Inside Finland's nuclear dump | BBC News
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- After two decades of construction, work will soon be completed on the world's first geological tomb for spent nuclear fuel - half a kilometre underground.
Finland opened Europe’s most powerful nuclear reactor last April - it's betting on nuclear to boost energy security and help it reach its climate goals.
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Calling it a "dump" gives off a very bad impression of the place to the people only reading headlines
Everything in media is meant or accidentally manipulative language
That's what they're going after
I'ts a clickbait title of course. Otherwse you might not have clicked on it.
THANK YOU! Came here to say that.
That's just stupid if they don't know the difference.
I had a nuclear dump this morning!
Haha
A biodegradable one too...
Save it for generations underground.
Yes, Ash Wednesday usually follows Taco Tuesday.
hahahaha
NEXT, ON HYDRAULIC PRESS CHANNEL
Well, he hasnt tried to press any depleted uranium yet...
@@ballenboy Uranium is soft and highly toxic, so nothing exciting there.
@@ballenboy gee dont give him any more ideas, dude....
@@ballenboy Don't they use Plutonium for those bombs where the core is pressed into the critical mass point, so nuclear fusion reaction bombs and depleted Uranium for nuclear fission reaction bombs?
Pragmatic and level headed, the Finns. We need more of them.
racist
@@pondeify 🤣
EDseel9 1:4o000pp
L0p0poo0o00op0ppp0pp0p02 90p000
Erzerserexdrd?😂😮ll 1:22
@@zapfanzapfanpplp0
P0p0pp0
Come visit Finland any time! 👍
"Dump" is a pretty misleading name
Yup. They’re still trying to sell nuclear as this massive waste producer and not the future of energy.
Not really. It´s a glorified landfill garnished with supreme hubris. "We guarantee nothing untoward will happen in hundreds of millenia."
The storage facility is named "onkalo" wich translates to "cavity". That's pretty fitting name IMO.
How is it misleading because that's exactly what it is???
@@ambassadorofreee3859 A massive tunnel system dug into the bedrock is a dump?
My friend works there. He says locals are happy for many high paying jobs it has created.
@@ElviaGomez-gc2pz i am allowed to talk, isnt that what the comments are for? no one ever asks, people just like to talk. dont be so negative for no reason.
edit: someone said "who asked"
Usually finns don’t talk 😂
This is all public. Anyone is allowed to comment on anything.@@ElviaGomez-gc2pz
@@ElviaGomez-gc2pz You seem like useless or just autistic.
@@ElviaGomez-gc2pz pretty childish comment, no one wants people like you around them. Be happy that you still have some friends who maybe cares about you.
A nice report. I just cannot fathom you still had to get the Greenpeace guy at the end. He did really not contribute anything.
Yep its fear mongering that they push.... One day this planet will be engulfed by our sun so should we all now just stop because the end is coming?!? Of course something can happen that no one even can imagine but to have that as your main reason why not to do something is pretty "ignorant".
Sometimes I wonder if all the "protect nature" organizations are full of "fox girls"(they released the american mink into the wild here so now we have to protect the native species from it. The correct thing to do would have been to end the lives of the minks, not let em out into the wild). Like they have to stop to act on emotions and start to act with logical ways to save the life on this planet because I do agree with them that we humans are like a plague for other life, we really need to tart to share this planet with other life and we do have the technology to do it just not the will because why do it the right way when you gain more wealth from doing it the wrong way.
That storage is probably the safest storage on this planet so even if it has risks the options we have been using are worse.
@jea-ci6ls Here there is storage management fee included in price of nuclear energy. Part of the money gained per Kwh, is directly put on maintaing the Onkalo after nuclear plant itself is no longer operational
They never do. Just speak, speak and speak. Hot air leaving the kettle. Actions? Sit on the road and block traffic, and spoil historical artifacts.
you just want to hear your opinion over and over again with no pushback, its great that the media covers both sides
These Greenpeace people are funny. They oppose everything but don't offer any real alternatives either. What they don't mention is that by doing that the alternative is basically to switch off and freeze.
Even the Greepeace bloke in the end couldn't elaborate dangerous scenario!
Posiva's own estimates in scenarios where the copper shield magically disappears and water flows upward through the bedrock resulted in less radioactivity than a single medical imaging procedure.
Good news story but your "dump" title is a little misleading. This is a well engineering deep geologic repository. Well done Finland!
It´s a landfill with a pricetag that gives engineers erections.
If the storage facility is well-planned and dry, it is as safe as can be made. Salt mines have also been suggested for nuclear waste depositories.
Washington state, US, where I live, has for years been a recipient of our nation's nuclear waste, at Hanford, which has deep bedrock in a dry desert area. The area was a part of the Manhatten Project manufacturing nuclear bombs in WW2 (along with 2 other locations), and later developing nuclear technology for energy production, etc.
The by-products were stored there with technology available, which lead to leaking into accompanying soil. There has been years-long cleanup of that mess, with similar burial of waste into tubes drilled into rock, then covered with concrete.
The biggest problem is that there is limited places for such waste. Safety is a consideration: has to be an earthquake-safe, dry place, maintained for hundreds of years.
Its not just spent rods from nuclear power plants that is the waste, its also all that radiation and nuclear medical waste from healthcare. Think about it, where do you put the chemotherapy treatment waste after its used for a patient? You cannot burn it, you would release radiation into the air, causing pollution and possibly cancer to those people breathing it. You gotta bury it. So facilities like this one in Finland is so very important. I applaud them for this work.
Some countries might not have enough suitable geology for nuclear waste storage, and transporting it somewhere else by ship sounds like a recipe for disaster. Like all sources of power generation there's no one size fits all approach.
@@RealUlrichLeland Japan just dumping radioactive water in an Ocean.
Last time they recomended to citizens to boil water to clean it from radioactive contamination 😂
When fish start poping up with level higher then allowed Japan just rised allowed level.
It's kind of became a habit. Heard much reports?
@@RealUlrichLelandTransportin dry casted nuclear waste isn't a problem. If somehow ship sunked, there isn't any safer place for the solid waste than in the water. There wouldn't be any large scale issues. The oil damage from ship would cause a bigger problem to environment, but not the nuclear waste in solid dry casts.
@@delta_glider4362The radiation is diluted to levels that is totally safe. Close to background radiation levels and meet all the standards. Even way lower than other fiels that have no such regulation. Coal industry spreads way way more radiation everywhere than the nuclear plants. It's all about safety regulations.
Btw, there's radiation everywhere. Just an example, beach sand usually have 2-10x higher radiation levels naturally from thorium (natural causes from erosion). If you ever see darker iron rich sand spots, those have usually higher radiation levels. Still safe for humans, but something people should know.
We benefit from living in a geologically dead area.
Well, not completely dead. There's post glacial rebound happening. It's not the most exciting thing though.
@@justskip4595and we benefit from that too, Re: raising sea levels
It's not a dump, it is a storage. Holy crap these news agencies language 😂
"dump
a site for depositing rubbish."
its not "storing" anything, its waste that will never be accessed again
Its pretty much a dump. The waste goes in and stays there for ever
@@teke2839 no it's not, dump is a place where you just throw stuff. This place is organized and high security facility with seismic sensors and radiation detectors everywhere.
@@Kerttis and you are the expert to say "never again" 😆 humans develope and even waste can become a useful product, in the unknow future. So buckle up and wait.
technically, dumps are storages...
But as they said in the report too, "grave" seems to be the word of choice with the folks involved. (Which is a type of storage too).
It's safe until Godzilla finds it.
Godzilla is approaching the generator, the generator is losing power!
No need to worry, MustaKrakish will fight him off.
Onkalo is built in a very boring place in the world. Not even Godzilla cares.
Trust me, we're good. We have Niilo22 defending us
Godzilla vs Iku-Turso? Bring it 🔥🤘
2:27 Kirkkovene
Gus Fring would be proud of those tunnels.
2:57 Walter is right there.
@@car8070 Walter has seen shit 💀💀💀
@@car8070”Heikinpekka”
Really good documentary about this from 2010 called "Into Eternity". Really fascinating thought experiments, like how do they signal to whatever people far in the future that it's dangerous and to stay away.
I would imagine people far into the future will have developed enough of a brain to realize that on their own without a tutorial.
@@4nlimited3dition_4n3d That’s the optimistic outlook. The pessimistic one is equally as likely considering everything within the past 100 years. The timescale is 100,000 years for nuclear waste as the documentary explains, while current human civilisation is a few 1000 depending on what you mark as the starting point. In the same way people were buried 2000 years ago according to their customs and we dig them up for research, while still burying our own people with the assumption ours will continue forever.
Posiva has evaluated the worst possible consequences of nuclear waste. In the scenario, a nuclear canister would corrode through in a thousand years instead of the calculated hundred thousand years, and at the same time, the surrounding clay buffer would inexplicably disappear. Additionally, groundwater would flow upwards, and a city would be built on the site. A person who lived from cradle to grave on the most contaminated square meter, eating only food grown there and drinking the most contaminated water, would receive only three times the radiation dose compared to people currently living in Pispala, Tampere (a typical Finnish residential area with slightly higher than normal radiation).
Discussion has arisen regarding the corrosion resistance of the 5-centimeter-thick copper wall of the nuclear waste final disposal canisters due to a study conducted at a Swedish university, which suggests that the canister might last intact for only about a thousand years instead of the planned 100,000 years. Based on corrosion tests, even a 1.5 cm thick copper wall would be sufficient to provide protection for over 100,000 years.
A three-kilometer-thick ice layer would cause a pressure of 30 MPa. The combined pressure of the ice, protective clay, and groundwater would be 45 MPa. The containers have been found to withstand three times this pressure.
Thank you for the details! There are so many people who wont do this research on their own and think based on intuition that the onkalo consept is unsafe and doomed to fail even though they have no idea of the research put into the project
Everybody should support nuclear energy. If its handled by professionals it is safe.
Spent fuel contains a mixture of isotopes, some of which have a shorter half life. But you could have a fuel rod as a decorative object in your living room just after a 1000 yrs. No prob unless you eat it. Geologically 1000 years is just a blink of an eye considering changes in old bedrock. 100 000 years is considered safe as radioactivity has decayed to same level as natural uranium ore.
That's not true. The decay is much much faster than that, a few hundreds of years = uranium ore levels.
There is a greate docu about this!
Yes--"Into Eternity". Everyone should watch it.
@@hanneloredean4152 Super docu. Makes you think.
Finnish Walter White, no way! Suomi Perkele
so youve summoned every finn
If we close the fuel cycle (meaning, reuse fuel cause 99% of the energy is still left in the fuel after it's been used), we won't have much waste
Yeah but that is good way to store it b4 you invent that fully closed cycle. That might be the largest battery ever built in future
2:34 kirkkovene? 😂
dump is kinda misleading term for this, i tought its something like they trow all the waste somewhere and forget about it
It's not a "nuclear dump" unless you call your petrol stations as "dumps". All the material stored in this facility is capable to be re-used as fuel for nuclear reactors. The tech has been around since the 60s but it has been rather expensive to re-use it until now. Gen 4 reactors are all going to have such reactors. Not to mention dozens of nations utilising such reactors for decades despite the added cost.
In UK, Germany... the Russian propaganda has been affecting to people's views about nuclear.
Thanks to BBC the English speaking West-Europe can now read also positve news from Finland . Be happy and enjoy what we have.
One mistake and the BBC will be dumping all over your country.💩😄
Thank you for sharing.
No it takes about 300 years for the worst parts of the radio active waste to decay. After about 1000 years the waste is pretty much harmless but still radioactive.
2:30 edustava kuva suomesta. kirkkovene graffiti.
ancient Finnish runes 😌
Finnish person here
BBC Thank you for your most positive, and may I say absolutely superb post on our new energy project yes it is truly a great success
I also have a nice dump after a taco bell
The way she pronounces Eurajoki XD
Hilarious 😂
Jee wilikers
I suspect calling it a "dump" is clickbait given the rest of the report, but it is still frustrating that you would stoop. The world _needs_ clean, sustainable, and affordable energy, which 'Green' politics has been holding us back from for decades.
None of those three is true.
Only 100k views L country
lols
Unfortunately due current laws, we cannot take care of other countries', such as EU's, nuclear waste. But I hope the laws will change in the near future and this facility will bring Europe closer to future, together.
Other countries must take care of their own nuclear waste themselves - each one individually - and NOT dump their nuclear waste into Finland. Finland is NOT Europe's nor any singular foreign country's nuclear waste dump.
@@marjaananivala3150why tho, take money for it
@@marjaananivala3150 They're not "dumping their waste" if we are providing a waste management service and getting compensated for it. We have the expertise and suitable location to safely deal with nuclear waste, why shouldn't we make use of such a valuable exportable service?
I bet they gonna create a Ballrog in there with nuclear radiation. :I
Does it take politicians as well
Well, I don't think anyone's going to check if you drop 1 or 2 inside of the small wells they showed in the video
If they radiate energy, then why not.
Eurojockey? 🤣
FINLAND!!!
- Patrick Star
Stupid pretentious overenthusiastic British scandal style news report. Can't the reporter use body language even just a bit monotonously instead of acting exaggeratedly.
"You might imagine that few would welcome such a facility in their back yard"
I really dislike this kind of portrayal. This implies that there are downsides to this. That the quality of life there is now somehow degraded. That their life or wellbeing is somehow at risk.
Don't fear monger based on bad vibes alone.
One of my favourite pastime: listening to English people pronounce Finnish place names and words 🤔😆
The number of bots on bbc is amazing
anyone worrying about the spent fuel lasting for a long time should worry more about plastics sinc ethey directly affect everyones lives while nuclear spent fuel doesnt
I thought this was surely going to be about the Olkiluoto 3 nuclear power plant. The title fits perfectly
Finnish kids aren't glowing from Ready Brek🙂
TORILLE
kunno rally english
They keep it for future reuse.
If we were to limit the temperature average rise to 2C, we need mass scale alternative energy sources. Nuclear energy could be the only solution left.
Renewables are already crushing nuclear on all fronts so NPP's only survive if govts force energy companies to throw money at nuclear energy.
Next Die Hard movie confirmed?
2:31 Lukko voittoon!
the green party doesn't support nuclear energy* 3:07
Well i hope there will be no earthquakes in finland😂
There is also a room for Putin and his friends.
better than windmills all day.
Only if they could get the newest olkiluoto running that has been built for 14 years. for 6 months in a row
What is with all these fake news?
Meanwhile Germany is/has decommissioned their nuclear power plants and doing the same to even coal plants increasing electricity exports and raising electricity prices outside Germany in the Nordics possibly other neighboring countries.
As a Finn myself, I would hope that they would build a couple more similar disposal sites. That space could then be rented out for foreign nuclear waste.
wow
It's interesting that I learn about this for the first time from British media... Where are interesting stories like these in our media?
This IS sustainable energy, just the cycle is extremely long term that our species is not used to. Even right now we have naturally occurring radioactive uranium deposits underground, one could even argue that the uranium is safer in this facility than it is in its natural environment. The biggest thing to understand is that we are safe to dump spent nuclear fuel this way for hundreds of thousands of years.
The spent nuclear fuel of even long standing nuclear plants can fit in a relatively small room on the premises so it's not like there's tons of this stuff out there relatively speaking considering how much energy it produces. However, locating it in an underground facility like this is orders of magnitude times safer compared to storing it on the surface next to the power plant.
These kind of facilities are best built in very geologically stable locations, not every country has those. That's why Finland needs to not only use it for its own spent nuclear fuel, but import it from other countries as well. It will not only be good for the economy of Finland and the local economy around the nuclear dump, but most importantly for the nuclear safety of the exporting countries as well.
Pretty expensive..
The electric bill for the next 100 000 years is around 1.21 gigabucks..
I'm from finland and my polish friends father is building a nuclear powerplant in the UK
hyyva
Are Dr. Moran’s “bed sheet eater dogs” & Dr. Moran’s “washroom dogs” taking analgesic.
I actually visited this place recently, the nuclear plant and also the unground place. Was pretty interesting
After watching this video, I gotta take a dump now.
2:58 "Jesse we need to make use of nuclear power"
Swedish problem manifested
käydään torilla😂
Finland dealing with the nuclear reality gg
I know how to get free fuel for cars for years :)
suomi mainittu!!!
I live in Eurajoki
Torille🇫🇮
You k bud
2:28 They really just going to show that on the news?
who cares
I don't understand why no developed country is working on molten salt reactors that use thorium. They can't meltdown, their spent fuel decays in in about 10 thousand years, they don't require huge amounts of water to cool the reactors (a case like we had in Fukushima is impossible), and its waste can't be used for weapons. Only China is working on building a MSR which is a huge loss for the west. If they could spend a fraction of the money they spend on fusion research we could have working prototypes now. It's the best option to prevent carbon emissions IMO.
India/china/russia will be the first to get that done. Here in Europe they are too slow and scared of doing anything good. Germany shut everything down.
They are still a new(ish) technology that is unproved at scale. We have many decades of experience with nuclear power plants, and understand the cost/benefits fairly well.
Europe is slow to adapt to new technology
It’s about cost and only dictatorship country like China has the financial means to support this research not concerning the cost. But I agree with you it is a good direction towards energy independence.
Problem is that modern nuclear plants, although not physically, are already meltdown proof... even if you have a lunatic dictator invading your country and throwing missiles at it. Even Fukushima that technically had a melt down, it did so because operators did not followed what they should have done. So mostly human error. Nevertheless there was no explosion like in Chernobyl so the radiation leak was pretty minimal.
Second thing is that European nations are moving away from nuclear and back into the "super clean" coal plants, while China need so much energy that using coal alone will, at best, not be enough or, at worst, kill everyone living nearby. To be fair China is shooting in every direction, hydro, nuclear, coal, gas, bio waste, doesn't matter, they are doing it all. Finally Europe is very stable, right now, on energy consumption so spending money developing a tech that would solve a problem that they do not have is pretty uncompelling. Right now energy expansion in Europe is so small that solar and wind is capable of supplying... unless a dictator decides to stop selling gas, but then it is too late to invest and develop new nuclear tech.
All in all the reason is because Europe doesn't need these new power plants while China, but also India, are desperate in search for every little what they can put their hands on.
I heard that the most terrible scenario with Onkalo would be that after its been filled up and then in the next 1000 years its existence could be forgotten. Then people would build a city above it. Then they could dig a deep well above it to get water from the underground water veins. If they do this and drink the water from the well for a lifetime the radiation would be about the same amount as eating a single banana. Horrible.
Indeed. Wouldn't want to live there, that's for sure!
Highly unlikely, but not impossible.
🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧❤❤❤
Kirkkovenehän se siellä
TORILLE PERKELE!!!
How and why has this not been in the news in FINLAND?!
Kyllä on.
Kaikki salataan.
🗨️☢️
am i the only one thinking how they get the car that deep :D
Magic :DDDDD
The magic of elevators.
Finland has already reached its climate goals with the vast forestation we have. We are carbon neutral. Always have been.
Even though the title has "dump" in it you shouldn't pull the statistics out of your derrière 😅 Finland has not been carbon neutral for several hundred years.
@@bohedberg9116 You don't even know when the industrial revolution happened. Shut the fuck up.
I dont believe at stuff put it in… by 🇫🇮
Everybody had a good time on Saturday.
Britain will be a dump if labour get in.
Scrap the TV licence fee asap🙂
Yeah, our French made most powerful reactor in Europe, whose operation has been shut down more times than I can remember. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Hehehehhehe😂😂😂😂😂😂
Although I agree that my country's current policies and climate goals aren't perfect and not on the same level as they were just a few years back, I am nevertheless pleased to see that my country's climate goals, crisis readiness, modeling education system and low corruption in all goverment agencies have begun to be seen more and more as pragmatic, pioneering and uplifting on a global scale.
spent nuclear fuel is HLW. there are also MLW & LLW which are hazardous & bulkier compared to HLW.
At least they’re in nato….
normal peoples hide waste in 50m dept, finland 1km, and we make money???
SUOMI MAINITTU