Really smart analysis. This was particularly interesting because it clarified my confusion about the messages of the film. Incredibles 2 isn't saying that superheroes are the answer to all our problems, and its not saying that superheroes are bad and we need to learn to rely on ourselves. It's saying both at the same time. The real evil of the film is believing there's only one answer, only one way of looking at the world. The Deavors' father believed that superheroes would inevitably save him, and perished. But all Evelyn Deavor took from that is the belief that superheroes were bad. Her father's binary thinking passed on to her. If it's not always good, it's bad. If not A then only B. So if superheroes aren't always there to save the day, they themselves are the cause of the crimes they fail to prevent. This binary thinking is the problem in every aspect of the film. Bob's struggle to be the caregiver stems from his belief that if he's not saving the world, he isn't doing anything worthwhile. And overcoming binary thinking is the biggest act of heroism in the movie. And as you point out, this is incredibly relevant in this current moment in history. Binary thinking effectively turns off people's brains, and allows them to ignore truth and swallow lies, if the truth doesn't fit their singularly focused idea of highest good, and if the lies do. This is what superhero stories are for, to examine the moral and philosophical forces in conflict in our society. It's great to see those themes discussed intelligently here. Great job.
Ted Naifeh, wow this comment perfectly concludes a 10 minute video! This should have been added to the main video! Everyone must see things the way you do!
Something i liked is that they made Bob struggle taking care of the kids but not because he's "a dumb dad" or that he has never bothered to spend time with his family. Bob was facing specially difficult moments like JackJack's new powers and Violet's boyfriend issues. Yes, Helen would have fixed the situation a little more easily, but it would still have been a difficult situation. So yeah, i don't like the trope of "mom's gone and the dad can't help his family because he's a dumbass who aparently has never spent time with his fucking children" but this works because Bob COULD have done a better job if Helen hadn't leave during the worst possible moment. Also when Bob is having problems he doesn't ask Helen for help, but not because of pride or fear of being told "i told you so", he genuinely doesn't want to ruin his wife's oportunity.
It's not just her opportunity but to improve the lot of their kids and all supers for a better world. He finds it hard but still persists I loved Edna and Jack Jack bonding too.
Please do a video about Princess Azula from _Avatar: The Last Airbender?_ She's such an interesting, complex and well-written character. A video about Sokka would also be great.
although I think evelyn is right to a certain extent. I agree with what you said at the end of the video. It’s what you choose to believe. It’s how you see it. (sorta like the theme for Wonder Woman ?) I for sure firmly believe with helen tho. yes we very much still need superheroes. I’ve always wished they were real so I could be one. but maybe instead of going out and fighting crime I hope to one day become a filmmaker to show and tell stories that inspire bc it seems too often today everybody’s a cynic with a cautionary tale that thinks the human race is ultimately doomed. superheroes being gone for X reasons is nothing new but the way you explained it certainly made me love this movie more. reminds me of the end of the opening cinematic of overwatch (which I sometimes watch til the very end cause it sometimes makes me tear up) "Look, the people decided they were better off without us. They even called us criminals! They tore our family apart... But look around! Someone has to do something! We have to do something! We can make a difference again. The world needs us now more than ever! Are you with me?" Ik I definitely am, thanks for reading and thanks for the video ! I hope to see more like it
Thank you so much for this! I loved "Incredibles 2" for exactly the reasons you pointed out and more. It's refreshing to know there are people out there who appreciate it as much as I do.
Pixelmated probably won't for quit a few years, look how long Frozen 2 is taking, and I'm not even particularly waiting for that but it seems it's been a while
The Screen Slaver reminded me a bit the Unabomber. Both used terrorism as a condemnation of technology, the Unabomber foresaw happening what, we and the Screen Slaver see today, and both used violence and terrorism as a misguided means to rebel.
I really did not feel that the world of part 2 felt very different from part 1 at all. A mix of better cgi rendering and different locations may have given a slightly different look, but I never felt for one minute that it wasn't the same world.
I think Brad Bird said that he wasn’t deliberately trying to reference any real world political discussion and that any connections people might have seen was all just coincidental? He said that he began throwing around ideas as soon as he was finished the first movie and that it’d be cool to have Bob and Helen’s roles switched for a potential sequel. Whatever “political” message people might be seeing is mostly in their head.
Genevieve1023 Superhero movies can tackle certain themes without touching any current day political topics. For instance, the original Star Wars trilogy was always about good vs evil, but it never outright addressed or picked sides along the contemporary political spectrum. It was what it was. At most, you could see the empire as being a shorthand to the Soviet Union and their authoritarian and collectivist ideology, but at most the story strayed away from modern day political discussion. You can be politically neutral and still tell a good story.
Genevieve1023 Doesn’t matter. It’s still a story of good vs evil which is capable of telling its story without resorting to referencing real world politics.
Syndrome wasn't wrong about everyone being super, but he took it in a literal and destructive matter by both stealing and having the disire to be worshipped, even lying in a devastating way where it was chaos and madness. Screenslaver on the other hand wasn't wrong about relying and getting too much help from others, but it was also in a literal and destructive matter as well, by using deception and manipulative methods for a horrendous outcome. Now Syndrome was narcissistic and full of vanity and was willing to sacrifice others for his own achievement. Mr. Incredible was a little like that too in the present day, but eventually he was coming to his senses and all it took was his family to help him remember he is suppose to be saving lives and being better...or super. Heh Screenslaver was too obsessed with the well being of only yourself and to make others feel helpless and abandoned even thinking it was for another's own good by keeping them safe away from harm by doing nothing. Elastagirl was a little like that too with her family and others, but eventually her own family came to her rescue and were inspired by her actions to take action and to make a difference, even other supers were inspired, Mr. Deavor too. Mr. Deavor insured he didn't make the same mistake as his parent did when no action was taking against the robbers where no one including the police were not coming to their aid.
okay well it just became suddenly apparent that there is going to be a ton of spoilers in this and as the only person who hasn't seen this movie yet I should just put this in my watch later list so i can enjoy it later have a wonderful day everyone
The screen slaver part, very relatable. So relatable that we're ignoring the damage we've done to ourselves and it renders our freewill to have order of our own.
Core movie was so good.. The actual actions of the villian/yhird act really really didn't elevate the movie. Thanks for the video highlighted those gems so well
If you watch nothing but marvel movies then the answer would be no, we don't need superheroes. There's nothing inspiring about marvel heroes and marvel films. The "heroes" are barely heroes and cause a lot of problems themselves, especially tony stark. If you've watched DC movies however, and I mean actually watched them with some kind of intelligence, then the answer would be yes, we do need superheros. DC heroes are inspirational and give us hope. DC movies show that while we see them as gods they're really just as human as the rest of us. They love, they make mistakes, they get angry, they fall, they hope, they dream, they're us but more. They're what we can become, and superman embodies this completely.
Marvel's heroes are meant to be more human. Real humans. With actual faults. Unlikable DC's unrealistic fairytale garbage. Superheroes are fairytale garbage anyway.
@@learn2draw716 Moron shut the fuck up. DC heroes are meant to be inspirations, which is what superheroes should be. They're supposed to inspire people to be better and that's exactly what they do. They're the most human characters in the genre, marvel's garbage doesn't compare. Especially since marvel and their characters are the poor man's version of DC. Pull your head out of your own ass.
i thought the movie was lackluster tbh. As soon as Evelyn came on screen, I was like "oh well she's obviously the villain" and every subsequent moment from then on had me thinking the same thing, she was obviously screen slaver. Every bit of dialogue & obvious attempts at manipulation & manifesting conflict....it was so obvious. But I was waiting for Disney to "subvert my expectations", It was too obvious they were trying to make her "a villain who you don't know is the villain" so obvious that I was waiting for the twist that she wasn't actually the villain.....but then she was. very predictable. not a bad movie, but not great, not worth the 14 year wait that's for sure.
meow meow is the goal of this movie to subvert expectations or to teach and inspire. I, too, knew she was the villain early on but that didn't take away from the movie experience because the central action of the film was the legal status of heroes and their family.
Lindsay Ellis did a video called Are Disney Villains Going Extinct a year and a half ago that explains this phenomenon. A lot of the modern Disney movies have the “villain you don’t know is the villain” thing going on rather than the classic shamelessly evil villains of the Disney Princess days. It has to do with modern attitudes shifting about good vs. evil, how we should be teaching people that no one is strictly good or strictly evil, there are shades of grey. However, I don’t think they should get rid of the Maleficents and Gastons entirely. People are becoming so used to the surprise villain reveal that it’s no longer a surprise. Why not have a Disney movie where the villain becomes the hero? (Oh wait, Despicable Me and Megamind already did that. But there’s got to be plenty of other ways to utilize that trope, rather than just using a “super villain”, right?) Or have the white knight hero of the film lose and get proved wrong by the villain in the end? THAT would be a twist. Anything but another surprise villain reveal...
AvgJane19 The goal of the film is to make money. Just because you were ~inspired~ by it doesn't mean someone else isn't allowed to criticise what they see as poor characterisation or predictability. The "goal" of the movie is to make money, which they did, it's not to inspire or teach. Beyond that, Disney or more specifically the people who work on it, wants it to be a good film, I explained why I didn't think it was. I'm confused by what you're trying to imply with your comment, "the central action of the film was the legal status of the heros"....even if it was how does that nullify criticism of other aspects of the movie? If you disagree with me, fine, explain why and we can have a fun discourse but your comment seems to be more about your anger at my audacity at sharing my opinion of the film....on a movie review comment page....because god forbid anyone not like a movie you like.
meow meow Okay. I'll take you up on your money debate. *cracks neck* Although money is an end goal/ by product of a movie, I would argue its not the central theme. Because if it was they would not need to try so hard with the story nor wait so long, and maybe not even give it good graphics. Especially for this movie. See, people have been asking, praying and BEGGING for this sequel for 14 years. The hype alone was enough for any adult in their mid-20's to buy a ticket. There was a meme as soon as it was announced that joked that the adults would push the kids out of the way to see the movie. Because we've been waiting so much longer. So Picar could have EASILY ripped us off. Give us something mediocre , and people would still have had a decent time and spend the money. But Pixar has always been (with the exception of Cars franchise) about telling good and interesting stories. From their first to latest film, they want to give interesting perspectives and good writing. Had they wanted to just get our money they would have just given in and given us an Incredibles 2 four years after the first movie, or less. And work off a third rate script. But they took time with this story, with the graphics, and updated its technology and released something that would be special. That was worth the wait. Sure it's Disney and they need to get the money back, but like the Lego Movie, that would have happened no matter what they did with this project. So instead they decided to give us something good. There are so many other movies out there that just want to rip you off and get the cash back. Like Suicide Squad as an example. It tugs at comic book nostalgia, tries to copy what Marvel did but without thought or structure, and throws a few good songs in there and quirky (read: not GOOD) characters that are currently popular in comic sales, and hope it goes well. (Plus a few cameos.) This movie knows it will get money back, so it doesn't try that hard. Heck its also well known that Warner Brothers doesn't actually care about DC movies, and it shows. The DCCU "franchise" IS a joke. The reason we didn't get a Batman movie out of it, is because Ben Affleck was so mad at not getting a proper script/ good story, that he completely abandoned the directing roll/ anything to do with it until a proper story was in place. And even a person who likes these movies (Me. I like them a lot.) Can realise there are a LOT of problems with the story telling, characterizations and SOOO MUCH MORE because these movies end goals are purely money related (Aside from WONDER WOMAN. THAT MOVIE WAS AMAZING!!!!!!!!) instead of focused on creating good stories. So yes. Pixar's "Incredibles 2" is not just meant to make money and it was not its central point. It's main objective, was to weave an interesting and good story about a family of Super Heroes.
yes we do. Superheroes are super. and that oliver sansweet is a real jerk for started the sued the supers and for having the supers going underground. if he is still alive I hope oliver sansweet will get turned into a clayface like villain.
I still feel as though the family dynamic was missing in this film. Bob and Helen were the main POVs for this film, somewhat to the first one but I felt more distant from the kids. It was a good film overall to me but certain things did cause me to lose interest.
Pierre Gilson I agree my main issue with the films is that if it's suppose to be so family centered, it needs to divide up among the family evenly, at least with the older kids, just my opinion though
ArronZ M. In the first one third solo scenes, for the children, are absolutely brilliant, for me they took center stage. They attempted to emulate that on the second one when they were on the boat but it lacked the growth I gained from watching the characters on the first one. That's a sequel problem at the end of the day because the newness isn't there. In the second one ot seemed like all the kids were there for was to cater to and help progress Bob's narrative. More of a supporting role for that plots protagonist. Whether it had to deal with Violent's love debacle, Jack Jack's powers, or Dash kinda coasting by throughout the story, he mostly did homework. It did not feel real to me but a story that was predictable within then first 15 minutes. I enjoyed it but I expected more.
the first half of the movie seemed to gearing up to make for a worthy sequel. bob and helen's opposing views on changing the status quo, the subversion of gender roles, and screenslaver as a concept promised a great film unfortunately, the kids arcs were far too inconsequential, jack-jack was overplayed, and most importantly the finale blew harder than fellatio from bomb voyage. (spoilers) you're telling me you have someone smart enough to create mass scale mind control and she decides to come up with the worst plan to accomplish nothing for nobody animation great jokes good 5/5 masterpiece
Another good essay, guys! Could watch these all day. Only, I think there's a lot to make of male vs female perception in Incredibles 2. Surprised you never touched on it. The movie's filled with latent reminders and examples of where men & women's schools of thought come to conflict and compromise. The dynamics between Bob & Helen as well as Evelyn & Winston really reflect the state of gender's perception and influence; which links back to your points on branding and image. Possibly another essay altogether???
No matter what happens the concept of superheroes will never die but will instead evolve to fit the modern audience we'd rather hero's that we can relate to instead of Superman who is like a god with no true personality! .
Thank you for this. The values and being there as a family set, even when we feel like doing other things, is something I need to hear in my life right now. As for Screenslaver and superheroes, I'd like to think these movies are an optimistic way to motive people, I agree with what you said. Even though it's ironic when we're all watching this on a screen lol. With people like Alexandria Cortez and Dorthy Gasque getting voted in, progressives, I believe our next generation can change the future.
These movies are less about supers and more about family. Even though it is less obvious in 2 it is still very much a husband and wife doing what they can to raise their kids in a way they feel is right. Even when tough times strike, it is the interactions between the family members that make or break the situation they are in. Our perception as an audience changed, the movie theme did not. We will always need family films that feel honest and down to earth, even sat in among cliche writing, and childish animation. The question of if we need supers, is really rather irrelevant...
So you guys are explaining the ideas of the Watchmen from Alan Moore. Kind does not surprise me because Bard Bird took heavily influences from Watchmen.
The world is in fact not post truth, no matter how much postmodernist neomarxist university professors want us to believe that. People were always prone to being influenced by fancy sounding but factually incorrect rethoric. The burden is on the one engainig in the rethoric to ensure its validity.
For those who wonder why most of the new supers are rather weak in comparison i'd point you to the fact syndrome tested his omnibots on likely the strongest supers to prepare it for Mr. Increadable and likely didn't see fit to include these supers as test subjects.
there are some very interesting points made in this video but I disagree with your reference to Syndrome at 12:48, he's not saying "everyone is super (period)" but that everyone will be super with the use of his technology so that when everyone is super, no one is. it just weakened whatever argument that was being made when you forced a quote where it wasn't accurate. I don't mean to "um actually" you but come on
it depends on how many people are hero's. if lets say 9/10 people have powers at which point being powerless is practically a disability. then conventional police forces are pretty much useless. yet if only 4/10 people have powers then you still need conventional law enforcement. the other thing to consider is how powerful your powered community is since some powers can feasibly be countered by one guy tackling you at the right time .
oh my god, so confused by the new voice, I still really like the content, but the voice is going to take a while to get used to. Susannah where are you??
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Feminism is cancer.
I felt, and still feel great. Thanks for asking.
Really smart analysis. This was particularly interesting because it clarified my confusion about the messages of the film. Incredibles 2 isn't saying that superheroes are the answer to all our problems, and its not saying that superheroes are bad and we need to learn to rely on ourselves. It's saying both at the same time. The real evil of the film is believing there's only one answer, only one way of looking at the world. The Deavors' father believed that superheroes would inevitably save him, and perished. But all Evelyn Deavor took from that is the belief that superheroes were bad. Her father's binary thinking passed on to her. If it's not always good, it's bad. If not A then only B. So if superheroes aren't always there to save the day, they themselves are the cause of the crimes they fail to prevent.
This binary thinking is the problem in every aspect of the film. Bob's struggle to be the caregiver stems from his belief that if he's not saving the world, he isn't doing anything worthwhile. And overcoming binary thinking is the biggest act of heroism in the movie.
And as you point out, this is incredibly relevant in this current moment in history. Binary thinking effectively turns off people's brains, and allows them to ignore truth and swallow lies, if the truth doesn't fit their singularly focused idea of highest good, and if the lies do.
This is what superhero stories are for, to examine the moral and philosophical forces in conflict in our society. It's great to see those themes discussed intelligently here. Great job.
Ted Naifeh, wow this comment perfectly concludes a 10 minute video!
This should have been added to the main video!
Everyone must see things the way you do!
Ted Naifeh 🔨 nailed it! Great comment, and I agree completely! I hope you are having a fabulous 2019!
Something i liked is that they made Bob struggle taking care of the kids but not because he's "a dumb dad" or that he has never bothered to spend time with his family. Bob was facing specially difficult moments like JackJack's new powers and Violet's boyfriend issues. Yes, Helen would have fixed the situation a little more easily, but it would still have been a difficult situation.
So yeah, i don't like the trope of "mom's gone and the dad can't help his family because he's a dumbass who aparently has never spent time with his fucking children" but this works because Bob COULD have done a better job if Helen hadn't leave during the worst possible moment.
Also when Bob is having problems he doesn't ask Helen for help, but not because of pride or fear of being told "i told you so", he genuinely doesn't want to ruin his wife's oportunity.
I agree with much of this TV Tropes points out Bob isn't just dumb muscle he's smart with it.
It's not just her opportunity but to improve the lot of their kids and all supers for a better world. He finds it hard but still persists I loved Edna and Jack Jack bonding too.
Please do a video about Princess Azula from _Avatar: The Last Airbender?_ She's such an interesting, complex and well-written character. A video about Sokka would also be great.
Even better: a whole series about the girls of Avatar.
Partner of the Light
No, the Cabbage Man!
😂
I second this
Please do this. This series is so worth a proper analysis.
BenHopkins1000 even better a whole series about all the characters in avatar the last airbender
"It's not about deserve, it's about what you believe" - Wonder Woman ;)
Sounds like an American
Yes. We do. More than ever.
That's crazy. I watching the first movie and this video pops up. You could say it's... incredible.😁
although I think evelyn is right to a certain extent. I agree with what you said at the end of the video. It’s what you choose to believe. It’s how you see it. (sorta like the theme for Wonder Woman ?) I for sure firmly believe with helen tho. yes we very much still need superheroes. I’ve always wished they were real so I could be one. but maybe instead of going out and fighting crime I hope to one day become a filmmaker to show and tell stories that inspire bc it seems too often today everybody’s a cynic with a cautionary tale that thinks the human race is ultimately doomed. superheroes being gone for X reasons is nothing new but the way you explained it certainly made me love this movie more. reminds me of the end of the opening cinematic of overwatch (which I sometimes watch til the very end cause it sometimes makes me tear up)
"Look, the people decided they were better off without us. They even called us criminals! They tore our family apart... But look around! Someone has to do something! We have to do something! We can make a difference again. The world needs us now more than ever! Are you with me?" Ik I definitely am, thanks for reading and thanks for the video ! I hope to see more like it
Some people might get fatigue. But not me. The heroes stay, always
Thank you so much for this! I loved "Incredibles 2" for exactly the reasons you pointed out and more. It's refreshing to know there are people out there who appreciate it as much as I do.
Man after watching the 2nd one I've been craving a 3rd one *ASAP* 😫😫😫
Pixelmated probably won't for quit a few years, look how long Frozen 2 is taking, and I'm not even particularly waiting for that but it seems it's been a while
It can literally be about kids being forced out of their innocence (like every child celebrity)
The Screen Slaver reminded me a bit the Unabomber. Both used terrorism as a condemnation of technology, the Unabomber foresaw happening what, we and the Screen Slaver see today, and both used violence and terrorism as a misguided means to rebel.
Sappy as it might sound, I like to think watching superhero movies has made me a better person.
Batman inspires me everyday in my struggle with depression.
The Ponderer How so?
It inspire me to be fit, to give the best of myself and this extent to many domain in my life.
I really did not feel that the world of part 2 felt very different from part 1 at all. A mix of better cgi rendering and different locations may have given a slightly different look, but I never felt for one minute that it wasn't the same world.
They weren't saying the world was actually different, but just that the tone of the world was different.
It would be great if you could do a video on X-men, and how they're an allegory for minorities! Great content as always :)
If you ask me, with the way things are going in the real word, we need them more than ever. These movies are what we need right now.
Yes, I've heard that All For One guy is crazy.
I think Brad Bird said that he wasn’t deliberately trying to reference any real world political discussion and that any connections people might have seen was all just coincidental? He said that he began throwing around ideas as soon as he was finished the first movie and that it’d be cool to have Bob and Helen’s roles switched for a potential sequel.
Whatever “political” message people might be seeing is mostly in their head.
I agree, people read a bit too much into things.
Superhero stories are inherently moral and political. They're all about doing the right thing.
Genevieve1023 Superhero movies can tackle certain themes without touching any current day political topics. For instance, the original Star Wars trilogy was always about good vs evil, but it never outright addressed or picked sides along the contemporary political spectrum. It was what it was. At most, you could see the empire as being a shorthand to the Soviet Union and their authoritarian and collectivist ideology, but at most the story strayed away from modern day political discussion.
You can be politically neutral and still tell a good story.
mannystella Star Wars isn't a superhero movie.
Genevieve1023 Doesn’t matter. It’s still a story of good vs evil which is capable of telling its story without resorting to referencing real world politics.
For me incredibles 2 is about finding what makes you you and using those skills to help others
Can’t afford to donate to you girls as of right now, but I absolutely love every video essay y’all do. Keep it up! 🎉🎉
Syndrome wasn't wrong about everyone being super, but he took it in a literal and destructive matter by both stealing and having the disire to be worshipped, even lying in a devastating way where it was chaos and madness.
Screenslaver on the other hand wasn't wrong about relying and getting too much help from others, but it was also in a literal and destructive matter as well, by using deception and manipulative methods for a horrendous outcome.
Now Syndrome was narcissistic and full of vanity and was willing to sacrifice others for his own achievement. Mr. Incredible was a little like that too in the present day, but eventually he was coming to his senses and all it took was his family to help him remember he is suppose to be saving lives and being better...or super. Heh
Screenslaver was too obsessed with the well being of only yourself and to make others feel helpless and abandoned even thinking it was for another's own good by keeping them safe away from harm by doing nothing. Elastagirl was a little like that too with her family and others, but eventually her own family came to her rescue and were inspired by her actions to take action and to make a difference, even other supers were inspired, Mr. Deavor too. Mr. Deavor insured he didn't make the same mistake as his parent did when no action was taking against the robbers where no one including the police were not coming to their aid.
It depends. They should make you want to change society for the better. To help people, or to help those that are, if you can not find a cause.
Yes great stuff as usual. I can't wait to see you guys tackles the Mission Impossible series.
Love your videos! This one is fantastic, right after watching Incredibles 2!
okay well it just became suddenly apparent that there is going to be a ton of spoilers in this and as the only person who hasn't seen this movie yet I should just put this in my watch later list so i can enjoy it later have a wonderful day everyone
The screen slaver part, very relatable. So relatable that we're ignoring the damage we've done to ourselves and it renders our freewill to have order of our own.
I don't know why but all of your videos make me cry... in a good way :)
Core movie was so good.. The actual actions of the villian/yhird act really really didn't elevate the movie. Thanks for the video highlighted those gems so well
Wow! Amazing commentary. Thank you
Two videos in two days. Screen Prism is on a roll.
If you watch nothing but marvel movies then the answer would be no, we don't need superheroes. There's nothing inspiring about marvel heroes and marvel films. The "heroes" are barely heroes and cause a lot of problems themselves, especially tony stark. If you've watched DC movies however, and I mean actually watched them with some kind of intelligence, then the answer would be yes, we do need superheros. DC heroes are inspirational and give us hope. DC movies show that while we see them as gods they're really just as human as the rest of us. They love, they make mistakes, they get angry, they fall, they hope, they dream, they're us but more. They're what we can become, and superman embodies this completely.
Marvel's heroes are meant to be more human. Real humans. With actual faults. Unlikable DC's unrealistic fairytale garbage. Superheroes are fairytale garbage anyway.
@@learn2draw716 Moron shut the fuck up. DC heroes are meant to be inspirations, which is what superheroes should be. They're supposed to inspire people to be better and that's exactly what they do. They're the most human characters in the genre, marvel's garbage doesn't compare. Especially since marvel and their characters are the poor man's version of DC. Pull your head out of your own ass.
i thought the movie was lackluster tbh. As soon as Evelyn came on screen, I was like "oh well she's obviously the villain" and every subsequent moment from then on had me thinking the same thing, she was obviously screen slaver. Every bit of dialogue & obvious attempts at manipulation & manifesting conflict....it was so obvious. But I was waiting for Disney to "subvert my expectations", It was too obvious they were trying to make her "a villain who you don't know is the villain" so obvious that I was waiting for the twist that she wasn't actually the villain.....but then she was.
very predictable. not a bad movie, but not great, not worth the 14 year wait that's for sure.
meow meow is the goal of this movie to subvert expectations or to teach and inspire. I, too, knew she was the villain early on but that didn't take away from the movie experience because the central action of the film was the legal status of heroes and their family.
Lindsay Ellis did a video called Are Disney Villains Going Extinct a year and a half ago that explains this phenomenon. A lot of the modern Disney movies have the “villain you don’t know is the villain” thing going on rather than the classic shamelessly evil villains of the Disney Princess days. It has to do with modern attitudes shifting about good vs. evil, how we should be teaching people that no one is strictly good or strictly evil, there are shades of grey. However, I don’t think they should get rid of the Maleficents and Gastons entirely. People are becoming so used to the surprise villain reveal that it’s no longer a surprise. Why not have a Disney movie where the villain becomes the hero? (Oh wait, Despicable Me and Megamind already did that. But there’s got to be plenty of other ways to utilize that trope, rather than just using a “super villain”, right?) Or have the white knight hero of the film lose and get proved wrong by the villain in the end? THAT would be a twist. Anything but another surprise villain reveal...
Sly Bacon i can't stand Lindsey she's so ungodly pretentious
AvgJane19 The goal of the film is to make money. Just because you were ~inspired~ by it doesn't mean someone else isn't allowed to criticise what they see as poor characterisation or predictability. The "goal" of the movie is to make money, which they did, it's not to inspire or teach. Beyond that, Disney or more specifically the people who work on it, wants it to be a good film, I explained why I didn't think it was.
I'm confused by what you're trying to imply with your comment, "the central action of the film was the legal status of the heros"....even if it was how does that nullify criticism of other aspects of the movie?
If you disagree with me, fine, explain why and we can have a fun discourse but your comment seems to be more about your anger at my audacity at sharing my opinion of the film....on a movie review comment page....because god forbid anyone not like a movie you like.
meow meow
Okay. I'll take you up on your money debate. *cracks neck*
Although money is an end goal/ by product of a movie, I would argue its not the central theme. Because if it was they would not need to try so hard with the story nor wait so long, and maybe not even give it good graphics. Especially for this movie.
See, people have been asking, praying and BEGGING for this sequel for 14 years. The hype alone was enough for any adult in their mid-20's to buy a ticket. There was a meme as soon as it was announced that joked that the adults would push the kids out of the way to see the movie. Because we've been waiting so much longer. So Picar could have EASILY ripped us off. Give us something mediocre , and people would still have had a decent time and spend the money.
But Pixar has always been (with the exception of Cars franchise) about telling good and interesting stories. From their first to latest film, they want to give interesting perspectives and good writing. Had they wanted to just get our money they would have just given in and given us an Incredibles 2 four years after the first movie, or less. And work off a third rate script. But they took time with this story, with the graphics, and updated its technology and released something that would be special. That was worth the wait. Sure it's Disney and they need to get the money back, but like the Lego Movie, that would have happened no matter what they did with this project. So instead they decided to give us something good.
There are so many other movies out there that just want to rip you off and get the cash back. Like Suicide Squad as an example. It tugs at comic book nostalgia, tries to copy what Marvel did but without thought or structure, and throws a few good songs in there and quirky (read: not GOOD) characters that are currently popular in comic sales, and hope it goes well. (Plus a few cameos.) This movie knows it will get money back, so it doesn't try that hard. Heck its also well known that Warner Brothers doesn't actually care about DC movies, and it shows. The DCCU "franchise" IS a joke. The reason we didn't get a Batman movie out of it, is because Ben Affleck was so mad at not getting a proper script/ good story, that he completely abandoned the directing roll/ anything to do with it until a proper story was in place. And even a person who likes these movies (Me. I like them a lot.) Can realise there are a LOT of problems with the story telling, characterizations and SOOO MUCH MORE because these movies end goals are purely money related (Aside from WONDER WOMAN. THAT MOVIE WAS AMAZING!!!!!!!!) instead of focused on creating good stories.
So yes. Pixar's "Incredibles 2" is not just meant to make money and it was not its central point. It's main objective, was to weave an interesting and good story about a family of Super Heroes.
"Everyone can be super... and when everyone's super, no one will be."
Love you new narrator, keep up the great work
yes we do. Superheroes are super. and that oliver sansweet is a real jerk for started the sued the supers and for having the supers going underground. if he is still alive I hope oliver sansweet will get turned into a clayface like villain.
I still feel as though the family dynamic was missing in this film. Bob and Helen were the main POVs for this film, somewhat to the first one but I felt more distant from the kids. It was a good film overall to me but certain things did cause me to lose interest.
Pierre Gilson I agree my main issue with the films is that if it's suppose to be so family centered, it needs to divide up among the family evenly, at least with the older kids, just my opinion though
ArronZ M. In the first one third solo scenes, for the children, are absolutely brilliant, for me they took center stage. They attempted to emulate that on the second one when they were on the boat but it lacked the growth I gained from watching the characters on the first one. That's a sequel problem at the end of the day because the newness isn't there. In the second one ot seemed like all the kids were there for was to cater to and help progress Bob's narrative. More of a supporting role for that plots protagonist. Whether it had to deal with Violent's love debacle, Jack Jack's powers, or Dash kinda coasting by throughout the story, he mostly did homework. It did not feel real to me but a story that was predictable within then first 15 minutes. I enjoyed it but I expected more.
Pierre Gilson agreed
It felt like an inferior movie almost in every apartment but the comedy.
screenprism always asking the real questions
THANK YOU for addressing how different this movie felt. It seemed like it could have happened in a different world, to me.
Yes, yes we do
It is official, you guys are the best!
I really liked that ending. Amazing video
you are awesome! keep up the good work...
the first half of the movie seemed to gearing up to make for a worthy sequel. bob and helen's opposing views on changing the status quo, the subversion of gender roles, and screenslaver as a concept promised a great film
unfortunately, the kids arcs were far too inconsequential, jack-jack was overplayed, and most importantly the finale blew harder than fellatio from bomb voyage. (spoilers) you're telling me you have someone smart enough to create mass scale mind control and she decides to come up with the worst plan to accomplish nothing for nobody
animation great jokes good 5/5 masterpiece
Another good essay, guys! Could watch these all day. Only, I think there's a lot to make of male vs female perception in Incredibles 2. Surprised you never touched on it. The movie's filled with latent reminders and examples of where men & women's schools of thought come to conflict and compromise. The dynamics between Bob & Helen as well as Evelyn & Winston really reflect the state of gender's perception and influence; which links back to your points on branding and image. Possibly another essay altogether???
No matter what happens the concept of superheroes will never die but will instead evolve to fit the modern audience we'd rather hero's that we can relate to instead of Superman who is like a god with no true personality! .
Gosh some RUclips channels say Incredibles 2 played it too safe to that I say watch this video!!!
I just realized how dumb there dad was, why didn't he call the cops if he knew superheroes were now illegal😂😭
Thank you for this. The values and being there as a family set, even when we feel like doing other things, is something I need to hear in my life right now. As for Screenslaver and superheroes, I'd like to think these movies are an optimistic way to motive people, I agree with what you said. Even though it's ironic when we're all watching this on a screen lol. With people like Alexandria Cortez and Dorthy Gasque getting voted in, progressives, I believe our next generation can change the future.
Love your channel. Any chance of getting Six feet under videos? My fav show.
These movies are less about supers and more about family. Even though it is less obvious in 2 it is still very much a husband and wife doing what they can to raise their kids in a way they feel is right. Even when tough times strike, it is the interactions between the family members that make or break the situation they are in. Our perception as an audience changed, the movie theme did not. We will always need family films that feel honest and down to earth, even sat in among cliche writing, and childish animation. The question of if we need supers, is really rather irrelevant...
you could say this about every genre of musics and entertainment in general.
i missed a nod towards alan moore who paed the way for all this debate with his take on the joker and wachtmen
So you guys are explaining the ideas of the Watchmen from Alan Moore. Kind does not surprise me because Bard Bird took heavily influences from Watchmen.
Can you review "Sorry To Bother You"? I really want to hear your thoughts on that film!
Tropical Malady analysis next
Craig T. Nelson has to deal with his movie children disappearing into an ethereal plane *again.* (See Poltergeist ,1982)
DO HUNTCHBACK OF NOTRE DAME PLEASE!!!!!!!
i rlly like the background music. what is it called?
I came here as fast as I could!!
The world is in fact not post truth, no matter how much postmodernist neomarxist university professors want us to believe that.
People were always prone to being influenced by fancy sounding but factually incorrect rethoric.
The burden is on the one engainig in the rethoric to ensure its validity.
You should make a video about vaas from far cry 3 why do people love him so much considering he is not even the main villain in the game
Consider the fact that the Superman Comic was born in the 1930's.
This is great :D Could you please do more house symbolisms for the Hogwarts houses? I myself is a Hufflepuff :)
You gotta love Pixar for making movies that anyone can enjoy on several levels!
For those who wonder why most of the new supers are rather weak in comparison i'd point you to the fact syndrome tested his omnibots on likely the strongest supers to prepare it for Mr. Increadable and likely didn't see fit to include these supers as test subjects.
Mmmmmh...incredible stew!
Amazing video
Yea this will lead more to fight for what they care.
PLEASE DO MR ROBOT
Do a video about Billions Bobby Axelrod
It's nice to hear that they at least hired Saul Goodman as their Attorney/Public Relations Manager.
It was pettiness that really caused the superhero ban in the first film.
there are some very interesting points made in this video but I disagree with your reference to Syndrome at 12:48, he's not saying "everyone is super (period)" but that everyone will be super with the use of his technology so that when everyone is super, no one is. it just weakened whatever argument that was being made when you forced a quote where it wasn't accurate. I don't mean to "um actually" you but come on
Gary Vaynerchuk is my hero
Look him up
We don't, but we will definitely take advantage of it.
Both
We do. That’s the answer
the question we should be asking is if the police force or army are gonna be obsolete like knights and warriors in a world full of Superheroes
Trixie Rubberhose no because they're not enough supers to substitute every cop,and not everything needs a super to be solved.
Just BØNY good point
it depends on how many people are hero's. if lets say 9/10 people have powers at which point being powerless is practically a disability. then conventional police forces are pretty much useless. yet if only 4/10 people have powers then you still need conventional law enforcement. the other thing to consider is how powerful your powered community is since some powers can feasibly be countered by one guy tackling you at the right time .
Debra looks a little bit like amy from big bang
MATH IS MATH
Wa wait a minute James McGill is in The Incredible II? whaaaaaaaaaaaa the fuck
Pld do Frida
Finally someone who understands that this movie is everything but a cashgrab
What is the song you used in this video?
good video
Bob odenkirk looks creepy animated.
I dont mean to be ocd but susannah is always on the left.
Please make a Sense8 video!!!!!
love you videos girls
I definitely wouldn’t call it non violent protests. There is definitely some violence
do we still need new incredibles moives?
Is it just me or is there a new narrator?
anybody knows a good book to read about these theories?
oh my god, so confused by the new voice, I still really like the content, but the voice is going to take a while to get used to. Susannah where are you??
Change the voice please
Is Debra narrating?
I thought it was an allegory for the reprrssion of sexual minorities
Fred Rogers is a real-life Super.
Riot Breaker *was
Grace Haven his legacy didn't die with him.
Riot Breaker no ur right
Elastigirl's exaggerated hips make me remember the exaggerated skirts of the 1860s. Maybe both are searching for a lost femininity.
I hate escapist garbage
200th like!