QUESTIONS COMMENT THREAD: What questions do you have? Reply to this comment so I can see it better! And thanks to all the patrons for their support and all of you for helping me get this channel monetized (this video was demonetized though!)
It blows my mind that The Super Mario Bros Movie (which isn't even a musical) did an intentionally terrible villain song for the sake of comedy, and it still was a better villain song than the one DISNEY DID.
The song sounds like a Disney message to the disney fans and haters,in the song it talks about wanting "respect" "complaining" "see this kingdom I've built and you still complain,the disrespect,are you sure You're not the problem" " I'd love to see you try and do my job" "desperate times call for desperate measures" " i refuse to have my power stripped",etc.
I just feel like it could have been better. (Imagine a more opera, theatrical style) “Their wants and their wishes, they drive me insane” (Puts on a little girl voice) “I want a big lion with a puffy great mane” (Back to normal making glasses and a list) “They beg for my power -cause they” (hint of confusion) “can’t fix a net?” “And thiiis is the thanks that I GET!?”
this SCREAMS classic disney villain to me - so perfect and so inspiring in just a few lines!! i swear i can feel all the lost potential from this movie in these few brainstorm corrections. absolutely fantastic, you have my songwriter brain buzzing
@@luxgaster9333 not really, I’m just good with short rhyme segments. Using words was never my strength, but give me enough to work with (in this case “evil wish granting king” and “this is the thanks that I get”) and I can occasionally get a hit. Most miss though.
Writing this here since some people are jumping down your throat and not listening. You're not the only one who felt this song was lacking and disappointing as a villain song.
I appreciate this! I think people think I'm attacking the movie or something - I'm actually looking forward to the movie, but I care a lot about music and this song isn't hitting it for me.
I still haven't seen the movie, but I've listened to this song a few times now and I don't like it. I've heard worse songs, but I love the Disney villain songs and this was extremely disappointing.
You know, Lin already wrote a super similar song to TITTIG with King George’s numbers in Hamilton. Same sort of sentiment, different styles, but much better delivery
Yes, except in that case it had a reason to be that way. LMM intentionally wrote the song to have that upbeat pop style to mimic breakup songs from british boy bands at the time. That's also why it is kind of a unique song in Hamilton and emphasized by how King George is the only one with an accent in that whole show (at least in US iterations afaik)
"This is the Thanks I Get?!" just SCREAMS "Contemporary Pop" that I thought I was accidentally listening to a song from a Disney Channel original movie instead.
The instrumental of “This is the Thanks I Get” is like that music that plays in medication commercials where the people are dancing, celebrating, and having fun while the side effects are being listed.
I looked up the instrumental version of this song because i suspected that it would sound like stock music and i was right. I even played to my gf and told her it was stock music and she believed me
This is very upsetting especially since what better way to show how characters differentiate from each other than genre? They could have given The King very royal/regal music and songs while making Asha’s songs more pop/modern showing their views stylistically. But Modern Disney is the epitome of lazy and refuses to get with the program. Very upsetting we could’ve had a banger
One of the keys to a villain song is being composed in minor. Our brains are hardwired to associate songs in minor to situations and characters with an eerie or tragic portrayal from years and years and years of audiovisual media linking notes to emotions. Magnifico's song is in major, which gives it a peppy tone that doesn't match the level of ill-will in his train of thought. This song would be more appropriate for a goodwilled character who got genuinely wronged.
While thats true, thats not always the case Mother Knows Best and Gaston are in Major key (i personally dont consider Gaston the villain song though but many do ), Major doesnt always mean happy or good and minor doesn't always mean sad or evil. . in theory this song could work in Major, and it goes into a shepards tone at the end. but execution is its downfall. theres stuff way more wrong with it that isn't just being in the wrong key. its just frankyl a very weak and sage song all together even if Magnifsco was written to be more antagonistic or good instead of villainous this song would still be weak in its current state.
@@stephanos6128 True. Mother Knows Best is in major cuz she wants to come across helpful and caring but it quickly turns to minor in its reprise cuz she's trying to discredit Rapunzel's choices, and Gaston is mostly the villagers' perspective of him, although I honestly think this is due to these songs surrounding the image they wanna pass rather than their thoughts and emotions. Magnifico's song sounds like a standalone pop song, and not by coincidence. For some reason, Disney brought in people who specialized in pop songs rather than musicals. *Sigh* I miss Stephen Sondheim.
@@IMayOrMayHaveNot right, but even as a standalone pop song this song is ass, there's betterpop sings on the radio as we speak. the song needed to be reworked entirely but its key isnt really a problem if an actual skilled songwriter put in the work and time into the song. i learned recently this movies music was written in a very rushed manner and without much context for the songwriter to work with, so Pop Writers isn't entirely the problem here (and it discredits other pop writers who write for Disney music and gave us actual bangers) Magnifeco's song is a glorified demo, a rough draft of the rough draft.
@@stephanos6128 Fair enough! I still think they should've hired composers specialized in musicals if they wanted to properly give their 100th anniversary a homage worthy of the Disney name. Once Upon A Studio was a MUCH better celebratory piece than whatever Wish tried to amount to.
I agree with you wholeheartedly with the music not being reactive enough to King Magnifico during the song, as it just gives the music personality and life as if it is either agreeing or disagreeing with the villain, or like it’s just trying to play along with the villain as well. There was like one or two moments near the end that almost got it right in the song which is why I like the ending half better, but it still is a weird song to hear as a villain song.
Exactly. And it’s not like modern Disney is completely inept at that particular skill either. “We Don’t Talk About Bruno” is a great example of a modern Disney song with plenty of reactive moments, even down to the beat of the song itself changing depending on which character is singing. It’s so disappointing that they couldn’t (or wouldn’t) do for Wish what they did for Encanto, at least musically. Imagine how great it could’ve been.
"You'll Be Back" also works because even though it's peppy, it fits the kings insanity (honestly, it feels like " the Thanks I Get" is trying to be "You'll be Back" but failing miserably)
@@undergirl04 Agreed. The dissonance of the deranged lyrics and the upbeat music serves to perfectly highlight how insane George's mentality is. Plus, the true terror about "You'll Be Back" is that it essentially reads like an abusive romantic partner's dialogue, only this time imagine if that abuser partner was literally a king and they're victim was America itself. That terror underneath the silliness is what makes the song work.
AAAAAAAAAAH WAIT FOT IT WASHINGTON ON YOUR SIDE AND ROOM WHERE IT HAPPENS MENTIONED ‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼WTF ARE BAD SONGS??? I LOVE any of Aaron's songs in Hamilton because they are just SO INDICATIVE of the theme of Hamilton's musical, that since this is from Hamilton's biographical perspective, Aaron being the "villain" is untrue, like it says in The World was Wide Enough: "Now I'm the villain in your history". Burr is never a malicious villain, he's just a political rival of Hamilton and both had been at each other's good and bad sides, is just the framing of the story that changes how we see a character. If this was Burr's biographical musical, Hamilton would be the nuisance that is constantly hindering his political life. Wait For It is just the biggest example of this because it doesn't show us Burr being jealous at Hamilton's life, it shows us how Burr sees and manages his life, being cautious and waiting for perfect times for strike rather than striking first, a lifestyle that is contrary to Hamilton and does a perfect paralel of both their strenghts and downfalls: Hamilton's eagerness to mark a difference in history makes him rush to commit mistakes in his personal life, while Burr reluctance to wait and see what's the best course of action makes him look like a doormat in many of the other politicians' eyes. Is that reluctance of taking a proper political stance that makes Hamilton vote for Jefferson despite hating him and his policies, which in turn seals Hamilton's fate in the duel. I personally don't see any of Burr's songs as "villain songs", more like "character songs", but in the context of Alexander's life, they fit to a tee while also being incredibly humanizing.
This video was helpful because I'm trying to write a song for the villain in my story and I've never written a song before lol. I didn't know there was so much storytelling with the instruments and that's fascinating. Also the bit about writing it as if the character was singing it is really useful, so thank you. Listening to "This is The Thanks I Get?!" felt . . . strangely unfinished? I can't explain it, but it felt like some backing instrumentals were missing or something. It lacked that punch some of the other villian songs had, especially on the chorus. It really did feel more like a pop sing you would hear on the radio. I've listened to some of the other songs too and they also feel weirdly unfinished. It's either the instrumentals or they're too quiet or the vocals were flat or something. I need to study this entire movie under a microscope when it comes out. This movie is going to be a 6/10 at best.
If you ever want to talk about music feel free to DM me on Twitter! Your villain song has me curious cause I'm writing some music for a story as well! I'm so glad that you found it helpful!!
Hated this song when I first heard it. The whole vibe of the song just doesn't mesh as a villain song. Give me something like Poor Unfortunate Souls, or Hellfire, even Be Prepared. This tone just didn't work for me.
I don’t mind the tone so much, I think they could have made it jaunty and evil though. Like Gaston, Mad Hatter from Wonderland etc. This could have been a cabaret number or something else fun, upbeat, jazzy but still evil 😭
Recently a friend made me hear the villain song “It’s Good To Be King” from the musical Journey to Bethlehem, sung by the biblical king Herod. Imagine Magnifico having a song like that.
I think the comparisons to Your Welcome are valid because it actually sounds like it's a trumpet away from becoming Your Welcome. It's because of the instrumental, mostly; the choppy guitar is a major voice in both songs and is played in the same way. There's also the whole mini segments where Maui raps about his accomplishments and the one where Magnifico decides to use the book. "A potion? A spell? A summon? a curse?" is sung very similarly to "the tide? The grass? The ground?" I don't think it's all trying to copy Miranda, but his influence is definitely there. Probably because poor Julia has never written a movie soundtrack before, so she listened to Moana's soundtrack and took elements she liked ETA: This isn't fair to blame Miranda for though. Him getting copied isn't his fault
reading the comment without watching the video, I thought at the start you were talking of You're welcome from Heathers lol, and was confused cause it makes a much better job as being catchy but scary at the same time lol.
I thought the idea was very cool. A manipulative villain who thinks the world owns him something and decides to destroy others when he thinks he doesn't get the praises he deserves? That's gold material. But they made him so childish and cartoonish that it just fails. it's like they didn't know if they wanted him to be manipulative, or being manipulated by the magic but well-meaning, so they tried to do both at the same time and you can see it in the song. Also, there are things that are just distracting you from the message, like his vanity which is just them for you to laugh and decredibilize him as a villain.
That would have been so much better. An almost rock music feel for a jaded, powerful man who was genuinely wronged in his past? It would have been great.
Your story about the music teacher gave me flash backs to year 8 audhd me handing in a typed A4 booklet with photos in it with borders, detailed explanations etc that id spent hours on. (We had been asked to turn in half a page on ww1 and half a page on ww2 both of which are a special interest) and infront of the class she held it up and complained that itd taken her entire lunch break to mark it. I was mortified.
I can't come up with an explanation of WHY they decided to hire a pop-song artist with like two good songs under her belt. I don't know if she was the only one who wasn't supporting the strike or if her family is somewhat important.
I'm in the middle on this song honestly. I absolutely love it taking it as it is, but I can't help but wish it did things a LITTLE different!! Just from a musical standpoint, there's maybe ONE or TWO parts in the song near the end (during the bridge and also where you can hear the sinister rising violin being added to the chorus) that really sell this as a villain song overall. I like that it starts innocent and peppy, but it seems to STAY that way for a bit longer than I would've liked. It doesn't give the vibe of a villain song. I saw someone online describe it as a song millenials are going to lipsync to online to complain about the children they chose to have, and taking it at total face value 😭 idk, that's just my perspective. I'm the furthest thing you could get from a Disney shill or anything like that, but I'm still kind of eager to see this movie so I hope it's good!
Oh my god not the millennials lip syncing about their children 😭😭😭😭😭 why does that sound so accurate oh no. I feel the same way. I’m really excited for the movie but the song feels like a work in progress instead of a completed version.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuchI can picture it now: a mom holding a baby and a toddler in the middle of doing housewife things w/o help, she then looks exasperated at the camera and goes “tHiS iS tHe ThAnKs I gEt?”
I think that teacher just didn't want to have to grade a thick ass paper in the future 😂. For everyone saying its too early to judge the film I have this to say. Disney has been flopping left and right because they have not paid attention to narrative and ironically to song. People don't want to spend their hard-earned money in this economy for some subpar piece of media. It's interesting that you noticed it, but a lot of the Disney production has been done by committee. It's by making sure that they're ticking all the diversity boxes instead of having one vision they are aiming for making sure the narrative flows together. For example, in Frozen instead of his monologue you could have had Hans sing a villainous version of "Love is an Open door" kind of a bookend song like mother's knows Best. Speaking of live action films I always thought it would be great if they really wanted to lean into musicals in live act films to get people from musical theater to do the films. Not movie stars (unless they had musical credits). I just remember listening to the behind the scenes section on DVD Alan mankin was so nervous composing for film when you have the shark chase sequence. He threw everything in the kitchen sink to prove he had the chops to do it. And the directors basically said yeah you're fine.
Hahaha, it was funny though because he never had to teach me again like, he wouldn't have ever got another paper lol. He truly just thought that you should pick a 'fun' pop song (in the context of an audition etc). But that's why I don't like pop songs that much because they are a "park and bark" or rather, a stand there and just sing I guess lol. I listened to that same DVD too recently when I had COVID!!! Yeah they talk about how Alan Menken was soooo stressed about composing a film score but he nailed it! I really wonder why they didn't just have him compose this movie because he's still alive, and he still does work for Disney! It's very odd!
Wait, people are saying it is too early to judge the film? Why? There is no "too early", you see if a movie makes sense or not right away. If a movie needs time to convince you it is good, then it is probably not that good.
Ooh, I love that concept, actually! Because his whole thing is that he used Anna’s love for him to gain power - so “love is an open door” would take on a new, darker meaning in the reprise. Because Anna loved him, her love was an open door into the queen’s inner circle.
I don't think of "You're welcome" as a Lin Manuel Miranda song but a Moana song. Primarily I think of Hamilton and the "My own drum" from Vivo when I think of the typical Min Manuel Miranda sound. I think people confuse his "style" with just adding modern elements not recognizing that there is so much more thought behind most of his songs. He's done a very good job at creating unique sounds in most of his work, he just also has the baggage of a few poorly integrated uses of rap.
I really enjoyed this! I’d love to see an analysis of ashas “want song” as I feel it just fell flat completely and lacks most elements that make these types of songs soar
8:54 however I do think that Phil Collins is better able to communicate the emotional growth and conflict better that Wish. Wish’s songs are just platitudes- they are really vapid meaning wise
I'm not a musical theory person at all, but when I heard the song, I would have thought Wish was a jukebox musical if it wasn't so specific with the lyrics. It just didn't sound right at all to me. What you said about the music reacting to the character was really interesting - I think that's what I was picking up
I really love this breakdown and the way you talk about characterization through music as a hallmark of the Broadway style. I kept thinking about a recent musical I really like, SIX, because all of its songs are dance-pop and therefore have a lot of repetitive rhythms. I still think it accomplishes what you were talking about better than Magnifico's song in terms of reacting to the characters and how they're feeling, and not only because each character's musical style is specifically based on a different pop musician. (Also worth keeping in mind that there's dancing throughout the entire show that also tells the story)
I agree 100%. There's just something about the modern Disney songs in general. The lyrics are lazy and the songs are not as memorable or quotable as the ones from the Disney Renaissance.
Something I thought was really weird lyrically was “I let you live here for free and I don’t even charge you rent” … maybe I’m just missing the joke but that’s what living there for free means dude 😂🤣 why did they say it twice? There are some lyrics I do like in this song but I keep thinking about how bad that one is unless it’s some inside joke in the movie 🥴
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch If they wanted to repeat that line, then they should add emphasis, not a conjunction: "I let you live here for free, no, I don't even charge you rent."
I'm surprised this seems to be your first video! I liked your thoughts and the quality of your editing and assumed you've been doing this for a while. Your passion for good musical theater and how it connects to the emotions of the character reminds me of myself, as I'm sometimes seen as someone who "cares too much" about these things. 😅 Also the comment about that song sounding like the celebrity version in the ending credits is EXACTLY how I felt! Great video and analysis 👏
Thank you so much! I actually have another channel where I cover video games/anime stuff, but I've always wanted to do Disney/Barbie/musical content so I made this channel and didn't tell anyone 😂 I only have two Disney video essays on my other channel and I'm clearly going to figure out how to remake them and bring them over to this one. I'm really glad that you enjoyed it! I know this video covered a 'trending topic' and so that may be part of its success but I hope it's an indication that people want to see this type of content in particular, so I'd love to do it for older Disney movies / The Barbie movie musicals etc!
After watching Mason idk's video about Hellfire. It HIT me what was off about this villain song. Sorry, in advance, for the long comment. Compared to other villains, the king is more closer to Judge Frollo in terms of their power and influence. So like Mason idk states on why Hellfire is so unique, since we see Frollo already in peak power, his song instead about his WEAKNESS and Hypocrisy. Magnifico's song is all about what's GOOD about him basically like Gaston's and, even, Maui's song. Emphasizing his arrogance. And I think this is where they slipped up. Because that's ALL they do in the film. Which makes him less evil and oddly more relatable and understandable. Making him turing evil near the end, feel like a whiplash. My suggestion for Magnifico's song, especially for a film about 100 years of Disney, is a beautiful more so mix of Gaston's praise song, but hiding his arrogance. Instead of flaunting it like Gaston. And Frollo's more tragic, but still irredeemably evil song. They can even try to merge traditional musical to pop, if they want to really make the song stand out. Instead of Magnifico praising himself. It's people praising him. with the chorus being him, alone, singing about how he deserves more praise and thanks than he's already getting. Basically showing his hypocrisy and maybe a hint of his fear. The chorus is where some of the beats and tempos and such, for when the song goes full evil takes a peak for the ears to recognize. (So it wouldn't feel sudden) Then halfway through- like many Disney villain songs, this is where he learns of the star, and the song's tone changes to fit in his fear and anxiety. It can be as subtle or as obvious as they want. But the change has to be felt. And feel natural. Letting all that evil tones in the chorus be center stage, while that ones the emphasize his arrogance before be in the background, keeping the song feeling consistent.
I had no idea that this much work went into villain songs, I mean... I knew that a lot effort went into them, but not _THIS_ much (don't mind me, just casually taking notes for if I want to create a villain song). Also explains why King Magnifico's song just... doesn't _feel_ right for a Disney Villain (TM). Especially with some of the lyrics, in my opinion: _"Peep the name, I'm magnificent!"_ _"And I'm always there when you need to vent." _"Are you sure that you're not the prob?"_ Like, what time period is this movie set in? 💀💀💀 _____________________________________________ That's only a minor nitpick for me though, as It's a great song in general, don't get me wrong. However, as a Disney Villain song... Yeah, it could do a little better... 😅
I mentioned this to someone else but if you ever want to talk about song writing feel free to hit me up on Twitter! I’m also writing a villain song 😂 it’s so cool to see so many aspiring song writers in the comments!
Might be late to this, but as someone who has listened to this song and is going to remake it soon, (possibly will post the song on a different account, who knows) this has amazing insight in why it's so infuriating to me and others. I graduated with an Instrumental performance degree (trumpet and violin are my instruments) so I appreciate the advice/perspective from someone whose specialty is closer to the actual material. Keep doing what you do.
Thank you so much!! I look forward to seeing someone remake it! I wanted to do the same thing but I am terrible with like, a DAW LOL. My one weakness 😂
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch Thanks for the excitement and reply! To be completely honest, I'm sort of learning most of how to make music on the computer as I go. It's a bit embarrassing, but had to look up what DAW was when you mentioned it. I wasn't taught any of that at any point in my musical career. Either way, I'm dead set on finding my way to make this happen. So we'll see how this goes.
I’ve been listening to a lot of anime OPs and EDs lately, so maybe I’m biased. But Magnifico’s song sounded too much like any of them. Just very pop-y and upbeat (mostly).
Yeah on a surface level I’d agree. But usually anime OPs and stuff have “over the top layers” in terms of how they create their sound, this song doesn’t really. It’s sort of hard to explain but basically composition wise they go overboard LOL. But the vibes are definitely similar.
I feel like calling it "copying Lin's style but worse" is a case of "the customer is great at knowing when something's wrong, but not why it's wrong." Like, in the examples you gave from you're welcome, you can hear his actual musical theatre experience coming through in the instruments, where he deliberately chooses more island feeling instruments to keep the immersion even though in universe there's probably not actual instruments playing, or the heroic flair in the brass while he's talking about all the cool stuff he's done. Meanwhile wish doesn't really have any of that. The songwriting in wish is literally so generic it had people accusing it of being written by ai lol.
I think the thing is that while it doesn't sound *literally* like LMM, it sounds like someone listened to Hamilton and Moana and Encanto and went "I can do that!" The thing with how it sounds like You're Welcome is with more of the lyrical work (plus how the vocal performances objectively aren't great but the difference there is that Dwayne Johnson isn't a singer whereas Chris Pine CAN sing but they didn't write it to his strengths). Like, they both are braggadocious and use extremely modern language ("I know it's a lot, the hair, the bod" -> "are you sure that you're not the prob?"). But there's still a big difference in that introducing Maoi like this IMMEDIATE gives us a sense of his character! Whereas even throughout the rest of the movie, when we see Magnifico's evil side, the song doesn’t match his character. So it really comes across as derivative of You're Welcome. It just feels so derivative. Also I strongly believe that full rest in the instrumentation to show a turning point in his character and that he's about to do something irredeemable was inspired by The World Was Wide Enough from Hamilton. It is my personal conspiracy theory.
I am so glad the algorithm recommended me this! I loved your analysis on og villain songs, it makes me admire them even more! The whole movie seems it's trying too hard to put in EVERYTHING and ending up being nothing. I hope we're proven wrong.
Thank you so much! I hope to do more Disney/animated movie analysis specifically, some of them songs but some of them more focused on the movie as a whole. I’m still looking forward to Wish, but I do hope it’s able to stick the landing since as you said they’re doing a lot 😅😅
my thoughts exactly! It's like the algorithm finding elements that worked best in the previous movies and stitching them all together to create the "perfect" movie for the 100th anniversary.
While I think the song works from the POV of someone who believes they're a hero who deserves to be selfish, the production feels a bit too generic, similar to "This Wish."
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I really wish they embraced the Iberian setting for the music, or perhaps went for an alternative/avant-garde sound--at least for the villain song--to make it stand out in Disney's repetoire.
I love people who think about music as seriously as I do, especially music as a medium in musical movies! I totally agree with the character part. The beast song was grim in a way that didn't feel evil, it's so reactive as you said! The songs are written in character, the songs are sang in character. "This is The Thanks I Get" could be in any movie and put on almost any character. I think a problem with this is that the characters in Wish aren't distinct as characters in my opinion. Pop artists have written songs for musicals that were amazing (Spongebob is an example I love to use). To put it simply, the music only adds to the fire that is Wish but it isn't the starter.
omg thank you! i dont think anyone has explained so well why this song doesnt work. you gave a perfect lesson of what is necessary to compose a disney (and musicals in general) melody. in the end it is all about having the character's soul ingrained in the melody, there needs to be a conversation between the two, i never really understood that before watching your video, so thank you once again for the wonderful and enlightening lesson!
I will never understand how this lyric "I let you live here for free and I don't even charge you rent" made it through multiple rounds of approvals and creative teams. And not one person thought it was a bad idea. "Wish" is the final nail that proves Disney simply does not care. They think they can churn out low-effort garbage, believing that as long as it's stuffed full of whatever's popular at that moment, it'll make bank. Doesn't matter how shallow it is, or that it'll be immediately dated within two years tops. They don't care. They have no interest in making good films, only profitable ones.
10:44 I'd say American Psycho is the biggest example of a musical without a traditional Broadway style, because it's entirely electronic besides the singers. Duncan Sheik in general is known for not having a Broadway style, but that is the ultimate example.
I agree with you. The song is very monotone and lacking, which is a shame because I do like the concept of the villain that we know is evil but is not apparent straight away. I just wish (haha) they executed it better.
I can't believe your channel is just starting out! I clicked to hear more musical analysis and then realized this was your first video. I hope you make more, you got my suscribe and the notification bell!
Thank you so much!! I’ll be posting an analysis about “This Wish” today and it’ll be pretty different compared to this video (though within the same vein). There is some different stuff to breakdown with that song!
Honestly I think it says EVERYTHING. Because the entire point of Disney movies are movies that appeal to kids, but aren’t necessarily only for children. But this movie completely shuts out the adults and even talks down to the kids like they’re stupid 🥴🥴🥴
Can you please, please, pretty please with a cherry on top; do a review on the song "This Wish"? I really did NOT like the overabundance of lyrics that was used in the song that just made the whole thing sound like a mess. I've only seen 1 video cover that issue but only briefly. I really want somebody with a professional background with experience to talk about this because I KNOW it needs to be brought more when it was supposed to be the "Let It Go" of Wish. I really don't care if it's 40 minutes. Lol
@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I wouldn't have cared if it was 90! I'm just so glad you read what I had to say! Omg this is exciting!!! 🤩🤩 Finally, a video that just backs me up even more by somebody who's qualified and an expert!
this is kinda off topic but I really enjoy how passionate you are when talking about all the different parts of songs like all the different sections :]
Thank you so much! That’s why I called the channel “Calxiyn Cares Too Much” because I know all of this is hyper specific but if I don’t care, who is going to?! 🥰🥰
''This is the thanks I get?!'' is the movies villain song. I'm going to be honest. Out of all the songs so far this is my favorite. But from what I saw it's also the one with most dislikes. My best guess is that people were excited and had high expectations about the new villain song since the last one was ''Shiny'' from Moana, 7 YEARS AGO! What also probably upset people is that despite being a ''Disney villain song'' it lacks a lot of the same punch. It's trying to be like ''Mother Knows Beast'' where the villain is being manipulative and try to pass of as the good guy. I'm going to judge the song for what it is, not for what I wish (wink wink) it would be. Just a heads up, it does pretty poorly. 1. The song is very repetitive with the ''this is the thanks I get'' being sang over and over. It's a rule at this point that the name of the song will be repeated many times in the song or that it will be named after whatever is repeated in the song the most, whichever comes first. But a whole freaking chorus?! At least Chris Pine sings it a bit differently each time. 2. Speaking of annoying repetition, the whole ''tu tu tu'' is driving me crazy. I mentioned it in one of my previous posts that I hate when writers put some sounds for singer to sing because they couldn't be bothered to come up with real words to put into their song. It's lazy and feels like padding. It's not a song in a club that you can bob your head to. It's a song in a musical. Tell a story! Unlike Chris Pine singing ''this is the thanks I get'' differently every time, ''tu tu tu'' is sang always the same. And lastly, who the hell is singing that part? Just because it's a musical it doesn't mean that singing comes out of nowhere. Usually the bad guy sings solo or with his/her minions. 3. Awkward modern talk that is showing up in all the songs. Examples include ''rent free'' and ''prob''. This is supposed to be a medieval kingdom. I don't expect them to speak like Shakespeare but come on! It sounds so cringe and will age the movie like milk. 4. Contradiction! Magnifico granted 14 wishes last year but Asha in ''Welcome to Rosas'' said he grants one wish every month. Does a year in Rosas has 14 months? How did no one noticed that? 5. Another problem I found with the song is how it less singing and more talking rhythmically. 6. There's a moment in the song when Magnifico starts going crazy evil and you might get excited about how the song might progress but it's interrupted with ''Where was I'' because we were getting too serious, so we interrupt it with MCU like joke. After that the song goes back to its previous monotone rhythm. 7. The song tries to build up some excitement again with evil high strings and Magnifico screaming (which sounds good) and a cheesy echo but it's too late. They had an awesome build up and squandered it. There is no walking it back. 8. This is the problem with all those songs. There seems to be beginnings and endings to those songs but for the most part they just meander around in the same tone, tempo, instruments and every time something resembling a build up or a change of pace it's right back to how it was sang before. It's a boring repetitive song just like all the others but is the most hated because people had high hopes for it. But to be fair I don't think a villain song that sounds actually evil is too demanding. Especially when people were very clear about what they want for years.
This is a pretty thorough analysis, especially since you do a good job of explaining the gripes with the Wish songs compared to the classic songs and why they're missing so much of what made them great. I didn't think I would watch all 30 minutes, but your enthusiasm about the subject is definitely infectious. The music either has to thrust the story forward, like most classic Disney songs do; or the animation has to thrust the story forward while the song provides accompaniment, like Tarzan does with the Phil Collins songs. Wish unfortunately does neither, where the music is very repetitive and therefore doesn't push the story forward, but the animation is focused on having the characters sing these songs that the animation also can't move the story forward, either. This causes the music to just kinda be a pause in the story, which makes it a real drag.
13:21 that most likely a gliss from brass bar chimes (or mark tree, or chime tree) used for music and sound effects :) and yea i think that plucking sound might be a harpsichord too
I can't believe your teacher got mad at you for writing a good report! Sometimes writing is FUN! You going all out on the report means you had motivation! You liked writing it! Not that you were overworking yourself. Eta: my favorite song ever is one my dad wrote because it gives me so many thoughts. The lyrics tell a story and I think so much about how complex it is and I just. I will write lengths about it. Because it's so good
Hahaha, I don’t think he was “mad” per se but yeah it was a strange situation lol. His point was that in the context of taking a pop-song to an audition you want something sort of thoughtless, but I don’t listen to pop music like that, I like narrative driven pop music. Also that’s so sweet about your dad 🥰 what a nice memory!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch also I don't know you much but would it be okay to email you or message you on some social media to show you my rewrite of This is the Thanks I Get? I've revised it a bit from the original and if you'd like to see what I have so far I'd be happy to share
Goodness! I love hearing Enthusiastic MusicPeople talk about music! Is this really your first video? It's good! The sound is a bit more quiet than I would personally like, but other than that it's well-produced. Your able to rip the vague thoughts I have in my head of how there's a sense of inadequacy for the song, and actually put it into words perfectly! Anyways! I'm super-subscribed! I hope this is the beginning of many more videos :D P.S: You have good Music Miming, it doesn't seem to always be in sync, perhaps the audio hasn't caught up with the camera, as it tends to have some sort of dissonance, but I still enjoy it (and I do the same thing, too, lol).
I wonder if you know/how you would react to Galavant, a non-Disney Menken work. There are a couple traditionnal and non-traditional villain songs in this one (a fairly normal one (She'll Be Mine), one mixed with an I want song in a way (No One But You), the last one being just a small part of a bigger song that makes you go "wait, what?" (The Happiest Day of Your Life)). People have been commenting on the fact that the queen in Wish was supposed to be evil too and the idea of a villainous power couple made me think of this series, though it's not that trope exactly, just close enough. The second season especially pays homage to other famous musicals like Les Mis or West Side Story. I also really like the heroine-villainess rap battle near the end, I Don't Like You :D It's funny as heck and makes you feel all the feels, too
I have never been someone who understands music. I love music! I can’t do anything without having something on in the background! But beyond the poetry aspect of music I’m completely useless lol, so this was genuinely really helpful! My whole reaction to this song was just “huh this sounds bad” lmao. I’d love to see more deep dives like this!
It sounds like the song for an Encanto villain if it had one. But I guess it fits Magnifico since he seems to be a pretender. However.... I hope it turns to boss music in the later half of the song. So we get the chills we're supposed to get from the villain. "Be preparrrrrreeeed!!" 🎵 🦁 Edit: I've just listened to the whole song. Like they lyrics, hate the melody and tone. But the song does fit him. And I like that part where he got unhinged. 👹😈
I could immediately tell the songs were Beast songs despite not being familiar with them! I got this tragic, regal, ominous yet not evil sorta vibe that immediately made me think of him.
Didn’t watch the movie yet but did heared the song And even though I love how catchy it is it’s still not a good « Villain » it’s sound more like a broken villain song or even a villain backstory song but NOTHING like a villain song At least Trolls Band Together actually managed to gave us a good villain song with their antagonist
I'd argue that as a villain song, "Hellfire" is an example of the principle that great artists know when to break the rules. The song breaks a lot of the standards for villain songs: Instead of bombastically reveling in how evil he is, Frollo is fearfully denying how evil he is (and not just superficial denials that are a blatant attempt at trickery like in "Poor Unfortunate Souls" or "Mother Knows Best"). It's almost like a villain song in opposite land where instead of Frollo gleefully boasting about his lust and corruption, he insists that none of that is true. Yet this is so good at characterizing him that it works really well---far better than a more traditional villain song. But "Hellfire" is the exception that proves the rule. And that was one problem I had with "This is the Thanks I Get": Why is Magnifico denying being evil? He's not trying to trick other people, like Ursula or Mother Gothel. He's not in denial like Frollo---or if he is, it isn't communicated very well. He should be reveling in his evil. Or if they *did* want him to be in denial like Frollo, they didn't do nearly a good enough job of pulling it off. IMO, the villain-in-denial like Frollo requires *very* good characterization, and if you fall short in that area, the villain-in-denial suffers far more that the classic evil-and-loving-it villain (who can still be somewhat entertaining even if he's made of cardboard).
The thing about Frollo as well as that his song is something we call "To the other self or God". So It's not even necessarily a rule break, it's just that most of the time villains either have an "I Want" song, or an "I Am" song. Like Gaston for example is about all the things he is, whereas Poor Unfortunate Souls is wanting Ariel to do something. With Frollo, his song actually falls into that "other self" category where the character is actually conflicted about their feelings and trying to sort it out with their "other self or god". The reason why you can't do that with Magnifcio is because he doesn't feel conflicted, and so he needs someone to actually sing to.
It may not be slappin, but it's certainly clappin.. (like a too friendly Christian summer camp counselor.) I think because the kingdom of Rosas is supposed to take place in Spain or inspired by medieval Spain, that's why it has folksy latin vibe. But bc chris pine is in it maybe he is bringing that fun camp with the 80s synth and bass guitar. But the song lyrics also reveals that King Magnifico is not all he is cracked up to be. He might be bound to spell book that gave him the ability to grant (and trap) wishes with spells. But he possibly isn't in full control of his power, or the source of it. This is why he is so threatened by Asha bringing the star to Rosas.
Okay, 'This Is The Thanks I Get' sounds bad... So that's why I'm gonna watch Oliver & Company, at least that has better pop songs. (kind of) I mostly watch the movie for its villain Sykes.
24:11 absolutely! I haven't watched any of the Beauty and Beast Movies in years, and while it took me a bit, B&B were my first guess! love your analysis, easy to understand and made me feel like i learned something.
I own an artbook for a FAN ALBUM of a novel series, not even officially licensed which made like a fake soundtrack with no words, just instrumentals and orchestra that somehow does a better job at conveying emotion and reactionary music choices that you mentioned that is overall a far better piece of art and music than a billion dollar Disney movie. Let that sink in. A KICKSTARTER for a FAN SOUNDTRACK to a BOOK is leages ahead of freaking Disney
This was my first video before the movie was even out predicting things wouldn’t end up great, so we didn’t do a full song analysis for this one! But I could do a more thorough one like I did for This Wish if people are interested!
This was so insightful! Thanks for explaining why this song didn't sound right to me. I'm so glad I found your channel, you're a really engaging and entertaining speaker! And also your hair is cool!
This is more of an issue with the movie, but to have a villain song, you need to have a villain. This comment is based on what I've seen other RUclipsrs say. A man who went from rags to riches because he learned magic through effort, built a kingdom with that magic, lets anyone come live there rent free as said in the song, and overall thinks what's best for the people of the kingdom and based on that actually makes some wishes come true, is not a villain. Magnifico takes everyone's wishes, sure, but those that he believes to be beneficial to the kingdom he makes true. There's a part where Magnifico holds a wish of someone becoming a great conqueror. That means war. That means death and suffering. That's not a wish that should become true, so Magnifico is in the right for not letting that one come true. But despite his magical omnipotency, Magnifico is still a human. He has emotions, emotional responses. I don't remember what it was, that made Magnifico do it, but he started to use an evil magic book of evilness that made Magnifico evil because lazy writing.
I LOVED THIS VIDEO TOO MUCH i would never notice by myself these little details from Broadway theater songs and its genuinely so interesting, ur super smart 😭💞
I hate that the lyrics cover things that Magnifico never does. While he is presented as a more subtle villain character (dismissive and controlling rather than overtly evil), the lyrics present him as the complete opposite of what we've seen. He talks about forcing complete randos whom we never see ( who tf is Carlito or Henry?) to do stuff we never see for people we never see asking for said stuff, because "thats stuff a villain WOULD do." If i were watching a Transformers cartoon and someone talks about Starscream being a backstabbing jerk, i believe that because i am SHOWN Starscream BEING a backstabbing jerk. YOU CANNOT MAKE A SONG ABOUT DOING PETTY BASICBITCH VILLAINOUS THINGS, IF HE IS NOT SHOWN AND ESTABLISHED AS A GUY WHO DOES PETTY BASICBITCH VILLAINOUS THINGS.
“I don’t want something that has no thought in it” struck me so much. I feel that so hard as an autistic person who has an over analytical brain (and probably would even if I weren’t ND)
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch Hooray! I also enjoy your video since I feel others used jargon and while I did grow up with musical theater I never learned film terminology. So the way you broke everything down was super helpful to me as someone who understands and loves storytelling but not musical technicalities
Thank you so much! I just started posting videos like this on this channel (but I do have a main channel with other stuff), so hopefully it’ll grow slowly. I’m really happy with how this was received so far, thank you so much!
I really enjoy music analysis and honestly I could listen to you explain reactive music in Disney songs for hours and never get bored. Incredible video. Thank you for making it :)
I’m shocked by how underrated your channel is. The video quality and charisma is amazing. This is probably the most in depth analysis of this song that I’ve seen so far.
Thank you so much! I just started on this channel and I really appreciate the encouragement!! I hope to do a lot more like this for songs, characters and the movies themselves!
I actually really like this song the fake humbleness of him at the start going to him then complaining about his people to his nice guy persona completely crumbling and him opening himself up to the dark magic and him finally losing it in the final line. that being said I do 100 percent get why other people don't like it.
My issues with the song: 1. The rhymes are so weird. The words do not sound good together 2. Lyrics are shallow. It’s basically the same message being said over and over. It doesn’t build much. 3. The song just feels plain? I cannot explain it 4. Most Disney songs have a moment of tension or suspense. Not here
My biggest complaint about this song, is that this ISN'T a villain song. This is a frustrated hero song. You know, when the hero has a goal but is about to retire because of his failure? That's the kind of song this is.
Yeah that’s a good way of putting it! And villains can see themselves as heroic but I think the problem is that it’s missing the element of “the villain thinks they’re the hero but we as the audience know they aren’t because they say something shitty” sort of thing. Like in Gaston how Gaston says he’s gonna put Belle’s father in the asylum, that’s so transparently evil even tho Gaston is about how great Gaston is!
People were soooo mad at me on Twitter and telling me "WAIT UNTIL THE MOVIE COMES OUT BEFORE YOU CRITICIZE IT" So I had to preface everything I said even though I was right 😭
WOW, okay I didn't know your background so I'm sorta blown away by how insightful this video is! I thought this was going to be a simple breakdown based mostly on personal opinions so I'm VERY pleasantly surprised!
oh god, the same thing from my school days is happening all over again. This is so much new information to me (because I have exactly 0 experience with music since I never studied it) that not only did I completely miss some points due to my lack of understanding of musical theory, I was processing the portion before while you were talking and I'm perpetually stuck in a loop of having no idea what's going on. I guess I'll have to watch the video twice lol ADHD be like
Thank you so much! I’m a musical theatre grad who also writes music sometimes! And don’t worry about the ADHD thing, I’m exactly the same way. My “This Wish” video is gonna focus less on the instrumental so hopefully it’ll be easier to follow along with! Thank you for watching!
The most I wanted was a good reprise to showcase his “true colors” like how we know Mother Gothel is a bad person but Rapunzel doesn’t know it so the first song she sings sounds sinister but almost something convincing while her reprise shows Rapunzel how manipulative she is We know the king is bad/manipulative maybe, but Asha doesn’t know it
Honestly, this is sort of what I wanted- I feel like they could have done a jaunty "good" version of the song, and then had it again later with a much more sinister tone and suddenly everyone realises there's a darker double meaning to the lyrics. Something like that could have been really clever. But you have to know what you're doing to make something like that work.
@@izzisart exactly like… We know he’s bad since the reveal, but what about the character? Does she know? I feel like the more the first song progresses she starts to realize he’s bad or something but the song continues on forcefully as if trying to reject the idea of thinking he’s bad but it’s very clear he is. Then later on we’d get a reprise that really shows all the (red flags) bad within him. Sort of like this rewritten version of the song I found on TikTok sang by Caleb Hyles or something
@@Skidibibapbap I'm gonna have to look that rewritten version up! Yeah, even though we as the audience know he's evil, doing the songs this way would do a really good job of putting us in the shoes if the character- you can see (or rather hear?) him pulling the wool over her eyes, and yet when it gets circled back to later, it shows there was stuff right there that everyone just missed.
😂 it wasn’t about them per se but more “the pop cover at the end of the Disney movie” vibe. Like Demi Lovato singing “Let It Go” - not Imagine Dragons’ original music or anything 😅😅
i can't believe i guessed correctly that those were Beast's songs, i'm not into BATB i've never seen the stage musical or the reboot but i did have a much-too-quiet recording of If I Can't Love Her on a cd when i was like 5 that i always skipped because i couldn't understand it. but that song sounds deep and heavy and really really anxious and insecure, and who is big and insecure? beast. youre so right on that one
I don’t know what they were going for or not, all I know is every time this song comes on, there’s a point where I just start sing You’re Welcome, and it’s jarring for me every time 😅😂
The song identification exercise was really interesting. Even though I last time I saw B&B was the live action, I could tell right away that that was the movie and then a little longer to determine it was for the Beast. I think the pop artists don’t quite understand how much the music itself conveys, not just melody and lyrics.
I love your music analysis! This is a really awesome in depth study that is worth listening to! And gave words to my feelings regarding my very “blah” reaction to Wish.
I remember that "princess and a frog" was so big because it was one of few movies that returned to classic Disney style. I remember that i was exited for it because I'm big simp for 2d animation. It was at the time when 3d effect in cinema were big thing and every studio was obsesed with that feature. This movie was standing out among others because it chosed classic style of animation and storytelling. And they delivered! A lot of people see this movie as end of an era in Disney. It was not something new but i had quality in it. Wish try replicate classic Disney movies but i feel that they don't want to fully embrace thier style. "Look we made it look like 2d animation! Look we made a villan song!" Wish feel like they don't uderstand what made those mediums stand out and in effect made the final product more bland than cookie made from saw dust. You can mix styles of old and new (puss in boots the last wish) but you need to think HOW both in music and animation
Agree on what makes a song Broadway material! Tarzan was successfully adapted into a Broadway production despite the 'pop' songs though. It's definitely not the 'popness' that's problematic, just evident lack of experience that results in overall badly-written songs; pop or otherwise
I’ve actually never heard of the Tarzan musical, I’m surprised it slipped entirely under my radar! But yeah I agree with some of the other comments that the difference between this and Tarzan is still that the “heart” of the scenes are captured well in the songs. Like “Strangers Like Me” and “You’ll Be In My Heart” are perfect for the story!
I wish i can find it but theres a song list floating around and theres no reprise listed. I hear theres a duet between Asha and Magnifeco but it's not listed in the song list
![How ‘Welcome To Rosas’ RUINED EVERYTHING [Wish]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/UyeEV7MHUUM/mqdefault.jpg)
![How ‘Welcome To Rosas’ RUINED EVERYTHING [Wish]](/img/tr.png)
![Why 'This Wish' Is WORSE Than You Thought [Wish]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/O5dG345ZM_I/mqdefault.jpg)
![Why Did Disney DELETE These Rapunzel Songs? [Tangled]](/img/1.gif)
QUESTIONS COMMENT THREAD: What questions do you have? Reply to this comment so I can see it better! And thanks to all the patrons for their support and all of you for helping me get this channel monetized (this video was demonetized though!)
I'm sure you'll love the My Fair Hatey episode from Wander over Yonder
29:50 Are you taking about Idol? Lol 😂😂
@@kennncheese435It was about Calliope Mori's Red!
😊😊😊😊
❤
It blows my mind that The Super Mario Bros Movie (which isn't even a musical) did an intentionally terrible villain song for the sake of comedy, and it still was a better villain song than the one DISNEY DID.
I never realized Peaches was intentionally terrible. Guess that just furthers my point that Bowser ain't getting any peaches lmfao
Hell the villan song from Baldur's Gate 3 was more Disney sounding than the 100th anniversary "spectacular"
I loved peaches
It had a villain song? And it was terrible???
What are you talking about "Peaches" was a masterpiece
The song sounds like a Disney message to the disney fans and haters,in the song it talks about wanting "respect" "complaining" "see this kingdom I've built and you still complain,the disrespect,are you sure You're not the problem" " I'd love to see you try and do my job" "desperate times call for desperate measures" " i refuse to have my power stripped",etc.
no it's just narcisist talking ot his kingdom actually. check game theory out
@@mob2644Nah, it definitely sounds like Disney is saying this.
Would have been cool had they done it with a good song
I actually never thought of it that way
@@mob2644 MatPat takes the L again
I just feel like it could have been better.
(Imagine a more opera, theatrical style)
“Their wants and their wishes, they drive me insane”
(Puts on a little girl voice) “I want a big lion with a puffy great mane”
(Back to normal making glasses and a list) “They beg for my power -cause they” (hint of confusion) “can’t fix a net?”
“And thiiis is the thanks that I GET!?”
I can visualize this so clearly, great job XD
Now THIS would’ve been perfect!
Just those few lines are better than this entire song!
this SCREAMS classic disney villain to me - so perfect and so inspiring in just a few lines!! i swear i can feel all the lost potential from this movie in these few brainstorm corrections. absolutely fantastic, you have my songwriter brain buzzing
@@luxgaster9333 not really, I’m just good with short rhyme segments.
Using words was never my strength, but give me enough to work with (in this case “evil wish granting king” and “this is the thanks that I get”) and I can occasionally get a hit.
Most miss though.
Writing this here since some people are jumping down your throat and not listening. You're not the only one who felt this song was lacking and disappointing as a villain song.
I appreciate this! I think people think I'm attacking the movie or something - I'm actually looking forward to the movie, but I care a lot about music and this song isn't hitting it for me.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I thought it was a widespread sentiment
I still haven't seen the movie, but I've listened to this song a few times now and I don't like it. I've heard worse songs, but I love the Disney villain songs and this was extremely disappointing.
You know, Lin already wrote a super similar song to TITTIG with King George’s numbers in Hamilton. Same sort of sentiment, different styles, but much better delivery
Exactly! Why did they get rid of him 😭😭😭
They probably didn't want to pay him what he wanted
That is quite the acronym
Yes, except in that case it had a reason to be that way. LMM intentionally wrote the song to have that upbeat pop style to mimic breakup songs from british boy bands at the time. That's also why it is kind of a unique song in Hamilton and emphasized by how King George is the only one with an accent in that whole show (at least in US iterations afaik)
"This is the Thanks I Get?!" just SCREAMS "Contemporary Pop" that I thought I was accidentally listening to a song from a Disney Channel original movie instead.
The instrumental of “This is the Thanks I Get” is like that music that plays in medication commercials where the people are dancing, celebrating, and having fun while the side effects are being listed.
@@cantpopdismollyHELP THIS IS THE PERFECT DEFINITION 😭😭
I looked up the instrumental version of this song because i suspected that it would sound like stock music and i was right. I even played to my gf and told her it was stock music and she believed me
Is that like generic music.
yeah
an insult to stock music
This is very upsetting especially since what better way to show how characters differentiate from each other than genre? They could have given The King very royal/regal music and songs while making Asha’s songs more pop/modern showing their views stylistically. But Modern Disney is the epitome of lazy and refuses to get with the program. Very upsetting we could’ve had a banger
One of the keys to a villain song is being composed in minor. Our brains are hardwired to associate songs in minor to situations and characters with an eerie or tragic portrayal from years and years and years of audiovisual media linking notes to emotions. Magnifico's song is in major, which gives it a peppy tone that doesn't match the level of ill-will in his train of thought. This song would be more appropriate for a goodwilled character who got genuinely wronged.
While thats true, thats not always the case Mother Knows Best and Gaston are in Major key (i personally dont consider Gaston the villain song though but many do ), Major doesnt always mean happy or good and minor doesn't always mean sad or evil. .
in theory this song could work in Major, and it goes into a shepards tone at the end. but execution is its downfall. theres stuff way more wrong with it that isn't just being in the wrong key. its just frankyl a very weak and sage song all together even if Magnifsco was written to be more antagonistic or good instead of villainous this song would still be weak in its current state.
This is true. Like "Poor Unfortunate Souls".
@@stephanos6128 True. Mother Knows Best is in major cuz she wants to come across helpful and caring but it quickly turns to minor in its reprise cuz she's trying to discredit Rapunzel's choices, and Gaston is mostly the villagers' perspective of him, although I honestly think this is due to these songs surrounding the image they wanna pass rather than their thoughts and emotions. Magnifico's song sounds like a standalone pop song, and not by coincidence. For some reason, Disney brought in people who specialized in pop songs rather than musicals.
*Sigh* I miss Stephen Sondheim.
@@IMayOrMayHaveNot right, but even as a standalone pop song this song is ass, there's betterpop sings on the radio as we speak. the song needed to be reworked entirely but its key isnt really a problem if an actual skilled songwriter put in the work and time into the song. i learned recently this movies music was written in a very rushed manner and without much context for the songwriter to work with, so Pop Writers isn't entirely the problem here (and it discredits other pop writers who write for Disney music and gave us actual bangers)
Magnifeco's song is a glorified demo, a rough draft of the rough draft.
@@stephanos6128 Fair enough! I still think they should've hired composers specialized in musicals if they wanted to properly give their 100th anniversary a homage worthy of the Disney name. Once Upon A Studio was a MUCH better celebratory piece than whatever Wish tried to amount to.
I agree with you wholeheartedly with the music not being reactive enough to King Magnifico during the song, as it just gives the music personality and life as if it is either agreeing or disagreeing with the villain, or like it’s just trying to play along with the villain as well. There was like one or two moments near the end that almost got it right in the song which is why I like the ending half better, but it still is a weird song to hear as a villain song.
Exactly. And it’s not like modern Disney is completely inept at that particular skill either. “We Don’t Talk About Bruno” is a great example of a modern Disney song with plenty of reactive moments, even down to the beat of the song itself changing depending on which character is singing. It’s so disappointing that they couldn’t (or wouldn’t) do for Wish what they did for Encanto, at least musically. Imagine how great it could’ve been.
If you want great Lin-Manuel Miranda villain songs listen to "Wait For It", "Washington on your side" or "The Room Where it Happens"
"You'll Be Back" also works because even though it's peppy, it fits the kings insanity (honestly, it feels like " the Thanks I Get" is trying to be "You'll be Back" but failing miserably)
@@undergirl04 Agreed. The dissonance of the deranged lyrics and the upbeat music serves to perfectly highlight how insane George's mentality is. Plus, the true terror about "You'll Be Back" is that it essentially reads like an abusive romantic partner's dialogue, only this time imagine if that abuser partner was literally a king and they're victim was America itself.
That terror underneath the silliness is what makes the song work.
AAAAAAAAAAH WAIT FOT IT WASHINGTON ON YOUR SIDE AND ROOM WHERE IT HAPPENS MENTIONED ‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼WTF ARE BAD SONGS???
I LOVE any of Aaron's songs in Hamilton because they are just SO INDICATIVE of the theme of Hamilton's musical, that since this is from Hamilton's biographical perspective, Aaron being the "villain" is untrue, like it says in The World was Wide Enough: "Now I'm the villain in your history". Burr is never a malicious villain, he's just a political rival of Hamilton and both had been at each other's good and bad sides, is just the framing of the story that changes how we see a character. If this was Burr's biographical musical, Hamilton would be the nuisance that is constantly hindering his political life.
Wait For It is just the biggest example of this because it doesn't show us Burr being jealous at Hamilton's life, it shows us how Burr sees and manages his life, being cautious and waiting for perfect times for strike rather than striking first, a lifestyle that is contrary to Hamilton and does a perfect paralel of both their strenghts and downfalls: Hamilton's eagerness to mark a difference in history makes him rush to commit mistakes in his personal life, while Burr reluctance to wait and see what's the best course of action makes him look like a doormat in many of the other politicians' eyes. Is that reluctance of taking a proper political stance that makes Hamilton vote for Jefferson despite hating him and his policies, which in turn seals Hamilton's fate in the duel.
I personally don't see any of Burr's songs as "villain songs", more like "character songs", but in the context of Alexander's life, they fit to a tee while also being incredibly humanizing.
Hamilton songs in general 🙏
You forgot Shiny. I thought that song was fun.
This video was helpful because I'm trying to write a song for the villain in my story and I've never written a song before lol. I didn't know there was so much storytelling with the instruments and that's fascinating. Also the bit about writing it as if the character was singing it is really useful, so thank you.
Listening to "This is The Thanks I Get?!" felt . . . strangely unfinished? I can't explain it, but it felt like some backing instrumentals were missing or something. It lacked that punch some of the other villian songs had, especially on the chorus. It really did feel more like a pop sing you would hear on the radio. I've listened to some of the other songs too and they also feel weirdly unfinished. It's either the instrumentals or they're too quiet or the vocals were flat or something. I need to study this entire movie under a microscope when it comes out. This movie is going to be a 6/10 at best.
If you ever want to talk about music feel free to DM me on Twitter! Your villain song has me curious cause I'm writing some music for a story as well! I'm so glad that you found it helpful!!
Hated this song when I first heard it. The whole vibe of the song just doesn't mesh as a villain song. Give me something like Poor Unfortunate Souls, or Hellfire, even Be Prepared. This tone just didn't work for me.
I don’t mind the tone so much, I think they could have made it jaunty and evil though. Like Gaston, Mad Hatter from Wonderland etc. This could have been a cabaret number or something else fun, upbeat, jazzy but still evil 😭
Recently a friend made me hear the villain song “It’s Good To Be King” from the musical Journey to Bethlehem, sung by the biblical king Herod.
Imagine Magnifico having a song like that.
That is one of my favorite songs right now!
I haven’t listened to that before, I’ll check it out!
And lo and behold, an animatic (animation?) video of King Magnifico using that song!
Thanks for telling me about it - I had never heard it before, but I went and listened to it, and it’s great!
I think the comparisons to Your Welcome are valid because it actually sounds like it's a trumpet away from becoming Your Welcome. It's because of the instrumental, mostly; the choppy guitar is a major voice in both songs and is played in the same way. There's also the whole mini segments where Maui raps about his accomplishments and the one where Magnifico decides to use the book. "A potion? A spell? A summon? a curse?" is sung very similarly to "the tide? The grass? The ground?" I don't think it's all trying to copy Miranda, but his influence is definitely there. Probably because poor Julia has never written a movie soundtrack before, so she listened to Moana's soundtrack and took elements she liked
ETA: This isn't fair to blame Miranda for though. Him getting copied isn't his fault
reading the comment without watching the video, I thought at the start you were talking of You're welcome from Heathers lol, and was confused cause it makes a much better job as being catchy but scary at the same time lol.
@@nanalove3819 even when I mentioned Maui?
@@redtailarts101 no that's the part where I get it lol
I thought the idea was very cool. A manipulative villain who thinks the world owns him something and decides to destroy others when he thinks he doesn't get the praises he deserves? That's gold material.
But they made him so childish and cartoonish that it just fails. it's like they didn't know if they wanted him to be manipulative, or being manipulated by the magic but well-meaning, so they tried to do both at the same time and you can see it in the song. Also, there are things that are just distracting you from the message, like his vanity which is just them for you to laugh and decredibilize him as a villain.
My wish (get it) was for him to sing something like "In the dark of the night" but nope. Someone bring me a Hellfire 2.0!! PLEASE!!
That would have been so much better. An almost rock music feel for a jaded, powerful man who was genuinely wronged in his past? It would have been great.
Your story about the music teacher gave me flash backs to year 8 audhd me handing in a typed A4 booklet with photos in it with borders, detailed explanations etc that id spent hours on. (We had been asked to turn in half a page on ww1 and half a page on ww2 both of which are a special interest) and infront of the class she held it up and complained that itd taken her entire lunch break to mark it. I was mortified.
that is plain humiliation
U good?
The people in the comments being like “you didn’t even see the movie!” Seem even dumber now that we have “full context”
😭😭😭😭 people were really getting on my ass when I posted this and now I feel very vindicated
I can't come up with an explanation of WHY they decided to hire a pop-song artist with like two good songs under her belt. I don't know if she was the only one who wasn't supporting the strike or if her family is somewhat important.
It's because Disney wanted to make the songs as likeable and marketable as possible, and pop songs are likeable and marketable, and...yeah
And what two songs would those be?
@@imthebossmermaid3648 Can't recall, she had a grammy nomination so I'm guessing that one +1
I'm in the middle on this song honestly. I absolutely love it taking it as it is, but I can't help but wish it did things a LITTLE different!!
Just from a musical standpoint, there's maybe ONE or TWO parts in the song near the end (during the bridge and also where you can hear the sinister rising violin being added to the chorus) that really sell this as a villain song overall. I like that it starts innocent and peppy, but it seems to STAY that way for a bit longer than I would've liked. It doesn't give the vibe of a villain song. I saw someone online describe it as a song millenials are going to lipsync to online to complain about the children they chose to have, and taking it at total face value 😭
idk, that's just my perspective. I'm the furthest thing you could get from a Disney shill or anything like that, but I'm still kind of eager to see this movie so I hope it's good!
Oh my god not the millennials lip syncing about their children 😭😭😭😭😭 why does that sound so accurate oh no.
I feel the same way. I’m really excited for the movie but the song feels like a work in progress instead of a completed version.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuchI can picture it now: a mom holding a baby and a toddler in the middle of doing housewife things w/o help, she then looks exasperated at the camera and goes “tHiS iS tHe ThAnKs I gEt?”
I think that teacher just didn't want to have to grade a thick ass paper in the future 😂.
For everyone saying its too early to judge the film I have this to say. Disney has been flopping left and right because they have not paid attention to narrative and ironically to song. People don't want to spend their hard-earned money in this economy for some subpar piece of media.
It's interesting that you noticed it, but a lot of the Disney production has been done by committee. It's by making sure that they're ticking all the diversity boxes instead of having one vision they are aiming for making sure the narrative flows together.
For example, in Frozen instead of his monologue you could have had Hans sing a villainous version of "Love is an Open door" kind of a bookend song like mother's knows Best.
Speaking of live action films I always thought it would be great if they really wanted to lean into musicals in live act films to get people from musical theater to do the films.
Not movie stars (unless they had musical credits).
I just remember listening to the behind the scenes section on DVD Alan mankin was so nervous composing for film when you have the shark chase sequence. He threw everything in the kitchen sink to prove he had the chops to do it. And the directors basically said yeah you're fine.
Hahaha, it was funny though because he never had to teach me again like, he wouldn't have ever got another paper lol. He truly just thought that you should pick a 'fun' pop song (in the context of an audition etc). But that's why I don't like pop songs that much because they are a "park and bark" or rather, a stand there and just sing I guess lol.
I listened to that same DVD too recently when I had COVID!!! Yeah they talk about how Alan Menken was soooo stressed about composing a film score but he nailed it! I really wonder why they didn't just have him compose this movie because he's still alive, and he still does work for Disney! It's very odd!
Wait, people are saying it is too early to judge the film? Why? There is no "too early", you see if a movie makes sense or not right away. If a movie needs time to convince you it is good, then it is probably not that good.
Ooh, I love that concept, actually! Because his whole thing is that he used Anna’s love for him to gain power - so “love is an open door” would take on a new, darker meaning in the reprise. Because Anna loved him, her love was an open door into the queen’s inner circle.
I don't think of "You're welcome" as a Lin Manuel Miranda song but a Moana song. Primarily I think of Hamilton and the "My own drum" from Vivo when I think of the typical Min Manuel Miranda sound. I think people confuse his "style" with just adding modern elements not recognizing that there is so much more thought behind most of his songs. He's done a very good job at creating unique sounds in most of his work, he just also has the baggage of a few poorly integrated uses of rap.
King Magnifico is far too benevolent at the start to be a credible villain. He just randomly turns bad halfway through the song.
Yeah that had me confused, because that implies he wasn't evil before. And Asha was going against him before he even turned evil.
I really enjoyed this! I’d love to see an analysis of ashas “want song” as I feel it just fell flat completely and lacks most elements that make these types of songs soar
Thank you so much! I’m gonna post this today!
8:54 however I do think that Phil Collins is better able to communicate the emotional growth and conflict better that Wish. Wish’s songs are just platitudes- they are really vapid meaning wise
Yeah, I completely agree.
I'm not a musical theory person at all, but when I heard the song, I would have thought Wish was a jukebox musical if it wasn't so specific with the lyrics. It just didn't sound right at all to me.
What you said about the music reacting to the character was really interesting - I think that's what I was picking up
I really love this breakdown and the way you talk about characterization through music as a hallmark of the Broadway style. I kept thinking about a recent musical I really like, SIX, because all of its songs are dance-pop and therefore have a lot of repetitive rhythms. I still think it accomplishes what you were talking about better than Magnifico's song in terms of reacting to the characters and how they're feeling, and not only because each character's musical style is specifically based on a different pop musician. (Also worth keeping in mind that there's dancing throughout the entire show that also tells the story)
I agree 100%.
There's just something about the modern Disney songs in general. The lyrics are lazy and the songs are not as memorable or quotable as the ones from the Disney Renaissance.
Something I thought was really weird lyrically was “I let you live here for free and I don’t even charge you rent” … maybe I’m just missing the joke but that’s what living there for free means dude 😂🤣 why did they say it twice? There are some lyrics I do like in this song but I keep thinking about how bad that one is unless it’s some inside joke in the movie 🥴
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch
I noticed in most of their new songs, the lyrics can use some polishing.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch If they wanted to repeat that line, then they should add emphasis, not a conjunction: "I let you live here for free, no, I don't even charge you rent."
I'm surprised this seems to be your first video! I liked your thoughts and the quality of your editing and assumed you've been doing this for a while. Your passion for good musical theater and how it connects to the emotions of the character reminds me of myself, as I'm sometimes seen as someone who "cares too much" about these things. 😅 Also the comment about that song sounding like the celebrity version in the ending credits is EXACTLY how I felt! Great video and analysis 👏
Thank you so much! I actually have another channel where I cover video games/anime stuff, but I've always wanted to do Disney/Barbie/musical content so I made this channel and didn't tell anyone 😂 I only have two Disney video essays on my other channel and I'm clearly going to figure out how to remake them and bring them over to this one. I'm really glad that you enjoyed it! I know this video covered a 'trending topic' and so that may be part of its success but I hope it's an indication that people want to see this type of content in particular, so I'd love to do it for older Disney movies / The Barbie movie musicals etc!
After watching Mason idk's video about Hellfire. It HIT me what was off about this villain song.
Sorry, in advance, for the long comment.
Compared to other villains, the king is more closer to Judge Frollo in terms of their power and influence.
So like Mason idk states on why Hellfire is so unique, since we see Frollo already in peak power, his song instead about his WEAKNESS and Hypocrisy.
Magnifico's song is all about what's GOOD about him basically like Gaston's and, even, Maui's song. Emphasizing his arrogance.
And I think this is where they slipped up. Because that's ALL they do in the film. Which makes him less evil and oddly more relatable and understandable.
Making him turing evil near the end, feel like a whiplash.
My suggestion for Magnifico's song, especially for a film about 100 years of Disney, is a beautiful more so mix of Gaston's praise song, but hiding his arrogance.
Instead of flaunting it like Gaston. And Frollo's more tragic, but still irredeemably evil song. They can even try to merge traditional musical to pop, if they want to really make the song stand out.
Instead of Magnifico praising himself. It's people praising him. with the chorus being him, alone, singing about how he deserves more praise and thanks than he's already getting. Basically showing his hypocrisy and maybe a hint of his fear.
The chorus is where some of the beats and tempos and such, for when the song goes full evil takes a peak for the ears to recognize. (So it wouldn't feel sudden)
Then halfway through- like many Disney villain songs, this is where he learns of the star, and the song's tone changes to fit in his fear and anxiety.
It can be as subtle or as obvious as they want. But the change has to be felt. And feel natural.
Letting all that evil tones in the chorus be center stage, while that ones the emphasize his arrogance before be in the background, keeping the song feeling consistent.
I had no idea that this much work went into villain songs, I mean... I knew that a lot effort went into them, but not _THIS_ much (don't mind me, just casually taking notes for if I want to create a villain song). Also explains why King Magnifico's song just... doesn't _feel_ right for a Disney Villain (TM). Especially with some of the lyrics, in my opinion:
_"Peep the name, I'm magnificent!"_
_"And I'm always there when you need to vent."
_"Are you sure that you're not the prob?"_
Like, what time period is this movie set in? 💀💀💀
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That's only a minor nitpick for me though, as It's a great song in general, don't get me wrong. However, as a Disney Villain song... Yeah, it could do a little better... 😅
I mentioned this to someone else but if you ever want to talk about song writing feel free to hit me up on Twitter! I’m also writing a villain song 😂 it’s so cool to see so many aspiring song writers in the comments!
Might be late to this, but as someone who has listened to this song and is going to remake it soon, (possibly will post the song on a different account, who knows) this has amazing insight in why it's so infuriating to me and others. I graduated with an Instrumental performance degree (trumpet and violin are my instruments) so I appreciate the advice/perspective from someone whose specialty is closer to the actual material. Keep doing what you do.
Thank you so much!! I look forward to seeing someone remake it! I wanted to do the same thing but I am terrible with like, a DAW LOL. My one weakness 😂
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch Thanks for the excitement and reply! To be completely honest, I'm sort of learning most of how to make music on the computer as I go. It's a bit embarrassing, but had to look up what DAW was when you mentioned it. I wasn't taught any of that at any point in my musical career. Either way, I'm dead set on finding my way to make this happen. So we'll see how this goes.
I’ve been listening to a lot of anime OPs and EDs lately, so maybe I’m biased. But Magnifico’s song sounded too much like any of them. Just very pop-y and upbeat (mostly).
Yeah on a surface level I’d agree. But usually anime OPs and stuff have “over the top layers” in terms of how they create their sound, this song doesn’t really. It’s sort of hard to explain but basically composition wise they go overboard LOL. But the vibes are definitely similar.
this song beats any weebish opening or cartoon ending or whatever. go back to general chat
@@mob2644No, it doesn’t. It’s a stupid villain song.
@@SweetOrangeGirlthe person has a mob pfp so I’m guessing their a troll.
Hey, anime songs are more complex than this.
Thanks for sharing your pov, I do agree I didn’t expect the song to sound so much like a pop song
Thank you for watching!
Given Julia Michaels' involvement, I'm unsurprised. The worst part is that there are a lot of good pop songs out there, but this one sounds generic.
it sounds like my favorite song
I feel like calling it "copying Lin's style but worse" is a case of "the customer is great at knowing when something's wrong, but not why it's wrong." Like, in the examples you gave from you're welcome, you can hear his actual musical theatre experience coming through in the instruments, where he deliberately chooses more island feeling instruments to keep the immersion even though in universe there's probably not actual instruments playing, or the heroic flair in the brass while he's talking about all the cool stuff he's done. Meanwhile wish doesn't really have any of that. The songwriting in wish is literally so generic it had people accusing it of being written by ai lol.
I think the thing is that while it doesn't sound *literally* like LMM, it sounds like someone listened to Hamilton and Moana and Encanto and went "I can do that!" The thing with how it sounds like You're Welcome is with more of the lyrical work (plus how the vocal performances objectively aren't great but the difference there is that Dwayne Johnson isn't a singer whereas Chris Pine CAN sing but they didn't write it to his strengths). Like, they both are braggadocious and use extremely modern language ("I know it's a lot, the hair, the bod" -> "are you sure that you're not the prob?"). But there's still a big difference in that introducing Maoi like this IMMEDIATE gives us a sense of his character! Whereas even throughout the rest of the movie, when we see Magnifico's evil side, the song doesn’t match his character. So it really comes across as derivative of You're Welcome. It just feels so derivative.
Also I strongly believe that full rest in the instrumentation to show a turning point in his character and that he's about to do something irredeemable was inspired by The World Was Wide Enough from Hamilton. It is my personal conspiracy theory.
I am so glad the algorithm recommended me this! I loved your analysis on og villain songs, it makes me admire them even more!
The whole movie seems it's trying too hard to put in EVERYTHING and ending up being nothing. I hope we're proven wrong.
Thank you so much! I hope to do more Disney/animated movie analysis specifically, some of them songs but some of them more focused on the movie as a whole. I’m still looking forward to Wish, but I do hope it’s able to stick the landing since as you said they’re doing a lot 😅😅
This is the voice of Chris Pine he a good singer and voice actor
my thoughts exactly! It's like the algorithm finding elements that worked best in the previous movies and stitching them all together to create the "perfect" movie for the 100th anniversary.
It reminds me so much of How Bad Can I Be from the lorax movie too lmao. I thought of it immediately.
Thats an insult to How Bad Can I Be /lh
The difference is that How Bad Can I Be is actually still good and still showed how villainous Onceler was
While I think the song works from the POV of someone who believes they're a hero who deserves to be selfish, the production feels a bit too generic, similar to "This Wish."
Yeah I totally agree! The lyrics are really good actually, it’s all the composition 😭 it’s so unfortunate
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I really wish they embraced the Iberian setting for the music, or perhaps went for an alternative/avant-garde sound--at least for the villain song--to make it stand out in Disney's repetoire.
I love people who think about music as seriously as I do, especially music as a medium in musical movies! I totally agree with the character part. The beast song was grim in a way that didn't feel evil, it's so reactive as you said! The songs are written in character, the songs are sang in character. "This is The Thanks I Get" could be in any movie and put on almost any character. I think a problem with this is that the characters in Wish aren't distinct as characters in my opinion. Pop artists have written songs for musicals that were amazing (Spongebob is an example I love to use). To put it simply, the music only adds to the fire that is Wish but it isn't the starter.
omg thank you! i dont think anyone has explained so well why this song doesnt work. you gave a perfect lesson of what is necessary to compose a disney (and musicals in general) melody.
in the end it is all about having the character's soul ingrained in the melody, there needs to be a conversation between the two, i never really understood that before watching your video, so thank you once again for the wonderful and enlightening lesson!
I will never understand how this lyric "I let you live here for free and I don't even charge you rent" made it through multiple rounds of approvals and creative teams. And not one person thought it was a bad idea.
"Wish" is the final nail that proves Disney simply does not care. They think they can churn out low-effort garbage, believing that as long as it's stuffed full of whatever's popular at that moment, it'll make bank. Doesn't matter how shallow it is, or that it'll be immediately dated within two years tops. They don't care. They have no interest in making good films, only profitable ones.
10:44 I'd say American Psycho is the biggest example of a musical without a traditional Broadway style, because it's entirely electronic besides the singers. Duncan Sheik in general is known for not having a Broadway style, but that is the ultimate example.
I agree with you. The song is very monotone and lacking, which is a shame because I do like the concept of the villain that we know is evil but is not apparent straight away. I just wish (haha) they executed it better.
stop laughing
Disney really had CHRIS PINE on set and made him sing...that
I can't believe your channel is just starting out! I clicked to hear more musical analysis and then realized this was your first video. I hope you make more, you got my suscribe and the notification bell!
Thank you so much!! I’ll be posting an analysis about “This Wish” today and it’ll be pretty different compared to this video (though within the same vein). There is some different stuff to breakdown with that song!
Says something that even Disney adults are mixed about this movie.
Honestly I think it says EVERYTHING. Because the entire point of Disney movies are movies that appeal to kids, but aren’t necessarily only for children. But this movie completely shuts out the adults and even talks down to the kids like they’re stupid 🥴🥴🥴
Can you please, please, pretty please with a cherry on top; do a review on the song "This Wish"? I really did NOT like the overabundance of lyrics that was used in the song that just made the whole thing sound like a mess. I've only seen 1 video cover that issue but only briefly. I really want somebody with a professional background with experience to talk about this because I KNOW it needs to be brought more when it was supposed to be the "Let It Go" of Wish. I really don't care if it's 40 minutes. Lol
I’m going to post it today!! I’m glad you don’t care if it’s 40 minutes because it is exactly 40 minutes long 😂🤣
@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I wouldn't have cared if it was 90! I'm just so glad you read what I had to say! Omg this is exciting!!! 🤩🤩 Finally, a video that just backs me up even more by somebody who's qualified and an expert!
this is kinda off topic but I really enjoy how passionate you are when talking about all the different parts of songs like all the different sections :]
Thank you so much! That’s why I called the channel “Calxiyn Cares Too Much” because I know all of this is hyper specific but if I don’t care, who is going to?! 🥰🥰
I love your energy! You explain your thought process excellently and your passion for the subject is obvious. Great video, I'm subscribed!
Thank you so much! The next video is coming very soon!
but it's genetics, he's got those genes from outer space! 😂 god what a mess
That line really bothers me 🥴🥴🥴 I have no idea why but the reference to outer space is just very out of place.
''This is the thanks I get?!'' is the movies villain song. I'm going to be honest. Out of all the songs so far this is my favorite. But from what I saw it's also the one with most dislikes. My best guess is that people were excited and had high expectations about the new villain song since the last one was ''Shiny'' from Moana, 7 YEARS AGO! What also probably upset people is that despite being a ''Disney villain song'' it lacks a lot of the same punch. It's trying to be like ''Mother Knows Beast'' where the villain is being manipulative and try to pass of as the good guy. I'm going to judge the song for what it is, not for what I wish (wink wink) it would be. Just a heads up, it does pretty poorly.
1. The song is very repetitive with the ''this is the thanks I get'' being sang over and over. It's a rule at this point that the name of the song will be repeated many times in the song or that it will be named after whatever is repeated in the song the most, whichever comes first. But a whole freaking chorus?! At least Chris Pine sings it a bit differently each time.
2. Speaking of annoying repetition, the whole ''tu tu tu'' is driving me crazy. I mentioned it in one of my previous posts that I hate when writers put some sounds for singer to sing because they couldn't be bothered to come up with real words to put into their song. It's lazy and feels like padding. It's not a song in a club that you can bob your head to. It's a song in a musical. Tell a story! Unlike Chris Pine singing ''this is the thanks I get'' differently every time, ''tu tu tu'' is sang always the same. And lastly, who the hell is singing that part? Just because it's a musical it doesn't mean that singing comes out of nowhere. Usually the bad guy sings solo or with his/her minions.
3. Awkward modern talk that is showing up in all the songs. Examples include ''rent free'' and ''prob''. This is supposed to be a medieval kingdom. I don't expect them to speak like Shakespeare but come on! It sounds so cringe and will age the movie like milk.
4. Contradiction! Magnifico granted 14 wishes last year but Asha in ''Welcome to Rosas'' said he grants one wish every month. Does a year in Rosas has 14 months? How did no one noticed that?
5. Another problem I found with the song is how it less singing and more talking rhythmically.
6. There's a moment in the song when Magnifico starts going crazy evil and you might get excited about how the song might progress but it's interrupted with ''Where was I'' because we were getting too serious, so we interrupt it with MCU like joke. After that the song goes back to its previous monotone rhythm.
7. The song tries to build up some excitement again with evil high strings and Magnifico screaming (which sounds good) and a cheesy echo but it's too late. They had an awesome build up and squandered it. There is no walking it back.
8. This is the problem with all those songs. There seems to be beginnings and endings to those songs but for the most part they just meander around in the same tone, tempo, instruments and every time something resembling a build up or a change of pace it's right back to how it was sang before.
It's a boring repetitive song just like all the others but is the most hated because people had high hopes for it. But to be fair I don't think a villain song that sounds actually evil is too demanding. Especially when people were very clear about what they want for years.
This is a pretty thorough analysis, especially since you do a good job of explaining the gripes with the Wish songs compared to the classic songs and why they're missing so much of what made them great. I didn't think I would watch all 30 minutes, but your enthusiasm about the subject is definitely infectious.
The music either has to thrust the story forward, like most classic Disney songs do; or the animation has to thrust the story forward while the song provides accompaniment, like Tarzan does with the Phil Collins songs. Wish unfortunately does neither, where the music is very repetitive and therefore doesn't push the story forward, but the animation is focused on having the characters sing these songs that the animation also can't move the story forward, either. This causes the music to just kinda be a pause in the story, which makes it a real drag.
13:21 that most likely a gliss from brass bar chimes (or mark tree, or chime tree) used for music and sound effects :)
and yea i think that plucking sound might be a harpsichord too
Thank you!!!
I loved your explanation of reactive music, the concept was totally new to me but you explained it so well with the examples! thank you!
I’m so glad to hear it!! Once you start to notice it, especially in Beauty and The Beast, Aladdin and Little Mermaid you won’t be able to stop 😂
I can't believe your teacher got mad at you for writing a good report! Sometimes writing is FUN! You going all out on the report means you had motivation! You liked writing it! Not that you were overworking yourself.
Eta: my favorite song ever is one my dad wrote because it gives me so many thoughts. The lyrics tell a story and I think so much about how complex it is and I just. I will write lengths about it. Because it's so good
Hahaha, I don’t think he was “mad” per se but yeah it was a strange situation lol. His point was that in the context of taking a pop-song to an audition you want something sort of thoughtless, but I don’t listen to pop music like that, I like narrative driven pop music.
Also that’s so sweet about your dad 🥰 what a nice memory!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch also I don't know you much but would it be okay to email you or message you on some social media to show you my rewrite of This is the Thanks I Get? I've revised it a bit from the original and if you'd like to see what I have so far I'd be happy to share
Goodness! I love hearing Enthusiastic MusicPeople talk about music! Is this really your first video? It's good! The sound is a bit more quiet than I would personally like, but other than that it's well-produced.
Your able to rip the vague thoughts I have in my head of how there's a sense of inadequacy for the song, and actually put it into words perfectly!
Anyways! I'm super-subscribed! I hope this is the beginning of many more videos :D
P.S: You have good Music Miming, it doesn't seem to always be in sync, perhaps the audio hasn't caught up with the camera, as it tends to have some sort of dissonance, but I still enjoy it (and I do the same thing, too, lol).
I wonder if you know/how you would react to Galavant, a non-Disney Menken work. There are a couple traditionnal and non-traditional villain songs in this one (a fairly normal one (She'll Be Mine), one mixed with an I want song in a way (No One But You), the last one being just a small part of a bigger song that makes you go "wait, what?" (The Happiest Day of Your Life)). People have been commenting on the fact that the queen in Wish was supposed to be evil too and the idea of a villainous power couple made me think of this series, though it's not that trope exactly, just close enough. The second season especially pays homage to other famous musicals like Les Mis or West Side Story. I also really like the heroine-villainess rap battle near the end, I Don't Like You :D
It's funny as heck and makes you feel all the feels, too
15:14 Sort of like a rattlesnake, that cue warns the listener of the danger he poses.
thank you so much for putting words to my frustrations for this song!
I'm glad it's not just me! Thank you so much for watching!
I have never been someone who understands music. I love music! I can’t do anything without having something on in the background! But beyond the poetry aspect of music I’m completely useless lol, so this was genuinely really helpful! My whole reaction to this song was just “huh this sounds bad” lmao. I’d love to see more deep dives like this!
It sounds like the song for an Encanto villain if it had one.
But I guess it fits Magnifico since he seems to be a pretender.
However....
I hope it turns to boss music in the later half of the song. So we get the chills we're supposed to get from the villain.
"Be preparrrrrreeeed!!" 🎵 🦁
Edit: I've just listened to the whole song. Like they lyrics, hate the melody and tone. But the song does fit him. And I like that part where he got unhinged. 👹😈
Not really. Encanto's music had heavy Colombian influences. This song does not.
I could immediately tell the songs were Beast songs despite not being familiar with them! I got this tragic, regal, ominous yet not evil sorta vibe that immediately made me think of him.
Ahhhhh I’m so glad! That leitmotif is one of my absolute favourites too!
“I let you live here for free and I don’t even charge you rent!”
😬😬😬😬😬
Magnifico is too nice for a villain.
Didn’t watch the movie yet but did heared the song
And even though I love how catchy it is it’s still not a good « Villain » it’s sound more like a broken villain song or even a villain backstory song but NOTHING like a villain song
At least Trolls Band Together actually managed to gave us a good villain song with their antagonist
I'd argue that as a villain song, "Hellfire" is an example of the principle that great artists know when to break the rules. The song breaks a lot of the standards for villain songs: Instead of bombastically reveling in how evil he is, Frollo is fearfully denying how evil he is (and not just superficial denials that are a blatant attempt at trickery like in "Poor Unfortunate Souls" or "Mother Knows Best"). It's almost like a villain song in opposite land where instead of Frollo gleefully boasting about his lust and corruption, he insists that none of that is true. Yet this is so good at characterizing him that it works really well---far better than a more traditional villain song. But "Hellfire" is the exception that proves the rule.
And that was one problem I had with "This is the Thanks I Get": Why is Magnifico denying being evil? He's not trying to trick other people, like Ursula or Mother Gothel. He's not in denial like Frollo---or if he is, it isn't communicated very well. He should be reveling in his evil.
Or if they *did* want him to be in denial like Frollo, they didn't do nearly a good enough job of pulling it off. IMO, the villain-in-denial like Frollo requires *very* good characterization, and if you fall short in that area, the villain-in-denial suffers far more that the classic evil-and-loving-it villain (who can still be somewhat entertaining even if he's made of cardboard).
The thing about Frollo as well as that his song is something we call "To the other self or God". So It's not even necessarily a rule break, it's just that most of the time villains either have an "I Want" song, or an "I Am" song. Like Gaston for example is about all the things he is, whereas Poor Unfortunate Souls is wanting Ariel to do something. With Frollo, his song actually falls into that "other self" category where the character is actually conflicted about their feelings and trying to sort it out with their "other self or god". The reason why you can't do that with Magnifcio is because he doesn't feel conflicted, and so he needs someone to actually sing to.
It may not be slappin, but it's certainly clappin.. (like a too friendly Christian summer camp counselor.) I think because the kingdom of Rosas is supposed to take place in Spain or inspired by medieval Spain, that's why it has folksy latin vibe. But bc chris pine is in it maybe he is bringing that fun camp with the 80s synth and bass guitar. But the song lyrics also reveals that King Magnifico is not all he is cracked up to be. He might be bound to spell book that gave him the ability to grant (and trap) wishes with spells. But he possibly isn't in full control of his power, or the source of it. This is why he is so threatened by Asha bringing the star to Rosas.
agree
I’m worried about Wish after Raya and the last dragon.
Okay, 'This Is The Thanks I Get' sounds bad... So that's why I'm gonna watch Oliver & Company, at least that has better pop songs. (kind of) I mostly watch the movie for its villain Sykes.
24:11 absolutely! I haven't watched any of the Beauty and Beast Movies in years, and while it took me a bit, B&B were my first guess! love your analysis, easy to understand and made me feel like i learned something.
I own an artbook for a FAN ALBUM of a novel series, not even officially licensed which made like a fake soundtrack with no words, just instrumentals and orchestra that somehow does a better job at conveying emotion and reactionary music choices that you mentioned that is overall a far better piece of art and music than a billion dollar Disney movie. Let that sink in. A KICKSTARTER for a FAN SOUNDTRACK to a BOOK is leages ahead of freaking Disney
Okay and where's the SONG REVIEW??
:/ It's just 2 minutes playing the music with no lyrics.
And in the last >10 minutes is about the actual song.
This was my first video before the movie was even out predicting things wouldn’t end up great, so we didn’t do a full song analysis for this one! But I could do a more thorough one like I did for This Wish if people are interested!
This was so insightful! Thanks for explaining why this song didn't sound right to me. I'm so glad I found your channel, you're a really engaging and entertaining speaker! And also your hair is cool!
Thank you so much!! I’m really glad to hear it 💖 I love being able to help to “teach” people!!
This is more of an issue with the movie, but to have a villain song, you need to have a villain. This comment is based on what I've seen other RUclipsrs say.
A man who went from rags to riches because he learned magic through effort, built a kingdom with that magic, lets anyone come live there rent free as said in the song, and overall thinks what's best for the people of the kingdom and based on that actually makes some wishes come true, is not a villain.
Magnifico takes everyone's wishes, sure, but those that he believes to be beneficial to the kingdom he makes true. There's a part where Magnifico holds a wish of someone becoming a great conqueror. That means war. That means death and suffering. That's not a wish that should become true, so Magnifico is in the right for not letting that one come true.
But despite his magical omnipotency, Magnifico is still a human. He has emotions, emotional responses. I don't remember what it was, that made Magnifico do it, but he started to use an evil magic book of evilness that made Magnifico evil because lazy writing.
I LOVED THIS VIDEO TOO MUCH i would never notice by myself these little details from Broadway theater songs and its genuinely so interesting, ur super smart 😭💞
Awwwww thank you so much!!! I’m glad you enjoyed!
I hate that the lyrics cover things that Magnifico never does.
While he is presented as a more subtle villain character (dismissive and controlling rather than overtly evil), the lyrics present him as the complete opposite of what we've seen. He talks about forcing complete randos whom we never see ( who tf is Carlito or Henry?) to do stuff we never see for people we never see asking for said stuff, because "thats stuff a villain WOULD do."
If i were watching a Transformers cartoon and someone talks about Starscream being a backstabbing jerk, i believe that because i am SHOWN Starscream BEING a backstabbing jerk.
YOU CANNOT MAKE A SONG ABOUT DOING PETTY BASICBITCH VILLAINOUS THINGS, IF HE IS NOT SHOWN AND ESTABLISHED AS A GUY WHO DOES PETTY BASICBITCH VILLAINOUS THINGS.
“I don’t want something that has no thought in it” struck me so much. I feel that so hard as an autistic person who has an over analytical brain (and probably would even if I weren’t ND)
I feel like this and the other Wish video are ND bat signals because so many people are ND in the comments and so am I! It’s so good to see 😭😭😭
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch Hooray! I also enjoy your video since I feel others used jargon and while I did grow up with musical theater I never learned film terminology. So the way you broke everything down was super helpful to me as someone who understands and loves storytelling but not musical technicalities
I can’t believe this channel doesn’t have any subscribers 🤯 this video is so well made!
Thank you so much! I just started posting videos like this on this channel (but I do have a main channel with other stuff), so hopefully it’ll grow slowly. I’m really happy with how this was received so far, thank you so much!
I really enjoy music analysis and honestly I could listen to you explain reactive music in Disney songs for hours and never get bored. Incredible video. Thank you for making it :)
Thank you so much! I really appreciate the encouragement! The next video is a bit more beefy so I hope it still won’t bore you 😂
I’m shocked by how underrated your channel is. The video quality and charisma is amazing. This is probably the most in depth analysis of this song that I’ve seen so far.
Thank you so much! I just started on this channel and I really appreciate the encouragement!! I hope to do a lot more like this for songs, characters and the movies themselves!
I actually really like this song the fake humbleness of him at the start going to him then complaining about his people to his nice guy persona completely crumbling and him opening himself up to the dark magic and him finally losing it in the final line.
that being said I do 100 percent get why other people don't like it.
Yea the concept is pretty good
First video of mine, and I gotta say you were in my ear for the entire time, like it was loud. SUBSCRIBED!
THIS IS THE SONG I GET!?
😂🤣
My issues with the song:
1. The rhymes are so weird. The words do not sound good together
2. Lyrics are shallow. It’s basically the same message being said over and over. It doesn’t build much.
3. The song just feels plain? I cannot explain it
4. Most Disney songs have a moment of tension or suspense. Not here
My biggest complaint about this song, is that this ISN'T a villain song.
This is a frustrated hero song.
You know, when the hero has a goal but is about to retire because of his failure?
That's the kind of song this is.
Yeah that’s a good way of putting it! And villains can see themselves as heroic but I think the problem is that it’s missing the element of “the villain thinks they’re the hero but we as the audience know they aren’t because they say something shitty” sort of thing. Like in Gaston how Gaston says he’s gonna put Belle’s father in the asylum, that’s so transparently evil even tho Gaston is about how great Gaston is!
It's kinda funny hearing you say "I'm not saying this movie will flop" now when we know it flopped
People were soooo mad at me on Twitter and telling me "WAIT UNTIL THE MOVIE COMES OUT BEFORE YOU CRITICIZE IT" So I had to preface everything I said even though I was right 😭
WOW, okay I didn't know your background so I'm sorta blown away by how insightful this video is! I thought this was going to be a simple breakdown based mostly on personal opinions so I'm VERY pleasantly surprised!
oh god, the same thing from my school days is happening all over again. This is so much new information to me (because I have exactly 0 experience with music since I never studied it) that not only did I completely miss some points due to my lack of understanding of musical theory, I was processing the portion before while you were talking and I'm perpetually stuck in a loop of having no idea what's going on. I guess I'll have to watch the video twice lol
ADHD be like
Thank you so much! I’m a musical theatre grad who also writes music sometimes! And don’t worry about the ADHD thing, I’m exactly the same way. My “This Wish” video is gonna focus less on the instrumental so hopefully it’ll be easier to follow along with! Thank you for watching!
The most I wanted was a good reprise to showcase his “true colors” like how we know Mother Gothel is a bad person but Rapunzel doesn’t know it so the first song she sings sounds sinister but almost something convincing while her reprise shows Rapunzel how manipulative she is
We know the king is bad/manipulative maybe, but Asha doesn’t know it
Honestly, this is sort of what I wanted- I feel like they could have done a jaunty "good" version of the song, and then had it again later with a much more sinister tone and suddenly everyone realises there's a darker double meaning to the lyrics. Something like that could have been really clever. But you have to know what you're doing to make something like that work.
@@izzisart exactly like…
We know he’s bad since the reveal, but what about the character? Does she know? I feel like the more the first song progresses she starts to realize he’s bad or something but the song continues on forcefully as if trying to reject the idea of thinking he’s bad but it’s very clear he is.
Then later on we’d get a reprise that really shows all the (red flags) bad within him. Sort of like this rewritten version of the song I found on TikTok sang by Caleb Hyles or something
@@Skidibibapbap I'm gonna have to look that rewritten version up!
Yeah, even though we as the audience know he's evil, doing the songs this way would do a really good job of putting us in the shoes if the character- you can see (or rather hear?) him pulling the wool over her eyes, and yet when it gets circled back to later, it shows there was stuff right there that everyone just missed.
Ok ok, I hate this song too. But what’s with the Imagine Dragons slander? This sounds nothing like Imagine Dragons.
😂 it wasn’t about them per se but more “the pop cover at the end of the Disney movie” vibe. Like Demi Lovato singing “Let It Go” - not Imagine Dragons’ original music or anything 😅😅
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch Oh ok. For the record, I don’t like Demi Lovato’s Let it Go either. Or whatever was going on in the end credits of Frozen 2 😂
i can't believe i guessed correctly that those were Beast's songs, i'm not into BATB i've never seen the stage musical or the reboot but i did have a much-too-quiet recording of If I Can't Love Her on a cd when i was like 5 that i always skipped because i couldn't understand it. but that song sounds deep and heavy and really really anxious and insecure, and who is big and insecure? beast. youre so right on that one
That's such a good way to put it - it does sound insecure!! Like dark, but not villainous. They did a really good job with the Beast Leitmotifs!
I don’t know what they were going for or not, all I know is every time this song comes on, there’s a point where I just start sing You’re Welcome, and it’s jarring for me every time 😅😂
They did not understand the assignment
The song identification exercise was really interesting. Even though I last time I saw B&B was the live action, I could tell right away that that was the movie and then a little longer to determine it was for the Beast. I think the pop artists don’t quite understand how much the music itself conveys, not just melody and lyrics.
This was a great song review. I sure look forward to see your other works!
Thank you so much!
I love your music analysis! This is a really awesome in depth study that is worth listening to! And gave words to my feelings regarding my very “blah” reaction to Wish.
Thank you so much!! I really appreciate it and I hope you’ll enjoy my other Wish videos (and future Barbie/Disney videos when they come out!)
I remember that "princess and a frog" was so big because it was one of few movies that returned to classic Disney style. I remember that i was exited for it because I'm big simp for 2d animation. It was at the time when 3d effect in cinema were big thing and every studio was obsesed with that feature. This movie was standing out among others because it chosed classic style of animation and storytelling. And they delivered! A lot of people see this movie as end of an era in Disney. It was not something new but i had quality in it.
Wish try replicate classic Disney movies but i feel that they don't want to fully embrace thier style.
"Look we made it look like 2d animation! Look we made a villan song!"
Wish feel like they don't uderstand what made those mediums stand out and in effect made the final product more bland than cookie made from saw dust.
You can mix styles of old and new (puss in boots the last wish) but you need to think HOW both in music and animation
Agree on what makes a song Broadway material! Tarzan was successfully adapted into a Broadway production despite the 'pop' songs though. It's definitely not the 'popness' that's problematic, just evident lack of experience that results in overall badly-written songs; pop or otherwise
I’ve actually never heard of the Tarzan musical, I’m surprised it slipped entirely under my radar! But yeah I agree with some of the other comments that the difference between this and Tarzan is still that the “heart” of the scenes are captured well in the songs. Like “Strangers Like Me” and “You’ll Be In My Heart” are perfect for the story!
Gonna cling to the idea that there’s a reprise where it’s a traditional villain song later but let’s be honest
I wish i can find it but theres a song list floating around and theres no reprise listed. I hear theres a duet between Asha and Magnifeco but it's not listed in the song list