This is honestly awesome information been riding for 18 years and never had anyone lay it out like keefer everyone tries to make it sound more complex then it is, run this series for everything kris talk tires motors gear whatveer im tuning in
Good video. One important thing that is often overlooked in all these suspension clicker videos is that the "rebound" adjuster is not just a rebound adjuster. The rebound clicker is actually a bypass circuit on production shocks that come on these bikes. It affects the rebound and compression by the same amount of "clicks". The fluid flows from the end of the shaft to rebound chamber on comp stroke and to the compression chamber on rebound stroke, so adjusting "rebound" by 2 clicks and changing the bleed area at the needle for rebound means that there is the exact same amount of bleed area added to compression. This cannot be stopped unless a check valve is installed in the shaft or rebound separator nut is used. The bleed through the shaft is also much larger than the bleed through the low speed adjuster circuit and has a much larger effect on compression. Very important to remember this when tuning your suspension.
Wait what? You sound really knowledgeable so somehow rebound affects compression settings too? How does this affect how I should do my adjustments? Dumb it down for me lol.
@@scannorse forks are no different. Anything that doesn’t use a check valve on the end of the shaft will flow oil in both directions. It’s not a bad thing just something to keep in mind when tuning. This is why people say to always tune your “rebound” first because it has an effect on the compression also. If you start with compression then move to rebound you are chasing your tail.
Just as a tip to the tip…the first click (out) from fully seated is not “1”, it is “0”. Always needed this as a reminder when writing/referencing settings for baselines.
Just to be clear, when we do testing once the clicker gets hard and it stops, back out is considered one. This is normal for production “clicker setting numbers”.
@@Keeferinctesting I’d be interested in knowing what the zero setting is that I find in my service manual. I can’t imagine the OEM suggesting to ride around with the clicker past the last click and fully seated.
I was having trouble on a2005 CRF450 and had the bike re-valved softer spring. I got in touch with Race Tec and what I got from the conversation was damping, damping, damping. It takes me a while, well I just bought a new 2023 YZ250X and I was struggling, then the light came back on and I adjusted the damping no softer spring and it worked.
Kris, I don’t have a Kawasaki… could you please do a video like this for a Husqvarna? By the way, I have a Two-Stroke if that makes a difference. Thank You!
Good tips overall. Keep in mind fork rebound has a large effect on cornering as well and it is not explained a lot in these types of videos. The correct amount of rebound dampening is needed to properly settle and follow through in the corner. Also, for pure sand typically a slower rebound is recommended rather than a faster one
In most cases yes, sand requires slower rebound but if you’re going in on comp/LSC then sometimes you’ll need to speed up rebound to compensate but I wasn’t trying to make this video too complicated. Simple basics then we can break down suspension more in a part two slightly longer video. 👍🏻
@@Keeferinctesting Thanks, I think myself and a lot of others would really appreciate an in depth video or podcast (perhaps with a suspension expert) with tips how to tackle the most common handling or suspension issues by using just the clickers and fork oil level etc. I feel a lot of guys get stuck in a window where the bike feels fairly balanced and are afraid to move out of that. To me it was a revelation just how much the KTM app recommends closing clickers on sand and it helps the cornering stability a lot.
It’s a preference thing and I didn’t want to make it harder for beginners to learn. Usually there is a 2 for 1. Every two clicks in on compression, go one out faster on rebound. Also vice versa. 2 out on compression, one in on rebound. This will be in written version this week on my website.
Stiffening up the rear was an eye opener for me on my KTM. My bike would be too low in the rear and it would push out of corners having a tendency to stand up. I went 5 clicks stiffer in the rear and the bike would feel like it was higher in the rear and it was finally able to dive the front in corners. Its crazy how much uou can tweak with these clickers alone. Interesting stuff Keefer, keep it up 👍
Kris I noticed your running Xtrigs on your sons bike. Have you tried the 21mm setting for better turn in? I have 22mm Ride engineering and looking for a little tighter turn in ability with these bikes.
Clickers feel like black magic. I can get a setting that feels unbeatable in corners but like booty in the chop. Then I can find a setting that’s good on jumps and chop but it’s booty in the corners. I’ve pretty much given up. I set them to your recommended clicker settings for the 22 yz450 and leave it at that.
Isn’t that cool!!! 2 questions; Let’s say we are 12 clicks out on the fork compression we should be somewhat close to 12 clicks out on rebound? 12 clicks out on compression and 1 click out on rebound would not be acceptable? I saw on the newest KTM factory edition there is a connectivity option. Is there a connectivity option or upgrade for a 2011 KTM 350 SXF? Thank you.
hi iam a novice on a kx 450f 2016. coming into corners the whole bike feels unstable. as if it wants to wash out. can you help.i feel weary just riding the bike.
4.2 springs front and 48 for rear for your weight ? Set sag and clickers in stock settings then work from there , hard to say clickers as it's down to the day on the track and your speed , see how stock feels ,maybe need to speed up rebound a little to account for small chattery bumps
4.6 on the front which is stock and I’ve got a 45 n k-tech spring on the rear. I feel like the front is good. Yesterday I was riding a very hard pack track braking and accelerating bumps. And I was feeling a lot of chatter when going hard in and out of corners. 👍🏽
Always hear you refer to high speed as ride height . But doesnt low speed control pitching and squatting considering these are low shaft speed movements and the high speed is for taking hits and bumps/ hard edge stuff. Low speed is what i use to control ride height on mtn bikes
In the world of dirt bikes, HSC actually affects ride height on/off throttle more than LSC. LSC can control some on throttle damping characteristics, of course but HSC affects the bike more statically. I’m not a suspension tech, I’m just a test guy that gives those other guys feedback. Most suspension techs will agree if you don’t want to mess with your sag, HSC can help balance of bike on/off throttle.
The more suspension videos that I watch, the more confused I become. I thought high speed compression affected the suspension for when the suspension was compressing really fast like jump landings, hard obstacles etc. I've never heard of it as a way to adjust rider height or sag. I'm not sure anybody really gets it. I've watched 3 videos and everybody has a different opinion on what the clickers affect lol. Probably best for me to stick to the stock settings.
@@JimG1964 HSC “acts” like a rode height. It’s not a sag measurement. If you like your rode height (sag) but you feel low on jump landings, faces, or g outs your HSC can help raise or lower those areas for you. Hence “acts” like a ride height. Hope this helps. Have fun!!
This is honestly awesome information been riding for 18 years and never had anyone lay it out like keefer everyone tries to make it sound more complex then it is, run this series for everything kris talk tires motors gear whatveer im tuning in
The bike looks sick, thanks for the tech info Keefer.
This is great information and well explained.
The west/east coast suggestions was really helpful. Thanks for the video!
Keefer, you are a moto treasure.
Good video. One important thing that is often overlooked in all these suspension clicker videos is that the "rebound" adjuster is not just a rebound adjuster. The rebound clicker is actually a bypass circuit on production shocks that come on these bikes. It affects the rebound and compression by the same amount of "clicks". The fluid flows from the end of the shaft to rebound chamber on comp stroke and to the compression chamber on rebound stroke, so adjusting "rebound" by 2 clicks and changing the bleed area at the needle for rebound means that there is the exact same amount of bleed area added to compression. This cannot be stopped unless a check valve is installed in the shaft or rebound separator nut is used. The bleed through the shaft is also much larger than the bleed through the low speed adjuster circuit and has a much larger effect on compression. Very important to remember this when tuning your suspension.
@googlesucks3520 ….meaning what ? What to do ?
@@googlesucks3520 …..meaning what ? What to do ? And what about closed cartridge forks ?
Wait what? You sound really knowledgeable so somehow rebound affects compression settings too? How does this affect how I should do my adjustments? Dumb it down for me lol.
@@googlesucks3520 so any responses ?
@@scannorse forks are no different. Anything that doesn’t use a check valve on the end of the shaft will flow oil in both directions. It’s not a bad thing just something to keep in mind when tuning. This is why people say to always tune your “rebound” first because it has an effect on the compression also. If you start with compression then move to rebound you are chasing your tail.
good info....thanks, my bike was diving in corners
Awesome video. The average Joe likely knows very little about suspension, including me. Saved this video for future reference 👍
thanks for the great info ..I've learnt alot from this
Thankyou brother, your doing allot for the sport. Love from UK, get yo ass back to foxhills 🤠
Thanks for the info, always helps.
I'm really glad for each video you record!
Just as a tip to the tip…the first click (out) from fully seated is not “1”, it is “0”. Always needed this as a reminder when writing/referencing settings for baselines.
Not true, did you not listen
Keefer liked the comment. Did you not see?
Just to be clear, when we do testing once the clicker gets hard and it stops, back out is considered one. This is normal for production “clicker setting numbers”.
@@Keeferinctesting I’d be interested in knowing what the zero setting is that I find in my service manual. I can’t imagine the OEM suggesting to ride around with the clicker past the last click and fully seated.
@@reineherrera8897exactly. Dont believe everything Queefer tells you… buddy should stick to his day job of thinking he is the perfect parent
This is great! Thanks
I was having trouble on a2005 CRF450 and had the bike re-valved softer spring. I got in touch with Race Tec and what I got from the conversation was damping, damping, damping. It takes me a while, well I just bought a new 2023 YZ250X and I was struggling, then the light came back on and I adjusted the damping no softer spring and it worked.
You the man Kris! Good stuff!
Kris, I don’t have a Kawasaki… could you please do a video like this for a Husqvarna?
By the way, I have a Two-Stroke if that makes a difference. Thank You!
Yeah Kris. Go out and buy every brand bike 4 stroke and 2 strokes and do a video on each so teeniorcitizen8537 can understand… serious mate?
Same rules apply regardless of motorcycle or more importantly suspension brand.
@@davidmoore_723 Thanks, but I have a Two-Stroke. I’ve emailed Kris and I’m sure he’ll get back to me.
🤣
@@teeniorcitizen8537 🤣
Good tips overall. Keep in mind fork rebound has a large effect on cornering as well and it is not explained a lot in these types of videos. The correct amount of rebound dampening is needed to properly settle and follow through in the corner. Also, for pure sand typically a slower rebound is recommended rather than a faster one
In most cases yes, sand requires slower rebound but if you’re going in on comp/LSC then sometimes you’ll need to speed up rebound to compensate but I wasn’t trying to make this video too complicated. Simple basics then we can break down suspension more in a part two slightly longer video. 👍🏻
@@Keeferinctesting
Thanks, I think myself and a lot of others would really appreciate an in depth video or podcast (perhaps with a suspension expert) with tips how to tackle the most common handling or suspension issues by using just the clickers and fork oil level etc. I feel a lot of guys get stuck in a window where the bike feels fairly balanced and are afraid to move out of that. To me it was a revelation just how much the KTM app recommends closing clickers on sand and it helps the cornering stability a lot.
Is there a general rule of thumb for clickers and rebound? If i go out two or three clicks, what should i be doing with rebound?
It’s a preference thing and I didn’t want to make it harder for beginners to learn. Usually there is a 2 for 1. Every two clicks in on compression, go one out faster on rebound. Also vice versa. 2 out on compression, one in on rebound. This will be in written version this week on my website.
Stiffening up the rear was an eye opener for me on my KTM. My bike would be too low in the rear and it would push out of corners having a tendency to stand up. I went 5 clicks stiffer in the rear and the bike would feel like it was higher in the rear and it was finally able to dive the front in corners. Its crazy how much uou can tweak with these clickers alone. Interesting stuff Keefer, keep it up 👍
Kris I noticed your running Xtrigs on your sons bike. Have you tried the 21mm setting for better turn in? I have 22mm Ride engineering and looking for a little tighter turn in ability with these bikes.
@@timberg331 We had to run these for his A Kit fork. Otherwise we would run stock clamps.
Clickers feel like black magic. I can get a setting that feels unbeatable in corners but like booty in the chop. Then I can find a setting that’s good on jumps and chop but it’s booty in the corners.
I’ve pretty much given up. I set them to your recommended clicker settings for the 22 yz450 and leave it at that.
thanks Keefer
A keefer channel?!?! Sub'd!
Isn’t that cool!!!
2 questions;
Let’s say we are 12 clicks out on the fork compression we should be somewhat close to 12 clicks out on rebound? 12 clicks out on compression and 1 click out on rebound would not be acceptable?
I saw on the newest KTM factory edition there is a connectivity option. Is there a connectivity option or upgrade for a 2011 KTM 350 SXF?
Thank you.
hi iam a novice on a kx 450f 2016. coming into corners the whole bike feels unstable. as if it wants to wash out. can you help.i feel weary just riding the bike.
How sensitive are clickers on WP components?
One click at a time. Fairly sensitive.
That's a nice pool :)
Thank you 🦾😎
Can you get that pipe with the green logos??
@@ste_v1983 Decal Works can make them
What would you recommend for a 2023 yzf250 hardback conditions intermediate level rider. Clicker wise
I have same bike in same conditions , what weight are you ?
I’m 70kg or 155 pounds, help would be appreciated
I’ve had my springs changed I just need clicker settings. Thanks
4.2 springs front and 48 for rear for your weight ? Set sag and clickers in stock settings then work from there , hard to say clickers as it's down to the day on the track and your speed , see how stock feels ,maybe need to speed up rebound a little to account for small chattery bumps
4.6 on the front which is stock and I’ve got a 45 n k-tech spring on the rear. I feel like the front is good. Yesterday I was riding a very hard pack track braking and accelerating bumps. And I was feeling a lot of chatter when going hard in and out of corners. 👍🏽
Do you go in or out on rebound to make rebound faster?
Out
@@293epartridge by going out. it makes if softer..moves more quicker.
Cheers Keef-diggy! Post up anything you consider helpful. -S.
Clear as mud
I though if your on 1 on rebound per say,that’s the fastest the fork will shoot back up. Is that wrong?
1 means, 1 out. That is slow.
Are you from Pittsburgh I went to school with a Chris Keefer
No, sir.
Is that Matthes humble abode?
Sir, Matthes place is much bigger and better than this place. 😂
Always hear you refer to high speed as ride height . But doesnt low speed control pitching and squatting considering these are low shaft speed movements and the high speed is for taking hits and bumps/ hard edge stuff. Low speed is what i use to control ride height on mtn bikes
In the world of dirt bikes, HSC actually affects ride height on/off throttle more than LSC. LSC can control some on throttle damping characteristics, of course but HSC affects the bike more statically. I’m not a suspension tech, I’m just a test guy that gives those other guys feedback. Most suspension techs will agree if you don’t want to mess with your sag, HSC can help balance of bike on/off throttle.
Thanks! Is that what $70k/year house looks like? I'm definitely doing something wrong..
High Dez 70K is different than most. 😝
@@Keeferinctesting Beautiful area and home. Impressive.
🤟🤟
The more suspension videos that I watch, the more confused I become. I thought high speed compression affected the suspension for when the suspension was compressing really fast like jump landings, hard obstacles etc. I've never heard of it as a way to adjust rider height or sag. I'm not sure anybody really gets it. I've watched 3 videos and everybody has a different opinion on what the clickers affect lol. Probably best for me to stick to the stock settings.
@@JimG1964 HSC “acts” like a rode height. It’s not a sag measurement. If you like your rode height (sag) but you feel low on jump landings, faces, or g outs your HSC can help raise or lower those areas for you. Hence “acts” like a ride height. Hope this helps. Have fun!!
@@Keeferinctesting Thanks Keefer! That helps and will try it.