Regarding brake controllers, there are two types. First is a time delay type that has a gain and sensitivity wheel. These are designed to allow the selected time from tow vehicle brake application to vary before the trailer brakes apply. This system also then applies the fixed voltage level to be applied to the brake magnets. Typically this system will allow for good braking when at highway speeds and very aggressive braking at slow speed. Very annoying. The second type of brake controller is an INERTIA type, typically with a pendulum inside. This gives you modulated braking, meaning lower voltages are sent to the brakes during slower stopping and full voltage to be applied during hard braking. Tekonsha makes an excellent controller, the P3 with the ability to work on several different types of trailer braking systems. I hope this helps anyone with the old style controller. Upgrade your controller and you will be pleasantly surprised.
Thanks Kenny for showing this. I have never messed with electrical brakes. This was very informative to me. I had no idea that they use the drum it self to put on the brakes after the magnet is energized and latches on to the drum. I wonder who came up with this idea? I know that electrical brakes have been around for a long time. Thanks again for your knowledge and know how. Keep filming.
Thanks Kenny. i learned something today. I've never come across this type of braking system so it was really interesting to learn about. I more familiar with the mechanical tow hitch operated brakes. I'm assuming the power source would be linked through the brake light circuit to avoid needing an extra pin in the hitch plug.
Greases compatibility is it's own rabbit hole. But it's usually not about the base oil in the grease, it's about the thickener. Maybe the additive package, but thickener compatibility comes first. To keep it simple, there are 3 main thickeners out there that are being used in automotive industry: - lithium complex (the most common one) - calcium sulfonate complex (gaining popularity day by day) - polyurea (stuff from the factory usually is packed with it, like U-joints and some bearings) The first two are more or less compatible (Li and Ca), meaning you can pump the old Li complex with a Ca one, just don't switch the grease each time you pump. The issue comes with polyurea - mixing it with pretty much anything else is a bad way to go. The mix can either soften or harden depending on the specific combination, but it's a bad day both ways. I highly advise just washing whatever part you're regreasing with clean gasoline until it's free of old grease and just repack it with a new one you're using. Also, polyurea has it's own distinct consistency and feel, compared to Li and Ca (complex) greases. It's kinda more gelatinous, while the latter two are more similar to a thick ketchup or a tomato paste, pardon the food analogy :)
That's worth knowing. I'm a little surprised to hear that a U joint would be packed with something incompatible with typical grease. The first thing I do when I install a U joint is add grease....
The other thing about compatibility of the greases is they will be actually corrosive if you mix different bases...as well as breakdown or hardening up. I've seen this, but in aircraft stuff. There's lots of different grease bases used in that environment for exacting, specific purposes. We are actually in good shape so far as automotive wheel bearings and stuff on auto applications as all we need to do is totally remove all grease and only use one type..
It's because polyurea is a good choice when a manufacturer makes a part that will likely be either uncerviceable (u joints without zerks) or people being people won't pump it even if it has one. It's great when it comes to rejecting water, doesn't wash out as easy as Li-based greases. The problem comes when the base oil eventually dries out - the seals on the u joint eventually lose that thin coat of oily grease, starts rubbing directly on metal, water/dirt gets under the seal and the part fails due to abrasion and corrosion. So yeah, if you do your repairs/maintenance properly it's a good idea to buy parts with zerks, clean the factory grease with gas, dry them, pack with new grease of choice that you know is gonna be compatible with future pumps, assemble and pump again. Used tooth brushes are your friends :)
Calcium Grease ,Lithium Grease ,Aluminum Complex Grease ,Barium Complex Grease ,Bentone (Clay) Grease , Polyurea Grease ,Polyurea Grease ,soap grease, When I was a young man working in the lead and gold zinc mines in the Yukon at Anvil mines at the town of Faro they mixed greases on a huge electric shovel the tracks didn't last 1/2 a mile walking to the next dig site ,cost them 1 million dollars to repair tracks pins bushings, that was in 1970 the head maintenance planer was fired ,and we told them don't do it was a cost cutting idea .
Years ago i was on the interstate. Saw something come across the divider and bounce down my lane. A wheel and tire combo. I dive to another lane watch the wheel as i pass it still bouncing nearly cab hight and across the interstate i see a truck with a empty car trailer coming to a stop on the shoulder smoke coming off the spindle. I needed clean shorts and i bet others did to
Great job Kenny doing a thorough inspection. Let me point out regarding greasing the hub through the zerk on the spindle, that there are two different types of seals available. You can find a single lip and a double lip seal that fits the drum. If your axle has the zerk fitting and bearing buddies grease caps, then a double lip seal is MANDATORY. This prevents the grease from being pushed out onto the brake linings. If you have an axle that is not drilled and no zerk fitting, then any seal will work. It must be understood that you do not pump grease into the bearing buddy and bottom out the piston. You want to fill the bearing buddy hub about half stroke. As mentioned before, replace the entire brake assembly as a unit. If you price out individual components you will spend more. Be sure to inspect the wiring for any corrosion or damage as this will affect the resistance and loss of voltage being applied to the electromagnet. A good working system will probably have about 6-9 volts being applied at the magnet during braking, if your controller is adjusted correctly.
Thank you brother Kenny. I used to own a Sunline travel trailer and I had the exact same concerns as you are having. I'm so glad that you are taking these precautions and performing these repairs as I wouldn't want you to break down either. You're too good a man for that to happen to. You know me well enought to know that I will still say my prayers for you for safe travel. Thank you for this very informative video. I learned a lot. Keep Wrenching Brother kenny!!
Pump your grease into spindle with drums off until all the old grease is out so you have minimal mixing. Pack your bearings in your grease and put it back together and pump it your grease to top off. That should take care if the mixing grease issue. Easy when its apart. Safe trip, cute dog.
Back in '01/02, I worked for an in ground swimming pool company, they had 4 daul axle dump trailers. I had my fill of doing brakes and springs on those sonofaguns!
I have used trailers like that, but never knew how they worked. Thanks for that. There are some trailers, smaller type that the tongue of the trailer pushes in when you brake the vehicle, I think they work like emergency brakes on a car, manually, but I don't really know. Like I said, I've used them before but never owned one or had one apart.
Standard braking on older caravans, because of the mass. Electric brakes never really took off by me, the only thing that has powered trailer brakes other than trucks are pickups with fifth wheels, where there the converter installs an air compressor and tank in the pickup, and the trailer has a pneumatic set of brake actuators, and a proportional valve tied into the regular hydraulic brake system, with an in cab parking brake for the trailer added on. Works really well, and is very effective, and the regular truck trailer mechanics can fix them with no problem, standard drums and S cam units, just a lot smaller than the truck version, and based off a Toyota drum and hub, so parts are not an issue anywhere in Africa for it.
Nice video. I’ve seen those easy lube things work as designed, but I’ve also seen them dump grease onto the brakes even when used as directed (pumping by hand while rotating the tire). Also, to me greasing bearings is more about getting the old grease and contaminates out, and you’d have to pump a lot of grease through the hub. Lastly if a bearing is grooved up or pitting, I’d prefer to change it at my shop as opposed to out on the highway. I’d also prefer to catch it before it spins on the spindle and ruins the axle.
I had a good idea how they worked but but it renewed the picture in my mind also i did not know about the grease interaction with other greases, i knew about long or short fiber greases though....very interesting👌
I have never seen a trailer that size with brakes on both axles, it's not needed. Brakes on the rear axle are enough, have to wonder why it's like that. You're right about the grease. We bought a toy hauler last year and the brakes weren't working very well. I pulled the drums to check and someone had mixed the grease and they had been greasing the crap out of every spindle. The brakes were saturated with grease. I cleaned each assembly and repacked the bearings and replaced the seals. Surprisingly the brakes work very well now, I wasn't sure if the pads would seat in again...they did. If you make a video on repacking the bearings, please mention that over greasing a spindle like that has consequences. I'm a firm believer in pulling the drums and checking everything once a year if the trailer is heavily used or it's a trailer like a toy hauler (bumper pull or 5th wheel, something heavy).
You MUST have brakes on each axle because you never know what you’re going to haul. The trailer braking system is designed to be independent from the tow vehicle, meaning that it should be capable of stopping the loaded trailer without any additional braking force from the tow vehicle.
I have heard the same with grease. It's always best to start from scratch with something you have no idea what is in there prior. It becomes thin, will destroy the bearings, possible the pads and can also become flammable if the situation allows it the'll. On a trailer, fire is probably unlikely but it will smoke like hell lol.
I have single axial Airstream and haven't removed the wheel hubs and always wondered how they worked. Trailer is a 2022. I do jack up the trailer and spin wheels to listen or feel anything and so far everything is fine. How often would you take apart and clean and repack?
Normally for a trailer once a year is a good thing, gets the grease moving if you have not used it, and allows a check to see linings are still attached and correctly adjusted, plus you also get to check the tyre for good air pressure and condition.
Was doing this last week. turns out the trailer module in the vehicle was also faulty, only 2 of the 4 outputs worked, so that got replaced as a unit. New LED lights at rear, soldered to the loom and mounted, and then at the front replaced the plug and 5m of wire to get rid of the last intermittent wiring, soldered again and taped up, and placed securely in the wiring channel again. Used a lot thicker wire as well, not for the current (LED units take under 1A total) but for the better fatigue life of the higher strand count wire. More ties added to hold the cable against flexing, and a loop so the trailer turning would not stress it either.
It's running off the 12v system of the pulling vehicle. Unless your alternator fails or you somehow are pulling the trailer with the vehicle off, it won't do anything to drain the battery. I guess worst case scenario, if you are holding the brake in vehicle off it would add a slightly larger draw than just the lights but I'm not 100% on that.
And if the grease run passes the seal, then there gos your brake shoes. i for one, I won't use the grease fitting. Just pack and go after all trailers get way fewer miles, then cars do, and no one greases their wheels that much
My brother taught me about trailer brakes over a decade ago when I repacked the bearings on my travel trailer. My trailer has the grease nipple too. (Bearing Buddy?) I was taught that is for really intended for boat trailers so you can pump the water out after loading your boat. Never really did much regreasing on the travel trailer. The grease in there ain’t going anywhere. Just repack them on a schedule and you will be good.
Great job Kenny doing a thorough inspection. Let me point out regarding greasing the hub through the zerk on the spindle, that there are two different types of seals available. You can find a single lip and a double lip seal that fits the drum. If your axle has the zerk fitting and bearing buddies grease caps, then a double lip seal is MANDATORY. This prevents the grease from being pushed out onto the brake linings. If you have an axle that is not drilled and no zerk fitting, then any seal will work. It must be understood that you do not pump grease into the bearing buddy and bottom out the piston. You want to fill the bearing buddy hub about half stroke. As mentioned before, replace the entire brake assembly as a unit. If you price out individual components you will spend more. Be sure to inspect the wiring for any corrosion or damage as this will affect the resistance and loss of voltage being applied to the electromagnet. A good working system will probably have about 6-9 volts being applied at the magnet during braking, if your controller is adjusted correctly.
Regarding brake controllers, there are two types. First is a time delay type that has a gain and sensitivity wheel. These are designed to allow the selected time from tow vehicle brake application to vary before the trailer brakes apply. This system also then applies the fixed voltage level to be applied to the brake magnets. Typically this system will allow for good braking when at highway speeds and very aggressive braking at slow speed. Very annoying.
The second type of brake controller is an INERTIA type, typically with a pendulum inside. This gives you modulated braking, meaning lower voltages are sent to the brakes during slower stopping and full voltage to be applied during hard braking. Tekonsha makes an excellent controller, the P3 with the ability to work on several different types of trailer braking systems. I hope this helps anyone with the old style controller. Upgrade your controller and you will be pleasantly surprised.
Thanks Kenny for showing this. I have never messed with electrical brakes. This was very informative to me. I had no idea that they use the drum it self to put on the brakes after the magnet is energized and latches on to the drum. I wonder who came up with this idea? I know that electrical brakes have been around for a long time. Thanks again for your knowledge and know how. Keep filming.
Thanks Kenny. i learned something today. I've never come across this type of braking system so it was really interesting to learn about. I more familiar with the mechanical tow hitch operated brakes. I'm assuming the power source would be linked through the brake light circuit to avoid needing an extra pin in the hitch plug.
Had to take my self adjusters off my 2024 camper they cap adjusting them up to Tie
Greases compatibility is it's own rabbit hole. But it's usually not about the base oil in the grease, it's about the thickener. Maybe the additive package, but thickener compatibility comes first.
To keep it simple, there are 3 main thickeners out there that are being used in automotive industry:
- lithium complex (the most common one)
- calcium sulfonate complex (gaining popularity day by day)
- polyurea (stuff from the factory usually is packed with it, like U-joints and some bearings)
The first two are more or less compatible (Li and Ca), meaning you can pump the old Li complex with a Ca one, just don't switch the grease each time you pump. The issue comes with polyurea - mixing it with pretty much anything else is a bad way to go. The mix can either soften or harden depending on the specific combination, but it's a bad day both ways. I highly advise just washing whatever part you're regreasing with clean gasoline until it's free of old grease and just repack it with a new one you're using.
Also, polyurea has it's own distinct consistency and feel, compared to Li and Ca (complex) greases. It's kinda more gelatinous, while the latter two are more similar to a thick ketchup or a tomato paste, pardon the food analogy :)
That's worth knowing. I'm a little surprised to hear that a U joint would be packed with something incompatible with typical grease. The first thing I do when I install a U joint is add grease....
The other thing about compatibility of the greases is they will be actually corrosive if you mix different bases...as well as breakdown or hardening up. I've seen this, but in aircraft stuff. There's lots of different grease bases used in that environment for exacting, specific purposes. We are actually in good shape so far as automotive wheel bearings and stuff on auto applications as all we need to do is totally remove all grease and only use one type..
It's because polyurea is a good choice when a manufacturer makes a part that will likely be either uncerviceable (u joints without zerks) or people being people won't pump it even if it has one. It's great when it comes to rejecting water, doesn't wash out as easy as Li-based greases.
The problem comes when the base oil eventually dries out - the seals on the u joint eventually lose that thin coat of oily grease, starts rubbing directly on metal, water/dirt gets under the seal and the part fails due to abrasion and corrosion.
So yeah, if you do your repairs/maintenance properly it's a good idea to buy parts with zerks, clean the factory grease with gas, dry them, pack with new grease of choice that you know is gonna be compatible with future pumps, assemble and pump again. Used tooth brushes are your friends :)
Hi, thanks for that very informative, electric breaking was new me, I had no idea till now, well explained I enjoyed the learnings
Calcium Grease ,Lithium Grease ,Aluminum Complex Grease ,Barium Complex Grease ,Bentone (Clay) Grease , Polyurea Grease ,Polyurea Grease ,soap grease, When I was a young man working in the lead and gold zinc mines in the Yukon at Anvil mines at the town of Faro they mixed greases on a huge electric shovel the tracks didn't last 1/2 a mile walking to the next dig site ,cost them 1 million dollars to repair tracks pins bushings, that was in 1970 the head maintenance planer was fired ,and we told them don't do it was a cost cutting idea .
Years ago i was on the interstate. Saw something come across the divider and bounce down my lane. A wheel and tire combo. I dive to another lane watch the wheel as i pass it still bouncing nearly cab hight and across the interstate i see a truck with a empty car trailer coming to a stop on the shoulder smoke coming off the spindle. I needed clean shorts and i bet others did to
Great job Kenny doing a thorough inspection. Let me point out regarding greasing the hub through the zerk on the spindle, that there are two different types of seals available. You can find a single lip and a double lip seal that fits the drum. If your axle has the zerk fitting and bearing buddies grease caps, then a double lip seal is MANDATORY.
This prevents the grease from being pushed out onto the brake linings.
If you have an axle that is not drilled and no zerk fitting, then any seal will work. It must be understood that you do not pump grease into the bearing buddy and bottom out the piston. You want to fill the bearing buddy hub about half stroke.
As mentioned before, replace the entire brake assembly as a unit. If you price out individual components you will spend more. Be sure to inspect the wiring for any corrosion or damage as this will affect the resistance and loss of voltage being applied to the electromagnet. A good working system will probably have about 6-9 volts being applied at the magnet during braking, if your controller is adjusted correctly.
Thank you brother Kenny. I used to own a Sunline travel trailer and I had the exact same concerns as you are having. I'm so glad that you are taking these precautions and performing these repairs as I wouldn't want you to break down either. You're too good a man for that to happen to. You know me well enought to know that I will still say my prayers for you for safe travel. Thank you for this very informative video. I learned a lot. Keep Wrenching Brother kenny!!
Pump your grease into spindle with drums off until all the old grease is out so you have minimal mixing. Pack your bearings in your grease and put it back together and pump it your grease to top off. That should take care if the mixing grease issue. Easy when its apart. Safe trip, cute dog.
Hey thanks Ken for the insight😊 this is ASE certified River Dave you think you know everything until you hear somebody else keep it up
Wow didn't know that grease would actually melt like that 😮. Learn something every single day. Wow 🎉
Back in '01/02, I worked for an in ground swimming pool company, they had 4 daul axle dump trailers. I had my fill of doing brakes and springs on those sonofaguns!
I always wanted to try a brake failure run off ramp on the highways in Maryland!!!LOLOL😁
I have used trailers like that, but never knew how they worked. Thanks for that. There are some trailers, smaller type that the tongue of the trailer pushes in when you brake the vehicle, I think they work like emergency brakes on a car, manually, but I don't really know. Like I said, I've used them before but never owned one or had one apart.
Standard braking on older caravans, because of the mass. Electric brakes never really took off by me, the only thing that has powered trailer brakes other than trucks are pickups with fifth wheels, where there the converter installs an air compressor and tank in the pickup, and the trailer has a pneumatic set of brake actuators, and a proportional valve tied into the regular hydraulic brake system, with an in cab parking brake for the trailer added on. Works really well, and is very effective, and the regular truck trailer mechanics can fix them with no problem, standard drums and S cam units, just a lot smaller than the truck version, and based off a Toyota drum and hub, so parts are not an issue anywhere in Africa for it.
In NY state your trailer is required to have brakes over a certain total weight, I think 3000lbs.
I did not understand how electric brakes work-but I do now👍
Hey thanks again my brother
Nice video. I’ve seen those easy lube things work as designed, but I’ve also seen them dump grease onto the brakes even when used as directed (pumping by hand while rotating the tire). Also, to me greasing bearings is more about getting the old grease and contaminates out, and you’d have to pump a lot of grease through the hub. Lastly if a bearing is grooved up or pitting, I’d prefer to change it at my shop as opposed to out on the highway. I’d also prefer to catch it before it spins on the spindle and ruins the axle.
I had a good idea how they worked but but it renewed the picture in my mind also i did not know about the grease interaction with other greases, i knew about long or short fiber greases though....very interesting👌
thanks for tip on grease. know what your talking about.? had red grease liquidfy by itself.????
I never knew how trailer brakes worked. Thanks for the info. And don’t forget to evacuate the old grease inside the spindle. Keep wrenching!
I have never seen a trailer that size with brakes on both axles, it's not needed. Brakes on the rear axle are enough, have to wonder why it's like that. You're right about the grease. We bought a toy hauler last year and the brakes weren't working very well. I pulled the drums to check and someone had mixed the grease and they had been greasing the crap out of every spindle. The brakes were saturated with grease. I cleaned each assembly and repacked the bearings and replaced the seals. Surprisingly the brakes work very well now, I wasn't sure if the pads would seat in again...they did. If you make a video on repacking the bearings, please mention that over greasing a spindle like that has consequences. I'm a firm believer in pulling the drums and checking everything once a year if the trailer is heavily used or it's a trailer like a toy hauler (bumper pull or 5th wheel, something heavy).
You MUST have brakes on each axle because you never know what you’re going to haul. The trailer braking system is designed to be independent from the tow vehicle, meaning that it should be capable of stopping the loaded trailer without any additional braking force from the tow vehicle.
@@jimfiles3307and like a truck are car front axle do 75% more work then the rear axle
I have heard the same with grease. It's always best to start from scratch with something you have no idea what is in there prior.
It becomes thin, will destroy the bearings, possible the pads and can also become flammable if the situation allows it the'll. On a trailer, fire is probably unlikely but it will smoke like hell lol.
I have single axial Airstream and haven't removed the wheel hubs and always wondered how they worked. Trailer is a 2022. I do jack up the trailer and spin wheels to listen or feel anything and so far everything is fine. How often would you take apart and clean and repack?
Normally for a trailer once a year is a good thing, gets the grease moving if you have not used it, and allows a check to see linings are still attached and correctly adjusted, plus you also get to check the tyre for good air pressure and condition.
Trailer lights are always a pain in the butt😂
Was doing this last week. turns out the trailer module in the vehicle was also faulty, only 2 of the 4 outputs worked, so that got replaced as a unit. New LED lights at rear, soldered to the loom and mounted, and then at the front replaced the plug and 5m of wire to get rid of the last intermittent wiring, soldered again and taped up, and placed securely in the wiring channel again. Used a lot thicker wire as well, not for the current (LED units take under 1A total) but for the better fatigue life of the higher strand count wire. More ties added to hold the cable against flexing, and a loop so the trailer turning would not stress it either.
And does the brake booster drain your battery.. ..?
Just like brake lights on the car, they only use power during braking.
It's running off the 12v system of the pulling vehicle. Unless your alternator fails or you somehow are pulling the trailer with the vehicle off, it won't do anything to drain the battery.
I guess worst case scenario, if you are holding the brake in vehicle off it would add a slightly larger draw than just the lights but I'm not 100% on that.
And if the grease run passes the seal, then there gos your brake shoes. i for one, I won't use the grease fitting. Just pack and go after all trailers get way fewer miles, then cars do, and no one greases their wheels that much
You don't need them, but it helps.
Hello Mr Kenny hope y'all are having a great weekend. Don't forget to throw on the cheeseburgers lol . I'm hungry 😅. Tell Mrs Kenny I said hello
My brother taught me about trailer brakes over a decade ago when I repacked the bearings on my travel trailer.
My trailer has the grease nipple too. (Bearing Buddy?) I was taught that is for really intended for boat trailers so you can pump the water out after loading your boat.
Never really did much regreasing on the travel trailer. The grease in there ain’t going anywhere. Just repack them on a schedule and you will be good.
Self adjuster cable on new brakes just hanging free
Trailer brakes,it is cheaper to buy it as an assembly already put together than buying the brake parts separately
Sorry saw better on closeup
Clean and lube the brake shoes
NO
Never lub brake shoes
Cylinders not cylinder's
Great job Kenny doing a thorough inspection. Let me point out regarding greasing the hub through the zerk on the spindle, that there are two different types of seals available. You can find a single lip and a double lip seal that fits the drum. If your axle has the zerk fitting and bearing buddies grease caps, then a double lip seal is MANDATORY.
This prevents the grease from being pushed out onto the brake linings.
If you have an axle that is not drilled and no zerk fitting, then any seal will work. It must be understood that you do not pump grease into the bearing buddy and bottom out the piston. You want to fill the bearing buddy hub about half stroke.
As mentioned before, replace the entire brake assembly as a unit. If you price out individual components you will spend more. Be sure to inspect the wiring for any corrosion or damage as this will affect the resistance and loss of voltage being applied to the electromagnet. A good working system will probably have about 6-9 volts being applied at the magnet during braking, if your controller is adjusted correctly.