I was the digital technician on Journey to the center of the earth 3D for the second unit, the 3D cameras were supplied by James Cameron, the main unit was working with beam splitter rigs while we were shotting with a side-by-side 3D setup, the ancestor of the system shown in your video, it was custom made with 2 sony studio HD camera, for which the sensors were removed and fitted inside a carbon fibre cube with B4 lens mounths, the les lens mounts on the camera were replaces with a huge multipin connectors that was tapping into the camera circuits, the camera bodies were fixed on a video cart using plain VCT-14 camera plate, the main unit used a similar system too but like I mentionned, on a beam splitter mirror mount, the main problem was the cables they would break easily
I have to say, watching Frame Voyager videos are like watch the very best content RUclips can provide without the annoying streaming service subscription. I swear, your content could be on network television. Fantastic content!
The Rialto wasn’t the first Sony did with a split block. They had a system for the HDC-1500 called the HKC-T1500. They were used a lot for gyro stabilized cameras on helicopters for broadcast. That was probably a decade before the Venice came out.
Correct! In fact pretty much all BVP & HDC broadcast cameras from BVP-550 through to HDC-2500 have had interchangeable sensor blocks, with the ability to use T Blocks for remote operation (gimbals or 3D etc).
The original J-Cam was based on F900s for a side-by-side 3D rig. Built by Sony for Panavision. I can't remember, but I think it was initally for the Terminator 2 ride film at Universal Studios that Cameron was making at the time. A few years ago, I saw Panavision were selling some of these cameras on E-Bay. That's what jogged my memory about them.
This is the kind of cool stuff you can do with properly designed modular systems. Seeing this in action finally gives me a reason to give Avatar 2 a watch.
Hopefully Sony starts to listen to their lower end consumers at some point. Focus breathing compensation is in the A7IV but not in the A1. And things like shutter angle, waveforms and DCI 4K/open gate has been requested for so long for their cine line
Man, I love each of your videos! I saw the rialto system in a couple of showrooms back in he day, and I love seeing how all this creative people have used it.
Difference being the rialto can be used for both. If I remembering right, the Alexa M was only just an Alexa they cut in 2 and it wasn't a detachable sensor block?
Actually, Cameron talked to Arri first and they built one in 2011 ruclips.net/video/oe8MmjNpryE/видео.html but they could not deliver a 4K version of the camera on time for Avatar 2, then Cameron reached out to SONY and they delivered.
Yep! Probably should have mentioned that. Though Cameron has worked with Sony for a while. It also makes sense Sony had the R&D power to deliver so quickly too.
This is so handy and revolutionary that it seems weird, that it have not been made, or at least it didn't work out, that good for cinema industry earlier.
Detached camera has been something you wanted in a lot of different types of camera systems but it has never been implemented for some reason, but we all know its cost... gotta get that last 0,1% profit instead of a user friendly system.
Would love to see a video on the origins of this tech via the SI-2k (Slumdog Millionare) and Alexa M - way ahead of their time but what prevented them from being as popular as the Rialto has become?
Yeah, every time I hear about this new tech/party trick, I'm thinking specifically of articles I read about SI2K and Slumdog Millionaire. Even going back further, the whole concept of the "cam-corder" back in the 80's was to sell the new convenience of having the recorder on the camera as opposed to having the recorder in a separate box in a sling bag or a table/rack box nearby which was the norm for mobile video recording before that invention. Though. I think the real innovation with the J-Cam came with the increased resolution in that detachable sensor. Making it possible to get that mobility while keeping the image quality.
@@jmalmsten It's not really an innovation because Alexa 65 can do the same thing. It was done in The Revenant (2015). Alexa 65 has a larger sensor and a larger resolution at uncompressed raw. I don't know why Cameron haven't used an Alexa. Probably because he has better relations with Sony and maybe something to do with 3D.
@@berkertaskiran Yeah, business-relations are probably in play. Sony can provide way more exposure with their channels through ads on TVs, Playstation, directly to consumers and everything else. ARRI, ... Is "just" a camera and equipment company.
Woah people don’t like it when they need to jump over hurdles and use third party adapters to overcome nonsensical design flaws? You’d never know looking at the world around us
what i'd think would be more impressive is if ghey were able to make imax film cameras that fit into these tight areas. say what you will about digital being the more superior thing, but the advancements made in recent years in records to how absolutely miniscule things can be produced with the technology we have now, i don't think that super-8 sized IMAX resolution film is an impossibillity anymore. it'd be great to see if we take what we know about reducing the size of digital sensors and applied it to film cinematography.
haha for sure! But I think that's starting to become something that no one will want to mess with when you have systems like these in place. Cost/Reward benefits might start to become less and less
@@FrameVoyager Well I don't think there's much of a cost/reward in regards to film-making in general. Or just, making stuff in general. You of all people should know that producing cinematographic equipment overall is a hit or a miss. So people taking that experimentation and applying that to film and film cameras, I think it'd be as succesful as most other cinematographic ventures. Kodak is starting to get a lot more hands-on with their partnered filmmakers. They produced 35mm Ektachrome stock for Euphoria and 75mm Eastman Double-X stock for Christopher Nolan for Oppenheimer. So they are open to modification and technological advancements to suit the filmmaker's needs, just like Sony or RED or Arri. Digital has not killed film, as some people really love to claim. In fact, it's helped it. The advancements of digital can be applied to film, and I think they will very soon. My prediction is we'll see orthochromatic cinefilm coming from Kodak very soon and as I said, IMAX quality images at Super8 sizes.
I'm curious, does anyone know if there is a limit to the length of cable that can be used for the Rialto? Like if at a certain length, you start to experience a degradation in quality or too much latency to pull focus?
I think currently 18 feet is the farthest away it's able to go. 9ft cable and then a 9 ft extension cable. It's an interesting to think about if we could have a wireless version in like 10-20 years. I wonder what the transmission rate would need to be...
For very long range, optical fiber cable is the way to go. There are very long thunderbolt optical cables(20+ meters), those cable can handle massive amount of data, like over 3gb per second.
The Rialto 2 does a max of 12 meters! You wouldn't so much get delay, but sending such an incredibly immense amount of raw data over fiber is very difficult. The final recorded RAW file can be up to around 670MB/s.
Frame Voyager really best docu about film world around for free...men great work...a question about a Blackmagic BMPCC and URSA12K Camera Fan any hope for the brand or will it be soon in your video Program as one of the abonndoned camera line...?
I'm surprised more (lower end) camera companies aren't doing the split block approach. I'd love to see a Blackmagic, Canon version, or same on Sony's mid-range camera range. I guess it's such a niche use that it's hard to justify for the mass market.
Sony had the UMC-S3C which was a block camera version of one of the A7 models, the problem was despite removing all the stuff to make it smaller it cost a lot more than the standard A7, it has since been discontinued. Granted it wasn't a split block but when you add in a remote battery, screen and controller it's not too far off that concept.
Very niche and also very expensive. Also only makes sense with cameras that are larger in their original format. A Blackmagic or similar is already as small as you're gonna get
What "needs" can your camera manufacturer fulfill? 😏😏😏
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I was the digital technician on Journey to the center of the earth 3D for the second unit, the 3D cameras were supplied by James Cameron, the main unit was working with beam splitter rigs while we were shotting with a side-by-side 3D setup, the ancestor of the system shown in your video, it was custom made with 2 sony studio HD camera, for which the sensors were removed and fitted inside a carbon fibre cube with B4 lens mounths, the les lens mounts on the camera were replaces with a huge multipin connectors that was tapping into the camera circuits, the camera bodies were fixed on a video cart using plain VCT-14 camera plate, the main unit used a similar system too but like I mentionned, on a beam splitter mirror mount, the main problem was the cables they would break easily
7:02 - I'm so happy to see Blomkamp as a director! He deserves more than just yt videos!
Agreed!
This got me hype for GT.. lol
Didn't know they were making a movie, so much tech now to make it REALLY look like a Video Game in real life
💯💯💯
They built a “J” camera for J. Cameron. Clever
I have to say, watching Frame Voyager videos are like watch the very best content RUclips can provide without the annoying streaming service subscription. I swear, your content could be on network television. Fantastic content!
🥰️🥰️🥰️
Specially while using Sponsorblock. Couldn't even imagine watching this shit without it.
I love Sony and I love this! ♥️❤️♥️❤️♥️
The Rialto wasn’t the first Sony did with a split block. They had a system for the HDC-1500 called the HKC-T1500. They were used a lot for gyro stabilized cameras on helicopters for broadcast. That was probably a decade before the Venice came out.
Also can’t forget the alexa M!
Correct!
In fact pretty much all BVP & HDC broadcast cameras from BVP-550 through to HDC-2500 have had interchangeable sensor blocks, with the ability to use T Blocks for remote operation (gimbals or 3D etc).
I've loved working with the Venice cams. The rialto system makes for some cool rigging that was previously only possible with the old Arri Alexa M.
It’s interesting that the rialto (on Venice 1) doesn’t record raw but uses Sony’s 10 bit log profile.
Sensor can also be detached in Alexa 65. They did the same thing in The Revenant.
@@daniellove162 The Venice itself doesn't record RAW without an AXS-R7
The original J-Cam was based on F900s for a side-by-side 3D rig. Built by Sony for Panavision. I can't remember, but I think it was initally for the Terminator 2 ride film at Universal Studios that Cameron was making at the time. A few years ago, I saw Panavision were selling some of these cameras on E-Bay. That's what jogged my memory about them.
This is the kind of cool stuff you can do with properly designed modular systems.
Seeing this in action finally gives me a reason to give Avatar 2 a watch.
That brand integration....SMOOOTH.
I work as a dolly grip in Toronto working on big TV shows. I have only worked on 1 arri show in the past 4 years. Everything has been sony
Sony really knocked it out if the park with the rialto!
They really did. Feels like a little bit of a flex for their development team 😂
Hopefully Sony starts to listen to their lower end consumers at some point. Focus breathing compensation is in the A7IV but not in the A1. And things like shutter angle, waveforms and DCI 4K/open gate has been requested for so long for their cine line
I'm sorry... did you say your name wasn't James Cameron? ☎️**Click**
@@FrameVoyager I feel triggered.
these stories are all so interesting. it is amazing to learn about how a movie was filmed and with what new tech!
We cover that a lot on this channel. A lot of the videos we try and get interviews from the people working on the shows or movies!
@@FrameVoyager yes! I love your channel ☺
@@deangofnungproductions 🥰🥰🥰
You're killing it with this channel. Good stuff.
Man, I love each of your videos!
I saw the rialto system in a couple of showrooms back in he day, and I love seeing how all this creative people have used it.
"Sony always wins, you can't beat Sony".
😅
The Alexa M did this 10 years ago. Also silicon imaging had something similar even longer ago. The Batman used rialto on a lot of the car shots too
Difference being the rialto can be used for both. If I remembering right, the Alexa M was only just an Alexa they cut in 2 and it wasn't a detachable sensor block?
@@FrameVoyager yeah it was two units connected by a cable and I don't think you could unplug it either
Once Sony was synonym of Televisions. Now it's cameras.
Love these videos, always learn something new. As for James Cameron having a need for blue creatures, I'd say the jury is still out on that.
for real 😅😅😅
2 minutes in, and this is the most fun and informative video I've seen in a month.
You must really like ads
@Taistelu_pelto Yikes. Can you recommend any videos about proctology? I'd like to learn how to respond to assholes, such as yourself.
I think the Venice is the best digital cinema camera out. From the movies I've seen shot on it, no other camera emulates the film look as well.
Actually, Cameron talked to Arri first and they built one in 2011 ruclips.net/video/oe8MmjNpryE/видео.html but they could not deliver a 4K version of the camera on time for Avatar 2, then Cameron reached out to SONY and they delivered.
Yep! Probably should have mentioned that. Though Cameron has worked with Sony for a while. It also makes sense Sony had the R&D power to deliver so quickly too.
It's like the IMAX prooved DJI ronin 4D but without intelligent gimbal 😁
😅😅😅
This is so handy and revolutionary that it seems weird, that it have not been made, or at least it didn't work out, that good for cinema industry earlier.
Detached camera has been something you wanted in a lot of different types of camera systems but it has never been implemented for some reason, but we all know its cost... gotta get that last 0,1% profit instead of a user friendly system.
Watching this reminded me: did we ever find out what the Sony camera was that was being used on Apex is?
it's insane that those hollywood filmmakers are using the same e-mount lenses as i do on a cheap a6000
Bro, cool video. But watch your sound levels and balance between your narration and soundtracks from films, TopGun track really hit my ears :)
Whoops. I may have forgotten to add the leveler on it. Sorry about that. I have a little Nolan in me when it comes to music haha
Would love to see a video on the origins of this tech via the SI-2k (Slumdog Millionare) and Alexa M - way ahead of their time but what prevented them from being as popular as the Rialto has become?
That one is on our list!
Yeah, every time I hear about this new tech/party trick, I'm thinking specifically of articles I read about SI2K and Slumdog Millionaire. Even going back further, the whole concept of the "cam-corder" back in the 80's was to sell the new convenience of having the recorder on the camera as opposed to having the recorder in a separate box in a sling bag or a table/rack box nearby which was the norm for mobile video recording before that invention.
Though. I think the real innovation with the J-Cam came with the increased resolution in that detachable sensor. Making it possible to get that mobility while keeping the image quality.
@@jmalmsten It's not really an innovation because Alexa 65 can do the same thing. It was done in The Revenant (2015). Alexa 65 has a larger sensor and a larger resolution at uncompressed raw. I don't know why Cameron haven't used an Alexa. Probably because he has better relations with Sony and maybe something to do with 3D.
@@berkertaskiran
Yeah, business-relations are probably in play. Sony can provide way more exposure with their channels through ads on TVs, Playstation, directly to consumers and everything else. ARRI, ... Is "just" a camera and equipment company.
They weren't actually the first. Sony have been doing detachable sensor blocks since about 1995!
🔥video! keep it up
Appreciate it!
Woah people don’t like it when they need to jump over hurdles and use third party adapters to overcome nonsensical design flaws? You’d never know looking at the world around us
😅😅😅
I think that chievo did it before Jim in the revenant when he had choped the Alexa
Can we get a abandon camera episode on the 2016 CRAFT modular cinema camera?
It's on the list 😉
@@FrameVoyager Sweet.
They should've put the camera in the Mechwarrior rig from the first Avatar.
That would have been the smart thing to do
@@FrameVoyager my back hurts just looking at him hold it.
@@mrshaheedmalik Seriously though haha
There is something budget friendly around with a zcam. I've seen it at IBC 2022 used as a helmet cam.
what i'd think would be more impressive is if ghey were able to make imax film cameras that fit into these tight areas. say what you will about digital being the more superior thing, but the advancements made in recent years in records to how absolutely miniscule things can be produced with the technology we have now, i don't think that super-8 sized IMAX resolution film is an impossibillity anymore. it'd be great to see if we take what we know about reducing the size of digital sensors and applied it to film cinematography.
haha for sure! But I think that's starting to become something that no one will want to mess with when you have systems like these in place. Cost/Reward benefits might start to become less and less
@@FrameVoyager Well I don't think there's much of a cost/reward in regards to film-making in general. Or just, making stuff in general. You of all people should know that producing cinematographic equipment overall is a hit or a miss. So people taking that experimentation and applying that to film and film cameras, I think it'd be as succesful as most other cinematographic ventures. Kodak is starting to get a lot more hands-on with their partnered filmmakers. They produced 35mm Ektachrome stock for Euphoria and 75mm Eastman Double-X stock for Christopher Nolan for Oppenheimer. So they are open to modification and technological advancements to suit the filmmaker's needs, just like Sony or RED or Arri. Digital has not killed film, as some people really love to claim. In fact, it's helped it. The advancements of digital can be applied to film, and I think they will very soon. My prediction is we'll see orthochromatic cinefilm coming from Kodak very soon and as I said, IMAX quality images at Super8 sizes.
I'm curious, does anyone know if there is a limit to the length of cable that can be used for the Rialto? Like if at a certain length, you start to experience a degradation in quality or too much latency to pull focus?
I think currently 18 feet is the farthest away it's able to go. 9ft cable and then a 9 ft extension cable. It's an interesting to think about if we could have a wireless version in like 10-20 years. I wonder what the transmission rate would need to be...
For very long range, optical fiber cable is the way to go. There are very long thunderbolt optical cables(20+ meters), those cable can handle massive amount of data, like over 3gb per second.
The Rialto 2 does a max of 12 meters!
You wouldn't so much get delay, but sending such an incredibly immense amount of raw data over fiber is very difficult. The final recorded RAW file can be up to around 670MB/s.
“Sony listens to their customers” tell me you’ve never had to shoot with an fx6 without telling me you’ve never had to shoot with an fx6…😂
i’ll wonder if we will have an FX camera with a remote head, to be used like the Ronin 4D
Frame Voyager really best docu about film world around for free...men great work...a question about a Blackmagic BMPCC and URSA12K Camera Fan any hope for the brand or will it be soon in your video Program as one of the abonndoned camera line...?
i'd be curious for more info on the Alexa XT M !
You imagine putting this on a Cine Lifter?
I'm down for the GT movie if the cars are the stars.
But what I don’t get, Arri did this 10 years ago with the Arri M
I really hate directors who just want to act like cinematographers on set without being an actual cinematographer!
Did the actor in top gun 2 really fly the F18, while self filming themselves ?
No, they were in the back seat normally occupied by the weapons officer.
unbereable with how loud this is
What part?
@@FrameVoyager top gun Maverick
why do you need all those fancy camera when the final film you see is 100% cgi?
20th Century STUDIO.
Disney won't be happy about the "fox"... And will force you to listen to "It's a small world after all" for eternity ! 🤣
My literal nightmare 😳
But they did have that play before the avatar movie if I'm not mistaken 😅
@@FrameVoyager The First one yes, not the second. Bewaaaaaaaare
@@Bast6 👀
first
You've been first a lot lately 😅😅😅
Toyota makes better cams. Celica was diuble cam shaft car.
Just a note here: i find the youtuber humor repulsive and distracting. If it helps you reach a wider audience i'll deal with it. Cheers.
I'm surprised more (lower end) camera companies aren't doing the split block approach. I'd love to see a Blackmagic, Canon version, or same on Sony's mid-range camera range. I guess it's such a niche use that it's hard to justify for the mass market.
Sony had the UMC-S3C which was a block camera version of one of the A7 models, the problem was despite removing all the stuff to make it smaller it cost a lot more than the standard A7, it has since been discontinued. Granted it wasn't a split block but when you add in a remote battery, screen and controller it's not too far off that concept.
Very niche and also very expensive. Also only makes sense with cameras that are larger in their original format. A Blackmagic or similar is already as small as you're gonna get
Hmm, split camera, when Sony did that last time...
www.broadcaststore.com/pdf/model/816495/F35%20Brochure%201_0.pdf
page 8...
YИOƧ is a camera brand I haven't heard in quite some time
😏😏😏