What a great interview! I’m reading Pastor Lusk’s new book “Measures of the Mission” where he talks about most of this in a very accessible format. Thank you for posting.
Most TRs would not be caught dead talking to someone like Pastor Lusk. At the same time, they wouldn't mind having a beer with Catholics like Tolkien or Augustine.
40:45 proper analogy for justification. Prince with infinite resources at his disposal takes the indebted woman and makers her his bride. His account becomes a joint account. She is incorporated into all that he has. She hasn’t earned it, but she has what he has because he is married to her. This is union with Christ. Faith unites us to Jesus. Faith lays hold of Christ.
The wages of sin is death... Christ has defeated death. We are dead and Chist and only Christ alone can give you life. Repent and trust in Chist alone for the for the forgiveness of sin. The marriage doesn't imput righteousness, Christ imputs his righteousness to the elect and gives them a heart of flesh, forgives their sin, past present and future! It is finished! The Cross is where he paid it all!!!!
@@SOWWHATAPOLOGETICS To be fair that is what the OPC and PCA people who opposed FV say that FV teaches. I would be surprised to find someone who accepts the FV Label who agrees that is what they teach.
@@SOWWHATAPOLOGETICS That's what the Bible openly states. You cannot deny it without denying Christ, the Word of God. Now, there is some question as to in what sense it does so. But there is, Scripturally, some sense in which it does.
Came from the podcast version of this episode, subscribed and commenting for the giveaway. Thank you all for all the work you do here, you were the final straw that brought me to Presbyterian theology, I can’t thank you enough!
Straight up heresy. How could any Christian say that Christ's perfect obiedence to the Law was not satisfactory because it leaves no room for our own keeping of the Law??? Which was stated between the 8 and 12 minute marks. What blasphemy.
Heretics and false teachers have for centuries used the “fallacy of the false dilemma.” We are either saved by faith and works or we are antinomian. There is a third option ,justification is by Faith alone. Rich Lusk is clearly a false teacher.
Heretics and false teachers have for centuries used the “ fallacy of the false dilemma.”We are either saved by faith and works or we are antinomian.There is a third option,justification is by faith alone.
The question that needs be asked is simply this... are you saying that the justification that you are speaking of...whereby you say that those who are justified before God, are required to be "in Christ", thus are you saying that a saint can fall in and out of Christ? And therefore can this justification that you are speaking of, can it be received, put on pause, and then re-gained again? Or in other words, can this justification that you speak of, be lost and then again regained whilst you walk the earth in this life as a Christian? And then the question remains.... Is it possible for a saint to be indwelt by the resurrection power of The Spirit, and yet be in a state whereby they are not justified?? Or are you saying that The Spirit actually leaves, and thus goes in and out of a saint, depending on their works?? Thus are you saying that a saint can be found in the morning a friend of God having the blood bought "Resurrection power of The Spirit dwelling within them, and thus the saint is found "justified" before God.... yet about lunch time they may find themselves an actual enemy of God, for blood bought resurrection power of The Spirit has actually left them, and thus they now find themselves "unjustified??? Can you please reply to my questions?
Yes that's exactly what FV teaches. There's no assurance in the FV gospel because their covenant is based on the believers obedience. In their system, the believer can unelect themselves and undo their union with Christ by not performing the requirements of the covenant. In their system, there are people in hell who used to be Christ's adopted children who he loved and whose atonement was applied to them. Some of God's formerly Justified, elect, regenerate people who God saved, are in hell according to FV.
One of the reasons Lusk isn't satisfied with Christ's active and passive obedience being what is credited to us upon being justified is because the FV salvation system is faith plus works. So if Christ's obedience is already credited to us, then FV couldn't have their works based salvation system because Jesus already obeyed for us. Jesus obedience needs to be erased or at least made irrelevant as it pertains to our salvation.
What a great interview! I’m reading Pastor Lusk’s new book “Measures of the Mission” where he talks about most of this in a very accessible format. Thank you for posting.
I wish that more of these OG guys would do some discussions with brothers in the TR camp. All of this needs to get more attention.
Most TRs would not be caught dead talking to someone like Pastor Lusk.
At the same time, they wouldn't mind having a beer with Catholics like Tolkien or Augustine.
Keep these coming! I love your guys’ show
40:45 proper analogy for justification.
Prince with infinite resources at his disposal takes the indebted woman and makers her his bride. His account becomes a joint account. She is incorporated into all that he has. She hasn’t earned it, but she has what he has because he is married to her. This is union with Christ.
Faith unites us to Jesus. Faith lays hold of Christ.
But wouldn't Lusk say that water Baptism unites us to Christ? That's what FV teaches.
The wages of sin is death... Christ has defeated death. We are dead and Chist and only Christ alone can give you life. Repent and trust in Chist alone for the for the forgiveness of sin. The marriage doesn't imput righteousness, Christ imputs his righteousness to the elect and gives them a heart of flesh, forgives their sin, past present and future! It is finished!
The Cross is where he paid it all!!!!
@@SOWWHATAPOLOGETICS To be fair that is what the OPC and PCA people who opposed FV say that FV teaches. I would be surprised to find someone who accepts the FV Label who agrees that is what they teach.
@@le_bouvier No. Not true. Do more research. Read all their books. Listen to all their stuff.
@@SOWWHATAPOLOGETICS That's what the Bible openly states. You cannot deny it without denying Christ, the Word of God.
Now, there is some question as to in what sense it does so. But there is, Scripturally, some sense in which it does.
Came from the podcast version of this episode, subscribed and commenting for the giveaway. Thank you all for all the work you do here, you were the final straw that brought me to Presbyterian theology, I can’t thank you enough!
awesome! thanks for the support!
Wait! Rich Lusk!!! 😮🎉🍻
Straight up heresy. How could any Christian say that Christ's perfect obiedence to the Law was not satisfactory because it leaves no room for our own keeping of the Law??? Which was stated between the 8 and 12 minute marks. What blasphemy.
Heretics and false teachers have for centuries used the “fallacy of the false dilemma.” We are either saved by faith and works or we are antinomian. There is a third option ,justification is by Faith alone. Rich Lusk is clearly a false teacher.
Heretics and false teachers have for centuries used the “ fallacy of the false dilemma.”We are either saved by faith and works or we are antinomian.There is a third option,justification is by faith alone.
Book chapter and verses
The question that needs be asked is simply this... are you saying that the justification that you are speaking of...whereby you say that those who are justified before God, are required to be "in Christ", thus are you saying that a saint can fall in and out of Christ?
And therefore can this justification that you are speaking of, can it be received, put on pause, and then re-gained again?
Or in other words, can this justification that you speak of, be lost and then again regained whilst you walk the earth in this life as a Christian?
And then the question remains.... Is it possible for a saint to be indwelt by the resurrection power of The Spirit, and yet be in a state whereby they are not justified??
Or are you saying that The Spirit actually leaves, and thus goes in and out of a saint, depending on their works??
Thus are you saying that a saint can be found in the morning a friend of God having the blood bought "Resurrection power of The Spirit dwelling within them, and thus the saint is found "justified" before God.... yet about lunch time they may find themselves an actual enemy of God, for blood bought resurrection power of The Spirit has actually left them, and thus they now find themselves "unjustified???
Can you please reply to my questions?
Yes that's exactly what FV teaches. There's no assurance in the FV gospel because their covenant is based on the believers obedience. In their system, the believer can unelect themselves and undo their union with Christ by not performing the requirements of the covenant. In their system, there are people in hell who used to be Christ's adopted children who he loved and whose atonement was applied to them. Some of God's formerly Justified, elect, regenerate people who God saved, are in hell according to FV.
One of the reasons Lusk isn't satisfied with Christ's active and passive obedience being what is credited to us upon being justified is because the FV salvation system is faith plus works. So if Christ's obedience is already credited to us, then FV couldn't have their works based salvation system because Jesus already obeyed for us. Jesus obedience needs to be erased or at least made irrelevant as it pertains to our salvation.
He is obviously not saying that. See the FV joint statement which he signed, which explicitly states the opposite.
@@SOWWHATAPOLOGETICS "the FV salvation system is faith plus works"
Can you quote the FV joint statement to that effect?
@@MrAbsentmindedprof Can you read between the lines and connect the dots?
I wish your wife was there asking questions as well