I agree. Fishing my 6'6" rod in my local stream is a pain. I'd love to fish a longer rod - unfortunately, the vegetation cover is such that I couldn't carry a 9'-10' rod in there, let alone cast it! Even casting opportunities with the short rod are severely limited. I'd suggest not all Small Streams are created equal (something you do acknowledge in your introductory remarks).
Well, different strokes for different folks. I enjoy fishing many small streams in the Rockies that are willow bound and lined with large pines. I also concentrate of fishing dry flys. I find 6 1/2' to 7 1/2' perfect for these situations. Then again, I don't nymph fish much in these waters because they are generally fairly shallow with the deep holes only 4' deep and most the water 1 1/2' to 3' and most places it's not even 9' wide. And those fish are opportunistic and looking up. I will tell you, unless you stayed back away from the bank and dabbed your fly, while poking your rod through the bushes, you couldn't do much with your 10' rod. One thing for sure if you lifted straight up with your 10', the tip would be in the trees.
Sounds like the creeks I fish in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. They are just choked with vegetation on the banks. I’ll try the longer rod, but I’m not sure I could do it.
Interesting. Our streams around here aren’t like that nor are the fest western anal streams I have fished, but you can bet when I find a stream like you’re describing I’ll attempt it with a long rod and maybe learn my lesson the hard way haha.
@@ChrisBeanFishingGuide I’ve left a lot of flies on those banks over the years, even with a short rod! 😉 You have given me a reason to buy a new rod though. You may get a call from my wife.
I have been using a 10' rod for awhile now on our east TN streams. I thought it was just going to be frustrating to use but really has been easy. I can reach through most anything and my bow and arrow cast is much more accurate. I do use a mono rig system so that keeps the fly line from pulling back through the guides. The biggest difference has been when the next pool is above me, I can just reach up with the rod and fish the lower portion without exposing myself or shadow to the fish. I tell people that are hesitant that it's one of those things that doesn't make sense in your head until you actually try it. :)
@@mattiasdahlstrom2024 I just rig straps on the side to carry it low in the case. My back packing rod is an 8' just because of size, it's a compromise but still works well. If it's a day trip with the 10', I carry it in my hand in 2 pieces with a rod sleeve that's meant for a bass rod.
@@mattiasdahlstrom2024 On the rare occasions that I bushwhack with one on my pack, it is always in a rod tube. However I typically carry the rod already rigged up, pointing straight in front of me, that way I can see to thread it through all the brush.
I have a 4' - practice rod that I attached a reel on with electrical tape. I can actually throw a loop with the tip pointing to the ground. It also loads a bow-cast with much more control. I can also do a lunge-cast with small rods - like a roll-cast that doesn't slap so much line on the water. Short rods allow for more line for casting given a certain length of line and leader unwound at the reel, so I can shoot more line. I've been using an Eagle Claw Classic Glass 5.5' with a 5wt line - my all-around dry fly set-up lately. A heavy line can make up for the lack of power and reach (shortness). I really like not having many guides on a rod to deal with every time I break-down during an angling-hike. I do like actual fly rods. My 6.6' 2wt is a nice all-around. It backpacks okay. Long rods are nice in tight scenarios. But, they demand a bit more from the operator. My buddy used to trade rods about mid-afternoon, or at the perfect spot - because we both knew that his set-up was like a Buick land yacht, and mine was like a pickup with a solid-beam-axle up front. Like why am I using this opportunity to try out my junk-equipment?
Chris, this is as really good video and well rounded, thanks. On my mountain streams in VA my two go to rods are a 5’6 and 6’8”, but occassionally I will use 9’ foot in winter due to more overhead room to high stick nymphs. For dries I don’t think small rod is a hinderance if you know how to cast, lay out line and use lite tippet, as a matter of fact with dries I prefer short. Feeder creeks demand smallest rod and with low pressure lots of fun. I never brought my 10’6” euro in winter but might be a lot of fun and will give it a try, especially on deeper pools. I think people need to understand their small streams before selecting rod as small streams as you discuss are all different. Example, I fished above Cherokee NC for first time earlier this year and thought it would be like my high mountain streams. I brought my 5’6” bamboo and my local buddy had 9’. My buddy did much better. I realized early I had wrong rod but I was very suprised how much casting room, both behind and above, your mountain streams are compared to VA, your rivers have even much more room to cast or swing rod than even southern western NC above GA when you are fighting the thick ronadondron (horrible spelling). Anyway, great video to gives us small rod guys good food for thought. For me best rod is the appropriate rod for the situation, I guess this is the reason we need and have multiple rods, but a shorter glass or bamboo rod for dries is just perfect to me.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! I like your point about knowing how to cast and lay out line. It was recently pointed out to me by a friend and fly shop owner that starting somebody off with a long rod gives them the option to become a one trick pony with high sticking and never learnt this complex casting. However, I do feel that you can also learn and use this type of complex casting with a long rod. If you start with a 10’ rod and never learn to cast like this, that is your own fault, not the rod’s, and not the fault of the person who suggested the rod to you. I do agree with you that learning to make these complex casts and drifts without high sticking is very important skill, and to be honest, it’s often more fun than high sticking. This is why I often fish an 8’8” rod in my free time, even knowing I would be more effective on my streams with a 10’ rod. In my area I feel that both of these skills are important. I find that on my streams, many situations can be handled with a long or short rod with equal effectiveness. However I certainly encounter many more situations here where a 10’ does the job better than a short rod than I encounter the inverse situation. If you are a novice in my area a 10’ rod is far more effective, but MOST of that gap in efficacy can be closed with advanced casting skills. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts. I love hearing well articulated counter arguments. It helps me to better understand my own stance as well as the issue as a whole!
Im certainly not opposed to a longer stick, however I have an overlined 7ft glass 4wt that stays in the truck. It's handy and it's enjoyable to fish with, at least for me.
I agree 8’4 2 weight is my favorite but I overload using 3 wt line sometimes 9’6 5 wt is my next choice for most Trout fishing I use a 7’9 4wt in some tight spots I show friends the difference in these lengths on the stream still they fish 6 to 7 footers A 10/0 5 is my next rod
I make my own rods, design them. I fish small streams very well for 30+ yrs and get 30-40 fish in an afternoon. Yes, I can hit a pie pan with 40-45" 20x in a row with my 8' 3# roll cast or back cast. Orvis now makes an 8" 3#. I was using my 7.5' 3# on really small creeks. I do have bigger rods, I design the rod for each stream, got over 15 rods, glass, bamboo, "plastic".
If you need the extra length and have the space to mend straight off the water then more power to you, but more often than not when I fish small, choked up brookie streams here in SWVA the mending I do is very limited, and forget about back casting 90% of the time. An overlined 6 foot rod on a small stream roll casts tight loops under overhanging greenery like nothing else (as long as the leader is short enough), and when you're standing in rushing water below a 2 square foot pool you're fishing, you wont spook anything anyway, even being even 8 ft away high sticking it with a short rod. Not like a large fly with a dropper really will drag all that much over such a short distance anyway. Am i thinking of smaller water than you're talking about? Maybe in a stream >10ft wide I can see the benefits of wanting a 10ft nymphing rod, where mending matters and its not just rapid water adjacent to small pools from rocks etc. But then again you say this advice applies to high gradient mountain streams, just some thoughts.
It sounds like you are talking about smaller streams than what I am mostly referring to here, although I believe it still applies to a smaller scale. When fishing streams like you’re describing in my area, I usually use an 8.5’ rod. I use these longer rods for the reach, but not for mending purposes. We do very little mending. We use this reach for a technique called “high sticking” in which we lift all of the line and leader off the water. Your proximity to the pool you’re fishing being the same, the longer your rod is, the more line you can pick up without dragging your fly. I do think that unless you’re blessed with very laminar flow in your streams, or unless you can keep all of your casts landing with fly, leader, and fly line all in the same current lane (i.e. a true direct upstream presentation), it is worth while to manage your drift either through mending or high sticking. If you land a cast with the leaders straight, and any part of your line is laying in current that is conflicting with the current your fly is in, your fly will drag to some degree weather you can see it or not. And it will do so pretty much immediately if your line straightened out. Maybe you are blessed with streams where you truly aren’t getting drag or maybe blessed with fish who don’t care, but here, we have neither haha. And then there are other scenarios like casting over a pour-over, which to my knowledge can’t be overcome by anything method except high sticking.
10-11’ all day for small streams. Haven’t seen anyone publicly stand behind this, it’s a very underrated means of fishing. I have a lot of people surprised by this, but if you give it a shot I’m sure it would be shockingly better than expected.
If I had a longer rod, I need a shorter leader. Eventually, there isn't much fly line to cast, so holding the rod upright simply pulls line back to the reel - shorter rod. Too hard to move around the stream with long rods - vegetation.
that's where tenkara shines... it's awesome on big water too... but a 12 to 13 foot rod is perfect for brookie fishing in the Pennsylvania mountain streams... 👍
![ROSÉ(로제) - APT. (Band VER.) (With. 이영지) [더 시즌즈-이영지의 레인보우] | KBS 241129 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IW8qaemx74g/mqdefault.jpg)
You said it right at the end. “Unless I’m trying to have fun” well that’s all I’m trying to do and fishing drys on my little 7’6” 3wt is a lot of fun
He obviously thinks he knows better than us. I love my 6' 3 wt.
I agree. Fishing my 6'6" rod in my local stream is a pain. I'd love to fish a longer rod - unfortunately, the vegetation cover is such that I couldn't carry a 9'-10' rod in there, let alone cast it! Even casting opportunities with the short rod are severely limited. I'd suggest not all Small Streams are created equal (something you do acknowledge in your introductory remarks).
Well, different strokes for different folks. I enjoy fishing many small streams in the Rockies that are willow bound and lined with large pines. I also concentrate of fishing dry flys. I find 6 1/2' to 7 1/2' perfect for these situations. Then again, I don't nymph fish much in these waters because they are generally fairly shallow with the deep holes only 4' deep and most the water 1 1/2' to 3' and most places it's not even 9' wide. And those fish are opportunistic and looking up. I will tell you, unless you stayed back away from the bank and dabbed your fly, while poking your rod through the bushes, you couldn't do much with your 10' rod. One thing for sure if you lifted straight up with your 10', the tip would be in the trees.
Sounds like the creeks I fish in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. They are just choked with vegetation on the banks. I’ll try the longer rod, but I’m not sure I could do it.
Interesting. Our streams around here aren’t like that nor are the fest western anal streams I have fished, but you can bet when I find a stream like you’re describing I’ll attempt it with a long rod and maybe learn my lesson the hard way haha.
@@ChrisBeanFishingGuide I’ve left a lot of flies on those banks over the years, even with a short rod! 😉 You have given me a reason to buy a new rod though. You may get a call from my wife.
@@Rooster0529 I’ll take full responsibility for that
Ive been flyfishing 64 years. You fish what you want and I'll fish my 6' er.
64 years and you still haven't learned anything.🤣
It was a fee country until guys like you decided you know better.@@steveyates1136
He's probably forgotten more than you'll ever know. LOL
I have been using a 10' rod for awhile now on our east TN streams. I thought it was just going to be frustrating to use but really has been easy. I can reach through most anything and my bow and arrow cast is much more accurate. I do use a mono rig system so that keeps the fly line from pulling back through the guides. The biggest difference has been when the next pool is above me, I can just reach up with the rod and fish the lower portion without exposing myself or shadow to the fish. I tell people that are hesitant that it's one of those things that doesn't make sense in your head until you actually try it. :)
Yes! Everyone is surprised by it, but by the end of the day they don’t want to fish the 8.5 anymore, they only want to fish the 10’.
Some idiot I know broke one of his rods tied to his backpack while bushwhacking. How do you protect your rods, asking for this friend..
@@mattiasdahlstrom2024 I just rig straps on the side to carry it low in the case. My back packing rod is an 8' just because of size, it's a compromise but still works well.
If it's a day trip with the 10', I carry it in my hand in 2 pieces with a rod sleeve that's meant for a bass rod.
@@mattiasdahlstrom2024 On the rare occasions that I bushwhack with one on my pack, it is always in a rod tube. However I typically carry the rod already rigged up, pointing straight in front of me, that way I can see to thread it through all the brush.
I have a 4' - practice rod that I attached a reel on with electrical tape. I can actually throw a loop with the tip pointing to the ground. It also loads a bow-cast with much more control. I can also do a lunge-cast with small rods - like a roll-cast that doesn't slap so much line on the water. Short rods allow for more line for casting given a certain length of line and leader unwound at the reel, so I can shoot more line.
I've been using an Eagle Claw Classic Glass 5.5' with a 5wt line - my all-around dry fly set-up lately. A heavy line can make up for the lack of power and reach (shortness). I really like not having many guides on a rod to deal with every time I break-down during an angling-hike.
I do like actual fly rods. My 6.6' 2wt is a nice all-around. It backpacks okay.
Long rods are nice in tight scenarios. But, they demand a bit more from the operator. My buddy used to trade rods about mid-afternoon, or at the perfect spot - because we both knew that his set-up was like a Buick land yacht, and mine was like a pickup with a solid-beam-axle up front. Like why am I using this opportunity to try out my junk-equipment?
Chris, this is as really good video and well rounded, thanks. On my mountain streams in VA my two go to rods are a 5’6 and 6’8”, but occassionally I will use 9’ foot in winter due to more overhead room to high stick nymphs. For dries I don’t think small rod is a hinderance if you know how to cast, lay out line and use lite tippet, as a matter of fact with dries I prefer short. Feeder creeks demand smallest rod and with low pressure lots of fun. I never brought my 10’6” euro in winter but might be a lot of fun and will give it a try, especially on deeper pools.
I think people need to understand their small streams before selecting rod as small streams as you discuss are all different. Example, I fished above Cherokee NC for first time earlier this year and thought it would be like my high mountain streams. I brought my 5’6” bamboo and my local buddy had 9’. My buddy did much better. I realized early I had wrong rod but I was very suprised how much casting room, both behind and above, your mountain streams are compared to VA, your rivers have even much more room to cast or swing rod than even southern western NC above GA when you are fighting the thick ronadondron (horrible spelling).
Anyway, great video to gives us small rod guys good food for thought. For me best rod is the appropriate rod for the situation, I guess this is the reason we need and have multiple rods, but a shorter glass or bamboo rod for dries is just perfect to me.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! I like your point about knowing how to cast and lay out line. It was recently pointed out to me by a friend and fly shop owner that starting somebody off with a long rod gives them the option to become a one trick pony with high sticking and never learnt this complex casting. However, I do feel that you can also learn and use this type of complex casting with a long rod. If you start with a 10’ rod and never learn to cast like this, that is your own fault, not the rod’s, and not the fault of the person who suggested the rod to you.
I do agree with you that learning to make these complex casts and drifts without high sticking is very important skill, and to be honest, it’s often more fun than high sticking. This is why I often fish an 8’8” rod in my free time, even knowing I would be more effective on my streams with a 10’ rod. In my area I feel that both of these skills are important.
I find that on my streams, many situations can be handled with a long or short rod with equal effectiveness. However I certainly encounter many more situations here where a 10’ does the job better than a short rod than I encounter the inverse situation.
If you are a novice in my area a 10’ rod is far more effective, but MOST of that gap in efficacy can be closed with advanced casting skills. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts. I love hearing well articulated counter arguments. It helps me to better understand my own stance as well as the issue as a whole!
Im certainly not opposed to a longer stick, however I have an overlined 7ft glass 4wt that stays in the truck. It's handy and it's enjoyable to fish with, at least for me.
Interesting points thanks
Thanks for watching
I agree
8’4 2 weight is my favorite but I overload using 3 wt line sometimes
9’6 5 wt is my next choice for most Trout fishing
I use a 7’9 4wt in some tight spots
I show friends the difference in these lengths on the stream still they fish 6 to 7 footers
A 10/0 5 is my next rod
I make my own rods, design them. I fish small streams very well for 30+ yrs and get 30-40 fish in an afternoon. Yes, I can hit a pie pan with 40-45" 20x in a row with my 8' 3# roll cast or back cast. Orvis now makes an 8" 3#. I was using my 7.5' 3# on really small creeks. I do have bigger rods, I design the rod for each stream, got over 15 rods, glass, bamboo, "plastic".
i always bring a sub 7' 3wt scott glass and a 10'6 2wt euro rod on all my appalachian blueline adventures. Best of both worlds
I’ve never been able to make the two rod thing work when I’m fishing for myself. Sounds like you’ve got a good system down though.
@@ChrisBeanFishingGuide yeah but I totally agree with what you’re saying especially if you’re bringing a single rod. I just love fishing the glass.
I do too. It’s the only reason I have a 7’ 3wt haha.
If you need the extra length and have the space to mend straight off the water then more power to you, but more often than not when I fish small, choked up brookie streams here in SWVA the mending I do is very limited, and forget about back casting 90% of the time. An overlined 6 foot rod on a small stream roll casts tight loops under overhanging greenery like nothing else (as long as the leader is short enough), and when you're standing in rushing water below a 2 square foot pool you're fishing, you wont spook anything anyway, even being even 8 ft away high sticking it with a short rod. Not like a large fly with a dropper really will drag all that much over such a short distance anyway.
Am i thinking of smaller water than you're talking about? Maybe in a stream >10ft wide I can see the benefits of wanting a 10ft nymphing rod, where mending matters and its not just rapid water adjacent to small pools from rocks etc. But then again you say this advice applies to high gradient mountain streams, just some thoughts.
It sounds like you are talking about smaller streams than what I am mostly referring to here, although I believe it still applies to a smaller scale. When fishing streams like you’re describing in my area, I usually use an 8.5’ rod. I use these longer rods for the reach, but not for mending purposes. We do very little mending. We use this reach for a technique called “high sticking” in which we lift all of the line and leader off the water. Your proximity to the pool you’re fishing being the same, the longer your rod is, the more line you can pick up without dragging your fly. I do think that unless you’re blessed with very laminar flow in your streams, or unless you can keep all of your casts landing with fly, leader, and fly line all in the same current lane (i.e. a true direct upstream presentation), it is worth while to manage your drift either through mending or high sticking. If you land a cast with the leaders straight, and any part of your line is laying in current that is conflicting with the current your fly is in, your fly will drag to some degree weather you can see it or not. And it will do so pretty much immediately if your line straightened out. Maybe you are blessed with streams where you truly aren’t getting drag or maybe blessed with fish who don’t care, but here, we have neither haha. And then there are other scenarios like casting over a pour-over, which to my knowledge can’t be overcome by anything method except high sticking.
Agreed. I overline my 7 footer. Works for me.
What ya using to hang them rods behind you?
Just command hooks lol
10-11’ all day for small streams. Haven’t seen anyone publicly stand behind this, it’s a very underrated means of fishing. I have a lot of people surprised by this, but if you give it a shot I’m sure it would be shockingly better than expected.
If I had a longer rod, I need a shorter leader. Eventually, there isn't much fly line to cast, so holding the rod upright simply pulls line back to the reel - shorter rod. Too hard to move around the stream with long rods - vegetation.
Yes I often fish very short leaders in these tiny streams
that's where tenkara shines... it's awesome on big water too... but a 12 to 13 foot rod is perfect for brookie fishing in the Pennsylvania mountain streams... 👍
Never tried it, but I’m glad it’s working well for you!
Tenkara is my safe word. 🤣
nope.