LOVE THAT AT LEAST ONE GUY ,,,,,,,,,,,,,, IS TELLING THE TRUTH ....... ITS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY I RESPECT THAT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Need to updated this. I just got locked out of my autel ultra maxisys and generally do not update these scan tools but every other year. This is now with tax around $2000.00 now along with having to have another fee or license along with having it connected to internet 24-7 along with having to pay for some makes a fee to go into manufacture to even do simple task. I had a 2020 hyundai this week and could not do the rear brakes it had me locked out of epb service mode. I finally worked around it by using a battery jumper and connectors to retract to service brakes and put back in postion by reversing polarity. I have 4 other scan tool that are now obsolete without paying for subscription and only used these for quick use instead of pulling out a big scan tool along with the box. This is going to cost the consumer and there will have to be increased charges to access vehicles to perform even the simplest recalibration or relearn now.
The funny thing as a shop owner who does key programmer but I think one big point that is being missed is what shop can keep up with the work as things r now... So when u put the capability to fix or program or whatever into the hands of fewer people in the industry where good techs r few n far between already....hmm I bet this will be good .... I been at this my who life but as they keep making it harder and more hurdles to have to jump over well one day nobody gonna wanna touch the things
Your money would be better spent learning the work arounds than obtaining the license. The work around will always be useful, the license price will continue to go up with more restrictions.
I bought a Serial data gateway bypass cable for Chrysler, dodge, Jeep, Ram. Works good but it’s still a hassle. This just seems like money grabbing to me, BS!
Keith at l1 auto has been an advocate for this for a long time. He is on the board for nastf, he may be a smart man, but he just lit Rome on fire and I have completely lost all respect for the man.
As if I needed another reason to get out of this hellscape of a career. IT professional salaries avg. $50k-$150k yr. Mechanic salaries avg. $30k-$60k yr.
@@JBansal in NC average wage $38k-$68k in 2023. I was a little off, but it’s still a joke compared to any other profession. I’m self employed and have over $70k in tools/equipment and it never ends. I should’ve just bought a tractor, moving dirt pays better than this nonsense.
@@johnwilliamson2393 wish I had gotten out while I was younger. Almost 30 yrs in the trades and all I have to show for it is a bunch of tools, bad knees, and a bad back.
This is not coming from OEM's; those policies have already been in place for some time. This is coming directly from the aftermarket tool sources and NASTF itself. Guess who gets paid with all of this? As they say, follow the money! Keep in mind, this is NOT mandatory for tool/scanner makers, this is a voluntary policy that the tool manufactures are implementing and NASTF is all on board with it.
@@kevinsutton5580plus a business license and several million in business insurance to qualify to work on your personal car(s). Their corporate lawyers have been paying attention to how John Deere, IH, Samsung, Apple, ... skirted the laws and they're all getting in line.
Car theft is a problem but I don't usually see measures passed that benefit oem's also benefitting us, no matter how much they say it's going to be great for all of us.
There use to be horse thieves until the penalty fit the crime. Same goes for car thieves. There's always been car thieves and it will continue. It's a money grab and it's only good for those that already have a license and the equipment and they want to prevent the rest of us from doing it. It's a money grab. Keith from Lt Training has that mentality. If you don't want to fill out the information you shouldn't be doing doing IMMO. Wrong attitude in my book.
All the thefts from using scan tools. Yet there is no remedy for Zipper or anything related to it that can copy a lock/unlock frequency and unlock literally any car.
Scan tool assisted thefts are a red herring. The Zipper and other similar hacker tools are less expensive and easier to get than scan tools. Many of those tools are just as illegal is lockpicks and just as easy to obtain.
I think it's ironic that this all started from Kia/Hyundai. Didn't they get sued because those a-holes sold cars without immobilizers, and their cars kept getting stolen????
I'm 100% with you and my opinions on this subject are not popular. However, on the bright side, they have a cap in place for how much they can charge customers on these "locked" items. No, I'm actually kidding. They will be price gouging customers without a doubt. It is for the better of out industry. Get rid of the "hacks" and stop theft. LOLOLOLOL BS
It is crap anyway. Some mechanics who want to swap ECUs, they might not be able to do that no more with having no NASTF VSP. Imagine we work on diagnosing a certain problem and figure out that a module is faulty. We will need to bring a person with a license to complete the task.
Should have seen this coming, Ford has required a VSP/LSID for years. The first time I installed a PCM and it asked for my VSP credentials for PATS years ago I got my LSID right away. Evan the 2021 Maverick has the security info stored in the ABS, probably will be locked out from just scanning it without a VSP. 2013 Fusion, MKZ 2015 F-150, Edge, Mustang, MKC, Focus, Focus BEV 2016 Explorer, MKX, C-Max 2017 Ford GT, Continental, F-Series Super Duty, Escape
Its simple workshops will not be doing this as the cost is sky rocketing ( in Australia) also When the sites are down or can't program and have to get another key or modul, yet more cost. Workshops will NOT be doing this... Customers will sooner or later workout not to buy said new vehicles. Things will change in years to come.
It's a hurdle for us because of crooks. Yeah, it's money in someone else's pocket. Using the excuse that it's to weed out the car thieves is think is bogus. It's to prevent us from fixing our own and forcing many of us out. Information they are asking for is none of their business and saying we need a locksmith license is more bullshit. Saying one has to have a million dollar insurance policy is just something else that's none of their business! Fkem!
This is all about money nothing else they want to stop the 50 dollar tech from programming keys and fobs that was said yesterday by a you tuber trainer who also is on the board of directors of that company that’s doing this sucks
@@8power0 according to his comment replies he's proud of it too. He don't care about small shops. Then he says cars and insurance will get cheaper. Not holding my breath on that one.
Good luck with that. Guys like me who already had a NASTF account will be happy to take your customers work. Basically one job pays for the year. If you are a $50-$100 key guy you get what you get. I am close to UHS. Hacks there everyday working out of their trunks buying crappy aftermarket fobs. They don't go back and warranty their work. I charge 3x times what they charge. I give a warranty and use OEM fobs and keys. I also don't want their cheap and or broke customers they can have each other. They aren't good for a successful business.
The truth is that this is not only for keys. It's for all modules considered by oem as security, meaning all your car will require a vsp. Start telling customers about the price hike to repair their cars now.
You won’t be able to get into anything having to do with security without a background check, millionaires dollar liability insurance and bond+ $425 for check and 2 years license!
It's just another version of what people in the 2A community are dealing with. There is the ongoing fight for right to repair. And there are those that will bend over backwards and jump through any hoop to block that.
I'm an automotive locksmith and some are over $600. I tell the customers if they don't like my prices tow it to the dealer and wait 3 days plus pay more. I honestly don't care any more. I tell them I didn't make your car, I don't make the keys/fobs and I didn't lose your keys. If you want to be successful in this business you already needed to be a member of NASTF to be able to get codes anyway. New charges just get passed on. It is what it is. We run 80-150 automotive locksmith calls per week. We are very busy. We use the best programmers and mostly OEM fobs so we charge accordingly. Cheap aftermarket fobs gave us trouble when we tried them. I also warranty all our work. We have close to zero callbacks. Had one lady ruin the buttons with her fingernail. As a courtesy we programmed a new fob. Second time she did it I told her this was on her. They decided to just use the key.
Only nastf member manufacrurwrs using their paid access to the pids will be affected. Most reverse engineered tools and the majority of the china tool manufacturers will tell em to pound sand. Autel, drewtech and a few others will comply. Look at the mastf membwrs list for equipmwmt to avoid
LOVE THAT AT LEAST ONE GUY ,,,,,,,,,,,,,, IS TELLING THE TRUTH ....... ITS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY I RESPECT THAT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Need to updated this. I just got locked out of my autel ultra maxisys and generally do not update these scan tools but every other year. This is now with tax around $2000.00 now along with having to have another fee or license along with having it connected to internet 24-7 along with having to pay for some makes a fee to go into manufacture to even do simple task. I had a 2020 hyundai this week and could not do the rear brakes it had me locked out of epb service mode. I finally worked around it by using a battery jumper and connectors to retract to service brakes and put back in postion by reversing polarity. I have 4 other scan tool that are now obsolete without paying for subscription and only used these for quick use instead of pulling out a big scan tool along with the box. This is going to cost the consumer and there will have to be increased charges to access vehicles to perform even the simplest recalibration or relearn now.
Anytime someone says it’s for “safety” or “security”, those are just buzz words to take away your money and control.
WELL I GUESS CLONING A MODULE IS UP NEXT FOR THE CHOPPING BLOCK
Advanced Diagnostics WILL NOT be taking part in this!
This will finish off the code readers scan tools and the do your selfers .
How do you figure? All this new rule is changing is the key programming which most people don't use a code reader or scan tool for.
The funny thing as a shop owner who does key programmer but I think one big point that is being missed is what shop can keep up with the work as things r now... So when u put the capability to fix or program or whatever into the hands of fewer people in the industry where good techs r few n far between already....hmm I bet this will be good .... I been at this my who life but as they keep making it harder and more hurdles to have to jump over well one day nobody gonna wanna touch the things
Chrysler and Ford already have done this with computer info.Have to pay for it
Your money would be better spent learning the work arounds than obtaining the license. The work around will always be useful, the license price will continue to go up with more restrictions.
I bought a Serial data gateway bypass cable for Chrysler, dodge, Jeep, Ram. Works good but it’s still a hassle. This just seems like money grabbing to me, BS!
WELL I GUESS CLONING A MODULE IS UP NEXT FOR THE CHOPPING BLOCK
It's a money grab, not a security fix
100% if it was actually about security dodge would have been in huge trouble years ago
Another thing to thick off us technicians.
Keith at l1 auto has been an advocate for this for a long time. He is on the board for nastf, he may be a smart man, but he just lit Rome on fire and I have completely lost all respect for the man.
As if I needed another reason to get out of this hellscape of a career. IT professional salaries avg. $50k-$150k yr. Mechanic salaries avg. $30k-$60k yr.
Where are they this low as an average? I know I feel we deserve more, but haven't seen wages this low in years.
@@JBansal in NC average wage $38k-$68k in 2023. I was a little off, but it’s still a joke compared to any other profession. I’m self employed and have over $70k in tools/equipment and it never ends. I should’ve just bought a tractor, moving dirt pays better than this nonsense.
Tech 3 on pickup trucks doing EVERYTHING is 21.05, state of louisiana. I just started for the benefits, but I promise I will NOT be there long.
@@johnwilliamson2393 wish I had gotten out while I was younger. Almost 30 yrs in the trades and all I have to show for it is a bunch of tools, bad knees, and a bad back.
Youd do anything for a living as long as it pays more huh?
This is why the right to repair laws are needed
WELL I GUESS CLONING A MODULE IS UP NEXT FOR THE CHOPPING BLOCK
Seems they are breaking that law! Right to repair is a law and why we have aftermarket tools!
This is not coming from OEM's; those policies have already been in place for some time. This is coming directly from the aftermarket tool sources and NASTF itself. Guess who gets paid with all of this? As they say, follow the money! Keep in mind, this is NOT mandatory for tool/scanner makers, this is a voluntary policy that the tool manufactures are implementing and NASTF is all on board with it.
AutoAuth pisses me off. Like yes, I'd love to pay another $50 annually in addition to my $600 update I already have to pay for annually. GTFOH.
Another $420
@@kevinsutton5580plus a business license and several million in business insurance to qualify to work on your personal car(s).
Their corporate lawyers have been paying attention to how John Deere, IH, Samsung, Apple, ... skirted the laws and they're all getting in line.
Car theft is a problem but I don't usually see measures passed that benefit oem's also benefitting us, no matter how much they say it's going to be great for all of us.
There use to be horse thieves until the penalty fit the crime. Same goes for car thieves. There's always been car thieves and it will continue. It's a money grab and it's only good for those that already have a license and the equipment and they want to prevent the rest of us from doing it. It's a money grab. Keith from Lt Training has that mentality. If you don't want to fill out the information you shouldn't be doing doing IMMO. Wrong attitude in my book.
Well said! All it's doing is making it harder for honest people. All the crooks are going to get around it anyways.
All the thefts from using scan tools. Yet there is no remedy for Zipper or anything related to it that can copy a lock/unlock frequency and unlock literally any car.
Scan tool assisted thefts are a red herring.
The Zipper and other similar hacker tools are less expensive and easier to get than scan tools. Many of those tools are just as illegal is lockpicks and just as easy to obtain.
I always hear in the news of Chrysler products in particular being stolen. Why do techs suffer when OEMs "security" doesn't seem to function?
I think it's ironic that this all started from Kia/Hyundai. Didn't they get sued because those a-holes sold cars without immobilizers, and their cars kept getting stolen????
Gm has moved to 120 minutes online security programming.
I'm 100% with you and my opinions on this subject are not popular. However, on the bright side, they have a cap in place for how much they can charge customers on these "locked" items. No, I'm actually kidding. They will be price gouging customers without a doubt. It is for the better of out industry. Get rid of the "hacks" and stop theft. LOLOLOLOL BS
WELL I GUESS CLONING A MODULE IS UP NEXT FOR THE CHOPPING BLOCK
@@8power0I mean, look at the email. It's black and white. "Anything the OE deems" what a crock
@@JoesAutoElectricsad times we live in
@@firstlast--- hopefully guys get on board and fight this communist BS
It is crap anyway. Some mechanics who want to swap ECUs, they might not be able to do that no more with having no NASTF VSP. Imagine we work on diagnosing a certain problem and figure out that a module is faulty. We will need to bring a person with a license to complete the task.
Should have seen this coming, Ford has required a VSP/LSID for years. The first time I installed a PCM and it asked for my VSP credentials for PATS years ago I got my LSID right away. Evan the 2021 Maverick has the security info stored in the ABS, probably will be locked out from just scanning it without a VSP.
2013
Fusion, MKZ
2015
F-150, Edge, Mustang, MKC, Focus, Focus BEV
2016
Explorer, MKX, C-Max
2017
Ford GT, Continental, F-Series Super Duty, Escape
Its simple workshops will not be doing this as the cost is sky rocketing ( in Australia) also When the sites are down or can't program and have to get another key or modul, yet more cost. Workshops will NOT be doing this... Customers will sooner or later workout not to buy said new vehicles. Things will change in years to come.
Got my application in yesterday. It would really suck if they denied my application for whatever reason and I just lost 425$
GOT $1,000,000 INSURANCE ????????????????????
@@8power0 yeah that’s pretty standard for garage liability
@@hancockautomotive1522PLEASE LET US ALL KNOW ,,,,,,,,,,, IF YOU GET IT VERY CURIOUS ??????????????????????????
This blatant money grab is some major BS.
It's a hurdle for us because of crooks. Yeah, it's money in someone else's pocket. Using the excuse that it's to weed out the car thieves is think is bogus. It's to prevent us from fixing our own and forcing many of us out. Information they are asking for is none of their business and saying we need a locksmith license is more bullshit. Saying one has to have a million dollar insurance policy is just something else that's none of their business! Fkem!
This is all about money nothing else they want to stop the 50 dollar tech from programming keys and fobs that was said yesterday by a you tuber trainer who also is on the board of directors of that company that’s doing this sucks
It has nothing to do with security, it’s the insurance companies…
Just like everything else. The added cost is just going to get pushed off to the customer. No big deal really.
L1 auto just made a video on this
Link?
L1 AUTO JUST BOWED DOWN
He mentioned he is on the board
@@8power0 according to his comment replies he's proud of it too. He don't care about small shops. Then he says cars and insurance will get cheaper. Not holding my breath on that one.
Yep, because he is a proud flag waver for NASTF and sits on the board and has stated that if you don't comply, to bad, you deserve to be shut down.
I won’t buy any vehicle that won’t allow any bidirectional scan tool to work on it
Right to repair is law, this nastf blackmail is not law, it is against it! I am a licensed Locksmith, and a class action lawsuit is in order!
Good luck with that. Guys like me who already had a NASTF account will be happy to take your customers work. Basically one job pays for the year. If you are a $50-$100 key guy you get what you get. I am close to UHS. Hacks there everyday working out of their trunks buying crappy aftermarket fobs. They don't go back and warranty their work. I charge 3x times what they charge. I give a warranty and use OEM fobs and keys. I also don't want their cheap and or broke customers they can have each other. They aren't good for a successful business.
The truth is that this is not only for keys. It's for all modules considered by oem as security, meaning all your car will require a vsp. Start telling customers about the price hike to repair their cars now.
My opinion, no reason for this to add a key or programming of a module such as a pcm. All lost keys, fine.
You won’t be able to get into anything having to do with security without a background check, millionaires dollar liability insurance and bond+ $425 for check and 2 years license!
@@kevinsutton5580 I just bought a key programmer. I’ll be good for a bit.
@@kevinsutton5580 nothing will stick until there are government mandate for tool makers/auto makers. Even then, black market tools will be out there.
It's just another version of what people in the 2A community are dealing with. There is the ongoing fight for right to repair. And there are those that will bend over backwards and jump through any hoop to block that.
SOO WHAT'S NEXT ,,,,,,, I GUESS CLONING A MODULE IS UP FOR THE CHOPPING BLOCK !!!!!!!!
just like homeland security...were here to help you??? and now how do you like it????
They dont use hacker tools to make keys.
Virtually every time the cops stop thieve they almost always have an autel key tool on them.
Are these $300+ dollar keys something people actually want? I hate it as a user and as a tech.
I'm an automotive locksmith and some are over $600. I tell the customers if they don't like my prices tow it to the dealer and wait 3 days plus pay more. I honestly don't care any more. I tell them I didn't make your car, I don't make the keys/fobs and I didn't lose your keys. If you want to be successful in this business you already needed to be a member of NASTF to be able to get codes anyway. New charges just get passed on. It is what it is. We run 80-150 automotive locksmith calls per week. We are very busy. We use the best programmers and mostly OEM fobs so we charge accordingly. Cheap aftermarket fobs gave us trouble when we tried them. I also warranty all our work. We have close to zero callbacks. Had one lady ruin the buttons with her fingernail. As a courtesy we programmed a new fob. Second time she did it I told her this was on her. They decided to just use the key.
Ok
Only nastf member manufacrurwrs using their paid access to the pids will be affected. Most reverse engineered tools and the majority of the china tool manufacturers will tell em to pound sand. Autel, drewtech and a few others will comply. Look at the mastf membwrs list for equipmwmt to avoid
Its a USA thing. Make America GREAT again. 😆
Why not do all this for high end cars only or the cars that are being stolen the most.....just do a lock out for those cars.....
Commenting on the video for the algorithm
oh god!!!
just don't carry out these functions. that will kill it
Well thanx KIA BOYS.
I think it is stupid but what can u do got pay the 400 dollars and keep going
Right to repair is dead!!
Well thanx KIA BOYS.