I use to work in a wastewater treatment plant for 23 years. Early on we were cleaning out the grit chamber and my shovel uncovered a Doan's fire starter marked Aviation. It was intact including the ferro rod. What struck me as phenomenal was that it was stamp dated 6/84 and here it was under water and in the grit 1994. Rod still sparked and edge shaved as it should. Today 8/2022 I still carry it in my pocket.
All Mg blocks are oxidized on the outside, dig down to the shiny metal. How you present the Mg shavings on the kindling (say in a birch bark nest) makes a big difference. Either of those would be worth their light weight. Carry a separate, large, ferro rod.
@@debbiej.2168 Magnesium does not catch fire when immersed in water and neither does ferrcerium. If magnesium erupted into Flame what immersed in water almost every water heater in the world would have exploded. The heating elements in most water heaters are magnesium and they are immersed in water constantly . If you put a ferrocerium rod into a jar of water and leave it it will eventually disintegrate. Try immersing both In water for a year. There will be no fire.
The lesson I learned here: both bars work, but I'd bring a decent ferro rod to work with either, since I couldn't operate the supplied ones with cold hands ...
I think the Chinese one works every bit as good (Or as bad) as the one made in the USA! When he was working with the American-made one he simply had improved his technique after spending a bunch of time practicing with the Chinese one. His technique sucks bad! You’re not supposed to scrap the back of the knife back and forth on the ferro rod, you’re supposed to make a quick, long stroke by pushing the back of the knife forward! Conclusion: there’s no diifference between the two tools, just one is 5 times more expansive!
A few years back, while hiking in the Cohutta Wilderness area with 2 other guys, wel all fell into the river and it was cold. We found that wet lighters wont light. I used my china made magnesium fire starter to get a fire going.I scraped the shavings onto a piece of cardboard. I sparked the shavings, when they lit I dropped hands full of pine needles and cones on it. Had a nice fire going in 5 minutes.
i was caught out in a cave wet to neck and busted my electric lamp once. only backup was bic lighter and candle stub. in the dark stretched out my wet shirt sleeve and ran the little flint wheel up and down my shirt sleeved arm till the friction warmed the moisture out of the flint and it would strike. it worked and saved me, but wore away a lot of that flint. so a wet lighter will work.
When I took wilderness survival classes in the early 80's, the Doan Magnesium Fire Starter was the standard for emergency fire starting. My instructor mentioned that women were often more successful when using them due to making more contained piles of finer magnesium dust, where men tended to be more aggressive and make scatterings of magnesium chips. I've never tested this, but it seems he may have been right. Doan Blocks were as common in gear as Ferrocerium Rods are today. Both offer the same bonuses of being resistant to moisture, temperature, altitude, and rough treatment while still being able to work. I see a lot of comments saying, "Just use a lighter", to which I say, "Go for it". Use whatever means fits your situation. The Magnesium block was doing just that. It was used as part of survival kits for pilots since the 70's. It is very light, unaffected by pressure changes at altitude, does not evaporate fuel like a Zippo, and I doubt that butane lighters of that era were considered safe for high altitude or mach capable military planes. Many Pilots Kits contained matches as well. While this can show the importance of the Magnesium Block Fire Starter in survival history, and demonstrate the thought process for choosing items based on the situations, it does not change the fact that nearly 50 years later there are much better options.
Striking almost straight down into the pile also helps considerably. The real nice thing about them is that you can actually light a piece of tire if you need a signal fire with smoke or if the wood is wet it will still light since the magnesium burns white hot.
I have only used Chinese-made mag bars for years, and I have made PLENTY of fires with them, and it never takes me that long, since I learned the best way to get it done. I make a lower-diameter, higher pile, more like a penny diameter and set it in contact with an available fuel in the wild, like pine sap, if available, and put them both on a leaf in the center of my "bird's nest." Further, with a ferro rod, you have to shave more carefully than with a mag bar when you need shavings. I can light up a magnesium pile with any kind of spark, low or high-temp. I can light a magnesium pile with a spark from an empty lighter, also; and with practice, a person can learn to get a pile lit in 1-4 strikes every time with the accompanying flint rod. I got past the struggle he had years ago! Mag bars last a very long time, and magnesium shavings are guaranteed to light, even when the bottom of the pile is wet. If you want finer shavings, I recommend the round-shaped magnesium and flint ones you can find on eBay for $5 or so. They used to be even cheaper. I have used 2 of them in the past, also, but I found the flint rod came off of those faster than they came off the mag bars, after lighting several fires. Then, I had to tape them together on the back end. I also used the flint rod to light other fuel, such as alcohol, when I would get to camp late at night or would be in a hurry to get lunch or dinner hot. I would often have to set up camp in the dark in my most active period of outdoor living, 5 years ago. A 900-degree ferro rod spark is overkill. Finally, a Bic or Scripto lighter is the last thing I would use in a survival scenario, because it is the easiest way, which I believe is better to save for the absolute worst and desperate situations and should be used after all other methods are exhausted or if seconds count.
I have had the same mag bar since I was 8. Used lots and lots and lots!!! It is still going strong. The striker is wore a lot, but it has survived 22 years of inexperienced and experienced use.
@@heathenshaunt681 I would expect that especially in the worst situations, like wet tinder, spreading the magnesium out would mean that the same heat energy released by it burning would need to vaporize more water before the fuel can light. Especially given that the magnesium burns out rather quickly, you'd be better off with it concentrated on a smaller area so that SOMETHING else is making a flame before it's all gone. While I haven't tested your idea physically, I'm an Eagle Scout & a mechanical engineer, have lots of general fire starting experience.
As so many other comments mention, not optimal for use when you are tired, wet, and cold. I bought a package of 6 bags of mag shavings from Amazon. I don't know how many fires you can get from all that, but I imagine quite a few. I tried it out just to see how well it works, and I can say it works pretty damn good. If you can't get a fire going with one bag, then you have a real problem, lol. I carry just one bag in my fire kit for emergencies only. I don't use it for normal fire starting, but if you really were in a jam, it would definitely work. The stuff burns like hell fire, and you don't have to mess around scraping. Just dump a pile out and light.
@Power 2 Weight Tell that to Black And Decker, that has "Made In USA" plastered all over it's Chinese crap under the names DeWalt, Stanley, and Craftsman.
Timothy Mckee I would still have to buy a Ferro rod for the other one as well because that ferro rod is also garbage. I’m not about to use s ferro rod the size of my pinky, especially if it’s cold outside and I have gloves on
Just an FYI, prior to the mid 1980's (Not sure of exact date?) most motorcycle engine cases and other small engines (VW beetle for sure) were made from magnesium. They stopped using magnesium for the same reason we want to-it burns like mad crazy! Anyways, find a junk one and break off a large piece. You will need a ferro rod and your in business. Oh yea, do yourself a favor and never let the good idea fairy whisper in your ear. She will tell you that throwing a large piece of magnesium on your moist tinder and kindling will accelerate the starting and drying process. All it will do is................... nothing! If you already have small coals and flame, do NOT put it in!! (Reach up and slap her off your shoulder!) I was at a bonfire one night and a guest (yes, a drunken one) yelled "Hey'yall watch this" and tossed a VW Beetle engine case in the fire. It was brighter than the sun itself or any welding arc I've ever seen. A few minutes later, fingers of liquid metal ran out of the fire and started anything it touched right up. We all learned a new dance step, as It started exploding with molten metal chunks landing from 5 to 20ft away, starting more fires. One chunk landed on the hood of a car, started the paint on fire and warped the hood. It is also next to impossible if you try and put it out. Do not use water if you do.
Both are just magnesium. One is a little softer but I have used both and of course both work. I am all for buying USA but at what point are we being ripped off? And we all know about bloated pricing on products sold to the military.
I have bought nearly a dozen of the harbor freight magnesium blocks, just standing in line at harbor freight. Have started dozens of fires with them. Duct tape and a pile of shavings and the ferro on the other good to go. Not the easiest thing for those who dont know how but after a few dozen fires lite you tend to get the hang of it. Good enough rods for the price!
It's a technique thing. Try this: Use much less pressure when shaving the magnesium, producing finer shavings. Put the shavings in a creased piece of paper or a bottle cap (etc) that will hold the magnesium shavings and capture the sparks. Then SLOWLY scrape the ferro-rod producing a small (BB size or less) pile of ferro shavings on the edge of the magnesium pile. Then give it one quick spark and it's lit. The samll amount of ferro powder will easily light up the magnesium. Often you'll spark by accident while scraping the ferro-rod and you'l have a fire. Be ready with your tinder. In my experience, the cheap magnesium bars are the same as the expensive ones. the scrapers are usually just a piece of hacksaw blade, and work OK, but a somewhat used knife is better, producing more controlled fine shavings as opposed to a fresly sharp one. In a pinch magnesium tent stakes, pack or whatever will get you going if you have a ferro-rod. If you have a ferro-rod, you have fire. Experiment and practice.
When using a rod, I keep the knife still and pull the rod away from whatever I'm trying to light. I may be doing it wrong but I think it works better. Stay safe and take care of yourself and your family.
In survival school in the Philippines (J.E.S.T.) we were taught many ways to get fire. But the use of magnesium fillings work even better if there fine shavings, we were taught to use pine wood and other woods that have the pine sap in the wood, it makes a fire quicker. And you are supposed to pile the shavings in a hill or ball. Thats the method we were taught at jungle environment survival training. Good video sir! I would buy the Harbor Freight stick. And a small magnifying glass at the dollar store.
Trying to get magnesium shavings from a Doan is like carving a rock . The ferro rod is ok , but using a doan in high winds or monsoon rain seriously sucks . A Zippo + spare wick , flints and an eye dropper bottle with enough fuel for at least 3 refills is the way to go . Common book matches and a Bic for backup . Thin strips of rubber inner tube and wax treated jute twine .
@Peeyoos - Correct and some folks don't know the flammable ingredient in fatwood is turpine . Turpentine is made from turpine and I've used very old pallet wood splinters to make fatwood . Never tried mixing wax with turpentine and may have to try this .
Wouldn't cotton balls mixed with vaseline arguably be a better option? I mean, if you're going with manufactured modern solutions anyway and skipping the "making fire from scratch" method, then what's a little homemade firestarter tinder/kindling/fuel mixture to that? Fluffing up the cotton ball's strands makes it trivially easy to catch a spark.
I've found the serrated scraper work best flat across the face opposite the ferro rod rather than on a corner, and it produces piles pretty quickly. After awhile you end up with deep furrows and the serrated edge doesn't work as well, but then the smooth edge takes down the furrows really well and makes piles of them well. The really attractive part of these is the magnesium will burn in wet conditions, and if you make a larger pile can even help with less than dry tinder. The ferros on those wear out really quick though.
@@tummypierced I understand the benefits of a bic and some greasy chips.. but a pile of magnesium will basically light underwater, in high wind, etc... you can't really be arguing these things are the same?
I purchased a HF fire starter and scrape off a small amount of material held the striker directly down onto the pile, two strikes with spark and it fired immediately. I wonder if the log was wet or something like that. It worked well! Thank you for your effort.
I think the Chinese one works every bit as good (Or as bad) as the one made in the USA! When he was working with the American-made one he simply had improved his technique after spending a bunch of time practicing with the Chinese one. His technique sucks bad! You’re not supposed to scrap the back of the knife back and forth on the ferro rod, you’re supposed to make a quick, long stroke by pushing the back of the knife forward! Conclusion: there’s no diifference between the two tools, just one is 5 times more expansive!
When my Dad worked for Boeing he was a machinist and collected shavings from the milling machine he ran and put them in a bag later he bought me 1 of the magnesium fire starter blocks like what you just demonstrated mine carved like a piece of wood like the 1 made in the USA Thank you
Magnesium shavings mixed with sulfur ahead of time in plastic straw tubes 1-1/2 to 2 inches long sealed at both end with hot pliers. Cut open pile it up, strike and add your tinder.
I have used several different Magnesium fire starters over the years. One thing I learned it is a combination of different things that makes one work well or not so much. The finer the shavings are the easier it is to spark to a flame. The tender also has a lot to do with whether you get a fire going or not. Put a small peace of a file in your kit to shave the magnesium which gives a very fine material to light. With the right tender a quarter size pile of shavings is over kill. Practice before it is needed and find what works best. Then when you do need to start a fire with one it will be much easier to get things going.
With the right tinder, you don't need magnesium at all! The idea of a mag block is in one small volume, light weight, all solid, near-indestructible piece (no fuel to evaporate), you can start many fires, even in rather adverse conditions (there's just been a flood/hurricane & EVERYTHING is soaking wet). Plus, as a solid block, enough fire to make that catch means you're already pretty far gone, it basically can't leak or otherwise make a mess & start a fire by accident. My personal favorite fire starter is cotton rounds saturated with petroleum jelly - peel one of those in half & the inside surface gives you plenty of very fine threads coming up that will catch a spark easily, then the body of it keeps burning for a good while. Haven't tested out how many fires you can start with one of these blocks, & compared total mass & volume of enough of mine to accomplish the same. Nothing much comes close to magnesium though in terms of burn temperature, especially that ignites so easily.
When you scraped the shavings together I could see many of them flying away. If you shaved into a cup you wouldn't have to keep scraping them together, just pour them out when you have enough.
Looks like the scraping was a bit awkward, with bits and pieces that weren't so easy to collect back into one pile. Would it be a good idea to use something like a handkerchief or other cloth to collect the scrapings and shavings?
He doesn't know or care, it seems he does not read directions or knows. Scrap 1 way into a pile! Which he did on the USA one, which is by far better metal. Do not buy Chinese crap, they get past regulations because of "trade agreements", that Biden put back in place. There is lead in your Chinese magnesium.
I have used both no real difference. Regardless of which you choose I would suggest using a separate faro rod for ease and more control over where you throw your spark.
That's a lot of work. If you were freezing cold your hands would be highly effected. Agree, I would choose a Bic lighter (water proofed) as a primary and a gob spark fire steel as a backup. Boat matches are great ax well. Good video Brian. Thanks
I’ve watched similar videos and I like the advice one guy had which was to use the magnesium scrapings and his own fero rod instead of the supplied one. He seemed to get a much better spark.
I have had good luck with the Hobo Freight model as a back up to my 6" ferro rod, but at least there is a U.S. made option. Props to Hobo Freight for including a tool to strike and scrape it with. You'd think the $12 Doan's would have one.
If it's made for the military, especially AF pilot's ejection seat kit, every gram matters. They know every kit will also have a knife in it, so the scraper would be a waste. HF is sold separately to whoever buys one; no guarantee they already have a knife.
I carry a full size fero rod in my pack so the little fero rod in the magnesium block is just a backup. I have used the Walmart magnesium blocks and the military issue ones. In my experience the magnesium is the same quality. It's the striker and tiny fero rod that are different. Both of them are more than capable of starting a fire and making thermite.
Thanks for a great compare video. I bought 3 of the HF ones, but have not tried the Doan one yet. With 3 I bought one worked real well, the other two were about like this one you had. I think the China one's lack consistency. The Doan should be consistent in every block.
A suggestion - after you make your pile of scrapings, do the same thing with the ferro-striker since it burns faster and hotter. You'd have to scrape slower so you don't throw sparks before you have enough ferro scrapings. Also I don't think you'll need nearly as much ferro scrapings as the other scrapings.
I use a speedy sharp on my mag bar and ferro rod. The mag pile ignites easily with little effort using that vs knife that is a bit cumbersome to use on a small pieces such as mag bars or short ferro rods. I also hold around a 70 degree angle over the mag pile when striking, that seems to work for me. The harbor freight mag bar I have is several years old, still functions the same as it did when it was new, as in the obnoxiously fast burn rate. Then again I've never scraped the reccomended size pile off it, usually can ignite wood curls with a dime sized pile.
@@johno6861 I was so cold after playing basketball outdoors with a friend as a kid that when I had to finally go in and take a piss, I had to get my Mom to unzip my pants cuz i could not grab the zipper.
Ive used both of these in cold in wet and cold/wet weather ...by cold i mean 40 below while living in maine and cold and wet in oregon with zero issues on either but i prefer the coghlans over the doan and harbor freight so honestly if you cant work it the tool isnt the problem its the user
Zippo lighter and life boat matches is the only way to go ....Bro . Don't forget the eye drops bottle with enough fuel to refill a Zippo at least 3 times .
Waterproof matches, or a Bic lighter are good to have. The magnesium fire starter is for emergencies when that is all you have left. Sometimes a Bic will not work if it gets too cold or wet, waterproof matches don't always work if the wood gets wet and wicks under the wax. The Mag fire starter is not intended to be your only fire source but more of a back up.
You could do another comparison between the two Mg bars using a separate ferro rod and see which Mg catches first. From the videos I have seen using a Ferro rod with a bird's nest works very well. I'd bring a small container of Mg shavings - an old Film container or pill bottle - and put some shavings on a piece of Duct tape inside a bird's nest. A nice video, thank you for the hard work.
Appeared to be that you could get some magnesium chips to "glow" with a few shots of sparks equally, but it took about 5 or six "glowings" for flames to appear in the H.F. kit, but only one for the Doans.
It would have been interesting to weigh them and take an equal weight of pure magnesium and compared the specific gravities of each a magnesium bar against the pure metal.
Great video and information... both will do for me however for $3 I go with the HF (who’s rod wear out quick) ... I would have gathered some of that dry grass behind you and lit that instead of shaving mag trimming
thicker shavings also why it was more work to catch the spark, what he needed to do was have some fine shavings on top of the thicker ones, takes practice...
I broke the supplied Harbor Freight striker in half and used the rough edge to obtain a much better spark from the ferro rod. This can be done in an emergency out in nature. I practiced a lot with the HF Mag starter, and wore the ferro rod very flat and a lot of the magnesium away. Regardless, I will always keep whatever remains of the magnesium block as a good wet condition ignition source to use with my larger, separate keychain ferro rod. Thank you for this helpful video.
The $3 works just fine. You need to work on your ability to throw sparks off a rod better. You just went to town on it with no finesse. Dig in with moderate pressure, scrape it down and out with controlled intent. Not this "herky jerky wam bam thank you mam was it good for you as it was for me" type of motion. You were throwing more sparks backward at you then you were out toward the mag pile.
I think the Chinese one works every bit as good (Or as bad) as the one made in the USA! When he was working with the American-made one he simply had improved his technique after spending a bunch of time practicing with the Chinese one. Yeah, you are right, his technique sucks bad! You’re not supposed to scrap the back of the knife back and forth on the ferro rod, you’re supposed to make a quick, long stroke by pushing the back of the knife forward! Conclusion: there’s no diifference between the two tools, just one is 5 times more expansive!
Silly question. Did you bust your knuckle fighting with the Harbor freight set or would you say it was just a natural accident? My curiosity comes from the concern of infection in a survival environment. I have several of the HF ones and have had good results with them.
I have tested both of them myself. For me, they worked both the same. You really need to have the right technique for these. But like others said, these are so last century. The Ferrocerium rods are definitely the way to go. I carry a rod, and a BIC lighter in my EDC and a Fresnel lens in my wallet.
My wife's got a larger Fresnel lens that she uses at times to read small print in books, etc. Took it out when we were camping once, just to see if it was capable of starting a fire like a normal magnifying glass .... and nearly fell off my perch!! It took all of about 3 seconds to ignite the tinder!!😲
Brian, I used the magnesium bars in the Army on our campouts (reforeger , and maneuvers) and found that if I pressed the point of my KBAR against the wood holding the shavings, and drew up on the ferro rod, the sparks go to the same place all the time. It will take some getting used to, I'm right handed and kept the ferro rod in my left. pull the left hand up, and viola, works rain , snow, fog, cold, hot. Never could find PERFECT conditions! :-)
As a welder I would say the American made is more of a pure magnesium and Chinese has a lot of impurities you can see this very well with how volatile the Chinese made burns and want to throw spatter where as the American just burns smoothly without spatter
This wood fire warms you not just twice but three times. Once gathering sticks and such for fuel and tender. Once starting the fire. Once when the fire is going.
My take on the comparison, the $12 probably had a slightly higher grade of magnesium with finer grain structure. This appeared to make it slightly easier to scrape. The rod on the $3 option seemed to be partially covered by glue and other residue from manufacturing, that required a few seconds of scraping to remove. The USA model caught a spark a couple of seconds faster, with a little bit less effort. In short $10 more for getting a fire a few seconds sooner, but not the difference between freezing vs being warm and dry. Of course the $12 model has a much higher grade of marketing and probably a better profit margin.
I find that it takes fewer attempts to light when you hold the striker static and pull on the ferro rod. It helps keep the sparks more where you want them.
I found myself in a so-called emergency need for a campfire once. I was 12 years old and in the Boy Scouts on a camping trip. We were supposed to make a campfire using the techniques from our manual that we had been talking about in our meetings leading up to the trip. After about 2 hours of everyone including the Scout Master and the other grownups trying I was getting hungry and broke out my Zippo and started a fire. I didn't smoke, of course, I just had a fascination with the Zippo lighters from the WWII movies I used to watch. My Scout Master was upset that we couldn't get a fire going with the traditional methods but was glad I had a lighter that I wasn't supposed to have even though my mom and dad knew about it and purchased the lighter and lighter fluid for me. Well, we all had hotdogs and hamburgers that night and didn't have to worry about a campfire for the rest of the trip. I just wish I had known we could bring our own fishing tackle and rod and reel because I was bored to death sitting around a lake without it.
We had survival training in scouts, and it taught us that while camping always carry on your person at least 3 different ways to make a fire. It was usually interpreted to mean a lighter, waterproofed matches, and any 3rd item of your choice (my 3rd item was a flat flexible fresnel lens...easy to carry, took up negligible space and was virtually unbreakable).
Remember when I graduated from Weblos to Boy scout. Everyone had to start a fire using only one match. Including all the older scouts. Mine was the only one that lit and stayed lit. 😉
Sir when striking a fero you keep your knife solid abouve you tinder and move the fero up the blade so it towards your self that way the fero spark drops from your blade in one beautiful big spark rite into your tinder pile or mag pile.... All so you don't hit your hands or knuckles
Either way, it's quite a lot of effort to produce a very short period of combustion ... Plus, in wet and windy conditions without a stump, it'd be a bit of a nightmare.
I gave up on mag bars.pj cotton balls and wax jute with fero rod works and light way eaiser. I have a small mint tin with small ferro rod ,pj straws and wax jute sticks . That take up the same space as a mag bar . I use it only for wet or humid tinder and it always works.
@Jason Watkins appliances are a whole other thing. In the case of DeWalt and a lot of tools it's the nylon body housings are made over seas, switches, motors, control boards and such and then they just bolt them together in the US. Appliances are one of the few mostly American things left.
I have used both myself. My experience they are almost identical. I think the Do and burns faster, harbor freight burns as hot, a spit second slower. I never understood why. Main thing is they work. I put an old piece mill file on it works fine. There is a little learning curve. You should have the block almost straight up and down so the rod is closer to the shavings. Like someone that posted, get a Ferro rod and mount a good Chuck of fat wood and your ready to go. I bought a lot of those HF blocks about 6 yrs ago and used them a lot. I have only used 4 blocks out of 20. I am sure my son will pass away before they are all gone. Thanks for the video, very good review
For anyone saying to just spend money on other firestarting tools, you're right that just about anything else is better in general. Magnesium bars absolutely suck for casual firestarting but do have an advantage in extreme situations. Flammable metals burn REALLY freaking hot (5,610 °F for magnesium), so you'll want to have a bar in the instance that damp materials are all you have to work with. Just get the cheapest one that actually works and hope that you never have to use it.
Both the Down and the Chinese fire starter looked like it was made in the same factory. They are so similar in shape, design and style. With not much difference in performance the Chinese fire starter is only $2.50. The packaging may say that its made in America but it looks just like the Chinese fire starter. Thanks for putting this up.
The grain on the end of the blocks was different, if you look carefully. My engineering intuition is that the Chinese may use a different alloy, with more other, cheaper metals in it. Or they extrude & cut to length with a bandsaw, don't change the blade out so often, so the bottom just had a rougher texture & that was shadows, hard to be sure on a video. Casting each block or engraving to get the instructions in there, is more labor-intensive for fabrication, doesn't add much value for somebody who knows what they're doing already.
>>>Magnesium is magnesium, doesn't matter where the bar comes from.>>> Lol! WTF! Do you actually believe that those bars are picked off of trees or something? They are smelted from a combination of alloys...and can be as much or as little actual magnesium as the mfg chooses to use, and as much useles junk alloys he chooses to use. No...magnesium is NOT magnesium. Actually, good pure magnesium bars carve rather easily, resulting in nice, curly slivers of metal. However they don't last long, so the military requests a longer lasting, harder, alloy. Neither of these bars do well with anything less than the sawback spine of a 7.5" KA-BAR fighting knife or similar.
Yeah, Mg is Mg, untill it's alloyed with other metals. Chinese mag blocks are not pure Mg and your imbecilic drivel has been a fun read, you adult child. Cheerio!
Funny how they both burn exactly the same then, which is all that you want and need from one of these fire starters. Exposing your ignorance is a rather bold move, but I would have kept that a secret if I were you.
when using the striker that came with the chinese firestarter, you need to remove the chain from the magnesium block so you can strike the magnesium w/ saw tooth edge of the striker...doing so will create a lot of sparks.
Having been in circumstances where I needed a fire, (and by the way, in my experience, at 12k ft a Bic lighter is a joke) I added up the strike times taking out all the pauses. The Chinese took 42 seconds of striking and burned for 9 seconds Dones took 18 seconds of striking but only burned for 7 seconds. I like the idea of the Ferro rod, but the finer shavings from the American made might make it worth it to spend the extra $10. My worst experience was building a fire after a rain in the Rockies at 12,000 feet. I was alone but had the paraffin boy scout fire starters, otherwise, I couldn't have done it. Having the magnesium in addition to the Ferro rod, in my experience can be necessary. Thanks for the vid
I think the Chinese one works every bit as good (Or as bad) as the one made in the USA! When he was working with the American-made one he simply had improved his technique after spending a bunch of time practicing with the Chinese one. His technique sucks bad! You’re not supposed to scrap the back of the knife back and forth on the ferro rod, you’re supposed to make a quick, long stroke by pushing the back of the knife forward! Conclusion: there’s no diifference between the two tools, just one is 5 times more expansive!
A huge amount of effort for a very small possibility of starting a fire. Survivability increases the easier it becomes and that is why after 9 years in the military and 37 years bushcrafting I always carry a BIC in every pocket, every pack and every first aid pouch. I still carry a good quality ferro rod and starter pack just in case.
I do have two magnesium blocks in my fire kits, however, I do not rely on the fire starting rods that come with them. I get a much better spark with a larger rod. I actually ordered some magnesium blocks from a scientific warehouse website, and when they come in, I'll do a comparison with them too. It's a good tool to have in your pack. Ya can never have enough fire starting options in my opinion....
Just nitpicking, but when scraping the HF you ONLY scraped one edge. On the Doans you scraped an edge and A LOT on the side, thus making different types of scrapings! Also, I would have taken the scraper off that ridiculously short chain on the HB. You could use it much more effectively that way. Still, good idea for a comparison. Also, if you have the Doans and a knife without a sharp spine you are SOL unless you use your blade which you should NEVER do. That's a big plus for the HB! ALSO, you could say that all that excess glue on the HB would actually hold it in BETTER!! Whew! And furthermore, you could buy FIVE HBs for the price of ONE Doans. AND, you would have FIVE scrapers and none with the Doans! Whew again! LOL!
Actually, I think it just looked like that in the video. I noticed it while I was editing. I tried my best to scrape them the same. Either way, neither one worked as well as my weather-beaten fatwood
@@SurvivalOnPurpose I agree. I bought a box of fatwood from Lowe's ( which I still have some of). It has a bunch of pieces that are partly black and burnt from where I PRESUME lightning had struck a pine killing it thus making fatwood!!! Now, THAT is the real deal!!
This idea is based of an old carpenters trick for driving trim nails in hard wood. You need a wood handle hammer. Drill a 3/8 to 1/2 hole about 2" deep into the bottom of the handle. For nails you fill the hole with beeswax. You stick a nail in the wax to coat it so it drives in easier. Use the same idea with the handle of your ferro rod. Wax would work ok but packing the hole with vaseline would work better. Use something to cap the end. Really you could drill out a pretty large and deep hole and store a cylindrical tube with matches, charcloth, Vaseline etc..
A couple days ago I went to use my Harbor Freight block and the magnesium would get small sparks on it but wouldn't flame on. When I got it a year ago it seemed to work fine. Now I am going to give it another try.
It doesn't work... You can't hold a knife or what ever..then pull in a reverse movement..not push foreword movement... then you have to hold it upside down...the rod underneath the knife..not even the difficulty in that... then you have to consider the length of the 3" rod...you might get the angle right with the knife..to have the sparks travel downward... The huge difference is the rod ...the American rod product wasn't worn all the way down like the foreign rod...no proof of how many times I can use the American rod...but it will be a lot more than the other...plus it ignited faster....I WOULD SPEND $12 because less effort..and durability..and reliable
I didnt get to test it out on my last trip but i did see a japanesse guy in his video do the reverse pull method just now . He still went forward with his blade but pulled back on the ferral rod also and got fast results .
Watch "【トリマトリ。】【Silky ONO】【 シルキー オノ】【使ってみた】" on RUclips ruclips.net/video/_pAYKOfdqKY/видео.html Thats the video i just watched its around the 7:40 mark
To me this is a comparison of ferro rods and the USA did win. If you wanted to do a better comparison of the magnesium blocks you should use a control ferro rod like the large one you showed to strike both piles of the magnesium and then compare who lights easier. Still a great video.
I would be interested to see how well the bars burn if you lit those with say a blowlamp or something. Neither seemed that great at catching a spark, but the Doans was quicker, but was that because the ferro rod was better? Just a thought. Regards.
When I go hunting I take my mother-in-law with me. She just has to stare at the kindling and it instantaneously ignites. Love you ma'
Hmmm
Has she ever stared at you?
I have a picture of my mother-in-law on the mantle piece above the fireplace. It keeps my children away from the fire.
We'll keep your secret!!
My father in law says when his wife opens her legs,... the furnace kicks on, lol.
I use to work in a wastewater treatment plant for 23 years. Early on we were cleaning out the grit chamber and my shovel uncovered a Doan's fire starter marked Aviation. It was intact including the ferro rod. What struck me as phenomenal was that it was stamp dated 6/84 and here it was under water and in the grit 1994. Rod still sparked and edge shaved as it should. Today 8/2022 I still carry it in my pocket.
It must have had a coating, or oxidation on it, otherwise it would have caught fire in the water.
mag wont react with water like that@@debbiej.2168
Awesome find ,I have on for several decades and still works like charm.
But your find is next level
All Mg blocks are oxidized on the outside, dig down to the shiny metal. How you present the Mg shavings on the kindling (say in a birch bark nest) makes a big difference. Either of those would be worth their light weight. Carry a separate, large, ferro rod.
@@debbiej.2168 Magnesium does not catch fire when immersed in water and neither does ferrcerium. If magnesium erupted into Flame what immersed in water almost every water heater in the world would have exploded. The heating elements in most water heaters are magnesium and they are immersed in water constantly . If you put a ferrocerium rod into a jar of water and leave it it will eventually disintegrate.
Try immersing both In water for a year. There will be no fire.
The lesson I learned here: both bars work, but I'd bring a decent ferro rod to work with either, since I couldn't operate the supplied ones with cold hands ...
fatwood
good thinking Alex
I thought they both worked alright too. In 2 minutes you had fire.
I think the Chinese one works every bit as good (Or as bad) as the one made in the USA! When he was working with the American-made one he simply had improved his technique after spending a bunch of time practicing with the Chinese one.
His technique sucks bad! You’re not supposed to scrap the back of the knife back and forth on the ferro rod, you’re supposed to make a quick, long stroke by pushing the back of the knife
forward!
Conclusion: there’s no diifference between the two tools, just one is 5 times more expansive!
A few years back, while hiking in the Cohutta Wilderness area with 2 other guys, wel all fell into the river and it was cold. We found that wet lighters wont light. I used my china made magnesium fire starter to get a fire going.I scraped the shavings onto a piece of cardboard. I sparked the shavings, when they lit I dropped hands full of pine needles and cones on it. Had a nice fire going in 5 minutes.
That's unfortunate.
All 3 of you falling into the river.
Better luck next time.
They are all the same.
But you can brag more with the pricy $ one.
i was caught out in a cave wet to neck and busted my electric lamp once. only backup was bic lighter and candle stub. in the dark stretched out my wet shirt sleeve and ran the little flint wheel up and down my shirt sleeved arm till the friction warmed the moisture out of the flint and it would strike.
it worked and saved me, but wore away a lot of that flint.
so a wet lighter will work.
That surprise me, I carry a bic lighter all the time. Wet, mud, oiled, and full of dirt the lighter still spark and ligth up.
When I took wilderness survival classes in the early 80's, the Doan Magnesium Fire Starter was the standard for emergency fire starting. My instructor mentioned that women were often more successful when using them due to making more contained piles of finer magnesium dust, where men tended to be more aggressive and make scatterings of magnesium chips. I've never tested this, but it seems he may have been right. Doan Blocks were as common in gear as Ferrocerium Rods are today. Both offer the same bonuses of being resistant to moisture, temperature, altitude, and rough treatment while still being able to work.
I see a lot of comments saying, "Just use a lighter", to which I say, "Go for it". Use whatever means fits your situation. The Magnesium block was doing just that. It was used as part of survival kits for pilots since the 70's. It is very light, unaffected by pressure changes at altitude, does not evaporate fuel like a Zippo, and I doubt that butane lighters of that era were considered safe for high altitude or mach capable military planes. Many Pilots Kits contained matches as well.
While this can show the importance of the Magnesium Block Fire Starter in survival history, and demonstrate the thought process for choosing items based on the situations, it does not change the fact that nearly 50 years later there are much better options.
AMEN
Striking almost straight down into the pile also helps considerably. The real nice thing about them is that you can actually light a piece of tire if you need a signal fire with smoke or if the wood is wet it will still light since the magnesium burns white hot.
I have only used Chinese-made mag bars for years, and I have made PLENTY of fires with them, and it never takes me that long, since I learned the best way to get it done. I make a lower-diameter, higher pile, more like a penny diameter and set it in contact with an available fuel in the wild, like pine sap, if available, and put them both on a leaf in the center of my "bird's nest."
Further, with a ferro rod, you have to shave more carefully than with a mag bar when you need shavings. I can light up a magnesium pile with any kind of spark, low or high-temp. I can light a magnesium pile with a spark from an empty lighter, also; and with practice, a person can learn to get a pile lit in 1-4 strikes every time with the accompanying flint rod. I got past the struggle he had years ago! Mag bars last a very long time, and magnesium shavings are guaranteed to light, even when the bottom of the pile is wet.
If you want finer shavings, I recommend the round-shaped magnesium and flint ones you can find on eBay for $5 or so. They used to be even cheaper. I have used 2 of them in the past, also, but I found the flint rod came off of those faster than they came off the mag bars, after lighting several fires. Then, I had to tape them together on the back end. I also used the flint rod to light other fuel, such as alcohol, when I would get to camp late at night or would be in a hurry to get lunch or dinner hot. I would often have to set up camp in the dark in my most active period of outdoor living, 5 years ago. A 900-degree ferro rod spark is overkill. Finally, a Bic or Scripto lighter is the last thing I would use in a survival scenario, because it is the easiest way, which I believe is better to save for the absolute worst and desperate situations and should be used after all other methods are exhausted or if seconds count.
Exactly! User incompetence!
Being aware of your own biases is SOOOO important. You are admirable sir. It's a trait lost to too many of us these days.
I have had the same mag bar since I was 8. Used lots and lots and lots!!! It is still going strong. The striker is wore a lot, but it has survived 22 years of inexperienced and experienced use.
P. S. You absolutely do noooot need that much magnesium lol
The trick is to pile the shavings into a little cone shape instead of a flat circle.
Or you can disperse the shavings throughout the tinder you intend to light so you can get multiple hot spots to add to and better odds
@@heathenshaunt681 I would expect that especially in the worst situations, like wet tinder, spreading the magnesium out would mean that the same heat energy released by it burning would need to vaporize more water before the fuel can light. Especially given that the magnesium burns out rather quickly, you'd be better off with it concentrated on a smaller area so that SOMETHING else is making a flame before it's all gone.
While I haven't tested your idea physically, I'm an Eagle Scout & a mechanical engineer, have lots of general fire starting experience.
As so many other comments mention, not optimal for use when you are tired, wet, and cold. I bought a package of 6 bags of mag shavings from Amazon. I don't know how many fires you can get from all that, but I imagine quite a few. I tried it out just to see how well it works, and I can say it works pretty damn good. If you can't get a fire going with one bag, then you have a real problem, lol. I carry just one bag in my fire kit for emergencies only. I don't use it for normal fire starting, but if you really were in a jam, it would definitely work. The stuff burns like hell fire, and you don't have to mess around scraping. Just dump a pile out and light.
Although they both are disappointing; The one made in America, due to the price tag, is a total ripoff; Therefore,even more disappointing!😳
Fatwood
Cause most Americans won't admit that made in USA is junk just like made in China except you pay more for it.
a lot of time made in america means made in china or mexico then assembled in america.
violated in international trade laws? how long do we have a war against drug? do we still have illegal drugs?
@Power 2 Weight Tell that to Black And Decker, that has "Made In USA" plastered all over it's Chinese crap under the names DeWalt, Stanley, and Craftsman.
pretty easy decision, get the cheap magnesium bar and buy a separate ferro rod
Maybe
Timothy Mckee I would still have to buy a Ferro rod for the other one as well because that ferro rod is also garbage. I’m not about to use s ferro rod the size of my pinky, especially if it’s cold outside and I have gloves on
Just an FYI, prior to the mid 1980's (Not sure of exact date?) most motorcycle engine cases and other small engines (VW beetle for sure) were made from magnesium. They stopped using magnesium for the same reason we want to-it burns like mad crazy! Anyways, find a junk one and break off a large piece. You will need a ferro rod and your in business.
Oh yea, do yourself a favor and never let the good idea fairy whisper in your ear. She will tell you that throwing a large piece of magnesium on your moist tinder and kindling will accelerate the starting and drying process. All it will do is................... nothing! If you already have small coals and flame, do NOT put it in!! (Reach up and slap her off your shoulder!)
I was at a bonfire one night and a guest (yes, a drunken one) yelled "Hey'yall watch this" and tossed a VW Beetle engine case in the fire. It was brighter than the sun itself or any welding arc I've ever seen. A few minutes later, fingers of liquid metal ran out of the fire and started anything it touched right up. We all learned a new dance step, as It started exploding with molten metal chunks landing from 5 to 20ft away, starting more fires. One chunk landed on the hood of a car, started the paint on fire and warped the hood. It is also next to impossible if you try and put it out. Do not use water if you do.
Both are just magnesium. One is a little softer but I have used both and of course both work. I am all for buying USA but at what point are we being ripped off? And we all know about bloated pricing on products sold to the military.
I have bought nearly a dozen of the harbor freight magnesium blocks, just standing in line at harbor freight. Have started dozens of fires with them. Duct tape and a pile of shavings and the ferro on the other good to go. Not the easiest thing for those who dont know how but after a few dozen fires lite you tend to get the hang of it. Good enough rods for the price!
It's a technique thing. Try this:
Use much less pressure when shaving the magnesium, producing finer shavings. Put the shavings in a creased piece of paper or a bottle cap (etc) that will hold the magnesium shavings and capture the sparks. Then SLOWLY scrape the ferro-rod producing a small (BB size or less) pile of ferro shavings on the edge of the magnesium pile. Then give it one quick spark and it's lit. The samll amount of ferro powder will easily light up the magnesium. Often you'll spark by accident while scraping the ferro-rod and you'l have a fire. Be ready with your tinder.
In my experience, the cheap magnesium bars are the same as the expensive ones. the scrapers are usually just a piece of hacksaw blade, and work OK, but a somewhat used knife is better, producing more controlled fine shavings as opposed to a fresly sharp one. In a pinch magnesium tent stakes, pack or whatever will get you going if you have a ferro-rod. If you have a ferro-rod, you have fire. Experiment and practice.
This dude was scraping back and forth on the ferro wondering why so muchwas gone
Great info
When using a rod, I keep the knife still and pull the rod away from whatever I'm trying to light. I may be doing it wrong but I think it works better. Stay safe and take care of yourself and your family.
@@windrider65 Never tried that, will give it a go, Thanks!
Love Ferro rods I buy the cheap magnesium bars and extract rods... Stash them everywhere
Lighters and matches are so underrated
hahahah. totally agreed
Absolutely agreed
James B. Armstrong to much work, most people go camping to chill and see nature
@@Arcamedi1 It is a survival tool. It is not intended for routine fire lighting while camping.
then you with matches waterproof Keep
Buy the Chinese one and donate 10 bucks to war veterans for that warm feeling.
Feeding the beast is how America screwed itself with the chicoms in the first place (along with a lot of our jobs),
Your always fair and reasonable when testing. Thanks so much for sharing and blessings to you and your family 😇
Thanks. I appreciate it.
In survival school in the Philippines (J.E.S.T.) we were taught many ways to get fire. But the use of magnesium fillings work even better if there fine shavings, we were taught to use pine wood and other woods that have the pine sap in the wood, it makes a fire quicker. And you are supposed to pile the shavings in a hill or ball. Thats the method we were taught at jungle environment survival training. Good video sir! I would buy the Harbor Freight stick. And a small magnifying glass at the dollar store.
The lesson I learned is magnesium bars suck Ferro rods with fatwood handles are a better option
Trying to get magnesium shavings from a Doan is like carving a rock . The ferro rod is ok , but using a doan in high winds or monsoon rain seriously sucks . A Zippo + spare wick , flints and an eye dropper bottle with enough fuel for at least 3 refills is the way to go . Common book matches and a Bic for backup . Thin strips of rubber inner tube and wax treated jute twine .
@Peeyoos - Correct and some folks don't know the flammable ingredient in fatwood is turpine . Turpentine is made from turpine and I've used very old pallet wood splinters to make fatwood . Never tried mixing wax with turpentine and may have to try this .
How ironic. Yesterday I figured I’d put a fat wood handle on my ferro rod. You must be as smart as me. Lol.
Wouldn't cotton balls mixed with vaseline arguably be a better option? I mean, if you're going with manufactured modern solutions anyway and skipping the "making fire from scratch" method, then what's a little homemade firestarter tinder/kindling/fuel mixture to that? Fluffing up the cotton ball's strands makes it trivially easy to catch a spark.
How about a ferro rod with a fatwood handle and a mag bar? Magnesium is just plain fun
I've found the serrated scraper work best flat across the face opposite the ferro rod rather than on a corner, and it produces piles pretty quickly. After awhile you end up with deep furrows and the serrated edge doesn't work as well, but then the smooth edge takes down the furrows really well and makes piles of them well.
The really attractive part of these is the magnesium will burn in wet conditions, and if you make a larger pile can even help with less than dry tinder. The ferros on those wear out really quick though.
All true
For $12 you would have a pile of bic lighters.
... and you might as well just try to light the pile of lighters on fire in wet conditions with damp wood
@@BobSmith-rs7tn
A few chips, doritos, fritos, etc.
And a bic.
Anyday.
@@tummypierced I understand the benefits of a bic and some greasy chips.. but a pile of magnesium will basically light underwater, in high wind, etc... you can't really be arguing these things are the same?
@@BobSmith-rs7tn If you happen to be underwater, lighting a fire is probably not your first priority.
@@happyhippie1957 lol... meant as a reference to extremely wet conditions.. but yeah..
I purchased a HF fire starter and scrape off a small amount of material held the striker directly down onto the pile, two strikes with spark and it fired immediately. I wonder if the log was wet or something like that. It worked well! Thank you for your effort.
The difference is the packaging!
and price
I think the Chinese one works every bit as good (Or as bad) as the one made in the USA! When he was working with the American-made one he simply had improved his technique after spending a bunch of time practicing with the Chinese one.
His technique sucks bad! You’re not supposed to scrap the back of the knife back and forth on the ferro rod, you’re supposed to make a quick, long stroke by pushing the back of the knife
forward!
Conclusion: there’s no diifference between the two tools, just one is 5 times more expansive!
The bragging rights.
When my Dad worked for Boeing he was a machinist and collected shavings from the milling machine he ran and put them in a bag later he bought me 1 of the magnesium fire starter blocks like what you just demonstrated mine carved like a piece of wood like the 1 made in the USA Thank you
Magnesium shavings mixed with sulfur ahead of time in plastic straw tubes 1-1/2 to 2 inches long sealed at both end with hot pliers. Cut open pile it up, strike and add your tinder.
that would work
Thats flash powder
Better idea , heat up the plastic tube or use a tin with watertight seal so you don't ruin your pliers.
@@darkneko5513 it may tricky to heat the tube without igniting the contents
@@chomratu heat guns exist or you could use a glue gun tbh
I have used several different Magnesium fire starters over the years.
One thing I learned it is a combination of different things that makes one work well or not so much.
The finer the shavings are the easier it is to spark to a flame.
The tender also has a lot to do with whether you get a fire going or not.
Put a small peace of a file in your kit to shave the magnesium which gives a very fine material to light.
With the right tender a quarter size pile of shavings is over kill.
Practice before it is needed and find what works best. Then when you do need to start a fire with one it will be much easier to get things going.
Tjanks
With the right tinder, you don't need magnesium at all! The idea of a mag block is in one small volume, light weight, all solid, near-indestructible piece (no fuel to evaporate), you can start many fires, even in rather adverse conditions (there's just been a flood/hurricane & EVERYTHING is soaking wet).
Plus, as a solid block, enough fire to make that catch means you're already pretty far gone, it basically can't leak or otherwise make a mess & start a fire by accident.
My personal favorite fire starter is cotton rounds saturated with petroleum jelly - peel one of those in half & the inside surface gives you plenty of very fine threads coming up that will catch a spark easily, then the body of it keeps burning for a good while.
Haven't tested out how many fires you can start with one of these blocks, & compared total mass & volume of enough of mine to accomplish the same.
Nothing much comes close to magnesium though in terms of burn temperature, especially that ignites so easily.
When you scraped the shavings together I could see many of them flying away. If you shaved into a cup you wouldn't have to keep scraping them together, just pour them out when you have enough.
Bootstrapper Wilson ...if he stayed in the house he could have turned the stove on.
He would use a cup, but some one keeps filling it with beer.
Bootstrapper Wilson: Scrape onto tape or vaseline.
Looks like the scraping was a bit awkward, with bits and pieces that weren't so easy to collect back into one pile. Would it be a good idea to use something like a handkerchief or other cloth to collect the scrapings and shavings?
He doesn't know or care, it seems he does not read directions or knows. Scrap 1 way into a pile!
Which he did on the USA one, which is by far better metal. Do not buy Chinese crap, they get past regulations because of "trade agreements", that Biden put back in place.
There is lead in your Chinese magnesium.
I have used both no real difference. Regardless of which you choose I would suggest using a separate faro rod for ease and more control over where you throw your spark.
That's a lot of work. If you were freezing cold your hands would be highly effected. Agree, I would choose a Bic lighter (water proofed) as a primary and a gob spark fire steel as a backup. Boat matches are great ax well. Good video Brian. Thanks
Good call!
Small drop of dollar store hand sanitizer and a ferro rod works for me every time.
Dollar store cotton balls and Vaseline w/ my 10 year old ferro rod for me.
@Qwerty Maybe so but it does work good
@Qwerty the alocohol in it burns hot enough to evaporate the water relative ly quickly
I’ve watched similar videos and I like the advice one guy had which was to use the magnesium scrapings and his own fero rod instead of the supplied one. He seemed to get a much better spark.
I have had good luck with the Hobo Freight model as a back up to my 6" ferro rod, but at least there is a U.S. made option. Props to Hobo Freight for including a tool to strike and scrape it with. You'd think the $12 Doan's would have one.
If it's made for the military, especially AF pilot's ejection seat kit, every gram matters. They know every kit will also have a knife in it, so the scraper would be a waste.
HF is sold separately to whoever buys one; no guarantee they already have a knife.
I carry a full size fero rod in my pack so the little fero rod in the magnesium block is just a backup. I have used the Walmart magnesium blocks and the military issue ones. In my experience the magnesium is the same quality. It's the striker and tiny fero rod that are different. Both of them are more than capable of starting a fire and making thermite.
Thanks for a great compare video. I bought 3 of the HF ones, but have not tried the Doan one yet. With 3 I bought one worked real well, the other two were about like this one you had. I think the China one's lack consistency. The Doan should be consistent in every block.
A suggestion - after you make your pile of scrapings, do the same thing with the ferro-striker since it burns faster and hotter. You'd have to scrape slower so you don't throw sparks before you have enough ferro scrapings.
Also I don't think you'll need nearly as much ferro scrapings as the other scrapings.
Conclusion: Split the difference in price and buy 25 disposable lighters for under $10.
Same result for both. I will go with the $3 version. Good video!
It seemed like the included ferro rods might have been the main issue. It might be interesting to try this again but use a different ferro rod.
It might indeed.
I use a speedy sharp on my mag bar and ferro rod. The mag pile ignites easily with little effort using that vs knife that is a bit cumbersome to use on a small pieces such as mag bars or short ferro rods. I also hold around a 70 degree angle over the mag pile when striking, that seems to work for me. The harbor freight mag bar I have is several years old, still functions the same as it did when it was new, as in the obnoxiously fast burn rate. Then again I've never scraped the reccomended size pile off it, usually can ignite wood curls with a dime sized pile.
Way more magnesium than I've ever used, in fact I mostly just use the fero rod and good tender.
I only made it about 3 or 4 mins into the video before I gave up. I did learn, no less than 3 times, the cost of your items. Thanks for the video.
Imagine trying to do this when it is cold and wet with gloves on. Waterproof matches or a Bic lighter seem to be better alternatives.
Robert S , I’ve been so cold that I had to hold a match between my thumbs and strike it on my teeth.
@@johno6861 I was so cold after playing basketball outdoors with a friend as a kid that when I had to finally go in and take a piss, I had to get my Mom to unzip my pants cuz i could not grab the zipper.
Ive used both of these in cold in wet and cold/wet weather ...by cold i mean 40 below while living in maine and cold and wet in oregon with zero issues on either but i prefer the coghlans over the doan and harbor freight so honestly if you cant work it the tool isnt the problem its the user
Zippo lighter and life boat matches is the only way to go ....Bro . Don't forget the eye drops bottle with enough fuel to refill a Zippo at least 3 times .
Waterproof matches, or a Bic lighter are good to have. The magnesium fire starter is for emergencies when that is all you have left. Sometimes a Bic will not work if it gets too cold or wet, waterproof matches don't always work if the wood gets wet and wicks under the wax.
The Mag fire starter is not intended to be your only fire source but more of a back up.
You could do another comparison between the two Mg bars using a separate ferro rod and see which Mg catches first. From the videos I have seen using a Ferro rod with a bird's nest works very well. I'd bring a small container of Mg shavings - an old Film container or pill bottle - and put some shavings on a piece of Duct tape inside a bird's nest. A nice video, thank you for the hard work.
I feel the same about "Made in the UK" I am British, Stay safe, Dave
We gotta support our fellow citizens. You stay safe too Dave.
Appeared to be that you could get some magnesium chips to "glow" with a few shots of sparks equally, but it took about 5 or six "glowings" for flames to appear in the H.F. kit, but only one for the Doans.
It would have been interesting to weigh them and take an equal weight of pure magnesium and compared the specific gravities of each a magnesium bar against the pure metal.
Great video and information... both will do for me however for $3 I go with the HF (who’s rod wear out quick) ... I would have gathered some of that dry grass behind you and lit that instead of shaving mag trimming
I seems to me that the Chines on actually had a longer burn time.
thicker shavings also why it was more work to catch the spark, what he needed to do was have some fine shavings on top of the thicker ones, takes practice...
I broke the supplied Harbor Freight striker in half and used the rough edge to obtain a much better spark from the ferro rod. This can be done in an emergency out in nature. I practiced a lot with the HF Mag starter, and wore the ferro rod very flat and a lot of the magnesium away. Regardless, I will always keep whatever remains of the magnesium block as a good wet condition ignition source to use with my larger, separate keychain ferro rod. Thank you for this helpful video.
The $3 works just fine. You need to work on your ability to throw sparks off a rod better. You just went to town on it with no finesse. Dig in with moderate pressure, scrape it down and out with controlled intent. Not this "herky jerky wam bam thank you mam was it good for you as it was for me" type of motion. You were throwing more sparks backward at you then you were out toward the mag pile.
I think the Chinese one works every bit as good (Or as bad) as the one made in the USA! When he was working with the American-made one he simply had improved his technique after spending a bunch of time practicing with the Chinese one.
Yeah, you are right, his technique sucks bad! You’re not supposed to scrap the back of the knife back and forth on the ferro rod, you’re supposed to make a quick, long stroke by pushing the back of the knife forward!
Conclusion: there’s no diifference between the two tools, just one is 5 times more expansive!
I will happily pay more for the US one. I have both, the US is better. You hold the knife still, and scrape the flint against it.
Silly question. Did you bust your knuckle fighting with the Harbor freight set or would you say it was just a natural accident? My curiosity comes from the concern of infection in a survival environment. I have several of the HF ones and have had good results with them.
There's nothing like a lighter. It doesn't seem to matter how much you pay for them. Dollar Tree lighters are just as good as name brand ones.
Will it work when it is wet, NOT!! It gets hotter when wet!!
No. Dollar Tree lighters run out of fuel quickly.
@@BeefT-Sq I've had good experiences with DT lighters. But brand name ones are readily available too.
I've tried a few different ones. I will stick with my ferro rod. Thanks Brian
I have tested both of them myself. For me, they worked both the same. You really need to have the right technique for these. But like others said, these are so last century. The Ferrocerium rods are definitely the way to go. I carry a rod, and a BIC lighter in my EDC and a Fresnel lens in my wallet.
My wife's got a larger Fresnel lens that she uses at times to read small print in books, etc.
Took it out when we were camping once, just to see if it was capable of starting a fire like a normal magnifying glass .... and nearly fell off my perch!! It took all of about 3 seconds to ignite the tinder!!😲
Something to help you out
Hold the knife, and drag the ferro.
Keeps the sparks at the source and helps control where they go
Brian, I used the magnesium bars in the Army on our campouts (reforeger , and maneuvers) and found that if I pressed the point of my KBAR against the wood holding the shavings, and drew up on the ferro rod, the sparks go to the same place all the time. It will take some getting used to, I'm right handed and kept the ferro rod in my left. pull the left hand up, and viola, works rain , snow, fog, cold, hot. Never could find PERFECT conditions! :-)
Thanks
As a welder I would say the American made is more of a pure magnesium and Chinese has a lot of impurities you can see this very well with how volatile the Chinese made burns and want to throw spatter where as the American just burns smoothly without spatter
Provided it was a sunny day, I could have started a fire with a 6" magnifying glass in 45 seconds and in less than 5 seconds with a bic lighter.
That's another good backup plan. I believe in redundancy in something as critical as starting a fire.
In Scouts we used full page fresnel magnifiers. Things worked like a flame thrower. Got the idea from Steven E. Harris of "Sunshine to Dollars".
Use kindling (so you don't get burned) to hold a gum wrapper's foil ends to a AA battery's ends - fire in 5 seconds.
This wood fire warms you not just twice but three times. Once gathering sticks and such for fuel and tender. Once starting the fire. Once when the fire is going.
My take on the comparison, the $12 probably had a slightly higher grade of magnesium with finer grain structure. This appeared to make it slightly easier to scrape. The rod on the $3 option seemed to be partially covered by glue and other residue from manufacturing, that required a few seconds of scraping to remove. The USA model caught a spark a couple of seconds faster, with a little bit less effort. In short $10 more for getting a fire a few seconds sooner, but not the difference between freezing vs being warm and dry. Of course the $12 model has a much higher grade of marketing and probably a better profit margin.
Nope
I find that it takes fewer attempts to light when you hold the striker static and pull on the ferro rod. It helps keep the sparks more where you want them.
I found myself in a so-called emergency need for a campfire once. I was 12 years old and in the Boy Scouts on a camping trip. We were supposed to make a campfire using the techniques from our manual that we had been talking about in our meetings leading up to the trip. After about 2 hours of everyone including the Scout Master and the other grownups trying I was getting hungry and broke out my Zippo and started a fire. I didn't smoke, of course, I just had a fascination with the Zippo lighters from the WWII movies I used to watch. My Scout Master was upset that we couldn't get a fire going with the traditional methods but was glad I had a lighter that I wasn't supposed to have even though my mom and dad knew about it and purchased the lighter and lighter fluid for me. Well, we all had hotdogs and hamburgers that night and didn't have to worry about a campfire for the rest of the trip. I just wish I had known we could bring our own fishing tackle and rod and reel because I was bored to death sitting around a lake without it.
lol, great story!
Great story 🔥
We had survival training in scouts, and it taught us that while camping always carry on your person at least 3 different ways to make a fire. It was usually interpreted to mean a lighter, waterproofed matches, and any 3rd item of your choice (my 3rd item was a flat flexible fresnel lens...easy to carry, took up negligible space and was virtually unbreakable).
Remember when I graduated from Weblos to Boy scout.
Everyone had to start a fire using only one match.
Including all the older scouts.
Mine was the only one that lit and stayed lit. 😉
Sir when striking a fero you keep your knife solid abouve you tinder and move the fero up the blade so it towards your self that way the fero spark drops from your blade in one beautiful big spark rite into your tinder pile or mag pile.... All so you don't hit your hands or knuckles
Either way, it's quite a lot of effort to produce a very short period of combustion ... Plus, in wet and windy conditions without a stump, it'd be a bit of a nightmare.
Yep. The only real benefit is the short combustion is REALLY hot
Its not difficult at all in wet windy weather
Scrape it onto some tape and you have great firestarter. Magnesium is great cause it burns at like 1800 degrees or something.
@@SlyDz420 magnesium burns much much hotter than that at 4,000 degrees
jesse bond I knew it was something ridiculous like that.
I think the Mag on both is fine but you need a nice long and fatter fero rod to get the fire going. Same thing I think when using fat wood.
I gave up on mag bars.pj cotton balls and wax jute with fero rod works and light way eaiser. I have a small mint tin with small ferro rod ,pj straws and wax jute sticks . That take up the same space as a mag bar . I use it only for wet or humid tinder and it always works.
I keep donz in canteen pocket. And ground down 2 of har freight for ready ground great video
actually, they´re both chinese. it says "made in america" which means --> packed in the US of A
Yup, like DeWalt and other tools with thier "assembled in the USA... With global materials"
Jason Watkins lots of local jobs in industries that support your business by supplying contract made components too ill bet.
@Jason Watkins appliances are a whole other thing. In the case of DeWalt and a lot of tools it's the nylon body housings are made over seas, switches, motors, control boards and such and then they just bolt them together in the US. Appliances are one of the few mostly American things left.
I have used both myself. My experience they are almost identical. I think the Do and burns faster, harbor freight burns as hot, a spit second slower. I never understood why. Main thing is they work. I put an old piece mill file on it works fine. There is a little learning curve. You should have the block almost straight up and down so the rod is closer to the shavings.
Like someone that posted, get a Ferro rod and mount a good Chuck of fat wood and your ready to go.
I bought a lot of those HF blocks about 6 yrs ago and used them a lot.
I have only used 4 blocks out of 20.
I am sure my son will pass away before they are all gone.
Thanks for the video, very good review
Thanks
Harbor freight was running a special on those. I got 20 of them, they were a $1.50 each.. They work REALLY WELL..👍😎👍
For anyone saying to just spend money on other firestarting tools, you're right that just about anything else is better in general. Magnesium bars absolutely suck for casual firestarting but do have an advantage in extreme situations. Flammable metals burn REALLY freaking hot (5,610 °F for magnesium), so you'll want to have a bar in the instance that damp materials are all you have to work with. Just get the cheapest one that actually works and hope that you never have to use it.
true
As often found when comparing HF stuff to Name Brand stuff, the name brand is superior. But is it 5X the price superior? That is the real question.
The Doan is worth one hundred time the price of the Harpo Freight one!!!
Both the Down and the Chinese fire starter looked like it was made in the same factory. They are so similar in shape, design and style. With not much difference in performance the Chinese fire starter is only $2.50. The packaging may say that its made in America but it looks just like the Chinese fire starter. Thanks for putting this up.
The grain on the end of the blocks was different, if you look carefully. My engineering intuition is that the Chinese may use a different alloy, with more other, cheaper metals in it. Or they extrude & cut to length with a bandsaw, don't change the blade out so often, so the bottom just had a rougher texture & that was shadows, hard to be sure on a video.
Casting each block or engraving to get the instructions in there, is more labor-intensive for fabrication, doesn't add much value for somebody who knows what they're doing already.
Starts at 3:00
Slow dowwwwnnnn. ;-)
I believe it's not ferro,,, it's flint rod,, there is a differents. I do enjoy your videos. Thanks for your input and insight.
Magnesium is magnesium, doesn't matter where the bar comes from.
>>>Magnesium is magnesium, doesn't matter where the bar comes from.>>>
Lol! WTF!
Do you actually believe that those bars are picked off of trees or something?
They are smelted from a combination of alloys...and can be as much or as little actual magnesium as the mfg chooses to use, and as much useles junk alloys he chooses to use. No...magnesium is NOT magnesium.
Actually, good pure magnesium bars carve rather easily, resulting in nice, curly slivers of metal.
However they don't last long, so the military requests a longer lasting, harder, alloy.
Neither of these bars do well with anything less than the sawback spine of a 7.5" KA-BAR fighting knife or similar.
@@frankdiscussion9988 So you failed chemistry. Good to know.
Wow!
Not only ignorant, but a know it all too.
Glad I could educate you, kid.
Yeah, Mg is Mg, untill it's alloyed with other metals. Chinese mag blocks are not pure Mg and your imbecilic drivel has been a fun read, you adult child. Cheerio!
Funny how they both burn exactly the same then, which is all that you want and need from one of these fire starters. Exposing your ignorance is a rather bold move, but I would have kept that a secret if I were you.
when using the striker that came with the chinese firestarter, you need to remove the chain from the magnesium block so you can strike the magnesium w/ saw tooth edge of the striker...doing so will create a lot of sparks.
Having been in circumstances where I needed a fire, (and by the way, in my experience, at 12k ft a Bic lighter is a joke) I added up the strike times taking out all the pauses.
The Chinese took 42 seconds of striking and burned for 9 seconds
Dones took 18 seconds of striking but only burned for 7 seconds.
I like the idea of the Ferro rod, but the finer shavings from the American made might make it worth it to spend the extra $10.
My worst experience was building a fire after a rain in the Rockies at 12,000 feet. I was alone but had the paraffin boy scout fire starters, otherwise, I couldn't have done it. Having the magnesium in addition to the Ferro rod, in my experience can be necessary.
Thanks for the vid
I think the Chinese one works every bit as good (Or as bad) as the one made in the USA! When he was working with the American-made one he simply had improved his technique after spending a bunch of time practicing with the Chinese one.
His technique sucks bad! You’re not supposed to scrap the back of the knife back and forth on the ferro rod, you’re supposed to make a quick, long stroke by pushing the back of the knife
forward!
Conclusion: there’s no diifference between the two tools, just one is 5 times more expansive!
If you are going to drag around a bar of magnesium, might as well have some powdered magnesium in a small plastic vial. Or several of them.
A huge amount of effort for a very small possibility of starting a fire. Survivability increases the easier it becomes and that is why after 9 years in the military and 37 years bushcrafting I always carry a BIC in every pocket, every pack and every first aid pouch. I still carry a good quality ferro rod and starter pack just in case.
So do I.
You can 4 of the Chinese for the price of one USA....The very small difference, if there really is one, isn't worth it...thanks for video
It's not like the weight would be a problem either
One got union fees.
I do have two magnesium blocks in my fire kits, however, I do not rely on the fire starting rods that come with them. I get a much better spark with a larger rod. I actually ordered some magnesium blocks from a scientific warehouse website, and when they come in, I'll do a comparison with them too. It's a good tool to have in your pack. Ya can never have enough fire starting options in my opinion....
yep
I think this is a matter of purity of the magnesium, how much of other junk metal & slag/dross is in these blocks when poured?
I agree with that. Is it my eye's or is the color of the two bars slightly different, as in the composition of the usa made one is more pure?
Exactly
I got the cheap bars, it feels more like aluminium not magnesium
@@reedwischhusen5376 but powdered/ sintered aluminum will burn
The US issue ones used to go for 5 bucks at the local surplus store and they last a life time!
Just nitpicking, but when scraping the HF you ONLY scraped one edge. On the Doans you scraped an edge and A LOT on the side, thus making different types of scrapings! Also, I would have taken the scraper off that ridiculously short chain on the HB. You could use it much more effectively that way. Still, good idea for a comparison. Also, if you have the Doans and a knife without a sharp spine you are SOL unless you use your blade which you should NEVER do. That's a big plus for the HB! ALSO, you could say that all that excess glue on the HB would actually hold it in BETTER!! Whew! And furthermore, you could buy FIVE HBs for the price of ONE Doans. AND, you would have FIVE scrapers and none with the Doans! Whew again! LOL!
Actually, I think it just looked like that in the video. I noticed it while I was editing. I tried my best to scrape them the same. Either way, neither one worked as well as my weather-beaten fatwood
@@SurvivalOnPurpose I agree. I bought a box of fatwood from Lowe's ( which I still have some of). It has a bunch of pieces that are partly black and burnt from where I PRESUME lightning had struck a pine killing it thus making fatwood!!! Now, THAT is the real deal!!
Will a magnifying solar lens also ignite a pile of these scrapings?
Harbor freight sells them for a dollar where I live
Too much
Same, just picked one up for less than $2 todat
This idea is based of an old carpenters trick for driving trim nails in hard wood. You need a wood handle hammer. Drill a 3/8 to 1/2 hole about 2" deep into the bottom of the handle. For nails you fill the hole with beeswax. You stick a nail in the wax to coat it so it drives in easier.
Use the same idea with the handle of your ferro rod. Wax would work ok but packing the hole with vaseline would work better. Use something to cap the end. Really you could drill out a pretty large and deep hole and store a cylindrical tube with matches, charcloth, Vaseline etc..
You turned the Dones over while striking but didn't do that with the Chinese.
A couple days ago I went to use my Harbor Freight block and the magnesium would get small sparks on it but wouldn't flame on. When I got it a year ago it seemed to work fine. Now I am going to give it another try.
There's always a smoker nearby with a lighter.
it would be interesting to see how they do using the the larger rod that you had to see if there is a difference in the magnesium alone
hmmm
when striking sparks, move the rod, not the knife.
that way the sparks remain in the same area.
Thanks for the tip , imgonna try that in a few days in a camping trip , hope it makes a diffrence cause when i try it looks like his trys
It doesn't work... You can't hold a knife or what ever..then pull in a reverse movement..not push foreword movement... then you have to hold it upside down...the rod underneath the knife..not even the difficulty in that... then you have to consider the length of the 3" rod...you might get the angle right with the knife..to have the sparks travel downward... The huge difference is the rod ...the American rod product wasn't worn all the way down like the foreign rod...no proof of how many times I can use the American rod...but it will be a lot more than the other...plus it ignited faster....I WOULD SPEND $12 because less effort..and durability..and reliable
I didnt get to test it out on my last trip but i did see a japanesse guy in his video do the reverse pull method just now .
He still went forward with his blade but pulled back on the ferral rod also and got fast results .
Watch "【トリマトリ。】【Silky ONO】【 シルキー オノ】【使ってみた】" on RUclips
ruclips.net/video/_pAYKOfdqKY/видео.html
Thats the video i just watched its around the 7:40 mark
To me this is a comparison of ferro rods and the USA did win. If you wanted to do a better comparison of the magnesium blocks you should use a control ferro rod like the large one you showed to strike both piles of the magnesium and then compare who lights easier. Still a great video.
Keep practicing until you actually figure out how to use them correctly and then do a comparison, it's really much easier than you make it look!
Shane Needles True. It doesn't take a whole lot of practice either.
@@jacksparrow6218 Straight down motion stop the back and forth.
I used both and the Coleman model which is halfway between the 2 price wise. The cheapest one's ferro rod fell out after a year or so.
Probably made in the same factory on both 🤷🏼♂️
I would be interested to see how well the bars burn if you lit those with say a blowlamp or something. Neither seemed that great at catching a spark, but the Doans was quicker, but was that because the ferro rod was better?
Just a thought. Regards.
Not enough surface area to really work.