A very helpful video, Brittany! I appreciate how well considered your comments on both series are. People can appreciate both series even though they’re different in many important respects. Like you, I have a personal preference for Malazan, but I respect WoT as a tremendous achievement.
Brilliant video and, in my opinion, insightful and balanced. Really great points about both series, especially as you highlight aspects that some might feel are negatives or positives depending on taste and preference. As ever, fantastic to hear your thoughts. Have a great week.
Brilliant video, Brittany! Although I can't speak for the Wheel of Time, I am completely with you on everything said about MBotF, at least as far along as I am right now. I don't think I could ever subject myself to the video challenge of explaining what the series is about, but the in-depth character work, prose, and themes are truly sublime. I wish I understood more than I do regarding various plot threads, but all the better for readers who love a great challenge and/or appreciate rereading a series. Brava, my friend!
WoT was almost entirely about gender dynamics with an ode to past civilization. The characters were very realistic in the sense that if something annoys you or attracts you about one of them, it always will. Erikson very credibly tackles gender dynamics, conservatism vs liberalism, reactionaries vs visionaries, race vs race, conservationism vs exploitation, good old days vs dystopia, bad old days vs enlightened civilization, capitalism vs communism, pastoralism vs city states, religion vs rational philosphy,.. constant juxtaposition.
This was such a good discussion! I think I would prefer WOT just bc I haven’t read that much high fantasy but I really want to get into it. I’ve only read the name of the wind (and loved it), but more straight forward plot, easier to read prose, and a good payoff make me feel like I’m just at a point in life where I could enjoy WOT. Such a good job discussing both series so well to help someone figure out what’s better for them, thank you!
Thanks for making this video. I read WoT during lockdown after failing to finish the series a few years ago. While I'm happy that reading it reignited my love of reading, I can't say I enjoyed Jordan's writing at all. I've dug deep and found more of my preferences and now Malazan is my next big commitment. After I finish the last 4 Dune books. And the last Expanse book. Ha!
Been waiting for this video for awhile to see your thoughts and preferences on both series. There is absolutely tons of enjoyment to be gained from both series but I am glad you favored Malazan in the end. I hope you continue on in the Malazan world with all the other side novels!
Good comparison. I prefer Malazan for many reasons but if I had to pick one it would be the characterization. We're rewarded for observing characters and spending time inside their heads with an insight into humanity, compassion, trauma, memory, relationships, etc. the list goes on and on. Not "I wish Paran were here he's good at talking to women."
I first heard of Malazan back in 2017 when I just started WoT. I’m still lukewarm on WoT, great worldbuilding but so much wasted time and I honestly didn’t enjoy lots of the characters. That’s me focusing on the bad rather than the good, but man does Book 10 not need to exist. Malazan is something I heard so many conflicting information on that I only decided to read it recently. Part of the reason I was lukewarm on WoT is because of poor expectations, which left me disappointed. I think I’m better I figuring out how the books will actually be and I think I’m ready for Malazan. Great comparison, thanks for this. I think it’s funny when you compare some WoT and they seem so small scale compared to Malazan while WoT is on a much larger scale than most fantasy, just shows how broad Malazan is. Malazan BotF sounds like a ten volume history series writing as a memoir but like real life their are no main characters.
Love this video! I have read 5 WoT books so far and I definitely agree with your criticisms, though I refuse to DNF the series at this point because now I am too invested to stop, lol. And even though I am not really a fan of war/battle stories, Malazan still intrigues me quite a bit. Especially the writing just sounds too good to miss out on. Thank you for doing this video, you did an amazing job comparing these series imo! ❤
Haven’t read either series yet but I had no intention of getting to Malazan before finding your channel. Now it’s absolutely on my tbr even if I’m still intimidated by it
No need to be intimidated. 😊 imagine yourself as being right there with the characters, learning what's going on along with them. Imagine being part of what's going on rather than being told a story.
Your thoughts on the series payoff at the end match many of my own feelings. The end of the Wheel of Time left me with that "It was all worth it!" feeling that I was hoping for. Malazan just left me wondering. That being said, not very many days go by that I don't think about Malazan's ending and themes. Whereas Wheel of Time is just... Done. So in a way Malazan has left more of a lasting effect on me. So there's that.
Hi Brittany, I agree on both counts. Before I comment.. need to restate my observation on your intro. Hands down, my FAVE post intro is your "Helllll-Oh" !!! Borderline obsessed lol. Anyway, I met Jordan several times. He always stated in every signing HE controlled his characters like "an Old Testament God". So he's severely repetitive. Never forget. But Jordan knows how to close the deal :-). Love Malazan bc as you say Erickson gives nothing away - you read or you die (as in you're lost lol). So Malazan seems richer bc he doesn't puke obvious detail. His magic to me is softer... non-formulaic. Jordan was a Southern boy... from Charleston no less. I'm from SC but traveled the globe as a Producer with NBC News in 90s. Jordan was a veteran with depth in world views. He oozes the Old Money and Southern Belle feel of historic Charleston. I've learned to look past his obvious gender hang-ups. Love both for very different reasons. PS- You and I gotta talk Star Wars my friend. Rob
Having read both series several times, and dune twice. I have never made any connections between dune and wheel of time before. Chosen one tropes are not new, but now you mention it I can draw parallels between the aiel and freeman, and the benijezzeret and aes Sedai, not in function or methodology, but being a desert tribe and a powerful order of supposed witches
From my WoT experience, Robert Jordan is a master subtly. Re-reads is where this comes out. Also I found his writing poetic during the re-reads. And as Sanderson himself admits, _his own prose is like a - clear glass - window while Robert Jordan's is a - stained glass - window._ I myself have only read the first Malazan book so I cannot really comment on that yet.
I enjoyed your insightful review/comparison. I was thinking about TV adaptations with WOT coming out Friday. I cannot imagine how they could ever adapt Erickson's work to a TV series, LOL. Not enough consistent plot/characters. Kind of like how Foundatin would be difficult for viewers to follow as characters change so often, WOT has a lot of characters but consistently follows a few main ones and has a straight forward plot/goal. I thin the TV series will be really good because they can eliminate excessive descriptions like what the dresses looked like bu simply showing them. I know you review books but woud be interested in your thoughts on the WOT TV series if you have time to watch it. As always, I enjoy your channel.
With regards to payoff, the one thing I would like to add is that; while the series itself doesn't have a great payoff in a typical sense, there are books in the series that have some amazing and satisfying conclusions. I'm thinking Reapers Gale and Toll the Hound in particular.
Really great video and perfect timing for me personally! Have recently started both series and whenever I decide on my next read I tend to gravitate towards Malazan more because I find the worldbuilding and story telling to be much more intriguing. It’s nice to hear from someone who’s read both series to completion how the two compare overall, it was very clearly explained and analyzed! As always, loving the content on your channel! :-)
I think the 10 book story arc is this: they have left world better than they found it. Trull, Tehol, Shadowthrone, the Parans, Karsa etc. these are people who chose to do something good whether big or small, succeeding or failing.
Haven't read any Malazan yet but WoT is okay...I'm on Book 8 right now and it's turned into a struggle to finish. I feel like WoT started really good, stayed good for about 5 books, then waned from 6 on. Still haven't finished Path of Daggers but since you mentioned the payoffs being good...I guess I'll force myself to read through it.
Finish it bro it is worth it. It will pick back up from book 11-14 it is one hell of a ride then. But push through sidenote Path of Daggers sucks worse book out the series in my opinion
@@BookswithBrittany Book 8-11 are definitely weaker than the rest of the series, i am re-reading wot ahead of the show and slowed down when i hit 8. Sanderson did an excellent job of finishing it however.
Hi 👋 like the video!! Theses two book series are so unique that u can’t compare they both series!! I like both series in different ways... happy reading to u!!! 😊📖🍁
Halfway through Gardens Of The Moon and its not my type but I still like it. Im on Wheel Of Time book 7 and its already my favoruite series, but I still respect Malazan. Good video.
interesting I would have explained Malazan magic as being "harder". Malazan warrens are sorted into categories and have a "type". omtose phellack = ice, tellann (from memory)= fire etc etc. where WoT magic you don;t know what it can do. Both male and female can use elemental magic, mind controlling, dream walking etc etc. Theres no rules to it
I love Malazan magic because I feel it reflects real world science in a way. It's "hard" in the sense that it seemingly has some sort of logic behind it, classifications, etc. But then it's "soft" in the sense that the underlying logic is incredibly complex, esoteric, and evades full understanding, leaving people to speculate, have competing theories, and have rare moments of intellectual (or magical) revolutions that significantly change or recontextualize everything.
Please make a similar video comparing Malazan Book of the Fallen and A song of Ice and Fire. I think thats a much better and much more even comparison except the length of the books. Especially how they both handle character POVs, how the political systems work, the history, the same disregard for good vs evil, and lots of other things, which are much more similar between these two, while also being unique in their own way. Please make a video on that, which will be even more interesting.
@@BookswithBrittany this one will be even better if you can make it a collaboration video with your fellow booktubers, with a deep dive analysis and comparison, with different opinions from different people.
These are my #1 and #2 book favorite book series. For me, WoT is the better, but part of that reason is that I've been reading it since I was 11 (27 years ago) and so it has a certain reminiscent feeling attached to it. I've read it 6 times through. Malazan I've only read twice, but look forward to a reread in the near future. I don't agree with all aspects of what you said, but I feel it was a fair assessment and as you said, just your experience. For me, Jordan's prose is top-notch, though I could see where the poetic nature of Erikson's is appealing to many. For characterization, there is no comparison, WoT is far and away better. Now, don't get me wrong, Malazan has some of my favorite characters in all of fantasy, but very few of them have any real arc where you watch them grow. There are a few exceptions, but most just come as the bad-asses they are and remain as such. It is far more philosophical though and a deep look at culture. As someone who has studied anthropology for most of my adult life, I greatly appreciate Erikson's worldbuilding more, though few other authors even get close to what Jordan has accomplished with his.
Finished Wheel of Time book 14 last week, started Malazan Gardens of the Moon recently--and, it's absolutely hard to get into early. it jumps around a ton!
Honestly enjoyed reading both of these series. Finished the Wheel of Time series years ago and can still remember most of the characters and events. The story does have a lot of fantasy tropes and Robert Jordan's writing style is kind of flowery, but to be fair the first few books came out in the early 90's. There is a lot of mystery to unravel while reading the Malazan series and a near ridiculous amount of characters to remember. You can also tell right of the bat that Erikson is very intelligent and he has a interesting writing style. I personally prefer the darker more brutal setting of the Malazan world.
Excellent video!!! Malazan hands down for me as well. I only read 3 books in WOT and I wasn't feeling it. I am only two thirds through Deadhouse Gates and there NO WAY I will put this series down. I think I just connect more with realistic/flawed characters......such as myself. lol
I want to see Malazan on the screen. WOT has gotten 2 3? shows. Maisey Williams as Sorry would be perfect, she has the acting chops and the dance training.
MalaZan be ending with some crazy stuff!! When ever it ends with Kalam I’m like this about to be bloody and good!! Dude be making it out and everyone like how did he do that
I'm currently on book 3 of WoT. I enjoy the story so far, the characters do frustrate me...I enjoy them, but I also want to shake them into understanding and not being dumb in their choices. I'm not sure how far I'll make it in that series, I'm not even to "the slog" and I find myself bored sometimes. Maybe it's the fact that so much is spelled out and I don't get challenged enough while reading. I might try Malazan when I have the brain capacity for something like that. I read a little of the sample and the prose sounds beautiful, I'm just afraid of getting lost, confused and then bored because I don't understand.
Hey so I haven't read Malazan, but is it really pronounced the way she says it? Daniel Greene is the only other person I've heard talk about Malazan and he says it differently. I don't wanna be misprounouncing it lol
I liked and enjoyed both, but for me- WOT gripped me more quickly, and would be my pick. It took a few attempts to get into Malazan. I do think the stormlight archive may become my fave. Maybe i am less into the convoluted gritty books? but then i enjoy Abercrombie who is pretty gritty. Anyway i enjoyed the comparison and i do think WOT books 8-11 are weaker than the rest.
@@BookswithBrittany we all have different taste and i respect yours too. I would agree there is more 'depth' to malazan. I guess that while i do enjoy 'grey' characters, i also enjoy having characters that i can root for (a good example being brent weeks).
I read & loved Malazan. It’s up there with The First Law World & ASOIAF in my top 3 fantasy series. I haven’t read WoT but I’ve wanted to for along time but I’m not sure I’ll like it & this video makes me think hard pass lol
Well, it seems to me that despite it's length, WoT is the "easier" of the two. At least that's what I got out of this. Of course not having read either, I couldn't say for certain, but I feel like Wheel would be less complex, and least likely to make your brain explode, LOL. Plus it seems like it would be a good old-fashioned adventure story.
I want to read one of them for this summer, but I really don't know which one to choose! I just finished the first law world and I really need something in a lighter tone like the WOT, but the whole idea of Malazan is so intriguing! And then there is the problem that English is my second language and I really don't feel confident enough to read Malazan, because of what you said about its comprehensibility for someone like me. I still don't know which one I should choose 😑
A second-language reader here. I'd say go for it, if you're a more or less experienced reader of fantasy. The main obstacle would be in skipping between POVs, in how many little bits of info you're given without a systematic overview. The language itself is not extremely hard or overdone.
@@imokin86 Thanks for the reassurance! I've decided to read Malazan, and I will start reading it after my exams. Good to know that the language is not that hard, because I was expecting something like a classic in that regard.
Never read Malazan, but if it doesn't have a plot how could the payoff equal WoT? WoT's got the vice of taking too long to resolve the plot, but this gives it the virtue that 13 books Chekov's guns going off at once, which combine with your anticipation of said arsenal, make the payoff great.
So far I have enjoyed both malazan and wheel of time I'm continuing with malazan right now I'm putting wheel of time on hold for because the library still doesn't have some of the books in the series I have read four books in the wheel of time series and 6 books in the malazan series
I’d prefer wheel of time personally, tried reading gardens of the moon and didn’t much care for it. On the other hand I’m already looking forward to my wheel of time re-read
I say Malazan as two syllables (maybe 3, according to my wife) with the "a" sound identical throughout. Though I admit not looking for a pronunciation guide.
Love this video and your amazing channel please stay safe and enjoy your reading 📖 love your number one Australia fan John looking like I have a lot of reading to do as I have never read either series can I please ask can you read both series together or one at a time
If the question between two series is which is better, you won't get 100 answers from 100 people. You'll get two answers, because there's only two answers to give.
Take it from my experience: if you’re someone who is looking for something to read after getting into game of thrones, The Wheel of Time is NOT it. In my opinion (which I like to think of as spectacular), if you’re willing to commit an excess amount of your time to reading a big ass series, Malazan is *by far* the better choice. That being said, it really does come down to your taste. I bring up game of thrones because I loved the gritty, cutthroat aspects. You will not find that in Robert Jordan’s writing. Instead, you will find glorified, overly complicated young adult fantasy with a sheen of inoffensive gloss coating every page. I will concede by saying I really enjoyed the great hunt though.
Easy way to find out honest opinion is to ask which one would you re-read 1st? Malazan wins every time hands down.. Have you tried the other dozen or so Malazan books outside of the Big Ten yet?
Oh that is an easy question to answer: Malazan. I might have little to no understanding on half the stuff in the series, but I have very rarely ever thought "I don't think the book needed to tell me about xyz". The inverse is true for wheel of time, and so I often find myself not liking it.
WoT is ok, i guess? I didn't dislike it, but for me it's not worth a reread. Malazan on the other hand, well i'm re-reading it, again (round 3) and i don't think it will be the last time...
I love both series and they are both in my top 5 all time currently. But for me WoT is better overall. Malazan has the best world building in the fantasy genre but WoT is very good there as well. Malazan also has a more complex plot and overall story than WoT but that can actually be a determent at times. It felt like Erikson intentionally made it too complicated; particularly with the jumping around from book to book. All that jumping around made it very hard for me to grow attached to any of the characters. I finally started liking a few in HoC and then bam; MT came along with an entire new set. That caused me to absolutely hate that book. I almost dropped the series midway through MT. I powered on because of how much I loved HoC. The ending of MT was great but that still is probably one of my least favorite books of all time and the reason that Malazan sits in my #4 spot in my top 10 and not #2. WoT on the other hand has the best characters in all of fantasy in my opinion. They main cast feel like they are old friends to me and it felt like I went on this amazing journey WITH them; not just read about it but actually experienced it alongside them. By the very end of Malazan I had some of those same feelings towards Fiddler and his Bonehunter squadmates. But it only happened in the second half of the series. Those first five books only had the Karsa sequence in HoC that gave me anything close to those same feelings. For me it's all about the characters so WoT is my #1 all time favorite and it probably always will be. But as I said I love Malazan as well (minus MT anyway, lol) and I feel like it will always have a spot in my top 10. But it also kind of feels like a bit of a letdown really. The series had amazing world building, an interesting story overall and some good characters as well. It should have ended up beating out WoT for that top spot. But the way Erikson told the story hurts it. If he had told the story in a more linear fashion without all the jumping around it would have been much better.
Both series kind of lose me in the middle, both in the series and in individual volumes. If I didn't have a good friend loaning me the WoT books, I probably would have taken far longer to finish...which is happening with Malazan.
Good news: The last five books of MBotF weren't the last five. And the prequels are as good as or better than The Ten. Linear plot, more focus on main characters, and because they are prequels, there's a notion of how things will end up for the fans of works of fiction geared more towards juvenile or less well-read fan bases- like Sanderson's, GoT and WoT, lol.
OK, the Wheel of Time died on me during some circus or something that took a book or more... I started snoring, and I never finished the series, I think. Well, somebody hid in a haystack that shouldn't be there at that time of the year... Isn't Erickson's Malazan books just as boring as Martin's, as just about everyone you might like just dies??? Oh, we need to look beyond that? Oops... Lev
I want to say something about Malazan's gender parity and sexual assault that I feel is often overlooked. (Disclaimer: I am a straight cis man so I have no personal experience being a woman. Like to think I'm empathetic and knowledgeable enough to make for a decent feminist, though.) First, I will say that Erikson does excellent on gender equality in social structures, military, etc. Moreover, it does it in a very organic manner that doesn't get awkwardly explicit and self-congratulatory where it blatantly states stuff like "woman can be just as strong and competent as men!" Now, all that said, I have some critiques on Erikson's handling of sexual assault. For one, I think he kind of overuses it as a plot/character device. Now, it's never pointless or gratuitous, and it (with one exception that was incredibly bad and cringy and so out of character for the series) always leads to relevant development -- sometimes even fantastic explorations (the exploration of indulging in personal trauma instead of moving on in MT, the motherhood stuff in TtH, etc)...so I can't be TOO mad at it. But it also is used SO often. I think GotM may be the only book in the series that doesn't include any sexual assault (and TCG? But since it's lumped into DoD so often...) And then he uses it again in Kharkanas Trilogy. And again in TGiNW. Again, it's not really that big of an issue since he utilizes it well in themes and development, rather than being gratuitous and exploitative. And the scale of the series and amount of characters is so large that even if it does occur in most books there's so much else there that it doesn't feel excessive. But, in retrospect, it certainly is a plot device Erikson has a habit of using. For the more spicy take though: the way the sexual assault of men is handled is kind of frustrating and isn't equal to the women in this regard at all. And I'm not just talking in quantity -- that's fine and realistic enough. No, I mean the quality. When women are raped in Malazan it tends to be violently, by malicious men just trying to assert power and get their rocks off. It's incredibly traumatic and significantly contributes to their arc and introspection. When men are raped it tends to be by goddesses or other such mystical ghostly figures, within a fugue or dreamlike state, and usually less about power and sex and more about utility (stealing their sperm to fulfill a purpose.) The men tend not to be bothered too much in the long term. Udinaas is the best example of a man who actually has some trauma from it, but even then it's barely anything compared to the women. This is a...noticeable trend after awhile, so I've always found it a bit odd how often people praise Malazan for simply including sexual assault of both genders, without going into any further nuance. There are exceptions of course. The Tenescrowri is often pointed out when I bring this up...but that's more of a world building thing than actual character experiences. The victims are all nameless and without POVs. And beyond that we get into the realm of using sexual assault of men as a punchline such as the Hedge/Detoran dynamic and some of the Ublala stuff. Erikson's usage of that really stuck out to me as like the one regressive old trope the series fell into. Though (and I'll be vague here to avoid spoilers) he does finally switch up the male sexual assault style in TGINW, and while it's still not really equal to the sexual assault of women in the series, it is easily the best and most compelling usage thus far. So perhaps Erikson has heard some of these criticisms before and actively worked to improve, which is great.
I’ve never spent a longer time reading per page than malazan and I love it, sometimes I have to reread a paragraph to get the whole picture
A very helpful video, Brittany! I appreciate how well considered your comments on both series are. People can appreciate both series even though they’re different in many important respects. Like you, I have a personal preference for Malazan, but I respect WoT as a tremendous achievement.
Thank you so much, Philip! I appreciate that.
It nearly perfected lotr
Brilliant video and, in my opinion, insightful and balanced. Really great points about both series, especially as you highlight aspects that some might feel are negatives or positives depending on taste and preference. As ever, fantastic to hear your thoughts. Have a great week.
Thank you, I really appreciate that! :)
I see on your bookshelf that the Dune series is like the buff dude keeping Malazan and WoT separated.
LOL ! Love that 😂
Good eye lol
Brilliant video, Brittany! Although I can't speak for the Wheel of Time, I am completely with you on everything said about MBotF, at least as far along as I am right now. I don't think I could ever subject myself to the video challenge of explaining what the series is about, but the in-depth character work, prose, and themes are truly sublime. I wish I understood more than I do regarding various plot threads, but all the better for readers who love a great challenge and/or appreciate rereading a series. Brava, my friend!
Thank you so much, glad you enjoyed it! ☺️
Having read both series, WoT easier read ,Mazalan really comes to life on reread. Both good reads.
WoT was almost entirely about gender dynamics with an ode to past civilization. The characters were very realistic in the sense that if something annoys you or attracts you about one of them, it always will. Erikson very credibly tackles gender dynamics, conservatism vs liberalism, reactionaries vs visionaries, race vs race, conservationism vs exploitation, good old days vs dystopia, bad old days vs enlightened civilization, capitalism vs communism, pastoralism vs city states, religion vs rational philosphy,.. constant juxtaposition.
Videos like these are part of what makes your channel so amazing!
🤍🤍🤍
I love how Wisdom of crowds is just chilling horizontally in the corner.
This was such a good discussion! I think I would prefer WOT just bc I haven’t read that much high fantasy but I really want to get into it. I’ve only read the name of the wind (and loved it), but more straight forward plot, easier to read prose, and a good payoff make me feel like I’m just at a point in life where I could enjoy WOT. Such a good job discussing both series so well to help someone figure out what’s better for them, thank you!
Glad you enjoyed it! :)
As usual I found myself nodding along with virtually the entire video. Great comparisons.
Thanks, glad you enjoyed it!
Thanks for making this video. I read WoT during lockdown after failing to finish the series a few years ago. While I'm happy that reading it reignited my love of reading, I can't say I enjoyed Jordan's writing at all. I've dug deep and found more of my preferences and now Malazan is my next big commitment. After I finish the last 4 Dune books. And the last Expanse book. Ha!
Been waiting for this video for awhile to see your thoughts and preferences on both series. There is absolutely tons of enjoyment to be gained from both series but I am glad you favored Malazan in the end. I hope you continue on in the Malazan world with all the other side novels!
I definitely want to! I just needed a break :)
Both series are in my top 5 but Malazan is my all time favorite that I go back to over and over
Love it!
Wonderfully done! Thank you so much for doing this! I had been going back and forth as to which series to attempt first!
Glad it was helpful!
Good comparison. I prefer Malazan for many reasons but if I had to pick one it would be the characterization. We're rewarded for observing characters and spending time inside their heads with an insight into humanity, compassion, trauma, memory, relationships, etc. the list goes on and on. Not "I wish Paran were here he's good at talking to women."
I first heard of Malazan back in 2017 when I just started WoT. I’m still lukewarm on WoT, great worldbuilding but so much wasted time and I honestly didn’t enjoy lots of the characters. That’s me focusing on the bad rather than the good, but man does Book 10 not need to exist.
Malazan is something I heard so many conflicting information on that I only decided to read it recently. Part of the reason I was lukewarm on WoT is because of poor expectations, which left me disappointed. I think I’m better I figuring out how the books will actually be and I think I’m ready for Malazan.
Great comparison, thanks for this. I think it’s funny when you compare some WoT and they seem so small scale compared to Malazan while WoT is on a much larger scale than most fantasy, just shows how broad Malazan is. Malazan BotF sounds like a ten volume history series writing as a memoir but like real life their are no main characters.
It sure is! Good luck with your reading journey :)
Love this video! I have read 5 WoT books so far and I definitely agree with your criticisms, though I refuse to DNF the series at this point because now I am too invested to stop, lol. And even though I am not really a fan of war/battle stories, Malazan still intrigues me quite a bit. Especially the writing just sounds too good to miss out on.
Thank you for doing this video, you did an amazing job comparing these series imo! ❤
Thank you so much my friend 🤍
Haven’t read either series yet but I had no intention of getting to Malazan before finding your channel. Now it’s absolutely on my tbr even if I’m still intimidated by it
It’s definitely worth checking out!
No need to be intimidated. 😊 imagine yourself as being right there with the characters, learning what's going on along with them. Imagine being part of what's going on rather than being told a story.
Your thoughts on the series payoff at the end match many of my own feelings. The end of the Wheel of Time left me with that "It was all worth it!" feeling that I was hoping for. Malazan just left me wondering. That being said, not very many days go by that I don't think about Malazan's ending and themes. Whereas Wheel of Time is just... Done. So in a way Malazan has left more of a lasting effect on me. So there's that.
I can definitely understand / agree with that!
Hi Brittany,
I agree on both counts. Before I comment.. need to restate my observation on your intro. Hands down, my FAVE post intro is your "Helllll-Oh" !!! Borderline obsessed lol. Anyway, I met Jordan several times. He always stated in every signing HE controlled his characters like "an Old Testament God". So he's severely repetitive. Never forget. But Jordan knows how to close the deal :-).
Love Malazan bc as you say Erickson gives nothing away - you read or you die (as in you're lost lol). So Malazan seems richer bc he doesn't puke obvious detail. His magic to me is softer... non-formulaic.
Jordan was a Southern boy... from Charleston no less. I'm from SC but traveled the globe as a Producer with NBC News in 90s. Jordan was a veteran with depth in world views. He oozes the Old Money and Southern Belle feel of historic Charleston. I've learned to look past his obvious gender hang-ups. Love both for very different reasons.
PS- You and I gotta talk Star Wars my friend.
Rob
Interesting, I didn’t know that!
I've been reading shorter books in the last month. But after my interview with Philip Chase, I think I'm going to give Malazan a go.
Hope you enjoy them!
Having read both series several times, and dune twice. I have never made any connections between dune and wheel of time before. Chosen one tropes are not new, but now you mention it I can draw parallels between the aiel and freeman, and the benijezzeret and aes Sedai, not in function or methodology, but being a desert tribe and a powerful order of supposed witches
Really!?
From my WoT experience, Robert Jordan is a master subtly. Re-reads is where this comes out. Also I found his writing poetic during the re-reads.
And as Sanderson himself admits, _his own prose is like a - clear glass - window while Robert Jordan's is a - stained glass - window._
I myself have only read the first Malazan book so I cannot really comment on that yet.
I enjoyed your insightful review/comparison. I was thinking about TV adaptations with WOT coming out Friday. I cannot imagine how they could ever adapt Erickson's work to a TV series, LOL. Not enough consistent plot/characters. Kind of like how Foundatin would be difficult for viewers to follow as characters change so often, WOT has a lot of characters but consistently follows a few main ones and has a straight forward plot/goal. I thin the TV series will be really good because they can eliminate excessive descriptions like what the dresses looked like bu simply showing them. I know you review books but woud be interested in your thoughts on the WOT TV series if you have time to watch it. As always, I enjoy your channel.
Thank you! Yes I’ll definitely be watching / discussing it :)
With regards to payoff, the one thing I would like to add is that; while the series itself doesn't have a great payoff in a typical sense, there are books in the series that have some amazing and satisfying conclusions. I'm thinking Reapers Gale and Toll the Hound in particular.
Really great video and perfect timing for me personally! Have recently started both series and whenever I decide on my next read I tend to gravitate towards Malazan more because I find the worldbuilding and story telling to be much more intriguing. It’s nice to hear from someone who’s read both series to completion how the two compare overall, it was very clearly explained and analyzed! As always, loving the content on your channel! :-)
Thanks so much! Glad you found this helpful :)
I think the 10 book story arc is this: they have left world better than they found it. Trull, Tehol, Shadowthrone, the Parans, Karsa etc. these are people who chose to do something good whether big or small, succeeding or failing.
Haven't read any Malazan yet but WoT is okay...I'm on Book 8 right now and it's turned into a struggle to finish. I feel like WoT started really good, stayed good for about 5 books, then waned from 6 on. Still haven't finished Path of Daggers but since you mentioned the payoffs being good...I guess I'll force myself to read through it.
Finish it bro it is worth it. It will pick back up from book 11-14 it is one hell of a ride then. But push through sidenote Path of Daggers sucks worse book out the series in my opinion
I do think it’s worth finishing!
I'm only on book 3 and I'm having commitment issues to the series... so props to you for getting as far as you are!
@@TheArtfulBrittani book 4 one of my favorites don't give up stay 💪
@@BookswithBrittany Book 8-11 are definitely weaker than the rest of the series, i am re-reading wot ahead of the show and slowed down when i hit 8. Sanderson did an excellent job of finishing it however.
Hi 👋 like the video!! Theses two book series are so unique that u can’t compare they both series!! I like both series in different ways... happy reading to u!!! 😊📖🍁
Truly not able to compare them against each other! More about helping people pick the right one for their reading tastes
@@BookswithBrittany thank u for the video!! Happy reading to u!!
Halfway through Gardens Of The Moon and its not my type but I still like it. Im on Wheel Of Time book 7 and its already my favoruite series, but I still respect Malazan. Good video.
Glad you’re enjoying WoT!
Give it till book 3 for Malazan. The first book is largely counted as the weakest of the series. 😊
interesting I would have explained Malazan magic as being "harder". Malazan warrens are sorted into categories and have a "type". omtose phellack = ice, tellann (from memory)= fire etc etc. where WoT magic you don;t know what it can do. Both male and female can use elemental magic, mind controlling, dream walking etc etc. Theres no rules to it
If you watch the video where I have a conversation with Steven Erikson he does not describe the magic in his books as ‘hard’.
I love Malazan magic because I feel it reflects real world science in a way.
It's "hard" in the sense that it seemingly has some sort of logic behind it, classifications, etc.
But then it's "soft" in the sense that the underlying logic is incredibly complex, esoteric, and evades full understanding, leaving people to speculate, have competing theories, and have rare moments of intellectual (or magical) revolutions that significantly change or recontextualize everything.
Please make a similar video comparing Malazan Book of the Fallen and A song of Ice and Fire. I think thats a much better and much more even comparison except the length of the books. Especially how they both handle character POVs, how the political systems work, the history, the same disregard for good vs evil, and lots of other things, which are much more similar between these two, while also being unique in their own way. Please make a video on that, which will be even more interesting.
I’ll have to wait until I reread ASOIAF so it’s fresh in my memory. I finished it years ago
@@BookswithBrittany this one will be even better if you can make it a collaboration video with your fellow booktubers, with a deep dive analysis and comparison, with different opinions from different people.
Brittany thank you for this video. It's great and you are wonderful
Glad you enjoyed it :)
These are my #1 and #2 book favorite book series. For me, WoT is the better, but part of that reason is that I've been reading it since I was 11 (27 years ago) and so it has a certain reminiscent feeling attached to it. I've read it 6 times through. Malazan I've only read twice, but look forward to a reread in the near future.
I don't agree with all aspects of what you said, but I feel it was a fair assessment and as you said, just your experience. For me, Jordan's prose is top-notch, though I could see where the poetic nature of Erikson's is appealing to many. For characterization, there is no comparison, WoT is far and away better. Now, don't get me wrong, Malazan has some of my favorite characters in all of fantasy, but very few of them have any real arc where you watch them grow. There are a few exceptions, but most just come as the bad-asses they are and remain as such. It is far more philosophical though and a deep look at culture. As someone who has studied anthropology for most of my adult life, I greatly appreciate Erikson's worldbuilding more, though few other authors even get close to what Jordan has accomplished with his.
Finished Wheel of Time book 14 last week, started Malazan Gardens of the Moon recently--and, it's absolutely hard to get into early. it jumps around a ton!
Honestly enjoyed reading both of these series. Finished the Wheel of Time series years ago and can still remember most of the characters and events. The story does have a lot of fantasy tropes and Robert Jordan's writing style is kind of flowery, but to be fair the first few books came out in the early 90's.
There is a lot of mystery to unravel while reading the Malazan series and a near ridiculous amount of characters to remember. You can also tell right of the bat that Erikson is very intelligent and he has a interesting writing style. I personally prefer the darker more brutal setting of the Malazan world.
So do i!
Excellent video!!! Malazan hands down for me as well. I only read 3 books in WOT and I wasn't feeling it. I am only two thirds through Deadhouse Gates and there NO WAY I will put this series down. I think I just connect more with realistic/flawed characters......such as myself. lol
Yeah I much prefer Malazan too!
If you like words, try The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever.
I want to see Malazan on the screen. WOT has gotten 2 3? shows. Maisey Williams as Sorry would be perfect, she has the acting chops and the dance training.
MalaZan be ending with some crazy stuff!! When ever it ends with Kalam I’m like this about to be bloody and good!! Dude be making it out and everyone like how did he do that
There are definitely crazy things that happen.
I'm currently on book 3 of WoT. I enjoy the story so far, the characters do frustrate me...I enjoy them, but I also want to shake them into understanding and not being dumb in their choices. I'm not sure how far I'll make it in that series, I'm not even to "the slog" and I find myself bored sometimes. Maybe it's the fact that so much is spelled out and I don't get challenged enough while reading. I might try Malazan when I have the brain capacity for something like that. I read a little of the sample and the prose sounds beautiful, I'm just afraid of getting lost, confused and then bored because I don't understand.
I say give it a go! :)
Hey so I haven't read Malazan, but is it really pronounced the way she says it? Daniel Greene is the only other person I've heard talk about Malazan and he says it differently.
I don't wanna be misprounouncing it lol
I pronounce it the way the author does.
@@BookswithBrittany Okay thanks! I just started reading Gardens of The Moon today.
Very different and both in my top 5 series all time, I have read both 3 times so far
thats an accomplishment!
I liked and enjoyed both, but for me- WOT gripped me more quickly, and would be my pick. It took a few attempts to get into Malazan. I do think the stormlight archive may become my fave. Maybe i am less into the convoluted gritty books? but then i enjoy Abercrombie who is pretty gritty. Anyway i enjoyed the comparison and i do think WOT books 8-11 are weaker than the rest.
I completely respect your opinion!
@@BookswithBrittany we all have different taste and i respect yours too. I would agree there is more 'depth' to malazan. I guess that while i do enjoy 'grey' characters, i also enjoy having characters that i can root for (a good example being brent weeks).
@@tw7998 I also LOVE Brent Week’s books !
I read & loved Malazan. It’s up there with The First Law World & ASOIAF in my top 3 fantasy series.
I haven’t read WoT but I’ve wanted to for along time but I’m not sure I’ll like it & this video makes me think hard pass lol
Well, it seems to me that despite it's length, WoT is the "easier" of the two. At least that's what I got out of this. Of course not having read either, I couldn't say for certain, but I feel like Wheel would be less complex, and least likely to make your brain explode, LOL. Plus it seems like it would be a good old-fashioned adventure story.
I would say WoT is far easier to read / understand
Brittany have you done or will you be hosting live chats during the holidays? - Rob
I want to read one of them for this summer, but I really don't know which one to choose! I just finished the first law world and I really need something in a lighter tone like the WOT, but the whole idea of Malazan is so intriguing!
And then there is the problem that English is my second language and I really don't feel confident enough to read Malazan, because of what you said about its comprehensibility for someone like me.
I still don't know which one I should choose 😑
A second-language reader here. I'd say go for it, if you're a more or less experienced reader of fantasy. The main obstacle would be in skipping between POVs, in how many little bits of info you're given without a systematic overview. The language itself is not extremely hard or overdone.
@@imokin86 Thanks for the reassurance! I've decided to read Malazan, and I will start reading it after my exams. Good to know that the language is not that hard, because I was expecting something like a classic in that regard.
Never read Malazan, but if it doesn't have a plot how could the payoff equal WoT? WoT's got the vice of taking too long to resolve the plot, but this gives it the virtue that 13 books Chekov's guns going off at once, which combine with your anticipation of said arsenal, make the payoff great.
Well there’s obviously still a plot, just not one single plot
So far I have enjoyed both malazan and wheel of time I'm continuing with malazan right now I'm putting wheel of time on hold for because the library still doesn't have some of the books in the series I have read four books in the wheel of time series and 6 books in the malazan series
Glad you’re enjoying both!
I’d prefer wheel of time personally, tried reading gardens of the moon and didn’t much care for it. On the other hand I’m already looking forward to my wheel of time re-read
Im on book 6 of wot and I absolutely love IT however I never read Malazan. 😊
I say Malazan as two syllables (maybe 3, according to my wife) with the "a" sound identical throughout. Though I admit not looking for a pronunciation guide.
Malazan stands head and shoulders above The Wheel Of Time for me
Love this video and your amazing channel please stay safe and enjoy your reading 📖 love your number one Australia fan John looking like I have a lot of reading to do as I have never read either series can I please ask can you read both series together or one at a time
Don't read anything else while you read Malazan, seriously.
I wouldn’t advise it either
@Lowland Joe no worries 😉 thanks
@Books with Brittany no worries 😉 thank you 😊
I am finally doin it! I am starting Malazan Jan 2022 ! 🤗
If the question between two series is which is better, you won't get 100 answers from 100 people. You'll get two answers, because there's only two answers to give.
Literally my top two series ever. Not fair.
🙈
Take it from my experience: if you’re someone who is looking for something to read after getting into game of thrones, The Wheel of Time is NOT it. In my opinion (which I like to think of as spectacular), if you’re willing to commit an excess amount of your time to reading a big ass series, Malazan is *by far* the better choice.
That being said, it really does come down to your taste. I bring up game of thrones because I loved the gritty, cutthroat aspects. You will not find that in Robert Jordan’s writing. Instead, you will find glorified, overly complicated young adult fantasy with a sheen of inoffensive gloss coating every page.
I will concede by saying I really enjoyed the great hunt though.
I totally agree 😂🙈
@@BooksRebound always nice to find like minded people! In light of that, I’m going to check out your channel now for more of your glowing takes.
Well stated
Easy way to find out honest opinion is to ask which one would you re-read 1st? Malazan wins every time hands down.. Have you tried the other dozen or so Malazan books outside of the Big Ten yet?
I’m just taking a break but will eventually !
Great job 👍
The Wheel of Time’s magic system is not shaped by gender roles, it is based on sex.
Oh that is an easy question to answer: Malazan. I might have little to no understanding on half the stuff in the series, but I have very rarely ever thought "I don't think the book needed to tell me about xyz". The inverse is true for wheel of time, and so I often find myself not liking it.
WoT is ok, i guess? I didn't dislike it, but for me it's not worth a reread.
Malazan on the other hand, well i'm re-reading it, again (round 3) and i don't think it will be the last time...
🙌🏻🙌🏻
The Aes Sedai from WOT are inspired by the Bene Gesserit from Dune.
Very obviously so…
I love both series and they are both in my top 5 all time currently. But for me WoT is better overall. Malazan has the best world building in the fantasy genre but WoT is very good there as well. Malazan also has a more complex plot and overall story than WoT but that can actually be a determent at times. It felt like Erikson intentionally made it too complicated; particularly with the jumping around from book to book.
All that jumping around made it very hard for me to grow attached to any of the characters. I finally started liking a few in HoC and then bam; MT came along with an entire new set. That caused me to absolutely hate that book. I almost dropped the series midway through MT. I powered on because of how much I loved HoC. The ending of MT was great but that still is probably one of my least favorite books of all time and the reason that Malazan sits in my #4 spot in my top 10 and not #2.
WoT on the other hand has the best characters in all of fantasy in my opinion. They main cast feel like they are old friends to me and it felt like I went on this amazing journey WITH them; not just read about it but actually experienced it alongside them. By the very end of Malazan I had some of those same feelings towards Fiddler and his Bonehunter squadmates. But it only happened in the second half of the series. Those first five books only had the Karsa sequence in HoC that gave me anything close to those same feelings.
For me it's all about the characters so WoT is my #1 all time favorite and it probably always will be. But as I said I love Malazan as well (minus MT anyway, lol) and I feel like it will always have a spot in my top 10. But it also kind of feels like a bit of a letdown really. The series had amazing world building, an interesting story overall and some good characters as well. It should have ended up beating out WoT for that top spot. But the way Erikson told the story hurts it. If he had told the story in a more linear fashion without all the jumping around it would have been much better.
I don't read the wheel of time but I LOVE the malazan world
Yass 🙌🏻
Both are necessary reads if you want to be a knowledgeable fantasy reader. WoT is like getting your masters and Malazan is getting your Phd.
I’m glad I’ve read both just to know more about the genre in the past
I like this comparison. And The Lord of the Rings would be the Bachelor’s? 😂
Yes😊😊😊
In addition, did you see the DUNE movie, what did you think? I thought it was really well done.
I’ve got a quite a few videos where I discuss it :)
@@BookswithBrittany Thanks, I will look for them
Both series kind of lose me in the middle, both in the series and in individual volumes. If I didn't have a good friend loaning me the WoT books, I probably would have taken far longer to finish...which is happening with Malazan.
Yeah I definitely think they both have pacing issues for what I prefer
I wanna get into Malazan but i can’t find the hardcovers for a good price
Yeah they’re usually 35-50$
Good news: The last five books of MBotF weren't the last five. And the prequels are as good as or better than The Ten. Linear plot, more focus on main characters, and because they are prequels, there's a notion of how things will end up for the fans of works of fiction geared more towards juvenile or less well-read fan bases- like Sanderson's, GoT and WoT, lol.
OK, the Wheel of Time died on me during some circus or something that took a book or more... I started snoring, and I never finished the series, I think. Well, somebody hid in a haystack that shouldn't be there at that time of the year...
Isn't Erickson's Malazan books just as boring as Martin's, as just about everyone you might like just dies??? Oh, we need to look beyond that? Oops...
Lev
The wheel of time slog might because that's when he got sick about that time and treatmente
Malazan slaps like no one
I want to say something about Malazan's gender parity and sexual assault that I feel is often overlooked. (Disclaimer: I am a straight cis man so I have no personal experience being a woman. Like to think I'm empathetic and knowledgeable enough to make for a decent feminist, though.)
First, I will say that Erikson does excellent on gender equality in social structures, military, etc. Moreover, it does it in a very organic manner that doesn't get awkwardly explicit and self-congratulatory where it blatantly states stuff like "woman can be just as strong and competent as men!"
Now, all that said, I have some critiques on Erikson's handling of sexual assault.
For one, I think he kind of overuses it as a plot/character device. Now, it's never pointless or gratuitous, and it (with one exception that was incredibly bad and cringy and so out of character for the series) always leads to relevant development -- sometimes even fantastic explorations (the exploration of indulging in personal trauma instead of moving on in MT, the motherhood stuff in TtH, etc)...so I can't be TOO mad at it. But it also is used SO often. I think GotM may be the only book in the series that doesn't include any sexual assault (and TCG? But since it's lumped into DoD so often...)
And then he uses it again in Kharkanas Trilogy. And again in TGiNW.
Again, it's not really that big of an issue since he utilizes it well in themes and development, rather than being gratuitous and exploitative. And the scale of the series and amount of characters is so large that even if it does occur in most books there's so much else there that it doesn't feel excessive.
But, in retrospect, it certainly is a plot device Erikson has a habit of using.
For the more spicy take though: the way the sexual assault of men is handled is kind of frustrating and isn't equal to the women in this regard at all. And I'm not just talking in quantity -- that's fine and realistic enough. No, I mean the quality.
When women are raped in Malazan it tends to be violently, by malicious men just trying to assert power and get their rocks off. It's incredibly traumatic and significantly contributes to their arc and introspection.
When men are raped it tends to be by goddesses or other such mystical ghostly figures, within a fugue or dreamlike state, and usually less about power and sex and more about utility (stealing their sperm to fulfill a purpose.) The men tend not to be bothered too much in the long term. Udinaas is the best example of a man who actually has some trauma from it, but even then it's barely anything compared to the women.
This is a...noticeable trend after awhile, so I've always found it a bit odd how often people praise Malazan for simply including sexual assault of both genders, without going into any further nuance.
There are exceptions of course. The Tenescrowri is often pointed out when I bring this up...but that's more of a world building thing than actual character experiences. The victims are all nameless and without POVs.
And beyond that we get into the realm of using sexual assault of men as a punchline such as the Hedge/Detoran dynamic and some of the Ublala stuff. Erikson's usage of that really stuck out to me as like the one regressive old trope the series fell into.
Though (and I'll be vague here to avoid spoilers) he does finally switch up the male sexual assault style in TGINW, and while it's still not really equal to the sexual assault of women in the series, it is easily the best and most compelling usage thus far. So perhaps Erikson has heard some of these criticisms before and actively worked to improve, which is great.
I definitely respect and appreciate your thoughts and opinions. There’s truth in there and as you said much more to the overall discussion !
Not read Malazan at all, but anything has to be better than WoT.
🤣
Brave topic choice lol
🤷🏼♀️🙃
I stopped reading WoT because of the gender problems.
Totally understand that!
The wheel of time is better because the series is actually finished
Malazan is a 10 book finished series…
you guys dont need a video to tell you MALAZAN is the GOAT of fantasy.We all know that