I have an upcoming video about the 1st test I use for judging any audio product. I have not heard these nor, as a business man, do I know much about the company. So, perhaps, one day, we will cross paths.
Agreed. Q Acoustics incorporates some legit proprietary technology in the Concept 500 that equates to a $7000 pair punching way over their price point.
I am buying Q-Acoustics concept 500 towers this week. I am like you, I prefer a warmer more neutral sound that I can listen to for hours, my ears do not like bright, harsh sounding speakers. No one is building speakers at that price point like Q-Acoustics.
I belong to a Patreon group following A British Audiophile. One of the discussions today centred on the lack of dealers and the quality of those remaining few. It’s clear that if we want high quality dealers, we can’t always be hunting down the best price. From watching your channel I can tell you go the extra mile to ensure your customers have a great experience and I’m betting they return time and again on their journey. If the vendors you deal with can’t see that short term cash grabs aren’t right for their faithful retail partners, let alone for their premium brand status, they absolutely deserve to be dropped. There are two business models a vendor can choose. If they want to control the market price they should go the direct route. If they want to sell ex-factory and have all distribution and retail handled by their partners, they should allow those partners the margin to survive. Hybrid models only confuse customers and don’t work in the long run.
That’s just not true. Tell that to Safe and Sound. They’re a Hybrid model and they are a rock solid business. They have a great retail showroom as well as a thriving internet business. Companies need to be flexible to survive in 2023.
@@kingtrance307 apologies, when I said hybrid, I was referring to the manufacturer. I accept retailers offer a variety of sales platforms to suit customer taste, however, customers need to decide how much value they place on the ability to go into a showroom to compare gear before they buy. If they are happy to constantly be swapping demo gear in and out of their systems then they can chase the last dollar of discount to their hearts content. But if they would rather consult an expert face to face, it’s only fair to support the dealer. Manufacturers that try to sell direct and via dealers further undermine the value that the retailer brings. Focal weren’t intentionally trying to go direct, however, by their actions they created a situation where service led dealers had no way to compete with other outlets who were buying below cost. That’s the equivalent of competing directly with the manufacturer.
Let me add a common experience. We just had a customer mail order 18,000 dollars of equipment we sell from a dealer 1,000 away. The rub is we did hours of demonstration and even a site inspection. So, in essence, the customer knowingly took service for which he had no intention of paying. Independents can not survive when customers engage in this unethical behavior. It is theft of services pure and simple. Then, the purchase was sealed with that dealer telling him it was sales tax free. That is not true. In many states, including Ohio, residents are required to report such purchases and pay the sales tax to the state in their annual state Income tax filing. It's right there on the form. (This is not an issue for states with no sales tax.) In addition, any mail order firm that annually sells more than 100,000 dollars of goods into the state of Ohio is, by law, required to collect such tax and pay it to the state. @@kingtrance307
A very thoughtful response. Thank you. This all began with the advent of custom installation where companies saw the opportunity to double their dealership base. The aurguement was that "they serve different customer." It completely ignored that we did such work and, worse yet, these "custom" installation companies, who had no demonstration facilities of their own, would gleefully send "their customers" into our shop and get free demos and sometimes even complete bids. We were, in essence, eating their business expenses in a sort of parasitic way. Of course they could play the price game because they and 0 invested in their business. This sank a lot of independents and started to create a sort of death spiral in actual dealer numbers. It is obvious why manufacturers leaped to mail order adding the convenience of less bookkeeping with fewer accounts. It made is easier to cut the direct link between the end user and the manufacturer. From the mail order perspective, that left smaller merchants either having to deal with it, quit, or go with Amazon. The picture is now complete. So, it's nearly impossible to actually hear a product anywhere increasing the need to "trust" reviews. I find most reviews about as trustworthy as a politician knowing quite well that audio is highly politicized. (Worse than old ladies talking over the backyard fence, actually.) Meanwhile, independents are forced to be very mindful of what they can sell to make a living under the constant threat of some Itchy and Scratchy selling it out of their basement. In our case, it is abundantly clear that our type of dealership is not wanted. Minimum purchase requirements and all sorts of things were implimented. It wasn't about what is best for the customer, it's what's best for the investors. Nuff said.
@@audibleeleganceinc - Well that was certainly a horribly depressing and accurate encapsulation of the current state of things Lou. I wasn’t trying to glorify the current business model with my Safe and Sound example, just saying their model seems to be working for them. Times have indeed changed and for old geezers like us not always for the better. I too grew up in what many of us consider to be the “glory days” of brick and mortar stores. I remember if you went in for a listen (liked what you heard) and got on with the dealer you eventually went home with new gear. Sometimes the dealer even loaned it to you first to listen for a while! Imagine that… Now we live in a lightning speed automated and impersonalized world ruled by the internet and AI 🤖and internet trolls. Unfortunately this has changed everything. Unscrupulous business people have always existed but like you say when the custom installers got into it many sabotaged it for brick and mortar. We’re never going back and it sucks. I will stop now because I’m probably just starting to sound like another old guy pining for the good old days (I AM.) Well good thing we can still put on some Doobie Brothers or Steely Dan (turn OFF the News), light up an occasional joint and forget about it all temporarily to avoid going completely mad. I wish I had a simple fix Lou but none of us can put time in a bottle…. Good luck to all of us! 🍀
Oh, it happens now and then. Focal once terminated us to go with another dealer and when that didn't work out, asked to come back to us. We accepted. But times change and it's what small merchants work through all the time. But the most recent was like you going to work and having your boss tell you how privileged you are to work for him so you should gladly accept a pay cut. Doesn't really work, does it?
Hi 👋, I totally agree with what you’re saying, If the manufacturer does not look after his customers, likewise, the shop look after his customers, you end up with no sale and a bad reputation, I’ve actually contacted them last year I have a pair of cobalt 806, serial number 10A00/1508 - and through, not my fault. One of the cabinets was knocked off the stand, and the twitter framework has broken as it is made of injected moulded, plastic, I’ve put the thing back together as best as I can, but I’m not happy with it, I contacted Focal JMLab , trying to find out whether I can get a new pair of tweeters, or whether they could tell me what the impedances, so I could actually purchase a pair of tweeters from another source I had no reply, If anybody knows the frequency response of the Tweeter or what I should replace it with, could you please let me know be very very appreciated, I actually live in France, Gone of the days when you could get back up service from most companies, all they seem to do nowadays is want your money, I wish you all that success for the future, and I hope you had a great Thanksgiving, Phil from the moulin France
It is a fine product and I am glad to hear you are enjoying them. Nothing in this video says otherwise. That said, I am pointing out that a small business can not remain in business if it has to deal with the way management wishes to sell their product. Like you, we are entitled to make our own business decisions. It's like this, you go into work and your boss decides that you do great work but is only willing to pay you 60% of your wages. How long will you stick around?
Well, Sir, many folks do not understand either the dynamics or difficulties of independents in our trade. It has been made more difficult by many factors including mail order, the internet, and investment groups. Art, knowledge, and service take a back seat to profit. I learned over the last few weeks of several of my brethren calling it quits. The loss of experience and knownledge is immense but they decided it was not worth it any more after cutting staff, taking away benefits like healthcare and paying for other basics. There was nothing more to cut.
@@audibleeleganceincHi I have been trying to leave a comment, This will be the third one, I do not know why but it’s linked to another comment, I’ll try again , I totally agree with what you’re saying, Loyalty trust in a relationship, whether it is with your partner, or the company that you are dealing with, has to work both ways, I always believe if you put 110% into your work, you should get back 110%. Gone of the days when people will go out their way to try and help , whether it is friends, family or in a working relations, I have actually contacted Focal, last year, had no response , I have a pair of cobalt 805, I think, and one of the tweeters has come apart, I was trying to get a pair of replacements, but without any success, I tried contacting some people that supply driver units, but they needed to know what the characteristics of the driver was is, I wish you all that success for the future , Phil from the moulin France
The industry as a whole is certainly at a low point. Their are far too few products being developed, offered, and supported by the passionate individuals that brought them forth. To think of all the brands that have been bought up and sold (often multiple time) or simply faded away during my thirty years in the industry is astonishing. There are many wonderful speaker vendors out there; more than any one dealer could carry, you just can not offer everything. Choosing to offer a selection of products from a vendor that takes care of their dealers is NOT something that is only a benefit to the dealer, but also is a huge benefit to the end customer....whether they realize it or not.
Thank you for taking the time to comment and reaffirm what I see what is going on. If anything, sadly, it is accelerating. I am even seeing manufacturers who said they wouldn't doing it. Between the changes in ownership, leadership, and staff, promises are being emptied.
I had hoped more dealers in North America wouldve dropped them. They trippled prices on the North American market. I actually made money on a pair that I sold used. I paid $800 new.. retail became little over 2 k new. I really can't believe more dealers didn't drop them.
Oh, I think you could say that for a great many brands and things. My personal property taxes on my truck in Virginia on a nearly 8 year old truck is the same value as my purchase price in 2016. Inflation is quite a devil.
Oh, my Moody Blues moments. Yeah, you are right. I don't write scripts, I don't practice, I don't have a teleprompter. I am afraid you don't get polished political messages where the speaker is polished and the content crap. I've flipped it. But, thank you and I will try to work on it. These are shot live and instantaneously. Usually one take only. Fun and fair comment.
It wasn't global supply issues that brought it all to an end but it didn't help. There has been simply a change in visions of which independents are really not a part of the picture. Add to this the complete lack of transparency and information and small dealers got stuck out in the middle of nowhere.
None of my observations were about the product at all but strictly the business decision. I am not alone in this observation and extends to the number of people who have left the company as well. If you are that sensitive to find things where they are not, then, perhaps might I suggest you ponder why you feel that way and what has given rise to it. Personally speaking, I find no cause at all to pick with France given that only with their assistance were we able to become a country. That's old history and today we are on the same team, generally speaking, as we watch the world stage.
I love Q Acoustics speakers due to their warmer sound and awesome value for your money even if it’s their most expensive models.
I have an upcoming video about the 1st test I use for judging any audio product. I have not heard these nor, as a business man, do I know much about the company. So, perhaps, one day, we will cross paths.
Agreed. Q Acoustics incorporates some legit proprietary technology in the Concept 500 that equates to a $7000 pair punching way over their price point.
I am buying Q-Acoustics concept 500 towers this week. I am like you, I prefer a warmer more neutral sound that I can listen to for hours, my ears do not like bright, harsh sounding speakers. No one is building speakers at that price point like Q-Acoustics.
I have a pair of Concept 30's I really like
I belong to a Patreon group following A British Audiophile. One of the discussions today centred on the lack of dealers and the quality of those remaining few. It’s clear that if we want high quality dealers, we can’t always be hunting down the best price.
From watching your channel I can tell you go the extra mile to ensure your customers have a great experience and I’m betting they return time and again on their journey. If the vendors you deal with can’t see that short term cash grabs aren’t right for their faithful retail partners, let alone for their premium brand status, they absolutely deserve to be dropped.
There are two business models a vendor can choose. If they want to control the market price they should go the direct route. If they want to sell ex-factory and have all distribution and retail handled by their partners, they should allow those partners the margin to survive. Hybrid models only confuse customers and don’t work in the long run.
That’s just not true. Tell that to Safe and Sound. They’re a Hybrid model and they are a rock solid business. They have a great retail showroom as well as a thriving internet business. Companies need to be flexible to survive in 2023.
@@kingtrance307 apologies, when I said hybrid, I was referring to the manufacturer. I accept retailers offer a variety of sales platforms to suit customer taste, however, customers need to decide how much value they place on the ability to go into a showroom to compare gear before they buy.
If they are happy to constantly be swapping demo gear in and out of their systems then they can chase the last dollar of discount to their hearts content. But if they would rather consult an expert face to face, it’s only fair to support the dealer.
Manufacturers that try to sell direct and via dealers further undermine the value that the retailer brings. Focal weren’t intentionally trying to go direct, however, by their actions they created a situation where service led dealers had no way to compete with other outlets who were buying below cost. That’s the equivalent of competing directly with the manufacturer.
Let me add a common experience. We just had a customer mail order 18,000 dollars of equipment we sell from a dealer 1,000 away. The rub is we did hours of demonstration and even a site inspection. So, in essence, the customer knowingly took service for which he had no intention of paying. Independents can not survive when customers engage in this unethical behavior. It is theft of services pure and simple. Then, the purchase was sealed with that dealer telling him it was sales tax free. That is not true. In many states, including Ohio, residents are required to report such purchases and pay the sales tax to the state in their annual state Income tax filing. It's right there on the form. (This is not an issue for states with no sales tax.) In addition, any mail order firm that annually sells more than 100,000 dollars of goods into the state of Ohio is, by law, required to collect such tax and pay it to the state. @@kingtrance307
A very thoughtful response. Thank you.
This all began with the advent of custom installation where companies saw the opportunity to double their dealership base. The aurguement was that "they serve different customer." It completely ignored that we did such work and, worse yet, these "custom" installation companies, who had no demonstration facilities of their own, would gleefully send "their customers" into our shop and get free demos and sometimes even complete bids. We were, in essence, eating their business expenses in a sort of parasitic way. Of course they could play the price game because they and 0 invested in their business. This sank a lot of independents and started to create a sort of death spiral in actual dealer numbers. It is obvious why manufacturers leaped to mail order adding the convenience of less bookkeeping with fewer accounts. It made is easier to cut the direct link between the end user and the manufacturer. From the mail order perspective, that left smaller merchants either having to deal with it, quit, or go with Amazon. The picture is now complete.
So, it's nearly impossible to actually hear a product anywhere increasing the need to "trust" reviews. I find most reviews about as trustworthy as a politician knowing quite well that audio is highly politicized. (Worse than old ladies talking over the backyard fence, actually.)
Meanwhile, independents are forced to be very mindful of what they can sell to make a living under the constant threat of some Itchy and Scratchy selling it out of their basement.
In our case, it is abundantly clear that our type of dealership is not wanted. Minimum purchase requirements and all sorts of things were implimented. It wasn't about what is best for the customer, it's what's best for the investors. Nuff said.
@@audibleeleganceinc - Well that was certainly a horribly depressing and accurate encapsulation of the current state of things Lou. I wasn’t trying to glorify the current business model with my Safe and Sound example, just saying their model seems to be working for them. Times have indeed changed and for old geezers like us not always for the better. I too grew up in what many of us consider to be the “glory days” of brick and mortar stores. I remember if you went in for a listen (liked what you heard) and got on with the dealer you eventually went home with new gear. Sometimes the dealer even loaned it to you first to listen for a while! Imagine that…
Now we live in a lightning speed automated and impersonalized world ruled by the internet and AI 🤖and internet trolls. Unfortunately this has changed everything. Unscrupulous business people have always existed but like you say when the custom installers got into it many sabotaged it for brick and mortar. We’re never going back and it sucks. I will stop now because I’m probably just starting to sound like another old guy pining for the good old days (I AM.)
Well good thing we can still put on some Doobie Brothers or Steely Dan (turn OFF the News), light up an occasional joint and forget about it all temporarily to avoid going completely mad.
I wish I had a simple fix Lou but none of us can put time in a bottle…. Good luck to all of us! 🍀
Sorry to hear this Lou. I don’t like learning of small business’s getting hurt one way or another.
Oh, it happens now and then. Focal once terminated us to go with another dealer and when that didn't work out, asked to come back to us. We accepted. But times change and it's what small merchants work through all the time. But the most recent was like you going to work and having your boss tell you how privileged you are to work for him so you should gladly accept a pay cut. Doesn't really work, does it?
@@audibleeleganceinc no it doesn’t. Hopefully Totem will be good for you. I have heard their loudspeakers are very good at the price point.
Hi 👋, I totally agree with what you’re saying, If the manufacturer does not look after his customers, likewise, the shop look after his customers, you end up with no sale and a bad reputation, I’ve actually contacted them last year I have a pair of cobalt 806, serial number 10A00/1508 - and through, not my fault. One of the cabinets was knocked off the stand, and the twitter framework has broken as it is made of injected moulded, plastic, I’ve put the thing back together as best as I can, but I’m not happy with it, I contacted Focal JMLab , trying to find out whether I can get a new pair of tweeters, or whether they could tell me what the impedances, so I could actually purchase a pair of tweeters from another source I had no reply, If anybody knows the frequency response of the Tweeter or what I should replace it with, could you please let me know be very very appreciated, I actually live in France, Gone of the days when you could get back up service from most companies, all they seem to do nowadays is want your money, I wish you all that success for the future, and I hope you had a great Thanksgiving, Phil from the moulin France
Focal Grande Utopia Evo….my life speakers i have. And i am in heaven ❤
Feel very happy because of them.
It is a fine product and I am glad to hear you are enjoying them. Nothing in this video says otherwise. That said, I am pointing out that a small business can not remain in business if it has to deal with the way management wishes to sell their product. Like you, we are entitled to make our own business decisions. It's like this, you go into work and your boss decides that you do great work but is only willing to pay you 60% of your wages. How long will you stick around?
Wow, this went deep ☺️
Well, Sir, many folks do not understand either the dynamics or difficulties of independents in our trade. It has been made more difficult by many factors including mail order, the internet, and investment groups. Art, knowledge, and service take a back seat to profit. I learned over the last few weeks of several of my brethren calling it quits. The loss of experience and knownledge is immense but they decided it was not worth it any more after cutting staff, taking away benefits like healthcare and paying for other basics. There was nothing more to cut.
Do you still sell Naim? I believe the same conglomerate owns Naim and Focal, is why I'm asking...
Yes, we continue forward with Naim.
Focal NAIM North America also distributes Thorens and IsoAcoustics. I forget if there are more brands.
👋, I just tried to leave a comment and it got deleted straight away,
Thanks for the heads up. I have accidently pressed the wrong button once or twice without meaning to do so. I'll see what I can do about that.
@@audibleeleganceincHi I have been trying to leave a comment, This will be the third one, I do not know why but it’s linked to another comment,
I’ll try again , I totally agree with what you’re saying, Loyalty trust in a relationship, whether it is with your partner, or the company that you are dealing with, has to work both ways, I always believe if you put 110% into your work, you should get back 110%.
Gone of the days when people will go out their way to try and help , whether it is friends, family or in a working relations,
I have actually contacted Focal, last year, had no response , I have a pair of cobalt 805, I think, and one of the tweeters has come apart, I was trying to get a pair of replacements, but without any success, I tried contacting some people that supply driver units, but they needed to know what the characteristics of the driver was is,
I wish you all that success for the future , Phil from the moulin France
The industry as a whole is certainly at a low point. Their are far too few products being developed, offered, and supported by the passionate individuals that brought them forth. To think of all the brands that have been bought up and sold (often multiple time) or simply faded away during my thirty years in the industry is astonishing. There are many wonderful speaker vendors out there; more than any one dealer could carry, you just can not offer everything. Choosing to offer a selection of products from a vendor that takes care of their dealers is NOT something that is only a benefit to the dealer, but also is a huge benefit to the end customer....whether they realize it or not.
Thank you for taking the time to comment and reaffirm what I see what is going on. If anything, sadly, it is accelerating. I am even seeing manufacturers who said they wouldn't doing it. Between the changes in ownership, leadership, and staff, promises are being emptied.
How about a video on Parasound? Thanks Lou!
Marc, interestingly enough, Parasound also now has a new owner. We do not have a clear picture, yet, of their plans and goals.
I had hoped more dealers in North America wouldve dropped them. They trippled prices on the North American market. I actually made money on a pair that I sold used. I paid $800 new.. retail became little over 2 k new. I really can't believe more dealers didn't drop them.
Oh, I think you could say that for a great many brands and things. My personal property taxes on my truck in Virginia on a nearly 8 year old truck is the same value as my purchase price in 2016. Inflation is quite a devil.
sad to hear this. Ironically I just bought Vestia No 3 about 3 weeks ago.
Well, our business needs have nothing to do with your purchase. If you felt you bought a good product, the purchase stands.
I don't understand the response. It was just a comment.@@audibleeleganceinc
Well, I just wanted you to be sure about your purchase. Our decision is separate from the one you made. I hope you enjoy them for years to come.
" um "
Oh, my Moody Blues moments. Yeah, you are right. I don't write scripts, I don't practice, I don't have a teleprompter. I am afraid you don't get polished political messages where the speaker is polished and the content crap. I've flipped it. But, thank you and I will try to work on it. These are shot live and instantaneously. Usually one take only. Fun and fair comment.
Wait, you want an apology based on global supply chain issues?
It wasn't global supply issues that brought it all to an end but it didn't help. There has been simply a change in visions of which independents are really not a part of the picture. Add to this the complete lack of transparency and information and small dealers got stuck out in the middle of nowhere.
I see a sort of French bashing
Explain your foolish comment. Where Focal is based is of zero importance. The bottom line is Lou got horrible treatment from them and lost money.
Being a Brit, I see nothing wrong with that 😂
None of my observations were about the product at all but strictly the business decision. I am not alone in this observation and extends to the number of people who have left the company as well. If you are that sensitive to find things where they are not, then, perhaps might I suggest you ponder why you feel that way and what has given rise to it.
Personally speaking, I find no cause at all to pick with France given that only with their assistance were we able to become a country. That's old history and today we are on the same team, generally speaking, as we watch the world stage.
What a silly and unfounded statement. Alas, this is the internet after all.