3:22 "as coffee ages, your shot will pull faster, encouraging you to grind finer." The statement I was looking for. No wonder I keep on set the grind setting finer once in a while for the same coffee bag.
Excellent explanation, practical knowledge. I have a simple question. I love Starbucks Italian or French dark roast coffee (very oily beans). I cannot use any home fully automatic espresso machine available on today’s market for oily beans including Jura espresso. Oily beans can damage the machine. To avoid any problem only solution is to use a separate good quality coffee grinder and espresso machine. Which brand of grinder and espresso are the best for the oily coffee beans (dark roast) for the home use?
Honestly, oily beans are tough on any grinder. You can absolutely use any grinder we sell, but you will find it necessary to deep-clean the grinder more often than not.
This video is amazing. I thought it was to fast but then I saw on the extended description de feature of choosing a specific subject. Thank you for that.
Excellent guide! I'm just now starting out with home espresso and this video REALLY helped me understand the relationship between dose, yield, grind size, and time. Looking forward to a fun hobby, thanks again for the video!
@@clivecoffee Thanks. My question was more like in a Cortado for example, there is 60 ml of espresso. 60ml is considered 2 shots of espresso. So logically, 1 shot of espresso is roughly 30 ml.
A cortado is a 1:1 ratio of milk to espresso. Typically a "double-shot" can be considered between 20g-60g of liquid yield, but even that's not a hard fast rule. This is why it's not useful to get hung up on definitions of what a double-shot is or isn't and why brew ratios are much more useful. We're usually working between a 1:1-1:3.
Hi. At 4:11 seconds you state the amount of pressure is not as important as repetition and consistency, but I've found the amount of pressure greatly effects how the water permeates the coffee grinds and ultimately passes through the portafilter. it isn't always possible for me to have beans roasted within a week, I am for the most part, limited to beans I can buy on Amazon or Wegmans such as Lavazza or Illy. They only state "best by" dates so I can be assured they were roasted weeks if not months ago. How can I limit/reduce the bitterness with beans like this? Or is it just not possible?
Highly recommend checking out a coffee subscription service like www.mistobox.com/ so you're not as limited! You may be experiencing issues with pressure exactly because the coffee you're using is too old. We don't discount pressure as a non-variable because it totally is, but if you're typically using coffee with a "best-by" date, there's really no way to know when the coffee was roasted....could be a year ago. Once you open the bag, coffee beans start to degrade immediately, so, the best-by date ends up being pretty much moot. Older coffee and darker roasts tend to be more bitter because of the roasting process, the age of the coffee, and the roaster's use and sourcing of lesser-quality beans. which tends to characterize coffee without a roast date or for companies like Illy and Lavazza that mainly get their coffee from the cheap commodities market.
Thank you! Very helpful. One question...other than timing & weighing your shot, how do you know when it's finished extracting? Sometimes it still seems like good stuff is coming out so it feels like I'm wasting product if I stop too early. But I don't want a bitter shot either. I fear my palette isn't very seasoned to know this on my own yet (by taste).
Hello, what manual grinder would you suggest? I see some reviews mentioning that Commandante is not good enough meaning it doesn't have enough steps. What do you think?
This is the only one we stock and we love it! clivecoffee.com/products/eureka-baby-hand-grinder. However, we try and avoid using a hand grinder for espresso. Way too much work.
Loved the video! I am new to espresso.. I bought the Breville Bambino plus and the Capreso Infinity plus conical grinder.. What would you advise I set the grinder at? Thank you!
Excellent video. Hopefully, this will shorten my already painful learning curve. Quick question: what is the brand and model of the small, round scale you used? Thanks!
I have watched this video multiple times. I was producing great espresso on a Profitec 500 PID with a Baratza sette 270 wi using a 20 gram basket. Recently without changing anything the water pours through the porta filter in 7-10 secs. I have replaced the shower screen and gasket, bought a Pullman big step tamper, and a new portafilter basket. I have change the grind size in a step wise fashion to finer to coarser without a difference. Any suggestions beside buying a super automatic machine? thanks ed
If you're going from finer to coarser, you're making your grind size larger, which means water will just pour through the puck even faster. You need to adjust finer.
Yes that is what common would suggest. I started incrementally making it as fine as possible. But the issue is I had dialed it in for perfection extraction and followed that formula for months! Now it gushes through without me altering a thing. I suspect there is channeling but examining the puck does not identify this.
Well, you were going to have to make grind adjustments at some point. That's the bread and butter of being a barista. If you're still not able to grind fine enough, you may have to install one of the metal shims that Baratza provides in the original package @@edzimmerman5591
Biggest recommendation I cant stress enough. If you normally drink cappuccinos or lattes, ask your barista at your hopefully local café not strong bux, to taste just the espresso. When I first started home espresso everything I made tasted horrible and I couldn't figure out why. New grinder, great coffee, great machine, and still terrible tasting espresso. Guess what? to me espresso taste terrible lol I asked for a shot at my café and almost spit it out, then drank my normal cappuccino and it was fantastic. All this can be great if you truly like just espresso but if you drink your espresso with milk then try making a full drink before saying it taste bad. Yes you waste more milk but you may save yourself tons of beans if you realize straight espresso is not up your alley. Just my two cents.
Yeah I don't like black coffee so I always put sugar in the shot before tasting. But I also taste without sugar to see if it's exceptionally acidic or bitter
Today I found that my shots were pulling faster BUT - was getting a restrettio instead of a expresso with the same grind/dose . Coffee is 3 weeks old, so it should have been going the other way. OK - I learned something new - coffee is like a woman, hard to predict, and often not easy to please. :)
Simple and easy explanation but I think 1:1.5 is towards the ristretto range than the espresso range . I prefer it at 1:2 or 2.2 for medium dark roasts.
doesn't really affect the shot, its just to have it aimed into a cup for less mess. a bottomless is used to diagnose the shot (to see if it is channeling, has even distribution, or just to see it come out because its cool)
espresso maker newbie. when hearing you say "time is the total number of seconds it takes including drop time," I'm stuck because on my new espresso machine you set the amount of ml you want. so if volume on my machine must be controlled how can dose and yield determine time, when choosing volume is mixed into the calculation? Am I thinking right here if my dose is 16g w Clive's 1:1.5 the yield I want is 24g I set vol. to something more than 24ml let's say 40 ml and stop it at 24? Am I thinking right there? Any advice to how to also choose the right volume to get a desired ratio?
Espresso extraction begins right when water touches the coffee puck. It's best to aim for an output instead of a volume. We measure our output in grams.
Great job on this. Nice to see an update to the older guide from 4 years ago. Interesting that this one lists double shot basket weights as 16-18g and the old one (which doesn't discuss basket sizes says 18-20g). 👍🏼for the produciton value and levity. Curious to know what that machine is with the built in timer!
Pucking a brew recipe is making me pull out my hair. Are you saying the ratio is more or less your choice? So i just choose? Cuz ive vhanged this ratio 3 times now and im not able yo get something as sweet and creamy as ive had at other cafes
Yep! You choose your brew ratio. It's best to not change so many variables and just change one at a time, for instance, your extraction time. Or make grind adjustments. It could be that you don't really like the coffee.
If you choose a recipe or ratio of 1:2 or 1:2.5 instead of 1:5 would you still aim for a time of 30 sec or would that increase also? If so by how much?
He says 1:1.5, not 1:5. As far as I understand it, you want the time to be constant - you control the amount of the end result liquid by adjusting the grind coarseness accordingly (finer = slower flow, less total liquid in 30 seconds and vice versa).
We typically include pre-infusion time in the total time because it's a part of the extraction. However, don't be afraid to leave the 25-30 second window and brew longer when pre-infusing. Judge on taste!
I have this question after watching many home espresso guides. Why is it always the time (30s something) that determines how we should adjust the grind size? What is the rationale behind this standard? Can anyone help me?
It is a general standard developed over the years so when different people get together to assess what is going on we can all understand what is going on with the extraction. Think of it this way, we use either MPH or KPH for speed depending on whether we follow metric or not. A standard of 25-30 seconds is what we all start with. Of course depending on the roast (light or dark) you can fine tune the extraction shot goal to 20-22 seconds (light roast) or 28-30 or more for darker roast. The overall concept is to fix/nail down all other variables (dose, grind size, etc,) and to use the time as a moving variable to understand what is going on to see how all variables are interacting. You should take a memo pad or index card and right down all your data. You start to see the relationship between dose, grind setting, tamp, water temp, shot clock, yield, etc. as you analyze shot after shot.
The idea is that if water flows too fast then the coffee won't be able to give all it has so it's going to taste weak and acidic. If it flows too slow then it's going to be very bitter. I notice that shots pulled at 25" are much less bitter than 30" ones. I also couldn't understand the reasoning but I tasted sour shots that went too fast and bitter ones
If I use 10 gram of coffee, and I brew 20 gram of yeild, what time should I consider the perfect time dialing? Or my question is, Is time(25s-30s) perfect for any type of ration espresso shots.
What kind of basket are you using in the portafilter? I always seem to get grounds stuck in the crease around the “neck” inside the basket. The one you are using doesn’t seem to have a crease.
We're using a triple basket in our bottomless portafilter. There is a small divot where the rim is around the top. You probably are using a single or double basket if it tapers quite a bit.
No... I use a dose around 17-18g in and look for a yield of 27-30g out to shoot for 1:1.5 ratio. Your shot is 18g in and 60g out which is a ratio of 1:3.3. That is on the really long shot and your flavor may not be optimal. You should also source local roastery who can sell you fresh roast coffee beans. Ideal freshness is 5-8 days after roasting date. If your coffee beans are sold without a roast date on it, it is not fresh generally.
There is a trend for really long shot espresso which is not the standard. I don't want to discourage you from liking long shots. As long as YOU like your coffee drinks, who am I to say otherwise?? Write down all your data on a note pad or index cards and write your notes down for flavors you noticed. Over time, you get the feel for what YOU like. Also, as beans age longer from roast date, you need to adjust your grinder to achieve the same flavor. That is not usually discussed on beginning level.
hi! great guide! i m just confuse about the dose, u said on the single basket has to be 7 to 10gr, so i suppose for having a single shot of espresso, but why on your recipe you are using 20gr of coffee for a single shot of espresso?
You'll find our most recent video very helpful in breaking down this concept: ruclips.net/video/eBQMy8ZlmIY/видео.html 20g dose is used to make a "triple shot" which would be close to 2oz of espresso out and would be served as the shot in most drinks.
Italians use lower dose in Italy. Americans use higher dose. Depends on what you want to achieve. If you get an Italian espresso roast, try 10-14 grams as a start since that is the recipe for Italian style espresso. Use a correct basket when using a lower dose. Good luck.
Hi. I'm using a very cheap, home espresso machine given to me by a friend who doesnt use it anymore. The machine comes with a pressurised basket unfortunately and i cannot actually see how each shot flows. The problem is that my shots come out too fast (10 seconds) and I wanted to ask whether there is any point grinding finer or is using a pressurised basket a hopeless case?
If I am getting to little volume in the 30 second time frame, how do I know if the issue is grind size or if I am tamping too hard? It seems that my tamp pressure varies which affects output, so it's challenging to discern what the problem is. Thanks.
The best thing you can do is keep your tamp as consistent as possible. It's okay to tamp with lots of pressure but you don't need to. If you can try to eliminate that as a changing variable, you'll have a much better time dialing in. If you can't seem to do that, I would recommend looking into the Artpresso or Saint Anthony tamping tools!
Tamping pressure and grind size are two independent variables which you already know. To nail down the issue, you should first try to achieve consistency in your tamping through tamping tools. There is the DWT tool to loosen up the puck, then a leveler/distributor which I highly recommend to avoid crooked level. Finally after a leveler, your regular tamp should be easier to press down level and be light on the touch to achieve consistent tamping. After that you can focus on grind size. Play with different grind setting and jot down the shot time for given grind size. Try to do 3 times for each setting to make sure the data is reliable and then make changes to grind size (coarse or fine) and repeat. You will figure out which way you should go based on the shot time (25-30 seconds). If you get less than 25 seconds, you go finer on the grind. Vice versa when shot time is too long.
Hi, brand new to espresso. We bought a fairly cheap machine to get started, and we don't grind our own coffee just yet (I know, a sin) do you have thoughts for budget coffee makers on getting the best out of what we have to work with? Or is dose/Yield/Time applicable to all setups?
How's it been going for you so far? It's VERY hard to be in control of your shots if you don't have a grinder. The grind size is your main tool for adjusting your time and extraction.
I'll add the big dark secret of Espresso. Assuming the machine does a good job maintaining temperature and pressure. The grinder is more important than the espresso machine. The equivalent of driving a high end automobile with cheap under inflated tires.
Your ratio also depends on what type of coffee drink you are planning. Ristretto will be 1:1 but espresso normale should be 1:1.2 to 1:2 generally. Some beans will require even a higher ratio like 1:2.5 to close to 1:3. Let your taste be the guide.
@@efte71 Depends on your particular machine setup. Generally, yes - 22-30 seconds range to cover light to dark roast beans. Goes without saying but you should match your dose to a correct size basket.
Thank you for great video! One thing i struggle with is understanding "time" and yield correlation, do i always aim for 25-30 seconds, doesnt matter if its 20ml ristretto or 60ml lungo? Or is there other technique and time is just a result?
Hey! Your total shot time should stay between 25-30 regardless of the yield. So, if you pull 40g in 30 seconds but want to shoot for 30g, adjust your grind finer to slow down the extraction. With a finer grind and smaller yield, your shot time is still staying between 25-30 seconds.
I have a sage barista express, I am using coffee that is within 7 days of roasting however even using a 22g shot I still extract a 1:2 ratio in 17 seconds and my machine is on the finest setting! Any ideas anyone?
I would recommend contacting Breville to look into calibrating your grinder. That is a large dose and very fresh coffee, so it doesn't seem to be the issue. If your grinder isn't able to go any finer and you're not able to calibrate, you could try to raise your dose more if there's any room. Otherwise, you may want to look into a separate grinder.
Have someone who has his own setup and have him/her visually confirm the grind size coming out of the grinder to be in the espresso size range. Those with experience can visually confirm whether your grinds are in the *general ballpark* or not. After that, you need to look at your *puck prep* which should be consistently done to promote repeatable consistency. Even if your grind size is perfect, your extraction will be fast (less than 25 seconds... like 15 to 17 seconds) if your puck prep is terrible - which could promote the dreaded *channeling* where the brew water bypasses the grinds through the puck. If you are new to espresso making, you need to invest in a DWT tool (generic ones will do) and a distributor to evenly prep the puck surface for your tamp which you need to practice to *get the feel* right so your hands/arm/elbow becomes consistent as well.
The barista express has a way for an additional adjustment at the grinder. This adjustment is done by taking off the hopper and twisting the top piece of the burr. Top burr adjustment.
I am confusifed on dosing to yield. If 1to 1.5 is 20g in 30 g out how is that ever going to be a double shot. I understand volume is different but thats not even close . 30g is like one shot.
I am not trying to be a hard head about this but how would ya make a cortada in a gibralter glass unless your putting 40g of coffee in. While i understand why the ratio between the coffee in and espresso out it doesnt seem to match correctly with any milk based recipe.@@clivecoffee
I think it's also feeling comfortable with "there are no rules" really. Not all specialty coffee shops make a cappuccino the same way. Being prescriptive with coffee kind of defeats the purpose and removes the fun of experimenting from our POV.
Thanks for the advice but why do all the RUclipsrs never really show the entry level/medium cost expresso machines 😅 don't get me wrong some of these cool looking machine you all show are lovely but cost about the same as a good used car 😅
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The sand/rocks analogy is brilliant
3:22 "as coffee ages, your shot will pull faster, encouraging you to grind finer." The statement I was looking for. No wonder I keep on set the grind setting finer once in a while for the same coffee bag.
Well explained! Thanks! One thing though: you could add a video on what change in your recipe will influence the taste.
very good and concise lesson. no pretentious rambling.
I'm a novice, and this is a great video: concise, easy to understand and comprehensive of several factors. Great stuff!
Happy shot pulling!
rarely straightforward and no nonsense video. bravo.
Finally!! Simple concise descriptive logical explanation and relation / ration between quantity, timing, grinding etc. Thank you !!!
Brilliant video, thank you
Thanks!
This was one of the clearest videos without much fillers .. a well tamped video - thanks for the effort put into this, I’ve gained loads :)
Glad you enjoyed it!
Excellent explanation, practical knowledge. I have a simple question. I love Starbucks Italian or French dark roast coffee (very oily beans). I cannot use any home fully automatic espresso machine available on today’s market for oily beans including Jura espresso. Oily beans can damage the machine. To avoid any problem only solution is to use a separate good quality coffee grinder and espresso machine. Which brand of grinder and espresso are the best for the oily coffee beans (dark roast) for the home use?
Honestly, oily beans are tough on any grinder. You can absolutely use any grinder we sell, but you will find it necessary to deep-clean the grinder more often than not.
This video is amazing. I thought it was to fast but then I saw on the extended description de feature of choosing a specific subject. Thank you for that.
Excellent guide! I'm just now starting out with home espresso and this video REALLY helped me understand the relationship between dose, yield, grind size, and time. Looking forward to a fun hobby, thanks again for the video!
That all made real sense! It has helped me to start using my new gaggia in a much more precise and repeatable way- well done for an excellent video.
Wonderful video. Very informative and to the point.
One thing I’ve learnt pulling shots at home is that espresso is an incredibly finicky little beast! Sometimes you hit a home run, sometimes you don’t.
Isn't that the truth! Thankfully, a bit of milk can save just about any shot.
Thank you for this informative and well presented video. As a beginner, I'm enjoying going down the espresso rabbit hole!
Cheers!
Great video, thanks August!
You just got a subscriber
No nonsense video
Thank you my friend
Cheers!
Clearly explained, thank you. When you pull a 20g in -> 30g out, do you call that an espresso shot or a double espresso shot?
@@marc-oliviergiguere3290 it can be called whatever you wish. referring to it as an espresso ratio rather than a double-shot could be more useful.
@@clivecoffee Thanks. My question was more like in a Cortado for example, there is 60 ml of espresso. 60ml is considered 2 shots of espresso. So logically, 1 shot of espresso is roughly 30 ml.
A cortado is a 1:1 ratio of milk to espresso. Typically a "double-shot" can be considered between 20g-60g of liquid yield, but even that's not a hard fast rule. This is why it's not useful to get hung up on definitions of what a double-shot is or isn't and why brew ratios are much more useful. We're usually working between a 1:1-1:3.
@@clivecoffee Cool thanks!
Thorightly explained for a beginner. Thank you 🙏
Happy shot pulling!
Hi. At 4:11 seconds you state the amount of pressure is not as important as repetition and consistency, but I've found the amount of pressure greatly effects how the water permeates the coffee grinds and ultimately passes through the portafilter. it isn't always possible for me to have beans roasted within a week, I am for the most part, limited to beans I can buy on Amazon or Wegmans such as Lavazza or Illy. They only state "best by" dates so I can be assured they were roasted weeks if not months ago. How can I limit/reduce the bitterness with beans like this? Or is it just not possible?
Highly recommend checking out a coffee subscription service like www.mistobox.com/ so you're not as limited! You may be experiencing issues with pressure exactly because the coffee you're using is too old. We don't discount pressure as a non-variable because it totally is, but if you're typically using coffee with a "best-by" date, there's really no way to know when the coffee was roasted....could be a year ago. Once you open the bag, coffee beans start to degrade immediately, so, the best-by date ends up being pretty much moot. Older coffee and darker roasts tend to be more bitter because of the roasting process, the age of the coffee, and the roaster's use and sourcing of lesser-quality beans. which tends to characterize coffee without a roast date or for companies like Illy and Lavazza that mainly get their coffee from the cheap commodities market.
Such a good guide! And I’ve watched like 3 hours of guides on yt !
Glad you enjoyed it! Happy shot pulling.
When start counting? I use a scaler
Have also timer on my espressomachine
So which one prefer?
Right when you start your shot.
Nice video fun and informative thank you
Thank you! Very helpful. One question...other than timing & weighing your shot, how do you know when it's finished extracting? Sometimes it still seems like good stuff is coming out so it feels like I'm wasting product if I stop too early. But I don't want a bitter shot either. I fear my palette isn't very seasoned to know this on my own yet (by taste).
Excellent video!! My new espresso machine is coming today. I have a lot of learning to do. This helps tremendously! Thank you!
Feeling very grateful that I found you :)
What is the correct dose for a 51mm portafilter? Is it still 16/18 grams?
Brilliant… Thank you.
Hello, what manual grinder would you suggest? I see some reviews mentioning that Commandante is not good enough meaning it doesn't have enough steps. What do you think?
This is the only one we stock and we love it! clivecoffee.com/products/eureka-baby-hand-grinder. However, we try and avoid using a hand grinder for espresso. Way too much work.
hey, great video , what espresso machine do you use in the video ?
That is the LUCCA X58 Espresso Machine - clivecoffee.com/products/lucca-x58-espresso-machine-by-quick-mill
@@clivecoffee thank you ! Is the Machine developed by you ?
Loved the video! I am new to espresso.. I bought the Breville Bambino plus and the Capreso Infinity plus conical grinder.. What would you advise I set the grinder at? Thank you!
no way to know until you pull a shot! every coffee is different so there is no starting grind setting.
I have the bambino but my infinity plus is not able to gind fine enough.. perhaps because it is a 10 yr old grinder??
That could be it. the burrs could be worn through. May be time to upgrade the grinder!@@kenroman777
Thank you, this video was very good for an espresso novice like me.
Glad it was helpful!
dude i really needed this video
Saving lives - one home barista at a time.
@@clivecoffee so im using 15G's but for some reason at the 30seconds mark im at 70 to 80 grams of liquid in my cup. what can I adjust?
@@mrchriz1000 make the grind finer, that will slow the liquid output
Such a high quality video! Love it!
Absolutely brilliant content and presenter !
Excellent video. Hopefully, this will shorten my already painful learning curve. Quick question: what is the brand and model of the small, round scale you used? Thanks!
the Acaia Lunar-clivecoffee.com/products/acaia-lunar-scale
@@clivecoffee Thank you!
Great video!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I have watched this video multiple times.
I was producing great espresso on a Profitec 500 PID with a Baratza sette 270 wi using a 20 gram basket. Recently without changing anything the water pours through the porta filter in 7-10 secs. I have replaced the shower screen and gasket, bought a Pullman big step tamper, and a new portafilter basket. I have change the grind size in a step wise fashion to finer to coarser without a difference. Any suggestions beside buying a super automatic machine?
thanks
ed
If you're going from finer to coarser, you're making your grind size larger, which means water will just pour through the puck even faster. You need to adjust finer.
Yes that is what common would suggest. I started incrementally making it as fine as possible. But the issue is I had dialed it in for perfection extraction and followed that formula for months! Now it gushes through without me altering a thing. I suspect there is channeling but examining the puck does not identify this.
Well, you were going to have to make grind adjustments at some point. That's the bread and butter of being a barista. If you're still not able to grind fine enough, you may have to install one of the metal shims that Baratza provides in the original package @@edzimmerman5591
Biggest recommendation I cant stress enough. If you normally drink cappuccinos or lattes, ask your barista at your hopefully local café not strong bux, to taste just the espresso. When I first started home espresso everything I made tasted horrible and I couldn't figure out why. New grinder, great coffee, great machine, and still terrible tasting espresso.
Guess what? to me espresso taste terrible lol I asked for a shot at my café and almost spit it out, then drank my normal cappuccino and it was fantastic. All this can be great if you truly like just espresso but if you drink your espresso with milk then try making a full drink before saying it taste bad. Yes you waste more milk but you may save yourself tons of beans if you realize straight espresso is not up your alley.
Just my two cents.
Great advice!
Yeah I don't like black coffee so I always put sugar in the shot before tasting. But I also taste without sugar to see if it's exceptionally acidic or bitter
Today I found that my shots were pulling faster BUT - was getting a restrettio instead of a expresso with the same grind/dose . Coffee is 3 weeks old, so it should have been going the other way. OK - I learned something new - coffee is like a woman, hard to predict, and often not easy to please. :)
Simple and easy explanation but I think 1:1.5 is towards the ristretto range than the espresso range . I prefer it at 1:2 or 2.2 for medium dark roasts.
I am also a beginner ,, is the 1.5 ratio the same for double or single,, is 30 seconds also the same for single of double ratios
Thx a lot for this video! I was kind of stuck at the 1:2 ratio and I am not very happy with it. Going to try 1:1.5 tomorrow!
The 1:1.5 seems to be a solid starting point for most roasts, give it a shot! (yes, pun intended)
Awesome work, like always.
Very helpful! Can't wait to make espresso tomorrow!
Total newvie here: why do you start the timer when you start the machine, and not when the first drop of liquid espresso falls into the cup?
Espresso extraction begins right when water touches the espresso puck.
Thx for the video! When should I use the double spout portafilter to spilt the shot?
doesn't really affect the shot, its just to have it aimed into a cup for less mess. a bottomless is used to diagnose the shot (to see if it is channeling, has even distribution, or just to see it come out because its cool)
espresso maker newbie. when hearing you say "time is the total number of seconds it takes including drop time," I'm stuck because on my new espresso machine you set the amount of ml you want. so if volume on my machine must be controlled how can dose and yield determine time, when choosing volume is mixed into the calculation? Am I thinking right here if my dose is 16g w Clive's 1:1.5 the yield I want is 24g I set vol. to something more than 24ml let's say 40 ml and stop it at 24? Am I thinking right there? Any advice to how to also choose the right volume to get a desired ratio?
Espresso extraction begins right when water touches the coffee puck. It's best to aim for an output instead of a volume. We measure our output in grams.
@ thanks for your quick response.
Great job on this. Nice to see an update to the older guide from 4 years ago. Interesting that this one lists double shot basket weights as 16-18g and the old one (which doesn't discuss basket sizes says 18-20g). 👍🏼for the produciton value and levity. Curious to know what that machine is with the built in timer!
I have three mugs of espresso coffee in the morning, Lismore NSW Australia.
Pucking a brew recipe is making me pull out my hair. Are you saying the ratio is more or less your choice? So i just choose? Cuz ive vhanged this ratio 3 times now and im not able yo get something as sweet and creamy as ive had at other cafes
Yep! You choose your brew ratio. It's best to not change so many variables and just change one at a time, for instance, your extraction time. Or make grind adjustments. It could be that you don't really like the coffee.
Hey, can you tell me the make and the model of the one you used
If you choose a recipe or ratio of 1:2 or 1:2.5 instead of 1:5 would you still aim for a time of 30 sec or would that increase also? If so by how much?
He says 1:1.5, not 1:5. As far as I understand it, you want the time to be constant - you control the amount of the end result liquid by adjusting the grind coarseness accordingly (finer = slower flow, less total liquid in 30 seconds and vice versa).
Do you include the pre-infusion time within the 25-30s window? I’m working with the Breville Barista express.
We typically include pre-infusion time in the total time because it's a part of the extraction. However, don't be afraid to leave the 25-30 second window and brew longer when pre-infusing. Judge on taste!
this is sooo helpful
Thank you for making this!
Grear video, thanks. May I ask what machine are you using?
Hi! In this video we're working with the LUCCA M58. For more info, take a look here: clivecoffee.com/products/lucca-m58-espresso-machine-by-quick-mill
perfect work !
I have this question after watching many home espresso guides. Why is it always the time (30s something) that determines how we should adjust the grind size? What is the rationale behind this standard? Can anyone help me?
It is a general standard developed over the years so when different people get together to assess what is going on we can all understand what is going on with the extraction. Think of it this way, we use either MPH or KPH for speed depending on whether we follow metric or not. A standard of 25-30 seconds is what we all start with. Of course depending on the roast (light or dark) you can fine tune the extraction shot goal to 20-22 seconds (light roast) or 28-30 or more for darker roast. The overall concept is to fix/nail down all other variables (dose, grind size, etc,) and to use the time as a moving variable to understand what is going on to see how all variables are interacting. You should take a memo pad or index card and right down all your data. You start to see the relationship between dose, grind setting, tamp, water temp, shot clock, yield, etc. as you analyze shot after shot.
The idea is that if water flows too fast then the coffee won't be able to give all it has so it's going to taste weak and acidic. If it flows too slow then it's going to be very bitter. I notice that shots pulled at 25" are much less bitter than 30" ones. I also couldn't understand the reasoning but I tasted sour shots that went too fast and bitter ones
If I use 10 gram of coffee, and I brew 20 gram of yeild, what time should I consider the perfect time dialing? Or my question is, Is time(25s-30s) perfect for any type of ration espresso shots.
Excellent
Thank you! Cheers!
What kind of basket are you using in the portafilter? I always seem to get grounds stuck in the crease around the “neck” inside the basket. The one you are using doesn’t seem to have a crease.
We're using a triple basket in our bottomless portafilter. There is a small divot where the rim is around the top. You probably are using a single or double basket if it tapers quite a bit.
Is this recipe for my coffee beans good? Dose 18 grams Yield is 60 and time is with in 25-32 seconds. I’m using an Allegro Coffee beans medium roast.
No... I use a dose around 17-18g in and look for a yield of 27-30g out to shoot for 1:1.5 ratio. Your shot is 18g in and 60g out which is a ratio of 1:3.3. That is on the really long shot and your flavor may not be optimal. You should also source local roastery who can sell you fresh roast coffee beans. Ideal freshness is 5-8 days after roasting date. If your coffee beans are sold without a roast date on it, it is not fresh generally.
There is a trend for really long shot espresso which is not the standard. I don't want to discourage you from liking long shots. As long as YOU like your coffee drinks, who am I to say otherwise?? Write down all your data on a note pad or index cards and write your notes down for flavors you noticed. Over time, you get the feel for what YOU like. Also, as beans age longer from roast date, you need to adjust your grinder to achieve the same flavor. That is not usually discussed on beginning level.
hi! great guide! i m just confuse about the dose, u said on the single basket has to be 7 to 10gr, so i suppose for having a single shot of espresso, but why on your recipe you are using 20gr of coffee for a single shot of espresso?
You'll find our most recent video very helpful in breaking down this concept: ruclips.net/video/eBQMy8ZlmIY/видео.html
20g dose is used to make a "triple shot" which would be close to 2oz of espresso out and would be served as the shot in most drinks.
Italians use lower dose in Italy. Americans use higher dose. Depends on what you want to achieve. If you get an Italian espresso roast, try 10-14 grams as a start since that is the recipe for Italian style espresso. Use a correct basket when using a lower dose. Good luck.
So I have a double shot filter but can only fit about 10g in there. My guess is because it is a 51mm. Would that be true?
That makes sense since the diameter of the portafilter basket is much more compact.
Thank you very much man
Hi. I'm using a very cheap, home espresso machine given to me by a friend who doesnt use it anymore. The machine comes with a pressurised basket unfortunately and i cannot actually see how each shot flows. The problem is that my shots come out too fast (10 seconds) and I wanted to ask whether there is any point grinding finer or is using a pressurised basket a hopeless case?
You could try grinding finer, but there's only so much you can do with a pressurized basket.
If I am getting to little volume in the 30 second time frame, how do I know if the issue is grind size or if I am tamping too hard? It seems that my tamp pressure varies which affects output, so it's challenging to discern what the problem is. Thanks.
The best thing you can do is keep your tamp as consistent as possible. It's okay to tamp with lots of pressure but you don't need to. If you can try to eliminate that as a changing variable, you'll have a much better time dialing in. If you can't seem to do that, I would recommend looking into the Artpresso or Saint Anthony tamping tools!
Tamping pressure and grind size are two independent variables which you already know. To nail down the issue, you should first try to achieve consistency in your tamping through tamping tools. There is the DWT tool to loosen up the puck, then a leveler/distributor which I highly recommend to avoid crooked level. Finally after a leveler, your regular tamp should be easier to press down level and be light on the touch to achieve consistent tamping. After that you can focus on grind size. Play with different grind setting and jot down the shot time for given grind size. Try to do 3 times for each setting to make sure the data is reliable and then make changes to grind size (coarse or fine) and repeat. You will figure out which way you should go based on the shot time (25-30 seconds). If you get less than 25 seconds, you go finer on the grind. Vice versa when shot time is too long.
Hi, brand new to espresso. We bought a fairly cheap machine to get started, and we don't grind our own coffee just yet (I know, a sin) do you have thoughts for budget coffee makers on getting the best out of what we have to work with? Or is dose/Yield/Time applicable to all setups?
How's it been going for you so far? It's VERY hard to be in control of your shots if you don't have a grinder. The grind size is your main tool for adjusting your time and extraction.
I'll add the big dark secret of Espresso. Assuming the machine does a good job maintaining temperature and pressure. The grinder is more important than the espresso machine.
The equivalent of driving a high end automobile with cheap under inflated tires.
Simple and perfect explanation, great video!
good video what kind of ratio do you recommended for French dark roasted bean in grams?.. thank you
Typically larger ratios like a 1:1 -1:2 would be best for dark roasts.
Your ratio also depends on what type of coffee drink you are planning. Ristretto will be 1:1 but espresso normale should be 1:1.2 to 1:2 generally. Some beans will require even a higher ratio like 1:2.5 to close to 1:3. Let your taste be the guide.
What is the name of these beautiful glasses? :)
Hay guys, in Peru and Bolivia thay usually give me doppio which is so acidic... Maybe 30ml-40ml of Caffe. What is the reason for this?
Could be the specific coffee. Maybe it would taste better pulled longer!
I am always wondering about this triple baskets, 20 grams isn't too much caffeine for the body?
For caffeine sensitive folks you might want to consider a smaller basket.
Where do i get that little scale?
Acaia Lunar: clivecoffee.com/products/acaia-lunar-scale
How many seconds to make good espresso, 1:1.5, 10g?
You should judge that based on taste but 25 to 30 seconds is a great place to start.
@@clivecoffee 10 grams or 18 grams still takes 25 to 30 seconds?
@@efte71 Depends on your particular machine setup. Generally, yes - 22-30 seconds range to cover light to dark roast beans. Goes without saying but you should match your dose to a correct size basket.
Thank you for great video! One thing i struggle with is understanding "time" and yield correlation, do i always aim for 25-30 seconds, doesnt matter if its 20ml ristretto or 60ml lungo? Or is there other technique and time is just a result?
Hey! Your total shot time should stay between 25-30 regardless of the yield. So, if you pull 40g in 30 seconds but want to shoot for 30g, adjust your grind finer to slow down the extraction. With a finer grind and smaller yield, your shot time is still staying between 25-30 seconds.
@@clivecoffee Thank you very much for your explanation! You've made my coffee making with one less headache haha cheers!
thank you. i am going to try 20 grams today
20 grams was nice very nice.
I have a sage barista express, I am using coffee that is within 7 days of roasting however even using a 22g shot I still extract a 1:2 ratio in 17 seconds and my machine is on the finest setting! Any ideas anyone?
I would recommend contacting Breville to look into calibrating your grinder. That is a large dose and very fresh coffee, so it doesn't seem to be the issue. If your grinder isn't able to go any finer and you're not able to calibrate, you could try to raise your dose more if there's any room. Otherwise, you may want to look into a separate grinder.
Have someone who has his own setup and have him/her visually confirm the grind size coming out of the grinder to be in the espresso size range. Those with experience can visually confirm whether your grinds are in the *general ballpark* or not. After that, you need to look at your *puck prep* which should be consistently done to promote repeatable consistency. Even if your grind size is perfect, your extraction will be fast (less than 25 seconds... like 15 to 17 seconds) if your puck prep is terrible - which could promote the dreaded *channeling* where the brew water bypasses the grinds through the puck. If you are new to espresso making, you need to invest in a DWT tool (generic ones will do) and a distributor to evenly prep the puck surface for your tamp which you need to practice to *get the feel* right so your hands/arm/elbow becomes consistent as well.
The barista express has a way for an additional adjustment at the grinder. This adjustment is done by taking off the hopper and twisting the top piece of the burr. Top burr adjustment.
I am confusifed on dosing to yield. If 1to 1.5 is 20g in 30 g out how is that ever going to be a double shot. I understand volume is different but thats not even close . 30g is like one shot.
If it's easier, just ignore terms like "double shot" and just focus on the ratio.
can do thanks, so if your making a milk drink recipe that is 1 to 2 then 60g of milk or is it 4oz of milk?@@clivecoffee
I am not trying to be a hard head about this but how would ya make a cortada in a gibralter glass unless your putting 40g of coffee in. While i understand why the ratio between the coffee in and espresso out it doesnt seem to match correctly with any milk based recipe.@@clivecoffee
A cortado is technically just a mini latte with 1:1 recipe, and in a tiny glass, so it completely makes sense. @@timothysmith6211
I think it's also feeling comfortable with "there are no rules" really. Not all specialty coffee shops make a cappuccino the same way. Being prescriptive with coffee kind of defeats the purpose and removes the fun of experimenting from our POV.
Great video, although you got the tips on adjusting your grind size around the wrong way!
I picked that up as well
Thanks for the advice but why do all the RUclipsrs never really show the entry level/medium cost expresso machines 😅 don't get me wrong some of these cool looking machine you all show are lovely but cost about the same as a good used car 😅
We have a bunch of those available on our website if you take a look!
This doesn’t make sense, 1.5oz liquid espresso target is 42.53g instead of 30g, which one is the the target, 30g or 1.5oz
Espresso is always measured in grams.
Distribution was way over simplified for the meant who won't have amazing grinders and who don't get nice fluffy grounds like he did in the video.
Dialing expresso cost alot of money buying and wasting beans too
Why? You'll still drink the coffee you make and each day you try to get it better
@@ioanna_vslunless it sucks so bad you just throw it down the drain
@@rockon609just Mary Pippins it
#successpeoplesquotes
A "complete" guide in 6 minutes? lol.
Still working on the novel-length version. Stay tuned.