some revolvers. The old Smith and Wesson hand ejector s, Colt New services. Thanks again.
I really want one of these. The magazine system is so weird and cool.
I have a Ruger No 3 in 30-40 Krag and the great part about that is since the No 1 and No 3 system are so rock solid, you can get 30-40 ammo loaded up to 30-06 velocities and the rifle easily eats it. I load my 30-40 with 150 Grain bullets I use for my M1 Garand Loads and 3031 pushing about 2700 FPS. Absolute laser of a cartridge out to about 300 yards. My issue with 30-40 Krag is the same issue I have with 22-250, that being brass right now is basically unobtanium levels. You can make 30-40 brass with 303 Brit but 30-40 Brass when you can find it and 303 go for the same price and are at about the same level of availability.
College buddy of mine in the 90s used one of these for deer hunting and absolutely loved it.
Nice hat and very cool rifle.
I bought one just like this, except the stock was original and they got rid of the rear right in favor of a quick reset peep sight. Got it for $250, my dad loved it and always wanted one, so I sold it to him for what I paid. It's a great rifle, better than my 30-30, but the ammo can be hard to find and not cheap. I think the front sight on mine was for a Springfield 1903, and I took it hunting once, but didn't get anything. Mine was also missing the cutoff, which really sucked. I was also lucky to find an old style sling for it as well.
I’ve had a Kraig for right at 50 years , beautifully sporterized , walnut stock , kept the infantry rifle length , accurate , got my first elk with it . The magazine cut off caused a bit of a laugh at a DOW officers expense , I had stopped at a friends camp on my way to the area I was licensed in , and while at his camp a game warden came in checking license’s , and if the rifles that were in the vehicals had empty chambers . The officer informed me that I wasn’t in my area and could not hunt where I was , i agreed , but stopped to have a cup of coffee and shoot the breeze with a couple of my friends , she wanted to check my rifle which was cased , so I uncased it and opened the bolt for her to see ithe chamber was empty , the magazine was full , I closed the bolt and she said I had chambered a round , of course I said no , she had me work the bolt again , again empty chamber , we did this a third time , she gave me a puzzled look , I simply said it was hell on follow up shots , recased the rifle and left , laughing once I was out of sight , never did show her the cut off , my friends later told me it was all they could do not to laugh outright at her
Depends on what year model, magazine lever up = off or lever down = off 😮
A very underrated innovated rifle, another underrated rifle is the Savage 99 lever action
I really like the period of immediately before WW1 to immediately after. It produced some of the most interesting firearms.
My dream milsurp is a Norwegian Krag in 6.5x55. If someone told me I could have one in mint condition in exchange for a kidney, I'd *really* have to think about it.
I must confess I seriously love the look of this.
I must confess you need electroshock therapy because something is badly, severely wrong.
I agree.
The concept that anyone might assemble a collection of sporterized firearms never occured to me, but i suppose anything is possible.
You
You would have some fine arms. I have military Kraigs and Springfields but I'm looking for the spotters also.❤
With boat tail spitzer bullets it's ballistics are nearly identical to the British .303.
I’ve always thought these were awesome but I never cared for the caliber just because it’s not as versatile as the 30-06
man slapped the magazine closed like the krag had just whispered "harder"
Freaky aah comment
Where are you doing these competitions and are they open to the public?
This is awesome!
I have a forty five seventy With a rear peep site I don't like scopes.The shoot with I do better with the rear peep sides
My first hunting rifle rifle was a sporterized Krag. So many things I absolutely love about the Krag. Sure, the magazine system poses problems in combat, but when hunting I actually prefer it to a Mauser-derived action and similar. The only complaint is the single lug bolt which limits what can fired through it. A modernized Krag with an improved locking bolt chambered for a modern cartridge would be an amazing hunting gun, in my opinion.
There's something about the way the Krag and Mosin handle rimmed rounds.
The US Krag-Jorgensen was arguably the weakest of the Krags. The Danes used theirs until WW2, chambered for the more potent 8x58R Danish Krag round that outclasses the .30-40 by any measure (initially 237-grain roundnose, then 196-grain spitzer at 2,500fps).
That's a really genius design. Amazing.
Have two sporterized Krags, one in a Bishop stock with a side mounted scope for hunting. The second is a rifle turned into a carbine with the rear sight removed and replaced with a peep.
And . . . All the sportorized Krags' are now in high demand on gun broker. 😂
They have been for a while. It's rare to see a Krag, sporterized or not go for cheap unless it's beat to hell or heavily altered by "bubba"
@LeftMech very true.
Friends dad has one. Among the first center fire i ever shot. The bix magazine is odd to modern eyes
I believe a sporterized Krag is in "To Kill A Mockingbird" movie
Yes, a cutdown carbine. You can tell because they mounted a 1903 front sight on it after they cut down the barrel.
Sporterized Krags border on folk art sometimes.
One of my favorites. I have a Norwegian speed loader modified for 30-40.
Whatever you think of it as a military rifle, the US Krag is an excellent recreational rifle. I am very fond of my non-sporterized 1898.
All Karl needs is some flapper girls
After WWII a lot of American Legion posts had these for ceremonies. During hunting season the local one here would rent you the gun for $1 per day. And yes, I have a Krag that still get shot.
I wonder what the weapon of choice would have been for the Wobblies (IWW members, my union) in the 20s. The General Defense Committee was very active in defending workers against both the Feds and non State reactionaries
I would expect your typical Winchester or Remington rifle of the time.
I have an 1899 carbine, that thing has the smoothest action of any service bolt gun I’ve felt
Any discussion about the Krag rifle and the transmission on to the 1903 and then the Garand is fascinating. Thanks for that and the shooting demonstration. I love how the spent casings dance through the air during ejection.
I have a sporterized 30-40 Krag, (mine is date: 1888) great rifle. One of the smoothest bolt-actions I have ever seen.
Me too, its a really nice non-scoped hunting rifle for my purposes. If these were made nowadays, it would cost 2K+.
One day, I'm hoping to get another that was sporterized & has a pitted bore and rechamber it to 7MM Mauser, seems like a great host for it.
if these were just rechambered to 7mm Mauser the military would've probably still used it through WW2 tbh.
@@RedZeppelinAirshipIsn't the locking mecanism to weak for that, it has only one "locking part" ?
@@kjellrogerjgensen60 This is a long answer, and difficult to explain, but here:
Maybe if you get a modern fast burning 7MM Mauser loading, but if you use loadings based around the original military powder loadings then it should have zero problems.
There is at least one you can find on the interwebs of someone with a 7mm chambered Krag, I assume it has been shot a bit so it shouldn't break in your hands.
Also the difference between 6.5 Swede and 7MM Mauser is not extraordinarily different.
Some more gunsmiths knowledge for you, the PSI ratings on 6.5 Swede is ~55,000 PSI and 7MM Mauser is ~51,000 PSI. The rifles originally chambered in 6.5 Swede probably were shot with a proof round making ~66,000 PSI.
With the less metal in the chamber I wouldn't load a round making more than ~56,000 PSI, and would load using a slow burning powder to assist in safety.
That said it should be fine even if I shot a +P equivalent round so long as it had slow burning powder.
Even in the 50s and 70s this was considered an excellent deer rifle when used with soft point loads. I have been tempted to buy one a few times, but never did. They are beautiful rifles.
Roaring 20, Thompson, BAR ,Springfield, Krag, revolver,M1911, several WW1. But a fedora is a must if your gonna be a public enemy or G-man
Mine's a keeper. Somebody did a REALLY nice job on it, ca. 1940s - new 18.5" barrel, full length stock with schnabel tip, three leaf sight, reblue, correct barrel banding, etc etc etc. Very fun, useful, and elegant rifle!
Mine is an 1898 NRA carbine passed down from my grandfather and is the first centerfire rifle I ever fired. I fired sub MOA grops wit it after changing to a Redfield peep sight...and with much younger eyes! They are a wonderful rifle and ballistically would have matched the 7x57 Mauser if they had loaded 180 grain bullets.It's also nice to be able to load the magazine while still having a shootable rifle in your hands. The Norwegians came up with an ingenious speed loader for it also!
My grand dad had one of these in the original configuration.
Really interested to see how "dump a load of loose rounds in" holds up under time preassure.
well... we may bring target rifles to war, but we are back to back WW champs... and the reigning military might... however you might view that
Well done. Super smooth action. Neat old rifles.
I was never interested in one of these until now
Good morning sir. This is Ted from Texas. I definitely enjoyed your video. Just wanted to let you know I actually have an 1892 model dated 1894 with a Cartouche of 1895. I plan on taking it to Rock Island auction next month in Texas. I have done a video of my Krag and it is on RUclips now . Just either look up Krag 1892 or use my name and you can check it out. I have owned my Krag for probably 30 plus years. Now it's time to move it on. I know it's worth a good deal of money. Thanks for the information
So much I don't know about 1800s calibers and rifles you can never stop learning there's endless information
The Krag system is the best bolt-action rifle system ever made. I saw one of these in a gun store a while back, but they wanted far more for it than I could afford, so I had to pass on it. :(
Best action? Hardly....
@@WALTERBROADDUS -- Smooth-operating, easiest to load--what's not to like?
Very impressive and nice rifle.
Townsend Whalen smiles at you from the grave
I had one and like a jackass sold it for some stupid reason. With a Lyman front ramp and rear peep it would shoot sub 2" groups at 100 yards with Winchester 180 gr Silvertips. The action of the rifle was one of the smoothest bolt actions I've ever owned and the 2 stage trigger was more than up to the test. If I cold find one in decent condition today I would buy it in a split second. the only short fall of these guns is that they fired black powder rounds and you rarely find one without severe bore pitting though it didn't effect the accuracy of mine. Glad to see an old war horse get it's due.
I would eye on the idea of purchasing a beat up Krag with a terrible bore and get a gunsmith to convert it to 7MM Mauser, 444 Marlin or 6.5 Swedish, or just outright buy a Norwegian Krag in 6.5x55 Swedish.
These would probably be fun options to run through a Krag. I have heard of some 7mm Krag conversions throughout the years, mainly already done conversions of krag rifles in the late 40s and rifles being bought down the line.
A friend of mine has a 444 Marlin chambered Krag he got from his grandpa. Probably one of the most nicest converted guns I have shot, and ammo isnt too difficult to get, nor ridiculously expensive, I am pretty sure that It requires no modification besides a new bore.
Just for fun because I am bored, I measured the rear aperture on a Krag. It measured at .067 (#51 drill bit). On a Stevens boys pocket rifle the rear aperture is .0225 (#74 drill bit). The Stevens aperture is .33% of the Krag. The Stevens wont shoot as far (.32 rimfire vs .30-40 Krag). The smallest aperture on a Hadley disk for vernier tang sight, think Quigley, is .021. They must have had better eyesight in the past.
Very cool looking rifle.
In Norway, Kongsberg Våpenfabrikk who built the Norwegian Krag Jørgensen. After ww2, there was little of everything, the germans had taken all the guns. So people needed hunting rifles. Kongsberg rebuilt some Krags to hunting rifles. Basically by changing the barrels with some German mashine gun barrels they had. So they made 500 rifles in 8x57IS. Named M48. I have one, all original.
8:35 random cassing on hat
Have a sporterized Krag myself. What I don’t have is ammo for it. Need to start reloading, I have a whole bunch of empties saved.
Snagged one like that for 350 a year or so ago. 1896 pattern, manufactured 1898. The peephole sights are poorly done unfortunately but its fun to mess with
I always wondered how in tge 1890s they knew it was 2300 feet per second.
I saw a YT video once with a wire cronograph to measure speed over distance using a wire to break a circuit.
For a sporting rifle, I really like the dump loading. It is easy and handy to use. As a martial rifle, not so much. I find it likely if someone is shooting back at me, I am likely to dump half my rounds on the ground trying to reload.
If you have a firearm that was avvalible during the 20s but your particular example was produced later, is it still okay to use at the match? For example, I have a Remington bolt action sporting rifle that started production in 1910, but this particular one was made in the late 1930s. Same with this old Sears shotgun that was made in the 1940s, but was a model available in the mid 40s. Knowing you, I would guess as long as it does not have newer features, the exact date of manufacturing is not important...but I am open to correction on that.
Thank you good sir! I have two of these to sell at the moment, I appreciate the bump in awareness!
Watch out, the ATF is classifying everyone as an unlicensed gun dealer and wants to give out Felonies.
Seeing a historical rifle like the Krag sporterized hurts my soul.
Lol why is no one talking about the last casing landing on Carl's hat and nesting itself.
I have a sporterized 1898 Mauser and one of the early 94's Best I can tell they were sporterized by big wholesale gun stores in the 1960s ? and done as cheaply as possible main thing they did have in common is the shortened barrel and new front band type sight silver soldered on. next the wood was original but cut and shaped to a more 'sporting' look and feel. Both rear sights are early side mount marbles peeps. I got both cheap cause... well... they were 'ruined' value wise. The 98 had swastikas' markings and would be very valuable in original configuration. but now? the old sporters are starting to gain value rapidly. They were originally bought by the 'everyman' hunter on a budget. and they did the job.
The Krag was the issued rifle during the Moro Rebellion in the Phillipines where the 38 pistols were having so much trouble anchoring the bad guys that they reintroduced the 45 Colt and thus the legend of what inspired the 1911 was born. What isn't often talked about is that the 30-40 Krag's were also having trouble stopping these guys and anyone who thinks the 45 Colt comes anywhere near the power of the admittedly less than modern full power rifle cartridge don't have an appreciation of the difference between rifle and pistol ammo.
The Moro's often wrapped themselves with thick vines which did a pretty good job of slowing down bullets as well as they were reported to have taken drugs that gave them inspiration while also dulling pain. Tough customers they were for sure! But any stopping issues of the rifles were down mostly to shot placement where the 38's were a pretty dismal handgun cartridge for combat use that did need an upgrade. The other lacking part of the story was that the reintroduced 45 Colt's struggled with these guys too...but that doesn't fit with the Legend of the 1911 so is conveniently omitted.
Love the look of Krag-Jorgensens, shame it was bubbad when you got it.