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Great vid Charlie and cheers for the shout-out! 👍😎 I'd concur with all of that. It'll be interesting to see how mine turns out since it's against a north facing wall that only gets sun 50% of the year. A mate of mine has decking that went down over 20 years ago - it was installed pretty badly and has had almost zero maintenance. It's still more-or-less fine. Yours still looks new - amazing! 👍💪
Cheers Andy. Yes your deck will be bullet proof and for a couple of hours' very satisfying work once in a while you can keep it looking great. Maybe being north facing will be a godsend in that the sun won't break down the oil so much .. 👊
Thanks Charlie. I have a huge deck which I’ve been maintaining each year for the last 6 years but you’ve now provided better tools to help with the future cleaning and oiling
Such a brilliant channel. Watched so many of your videos, both when I’m in a sticky situation and attempting it myself and also when I’m just curious about the logistics of certain jobs
Another great video Charlie, very interesting to see how the substructure has performed over that time. Hopefully the one I installed (using your original video as a guide) will still be ok Also. I noticed that although you mentioned that you had installed the decking without any gap, you didn't say what gap you did use on the re-install. You might remember that I used the Kreg jig and screws to give a nice consistent gap and also as the screws are inserted at a 45 degree angle, they are hidden from view. I fitted Yellow Balou boards and although they did need some extra treatment in the early stages, they have remained in really great condition since with excellent water beading Keep up the good work and thanks again for always showing your mistakes as well as your successes
Interesting analysis of materials and techniques - I'm with you on a smooth surface! (I think the two grooves on the underside of the boards you have are to reduce the risk of them cupping)
Hi Charlie, in my old house built a deck in 2003 with basic tanalised subfloor and the typical decking boards. For the first 15 years or so minimal maintenance and was fine. As the boards started to look scruffy used deck repair paint - bad decision as looked great at first but chipped and scuffed and needed at least yearly re-paint. Still, lasted 18 years before we moved out (and still down with the new owners). Built a deck in the new house just over 2 years ago with tanalised subfloor, bitumen paint on the top edges and composite deck (light grey with dark grey edging) with the t-track fixing to hold it down. Looked great at first, gaps perfect but with constant expansion and contraction the boards creep and the gaps now look awful. Need to spend a day getting the gaps good again and putting a single screw in each board to anchor one point in place. The composite boards also scratch fairly easily. If I were to do it again would use a natural product.
Thanks for this. We had a timber deck installed in June and while I don't know the ins-and-outs of what wood was used as we didn't install it ourselves, this is still a helpful video. I've also watched your decking oil vid from 2021 which I would recommend to anybody wanting to maintain a deck. Good nod to Gosforth Handyman too. I've watched a few of his videos and found them interesting so I will check out his decking video as well. Re marina decks. My guess (and it is only a guess...) is that timber is preferred because I believe a downside of composite is that it can get slippy - or at least slippier than a timber deck - when wet so if that's true then it would explain why most decks in those areas are made of wood.
Very interesting review, I've built a number of decks over the years and always seemed to move house a year or two after building it so never got to see how mine fared. I was pleased to see that over time I've been doing similar things to what you've done with the exception of using decking paint rather than oil. That came down to an style decision by the boss. But although the paint will come off over time, or a strong pressure wash, at least it means I can change the colour every few years if I want. Oh, and never use so called anti-slip paint. It maybe is anti-slip, but the finish is awful and just attracts dirt and mildew. Keep up the good work, I've learned loads from people like you, Gosforth Handyman and Stuart from Proper DIY - would love to see you all work on something together :)
Great analysis video, but just one thing-stainless screws don't corrode, but they snap very very easily. I stopped using them because when you try and remove them from weathered wood, you tend to lose 2/3rds of them and then you have to deal with the bit of screw that's left in the wood.🥴
As always some well thought out and good general advice Charlie. For years I've installed ridge side down and this I've found makes a massive difference for longevity of both the decking and subframe (tho I also creocote the subframe). The double sided decking is made to cater to customers who like the aesthetics of ridged decking (according to the suppliers I've spoken to). The misconception of ridge side up being more grippy is based on feelings and not fact, I've had this same argument with far more competent joiners than myself but the argument begins and ends with 'find a single Yacht manufacturer that fits wood decking with ridges' teak isn't magically grippy it's wood it just weathers better, the same joiners also argue decking is lethal in the wet yet smooth topped decking I've installed in various properties is only slippery when covered in ice.
I've always wanted decking and even though we're about to move into our forever bungalow soon, there's nowhere I can think of where I can put any decking. I think. Bit of an odd shaped garden so once the fence has been put up, will have to look at what my options are then. Many thanks for this video, confirmed a couple suspicions (I used to work for a timber yard that sold the composite stuff and I've always had my reservations on it) and I've learnt quite a bit.
Great video as always! As it happens, we are doing a new deck in a few months time. I started out thinking to do composite, and for similar reasons as you (doubt about durability & maintenance, not to mention price), I am now leaning towards Kwila or similar, and just letting it weather. Bear in mind I'm in New Zealand, so options are a bit different. Definitely agree about the grooves!
Thanks so much. I'm always humbled when my videos are watched so far afield.. Massive thanks for your interest and support, and for the comment. Good luck with your new deck and don't forget to design a bullet (weather) proof sub frame. 👊
Thanks for the update Charlie, If I remember right, I think you mentioned you had to buy the Osmo pole , £24-26 as Osmo had mad it a proprietary connection. which was annoying . I actually needed up buying a cheep B&Q own brand extension pole for less than half the price. It does not have the locking tabs but the screw end tip is small enough that it will slip into the brush head with no problem and you just push and twist it in. It locks into place very tight and I had no issues of it coming of when using it vigorously.
Hey Charlie, just cleaned my decking using the Ronseal cleaner. It's looking a lot better but the decking still has a green colour to it in several places. It's been in place about 10 years and I think I've only jet washed it once in that time and never stained it! I guess i could buy another bottle of cleaner and give it a second go but thinking i will just stain it now and see how it looks...
Nice video good for people to see what to expect. As long as the base is good that's where your save as when you come to change the decking your won't need to do the base as well. In regards to the DPM you tried to use your right to use it if its a base for a building with an overhang on the roof. In your case you didn't put the roof on and when you did not much overhang so rain gets in. The DPM will last forever but the paint won't. In short if its a deck base paint the underside and tops and leave the sides of the joists but if its a base for a shed, cabin or something with a roof and roof over hang use DPM.
Thank you for the video. Strongly recommend 32mm deck timber. Strongly recommend flat surface on top. Also Strongly recommended using concealed fixing screw, so clean on the surface.
I’ve recently redone my decking that had survived 12 years. The subframe had rotted in many places but not in areas I’d applied 2 coats of wicks liquid DPC, ie at joint positions and support brackets. This time, like you I applied a bitumastic coating (the same Wicks brand) but not on the underside to allow the wood to breath. Since the top of the frame had the greatest proportion of rot I applied a 100mm strip of self adhesive flashing which folds over 25mm each side. I’m hoping this will last much longer.
I can say with experience having the grooves on the bottom & flat side on the top is the best way to do it. First deck I built grooves faced up & even with cleaning turned into an ice rink when wet in the summer & in the winter. Second deck flat side up not slippery in the slightest.
Great video Charlie. Longevity is all in the base. As long as you keep joists off the ground and have plenty of airflow it will last decades. You have put me off replacing some of my decking with composite - the fading and warping was my main concern for something so pricey. The main deck i was thinking of is at a chalet we rent out on the Pembrokeshire coast where the weather is extreme. But its so large it takes a few days every year to do the maintenance on - and you can never get enough dry days in a row in spring when I try and get it ready for guests. Every year I try new hacks and tools but the grooves are what make it so slow. I just wish more places did proper flat decks - I wonder if the grooves help mask imperfections which is why its sold?
After 1 year my cheapest composite still looks pristine, very nice to walk bare foot for me and toddler, just feels like being on interior floor. Will see what happens after more years though, fingers crossed...
I used Iroko for an internal deck underneath the shower in a wet room. Five years later when I moved out, I t was good as new even with the dramatic temperature fluctuations (glass ceiling) and humidity - untreated.
Great video Charlie. That hardwood you took out of a skip looked like Ekki from the endgrain, that stuff is used to make canal lock gates so no worries for a bit of flooring 😂👍
We’ve got a large raised deck that needs replacing at the back of our house - we installed it when we renovated the house 16 years ago. The subframe is in almost perfect condition built with treated 6x2 - we gave it no special treatment (We renovated the house and intended to sell immediately) It’s the posts that are failing. I think in future, I’ll do what the Americans do and build off concrete piers. Or maybe just use a steel frame.
grooved decks are definitely not less slippy i had a deck outside my patio at the my old house same profile as that and in winter in was like an ice rink, so i agree i would 100% get a flat surface deck just becuase it so much easier to maintain
We got 22 years from our wood deck. I'm now rebuilding new. Neotimber plastic joists and posts for elevated sub frame. If putting in the effort and time, may as well spend and get something that won't rot. I'm guessing 3 times the price of wood. Save money on the top boards if need be, but don't scrimp on the subframe - I dont want to do it again! Simon Bowler has good video on this.
We used Kwila hardwood for our deck and after 25 years it's still as good as new. Hardwood is the way to go. Edited to say that we only waterblast and stain every 4 years.
It's brilliant isn't it. I wouldn't use anything that sits on the surface. For me it's crucial it sinks in which is why I also wouldn't touch water based decking oils - should have mentioned that 🤦
There is only 1 tip get good quality composite decking, job done, replaced our aging wooden one for the third time many years ago, it still looks as good as they say we laid it.!
@@liftfan2 lots of sellers even the Wickes stuff is good when on offer, just watch for the stuff with a thin top & large hollow cores. Ours is solid but most has cores now, my son-in law got the Wickes when it was reduced & that looks great, fiddly little clamps to fit but comes with a thin bit so it doesn’t mark the inner edges. (Fittings are between the boards so hard to see)
Last time I used a "tinted oil" (no nonsense cedar decking oil) the colouring despite vigorous shaking and mixing was never even in application and the colour could be seen seperating. This got worse after storing the tin then using it again...clear for me from now on.
My best tip is to buy the NKT hidden fastener system, especially if you're going smooth. It makes installation a piece of p***, and doesn't give water a well to sit in.
Interesting 👌 I guess the only problem with the NKT is trying to get the screws out if you need to take the deck up. I don't notice the screws once they're in.
Yes, if you get too close. I always advise people NOT to pressure wash soft woods for this very reason. Once the grains open up the water can pool longer leading to the wood rotting quicker.
@@CharlieDIYte thank you I have loads of 4x2 do you think that would work with more supports to the floor I have spare railway sleepers to tie them into would this work do you think
@@decisionsdecisions8906max span of a 4x2 is 6 feet. The old rule of thumb for calculating depth of timber vs timber spans (imperial units not metric) is to divide the proposed span by 2, then add 1. So 6 feet divided by 2 =3+1= 4 inches joist depth. If your span is greater then add additional support at max 6ft centres.
After my experience with the Fiddes high build oil on the outdoor furniture I'm not ever touching varnish again. I need stuff that sinks in. Stuff on the surface will get destroyed by the sun.
Hi Charlie. Been a fan and viewer for years and love your vids. May I respectfully say that in this case, by way of design your deck is a lot of effort and not a reasonable amount of reward? (I'm not referring to the reward of the time you spend there as such... that's a different matter.) We laid a concrete slab (5x4m) and simply mortared a load of bricks onto the slab. Installed 2 drain outlets which lead to a soakaway a couple of metres up the garden. C24 treated timber, straight on the bricks. No faffing painting timbers or worrying about condition. We are 4 years down the line as well, and the timbers are basically as new. We used hardwood decking - Balau, which was 16 quid per plank from Builder Depot. A bit more expensive but - after multiple visits where I went and manually selected planks that were actually straight (!), it looks stunning to this day. I used timbadeck screws - small star heads that sink flush. And you know what - I screwed the boards down at each end (left and right side of the plank) plus only 1 or 2 points in the middle. Out of laziness I didn't bother doing any more. The things are still going strong, no bowing or twisting, tonnes of ventilation as I left good 3mm gaps. Admittedly ours is built right up against two party walls either side (brick, about 3m high) so that prevents rain coming in from the sides and rear. And at the front we have white curtains for hot tub privacy. A bit fun when it's windy, but still completely usable. Roof is a single pitch with a good fall, mini plastic corrugated stuff with split bamboo loose laid on top and cable tied down at the sides. Sexy philips hue lighting around the bricks, and it's a lovely little indoor space outdoors. Roof is held up by 4x4 posts (sitting on little concrete risers we poured in place, 4x4 to match the posts above and with a stainless steel rod sticking out, which then we resin-fixed into a hole we made in posts, then 2x4 joists above with roofing battens going across every 150mm. That's what the mini plastic corrugated roof went on. The plastic crap is hidden as you just see bamboo. But perfectly waterproof. (More so than my home... err...?) Whole lot painted in ronseal walnut colour. We installed a fridge, hifi, wifi, concrete counter top, the whole lot. By the way - hot tub went straight onto the concrete and we decked around it. Much easier that way. Also a nice large corner bench which accommodates 3 people or 2 people lying down. Made also from the balau hardwood decking. If I could do it all again I would definitely consider using composite. Our hardwood decking looks good still - really good. I didn't treat it with anything from day 1, and still don't really feel the need to. It's protected enough. No mould or algae due to good ventilation. But it has silvered slightly as you'd expect of any wood. I prefer the nice rich tones hence thinking composite might have been better. But still - we really enjoy the space and watching this vid, I feel very grateful we put the initial work in to make it lower maintenance in the long term as I know I wouldn't be bothered to apply oils and whatnot a few years down the line... Finally - not wanting to sound like a complete snob, but I really do think softwood decking looks a bit basic. The hardwood planks are thinner and look really refined in comparison. Just my personal opinion :)
What I've learnt with decking is to never put it down and get rid of it as soon as you can. It may be all fine if you are OK with all the maintenance and initial cost but a few years in and if the decking is in the sun it splits and you get nasty splintering wood when it is dry. When winter comes and it is wet it goes green in no time as wet just sits in the grooves. Then it is ridiculously slippery. I bought a house with a big patio of decking that is about 10 years old and it is all coming out soon. Awful stuff! Really just dont do it.
Wood splits because it dries out. Keep it oiled and it won't split. It gets slippery because it's not properly maintained. If it's going green there's insufficient light and air flow to dry it out. The green stuff only grows because it stays wet for prolonged periods of time.
Awesome stuff isn't it! Goes on black and doesn't take long to dry and fade slightly showing the wood grain through quite clearly. I've built two very large planters out the front of my place (1m x 2m x 17") and a recycle bin storage shed. First coat was Creosote (not Creocote!) and after then every year middle of summer I coat with used engine oil from a diesel vehicle. My local garage is more than happy to supply this for free.
I'm with you on that. I think paving looks nice. BUT - nothing like getting out of a hot tub and the walking around wet on nice wooden floor. Water drains away really nicely.
@@Lyonscarpentry ours is a hardwood deck with full coverage from the elements, haven’t needed to do anything even after 5 years still looks presentable. I guess it depends on general design
As someone who has been building deckings for nearly 15 years, I wholeheartedly disagree with oiling. You listed a reason against staining as it will come off after 12 months yet you are re oiling yours in the same time period. The problem with oil is once the wood has absorbed oil a few times, it no longer does. Like you say, stain sits on the outer layer of the timber BUT it can be completely removed and changed at will and I would actually list that as an advantage.
This bloke hasn't a clue, 1) to clean decking use 50/50 water and thin bleach, all you need to do is make the decking wet and wait for a few days, with 5mm gaps in boards this should be enough for the boards to last 20+ years, BTW never presser wash decking or oil it. 2) The frame will always rot out before the boards but if you want it to last do these things, use tacky tape (Brand Butyl Tape) on every screw, this prevents water ingress into the long grain and seal all end grain on the sub base, use slate on top of the cement pads the base rests on.
There's always someone who says they know more, especially in the anonymous world of youtube comments. Thing is, Charlie is an all-rounder, so when he does a video about a subject that he's not the most expert in, we all learn a tonne. I can't really learn from your comment because it starts with a slur, so I don't tend to take the rest seriously..
LOL never pressure wash your deck. The reason you have to be careful is that it can lift the wood fibres and make for a fluffy surface but only with high pressure and soft timber, just be careful. Generalisations like these don't help.
@@MatSmithLondon You keep spending loads of money on products and hours of scrubbing to keep your decking clean and after that use high pressure water to separate the fibers while I'll just kill the organisms that make it rot and go green by just making it wet with 50/50 (takes a few mins)
@@djstuc You keep spending loads of money on products and hours of scrubbing to keep your decking clean and after that use high pressure water to separate the fibers while I'll just kill the organisms that make it rot and go green by just making it wet with 50/50 (takes a few mins)
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Great vid Charlie and cheers for the shout-out! 👍😎 I'd concur with all of that. It'll be interesting to see how mine turns out since it's against a north facing wall that only gets sun 50% of the year. A mate of mine has decking that went down over 20 years ago - it was installed pretty badly and has had almost zero maintenance. It's still more-or-less fine. Yours still looks new - amazing! 👍💪
Cheers Andy. Yes your deck will be bullet proof and for a couple of hours' very satisfying work once in a while you can keep it looking great. Maybe being north facing will be a godsend in that the sun won't break down the oil so much .. 👊
The minor grooves on the reverse of the deck boards are there to help prevent the boards curling up or down.
Thanks Charlie. I have a huge deck which I’ve been maintaining each year for the last 6 years but you’ve now provided better tools to help with the future cleaning and oiling
You're welcome. Good work on the deck. I bet it looks great 👌
Looks great. People are complaining about the maintenance but it must be two hours work a year. Easily worth it!
Another excellent and informative video. To the point and without annoying music accompaniment etc. Keep up the great work.
What a pain in the arse. Decking project put on hold. Thanks.
Such a brilliant channel. Watched so many of your videos, both when I’m in a sticky situation and attempting it myself and also when I’m just curious about the logistics of certain jobs
Thanks so much, can't tell you how much I appreciate that, and I'm humbled you find my videos useful/ interesting 👊
Another great video Charlie, very interesting to see how the substructure has performed over that time. Hopefully the one I installed (using your original video as a guide) will still be ok Also. I noticed that although you mentioned that you had installed the decking without any gap, you didn't say what gap you did use on the re-install. You might remember that I used the Kreg jig and screws to give a nice consistent gap and also as the screws are inserted at a 45 degree angle, they are hidden from view. I fitted Yellow Balou boards and although they did need some extra treatment in the early stages, they have remained in really great condition since with excellent water beading
Keep up the good work and thanks again for always showing your mistakes as well as your successes
Thanks mate. Yes I should have mentioned that. It was a good 5-8mm I'd say. Great work going for the balau 👌
Interesting analysis of materials and techniques - I'm with you on a smooth surface! (I think the two grooves on the underside of the boards you have are to reduce the risk of them cupping)
Hi Charlie, in my old house built a deck in 2003 with basic tanalised subfloor and the typical decking boards. For the first 15 years or so minimal maintenance and was fine. As the boards started to look scruffy used deck repair paint - bad decision as looked great at first but chipped and scuffed and needed at least yearly re-paint. Still, lasted 18 years before we moved out (and still down with the new owners). Built a deck in the new house just over 2 years ago with tanalised subfloor, bitumen paint on the top edges and composite deck (light grey with dark grey edging) with the t-track fixing to hold it down. Looked great at first, gaps perfect but with constant expansion and contraction the boards creep and the gaps now look awful. Need to spend a day getting the gaps good again and putting a single screw in each board to anchor one point in place. The composite boards also scratch fairly easily. If I were to do it again would use a natural product.
Thanks mate. That's really useful feedback 👌👊
Thanks for this. We had a timber deck installed in June and while I don't know the ins-and-outs of what wood was used as we didn't install it ourselves, this is still a helpful video. I've also watched your decking oil vid from 2021 which I would recommend to anybody wanting to maintain a deck. Good nod to Gosforth Handyman too. I've watched a few of his videos and found them interesting so I will check out his decking video as well.
Re marina decks. My guess (and it is only a guess...) is that timber is preferred because I believe a downside of composite is that it can get slippy - or at least slippier than a timber deck - when wet so if that's true then it would explain why most decks in those areas are made of wood.
Thanks for sharing that, Martin, you're probably right. 👊
Charlie always great content mate and I remember you building this. Fair play for revisiting. Gives all all such a great insight.
Very interesting review, I've built a number of decks over the years and always seemed to move house a year or two after building it so never got to see how mine fared. I was pleased to see that over time I've been doing similar things to what you've done with the exception of using decking paint rather than oil. That came down to an style decision by the boss. But although the paint will come off over time, or a strong pressure wash, at least it means I can change the colour every few years if I want. Oh, and never use so called anti-slip paint. It maybe is anti-slip, but the finish is awful and just attracts dirt and mildew. Keep up the good work, I've learned loads from people like you, Gosforth Handyman and Stuart from Proper DIY - would love to see you all work on something together :)
Great analysis video, but just one thing-stainless screws don't corrode, but they snap very very easily. I stopped using them because when you try and remove them from weathered wood, you tend to lose 2/3rds of them and then you have to deal with the bit of screw that's left in the wood.🥴
What's you use now then
@@coolmonkey619 The very same timbadeck green screws you see in this video.👍
Brilliant video!! Very very interesting!! Hope all is well and hope you have a great weekend, take care
As always some well thought out and good general advice Charlie.
For years I've installed ridge side down and this I've found makes a massive difference for longevity of both the decking and subframe (tho I also creocote the subframe). The double sided decking is made to cater to customers who like the aesthetics of ridged decking (according to the suppliers I've spoken to).
The misconception of ridge side up being more grippy is based on feelings and not fact, I've had this same argument with far more competent joiners than myself but the argument begins and ends with 'find a single Yacht manufacturer that fits wood decking with ridges' teak isn't magically grippy it's wood it just weathers better, the same joiners also argue decking is lethal in the wet yet smooth topped decking I've installed in various properties is only slippery when covered in ice.
Fair point. It makes sense doesn't it. You need maximum surface area under foot for your show to grip onto. If it gets a bit slippy, clean it 😉
I've always wanted decking and even though we're about to move into our forever bungalow soon, there's nowhere I can think of where I can put any decking. I think. Bit of an odd shaped garden so once the fence has been put up, will have to look at what my options are then. Many thanks for this video, confirmed a couple suspicions (I used to work for a timber yard that sold the composite stuff and I've always had my reservations on it) and I've learnt quite a bit.
Great video as always! As it happens, we are doing a new deck in a few months time. I started out thinking to do composite, and for similar reasons as you (doubt about durability & maintenance, not to mention price), I am now leaning towards Kwila or similar, and just letting it weather. Bear in mind I'm in New Zealand, so options are a bit different. Definitely agree about the grooves!
Thanks so much. I'm always humbled when my videos are watched so far afield.. Massive thanks for your interest and support, and for the comment. Good luck with your new deck and don't forget to design a bullet (weather) proof sub frame. 👊
Tons of information as always, thanks for that. Bottom surface cuts on floor boards are for cup resistance I always thought?
Thanks for the update Charlie, If I remember right, I think you mentioned you had to buy the Osmo pole , £24-26 as Osmo had mad it a proprietary connection. which was annoying . I actually needed up buying a cheep B&Q own brand extension pole for less than half the price. It does not have the locking tabs but the screw end tip is small enough that it will slip into the brush head with no problem and you just push and twist it in. It locks into place very tight and I had no issues of it coming of when using it vigorously.
That's good to know 👌👊
Hey Charlie, just cleaned my decking using the Ronseal cleaner. It's looking a lot better but the decking still has a green colour to it in several places. It's been in place about 10 years and I think I've only jet washed it once in that time and never stained it! I guess i could buy another bottle of cleaner and give it a second go but thinking i will just stain it now and see how it looks...
Yes Dave the more you clean it the better the result will be but as you say it's so tempting to just say, ah well that'll do, and wack the oil on 😉
Nice video good for people to see what to expect. As long as the base is good that's where your save as when you come to change the decking your won't need to do the base as well. In regards to the DPM you tried to use your right to use it if its a base for a building with an overhang on the roof. In your case you didn't put the roof on and when you did not much overhang so rain gets in. The DPM will last forever but the paint won't. In short if its a deck base paint the underside and tops and leave the sides of the joists but if its a base for a shed, cabin or something with a roof and roof over hang use DPM.
Yep that's exactly what I did. 👊
Excellent informative video! I believe the groves underneath are to prevent cupping and not for ventilation.
I think cupping largely depends on which way up the grain is but it's an interesting point 👌
Thank you for the video.
Strongly recommend 32mm deck timber. Strongly recommend flat surface on top. Also Strongly recommended using concealed fixing screw, so clean on the surface.
Thanks 👌👊
I’ve recently redone my decking that had survived 12 years. The subframe had rotted in many places but not in areas I’d applied 2 coats of wicks liquid DPC, ie at joint positions and support brackets. This time, like you I applied a bitumastic coating (the same Wicks brand) but not on the underside to allow the wood to breath. Since the top of the frame had the greatest proportion of rot I applied a 100mm strip of self adhesive flashing which folds over 25mm each side. I’m hoping this will last much longer.
I can say with experience having the grooves on the bottom & flat side on the top is the best way to do it. First deck I built grooves faced up & even with cleaning turned into an ice rink when wet in the summer & in the winter. Second deck flat side up not slippery in the slightest.
Thanks. I agree! 👊
Thankyou for such an informative video :)
You're welcome. I went to a fancy dress party as Hong Kong Phooey recently 😉👌
@@CharlieDIYte Brilliant !
Great video Charlie. Longevity is all in the base. As long as you keep joists off the ground and have plenty of airflow it will last decades.
You have put me off replacing some of my decking with composite - the fading and warping was my main concern for something so pricey. The main deck i was thinking of is at a chalet we rent out on the Pembrokeshire coast where the weather is extreme. But its so large it takes a few days every year to do the maintenance on - and you can never get enough dry days in a row in spring when I try and get it ready for guests. Every year I try new hacks and tools but the grooves are what make it so slow. I just wish more places did proper flat decks - I wonder if the grooves help mask imperfections which is why its sold?
After 1 year my cheapest composite still looks pristine, very nice to walk bare foot for me and toddler, just feels like being on interior floor. Will see what happens after more years though, fingers crossed...
I used Iroko for an internal deck underneath the shower in a wet room. Five years later when I moved out, I t was good as new even with the dramatic temperature fluctuations (glass ceiling) and humidity - untreated.
That's amazing - and great to know. Thanks Simon 👌
👍👍👍. Thank you Charlie
Great video Charlie. That hardwood you took out of a skip looked like Ekki from the endgrain, that stuff is used to make canal lock gates so no worries for a bit of flooring 😂👍
Thanks mate. Yes it's extraordinary stuff and so heavy.
Learned a lot, cheers.
Thanks mate 👊
Another great video.
Thanks 👊
Bitumastic paint is my favourite DIY product, the best thing since sliced bread. 👍
It's good isn't it. You also need to try barn door paint. It's ridiculously good ruclips.net/video/Y7whXp3aBbQ/видео.htmlsi=hvCeY3pT5oUV8_H7 👊
But can you put it on sliced bread? How does the coverage compare to the industry standard marmite? I'd imagine it tastes better...
We’ve got a large raised deck that needs replacing at the back of our house - we installed it when we renovated the house 16 years ago. The subframe is in almost perfect condition built with treated 6x2 - we gave it no special treatment (We renovated the house and intended to sell immediately) It’s the posts that are failing. I think in future, I’ll do what the Americans do and build off concrete piers. Or maybe just use a steel frame.
Could you set new posts, maybe concrete, near the old ones without moving the sub frame? Concrete deck posts pre drilled for a tenner each
grooved decks are definitely not less slippy i had a deck outside my patio at the my old house same profile as that and in winter in was like an ice rink, so i agree i would 100% get a flat surface deck just becuase it so much easier to maintain
Agreed 👌
We got 22 years from our wood deck. I'm now rebuilding new. Neotimber plastic joists and posts for elevated sub frame. If putting in the effort and time, may as well spend and get something that won't rot. I'm guessing 3 times the price of wood. Save money on the top boards if need be, but don't scrimp on the subframe - I dont want to do it again! Simon Bowler has good video on this.
We used Kwila hardwood for our deck and after 25 years it's still as good as new. Hardwood is the way to go. Edited to say that we only waterblast and stain every 4 years.
I always found decking super slippy in winter time when frost or ice hits just like porcelain slabs a death trap
Personally I would go for composite on the deck sub structure and posts etc then use a quality hardwood on top for looks and longevity
Yep, or concrete posts 👌
I have large Softwood Deck. Big fan of the Ronseal Deck Cleaner/Reviver. What do you think about Decking Paints?
It's brilliant isn't it. I wouldn't use anything that sits on the surface. For me it's crucial it sinks in which is why I also wouldn't touch water based decking oils - should have mentioned that 🤦
You have a really nice deck 👌🏼
Thanks mate 👊
There is only 1 tip get good quality composite decking, job done, replaced our aging wooden one for the third time many years ago, it still looks as good as they say we laid it.!
What brand and type of composite if you don’t mind me asking?
@@liftfan2 lots of sellers even the Wickes stuff is good when on offer, just watch for the stuff with a thin top & large hollow cores. Ours is solid but most has cores now, my son-in law got the Wickes when it was reduced & that looks great, fiddly little clamps to fit but comes with a thin bit so it doesn’t mark the inner edges. (Fittings are between the boards so hard to see)
@@thomasbroker69 Thanks for the tips! There are so many brands it’s difficult to decide.
Great video well donw
Thanks 👍
Last time I used a "tinted oil" (no nonsense cedar decking oil) the colouring despite vigorous shaking and mixing was never even in application and the colour could be seen seperating. This got worse after storing the tin then using it again...clear for me from now on.
My best tip is to buy the NKT hidden fastener system, especially if you're going smooth. It makes installation a piece of p***, and doesn't give water a well to sit in.
Interesting 👌 I guess the only problem with the NKT is trying to get the screws out if you need to take the deck up. I don't notice the screws once they're in.
Charlie just get slabs...your video has made that decision an easy one for me
Decking just feels better than slabs and creates a completely different atmosphere.
Does pressure washing open the grain.
Yes, if you get too close. I always advise people NOT to pressure wash soft woods for this very reason. Once the grains open up the water can pool longer leading to the wood rotting quicker.
You could have used marine deck paint or coating. It's getting more popular for wooden decks.
Interesting - thanks for sharing that 👌
How thick were your joists please
6"x2" so about 45mm
@@CharlieDIYte thank you I have loads of 4x2 do you think that would work with more supports to the floor I have spare railway sleepers to tie them into would this work do you think
@@decisionsdecisions8906max span of a 4x2 is 6 feet. The old rule of thumb for calculating depth of timber vs timber spans (imperial units not metric) is to divide the proposed span by 2, then add 1. So 6 feet divided by 2 =3+1= 4 inches joist depth. If your span is greater then add additional support at max 6ft centres.
why not use marine varnish?
After my experience with the Fiddes high build oil on the outdoor furniture I'm not ever touching varnish again. I need stuff that sinks in. Stuff on the surface will get destroyed by the sun.
Hi Charlie. Been a fan and viewer for years and love your vids. May I respectfully say that in this case, by way of design your deck is a lot of effort and not a reasonable amount of reward? (I'm not referring to the reward of the time you spend there as such... that's a different matter.) We laid a concrete slab (5x4m) and simply mortared a load of bricks onto the slab. Installed 2 drain outlets which lead to a soakaway a couple of metres up the garden. C24 treated timber, straight on the bricks. No faffing painting timbers or worrying about condition. We are 4 years down the line as well, and the timbers are basically as new. We used hardwood decking - Balau, which was 16 quid per plank from Builder Depot. A bit more expensive but - after multiple visits where I went and manually selected planks that were actually straight (!), it looks stunning to this day. I used timbadeck screws - small star heads that sink flush. And you know what - I screwed the boards down at each end (left and right side of the plank) plus only 1 or 2 points in the middle. Out of laziness I didn't bother doing any more. The things are still going strong, no bowing or twisting, tonnes of ventilation as I left good 3mm gaps. Admittedly ours is built right up against two party walls either side (brick, about 3m high) so that prevents rain coming in from the sides and rear. And at the front we have white curtains for hot tub privacy. A bit fun when it's windy, but still completely usable. Roof is a single pitch with a good fall, mini plastic corrugated stuff with split bamboo loose laid on top and cable tied down at the sides. Sexy philips hue lighting around the bricks, and it's a lovely little indoor space outdoors. Roof is held up by 4x4 posts (sitting on little concrete risers we poured in place, 4x4 to match the posts above and with a stainless steel rod sticking out, which then we resin-fixed into a hole we made in posts, then 2x4 joists above with roofing battens going across every 150mm. That's what the mini plastic corrugated roof went on. The plastic crap is hidden as you just see bamboo. But perfectly waterproof. (More so than my home... err...?) Whole lot painted in ronseal walnut colour. We installed a fridge, hifi, wifi, concrete counter top, the whole lot. By the way - hot tub went straight onto the concrete and we decked around it. Much easier that way. Also a nice large corner bench which accommodates 3 people or 2 people lying down. Made also from the balau hardwood decking. If I could do it all again I would definitely consider using composite. Our hardwood decking looks good still - really good. I didn't treat it with anything from day 1, and still don't really feel the need to. It's protected enough. No mould or algae due to good ventilation. But it has silvered slightly as you'd expect of any wood. I prefer the nice rich tones hence thinking composite might have been better. But still - we really enjoy the space and watching this vid, I feel very grateful we put the initial work in to make it lower maintenance in the long term as I know I wouldn't be bothered to apply oils and whatnot a few years down the line...
Finally - not wanting to sound like a complete snob, but I really do think softwood decking looks a bit basic. The hardwood planks are thinner and look really refined in comparison. Just my personal opinion :)
A porcelain slabbed area would be best.
IMO best way to do it is invite some friends for a BBQ , let them do it whilst you preparing the meat works for other (dirty) jobs too.
Love it ! 👌
One thing anyone whom lays a deck realises quickly is to clean it regularly or risk a trip to a & e going flying with algae on the surface 😂
What I've learnt with decking is to never put it down and get rid of it as soon as you can.
It may be all fine if you are OK with all the maintenance and initial cost but a few years in and if the decking is in the sun it splits and you get nasty splintering wood when it is dry.
When winter comes and it is wet it goes green in no time as wet just sits in the grooves. Then it is ridiculously slippery.
I bought a house with a big patio of decking that is about 10 years old and it is all coming out soon. Awful stuff! Really just dont do it.
Wood splits because it dries out. Keep it oiled and it won't split. It gets slippery because it's not properly maintained. If it's going green there's insufficient light and air flow to dry it out. The green stuff only grows because it stays wet for prolonged periods of time.
@@YesiPleb Or it is not a suitable material for the damp uk climate.
It’s ipe (ee-pay), not I.P.E - surely?!
Oops sorry about that
might just stick with gravel or flags.
Flags are certainly an easier option. 😉
Maybe get a stone patio instead 😂
Here is an unholy idea... what if...we would cover the decking with Yaht varnish? 🙊🤔
I think you need something that sinks in rather than sits on the surface.
The biggist mistake people make when laying decking is laying it with the grooved side up its far better to have the smooth side up its self cleaning
Agreed 👍
Old diesel engine oil.
Better than creosote
Awesome stuff isn't it! Goes on black and doesn't take long to dry and fade slightly showing the wood grain through quite clearly. I've built two very large planters out the front of my place (1m x 2m x 17") and a recycle bin storage shed. First coat was Creosote (not Creocote!) and after then every year middle of summer I coat with used engine oil from a diesel vehicle. My local garage is more than happy to supply this for free.
Best advice for decking…..do paving instead🤣
I'm with you on that. I think paving looks nice. BUT - nothing like getting out of a hot tub and the walking around wet on nice wooden floor. Water drains away really nicely.
@@MatSmithLondon just isn’t worth the upkeep, use sandstone slabs, that’s what we have for the hot tub
@@Lyonscarpentry ours is a hardwood deck with full coverage from the elements, haven’t needed to do anything even after 5 years still looks presentable. I guess it depends on general design
As someone who has been building deckings for nearly 15 years, I wholeheartedly disagree with oiling. You listed a reason against staining as it will come off after 12 months yet you are re oiling yours in the same time period. The problem with oil is once the wood has absorbed oil a few times, it no longer does. Like you say, stain sits on the outer layer of the timber BUT it can be completely removed and changed at will and I would actually list that as an advantage.
As someone who has just had to sand back all their decking i agree fully with oiling it looks bettef and easier to maintain
Look at this guy with his expensive deck
🤣🤣🤣 "I certainly wouldn't install an expensive deck like that and I don't think any of you would either". 🤦
Just watch the Americans
They are deck kings and they don’t use grooved Timbers
Food for thought
This bloke hasn't a clue, 1) to clean decking use 50/50 water and thin bleach, all you need to do is make the decking wet and wait for a few days, with 5mm gaps in boards this should be enough for the boards to last 20+ years, BTW never presser wash decking or oil it. 2) The frame will always rot out before the boards but if you want it to last do these things, use tacky tape (Brand Butyl Tape) on every screw, this prevents water ingress into the long grain and seal all end grain on the sub base, use slate on top of the cement pads the base rests on.
There's always someone who says they know more, especially in the anonymous world of youtube comments. Thing is, Charlie is an all-rounder, so when he does a video about a subject that he's not the most expert in, we all learn a tonne. I can't really learn from your comment because it starts with a slur, so I don't tend to take the rest seriously..
LOL never pressure wash your deck. The reason you have to be careful is that it can lift the wood fibres and make for a fluffy surface but only with high pressure and soft timber, just be careful. Generalisations like these don't help.
In my original decking oil vid I showed how weak that Karcher pressure washer was by pressure washing my hand.😉
@@MatSmithLondon You keep spending loads of money on products and hours of scrubbing to keep your decking clean and after that use high pressure water to separate the fibers while I'll just kill the organisms that make it rot and go green by just making it wet with 50/50 (takes a few mins)
@@djstuc You keep spending loads of money on products and hours of scrubbing to keep your decking clean and after that use high pressure water to separate the fibers while I'll just kill the organisms that make it rot and go green by just making it wet with 50/50 (takes a few mins)