TYM#3 - 60Hz AC motor in a 50Hz country and why you may want that + the worst packing job ever seen
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- Опубликовано: 24 авг 2024
- Tame your Motor, episode #3
Here we explain why a 60Hz induction motor can be the better choice if you live in a 50Hz country. The first few minutes however do show an unsuitable packing job and the damage from that. Also a closer look at of 2 electric motors which are sold to me as "new in original box" (Hope the seller feels really sick by watching this...)...
The dry theory stuff behind the 50/60Hz question starts around the 09:00 time stamp. This should also explain why the fake Huanyang VFD we recently looked at is entirely unsuitable if do want to do more than simple bread-and-butter stuff.
If you interested in motors and VFDs, you may want to watch the other videos of my "Tame your motor" series, the electric motor stuff playlist is here:
• Electric Motor stuff
(c) 2018
www.dynoguy.co.uk
Disclaimer:
This footage is for entertainent only, it may show poor and/or unsafe/dangerous practice.
Always consult an expert first. I must not held responsble if you kill/injure yourself and/or others, also not for any damage whatsoever. 
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thank you very much! 😘 all i wanted to hear was vfd. thats all i was looking for. i didn't kjow how to ask RUclips but somehow i got to ur vid and managed to watch till the part where you said vfd
I don't think its a big problem when the power drops at higher frequencies. On a lathe those higher speeds are used for smaller diameter work- pieces so the power loss probably won't be problem. (assuming one overdrives the motor frequency)
Larger diameter work-pieces at low frequencies are the problem.
Well, it depends on the lathe, ...with insert tooling and a good feed rate i can stall the little green lathe at any speed, long before i reach the limit of the cutting tool. The desired motor type is a 4 pole because of shorter flux linkage and less copper losses in the short ends than a 2 pole type,. The higher number of poles also gives you better control and better torque development at the bottom end. But here comes the problem, for reasonable torque at low spindle speeds you want a belt ratio of a least 2 or even 3. That leaves you with 750 spindle rpm at 50 Hz, or 1500 at 100Hz.. Let's assume we have a 1kW motor, your 230 V VFD+motor delivers
1kW and 12Nm (with 750rpm at the spindle) at 50Hz and 1kW and 6Nm at 100Hz, sharply dropping thereafter as you can't even drive the magnetizing current anymore because you running out of voltage. With the solution as described i have 1kW and 12Nm at 750 spindle rpm, 2kW and 12Nm at 1500 (100Hz) and still 1kW and 6Nm at 2250rpm (150Hz), and still not running out of voltage as i have 440V from my transformers ... hope you now can see why this all makes good sense ..... (numbers are ideal, real world data may vary)
I kinda like the way you do the unboxing part of the video while smoking a cigarette.
Always trying my best ...:-)
Funny charged twice but got a half way packing job that is upsetting when they claim thinks are new.
Still having fun with that guy,.... Took one apart and replaced the bearings, video is coming soon ... with some rather interesting findings,
Nice looking motors. Get a needle tip for your grease gun and pump some grease in behind the seals. I agree about the packaging. This happens to me.
They actually look better on the video ...:-) ... and for greasing, these are ZZ bearings, means hard covers, not rubber seals. It's not worth to rescue a Chinese bearing anyway, a quality brand replacement is around $3, so what...
I think before using this item is better to be checked for lubrication as it looks to me these units where hiding in a wear house in the same box for a while and many items have fallen on it
the bearings were toast, replaced them all, ...and yes, your right, they must have been sitting somewhere for ages.
I’ll have to watch this a few times to get the idea I think, I’ll tell what would make a good video Mike, a run through of all the settings on the VFD as I think a lot of us have the Chinese ones also I have two Mitsubishi but there’s so many channels to change and it’s a pain when you don’t know what’s what, just a suggestion, (please) the seller wants hanging by his balls for that might make him take a bit more care next time.
Regards Alan.
Hi Alan,...sounds like a good idea, I'll see if i can find the time for a short clip doing exactly that, so you don't need to call for help on Sunday nights anymore ....:-) ... The biggest problem for most HuanYang users is that they come with strange default settings, i never had one which worked straight off the box........ I hate violence, but it seems he's got quite big balls, may need to switch to anger level 2 soon.
Good lord! What kind of goof packed that up!? I'm surprised the castings aren't busted all to hell. Look like nice motors though. Are they cast iron or aluminum?
I was quite surprised, too, apart from the bent foot it seems to be ok, we'll see what bits fall off when i take them apart. Without the dents ant dirt, they may look nice, the truth is inside, rotor run out and air gap is what makes the difference. Housing is Aluminium, nameplate says 16kg, average for that size.
....correct me if I'm wrong, but I always thought that the UK ran on 240v @50hz not 230v...
Technically you correct, but from a specification point, you wrong...:-)... Fact is that in 1995 it was decided to harmonise the mains voltage all over Europe, UK had 240/415V 50Hz where most of the rest had 220/380V.
What they did was just changing the tolerance declaration and the nominal voltage, we now have 230V +10/-6%, whereas before it was 240V +/- 6%. We still have well over 240V in most areas, my transformer is just over the fence and i usually see well over 245V . The problem is that you can't just drop a country wide grid by 10V,, that would involve some significant investments, too. So we now officially have 230/400V by definition, just sitting a bit in the high end of the tolerance band.
ah, thanks for that....I live and learn! :)
you're welcome ...
@@dynoguy I live in Italy where the old standard was 220/380V, but I don't think I've ever actually seen a voltage lower than 230 (edit: other than a brownout once where the lights suddenly dimmed so much that I was wondering and measured the voltage, it was 190V. It came back to 245 after a couple minutes).
Most of the time it's around 230-235, but I've seen as high as 250. I wonder if it's the same in rural areas that are served by older/less upgraded parts of the grid.
Pls help me i bought a 115 volt 60hz welder from the us and where i live the electricity is 115 volt 50 hz
The model is the hobart handler 140
That looks like being a transformer welder, so it might just work on 115V/50Hz, but power and duty cycle will be derated a bit, also the transformer may hum a bit as it's closer to saturation on 50Hz..
Will the machines life be shorter?
I have 60hz motor in 50hz country whats the solution to run that motor peoperly
Well,...the answer is in the video and further information in some of my other videos, links are in the description.
Hi, I have an ecogoo 220v input to 380v output vfd, I think it's a 1.5kw one. It has a problem with its display and so can't be programmed. I'm pretty sure you would be able to fix it, so do you want it? If you do I'll post it to you and it's all yours to play with, just send me a massage and I'll get it sorted.
Hi, thanks for the offer, but i am in the process of moving house so i'd rather trying to get rid of some clutter.
Hello, i like your video. I need your help. I bought an electric pressure washer in china. The volt is 220v 50hz. But my country electricity is 220v 60hz. Do I need to use the VFD converter? When I asked the shop in china, the owner told me it's useless using the VFD. I need your help, please to run my motor.
You should not run single phase motors on a VFD at all, to many issues which may occur.
All you can do is plug it in and run it as it is. If it's an induction motor, It will run about 20% slower with 20% less power, if it's a brushed motor (quite common with cheap pressure washers) you may see less reduction in power. Anyway, it will run, but not to full performance. Hope this helps ...
jeeeezuss.. that packing job is for the birds.. and the handling of the package was almost as bad as DHL handled my Deckel in transit. if the douchebag charged twice for shipping, the least he could have done is mount the motors on a piece of OSB or plywood to keep them from poking thru the sides of the box...
the chinese don't have the best QC when it comes to bearings... which i'm guessing is what's inside those motors as they too are probably chinese.
correct me if i'm wrong: i was under the impression a 60hz motor would just run a little slower on 50hz juice? i'm gonna have to re-watch the video a few times to really digest the content as i know virtually nothing about electric motors and stuff...
Well, ...it seems he's a bit stubborn, too. My next conversation will be in "friendly mode off".
I assume these are made in china with chinese bearings, so i just replace them.
You correct, it will run slower, but you also need to watch the voltage as lower frequency requires lower voltage for maintaining the same current. That's why most 60Hz motors are 440V or 460V, but the same plate then says 400V 50Hz....practical example of following the curve on my sketch.
These seem a bit special as the 60Hz voltage is unusually low, that's why i wanted them, we.ll soon find out what's really in it, name plates don't always tell the truth but not very many people can test that ....
Hey I have a 50hz motor but my country 60hz will it run nomal and it's a 3 hp will I lose ph or rpm and it's 110v
Running a 50Hz motor in a 60Hz country is not a problem, providing the 60Hz supply voltage is no more than 20% higher.
I understand that your motor is 110V/50Hz induction motor, , this means it's good for a 110V/60Hz or 127V/60Hz mains as well, it will run about 20% faster, torque might be less, depending on your actual mains voltage, but the higher speed may have the effect that your net power might be the same or even slightly higher. To achieve exactly the same current (and torque) as on a 50Hz mains, you will need at least 132V/60Hz, which is a rather unusual mains voltage.
@@dynoguy Thanks much..
you're welcome
I have washing machine use 60hz/220/230v gross power 2200w
And my house have 50hz/220v power
I need easy cheep Solution
Just plug it in, should work, if it is an asynchronous motor, it will run about 20% slower on 50Hz,, that's all. The heater doesn't care if it's 50 or 60Hz, that's just a resistor.
@@dynoguy
I plugged it but it shut down itself
well, do you have a picture of the data plate,. there are thousands of different machines out there and with no information at all i can't really help you
Looked at it and i still think it should just work on 50Hz, the motor appears to be a DC motor, so the mains frequency does not matter. Is the machine used or new ? did it work elsewhere ? Why not just ask the manufacturer what to do.
You certainly can use a VFD, but it needs to be rated for at least 6kW because you only use 2 phases of the output, also some vfd's don't like to be loaded on 2 phases only. Cost will be in the region of $300 for a cheap Chinese one,
@@dynoguy
My uncle send it to me it's brand new i try it and it shut down itself and i leave it for several months it doesn't worth it
It cost about 185 USD i will try again if doesn't work i will sell it or leave it.
Thanks anyway
60 Hertz motor can run on 50 hertz but with lower capacity
of course it will, but if you reduce the frequency by 20% you MUST reduce the voltage by 20% as well, otherwise it will draw excessive magnetizing current, even when just idling with no load.
@@dynoguy of course that I understand. Thanks 😊
@@dynoguy please Sir help me
60hz 440v mother
50hz why on??
Well it damages the motor if you do that long term