For everyone who responded seriously to this video: thank you. But this video is nothing more and nothing less than a little organ joke of mine. A few days ago I heard someone say in a lively discussion on FB: "what if Sietze de Vries had played this reopening?". And that got me thinking; what would that have looked like? And so, just for fun, I started editing and tried to make it look as real as possible. It was a lot of fun (and a lot of work) to do that. But of course: nothing fits better in this historic place, Notre Dame of Paris, with its rich musical Catholic-liturgical tradition, than the musical tradition that has been going on there for centuries. And that is the tradition of improvising as the French do: on Gregorian themes, in a romantic and modern style, building on the legacy of the great French composers and players such as Cochereau, etc. Let's not forget that we also heard a classic improvised Tierce en Taille by Vincent Dubois and later a Plein Jeu by Fajoles during the reopening. So even though I am a big fan of the improvisations of Sietze de Vries (baroque improvisation doesn't get any better); for a place like Notre Dame to reopen, you don't need a foreign organist from a different musical tradition to play. I'm a catholic church musician myself and have been to Notre Dame several times; i always enjoyed the organ and the playing there. So take this video with a big wink :) and I hope it brought you all a big smile!
Better have good friends in high places than real music talent. That s all the reality of "tradition of the last 20 years"... Never heard such noise before
Out of the lot that I've heard that night- out of place or NOT for Notre-dame- this is certainly one of the more desirable pieces instead of crashing dissonant chords here and there (even though Latry IS an incredible 'improvisationalist', per se. This sounds like an improvisation on a Bach fugue- for variety of musical genre- this was an interesting and most enjoyed addition to the mix!
Merci pour cet astucieux montage. C'est exactement ce que nous aurions aimé entendre ce soir là. Nous aurions mieux fait d'inviter les organistes Hollandais, que personnellement j'admire beaucoup. L' organiste Sietze de Vries est un génie de l'improvisation.
Maybe if it was reopening of Bovenkerk Kampen or Bavokerk in Haarlem organ or something similar, then yes. Otherwise, no. It’s out of place in the Notre Dame tradition.
@@cabbagepatch8947 That's fine by me. But Sietze would be so out of place, just because his style just doenst fit in. Something in even cochereau-style would fit i think.
@ I agree. For example, would have preferred to hear 8 versets of improvisations on some Gregorian chant tunes and all 4 organists have done it a thousand times on other occasions but I respect their improvisation tradition which stems from Pierre Cochereau and I understand why it was done exactly this way.
Dit was geweldig geweest in een Noord-Duitse kerk, maar doe mij in de Notre Dame maar de heerlijk impressionistische improvisaties van Olivier Latry, gestoeld op een eeuwenlange traditie.
Merci Marcel. Personnellement je n'apprécie pas ce parisianisme élitiste. Le matin de ce réveil de l'orgue je suis passé à La Madeleine où j'ai entendu Sander Van den Houten qui préparait ses registrations sur le magnifique Cavaillé-Coll de tribune pour un concert de musique romantique qu'il donnait le lendemain après midi. Bravo Sander. J'étais devant la télévision pour ce réveil de l'orgue de Notre Dame. J'ai arrêté après la seconde improvisation d'Olivier Latry réputée devant illustrer les incantations de l'évêque. Qu'est-ce que cette conception d'un culte spectacle, vantant les tenues du clergé conçues par un grand couturier, proposant une musique inaudible pour l'assemblée ? Autant le cérémonial que la musique illustraient à qui en doutait le fossé qui isole structurellement le clergé catholique romain et ses serviteurs du commun des mortels. L'organiste que je suis, immensément loin de la technicité des organistes titulaires de ND - mais ici on ne parle pas de technique -, a la même sensibilité que vous au regard de ce réveil. Par contre félicitations à tous ceux qui ont restauré ND de cette façon.
@@TheRobe477 La différence étant que la musique de Bach, indépendemment de la perception des deux trois insatisfaits dont l'opinion nous est parvenue (le reste de ses contemporains sont plutôt unanimes), on peut lui trouver objectivement un sens et une substance. Essayez de m'expliquer quel était le sens de l'ACV en direct de Latry. Orgue, instrument sacré pour la louange de Dieu : on tape sur l'orgue comme un enragé. Orgue, prière à Marie : on tape sur l'orgue comme un enragé. Latry est un grand technicien, mais on est pas mal unanimes que sa musique est vide de sens, voire d'intérêt parce qu'elle ne dit rien et ne fait rien ressentir sinon du déplaisir et de la douleur. Vide. C'est tout. Du vide et du chaos très bruyant. Mais bon, les nihiliste se trouvent intelligents.
@@TheRobe477 Bonjour, "les" contemporains, je ne sais pas, mais le conseil d'Arnstadt, oui. Je ne doute pas un seul instant des qualités musicales d'Olivier Latry. La question qui se pose est sur la musique qu'il convenait de jouer lorsque la nation entière, et au delà des frontières, était invitée, au delà des confessions, à partager la joie de la restauration réussie de ND de Paris. Je suis certain que Latry sait improviser non seulement dans le style baroque nord-allemand correspondant au choix musical réalisé par Marcel Mangnus pour illustrer son post d'humour (et d'humeur), mais aussi dans le style romantique français qui a longtemps dominé à la tribune de ND comme au CNSMP. Il a été réalisé un choix réservé, en pratique, à un cercle d'esthètes (ou d'auditeurs qui se plaisent à croire qu'ils le sont). Je considère que c'est un mauvais choix au regard de ce qui était l'enjeu.
This video has the hashtag 'organ humor' and it is indeed a very clever joke. But of course no one is suggesting that Sietze de Vries *should* have played at Notre Dame's re-opening. While Latry's opening improvisation was indeed in the current style of French organ improvisation, the reconstruction of Notre Dame was NOT an exercise in replacing history with something contemporary. Oak forests across France contributed trunks to replace the medieval beams. I believe that Marcon originally suggested that there be an architectural competition to find a design for a replacement of Viollet-le-Duc's spire, destroyed in the fire. But in the end the decision was made to recreate the 19th-century spire. The re-opening of the cathedral was not a celebration of the new, but of re-creating and preserving the old. Although the organists did, later in the ceremony, evoke older traditions of French organ playing, the first response to the archbishop's beautiful prayer celebrating the organ was an angry, discordant mess of notes which many people, not only in the cathedral but around the world, found ugly. And I think that was a great shame. Great improvisers should be able to understand the occasion, the context, and the audience better. This was an opportunity to show the world not only what a powerful and frightening instrument the organ is, but how moving and inspiring it can be. Inevitably it was only this first improvisation which the largest number of people heard, as it was picked up by the international media. Such a shame.
Perhaps Latry wanted to express something else: the pain of the fire and the destruction of the church. The organ saw this and lamented. In the next improvisations, the jubilation and joy gradually reappeared.
Who selected the repertoire and the performers for this event? Perhaps that is the real background required for all the discussion. Despite the massive efforts that went into considering and confirming the selection of traditional and professional competences of all those artisans who worked to restore Notre Dame, the selection of music did not pay the slightest attention to the repertoire that was born in the Notre Dame school - meaning the first polyphony - music actually written for the acoustics of a Gothic cathedral. Over five centuries of music by distinguished composers was neglected. France is a country in which all these repertoires are regularly performed by distinguished French ensembles that are funded by the French government - no problem for effective programming and performers. The selection of repertoire was a mistake: the English would have never represented a grand event like the recent coronation with the sloppy selection of repertoire and artists of the performances that we witnessed at Notre Dame. The current organ is part of the 19th and 20th century additions to Notre Dame, as is the tradition of 19th and 20th century French organ improvisation. But what about the earlier repertoire?
Given some of the more "illustrious" members of the audience, I'd say they got the hot steaming plate of slop they deserved. I missed the live stream event entirely, - I knew it would be a train wreck. I've seen as much to confirm what I predicted.
I agree with you, as first piece I would have expected at least a clear reférence to the gothic style which goes back to the origin, for example an estampie ou perharps a veni creator spiritus harmonized / improvised in quart and fives or organum-style.
@@hl007a I listened with a student to Leonin (a revelation) and Perotin while this service was still going on. And then, Sumer is icumen in'. To make just your point.
These are the current organists if Notre-Dame playing in the current style (while still utilizing Gregorian Chant themes). The other composers are dead and are not relevant for a contemporary occasion. Figure it out brilliant
"Alleluia Nativitas" would have been a nice selection instead of that gawdawful and overused Handel chorus. Text of the Pérotin work: _Alleluia Nativitas gloriose virginis Marie ex semine Abrahe orta de tribu Juda clara ex stripe David._
Het daadwerkelijke resultaat was op zijn minst abstract te noemen… (wat natuurlijk niets afdoet aan het talent van de voorkomende musici) Als je het mij vraagt had ik toch liever Sietze of Evan Bogerd gehad
Niet in de Notre-Dame daar zijn zowel De Vries als Bogerd niet op hun plek. De Notre-Dame is een plek waar altijd al vernieuwing is geweest, die traditie moet je niet verloochenen.
It probably would work, if the new organ had a mechanical action, but like most of the new built organs of this size everything is electric these days...
@@MarcelMangnus Thank you very much. I'm so thrilled to listen his improvisations, especially fugue. How is it possible? His head is like a computer :)))) Absolutely stunning. I m looking forward to hear and learn more from this extraordinary musician!!! Regards from Denmark :)
This is part of the longer improvisation on 'Jesus, meine Zuversicht'. At the end (versus 6) you hear this prelude and fugue. See ruclips.net/video/GqpdTuVFpBQ/видео.html
Now THAT'S more like it. Only the camera scans of the audience would have reflected more joy than polite acceptance. Mr cr Vries and Balint Karosi are two of the best improvisers in both the ancient and up-to-date traditions. Latry could have done something like it but who knows who was manipulating who?
Sietze de Vries's music would have been far more suitable for this moment than Olivier Latry's harshly strident improvisations, which some people in the audience strongly disliked. Some French organists seem to be hell-bent on discouraging the use of the organ in the church and driving its use into oblivion. Improvisation, a staple skill of French organists, seems to have devolved more and more into merely making as much NOISE as possible, with little thought given to expressing the beauty of the organ. Olivier Latry IS a fine organist, but as Notre Dame's titulaire, he has become known as a player who oftentimes bangs out the worst kind of cacophonous improvisations imaginable from Notre Dame's splendid organ. (Two of the musical selections played later during the organ's reopening ceremony were, however, far more eloquent and moving representations of the dignified grandeur of 17th- and 18th-century French classical organ music at its finest and were quite appropriate for this occasion.}
What Latry played is perfectly consistent with the long-standing style of French organ music. Think Messiaen and Langlais. I went to a school where chapel attendance was compulsory, and the only piece for which half the school stayed to listen was when James Lancelot played Messiaen's Dieu parmi nous - otherwise the chapel emptied immediately.
@@peterwilton9047 And the 8 (I believe) invocations pefectly fit the concept. The organ awakens from fire disaster torments and subsequent sleep during restorations of the Notre Dame and itself thru 8 "sets". Every next set is becoming more and more in line of what we know by organ. No wonder the first invocaiton by Latry is as it is - this is organs clearing of the throat and still being angry of not finding its former - glorious voice. The last invocation ends on a very merry major chord, if I remember correctly it is even a picardy third. So all good in the sense of how to do that in France and the fact that some people did not find it pleasing is totally beyond the point.
In my opinion, octotonic pieces like these are not cacaphonic. Go have a listen to Holst’s planets… or Messiaens Apparation. It’s already 100 years active.
👉Better have good friends in high places than real music talent. 🤘🤘🤘 That s all the reality of "tradition of the last 20 years"... Never heard such noise before
They probably expected music from a talented composer like Messiaen or Langlais. Instead they got some skilled keyboard and pedal work from a hack composer.
@@AlexRCarlson Nothing will ever bring America together. To your other point, I really enjoy French organ music and I played a lot of it when I studied organ long ago, and that is why I really dislike what I heard from Latry.
absolute Zustimmung......wäre dem Anlass würdiger gewesen als immer diese Selbstdarstellung des Organisten mit diesem lauten modernen Orgelgetöse......
L'improvisation n'était abstraite mais bien construites sur les thèmes...même si je n'ai pas apprécié nos organistes sont de renommée internationale....mais sietze de Vries est de la même tempe dans style différent que je préfère....
Met alle respect voor Sietze de Vries maar die is daar niet op zijn plek hoor. Het orgel van de Notre-Dame is een modern-symfonisch orgel met een stevige Cavaille-Coll inslag. Dat past niet bij De Vries. In de Notre-Dame horen organisten uit de Franse improvisatie traditie (Dupré, Cochereau), zoals dus Latry maar ook de recent benoemde Escaich.
LOL! Sounds much much better to me, than the real reopening organ music. But that's maybe, because I like music much more than random noise 😀. Yes, I don't understand French noise (music) tradition 😀.
Un peu "carnivalesque" comme d'ailleurs a été une bonne partie de la céremonie. Il y a, bien sur, des œuvres plus appropriés à une occasion tellement dense. Respectueusement, Mmes & Mrs.
Sietze de Vries. Il est organiste à Groningen (NL). Il est célèbre pour ses improvisations dans des styles divers (et il enseigne l'art de l'improvisation à l'orgue). Dans le cas présent il s'agit d'une improvisation (prélude & fugue) dans le style baroque nord-allemand sur le choral luthérien Jesus, meine Zuversicht, improvisation exécutée sur l'orgue Schnitger de la Martinikerk de Groningen. Sietze de Vries, lui, est réformé.
😊it sounds baroque; Bach, Weckmann, Scheidermann? The fugue is very chromatic, but too pedestrian for Bach. I’d go for an impro by the organist. The audience looked baffled! What a lark!
Voor het geval het niet toch serieus bedoeld wordt en niet alleen als een grap: het ging om de heropening van een Franse kathedraal met een totaal andere cultuur en historie. Ik vind de vergelijking ongelukkig gekozen, hoe goed de opname ook. Persoonlijk vond ik de improvisaties van Olivier Latry overtuigend en passend bij de Franse plechtigheid. Er werden ook oud-Franse werken ten gehore gebracht. Daarover hoor ik niemand. Ik vond de plechtigheid heel imposant. De Fransen houden van "grandeur".
Lol I don’t want to criticise Olivier Latry as the guy is one of my heroes but he and Vincent Dubois made a misjudgment here. I know they are fiercely talented intellectual musicians but they could have done an improv on the French national anthem or something. I have not met anyone, organist or otherwise, who has a good word to say about this.
Il n'aurait pas gagné le concours "comment éviter les accords majeurs et mineurs" avec Latry et les bobos de Paris n'auraient pas eu leur petit moment de frissons tant aimé des dissonances de l'école française encensée
Eh bien qu'attendez vous pour nous faire adminer vos prouesses sonores ?. Les styles sont différents, plaisent ou non. Mais peut être après tout que vous avez les compétences techniques en matières d'improvisation pour juger...je nai pas dit évaluer car la j'en doute maître..ceder a l'émotion est tres différent de la raison mais les deux doivent aussi se rencontrer en musique. Sietze de vries le fait a sa manière avec art et élégance . Si vous etes musicien et organiste,et professionnel de surcroît je vous plains de ne pas avoir compris ça pendant vos annees de conservatoire...
@@ewennlesergent3625 Comment vous faire comprendre? Tout le monde peut être d'accord que Bocuse savait parfaitement cuisiner une salade de trippes dans la tradition de la haute cuisine française et à la hauteur de son art, pour autant ça ne serait pas une bonne idée de la servir à un banquet d'état international, mais plutôt un petit filet mignon cuisiné avec autant d'amour. Par contre si on me disait (ce qui serait une idiotie grossière) que Bocus pouvait uniquement cuisiner des salades de trippes et rien d'autres pour tenir haut le flambeau de la gastromie française, ça poserait un problème.... Mais peut-être c'est uniquement les chefs étoilés qui ont droit de se prononcer sur ce sujet, que sais-je, moi, petit ignorant impertinent osant donner mon opinion sur les trippes?
Elle a l'air bien la vieille sous sa masse de cheveux. Franchement une personne constituée normalement ne possède pas d'autant de cheveux. C'est remarquable ce qu'ont les organistes. ça c'est de la musique !
that hocus pocus is called mysticism and meditation .... it is something heavenly and intimate for a soul. It is french liturgical music. Quite different from protestant counties - they have to play all in sermon mode, nothing intimate, all has to be popular.
For everyone who responded seriously to this video: thank you. But this video is nothing more and nothing less than a little organ joke of mine. A few days ago I heard someone say in a lively discussion on FB: "what if Sietze de Vries had played this reopening?". And that got me thinking; what would that have looked like? And so, just for fun, I started editing and tried to make it look as real as possible. It was a lot of fun (and a lot of work) to do that.
But of course: nothing fits better in this historic place, Notre Dame of Paris, with its rich musical Catholic-liturgical tradition, than the musical tradition that has been going on there for centuries. And that is the tradition of improvising as the French do: on Gregorian themes, in a romantic and modern style, building on the legacy of the great French composers and players such as Cochereau, etc. Let's not forget that we also heard a classic improvised Tierce en Taille by Vincent Dubois and later a Plein Jeu by Fajoles during the reopening.
So even though I am a big fan of the improvisations of Sietze de Vries (baroque improvisation doesn't get any better); for a place like Notre Dame to reopen, you don't need a foreign organist from a different musical tradition to play. I'm a catholic church musician myself and have been to Notre Dame several times; i always enjoyed the organ and the playing there.
So take this video with a big wink :) and I hope it brought you all a big smile!
As a 63 year old musical grandson of Dupre, I can tell you that all of this arguing is actually the “true tradition of Notre Dame“ 🤣🤣🤣
Tu veux dire qu’ils veulent faire la messe à la place des autres
LMFAO!
Better have good friends in high places than real music talent.
That s all the reality of "tradition of the last 20 years"... Never heard such noise before
Out of the lot that I've heard that night- out of place or NOT for Notre-dame- this is certainly one of the more desirable pieces instead of crashing dissonant chords here and there (even though Latry IS an incredible 'improvisationalist', per se. This sounds like an improvisation on a Bach fugue- for variety of musical genre- this was an interesting and most enjoyed addition to the mix!
Either style, or, in fact, ALL STYLES, are welcome! What a superb day, and what a superb organ! (Perhaps a “Play-off?”
Sietze de Vries should be the organ teacher of Latry and Dubois !!!
Merci pour cet astucieux montage. C'est exactement ce que nous aurions aimé entendre ce soir là. Nous aurions mieux fait d'inviter les organistes Hollandais, que personnellement j'admire beaucoup.
L' organiste Sietze de Vries est un génie de l'improvisation.
Elon: "Could AI do this?" Touché, mon ami! 😂😂😂
I didn't know CC was into flexible wind!
Maybe if it was reopening of Bovenkerk Kampen or Bavokerk in Haarlem organ or something similar, then yes. Otherwise, no. It’s out of place in the Notre Dame tradition.
Finally someone who get's it. Though it wasn't the most 'ear-friendly', it was perfect within Notre Dame tradition...
@@ardjankoster The type of audience should have determined the music - tradition surely would include some ear-friendly music.
@@cabbagepatch8947 That's fine by me. But Sietze would be so out of place, just because his style just doenst fit in. Something in even cochereau-style would fit i think.
@ I agree. For example, would have preferred to hear 8 versets of improvisations on some Gregorian chant tunes and all 4 organists have done it a thousand times on other occasions but I respect their improvisation tradition which stems from Pierre Cochereau and I understand why it was done exactly this way.
I agree
Dit was geweldig geweest in een Noord-Duitse kerk, maar doe mij in de Notre Dame maar de heerlijk impressionistische improvisaties van Olivier Latry, gestoeld op een eeuwenlange traditie.
Latry’ll never stop. Let him start a new genre of music called “heavy metal thunderstorm”
Merci Marcel. Personnellement je n'apprécie pas ce parisianisme élitiste. Le matin de ce réveil de l'orgue je suis passé à La Madeleine où j'ai entendu Sander Van den Houten qui préparait ses registrations sur le magnifique Cavaillé-Coll de tribune pour un concert de musique romantique qu'il donnait le lendemain après midi. Bravo Sander. J'étais devant la télévision pour ce réveil de l'orgue de Notre Dame. J'ai arrêté après la seconde improvisation d'Olivier Latry réputée devant illustrer les incantations de l'évêque. Qu'est-ce que cette conception d'un culte spectacle, vantant les tenues du clergé conçues par un grand couturier, proposant une musique inaudible pour l'assemblée ? Autant le cérémonial que la musique illustraient à qui en doutait le fossé qui isole structurellement le clergé catholique romain et ses serviteurs du commun des mortels. L'organiste que je suis, immensément loin de la technicité des organistes titulaires de ND - mais ici on ne parle pas de technique -, a la même sensibilité que vous au regard de ce réveil. Par contre félicitations à tous ceux qui ont restauré ND de cette façon.
Savez-vous comment les contemporains de Bach percevaient sa musique ?
cette séparation du clergé fut l'un des moteurs de la réforme protestante
@@TheRobe477 La différence étant que la musique de Bach, indépendemment de la perception des deux trois insatisfaits dont l'opinion nous est parvenue (le reste de ses contemporains sont plutôt unanimes), on peut lui trouver objectivement un sens et une substance. Essayez de m'expliquer quel était le sens de l'ACV en direct de Latry. Orgue, instrument sacré pour la louange de Dieu : on tape sur l'orgue comme un enragé. Orgue, prière à Marie : on tape sur l'orgue comme un enragé. Latry est un grand technicien, mais on est pas mal unanimes que sa musique est vide de sens, voire d'intérêt parce qu'elle ne dit rien et ne fait rien ressentir sinon du déplaisir et de la douleur. Vide. C'est tout. Du vide et du chaos très bruyant. Mais bon, les nihiliste se trouvent intelligents.
Vous parlez de Latry, mais quid alors de Dubois, Fajoles et Escaich ? Vous avez parfaitement raison : "Les nihilistes se trouvent intelligents."
@@TheRobe477 Bonjour, "les" contemporains, je ne sais pas, mais le conseil d'Arnstadt, oui. Je ne doute pas un seul instant des qualités musicales d'Olivier Latry. La question qui se pose est sur la musique qu'il convenait de jouer lorsque la nation entière, et au delà des frontières, était invitée, au delà des confessions, à partager la joie de la restauration réussie de ND de Paris. Je suis certain que Latry sait improviser non seulement dans le style baroque nord-allemand correspondant au choix musical réalisé par Marcel Mangnus pour illustrer son post d'humour (et d'humeur), mais aussi dans le style romantique français qui a longtemps dominé à la tribune de ND comme au CNSMP. Il a été réalisé un choix réservé, en pratique, à un cercle d'esthètes (ou d'auditeurs qui se plaisent à croire qu'ils le sont). Je considère que c'est un mauvais choix au regard de ce qui était l'enjeu.
This video has the hashtag 'organ humor' and it is indeed a very clever joke. But of course no one is suggesting that Sietze de Vries *should* have played at Notre Dame's re-opening.
While Latry's opening improvisation was indeed in the current style of French organ improvisation, the reconstruction of Notre Dame was NOT an exercise in replacing history with something contemporary. Oak forests across France contributed trunks to replace the medieval beams. I believe that Marcon originally suggested that there be an architectural competition to find a design for a replacement of Viollet-le-Duc's spire, destroyed in the fire. But in the end the decision was made to recreate the 19th-century spire. The re-opening of the cathedral was not a celebration of the new, but of re-creating and preserving the old.
Although the organists did, later in the ceremony, evoke older traditions of French organ playing, the first response to the archbishop's beautiful prayer celebrating the organ was an angry, discordant mess of notes which many people, not only in the cathedral but around the world, found ugly. And I think that was a great shame. Great improvisers should be able to understand the occasion, the context, and the audience better. This was an opportunity to show the world not only what a powerful and frightening instrument the organ is, but how moving and inspiring it can be. Inevitably it was only this first improvisation which the largest number of people heard, as it was picked up by the international media. Such a shame.
Perhaps Latry wanted to express something else: the pain of the fire and the destruction of the church. The organ saw this and lamented. In the next improvisations, the jubilation and joy gradually reappeared.
Correct
It’s not a question of can it be done but should it be done?
Who selected the repertoire and the performers for this event? Perhaps that is the real background required for all the discussion.
Despite the massive efforts that went into considering and confirming the selection of traditional and professional competences of all those artisans who worked to restore Notre Dame, the selection of music did not pay the slightest attention to the repertoire that was born in the Notre Dame school - meaning the first polyphony - music actually written for the acoustics of a Gothic cathedral.
Over five centuries of music by distinguished composers was neglected. France is a country in which all these repertoires are regularly performed by distinguished French ensembles that are funded by the French government - no problem for effective programming and performers.
The selection of repertoire was a mistake: the English would have never represented a grand event like the recent coronation with the sloppy selection of repertoire and artists of the performances that we witnessed at Notre Dame.
The current organ is part of the 19th and 20th century additions to Notre Dame, as is the tradition of 19th and 20th century French organ improvisation. But what about the earlier repertoire?
Given some of the more "illustrious" members of the audience, I'd say they got the hot steaming plate of slop they deserved. I missed the live stream event entirely, - I knew it would be a train wreck. I've seen as much to confirm what I predicted.
I agree with you, as first piece I would have expected at least a clear reférence to the gothic style which goes back to the origin, for example an estampie ou perharps a veni creator spiritus harmonized / improvised in quart and fives or organum-style.
@@hl007a I listened with a student to Leonin (a revelation) and Perotin while this service was still going on. And then, Sumer is icumen in'. To make just your point.
These are the current organists if Notre-Dame playing in the current style (while still utilizing Gregorian Chant themes). The other composers are dead and are not relevant for a contemporary occasion. Figure it out brilliant
"Alleluia Nativitas" would have been a nice selection instead of that gawdawful and overused Handel chorus. Text of the Pérotin work:
_Alleluia Nativitas
gloriose virginis Marie
ex semine Abrahe
orta de tribu Juda
clara ex stripe David._
But this is "german" improvisation 😂
Het daadwerkelijke resultaat was op zijn minst abstract te noemen… (wat natuurlijk niets afdoet aan het talent van de voorkomende musici) Als je het mij vraagt had ik toch liever Sietze of Evan Bogerd gehad
Niet in de Notre-Dame daar zijn zowel De Vries als Bogerd niet op hun plek. De Notre-Dame is een plek waar altijd al vernieuwing is geweest, die traditie moet je niet verloochenen.
and this is the good part!
Well cut... ;D ^^
Now I really wonder how Mr. de Vries would play a service at Notre Dame... ^^
am i the only one who thinks it would have been awesome if they started with the wind system off so it sounded like the organ was coming to life
It probably would work, if the new organ had a mechanical action, but like most of the new built organs of this size everything is electric these days...
Bach, Vierne and Messiaen's Apparition de L'eglise Eternelle should've been on the menu.
Thank you ❤❤❤ for the amazing Bach.
Can anyone please write bwv nr.
This is not a composition, but an improvisation from Sietze de Vries. See the full improvisation here: ruclips.net/video/GqpdTuVFpBQ/видео.html
It's an improvisation on Jesus meine Zuversicht (sixth part of an improvised partita on the Martinikerk main organ at Groningen, north of Nederland)
@@MarcelMangnus Thank you very much. I'm so thrilled to listen his improvisations, especially fugue. How is it possible? His head is like a computer :)))) Absolutely stunning. I m looking forward to hear and learn more from this extraordinary musician!!!
Regards from Denmark :)
Belle pièce de style baroque en tout cas et très bien interprétée. C'est de qui? Bach, je pense pas. Prélude et fugue improvisé?
This is part of the longer improvisation on 'Jesus, meine Zuversicht'. At the end (versus 6) you hear this prelude and fugue. See ruclips.net/video/GqpdTuVFpBQ/видео.html
@@MarcelMangnus Thanks a lot!
Oh geniaal dit! 😂
Now THAT'S more like it. Only the camera scans of the audience would have reflected more joy than polite acceptance. Mr cr Vries and Balint Karosi are two of the best improvisers in both the ancient and up-to-date traditions. Latry could have done something like it but who knows who was manipulating who?
Sietze de Vries's music would have been far more suitable for this moment than Olivier Latry's harshly strident improvisations, which some people in the audience strongly disliked. Some French organists seem to be hell-bent on discouraging the use of the organ in the church and driving its use into oblivion. Improvisation, a staple skill of French organists, seems to have devolved more and more into merely making as much NOISE as possible, with little thought given to expressing the beauty of the organ.
Olivier Latry IS a fine organist, but as Notre Dame's titulaire, he has become known as a player who oftentimes bangs out the worst kind of cacophonous improvisations imaginable from Notre Dame's splendid organ. (Two of the musical selections played later during the organ's reopening ceremony were, however, far more eloquent and moving representations of the dignified grandeur of 17th- and 18th-century French classical organ music at its finest and were quite appropriate for this occasion.}
What Latry played is perfectly consistent with the long-standing style of French organ music. Think Messiaen and Langlais. I went to a school where chapel attendance was compulsory, and the only piece for which half the school stayed to listen was when James Lancelot played Messiaen's Dieu parmi nous - otherwise the chapel emptied immediately.
@@peterwilton9047 And the 8 (I believe) invocations pefectly fit the concept. The organ awakens from fire disaster torments and subsequent sleep during restorations of the Notre Dame and itself thru 8 "sets". Every next set is becoming more and more in line of what we know by organ. No wonder the first invocaiton by Latry is as it is - this is organs clearing of the throat and still being angry of not finding its former - glorious voice. The last invocation ends on a very merry major chord, if I remember correctly it is even a picardy third.
So all good in the sense of how to do that in France and the fact that some people did not find it pleasing is totally beyond the point.
Cavaille-Coll IXXeme siècle..
In my opinion, octotonic pieces like these are not cacaphonic. Go have a listen to Holst’s planets… or Messiaens Apparation. It’s already 100 years active.
Never heard of him 😊
👉Better have good friends in high places than real music talent. 🤘🤘🤘
That s all the reality of "tradition of the last 20 years"... Never heard such noise before
Yes, it is a fugue. 🙂
Thanks for doing justice to sacred music !❤
Hear hear!
Dit was ook prima geweest: ruclips.net/video/Ub9NZajv4zc/видео.htmlfeature=shared
I loved his playing . What did his critics expect, Amazing Grace? This is French organ music.
They probably expected music from a talented composer like Messiaen or Langlais. Instead they got some skilled keyboard and pedal work from a hack composer.
Hating French organ music really brought America together.
@@AlexRCarlson Nothing will ever bring America together. To your other point, I really enjoy French organ music and I played a lot of it when I studied organ long ago, and that is why I really dislike what I heard from Latry.
@@michaeltres Messiaen would not have "accessibble" music for the general listener.
Wht not Amazing Grace or some other well-known hymn or other well-known tune, with clever variations that were not jusy "noise" to the average person?
It is the great french tradition, or a run away vacuum cleaner.... if you like a joke now and then.
...diese Improvisation hätte der Wiedereinweihung der Orgel von Notre Dame besser zu Gesicht gestanden👍👍😀😀
absolute Zustimmung......wäre dem Anlass würdiger gewesen als immer diese Selbstdarstellung des Organisten mit diesem lauten modernen Orgelgetöse......
still better than opening night exit piece
Grande...questo ci voleva non le astratte improvvisazioni.....dovevano far sentire la maestosità dell'organo.
L'improvisation n'était abstraite mais bien construites sur les thèmes...même si je n'ai pas apprécié nos organistes sont de renommée internationale....mais sietze de Vries est de la même tempe dans style différent que je préfère....
Feike Asma was our neighbour in Maassluis he would be turning in his grave so would Klaas Jan Mulder and Sander van Marion and ofcourse Bach
idd... heb maar een stukje geluisterd... was niet om aan te horen... wat een bak herrie
Who cares.
Ist das der neue 24 jährige Organist ? 😀
👍👊
Was zeker een plechtige opening geworden, ik gun Sietze de Vries titularistitel van Notre Dam
Met alle respect voor Sietze de Vries maar die is daar niet op zijn plek hoor. Het orgel van de Notre-Dame is een modern-symfonisch orgel met een stevige Cavaille-Coll inslag. Dat past niet bij De Vries. In de Notre-Dame horen organisten uit de Franse improvisatie traditie (Dupré, Cochereau), zoals dus Latry maar ook de recent benoemde Escaich.
SUPER MERCI
LOL! Sounds much much better to me, than the real reopening organ music. But that's maybe, because I like music much more than random noise 😀. Yes, I don't understand French noise (music) tradition 😀.
I think it was in the tradition of the Gaulish bard Cacofonix.
Merci d'avoir nettoyé nos oreilles.
Excellent !!! 😀😀😀 j'ai adoré cette fugue
Excellent! I love this Fugue!--trans from French.
Sitze de Vries is a real genius.👏👏👏
Cette interprétation était magnifique.
Un peu "carnivalesque" comme d'ailleurs a été une bonne partie de la céremonie.
Il y a, bien sur, des œuvres plus appropriés à une occasion tellement dense.
Respectueusement, Mmes & Mrs.
This interpretation is magnificent!--trans from French.
it’s an improvisation, not an interpretation
At 5:34 someone is telling him is time to applaud 😅
Who is playing the organ? Olivier Latry?
Sietze de Vries. Il est organiste à Groningen (NL). Il est célèbre pour ses improvisations dans des styles divers (et il enseigne l'art de l'improvisation à l'orgue). Dans le cas présent il s'agit d'une improvisation (prélude & fugue) dans le style baroque nord-allemand sur le choral luthérien Jesus, meine Zuversicht, improvisation exécutée sur l'orgue Schnitger de la Martinikerk de Groningen. Sietze de Vries, lui, est réformé.
Excellent ! Oui, on entend là un organiste qui a le sens de ma "majesté sonore" qui sied à un espace sacré tel que Notre-Dame de Paris.
Hahahah geweldig
😊it sounds baroque; Bach, Weckmann, Scheidermann? The fugue is very chromatic, but too pedestrian for Bach. I’d go for an impro by the organist. The audience looked baffled! What a lark!
I never understand why it has to so bombastic, and why play this now and not at the end when people are leaving?
Voor het geval het niet toch serieus bedoeld wordt en niet alleen als een grap: het ging om de heropening van een Franse kathedraal met een totaal andere cultuur en historie. Ik vind de vergelijking ongelukkig gekozen, hoe goed de opname ook. Persoonlijk vond ik de improvisaties van Olivier Latry overtuigend en passend bij de Franse plechtigheid. Er werden ook oud-Franse werken ten gehore gebracht. Daarover hoor ik niemand. Ik vond de plechtigheid heel imposant. De Fransen houden van "grandeur".
Dag Ton, zie mijn vastgezette reactie bovenaan
Lol I don’t want to criticise Olivier Latry as the guy is one of my heroes but he and Vincent Dubois made a misjudgment here. I know they are fiercely talented intellectual musicians but they could have done an improv on the French national anthem or something. I have not met anyone, organist or otherwise, who has a good word to say about this.
Hilarious! Thank you.
ah de welbekende jesu ist mein suverzicht 😄
Man hat vergessen, die Empore zu renovieren...da sind noch Risse in der Wand. ist das der neue 24 jährige Organist ?
"What if Sietze de Vries HAD played the reopening of the Notre Dame organ?"
😂
Thank you, i adjusted it!
👏🏻
I vote for Max Reger. He was Catholic....! (And he wrote a big piece on A Mighty fortress is our God...)
Indescribable!
Il n'aurait pas gagné le concours "comment éviter les accords majeurs et mineurs" avec Latry et les bobos de Paris n'auraient pas eu leur petit moment de frissons tant aimé des dissonances de l'école française encensée
Eh bien qu'attendez vous pour nous faire adminer vos prouesses sonores ?.
Les styles sont différents, plaisent ou non. Mais peut être après tout que vous avez les compétences techniques en matières d'improvisation pour juger...je nai pas dit évaluer car la j'en doute maître..ceder a l'émotion est tres différent de la raison mais les deux doivent aussi se rencontrer en musique. Sietze de vries le fait a sa manière avec art et élégance . Si vous etes musicien et organiste,et professionnel de surcroît je vous plains de ne pas avoir compris ça pendant vos annees de conservatoire...
@@ewennlesergent3625 Comment vous faire comprendre? Tout le monde peut être d'accord que Bocuse savait parfaitement cuisiner une salade de trippes dans la tradition de la haute cuisine française et à la hauteur de son art, pour autant ça ne serait pas une bonne idée de la servir à un banquet d'état international, mais plutôt un petit filet mignon cuisiné avec autant d'amour. Par contre si on me disait (ce qui serait une idiotie grossière) que Bocus pouvait uniquement cuisiner des salades de trippes et rien d'autres pour tenir haut le flambeau de la gastromie française, ça poserait un problème.... Mais peut-être c'est uniquement les chefs étoilés qui ont droit de se prononcer sur ce sujet, que sais-je, moi, petit ignorant impertinent osant donner mon opinion sur les trippes?
I don't think Donald Trump knows what a fugue is...
He looks as though he’s in a fugue state.
@@andrewharrison8975”is this a fugue?” yes; the fugue of a convicted felon
Of course he does he’s seen Biden it a fugue state of an on for at least the last five years.
He know because he had many years of piano lessons !
Phantastikc organ performance that passes totally unperceived by the great majoritiy of the listeners.
Elle a l'air bien la vieille sous sa masse de cheveux. Franchement une personne constituée normalement ne possède pas d'autant de cheveux. C'est remarquable ce qu'ont les organistes. ça c'est de la musique !
It would have been entirely inappropriate. In a FRENCH cathedral...C'mon!!!
we live in 2024 not in 1700
Exactly!!!
@@stevenmichael3426 Yes Hiroshima, Nagasaki, 9/11, Latrys Improvisations and other cathatrophes happened since 1700 !!!
It couldn't be clearer, the difference between Roman Catholic and Protestant. Protestants don't like hocus pocus, Latry all the more.
that hocus pocus is called mysticism and meditation .... it is something heavenly and intimate for a soul. It is french liturgical music. Quite different from protestant counties - they have to play all in sermon mode, nothing intimate, all has to be popular.
Truly terrible version of organ music. They should have played the Marseillaise
They could have played literally anything from the colossal canon of French classical Organ music, yet they chose to shit in everyone's ears instead.
The choice of music, though remarkable to the learned, was a bloody travesty to the average person. Very poor choice.
Pas du tout l’improvisation est superbe
Hideuse plutôt.
Nooo, this is NOT more suitable than Latry's Impro.
This is much better than Latrys trash !!!
Just terrible