HVAC 123 Recovery Tanks part 1
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- Опубликовано: 16 май 2024
- part 1 Recovery tank introduction, define recovery and reclaim. Refrigerant recovery tanks, liquid and vapor valves. checking refrigerant tank contents and purity. tank protection and transpiration, DOT ratings, and a few more.
Ty, you are an excellent teacher. I got my hvac degree back in 2010, but I continually learn from your videos as you explain everything in such detail. Every teacher, whether in a trade school or university, should strive to meet your level of teaching excellence. Thank you so much.
Thank you Bill!
alot of university's or tech schools don't teach what really needs to be taught. they want ppl to go the distance and come back to that school to pay them more to learn more ... but I've learned more on my own then from when I took this hvac course at a boces adult education center years ago. the key is to keep reading about hvac related stuff and watch videos and go to seminars etc and learn on your own
Thought you were just pointing at the wrong knob, then understood manufacturers will mess with us by switching liquid knob to blue color. Thanks for that bit of info, good to know.
I could not agree more with other comments. You are incredible teacher with a gift to explain the whole process in details using practical real world examples. Thanks, I appreciate all work you did to share your valuable professional knowledge with others!
Absolutely love the cut out. I learn more from visual than just words.👍
Thank you share us you knowledge I learn a lot
Awesome video
What an awesome lesson! Thanks Ty 🙏
TY,
I love your style and you NEVER disappoint. I've been dealing with refrigerants since 1972, and I still learn something new. Thanke so much. Keep making great videos and I'll keep tuning in.
MUCH RESPECT!!!
JESS
Thank you Jess! I really appreciate that!
Great video, really cleared up lots of things I assumed incorrectly about recovery tanks and being able to view the inside was a huge help!
What an awesome video! You just taught me a ton of things that I was never quite sure about. It really tied all of it together. Thank you!!!
Best hvac RUclips channel.
Awesome command over the subject
Thank you so much for the detailed explaination from the true functionality perspective.
very good informative staff thank you a lot man
Thank you Ty!
Tnx a million sir!
Thanks for you information very helpful for us the new hvac
Very clear examples
Wow very interesting
Thank u, very helpful and informative, a sure 👍
Glad it was helpful!
Nice, you finally have commercials, I will watch them for what you are doing for us. Thank you Ty, much needed and appreciated in our industry.
Any commercials are all form RUclips direct.
My channel is not monotized.
At some point may have to change but I will keep it non monotized for as long as I can.
Thanks for the elaborate explanation. I'm sure this answers all my questions and clearifies all the doubts and confusions. God bless you sir.
🍺😎👍🏻
Thanks again for the videos!
Some of these subjects are not fun but I have to push threw. This one is always much better in a class with interactions. Well all classes are much more fun with interactions.
I really appreciate your support! Thank you!
@@love2hvac I really appreciate your informative content!🍺👍🏻
Your videos are to point and not extra commentary or slightly related info like the other guy.
Great content
Why does the blue knob on the recovery tank say vapor and red knob say liquid. Everything you say is true but reverse?
Edit: continued watching your video. Nevermind! :-)
Thx for taking the time. As an AC rank novice…No valve handle colour standard seems like madness. Very strange indeed.
Agreed!
I bought a recovery cylinder from Johnstone Supply and was laughed to scorn when I asked about the out of date test date stamped on the cylinder collar. He said, "We've never had anyone ask about that."
Scary! I had to ask them to get me a different cylinder (the one I got has only a three-years-old test date)
9:00 that happend in germany last year. the guy passed out and crashed. he did survive because he was not wearing a seatbelt and was trown from the van wich saved his life ironically enough. he was fired tho wich is an impressive feat in europe.
That is quite interesting. I would like to have a beer with this person and hear this story go down.
I can already hear there begining, it was a long summer a late and I always strap the tanking, this time...
@@love2hvac i talked to one of the guys of that company on a job site. it was basically that yes. as it is always....
most dumb thing is that the van (as is mandatory in the EU) had tank holders.
Ty you for your video curious, are all liquid on the right (regardless of color) and corresponding left is vapor (regardless of color) would that be a industry standard?
👍🏼
pressure variates w ambient temperature, will that chart be accurate to test tank temp vs tank pressure?
Yes it will follow the chart as long as there is some liquid in the tank and it's the pure refrigerant. If there is only vapor or it's contaminated it will not follow the chart.
Question sir.
Context here is a mini-split running R410A.
Can recovered refrigerant from a unit that was low on charge due to a minor line-set leak, for instance, be reused?
System never open to the atmosphere, just low on charge and no other failure or repair other than leak correction after drawdown isolation to the condenser side.
Charge weight being critical on these machines, I would assume recovering, weighing, and reintroducing the used refrigerant plus make-up refrigerant from a new cylinder into a properly evacuated system would ensure the proper charge.
I'd appreciate your thoughts and input on this.
You can reuse it there is alwasy the risk of did it run into a vacuum at any point and pull in moisture? it also takes linger but here is the steps.
Pull a deep vacuum on you recovery tank and do a decay test to ensure it clean and dry,
Hook up your hoses and recovery machine and a new in line filter drier for your recovery machine.
Pull a deep vacuum on that setup. (hoses recovery machine ext.)
Open the valve to the unit, start recovery machine, open the valve to the tank and recover.
When the repair is done, put a new inline filter direr on the recovery tank and a hose to that.
pull a vacuum trough the systems AND to the hose to the recovery tank at the same time.
Preform your decay test.
Then weigh in the refrigerant back into the unit. it will e short so you will still need a new tank to top it off.
@@love2hvac, thank you so much for your reply.
I understand exactly what you're saying and the procedure you're recommending.
I know, a lot of connections and reconnections here, everything has to be evacuated properly with every connection.
This is my own system, so I know the history of it. It's low but has not gone dead or low enough to draw in atmosphere.
If I have any doubts, I will have a friend of mine take my refrigerant for recycling in his equipment and I will start with a new charge.
Thank you again for your reply, I truly appreciate it.
Love your channel and I have subscribed!
Hi there. Watching your videos now. My friends grandpa passed away leaving me a yellow jacket tank and an old marathon pump. Both work well but I don’t know what to do with them. See they worth any money or should I dispose of them?
Send me some pictures and I can give you more information.
Ty @ love2hvac.com remove spaces
I think my 125 pound cylinder tank from 1952 has far surpassed their reinspection date.
I can tell you from experience in an emergency when you put R410 in a 350 psi tank and you overfill it on a hot summer day when it blows off inside your vehicle with the oil that is mixed in the tank it instantly becomes all foggy inside your vehicle.
Oh no!!! That sounds like a hot mess!
I never thought about the 125 pound tanks. Do they have the same recertification dates?
I worked for a guy years ago who bought a new 250 gallon propane tank. Pulled a vacuum on it for a week and used it for his recovered R22 tank. He purchased a recycler and was planing on one day reselling it. That was 15 years ago I need to follow up on it now.
@@love2hvac I’m pretty sure they need to be recertified but I never have I also have two 240 pound reclaim tanks filled with refrigerant that I bought back in the early 90s that have never been recertified.
But I only use them for clean dry refrigerant that I recycled only I touch the tanks and I certify that my refrigerant is dry down to the parts per million so the tanks have been clean and dry since the 90s.
I never have air or moisture in my recycled refrigerant that I recycle myself
Hey Ty, do the companies that reclaim refrigerant have a procedure for mixed refrigerant? Meaning a way to separate them chemically?
2.5.1 Mixed-gas separation
Several processes can be used to separate mixed-gas; the most common is fractional distillation
(Powell, 2009). However, few reclaimers have the resources to perform these complex processes,
which can require as much as 50 times more energy per pound to process refrigerant than
standard reclamation processes (Mandracchia, 2009). According to one reclaimer, there are only
three or four facilities with separation capability at present (Steve Mandracchia, Hudson
Technologies, personal communication, June 9, 2010). Most reclaimers will send mixed gas that
is not easily blended up to 99.5% purity to these separation facilities.
One reclaimer explained that the cost of separation for a 75% purity R-22 is about $3 per pound
(not including the shipping cost), which would be taken out of the price the separation facility
paid for the refrigerant. At present, separation facilities will purchase R-22 even if the purity of
the refrigerant is as low as 75% because of the current price of R-22 (Jimmy Trout, AllCool,
personal communication, June 24, 2010)
I found thir report at is possible depending on how bad the mixture is and what else it is mixed with.
It seems like only a few have the capability and it's very costly. It seems that many have to destroy the refregerants Wich is very costly.
www.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2015-08/documents/analysis_of_equipment_and_practices_in_the_reclamation_industry.pdf
@@love2hvac , thanks so much for the reply. Hopefully this opens up the creative mind in people to create a more cost effective system. Always a way. You’re the man Ty. Much appreciated.
When i recovered refrigerant out of my car A/C system, which is contaminated with 7% air, How could I remove air out of tank? i guess i could just open the vapor valve and release the pressure as the refrigerant is heavier than air will the air leave the cylinder first? Or the second possibility, if I turn the cylinder upside-down, or use the liquid port, then the air will stay on top of the cylinder, and when I refill the AC system with liquid refrigerant, I am 100% sure that it is free of air contamination?
Once it's contaminated, it should not be reused.
There is also moisture and other contaminants in the air assuming you could get the air itself out.
After pulling a deep vacuum, use new refrigerant.
Sadly now a days with all the Ozone friendly R22 retro its not pure R22 anymore then when you turn in/exchange tank. Suppliers back charge you for a mix of Freon.... Sooooo Tech/company has to eat that charge?
R22 was undoubtedly the best.
Every single person in the trade was required to have an EPA 608 certification wich made it clear to not bent and "do not mix refrigerants"
The R22 replacements where retro fits not drop in.
All these "techs" that where mixing Refrigerant are the ones screwing over customers and the good techs.
When the refrigerant are mixed they can't be recycled or reclaimed and have to be disposed of which is very expensive. It also means the applications that still need R22 are so hard to find and over priced because the lack of stock not being turned in back in.
So yes techs, customers and companies have to eat the charge all because some lazy person who can't follow the basic most instructions decided it would be okay to just mix a substitute ruining both and cost someone else a lot of money down the line.
@@love2hvac They tried to pull the Hubble telescope found the hole in ozone, Ozone,.
but funny when you do further research the real magnetic field of the Earth is in the exact same spot in Brazil.
I leave because they lost a patent right to make R22 and control all the money they came up with Huron now we find puran or R for 10A is actually worse and more detrimental than R22.
That's why they're going to R32 and R454A, R600
Which is much more flammable.
Please explain for red and green valves what's different between ?
Color does not matter, read on the valve for liquid or vapor.
Liquid has a straw to the bottom of the tank. Vapor opens to the top of the top of the tank
I am trying to evacuate a new refrigerant tank. I can only get it down to 3000 microns or so.
Is that acceptable for filling with R22. Is my vacuum pump not up to the task? I see where it should be down to 500 microns before using.
Sounds like there is a lot of contamination (moisture) in the tank
Can we reuse the recovered refrigerant is it’s same manufacture
ruclips.net/video/_JK8Ly4noMw/видео.html
Does the supply house pay anything for recovered refrigerant?
Many of them do
@@love2hvac thanks. I'm just learning.
After all these years, I'm still learning too! It keeps you young, never stop.
Re. fresh tanks of r410a, when charging upside down how do you know when the liquid is finished and only gas is coming out?
Two ways
Method 1 weight the tank before. Subtract the net weight (usually 25poinds) from the total now you know how much the empty tank weighs.
Method 2 zero the scale at each use. Record how much was used each time. When you reach the net amount (usually 25 pounds for 410A) you know the liquid is gone.
After all the liquid is gone, recover the remaining vapor.
@@love2hvac thank you. But what if, as you come close to finishing that 25 pounds, some of that liquid flashes into vapour because of less pressure in the tank? Or is the pressure in the tank always high enough to keep the liquid as liquid?
410A is a near azeotrope.
It is so close, it is highly unlikely to ever fractionate.
If you have a high glide such as 407C it's more of a concern, but if you were to take all the refrigerant out it would be the same % mixture as it was out into the tank.
@@love2hvac ah i understand🤘thank you for your help
I have an empty tank that had 410a if I pull a vacuum on the tank can i use it for r22 or will it be contaminated?
Pull a deep vacuum and you can use it for R22.
The I known will be the oil or oil contaminants inside the tank.
@@love2hvac thanks man!
can i use one of these tanks for 134a.
Yes
1:48 - you probably meant "liquid out of the gas side"
and why is liquid knob painted blue LoL
The manufacturer chooses the color. This is why we must look for the words vapor and liquid. No standard for recovery tanks.
Hello, thank you for this video. I have a question - my R22 recovery bottle has the red and the blue valves but my R22 manifold has the yellow input house. Do you know by any chance where I connect the yellow house, to the red or the blue valves? I want o to recharge my system from the recovery bottle.
The colors of the knobs on the the tank are not relevant.
Read the words. One should say liquid one should say vapor.
You would connect the yellow hose to the one that said liquid.
Purge the hoses before charging.
@@love2hvac Thank you for your prompt reply! I was just recharging my AC from the R22 recovery bottle. I measured the pressure inside the bottle and at the beginning it was 148 psi at outside temperature 84 Fahrenheit. I purged all my hoses red, blue and yellow. I have connected the yellow hose of my R22 charging manifold to the vapor side and placed the tank upside down on the scale. When red and blue hoses were connected (red to the thin high side and blue to the thick low line) and the air conditioner was off I measured on red line 120 PSI and on blue line 115 PSI. When i started the AC, the red line was at 195 PSI and the blue was at 195 PSI. I started to add the R22 refrigerant from the bottle via the blue side vale in small portions and after 20 minutes of charging blue line was at 40 PSI and red was at 210 PSI. After 30 minutes of charging blue line at 46 PSI and red line at 215 psi. What is bothering me is that at the beginning the air temperature inside my house leaving the air duct was at 16.2 degree Celsius and after 30 minutes of my AC charging it was 18.6 degree Celsius. Also I was under impression that the red line pressure will go up after charging and the blue line pressure should actually go down, but in my case it went up instead. Any recommendation what I have done wrongly?
Well, there is a lot wrong there.
1st pressures don't matter.
It's all about the metering device, superheat and subcooling.
You will only be able to add while the system is running but only by slowly throttling it into the suction (blue) side. If it's not done right it will flood the compressor and damage it.
If you open the high side (red) while it is running, the unit will push refrigerant out of the unit into the tank.
Doesn't make a sense to go through each refrigerant type. each type should have certain pressure depending on temperature, i.e should just enter temperature and get pressure table to compare results
If you don't know the refrigerant, and only know the temperature and pressure, you will have to compare it to something.
It also will not work with high glide blended refrigerants such as 406C
@@love2hvac you compare with pressure table: type of refrigetrant - pressure.. will be much faster than enter this result for each individual type
With the table you still have to go through several refrigerants. The table jumps in higher increments of temp and pressures.
In this digital world your much more likely to have an app than a printed PT chart.