I've listened to several reviews of both the B&W and Focal headsets. This review was the most informative, most humorous (great sense of humor) and most well-considered that I've found in the RUclips space. I subscribed and look forward to more from your channel.👏👏👏
Hola! Thanks for this review! I’m going to buy a usbc cable to lightning for use the DAC of the focal Bathys on my iphone 14 and wondering if you can recommend any cable in particular, thanks again
Seen quite some review vids regarding the PX8, and u r the only one so far who’s mentioned the difference in sounds quality after a certain period of breaking them in. That info is incredibly valuable, thank u so much for that!!
Yeah, most of all, it's a great way to 'get even' with my two teenagers when they call for daddy and I show up with big headphones on, looking them in the eyes while they speak to me, and then answer..."what?" 🤣
I love your reviews. Well detailed, honest and your voice is calming. For me, I love my Focal Bathys. As soon as I started listening in them, I knew I'm going to love it. I fell in love with their sound stage and overall quality. I am thoroughly impressed.
Very good review. Feeling the same way towards my Px8. Not the typical audiophile sound, yet I just connect with its musicality. That closeness is magic on some recordings.
@@immersivesoundtech amazing video, is it worth it to spend £100 more for the bathys? Also would love to see you review the b and o Ex ear buds vs astell and kern uw100mk2 vs bowers and Wilkins pi7s2
@@WhatTheFragrance Thanks for your kind words! You really have to take a listen to both Bathys and Px8 to find out which one that sounds the best - to you. And also figure out which one that fits your head the best. Reviewing B&W Pi7 S2 right now and I will compare them with Apple AirPods Pro 2 because they are roughly the same price (and my son wears them pretty much 24/7). Let me think about reviewing other earbuds okay. 👍
I came to your video to decide on what to save up for whether it be the Focal Bathys ANC BT Headphones or the Bowers and Wilkins Px8 headphones. I found you very likeable, professional and genuine. You seem like a very humble person which is very refreshing.
I think you described the attributes and sound of the B&W Px8 headphones very, very well! As you hint at, no headphones can do it all depending on the user's preferences and use environment. Many thanks!!!
Thanks for your kind words! 🙏 The T+A Solitaire T headphones looks really interesting and are definitely worth reviewing. Thanks for the tip! I've reached out to the manufacturer suggesting a review, let's see what they answer. Cheers Fred
Great video Frederick. I always love to hear other people's opinions on sound gear. For me it was always the ML. I really enjoy the PX8 and the Bathys (2nd fav) but the sound I get from the 5909 is just so clean and balanced. I agree it does seem to have less boomy bass when compared to the PX8, but there's an almost gutteral growl in the sub-bass that the other two just can't seem to hit which sounds so damn good lol. It's the passive audio from the 5909 that made the biggest impression on me though. If you're just running the wire straight from your phone I agree that the DAC mode on the Bathys has a slight upper hand especially if you're connecting to an Iphone, but if you connect the 5909 to a DAC or DAP that thing puffs it's chest out BIG TIME. Even when running it from an IFI Go Bar and IFI Go Blu I was shocked how the sound from the 5909 reminded me so much of the DCA Aeon 2 Noire and Focal Radiance
Totally agree on the bass matter! I also find it very joyful to enable bass extension in the app, however it quickly becomes fatiguing (drum & bass and other bass heavy music) :)
Hi I enjoyed this review, very detailed and I agree these will all be fantastic headphones so it will be the horses for courses analogy. Are you able to do a comparison between the focal bathys and the Dali IO-12 please, I'm looking for a true to source sound using my sp3000 or as close as poss lol thank you subscribed
Great comparison video as always. You mentioned being able to connect the Focals to your iPhone with a cable to get a better sound quality. I have a pair of the B&W and I use a USB-C to USB-C cable that is included to connect to my iPhone 15 Pro Max. The 24-bit/192 kHz Hi-Res audio sounds incredible via Bluetooth, but plugged in it sounds even better. Like amazingly better! It is less compressed than it is via Bluetooth and at least 25% or more louder. Jut incredible. I bought my son a pair of the B&W for Christmas and he has commented that they are the best sounding headphones he's ever heard and the quality is so clean that its almost as if the musicians are in the room with you. I have been a musician myself (not professionally) for 30 years and these B&W headphones have changed the way I listen to music.
Thanks Kevin for your post. Much appreciated. I plan to upgrade to iPhone 15 Pro as soon as I can - mostly to get rid of the lighting port (that's slowing down my work when trying to export videos filmed with my iPhone 14 Pro). Your report just made my decision even more easy. Glad to hear that your son is so happy with his B&W Px8. What a great way to teach your kids about the wonders of HiFi sound. 😃 I also think they sound great and as you point out, listening to them via USB-C cable, they sound even better. Saving up for that iPhone 15 Pro. 😉
Thanks for your kind words, Nash! Much appreciated! I've reached out to B&O, asking for headphones to review. Unfortunately they couldn't accommodate my request. I don't have the financial means to buy headphones to review, so for now, I will only be able to review headphones sent to me from the manufacturer.
Hi Frederick, I am loving your videos. Any chance you can try the Edifier Stax Spirit S3 and give your opinion on how they sound and compare to these ones sound quality-wise? They are planar magnetics wireless with no ANC, and are cheaper than these three.
Well your video convinced me to give the PX8 a second go! I just re-ordered them them after giving my original PX8 headphones to my son-in-law. I didn't like the bass of my originally owned PX8. I do believe in the benefits of break-in, and also am convinced my "brain" does adapt to the sound of a headphone over time. I know there are many naysayers regarding break in of audio equipment. Hey, whatever works for the individual listener!
Well spoken and thanks for watching my videos. Highly appreciated! So, please let me know how the Px8 sound now that you've 'broken them in'. Cheers Frederick
Thank you for this very decent review and a deep dive into the world of sound engineers ;-) You are a very sympathic and enjoyable listen-to person and I really enjoyed this video! Thank you for all the brunch of detailed and hand picked information. All the best to Sweden!
I've been researching for the next headphones, to upgrade from my existing Sennheiser Momentum 4s. This is by far the best review of my top three candidates. Truly exceptional amount of detail conveyed in simple language for anyone to understand. Thank you!!!
Thank you, Tim! I'm talking about 'break in' in my Focal Bathys and B&W Px8 videos, so please take a look at them. I plan to do a proper video about 'burning in' headphones and speakers. It's quite a controversial subject, so I'm working up energy to deal with the naysayers and antagonists.
Well I did get my new PX8s (McLaren edition) and they’re gorgeous. They are quite tight in my opinion and as you said should loosen up over time. As for breaking, I’m in your camp on this one, we have Hi-Fi stuff at home -basic KEF gear with Arcam amp and cd player but they needed to be broken in as well, can’t see why headphones would be different. Thanks again, great video! I’ll find the other videos!
The McLaren edition colors look great - envious eyes over here. 😍 Yes, in my experience, headphones are no exception and need to be 'broken in' before doing any proper evaluation of the sound quality and sound stage. I'd even go as far as saying that the benefits of 'break in' are more obvious in headphones, than in a pair of speakers, because there are less variables at play, evaluating the sound quality. With speakers, you have the room acoustics that play a big part of the sound and if you just sit a little bit closer or further away, the sound with slightly alter in character - making it harder to distinguish the possible differences. Also, there is less equipment involved, evaluating a pair of headphones and they pretty much fit the same on your head, each time you put them on. And they are much easier to break in by just leaving them in a closet playing 24/7 for a couple of weeks. With a pair of speakers, that can be tough for a normal user - having them play around the clock in the living room. Lucky for me, I have a separate control room where I position new speakers and subwoofers, and let them play 24/7 without disturbing anyone. That's why I know what a difference proper 'break in' do to most speakers, headphones and equipment. Let me know what you think of my other videos, okay. 👍 Cheers Fred
I preferred the Bathys . My personal sound preferences were more accommodated by the focals . I also preferred the feel of the build quality and the looks . I like the case and app they provide. Everything they supplied just did it for me . I think I gravitate to the Focal sound as I have 4 Focal headphones and a pair of Choras w Dolby atmos and a center channel speaker .I also have sennheiser , Hifiman ,and Empyriums . Focal is such a incredible company despite being French. These headphones sound like crap in my opinion wired . They r intended to be used wireless.
Hello from Mexico , thank you very much for this incredible video ! I have the bowers and Wilkins px8, would you replace the type c to 3.5 mm cable that comes with the headphones with a more professional cable? If so, what cable would you use? I will be very grateful for your comment
Hi Paco! Thanks for watching my videos! 👍 If you are using that cable, sure it can most likely be swapped to a 'better' one. Cables are important. Unfortunately, I have no suggestion for you right now. Maybe someone else here can suggest a good cable. I plan to address the importance of cables in future videos.
Thank you for the great review! I recently purchased a Bathys at a really good price in Australia, and I'm quite pleased with it. However, I didn't find it as comfortable as some others have mentioned. I also wish it had a bit more bass, and the treble is a bit too sharp for my liking.
Sound-wise, you should let them 'burn-in' for a couple of weeks, and the sound stage will settle. Then evaluate if you like how they sound or not. 👍 Regarding the comfort, there is only one way to know, and it is trying them out yourself, like you have.
Thank you for this video,this is the right stuff! One question : I do listen a lot of club music with lots of Bass,Which one of these Headphones do you recommend?
Thanks for your kind words! Highly appreciated! If you want a low-end that digs deep and still sound 'punchy' and vibrant, I would recommend listening to the Focal Bathys. And if you like a slightly overblown but punchy and 'fun' low-end, go for the Bower & Wilkins Px8 with the ANC enabled. Personally, I also love bass (I started my sound engineering career as a DJ back in the late 80ies) and I still can't quite decide which headphones I like the best for club music. If you like to listen loud - which you shouldn't do - the Px8 are definitely better. The louder you play em, the 'better' they sound. Hope this helps. Let us know which you decide to buy and how they work out for you, okay. All the best Frederick
Great video.✔️I'm thinking about buying the bathys but I didn't know if it was too big for me. I had the px8 and found it very stylish - unfortunately I didn't like the sound in many genres... but you say you should use it longer. I'm not sure whether I should buy it again.
Any normal head size or larger won't have any problem wearing the Bathys and the only wearing issues you could possibly face are a feeling like the ear pads come a little close to the jaw if your head runs a little on the smaller side or that you stand out cause they look so different from the usual BT headphone style. Other than that they're IMO one of the most comfortable wireless headphones around. As far as sound goes between the 3 it's way too subjective and it really boils down to your listening style. If you didn't care too much for the PX8's sound before then the burn-in probably won't make that much of a difference to change your mind. The PX8, as you've probably noticed, has a very energetic sound with a bit of a bass boost so it does really well with genres that emphasize that (hip-hop, rap, Dance, electronica, pop). The only downside to the PX8 is that because of that tuning, while it does sound really good in general, things like vocals or genres that emphasize the upper region (classical, jazz, rock) can sound a little washed out by the bass or not give you the instrument separation you would get on something like the Bathys or 5909. On the flipside if you do prefer those energetic and bass heavy sounds then the Bathys and 5909 won't come quite as close to hitting them as the PX8 can (though to me 5909 sounds the cleanest). This is what I've personally found between the 3: Bathys has the widest soundstage, the best transparency, the best app and custom eq, and a very balanced sound albeit sometimes sounding a little dull with the burn-in making it slightly warmer (though the DAC mode sounds fantastic). The PX8, like I said earlier, lends it's energy to a very clean and slightly harder bass, has better ANC and a very responsive and "fun" sound. The 5909 is the most balanced of the 3 to me with great ANC (maybe tie with PX8), a very comfy fit, best case and accessories, and the cleanest sound that focuses on attenuation and separation. It's also the only one of the 3 that can play passively without any battery power. My favorite tends to be the 5909 followed by the Bathys. They're just great all-arounders plus there's enough differences to set them apart from most other headphones out there but none of them are a bad choice AT ALL since they all sound so damn good. It just comes down to what usually sounds good to you. I will also add that the 5909 is the only one of the 3 that easily connects to Dacs and Daps which makes them sound even better!
Hi Alexander! Well, you have tried out the B&W Px8 and if you didn't like the sound, my suggestion is that you try out the Focal Bathys - maybe they will better present the music as you would like to hear it. On the other hand, sounds like you didn't 'break in' the Px8 properly before evaluating the sound - so you really haven't experienced the full 'glory'. That said, it's not a night-or-day difference, after they are properly 'broken in', so my suggestion is to try out the Focal Bathys. Please let us know how they work out for you. Good luck! Frederick
What a great review and very interesting. The B&W has my interest. I would use them for music laying in bed and for travel. I actually just bought a pair of Bose QC45 but those are going back to the dealer since they sound unbalanced between the right and left channel
@@immersivesoundtech Thank you. Can I ask you if you have tested video delay? Some wireless headphones unfortunately have a visible delay between video and sound
Well, all wireless headphones have latency - especially when they are set to high sound quality codecs. As of now and as far as I know, there is no workaround other than adjusting for that latency in your media player, TV or iPad app. And if the lip sync or latency can't be adjusted, the only way is to lower the sound quality of the Bluetooth transmission and thus get a bit lower latency - in some cases. This is definitely a subject for a future video of mine. Thanks for the question, and if someone of my subscribers knows more about the subject, please feel free to comment.
Nice dossier , just got my B&W yesterday, did the firm update and I am so satisfied. No LDAC but still keep my old sonys XM3. Perfect fit , sound and price 680$. Keep the sound up🎉cheer .
Hi! Great video. 3 days ago I bought the px8 and they give me the impression of being muddy and boomy with no definition, I decided to give them a try and give them too much use and I need to say that 20 hrs later they sound so much better , I believe you that in 100 or plus hours they will sound even better. Thanks!
Thanks for you input! Yes, the headphones will in my experience both open up and become more firm in the low-end, as they are 'broken in'. Just leave them playing overnight for a couple of weeks, and they will keep on giving. 🎶👍
Great review, i suscribe to your channel, im between px8 and bathys, which one you think is better in terms of sound quality? Im not interested on anc mode, thanks a lot
Thanks for your kind words! It's really apples or oranges, both headphones sound great - in their own way. Focal Bathys are more transparent and natural-sounding - although the ANC can't be disabled. B&W Px8 sound more 'fun' with an 'inflated' low-end when the ANC is enabled. With the ANC off, they sound a bit too thin for my taste. I love both headphones. 🎶❤️ The best is if you're able to compare them yourself, before buying. 👍
I ordered the black PX8 because the Focal is too massive for me. The PX8's sound is outstanding, but I find the sound very mixed in some pop songs. I'm curious whether there really is a burn-in. I'm happy to report.
Good for you. Yes, rest assure, your B&W Px8 will just sound better and better, the more you 'burn' them in. It will mostly be audible in the low-end and the upper mid-range. Please let us know how they work out for you over time. 👍
@@immersivesoundtech May I ask do you know by any chance how different B&W px8 are over px7? I own a px7 I am pretty satisfied but I wish they had more details and be less boomy I wonder if px8 is a big improvement over these. Also can mark levinson n5909 be connected to a DAC like I heard you can do that only when you have them completely discharged.
I haven't listened to the B&W Px7 S2 or S2E, but hopefully the distributor will send me a pair for review. Working on it. 👍 The Mark Levinson 5909 can be used passively by connecting a special cable that is included in the carry case, and hooked up to an external DAC with headphone output.
@@immersivesoundtechThank you soo much for quick reply I hope your channel will get more views, your content is soo underrated man. There are a few people that have the balls to review these top tier bluetooth headphones.
Thanks for your kind words Zajko! Highly appreciated! If you have the time, please spread the word about my channel on Facebook and Internet forums. That would help me a lot. Right now I'm getting closer and closer to be able to apply for the RUclips affiliate program - which will enable me to do more videos and reviews, get access to more creator tools and start monetizing all the work I've put into my channel. Hehe, I've spend hundreds of hours working on this channel, and have yet to receive a dollar for my work. It's all done on my spare time, 'pro bono' for you guys. It's all based on my passion for music and music technology, and my new passion for filming, editing and making videos. So, any help promoting my channel is highly appreciated. 🙏 I have great plans for this channel and tons of ideas for new videos that I think will be both educational and entertaining to watch. Have a nice and relaxing Sunday! Frederick
Which suits the biggest head sizes? I am unable to try the different models as I am disabled and live in a rural area. Many headphones do not fit my large noggin and have excessive clamp force; eg Beyer Dynamic T1 or Bose QC35. Sennheiser HD650 is just OK, Meze 99 with strap removed, best fit ever was the Denon AHD7000. So I need best sound quality and largest size, noise cancelling a secondary issue.
My brain's symetry fixation congratulates you for your background and shot setup. Also, I think if you're supposed to "break in" the BW for 500 hours for them to start sounding good, that's reason enough not to buy them. Great video! new sub. A Bathys enjoyer
Thanks you! Well, I'm rather picky when setting up my control room for video shooting and it's cumbersome to get the right depth-of-field, picture composition and proper lighting. Thanks for noticing. 🙏 I have now invested in a 7-inch portable video monitor which will me do a proper set up fast and more accurate - at least I hope it will. Regarding 'break-in', my experience - after having reviewed headphones in trade magazine for over twenty years - is that all factory-new headphones benefit being properly "broken in", so don't judge the Px8 by that 'fact'. When you have bought a new pair of headphones, I think it's good practice to have them play around the clock for a couple of weeks. All designs and cone materials are different, so there is no general rule how many hours that are needed, but if you exercise them for a couple of weeks, they will be "broken in". I know this is a controversial topic, but my findings are based on empirical findings having reviewed a lot headphones through the years.
How big is the difference between Px7s2 and Px8? I had the Px5 and Px7 and both were pretty similar in sound, however the glue from Px7 earcups did not last that long. Then I checked the Bose Quietcomfort and the Quietcomfort ultra. On default settings the Quietcomfort Ultra is on par with Px7 & Px7s2 for me (even after burn in). However the immersive audio makes the ultra superior for me. This is something the Px7s seem to be quite behind. So I am wondering if the Px8 have the same weakness. At least the Rtings review pointed that out
I haven't had the chance to compare the B&W Px7s2 and Px8 yet. And I haven't listened to the Bose Quietcomfort Ultra headphones. Hopefully I will be able to do that in the future.
I had the opportunity to demo those three along with B&O H95, AirPod Max and Solitaire. With the exception of Solitaire, the 5909s literally wiped the floor with the rest of them in terms of sonic experience (clarity, soundstage, instrument separation). I played the latest Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto by Yuja Wang and Gustavo Dudamel as it was recorded live with LA Phil (HighRes) and I was in total awe. I just couldn’t justify purchasing any of the others. Especially, when it can also operate as a totally passive wired headphone (when battery dies on you completely). So I was shocked on your remarks on the sound quality. I will agree that the need to work a little on the BASS enhancement for more oomph but in general the bass maybe shy but it’s right and HD something you can’t say for the other too. I found the Focal bass very flabby and the B&W way too much.
The 5909 lends themselves well to classical music, which I believe I state in my review. And I'm glad to hear that you've found the best-sounding headphones - for you. 👍 Personally, I have a hard time accepting that the 5909 'crap out' when I'm listening to electronic music and they distort in the low-end at higher listening levels. This should have been addressed in the design phase, me thinks. None of the other wireless headphones I've used or review have any problem with playing low-end at higher listening levels, like the 5909 have. I don't find the 5909 useful in passive mode, due to the lack of low-end without the built-in digital processing. That said, some of my subscribers find the 5909 best-sounding of the trio I compared, and I can understand that. Because listening to a pair of headphones is the most personal listening experience, and what I find 'great-sounding' might not be great-sounding to someone else - and vice verse. That's why it's so important to do your own listening tests, like you have done. 👍 Have a nice Sunday!
@@immersivesoundtech that is weird, I listen to a lot of EDM stuff and I have never experienced any distortion on any frequency register. Are you sure it’s not a unit issue? Have you talked to ML? Talking about low end, I wish it had a little bit more of it, more oomph for my EDM and heavy metal playlists but I am willing to sacrifice that for clarity and definition. Plus the bass on the ML may not be impressive in terms of presence and volume but definitely has immediacy and definition they couldn’t find on either Bathys or Px8s. Hopefully they can improve it through the firmware at some point. Also aesthetically I am not a big fan of the 5909s. The Px8s are to die for in terms of looks and the ones I was hoping to get, but sonic performance prevailed on my decision making process at the end. Thanks 🙏 for your feedback anyway, enjoy the rest of the weekend too man :)
ML hasn't replied back to me, but user's at Head-Fi.org are reporting the same kind of distortion in the low-end. Here's what I want you to do, enable the ANC and bass boost, and play "Imaginary Friends" by Deadmau5. Crack up the volume. Please let me know if you can to full volume without distorting the low-end. 👍 Thanks for you opinion about Bathys and Px8. I find both headphones more 'fun' to listen to in the low-end, compared to ML 5909. But we all experience sound slightly differently, especially using headphones. That's why everyone should do their own listening tests, like you and I have done. 👍 Cheers Frederick
@@immersivesoundtech I’ll certainly do the test when I get home. I use enhanced Bass most of the time, especially with EDM stuff, cause like you said I find the MLs lacking that extra oomph you get from the Px8s. But I never play them at 100% volume. Like with most audio equipment I listen around 70~80% max. I don’t want to screw up the drivers. I’ll get back to you on that one.
@@immersivesoundtech Ok, just finished the test. This is a heavy bass track to begin with and IMHO sounds better at NEUTRAL setting (more sonic balanced). Especially when you have the ANC on HIGH which adds bass by default. The recording is very bass heavy and drowns the rest of the frequencies if you don’t EQ it. But ok that’s down to personal taste. I certainly wouldn’t listen to it so heavily bass enhanced though. BUT for the purpose of our test I went with your proposed settings: BASS CONTOUR: ENHANCED ANC: HIGH SOUND VOLUME: 80% *had a listen at 90% volume but since I want to preserve the headphone drivers, and MOST importantly my hearing, I didn’t stay at that setting for more than 15-20 seconds. Verdict: honestly I didn’t hear any distortion on the low register. What I did hear is the tune pushing the limits of the headphones’ bass. In a way making it unpleasant for my ears at 90+% volume and not so enjoyable, but that’s because the bass drowns everything like a blanket and makes it less high def (for lack of a better word). Because 5909s characteristics is bass speed (rather than volume), with the bass and sound volume all the way up I find that it loses that speed and HD feeling and becomes more “boomy” but certainly not distorted. Not to my ears anyway. An effect btw that is audible with all high end equipment that I have demoed if you push the volume almost to the edge of the drivers (something you should NOT do). Sidenote: I also played the track on my B&W Formatiom Duo speakers at 70-80% volume - my neighbours were not happy 😂 Even there at high volumes and BASS at high settings I had the same effect. And the Formation’s bass goes very low btw (25Hz) but has that HD immediacy effect, which it kinda lost at those settings. So I had to reduce the BASS by -2.0 dB to achieve sonic balance, audiophile character and enjoyability of the track. I hope that helps. Great track btw and if you have other track recommendations let me know I’ll be happy to do more testing.
Thanks Frederick. Incredibly thorough review and well measured advice with a dash of humour. I also have a potato head and shortly hope to start to mix music (but not on the fly)! I was interested in how you use the Focals to mix music as I thought that there would be colouration of the sound when previously I had been advised to go with neutral sounding headphones for mixing music within a DAW. That being said I will demo the Bathys and Mark Levinson with my dealer (though don’t think they deal with B&W). Currently I love the sound I get from my closed planar Oppo Pm-3s, which are my bedroom headphones and the ones I currently relax with.
Thanks for your kind words! Mixing in headphones is tough and there's quite a long learning period - for me at least. I would have loved to be able to disable the ANC on the Bathys, to really be able to hear the finer details when working on a mix or sound editing. Also, I find the mid-range to be a little bit "too kind" when mixing, making me add more upper mid-range and treble than needed. It's of course part of the learning process to find the pros and cons of a pair of headphones when using them for work. I compared them with Focal Stellia, and then I really could hear what I'm missing, working in the Bathys. Maybe not the most fair comparison given the difference in price, but an eye-opener when it comes to sound clarity. Did you get the chance to try out Focal Bathys and Mark Levinson 5909 yourself? If so, how did they work out for you? All the best Frederick
@@immersivesoundtech Hi Frederick. Three months on and still not booked a session! I will though. As regards to mixing I think speakers will be the way to go, not headphones. Will probabaly buy some KRK Rokits as my current speakers are for hi fi, so not great for flat mixing.
@@immersivesoundtech Okay Frederick. Your reply spurred me on to approach my dealer, who has kindly leant me both headphones to test at home. I have just received the 5909s today, although I have had the Bathys for a week now. So jury is out for me at the moment, when I thought it would be a slam dunk for the Bathys after demoing them for a week. The Focal Bathys have such a wide soundstage, fantastical in a wireless ANC headphone, I love that feeling of placement in the stereo image. However even after a day, the 5909's fit better on my head, seem a lot lighter and although the soundstange isn't as wide, I am enjoying the music just as much. After a couple of hours with the Bathys, the headband irriated my bald head, I guess as it was rubbing slightly - despite fiddling with the fit of the thing. The 5909s have a nice clamping force for me and so far no issues with the headband, I moved the armature up a click on both sides and it is fine. The 5909s seem to have dropped in price too. £750, and £700 for the Bathys at the time of writing. Incidentally, did you experience and feeling of pressure change in the 5909s, when listening in ANC High mode? When I switched to ANC there was a weird feeling when I moved my head (almost akin to the spatical mode on ipod pros), but that seems to have disappeared. Maybe it's due to the use of the Bathysphere which descend to greater depths and I have got the bends from the pressure? Who knows. ;) So which do I choose?! I will let you know when I decide. Thanks again for the great review (I watched it again just for your story on the Turkish airlines)!
Hey hope you been well, would you be able to review the Dali IO-12 headphones, they seem like a strong contender to be the best bluetooth anc headphones
@@Realdjheisenberg Im going to go test them out in couple weeks, deciding bewteen them or focals or 5909, but seems like they are the ones, how is the anc on them, is there any hissing when there is no music playing?
@@jtoster4980 dead silent. You cannot begin to imagine what an experience these are to wear and operate. James Bond himself greets you, as you press the various buttons, with various messages depending how fast you scroll through the options for each buttons. I’ve never experienced anything like this with any headphones, let alone wireless. There’s no competition.
Just had a video call with product manager at Dali and he described how much work they’ve put into designing and building the Dali IO-12 wireless headphones. I will hopefully receive a pair for review next week. 🎧😀
⚠️I find the video very interesting and have extensively tested the Focal Bathys and the PX8. I kept the PX8, even though the Bathys sounds slightly better. The PX8 is more comfortable, compact, and looks better. Since I can use them better on the go, I chose the Bowers & Wilkins. The sound is still very good and better in certain genres. ⚠️What interests me is the Burn In Effect, which is highly debated. I also feel that they sound better than initially, but it could be placebo. Can this be tested? Do you have the opportunity to compare these with a new PX8 and substantiate your thesis? That would be almost worth its own video
Comfort is almost as important as the sound quality, and I can understand that you like the Px8 more. They sit very well on my head as well. Personally, I'm passionate about sharing my experience with the 'burn-in' process after having reviewed speakers and headphones in different trade magazines for more than twenty years. However, I'm not on a crusade, and 'burn-in' is a hot potato in the studio and HiFi-world. I guess it's possible to get two pairs of headphones from the same manufacturing batch, and 'burn in' one pair while the other stays in its box 'unplayed'. Then do measurements and double-blind listening tests, and try to statistically 'prove' that there is a difference in sound quality. A lot of work, and even if I would 'prove' that there is a difference in sound quality, the tests would be scrutinized by the Internet in every way possible, to prove that I'm wrong. To me, it's just not worth the time and energy. I have TONS of ideas for videos that will be more beneficial to my subscribers. Instead you have two options, take my word that there is difference or do your own listening tests. All the best Frederick
Excellent review, I really like my Px7 and even more after the firmware update. Not in a hurry though but it will probably the Px8 as you said intimate sounding.
Thanks for your kind words! 🙏 Good to hear that Bowers & Wilkins update and improve the sound quality of the Px7 too. With the latest firmware update of the Px8, the low-end performance got even better and the upper mid-range 'cleared up' a little bit. Good stuff! I've been promised Px7 headphones for reviewing by the distributor and I'm keep to get my hands on them. 😉 Also been promised to be able to review the Pi7 earbuds.
@Immersive sound tech Hoping you can help. I've purchased the PX8 and the Bathy's. I have 14 days to try them out at home. Both sound glorious but the problem I have is that both sets of headphones hurt the top of my head. The PX8 are worst offenders as they cause me jaw ache too so they are definitely going back for a refund. Unfortunately the Bathy's still cause me mild discomfort. With both pairs of headphones I have the arms fully extended out. I do have a pair of Sony XM5's but they now sound muffled by comparison. What could I try next?
Hi; thanks for this review. I can get a 5909 for 400 dollras. Does it worth it if I have already an ibasso sr2 (wired?). Better than the Bathys? I look for deatailed but also relaxing sound (for jazz, music movies ost, music from the 80...). The passive mode seems to be better on the 5909 since the Bathys (wich I am looking also too) doesn't have. Thx!
If you can buy a used pair of Mark Levinson 5909 for just $400, I think you should buy them. Try them out and if you don’t like them, you can always sell them for 400 dollar, me think.
Thanks. I’ve been using PX7 for almost 2 years and considering an upgrade. This is the video I wanted to see. I’d be happy to hear your review on the new Master and Dynamics as well 😊
@@dfk1991 focal are more comfortable for me, but I get hot ears after a while. Calls are better on Px8. Noise cancelling better on Px8. I'm listening more to focal but not disappointed when I use my Px8 either. Sorry that's probably not very helpful.
....Just My Opinion And Experience.... .... I liked the bathys focal umtil comparing it with my phillips fidelio X2HR .... Both Were Connected Wired To My Fiio BTR7 Set To LDAC and LDAC Was Set To PRIORITY ON SOUND QUALITY ....
Hello - many thanks for a great review. I think the reason the PX8s and Bathys go "quiet" when wired into an Android phone is that the DAC in the Android phone takes precedence of any external DAC. It can only be bypassed by installing third party software which costs around $10 to allow you to use alternative DACs than the one inside Android devices. Your music is then accessed via the third party software as opposed to source you are actually using (Tidal/Spotify etc etc). The 5090s can be used wired AND not powered so they are not having to overcome any "interactions" their own DAC in order to use the DAC inside the Android devices and therefore do not go "quiet". I believe that the 5090s are the only headphone of the three tested that are able to used as true wired passive headphones and this maybe worth considering if you ever are concerned regarding battery replacement. Many thanks.
I'm shopping for a pair of excellent sounding headphones and your reviews are the best I've seen. You explain the technical aspects and practical uses while also emphasizing the most important feature - the sound. I will definitely consider your top picks for my choice. Thanks for your expertise and knowledge.
Thanks for watching my videos and for your kind words! It means a lot to me. 👍 When you've made your choice, please let me know how your new headphones works out for you, okay. 🎧🎶
I own both Px8 and 5909s. However my use case is being wireless at home (office), hence I always go with passive mode and about 40-50% volume (that is more than enough for me). So both pairs are actually joyful to me :) Px8 actually is a bit more comfy and an easy goer in case of frequent distractions because of smaller clamp force and very forgiving head positioning - all that makes freeing up one ear a no brainer for short reaction to outer world event. Yes, there's transparency mode for that, but it's not well thought because user should cycle through all modes one by one to reach out to it (passive -> anc -> transparent -> passive -> ...) when each mode switch takes probably a second to apply.
That's great to know (passive optioen in 22:43). are there any other headphones ypu know that do it? Being active wireless but can be used passively with analog conection for use witha better AMP/DAC? I own the B&W P7 Wireless (the originals) and I just love them..!! But I feel that replacement is coming. Thank you.
If you love the Px7, you should definitely take a listen to the B&W Px8. They are great-sounding headphones with the same 'character' but with "extra everything". 👍
@@immersivesoundtech What a wonderful news..!! Thank you..!!! I WILL definitly try them asap..!! But I've try the Px7 the ones I own and LOVE are the P7 one generation before the Px series, and the wonderful thing of the P7 wireless is that they work completly analog if you whish it so, they can be connected to a $3,000usd rig with DAC and everything and scale accordingly since they will not be bound by the internal AMP or DAC, thus making them very versatile...
I'm struggling between Bathys and 5909, I have new neighbours and they are awful, so I have to use ANC nowadays (or earbuds). I prefer open back but of course, isolation is much more difficult. I understand ANC has an affect, however I just don't have a choice.
Neighbors...what can I say... 😐 I'm fortunate to live in my own house since almost fifteen years now, and it's really a blessing when it comes to not having any neighbors next door. If you prefer open-back headphones, you like the 'open' sound stage they usually produce, right? To my ears, Focal Bathy have more transparent-sounding ANC, and a more natural sound stage. The best thing would be for you to test both headphones, before buying. I know that it's not always possible. Good luck! Please let me know what you decided to buy and how they work out for you.
Thanks for watching my videos! I've done some travelling with the Focal Bathys, and even if they are a bit bigger, it hasn't been a problem for me. The B&W Px8 are comparatively a bit slimmer and I really enjoy them as travel partners. Lately, I've used the new Sonos ACE headphones, and even though they don't have the same sound quality as Focal Bathys, they are slimmer, lighter and very comfy.
@@immersivesoundtech I think I’ll switch from carrying a laptop with me and get an IPad. Then I can have space for bigger headphones. Problem solved! Sound quality is number 1 as a priority.
I sometimes use a pair of Campfire Mammoths for my cell phone (for walking & exercise) but because these IEMs are wired only and my new phone does not have a headphone jack (I miss my LG with quad DACs) I purchased a Bluetooth adapter for them. I purchased the iFi Go blu as it had the functionality I wanted. Supports almost all codecs (LDAC is my preferred one), has 3.5mm single ended and 4.4mm balanced outputs, and can act as a USB DAC as well - my phone's USB connector has issues but I do use it on my tablet and PC from time to time. Not trying to sound like a salesman, just wanted to mention that for people who have passive headphones they want to use with their phones without a jack. I came here to look at these 3 headphones as I am upgrading my travelling ANC headphones from the PX7's. Now I just have to find time to get to the store that has all 3 I can try. Thanks for looking at these, funny enough the ones I was hoping to see.
Hi Rob Glad to help out and good luck with listening to all three pair of headphones - they are all great in some ways. Please let me know which pair that sounds the best to you. Regarding Bluetooth adapters and DAP units - it's a Universe I have yet to explore. I think the beauty of wireless headphones is that they are wireless, but at the same time, it's cool that it's possible to bring wired headphones for travel, and be able to enjoy higher sound quality than merely using the output of your phone. 👍 Thanks for the tip! 🙏
@@immersivesoundtech Today I was able to get to a local store that I frequent and they had all three of these headphones for me to test. After listening to each pair once (to a few songs on my Qobuz HD playlist) I immediately ruled out the PX8's, there was just something about the sound I did not like, I would almost say that to me the sound is lifeless. That left me with the other 2 which I switched back and forth between a few more times. The Bathys impressed me with the sound but there was a slight underlying sibilance in the s sounds, which may be the headsets or it could be the codec I was using, but not the playlist which remained the same for all 3 pairs. Then it was the No5909's turn and they sounded, while not perfect, really good to me, with a nice bass sound I preferred over the others. I was not sure about which one I wanted and asked about the new colour (Dune I think) the Bathys was being released in which looks pretty sharp to me. However, here in Canada, that colour is exclusive to an online retailer (WTF Focal?). Some people say "go to the store and try them then order online". If everyone did that then there would be nowhere to try these things, especially something as subjective as good sounding headphones. But I really do not like to do that, plus I prefer to support my local physical retail stores and would not abandon them for an online retailer. Not for just the colour anyway.. I tried the 2 on a few times more and settled on the No5909s due to a few things, not in a specific order: Comfort - they fit my head better than any other over the ear headphones I have tried; Sound - I preferred them and the slightly "bassier" sound; LDAC - this is my favorite codec so having this was an instant plus; True passive mode is nice to have if I decide I want to listen at home on my stereo rather than phone or PC, and does not require power. Plus the retailer knocked about 10% off the price which helped in my decision as price-wise I was leaning toward the Bathys even though I mostly preferred the No5909. In case you are wondering, I got the red No5909's as I prefer the contrast between the shiny red and matte black. Thanks again for your great review!
Thanks for your report, Rob! 🙏 You have done what everyone interested in new headphones should do, try them out yourself. 👍 And I'm glad you found the best wireless headphones - for you. One think to think about when trying out active wireless headphones in stores - and I say this as much to myself - is the importance of downloading the app for each headphones, connect to each headphones via Bluetooth and check the settings. Because I have, at several times, auditioned wireless headphones at stores, only to find them 'strange sounding' and then taken the time to connect to the headphones and reset the settings - which were quite 'all over the place'. I too, think the Sony LDAC codec is currently the best codec available for Bluetooth.
With music. I create a one-hour playlist in one of my portable media players, and include a five-minute sound file with just silence. So, 55 minutes of music, five minutes of silence, and then played in repeat for two-three weeks, preferably.
Thanks for asking! Yes, I have. My Dali IO-12 review is in the making. I've just been so tremendously busy lately. But, please stay tuned for a detailed review of the IO-12. ☺️
I have reached out to Band & Olufsen and asked if they could send me a pair of Beoplay H95 headphones for review, but unfortunately they declined my request due to lack of units for demo purposes right now.
@@BoronAlloyWell, I prioritise the manufacturers that take the time and effort to send me headphones for review. If B&O had any interest in my opinion, they would have sent me a pair of H95 for review.
I have a Focal Bathys. I've used it in DAC mode with my (Android) Samsung Zflip5 without the volume loss that you described, and enjoyed very good sound quality. You didn't mention one of the best features of the Focal app that provides a hearing test for the user and adjusts the Bathys' EQ to compensate somewhat for the user's high frequency hearing loss (which is significant in my case). Compared to my Sony XM5 headphones, the Sony has better noise cancelling, but the Bathys sounds better. In wireless mode, I'm using the AptX codec with either my Samsung phone or Astell&Kern DAP. I get the very best sound from my Bathys when connected with an analog cable to my A&K Kann Alpha.
I'm glad to hear that you like your Focal Bathys - they're are great-sounding headphones. I agree that the Sony XM5 headphones have stronger ANC, but that the Bathys ANC sound much better. The Mimi hearing test functionality wasn't available when I reviewed the headphones, it was introduced with a firmware update almost a year later. When needed, I think it's a nice functionality, and I'm glad that it works well for you. I don't have need for it (yet), but it's good to know that it's available. 👍 The A&K Kann Alpha looks like a really nice DAP. I get the best sound quality when connecting the Bathys via USB-C and set them DAC Mode. Works really well both with an iPhone using an Apple Camera Adapter and directly connected to my laptop. 👍
Fredrick, you are the best when it comes to reviewing equipment, thanks. I purchase based off of your videos and so far have been spot on. I own the Bathys and the PX8’s with the 5909’s currently being shipped to me so I can’t comment on those. As far as the other two are concerned I like them both sound quality wise however I find the build quality of the Focals superior to the B&W’s. The PX8 shortcomings, for me are the cup size which I find a little small and thus not as comfortable as the Focals and the buttons on the PX8 I find to be cheap. Especially the on/off switch which wiggles and doesn’t slide as nicely as the Focals. Small issues. I’ll let you know my thoughts on the 5909’s, should have them by early next week. Keep up the good work. Nick in California.
Thanks for your kind words and for your report! Glad to hear that my videos have been of help to you. 👍 Regarding testing headphones, it's so important to do what you have done, test them yourself. I actually like the tighter fit of the B&W Px8 headphone cups and I think they fit better when I lay down in bed listening to music - it's a personal think. I'd say that how the headphones fit is almost as important as how they sound - especially if you plan to use them for long listening sessions. That said, I love how the Focal Bathys fit too - more like a pair of "studio headphones" that I'm so used to work with as a sound engineer. Please let me know how you fancy the Mark Levinson 5909. Cheers Frederick
Update: I currently own 4 ANC Wireless headphones (PX8, 5909, H95, & Bathys) so one had to go. I'm currently reviewing the H95 and 5909 which I anticipate should be fine with the intent of dumping the PX8 which I find uncomfortable (ear cups too small) and inferior sound quality in my opinion. I did season them for over 100 hours and really saw no improvement. Just thought I'd let you know as a follow up. thanks man@@immersivesoundtech
@@jtoster4980 I own the Solitaire T which I failed to mention since I rarely use them and find them way over priced and inferior to the Bathys which sound better and are a much better price value. I love the sound of the H95’s which I also feel are superior to the overpriced Solitaire T’s. Have not tried the Dali IO-12 as yet and have purchased them on your recommendation. I find sound quality to be quite subjective and genre dependent. Thanks for your reply.
I have to focal bathys which sound superb especially with the latest firmware which added mimi hearing adjustments. I recommend anyone who owns the focals to run the mimi hearing adjustments, it really opens them up.
It's nice feature that Focal added without saying much about it. Personally, I don't need it and when adding treble and upper mid-range, it sounded slightly 'processed', to me. However, if it 'opens up' the sound stage for you and other users, then perfect. It's worth trying out. 👍
Great review Frederick…i am thinking of purchasing the ML 5909 but only when price drops. I’ve owned Bowers headphones before, PX7 to be precise, but found them too bassy for my liking and a little muddy in the high end. I have had the Bathys for over a year and find them as you do, absolutely stunning soundwise. I don’t care about battery death in years to come, i’ll pay what it takes to be replaced by Focal, in DAC mode with the basic Focal usb c cable into Apple camera adapter they sound just fantastic, for the money, they are a gift 😀👍
The Focal Bathys are mighty fine headphones, and it is possible to change the battery when it eventually dies. I have DIY instructions how to do it from a user on the Internet. You can even fit a slightly larger battery and, in theory, get even more battery life. 👍
For what it's worth, the PX7 are trash compared to the PX8. That being said, the Bathys is noticeably more detailed when listening in quiet environments, and have a wider soundstage than the PX8. But, I think the PX8 has a slightly more natural timbre and are more fun (but still a very controlled, tight sound) when listening to modern music. The PX8 are also much better than the Bathys when used as travel or commuting headphones...which is what most ANC headphones are designed to be.
I'm trying to get both B&W Px7 S2 and S2E for a review as viewers are asking about my opinion about them. I haven't heard either of them yet. As you say, the Bowers & Wilkins Px8 are great travel partners. 👍 In my ears, the Focal Bathys have a more natural timbre, although slightly 'rolled off' in the treble, with a bigger and deeper sound stage. But I agree that the Px8 are more 'fun' to listen to most of the time. I just love how they sound, whereas Bathys almost makes me forget that I'm listening to a pair of headphones. I'm a happy camper owning both pair of headphones. 😉
@@immersivesoundtechfinally got the ML5909 in Radiant Red and boy they are beautiful and sound stunning..i was tempted to sell my Bathys to finance them but i just can’t do it, they are not as classy as the ML but they still sound fantastic in comparison. I have 4 bikes so one of them is going😀
Yes, I would say that it would be quite an upgrade. 👍 If possible, the best way to do it, is to audition the Px8 at a local HiFi-store - before making the decision.
I have both the Bathys and px8. I have a preference for the bathys, with a better sound and a much more confortable fit (the px8 is too tight on my head). It is perfect f you can sit on a plane or a train. I use the PX8 on the go (subway, walking) because I do not feel confortable wearing such a large headphone as the bathys in public areas. No big difference in ANC.
Thanks for your comment. I also use the Px8 when travelling and mostly the Bathys when I'm at home listening to music. Both headphones are mighty fine. 🎶👍
What is your equalizer setting for the PX8 (with current firmware 3.0.0)? I take the bass down a bit and raise the treble. I'm curious what an expert likes.
Thanks for you question. With the latest firmware 3.0 - and with the ANC enabled - I've found the best balance by setting the BASS -1.5dB and the TREBLE at 0. I rarely add treble when listening to headphones, because I think it spoils the 'magic' and reveal that I'm listening to headphones. I rather let my ears get used to the sound stage. Though, the Px8 filters sound rather good, so it is possible to set the TREBLE +2dB which will make the sound stage a bit more intense rather than more 'open'. It's a personal thing, so if you like adding a bit of treble, go for it! :-) Cheers Frederick
@@immersivesoundtech Thanks for your answer. I do something similar with the PX8. Lower the bass a little and raise the treble slightly. greetings Alex
Really like your reviews. Sounded like you were being diplomatic towards the end not to upset anyone but I could tell deep down your favourite cans are the Focal Bathys 🤭 I've also had the chance to test these against the Px8 and decided to keep the Bathys! Not been able to hear the Mark Levinson but don't think I need to after watching most of the reviews on these against the Focal Bathys. Anyway am I right?
Thanks for your kind words! Well, I'm not trying to be diplomatic, not at all. Just highlighting the pros and cons of all three and put them in perspective with each other. If you read some of the other comments, you will see that different taste is very much at play. What sounds great to me, might not sound great to you. And that's the way it should be. To me, the headphone listening experience is the most personal listening experience. And you have taken the time to compared the Px8 and Bathys - and that's the way to do it. Whether you should listen to the Mark Levinson 5909 or not, I think it's always interesting to compare things. 👍 On the other hand, do you feel anything lacking with the sound of the Focal Bathys? 😉
Well I think Focal's first entry into this market is outstanding and bodes well for future models. Is there anything lacking, well I'm certainly no expert at this unlike yourself but I can only hope that future models bring even more details across the spectrum and clearer and punchier bass. For example I own a pair of Sennheiser over ear audiophile cans and these are even clearer and more detailed where certain sounds pop but they are no where near as punchy and dynamic as the Focals. The Px8 does better on certain tracks and is more bass heavy than the Bathys but the overall presentation of sound is superior on the Bathys in my opinion. All said I found the Bass in the Px8 can be fatiguing and I'm not sure if it is doing ones ears any favours. So the Focal could make a future model with yet even more clearer and detailed sound, slightly more punchy bass (nit picking) but keep the same wonderful open sound signature. For now I'm thoroughly enjoying my Focal Bathys and once I start listening to music on them I have a job to get them off! Just to add I'm not bothered by a super impressive ANC so this doesn't affect me and yes the cans leak a bit of sound compared with say the Px8 but this is probably necessary not to sacrifice the comfort and sound quality. So far this is not an issue for me. And as said enjoying your reviews and the way you deliver them 👍
Thanks for your kind words Michael! 🙏 Like I say in the video, the B&W Px8 are growing on me. Not as 'detailed', 'wide' or 'dynamic' as the Bathys, but still great-sounding, intimate sound stage and super-comfy on my big head. 😃 I agree, the Focal Bathy sound great! Regarding the low-end performance, I think they sound better than many wired and more expensive headphones do. Like I say in my videos, I think Focal has digitally worked on the phase response in the low-end, because it's so coherent with the rest of the frequency spectrum - something not possible to do in the analogue domain (read: with passive headphones). Personally, I would love to hear them with the ANC disabled, because my guess is that the low-end would be even 'better' and even more 'punchy', and the slightly recessed treble would 'open up'. But that's just my guess. Also, I would love to have a Bathys Signature model with Beryllium cones - think an active version of Focal Stellia. That would have the potential of becoming the 'best' headphones on the market, don't you think? 😃 When I have the time, I plan to make a video comparing Focal Bathys with Focal Stellia. I have a pair of Stellia as well and I think they sound amazing. I'm lost for hours listening to music on them. 🎵❤️
I've read up on those Focal Stellia and they've had incredible reviews. What HiFi said as you're probably aware that these headphones are most likely the best sounding closed backed headphones to date (the closed back version of the award winning Utopia) And I totally agree, I would love Focal to design a future edition of these great Bathys using Beryllium cones. Next time I'm heading to a hifi shop I'll try and listen to those stellia cans, problem is I'll be tempted to save for a set and my family will have to do without a holiday 😂 Hopefully What HiFi show in Bristol next year will have these in one of their demonstration rooms. Because of my situation at present and not being able to listen to my music on speakers due to young children and the addition of a baby I can justify purchasing a good set of cans. Only recently discovered Focal as I've been more familiar with Sennheiser and B&W but I'm kind of hooked by this make now and excited to see what happens next. I look forward to your next review of the Focal Bathys vs stellia but I won't be surprised if the Stellia blows them out of the water, after all they have a huge price tag! Thanks again
Me too... 😃 I have now contacted the press department at Master & Dynamic and presented myself, and their Founder & CEO replied within minutes. Now that's professional conduct. 👍 He's going to send me a pair of MW75 headphones for review. Have a nice weekend!
The Master & Dynamic MW75 headphones are in my possession now, and are 'breaking in' in my control room. It's going to be really interesting reviewing them. 👍
chaps leauge ! hard to make a choice between these really. all great. I owned previously Focal it was sounding good. but i always wonder how ML sounds compared to Bathys :D since I have currently B&W PI7 S2 earbuds. i know their sound signature. I'll probably buy ML 5909 very soon. its making me excited.:) great review as always thanks for it
Can I just say the B&W look great in that colour also dont look like ear defenders like the other two. P.S I am a B&W fan own a few speakers Zeppelin and the Z2
Great video! I would suggest checking out the Edifier Spirit Stax S3 headphone that's a planar magnetic Bluetooth headphone for a lower price. It would be interesting to have a comparison between the Focal Bathys and the Stax S3.
The Bathys Can Connect to iPhone usb c in DAC mode. The 5909 has the direct digital ability. But Can the 5909 connect to an iPhone via usb c and work as a DAC with their 24/96 converter?
Hi Jesper I haven't upgraded to iPhone 15 Pro yet, so I don't know if the 5909 can be used that way. My guess is that they can, but maybe someone else can chime in and answer you question. I can't wait to throw all our Apple lightning cables in the trash. Just need to save up for four iPhone 15 to cover the whole family. Ah well... 💵🤩 Thanks Frederick
I can confirm the 5909's work well with the iPhone 15 Pro through USB-C and sound great (Hi-res, MQA, etc). Because it's passive you don't get the options you get via BT with the app, so no bass enhancement, no volume control or play/pause, but the noise cancelling modes still work using the button on the left ear-cup.
Friend, tell me some headphones or a hi-fi player with physical keys to rewind tracks 10 seconds forward or backward. and not just switching tracks forward back, do such things even exist?
Anybody any idea why my px8 volume is considerably lower than when i listen via Bluetooth. I am connecting to samsung note 20 ultra. Have double checked all volume limits and nothing is limiting it. Bluetooth sounds great but when i connect usb c to usb c the volume is very low. Any ideas?
Take the B&O H95 to the test and you’ll have a new nr.1! Tweak the EQ slightly to mid-right and you’ll be sold. Few years on the market now, but still in a league of their own. Not for nothing still Flossy Carters no.1! But tastes differ I realize that, just my opinion on headphones after months of testing. Cheers!
Thanks for your comment! I have listened to the Bang & Olufsen Beoplay H95 headphones a couple of times, and while nice-sounding, they didn't blow me away. The filter opportunities are both a blessing and a curse, because as a listener you can really change the sound, and in the hands of a novice user, that might be overwhelming. I have reached out to Bang & Olufsen and asked for a pair of H95, but they didn't have a pair available for review.
For me, the codecs need to support uncompressed 16 bit/44.1 kHz format before seriously plopping down over $500 for a wireless solution. LDAC is almost there but it needs to 1.5x to support true CD quality. Forget about Hi-Res. That is so far into the future. If I want to enjoy SQ, I sit down and go with the wired solution.
Understood, and I know how you reason. I want that sound quality too, and LDAC sound great to me, and Qualcomm is releasing apTX lossless soon. Great things are in the making. That said, I have a blast listening to both B&W Px8 and Focal Bathys via Apple AAC on iPhone. 👍
@@buttoxbrown I would think it very unlikely, for two reasons. 1) The hardware can’t be updated to include the codec 2) B&W would probably prefer (as they’re primarily an audio device manufacturer, not a software company) to sell you the solution in the form of PX8 version 2 or PX9. With LDAC, and ApTX Lossless, I wonder how Apple will respond, if at all. They may maintain that the vast majority of people cannot hear any appreciable difference between AAC, and other high bandwidth lossless formats.
Well, WavPack is a lossy or lossless codec for shrinking music files into smaller size - it's not a BlueTooth transmission codec. It is up to your media player to support WavPack files, if that's what you are using to archive you ripped CDs. 👍 As far as I know, the most supported lossless codec in media players is FLAC - and it works great.
How is the bass on these? Anyone? I have some Focal Clear and they bass on these are very thin. I don´t want to buy these and have two pair of expensive headphones with low bass. Are the Bathys good with techno and electronic music? Because the Clear is not, so I use those for classic and jazz music mostly.
Andrea, I have reached out to T+A Elektroakustik and asked about headphones for review, but never heard back from them. So, no reviews planned of them unfortunately.
@@immersivesoundtechvery interested in hearing your findings on the Dali IO 12. I am considering buying them this week. I tried the ML 5909 with a range of music and needed the volume at maybe 80% or more. Just felt I’d like to have more volume in the tank if required. Hoping the Dalis have a wider volume range. Do you have an initial view on this? Thanks and happy new year.
The Dali IO-12 headphones have a wider volume range compared to the Mark Levison 5909. 👍 Let me know how they work out for you, okay. All the best Frederick
I have an iPhone, I'm looking for a great audio quallity pair of headphones, intending to occasionally use them with wire for lossless audio, can afford only one, which one of these would you recommend me to buy? or should I get a DAC and use wired headphones?
Thanks for watching my review! If you want a pair of headphones that sound 'fun' och 'musical' then try out the Bowers & Wilkins Px8. And if you want the most sound quality, wide sound stage and depth then try out the Focal Bathys. Let me know how they work out for you, okay. Cheers Frederick
I've listened to several reviews of both the B&W and Focal headsets. This review was the most informative, most humorous (great sense of humor) and most well-considered that I've found in the RUclips space. I subscribed and look forward to more from your channel.👏👏👏
Glad you enjoyed it! 😃
Hola! Thanks for this review! I’m going to buy a usbc cable to lightning for use the DAC of the focal Bathys on my iphone 14 and wondering if you can recommend any cable in particular, thanks again
Seen quite some review vids regarding the PX8, and u r the only one so far who’s mentioned the difference in sounds quality after a certain period of breaking them in. That info is incredibly valuable, thank u so much for that!!
Glad I could help!
And if you hear your spouse talking to you, simply push this button and you can't hear them anymore.
Yeah, most of all, it's a great way to 'get even' with my two teenagers when they call for daddy and I show up with big headphones on, looking them in the eyes while they speak to me, and then answer..."what?" 🤣
:D
Hahahaha
I love your reviews. Well detailed, honest and your voice is calming. For me, I love my Focal Bathys. As soon as I started listening in them, I knew I'm going to love it. I fell in love with their sound stage and overall quality. I am thoroughly impressed.
Glad you like them!
Focal are really good………love them
How about walking or travelling with them? Aren't they too large/heavy?
Very good review. Feeling the same way towards my Px8. Not the typical audiophile sound, yet I just connect with its musicality. That closeness is magic on some recordings.
Thanks for your kind words!
Yes, the Px8 are very 'musical' sounding - close, intimate sound stage.
@@immersivesoundtech amazing video, is it worth it to spend £100 more for the bathys? Also would love to see you review the b and o Ex ear buds vs astell and kern uw100mk2 vs bowers and Wilkins pi7s2
@@WhatTheFragrance Thanks for your kind words!
You really have to take a listen to both Bathys and Px8 to find out which one that sounds the best - to you.
And also figure out which one that fits your head the best.
Reviewing B&W Pi7 S2 right now and I will compare them with Apple AirPods Pro 2 because they are roughly the same price (and my son wears them pretty much 24/7).
Let me think about reviewing other earbuds okay. 👍
@@WhatTheFragrance they are very-very different🙂
I came to your video to decide on what to save up for whether it be the Focal Bathys ANC BT Headphones or the Bowers and Wilkins Px8 headphones. I found you very likeable, professional and genuine. You seem like a very humble person which is very refreshing.
Glad I could help!
I think you described the attributes and sound of the B&W Px8 headphones very, very well! As you hint at, no headphones can do it all depending on the user's preferences and use environment. Many thanks!!!
Really great video. So informative. Will there be a test of the T+A Solitaire T?
Thanks for your kind words! 🙏
The T+A Solitaire T headphones looks really interesting and are definitely worth reviewing. Thanks for the tip!
I've reached out to the manufacturer suggesting a review, let's see what they answer.
Cheers
Fred
Great video Frederick. I always love to hear other people's opinions on sound gear. For me it was always the ML. I really enjoy the PX8 and the Bathys (2nd fav) but the sound I get from the 5909 is just so clean and balanced. I agree it does seem to have less boomy bass when compared to the PX8, but there's an almost gutteral growl in the sub-bass that the other two just can't seem to hit which sounds so damn good lol. It's the passive audio from the 5909 that made the biggest impression on me though. If you're just running the wire straight from your phone I agree that the DAC mode on the Bathys has a slight upper hand especially if you're connecting to an Iphone, but if you connect the 5909 to a DAC or DAP that thing puffs it's chest out BIG TIME. Even when running it from an IFI Go Bar and IFI Go Blu I was shocked how the sound from the 5909 reminded me so much of the DCA Aeon 2 Noire and Focal Radiance
Totally agree on the bass matter! I also find it very joyful to enable bass extension in the app, however it quickly becomes fatiguing (drum & bass and other bass heavy music) :)
That's why it's so important to do your own listening tests of different headphones. 👍
Hi I enjoyed this review, very detailed and I agree these will all be fantastic headphones so it will be the horses for courses analogy. Are you able to do a comparison between the focal bathys and the Dali IO-12 please, I'm looking for a true to source sound using my sp3000 or as close as poss lol thank you subscribed
What a great review. I've been trying to get a decent review between these three headphones. Think I'll go with the Focals
Thanks for your kind words! Appreciated! 🙏
Good luck with the Focal Bathys! 🎵😃
good choice
Great comparison video as always. You mentioned being able to connect the Focals to your iPhone with a cable to get a better sound quality. I have a pair of the B&W and I use a USB-C to USB-C cable that is included to connect to my iPhone 15 Pro Max. The 24-bit/192 kHz Hi-Res audio sounds incredible via Bluetooth, but plugged in it sounds even better. Like amazingly better! It is less compressed than it is via Bluetooth and at least 25% or more louder. Jut incredible.
I bought my son a pair of the B&W for Christmas and he has commented that they are the best sounding headphones he's ever heard and the quality is so clean that its almost as if the musicians are in the room with you. I have been a musician myself (not professionally) for 30 years and these B&W headphones have changed the way I listen to music.
Thanks Kevin for your post. Much appreciated.
I plan to upgrade to iPhone 15 Pro as soon as I can - mostly to get rid of the lighting port (that's slowing down my work when trying to export videos filmed with my iPhone 14 Pro).
Your report just made my decision even more easy.
Glad to hear that your son is so happy with his B&W Px8. What a great way to teach your kids about the wonders of HiFi sound. 😃
I also think they sound great and as you point out, listening to them via USB-C cable, they sound even better.
Saving up for that iPhone 15 Pro. 😉
Great review! Did you ever try the B&O Beoplay h95 or h100?
Thanks for your kind words, Nash! Much appreciated!
I've reached out to B&O, asking for headphones to review. Unfortunately they couldn't accommodate my request.
I don't have the financial means to buy headphones to review, so for now, I will only be able to review headphones sent to me from the manufacturer.
Hi Frederick, I am loving your videos. Any chance you can try the Edifier Stax Spirit S3 and give your opinion on how they sound and compare to these ones sound quality-wise? They are planar magnetics wireless with no ANC, and are cheaper than these three.
Thanks for your kind words.
I will try to look into reviewing them - got lots of headphones in the pipeline.
Well your video convinced me to give the PX8 a second go! I just re-ordered them them after giving my original PX8 headphones to my son-in-law. I didn't like the bass of my originally owned PX8. I do believe in the benefits of break-in, and also am convinced my "brain" does adapt to the sound of a headphone over time. I know there are many naysayers regarding break in of audio equipment. Hey, whatever works for the individual listener!
Well spoken and thanks for watching my videos. Highly appreciated!
So, please let me know how the Px8 sound now that you've 'broken them in'.
Cheers
Frederick
Thank you for this very decent review and a deep dive into the world of sound engineers ;-) You are a very sympathic and enjoyable listen-to person and I really enjoyed this video! Thank you for all the brunch of detailed and hand picked information. All the best to Sweden!
Thanks for your kind words! Highly appreciated!
I wish you a nice and relaxing weekend! 🎧🎶
I've been researching for the next headphones, to upgrade from my existing Sennheiser Momentum 4s.
This is by far the best review of my top three candidates. Truly exceptional amount of detail conveyed in simple language for anyone to understand.
Thank you!!!
Glad I could help!
Cuales elegiste finalmente?
I had both momentum 4 and bathys....for that much difference in the money momentum 4 is the best bet.
Great review and quite informative! Thank you so much.
You mention breaking in the headphones, how do you go about this?
Thank you, Tim!
I'm talking about 'break in' in my Focal Bathys and B&W Px8 videos, so please take a look at them.
I plan to do a proper video about 'burning in' headphones and speakers.
It's quite a controversial subject, so I'm working up energy to deal with the naysayers and antagonists.
Well I did get my new PX8s (McLaren edition) and they’re gorgeous. They are quite tight in my opinion and as you said should loosen up over time.
As for breaking, I’m in your camp on this one, we have Hi-Fi stuff at home -basic KEF gear with Arcam amp and cd player but they needed to be broken in as well, can’t see why headphones would be different.
Thanks again, great video! I’ll find the other videos!
The McLaren edition colors look great - envious eyes over here. 😍
Yes, in my experience, headphones are no exception and need to be 'broken in' before doing any proper evaluation of the sound quality and sound stage.
I'd even go as far as saying that the benefits of 'break in' are more obvious in headphones, than in a pair of speakers, because there are less variables at play, evaluating the sound quality.
With speakers, you have the room acoustics that play a big part of the sound and if you just sit a little bit closer or further away, the sound with slightly alter in character - making it harder to distinguish the possible differences.
Also, there is less equipment involved, evaluating a pair of headphones and they pretty much fit the same on your head, each time you put them on.
And they are much easier to break in by just leaving them in a closet playing 24/7 for a couple of weeks.
With a pair of speakers, that can be tough for a normal user - having them play around the clock in the living room.
Lucky for me, I have a separate control room where I position new speakers and subwoofers, and let them play 24/7 without disturbing anyone.
That's why I know what a difference proper 'break in' do to most speakers, headphones and equipment.
Let me know what you think of my other videos, okay. 👍
Cheers
Fred
Now THAT is a nice room.
I preferred the Bathys . My personal sound preferences were more accommodated by the focals . I also preferred the feel of the build quality and the looks . I like the case and app they provide. Everything they supplied just did it for me . I think I gravitate to the Focal sound as I have 4 Focal headphones and a pair of Choras w Dolby atmos and a center channel speaker .I also have sennheiser , Hifiman ,and Empyriums . Focal is such a incredible company despite being French. These headphones sound like crap in my opinion wired . They r intended to be used wireless.
Hello from Mexico , thank you very much for this incredible video ! I have the bowers and Wilkins px8, would you replace the type c to 3.5 mm cable that comes with the headphones with a more professional cable? If so, what cable would you use? I will be very grateful for your comment
Hi Paco! Thanks for watching my videos! 👍
If you are using that cable, sure it can most likely be swapped to a 'better' one. Cables are important.
Unfortunately, I have no suggestion for you right now.
Maybe someone else here can suggest a good cable.
I plan to address the importance of cables in future videos.
Thank you for the great review! I recently purchased a Bathys at a really good price in Australia, and I'm quite pleased with it. However, I didn't find it as comfortable as some others have mentioned. I also wish it had a bit more bass, and the treble is a bit too sharp for my liking.
Sound-wise, you should let them 'burn-in' for a couple of weeks, and the sound stage will settle. Then evaluate if you like how they sound or not. 👍
Regarding the comfort, there is only one way to know, and it is trying them out yourself, like you have.
And how do they sound after a couple of months? Did you change the EQ?
Thank you for this video,this is the right stuff! One question : I do listen a lot of club music with lots of Bass,Which one of these Headphones do you recommend?
Thanks for your kind words! Highly appreciated!
If you want a low-end that digs deep and still sound 'punchy' and vibrant, I would recommend listening to the Focal Bathys.
And if you like a slightly overblown but punchy and 'fun' low-end, go for the Bower & Wilkins Px8 with the ANC enabled.
Personally, I also love bass (I started my sound engineering career as a DJ back in the late 80ies) and I still can't quite decide which headphones I like the best for club music.
If you like to listen loud - which you shouldn't do - the Px8 are definitely better. The louder you play em, the 'better' they sound.
Hope this helps.
Let us know which you decide to buy and how they work out for you, okay.
All the best
Frederick
Just got the bathys and they are awesome.
Great video.✔️I'm thinking about buying the bathys but I didn't know if it was too big for me. I had the px8 and found it very stylish - unfortunately I didn't like the sound in many genres... but you say you should use it longer. I'm not sure whether I should buy it again.
Any normal head size or larger won't have any problem wearing the Bathys and the only wearing issues you could possibly face are a feeling like the ear pads come a little close to the jaw if your head runs a little on the smaller side or that you stand out cause they look so different from the usual BT headphone style. Other than that they're IMO one of the most comfortable wireless headphones around. As far as sound goes between the 3 it's way too subjective and it really boils down to your listening style. If you didn't care too much for the PX8's sound before then the burn-in probably won't make that much of a difference to change your mind. The PX8, as you've probably noticed, has a very energetic sound with a bit of a bass boost so it does really well with genres that emphasize that (hip-hop, rap, Dance, electronica, pop). The only downside to the PX8 is that because of that tuning, while it does sound really good in general, things like vocals or genres that emphasize the upper region (classical, jazz, rock) can sound a little washed out by the bass or not give you the instrument separation you would get on something like the Bathys or 5909. On the flipside if you do prefer those energetic and bass heavy sounds then the Bathys and 5909 won't come quite as close to hitting them as the PX8 can (though to me 5909 sounds the cleanest). This is what I've personally found between the 3: Bathys has the widest soundstage, the best transparency, the best app and custom eq, and a very balanced sound albeit sometimes sounding a little dull with the burn-in making it slightly warmer (though the DAC mode sounds fantastic). The PX8, like I said earlier, lends it's energy to a very clean and slightly harder bass, has better ANC and a very responsive and "fun" sound. The 5909 is the most balanced of the 3 to me with great ANC (maybe tie with PX8), a very comfy fit, best case and accessories, and the cleanest sound that focuses on attenuation and separation. It's also the only one of the 3 that can play passively without any battery power. My favorite tends to be the 5909 followed by the Bathys. They're just great all-arounders plus there's enough differences to set them apart from most other headphones out there but none of them are a bad choice AT ALL since they all sound so damn good. It just comes down to what usually sounds good to you. I will also add that the 5909 is the only one of the 3 that easily connects to Dacs and Daps which makes them sound even better!
Hi Alexander!
Well, you have tried out the B&W Px8 and if you didn't like the sound, my suggestion is that you try out the Focal Bathys - maybe they will better present the music as you would like to hear it.
On the other hand, sounds like you didn't 'break in' the Px8 properly before evaluating the sound - so you really haven't experienced the full 'glory'.
That said, it's not a night-or-day difference, after they are properly 'broken in', so my suggestion is to try out the Focal Bathys.
Please let us know how they work out for you.
Good luck!
Frederick
What a great review and very interesting. The B&W has my interest. I would use them for music laying in bed and for travel. I actually just bought a pair of Bose QC45 but those are going back to the dealer since they sound unbalanced between the right and left channel
Personally, I love using the B&W Px8 for travel.
Well worth trying out. 👍
@@immersivesoundtech Thank you. Can I ask you if you have tested video delay? Some wireless headphones unfortunately have a visible delay between video and sound
Well, all wireless headphones have latency - especially when they are set to high sound quality codecs.
As of now and as far as I know, there is no workaround other than adjusting for that latency in your media player, TV or iPad app.
And if the lip sync or latency can't be adjusted, the only way is to lower the sound quality of the Bluetooth transmission and thus get a bit lower latency - in some cases.
This is definitely a subject for a future video of mine.
Thanks for the question, and if someone of my subscribers knows more about the subject, please feel free to comment.
Thank you Frederick, keep them coming
Good review. My only question is how can you mow your lawn - with all kinds of dust, pollen, etc flying around - with such expensive headphones lol.
It's a tough job being a RUclipsr. 💪😃😉
Nice dossier , just got my B&W yesterday, did the firm update and I am so satisfied. No LDAC but still keep my old sonys XM3. Perfect fit , sound and price 680$. Keep the sound up🎉cheer .
Great to hear! 👍
How does the aptx codec sound with the px8's from Android? What is the bandwidth?
Fantastic information review. Thanks!. I love my focal bathys 🎧.
Thanks for watching! 😃
Hi! Great video. 3 days ago I bought the px8 and they give me the impression of being muddy and boomy with no definition, I decided to give them a try and give them too much use and I need to say that 20 hrs later they sound so much better , I believe you that in 100 or plus hours they will sound even better. Thanks!
Thanks for you input!
Yes, the headphones will in my experience both open up and become more firm in the low-end, as they are 'broken in'.
Just leave them playing overnight for a couple of weeks, and they will keep on giving. 🎶👍
Great review, i suscribe to your channel, im between px8 and bathys, which one you think is better in terms of sound quality? Im not interested on anc mode, thanks a lot
Thanks for your kind words!
It's really apples or oranges, both headphones sound great - in their own way.
Focal Bathys are more transparent and natural-sounding - although the ANC can't be disabled.
B&W Px8 sound more 'fun' with an 'inflated' low-end when the ANC is enabled. With the ANC off, they sound a bit too thin for my taste.
I love both headphones. 🎶❤️
The best is if you're able to compare them yourself, before buying. 👍
I ordered the black PX8 because the Focal is too massive for me. The PX8's sound is outstanding, but I find the sound very mixed in some pop songs. I'm curious whether there really is a burn-in. I'm happy to report.
Good for you.
Yes, rest assure, your B&W Px8 will just sound better and better, the more you 'burn' them in. It will mostly be audible in the low-end and the upper mid-range.
Please let us know how they work out for you over time. 👍
Thank you soo much I was soo curious of your thoughts when it comes to these 3 big names in bluetooth headphones market.
Glad I could help! 😃
@@immersivesoundtech May I ask do you know by any chance how different B&W px8 are over px7? I own a px7 I am pretty satisfied but I wish they had more details and be less boomy I wonder if px8 is a big improvement over these. Also can mark levinson n5909 be connected to a DAC like I heard you can do that only when you have them completely discharged.
I haven't listened to the B&W Px7 S2 or S2E, but hopefully the distributor will send me a pair for review. Working on it. 👍
The Mark Levinson 5909 can be used passively by connecting a special cable that is included in the carry case, and hooked up to an external DAC with headphone output.
@@immersivesoundtechThank you soo much for quick reply I hope your channel will get more views, your content is soo underrated man. There are a few people that have the balls to review these top tier bluetooth headphones.
Thanks for your kind words Zajko! Highly appreciated!
If you have the time, please spread the word about my channel on Facebook and Internet forums. That would help me a lot.
Right now I'm getting closer and closer to be able to apply for the RUclips affiliate program - which will enable me to do more videos and reviews, get access to more creator tools and start monetizing all the work I've put into my channel.
Hehe, I've spend hundreds of hours working on this channel, and have yet to receive a dollar for my work. It's all done on my spare time, 'pro bono' for you guys.
It's all based on my passion for music and music technology, and my new passion for filming, editing and making videos.
So, any help promoting my channel is highly appreciated. 🙏
I have great plans for this channel and tons of ideas for new videos that I think will be both educational and entertaining to watch.
Have a nice and relaxing Sunday!
Frederick
Which suits the biggest head sizes? I am unable to try the different models as I am disabled and live in a rural area. Many headphones do not fit my large noggin and have excessive clamp force; eg Beyer Dynamic T1 or Bose QC35. Sennheiser HD650 is just OK, Meze 99 with strap removed, best fit ever was the Denon AHD7000. So I need best sound quality and largest size, noise cancelling a secondary issue.
My brain's symetry fixation congratulates you for your background and shot setup.
Also, I think if you're supposed to "break in" the BW for 500 hours for them to start sounding good, that's reason enough not to buy them.
Great video! new sub. A Bathys enjoyer
Thanks you!
Well, I'm rather picky when setting up my control room for video shooting and it's cumbersome to get the right depth-of-field, picture composition and proper lighting. Thanks for noticing. 🙏
I have now invested in a 7-inch portable video monitor which will me do a proper set up fast and more accurate - at least I hope it will.
Regarding 'break-in', my experience - after having reviewed headphones in trade magazine for over twenty years - is that all factory-new headphones benefit being properly "broken in", so don't judge the Px8 by that 'fact'.
When you have bought a new pair of headphones, I think it's good practice to have them play around the clock for a couple of weeks.
All designs and cone materials are different, so there is no general rule how many hours that are needed, but if you exercise them for a couple of weeks, they will be "broken in".
I know this is a controversial topic, but my findings are based on empirical findings having reviewed a lot headphones through the years.
How big is the difference between Px7s2 and Px8?
I had the Px5 and Px7 and both were pretty similar in sound, however the glue from Px7 earcups did not last that long.
Then I checked the Bose Quietcomfort and the Quietcomfort ultra.
On default settings the Quietcomfort Ultra is on par with Px7 & Px7s2 for me (even after burn in). However the immersive audio makes the ultra superior for me. This is something the Px7s seem to be quite behind.
So I am wondering if the Px8 have the same weakness. At least the Rtings review pointed that out
I haven't had the chance to compare the B&W Px7s2 and Px8 yet.
And I haven't listened to the Bose Quietcomfort Ultra headphones.
Hopefully I will be able to do that in the future.
Great job my friend. Very informative. Just subscribed 👍
I had the opportunity to demo those three along with B&O H95, AirPod Max and Solitaire. With the exception of Solitaire, the 5909s literally wiped the floor with the rest of them in terms of sonic experience (clarity, soundstage, instrument separation). I played the latest Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto by Yuja Wang and Gustavo Dudamel as it was recorded live with LA Phil (HighRes) and I was in total awe. I just couldn’t justify purchasing any of the others. Especially, when it can also operate as a totally passive wired headphone (when battery dies on you completely).
So I was shocked on your remarks on the sound quality. I will agree that the need to work a little on the BASS enhancement for more oomph but in general the bass maybe shy but it’s right and HD something you can’t say for the other too. I found the Focal bass very flabby and the B&W way too much.
The 5909 lends themselves well to classical music, which I believe I state in my review. And I'm glad to hear that you've found the best-sounding headphones - for you. 👍
Personally, I have a hard time accepting that the 5909 'crap out' when I'm listening to electronic music and they distort in the low-end at higher listening levels. This should have been addressed in the design phase, me thinks.
None of the other wireless headphones I've used or review have any problem with playing low-end at higher listening levels, like the 5909 have.
I don't find the 5909 useful in passive mode, due to the lack of low-end without the built-in digital processing.
That said, some of my subscribers find the 5909 best-sounding of the trio I compared, and I can understand that. Because listening to a pair of headphones is the most personal listening experience, and what I find 'great-sounding' might not be great-sounding to someone else - and vice verse.
That's why it's so important to do your own listening tests, like you have done. 👍
Have a nice Sunday!
@@immersivesoundtech that is weird, I listen to a lot of EDM stuff and I have never experienced any distortion on any frequency register. Are you sure it’s not a unit issue? Have you talked to ML?
Talking about low end, I wish it had a little bit more of it, more oomph for my EDM and heavy metal playlists but I am willing to sacrifice that for clarity and definition. Plus the bass on the ML may not be impressive in terms of presence and volume but definitely has immediacy and definition they couldn’t find on either Bathys or Px8s. Hopefully they can improve it through the firmware at some point. Also aesthetically I am not a big fan of the 5909s. The Px8s are to die for in terms of looks and the ones I was hoping to get, but sonic performance prevailed on my decision making process at the end.
Thanks 🙏 for your feedback anyway, enjoy the rest of the weekend too man :)
ML hasn't replied back to me, but user's at Head-Fi.org are reporting the same kind of distortion in the low-end.
Here's what I want you to do, enable the ANC and bass boost, and play "Imaginary Friends" by Deadmau5. Crack up the volume.
Please let me know if you can to full volume without distorting the low-end. 👍
Thanks for you opinion about Bathys and Px8. I find both headphones more 'fun' to listen to in the low-end, compared to ML 5909.
But we all experience sound slightly differently, especially using headphones.
That's why everyone should do their own listening tests, like you and I have done. 👍
Cheers
Frederick
@@immersivesoundtech I’ll certainly do the test when I get home. I use enhanced Bass most of the time, especially with EDM stuff, cause like you said I find the MLs lacking that extra oomph you get from the Px8s. But I never play them at 100% volume. Like with most audio equipment I listen around 70~80% max. I don’t want to screw up the drivers. I’ll get back to you on that one.
@@immersivesoundtech Ok, just finished the test.
This is a heavy bass track to begin with and IMHO sounds better at NEUTRAL setting (more sonic balanced). Especially when you have the ANC on HIGH which adds bass by default. The recording is very bass heavy and drowns the rest of the frequencies if you don’t EQ it. But ok that’s down to personal taste. I certainly wouldn’t listen to it so heavily bass enhanced though.
BUT for the purpose of our test I went with your proposed settings:
BASS CONTOUR: ENHANCED
ANC: HIGH
SOUND VOLUME: 80%
*had a listen at 90% volume but since I want to preserve the headphone drivers, and MOST importantly my hearing, I didn’t stay at that setting for more than 15-20 seconds.
Verdict: honestly I didn’t hear any distortion on the low register. What I did hear is the tune pushing the limits of the headphones’ bass. In a way making it unpleasant for my ears at 90+% volume and not so enjoyable, but that’s because the bass drowns everything like a blanket and makes it less high def (for lack of a better word). Because 5909s characteristics is bass speed (rather than volume), with the bass and sound volume all the way up I find that it loses that speed and HD feeling and becomes more “boomy” but certainly not distorted. Not to my ears anyway. An effect btw that is audible with all high end equipment that I have demoed if you push the volume almost to the edge of the drivers (something you should NOT do).
Sidenote: I also played the track on my B&W Formatiom Duo speakers at 70-80% volume - my neighbours were not happy 😂
Even there at high volumes and BASS at high settings I had the same effect. And the Formation’s bass goes very low btw (25Hz) but has that HD immediacy effect, which it kinda lost at those settings. So I had to reduce the BASS by -2.0 dB to achieve sonic balance, audiophile character and enjoyability of the track.
I hope that helps. Great track btw and if you have other track recommendations let me know I’ll be happy to do more testing.
Thanks Frederick. Incredibly thorough review and well measured advice with a dash of humour. I also have a potato head and shortly hope to start to mix music (but not on the fly)!
I was interested in how you use the Focals to mix music as I thought that there would be colouration of the sound when previously I had been advised to go with neutral sounding headphones for mixing music within a DAW.
That being said I will demo the Bathys and Mark Levinson with my dealer (though don’t think they deal with B&W).
Currently I love the sound I get from my closed planar Oppo Pm-3s, which are my bedroom headphones and the ones I currently relax with.
Thanks for your kind words!
Mixing in headphones is tough and there's quite a long learning period - for me at least.
I would have loved to be able to disable the ANC on the Bathys, to really be able to hear the finer details when working on a mix or sound editing. Also, I find the mid-range to be a little bit "too kind" when mixing, making me add more upper mid-range and treble than needed.
It's of course part of the learning process to find the pros and cons of a pair of headphones when using them for work.
I compared them with Focal Stellia, and then I really could hear what I'm missing, working in the Bathys. Maybe not the most fair comparison given the difference in price, but an eye-opener when it comes to sound clarity.
Did you get the chance to try out Focal Bathys and Mark Levinson 5909 yourself?
If so, how did they work out for you?
All the best
Frederick
@@immersivesoundtech Hi Frederick. Three months on and still not booked a session! I will though. As regards to mixing I think speakers will be the way to go, not headphones. Will probabaly buy some KRK Rokits as my current speakers are for hi fi, so not great for flat mixing.
@@immersivesoundtech Okay Frederick. Your reply spurred me on to approach my dealer, who has kindly leant me both headphones to test at home. I have just received the 5909s today, although I have had the Bathys for a week now. So jury is out for me at the moment, when I thought it would be a slam dunk for the Bathys after demoing them for a week.
The Focal Bathys have such a wide soundstage, fantastical in a wireless ANC headphone, I love that feeling of placement in the stereo image. However even after a day, the 5909's fit better on my head, seem a lot lighter and although the soundstange isn't as wide, I am enjoying the music just as much. After a couple of hours with the Bathys, the headband irriated my bald head, I guess as it was rubbing slightly - despite fiddling with the fit of the thing. The 5909s have a nice clamping force for me and so far no issues with the headband, I moved the armature up a click on both sides and it is fine. The 5909s seem to have dropped in price too. £750, and £700 for the Bathys at the time of writing.
Incidentally, did you experience and feeling of pressure change in the 5909s, when listening in ANC High mode? When I switched to ANC there was a weird feeling when I moved my head (almost akin to the spatical mode on ipod pros), but that seems to have disappeared. Maybe it's due to the use of the Bathysphere which descend to greater depths and I have got the bends from the pressure? Who knows. ;)
So which do I choose?! I will let you know when I decide. Thanks again for the great review (I watched it again just for your story on the Turkish airlines)!
Hey hope you been well, would you be able to review the Dali IO-12 headphones, they seem like a strong contender to be the best bluetooth anc headphones
They are. I replaced my bathys with the IO-12. In my opinion the world’s best BT headphones
@@Realdjheisenberg Im going to go test them out in couple weeks, deciding bewteen them or focals or 5909, but seems like they are the ones, how is the anc on them, is there any hissing when there is no music playing?
@@jtoster4980 dead silent. You cannot begin to imagine what an experience these are to wear and operate. James Bond himself greets you, as you press the various buttons, with various messages depending how fast you scroll through the options for each buttons.
I’ve never experienced anything like this with any headphones, let alone wireless. There’s no competition.
I am in contact with Dali and they have promised to send me a pair of Dali OI-12 when they have a review pair available for me. 👍
Just had a video call with product manager at Dali and he described how much work they’ve put into designing and building the Dali IO-12 wireless headphones.
I will hopefully receive a pair for review next week. 🎧😀
⚠️I find the video very interesting and have extensively tested the Focal Bathys and the PX8. I kept the PX8, even though the Bathys sounds slightly better. The PX8 is more comfortable, compact, and looks better. Since I can use them better on the go, I chose the Bowers & Wilkins. The sound is still very good and better in certain genres.
⚠️What interests me is the Burn In Effect, which is highly debated. I also feel that they sound better than initially, but it could be placebo. Can this be tested? Do you have the opportunity to compare these with a new PX8 and substantiate your thesis? That would be almost worth its own video
Comfort is almost as important as the sound quality, and I can understand that you like the Px8 more. They sit very well on my head as well.
Personally, I'm passionate about sharing my experience with the 'burn-in' process after having reviewed speakers and headphones in different trade magazines for more than twenty years.
However, I'm not on a crusade, and 'burn-in' is a hot potato in the studio and HiFi-world.
I guess it's possible to get two pairs of headphones from the same manufacturing batch, and 'burn in' one pair while the other stays in its box 'unplayed'. Then do measurements and double-blind listening tests, and try to statistically 'prove' that there is a difference in sound quality.
A lot of work, and even if I would 'prove' that there is a difference in sound quality, the tests would be scrutinized by the Internet in every way possible, to prove that I'm wrong.
To me, it's just not worth the time and energy. I have TONS of ideas for videos that will be more beneficial to my subscribers.
Instead you have two options, take my word that there is difference or do your own listening tests.
All the best
Frederick
Excellent review, I really like my Px7 and even more after the firmware update. Not in a hurry though but it will probably the Px8 as you said intimate sounding.
Thanks for your kind words! 🙏
Good to hear that Bowers & Wilkins update and improve the sound quality of the Px7 too.
With the latest firmware update of the Px8, the low-end performance got even better and the upper mid-range 'cleared up' a little bit.
Good stuff!
I've been promised Px7 headphones for reviewing by the distributor and I'm keep to get my hands on them. 😉
Also been promised to be able to review the Pi7 earbuds.
Where would you rate the B&O H95 compared to Mark Levinson?
@Immersive sound tech
Hoping you can help. I've purchased the PX8 and the Bathy's. I have 14 days to try them out at home. Both sound glorious but the problem I have is that both sets of headphones hurt the top of my head.
The PX8 are worst offenders as they cause me jaw ache too so they are definitely going back for a refund. Unfortunately the Bathy's still cause me mild discomfort. With both pairs of headphones I have the arms fully extended out.
I do have a pair of Sony XM5's but they now sound muffled by comparison.
What could I try next?
Creative Zen hybrid pros, Yamaha e700a, or master& dynamic mw75... Those are my choices at least.
Just bought a bathys dune edition and loving it! Almost forget to use my 800s
Did you decide against the review of the MD MW75’s?
Hi; thanks for this review. I can get a 5909 for 400 dollras. Does it worth it if I have already an ibasso sr2 (wired?). Better than the Bathys? I look for deatailed but also relaxing sound (for jazz, music movies ost, music from the 80...). The passive mode seems to be better on the 5909 since the Bathys (wich I am looking also too) doesn't have. Thx!
If you can buy a used pair of Mark Levinson 5909 for just $400, I think you should buy them.
Try them out and if you don’t like them, you can always sell them for 400 dollar, me think.
Thanks. I’ve been using PX7 for almost 2 years and considering an upgrade. This is the video I wanted to see. I’d be happy to hear your review on the new Master and Dynamics as well 😊
which one you choose ?
@@dandykon3178Bathys. Quite happy with them. I still use my PX7 though.
Great video. Lots of useful info. Thank you. I have PX8 since they came out and enjoy them. Got Focal Bathys last week, so far so good.
Thanks for your kind words! 🙏
Sounds like you are well sorted owning both the Bathys and Px8. 🎵👍
What are ur impressions?
@@dfk1991 focal are more comfortable for me, but I get hot ears after a while. Calls are better on Px8. Noise cancelling better on Px8. I'm listening more to focal but not disappointed when I use my Px8 either. Sorry that's probably not very helpful.
I m gonna buy px8 by this videos is that fine?
Sure, I think they sound really good. I hope you like them too. 👍
Please let me know how they work out for you, okay.
....Just My Opinion And Experience....
.... I liked the bathys focal umtil comparing it with my phillips fidelio X2HR .... Both Were Connected Wired To My Fiio BTR7 Set To LDAC and LDAC Was Set To PRIORITY ON SOUND QUALITY ....
Hello - many thanks for a great review. I think the reason the PX8s and Bathys go "quiet" when wired into an Android phone is that the DAC in the Android phone takes precedence of any external DAC. It can only be bypassed by installing third party software which costs around $10 to allow you to use alternative DACs than the one inside Android devices. Your music is then accessed via the third party software as opposed to source you are actually using (Tidal/Spotify etc etc). The 5090s can be used wired AND not powered so they are not having to overcome any "interactions" their own DAC in order to use the DAC inside the Android devices and therefore do not go "quiet". I believe that the 5090s are the only headphone of the three tested that are able to used as true wired passive headphones and this maybe worth considering if you ever are concerned regarding battery replacement. Many thanks.
Which app is that? I cant use Bowers wired in Android, it doesn't sound
@@Aqil.Samedov in the Google play store the one I have used is called "USB Audio Player Pro".
Okay, thanks for the tip. I'm going to try out that app.
I'm shopping for a pair of excellent sounding headphones and your reviews are the best I've seen. You explain the technical aspects and practical uses while also emphasizing the most important feature - the sound. I will definitely consider your top picks for my choice.
Thanks for your expertise and knowledge.
Thanks for watching my videos and for your kind words! It means a lot to me. 👍
When you've made your choice, please let me know how your new headphones works out for you, okay. 🎧🎶
That’s great! Good luck!!
I own both Px8 and 5909s. However my use case is being wireless at home (office), hence I always go with passive mode and about 40-50% volume (that is more than enough for me). So both pairs are actually joyful to me :)
Px8 actually is a bit more comfy and an easy goer in case of frequent distractions because of smaller clamp force and very forgiving head positioning - all that makes freeing up one ear a no brainer for short reaction to outer world event. Yes, there's transparency mode for that, but it's not well thought because user should cycle through all modes one by one to reach out to it (passive -> anc -> transparent -> passive -> ...) when each mode switch takes probably a second to apply.
They are both great-sounding headphones, and I agree, the B&W Px8 are so comfy to wear for hours. 👍
That's great to know (passive optioen in 22:43). are there any other headphones ypu know that do it? Being active wireless but can be used passively with analog conection for use witha better AMP/DAC? I own the B&W P7 Wireless (the originals) and I just love them..!! But I feel that replacement is coming. Thank you.
If you love the Px7, you should definitely take a listen to the B&W Px8. They are great-sounding headphones with the same 'character' but with "extra everything". 👍
@@immersivesoundtech What a wonderful news..!! Thank you..!!! I WILL definitly try them asap..!! But I've try the Px7 the ones I own and LOVE are the P7 one generation before the Px series, and the wonderful thing of the P7 wireless is that they work completly analog if you whish it so, they can be connected to a $3,000usd rig with DAC and everything and scale accordingly since they will not be bound by the internal AMP or DAC, thus making them very versatile...
I'm struggling between Bathys and 5909, I have new neighbours and they are awful, so I have to use ANC nowadays (or earbuds). I prefer open back but of course, isolation is much more difficult. I understand ANC has an affect, however I just don't have a choice.
Neighbors...what can I say... 😐
I'm fortunate to live in my own house since almost fifteen years now, and it's really a blessing when it comes to not having any neighbors next door.
If you prefer open-back headphones, you like the 'open' sound stage they usually produce, right?
To my ears, Focal Bathy have more transparent-sounding ANC, and a more natural sound stage.
The best thing would be for you to test both headphones, before buying. I know that it's not always possible.
Good luck!
Please let me know what you decided to buy and how they work out for you.
This is such a detailed and helpful video
Glad I could help out! ☺️
Well, from this it sounds as though I’d enjoy the Focals more but, I want to travel with them and they are huge for that purpose.
Thanks for watching my videos!
I've done some travelling with the Focal Bathys, and even if they are a bit bigger, it hasn't been a problem for me.
The B&W Px8 are comparatively a bit slimmer and I really enjoy them as travel partners.
Lately, I've used the new Sonos ACE headphones, and even though they don't have the same sound quality as Focal Bathys, they are slimmer, lighter and very comfy.
@@immersivesoundtech I think I’ll switch from carrying a laptop with me and get an IPad. Then I can have space for bigger headphones. Problem solved! Sound quality is number 1 as a priority.
I sometimes use a pair of Campfire Mammoths for my cell phone (for walking & exercise) but because these IEMs are wired only and my new phone does not have a headphone jack (I miss my LG with quad DACs) I purchased a Bluetooth adapter for them. I purchased the iFi Go blu as it had the functionality I wanted. Supports almost all codecs (LDAC is my preferred one), has 3.5mm single ended and 4.4mm balanced outputs, and can act as a USB DAC as well - my phone's USB connector has issues but I do use it on my tablet and PC from time to time. Not trying to sound like a salesman, just wanted to mention that for people who have passive headphones they want to use with their phones without a jack.
I came here to look at these 3 headphones as I am upgrading my travelling ANC headphones from the PX7's. Now I just have to find time to get to the store that has all 3 I can try. Thanks for looking at these, funny enough the ones I was hoping to see.
Hi Rob
Glad to help out and good luck with listening to all three pair of headphones - they are all great in some ways.
Please let me know which pair that sounds the best to you.
Regarding Bluetooth adapters and DAP units - it's a Universe I have yet to explore.
I think the beauty of wireless headphones is that they are wireless, but at the same time, it's cool that it's possible to bring wired headphones for travel, and be able to enjoy higher sound quality than merely using the output of your phone. 👍
Thanks for the tip! 🙏
@@immersivesoundtech Today I was able to get to a local store that I frequent and they had all three of these headphones for me to test. After listening to each pair once (to a few songs on my Qobuz HD playlist) I immediately ruled out the PX8's, there was just something about the sound I did not like, I would almost say that to me the sound is lifeless. That left me with the other 2 which I switched back and forth between a few more times.
The Bathys impressed me with the sound but there was a slight underlying sibilance in the s sounds, which may be the headsets or it could be the codec I was using, but not the playlist which remained the same for all 3 pairs. Then it was the No5909's turn and they sounded, while not perfect, really good to me, with a nice bass sound I preferred over the others.
I was not sure about which one I wanted and asked about the new colour (Dune I think) the Bathys was being released in which looks pretty sharp to me. However, here in Canada, that colour is exclusive to an online retailer (WTF Focal?). Some people say "go to the store and try them then order online". If everyone did that then there would be nowhere to try these things, especially something as subjective as good sounding headphones. But I really do not like to do that, plus I prefer to support my local physical retail stores and would not abandon them for an online retailer. Not for just the colour anyway..
I tried the 2 on a few times more and settled on the No5909s due to a few things, not in a specific order: Comfort - they fit my head better than any other over the ear headphones I have tried; Sound - I preferred them and the slightly "bassier" sound; LDAC - this is my favorite codec so having this was an instant plus; True passive mode is nice to have if I decide I want to listen at home on my stereo rather than phone or PC, and does not require power. Plus the retailer knocked about 10% off the price which helped in my decision as price-wise I was leaning toward the Bathys even though I mostly preferred the No5909.
In case you are wondering, I got the red No5909's as I prefer the contrast between the shiny red and matte black. Thanks again for your great review!
Thanks for your report, Rob! 🙏
You have done what everyone interested in new headphones should do, try them out yourself. 👍
And I'm glad you found the best wireless headphones - for you.
One think to think about when trying out active wireless headphones in stores - and I say this as much to myself - is the importance of downloading the app for each headphones, connect to each headphones via Bluetooth and check the settings.
Because I have, at several times, auditioned wireless headphones at stores, only to find them 'strange sounding' and then taken the time to connect to the headphones and reset the settings - which were quite 'all over the place'.
I too, think the Sony LDAC codec is currently the best codec available for Bluetooth.
Nice headphone comparison... the CR1s in the background thou 😍
My babies… 🥰
How do you normally break in headphones? With music or frequency sweeps?
With music. I create a one-hour playlist in one of my portable media players, and include a five-minute sound file with just silence. So, 55 minutes of music, five minutes of silence, and then played in repeat for two-three weeks, preferably.
Have you tried the Dali IO-12's? I debating if its worth 1300$ vs the Focal Bathys
Thanks for asking!
Yes, I have. My Dali IO-12 review is in the making. I've just been so tremendously busy lately. But, please stay tuned for a detailed review of the IO-12. ☺️
Do you have a video about running in headphones? At what volume do you run them at?
Hi Dave! No I haven't, but I plan to publish a video about proper 'break-in'.
Please talk about the bang and Olufsen beoplay H95. I’m debating between them and the focals
I’m going to reach out to Beosound and ask for a pair of review headphones.
I have now reached out to Bang & Olufsen and asked for a pair of Beoplay H95 for review. Let's see what they answer.
I have reached out to Band & Olufsen and asked if they could send me a pair of Beoplay H95 headphones for review, but unfortunately they declined my request due to lack of units for demo purposes right now.
@@immersivesoundtech
Perhaps a chat with your local B&O store could see you borrow a pair of broken-in H95s for a little while.
@@BoronAlloyWell, I prioritise the manufacturers that take the time and effort to send me headphones for review.
If B&O had any interest in my opinion, they would have sent me a pair of H95 for review.
Super comparison
I have a Focal Bathys. I've used it in DAC mode with my (Android) Samsung Zflip5 without the volume loss that you described, and enjoyed very good sound quality. You didn't mention one of the best features of the Focal app that provides a hearing test for the user and adjusts the Bathys' EQ to compensate somewhat for the user's high frequency hearing loss (which is significant in my case). Compared to my Sony XM5 headphones, the Sony has better noise cancelling, but the Bathys sounds better. In wireless mode, I'm using the AptX codec with either my Samsung phone or Astell&Kern DAP. I get the very best sound from my Bathys when connected with an analog cable to my A&K Kann Alpha.
I'm glad to hear that you like your Focal Bathys - they're are great-sounding headphones.
I agree that the Sony XM5 headphones have stronger ANC, but that the Bathys ANC sound much better.
The Mimi hearing test functionality wasn't available when I reviewed the headphones, it was introduced with a firmware update almost a year later. When needed, I think it's a nice functionality, and I'm glad that it works well for you. I don't have need for it (yet), but it's good to know that it's available. 👍
The A&K Kann Alpha looks like a really nice DAP.
I get the best sound quality when connecting the Bathys via USB-C and set them DAC Mode. Works really well both with an iPhone using an Apple Camera Adapter and directly connected to my laptop. 👍
I have both the T+A Solitaire T and the Dali IO 12....how would you rate these vs the Bathys and the Mark Levinsons?
I haven't listened to the T+A Solitaire, but I have the Dali IO-12 on review right now, and they are interesting indeed... 😉
@@immersivesoundtech let's see what comes with that review then!
Fredrick, you are the best when it comes to reviewing equipment, thanks. I purchase based off of your videos and so far have been spot on. I own the Bathys and the PX8’s with the 5909’s currently being shipped to me so I can’t comment on those. As far as the other two are concerned I like them both sound quality wise however I find the build quality of the Focals superior to the B&W’s. The PX8 shortcomings, for me are the cup size which I find a little small and thus not as comfortable as the Focals and the buttons on the PX8 I find to be cheap. Especially the on/off switch which wiggles and doesn’t slide as nicely as the Focals. Small issues. I’ll let you know my thoughts on the 5909’s, should have them by early next week. Keep up the good work. Nick in California.
Thanks for your kind words and for your report!
Glad to hear that my videos have been of help to you. 👍
Regarding testing headphones, it's so important to do what you have done, test them yourself.
I actually like the tighter fit of the B&W Px8 headphone cups and I think they fit better when I lay down in bed listening to music - it's a personal think. I'd say that how the headphones fit is almost as important as how they sound - especially if you plan to use them for long listening sessions.
That said, I love how the Focal Bathys fit too - more like a pair of "studio headphones" that I'm so used to work with as a sound engineer.
Please let me know how you fancy the Mark Levinson 5909.
Cheers
Frederick
Update: I currently own 4 ANC Wireless headphones (PX8, 5909, H95, & Bathys) so one had to go. I'm currently reviewing the H95 and 5909 which I anticipate should be fine with the intent of dumping the PX8 which I find uncomfortable (ear cups too small) and inferior sound quality in my opinion. I did season them for over 100 hours and really saw no improvement. Just thought I'd let you know as a follow up. thanks man@@immersivesoundtech
@@skenic1952 I owned all, you should drop the px8, h95 and bathys and get the solitare t and the new dali io-12
@@jtoster4980 I own the Solitaire T which I failed to mention since I rarely use them and find them way over priced and inferior to the Bathys which sound better and are a much better price value. I love the sound of the H95’s which I also feel are superior to the overpriced Solitaire T’s. Have not tried the Dali IO-12 as yet and have purchased them on your recommendation. I find sound quality to be quite subjective and genre dependent. Thanks for your reply.
I have to focal bathys which sound superb especially with the latest firmware which added mimi hearing adjustments. I recommend anyone who owns the focals to run the mimi hearing adjustments, it really opens them up.
It's nice feature that Focal added without saying much about it.
Personally, I don't need it and when adding treble and upper mid-range, it sounded slightly 'processed', to me.
However, if it 'opens up' the sound stage for you and other users, then perfect.
It's worth trying out. 👍
Great review Frederick…i am thinking of purchasing the ML 5909 but only when price drops. I’ve owned Bowers headphones before, PX7 to be precise, but found them too bassy for my liking and a little muddy in the high end. I have had the Bathys for over a year and find them as you do, absolutely stunning soundwise. I don’t care about battery death in years to come, i’ll pay what it takes to be replaced by Focal, in DAC mode with the basic Focal usb c cable into Apple camera adapter they sound just fantastic, for the money, they are a gift 😀👍
The Focal Bathys are mighty fine headphones, and it is possible to change the battery when it eventually dies. I have DIY instructions how to do it from a user on the Internet. You can even fit a slightly larger battery and, in theory, get even more battery life. 👍
@@immersivesoundtech wow..thats worth knowing, cheers for sharing Frederick 😀👍
For what it's worth, the PX7 are trash compared to the PX8. That being said, the Bathys is noticeably more detailed when listening in quiet environments, and have a wider soundstage than the PX8. But, I think the PX8 has a slightly more natural timbre and are more fun (but still a very controlled, tight sound) when listening to modern music. The PX8 are also much better than the Bathys when used as travel or commuting headphones...which is what most ANC headphones are designed to be.
I'm trying to get both B&W Px7 S2 and S2E for a review as viewers are asking about my opinion about them. I haven't heard either of them yet.
As you say, the Bowers & Wilkins Px8 are great travel partners. 👍
In my ears, the Focal Bathys have a more natural timbre, although slightly 'rolled off' in the treble, with a bigger and deeper sound stage.
But I agree that the Px8 are more 'fun' to listen to most of the time. I just love how they sound, whereas Bathys almost makes me forget that I'm listening to a pair of headphones.
I'm a happy camper owning both pair of headphones. 😉
@@immersivesoundtechfinally got the ML5909 in Radiant Red and boy they are beautiful and sound stunning..i was tempted to sell my Bathys to finance them but i just can’t do it, they are not as classy as the ML but they still sound fantastic in comparison. I have 4 bikes so one of them is going😀
Would you recommend to upgrade my Sennheiser momentum 4 to the PX8?
Yes, I would say that it would be quite an upgrade. 👍
If possible, the best way to do it, is to audition the Px8 at a local HiFi-store - before making the decision.
Excellent review
Glad you liked it!
I have both the Bathys and px8. I have a preference for the bathys, with a better sound and a much more confortable fit (the px8 is too tight on my head). It is perfect f you can sit on a plane or a train. I use the PX8 on the go (subway, walking) because I do not feel confortable wearing such a large headphone as the bathys in public areas. No big difference in ANC.
Thanks for your comment. I also use the Px8 when travelling and mostly the Bathys when I'm at home listening to music.
Both headphones are mighty fine. 🎶👍
What is your equalizer setting for the PX8 (with current firmware 3.0.0)? I take the bass down a bit and raise the treble. I'm curious what an expert likes.
Thanks for you question.
With the latest firmware 3.0 - and with the ANC enabled - I've found the best balance by setting the BASS -1.5dB and the TREBLE at 0.
I rarely add treble when listening to headphones, because I think it spoils the 'magic' and reveal that I'm listening to headphones.
I rather let my ears get used to the sound stage.
Though, the Px8 filters sound rather good, so it is possible to set the TREBLE +2dB which will make the sound stage a bit more intense rather than more 'open'.
It's a personal thing, so if you like adding a bit of treble, go for it! :-)
Cheers
Frederick
@@immersivesoundtech Thanks for your answer.
I do something similar with the PX8. Lower the bass a little and raise the treble slightly. greetings Alex
Really like your reviews. Sounded like you were being diplomatic towards the end not to upset anyone but I could tell deep down your favourite cans are the Focal Bathys 🤭 I've also had the chance to test these against the Px8 and decided to keep the Bathys! Not been able to hear the Mark Levinson but don't think I need to after watching most of the reviews on these against the Focal Bathys. Anyway am I right?
Bathys are the best affordable headphones on earth. and that will stay like this for quite a while
Thanks for your kind words!
Well, I'm not trying to be diplomatic, not at all. Just highlighting the pros and cons of all three and put them in perspective with each other.
If you read some of the other comments, you will see that different taste is very much at play. What sounds great to me, might not sound great to you.
And that's the way it should be. To me, the headphone listening experience is the most personal listening experience.
And you have taken the time to compared the Px8 and Bathys - and that's the way to do it.
Whether you should listen to the Mark Levinson 5909 or not, I think it's always interesting to compare things. 👍
On the other hand, do you feel anything lacking with the sound of the Focal Bathys? 😉
Well I think Focal's first entry into this market is outstanding and bodes well for future models. Is there anything lacking, well I'm certainly no expert at this unlike yourself but I can only hope that future models bring even more details across the spectrum and clearer and punchier bass. For example I own a pair of Sennheiser over ear audiophile cans and these are even clearer and more detailed where certain sounds pop but they are no where near as punchy and dynamic as the Focals. The Px8 does better on certain tracks and is more bass heavy than the Bathys but the overall presentation of sound is superior on the Bathys in my opinion. All said I found the Bass in the Px8 can be fatiguing and I'm not sure if it is doing ones ears any favours. So the Focal could make a future model with yet even more clearer and detailed sound, slightly more punchy bass (nit picking) but keep the same wonderful open sound signature. For now I'm thoroughly enjoying my Focal Bathys and once I start listening to music on them I have a job to get them off! Just to add I'm not bothered by a super impressive ANC so this doesn't affect me and yes the cans leak a bit of sound compared with say the Px8 but this is probably necessary not to sacrifice the comfort and sound quality. So far this is not an issue for me. And as said enjoying your reviews and the way you deliver them 👍
Thanks for your kind words Michael! 🙏
Like I say in the video, the B&W Px8 are growing on me. Not as 'detailed', 'wide' or 'dynamic' as the Bathys, but still great-sounding, intimate sound stage and super-comfy on my big head. 😃
I agree, the Focal Bathy sound great!
Regarding the low-end performance, I think they sound better than many wired and more expensive headphones do.
Like I say in my videos, I think Focal has digitally worked on the phase response in the low-end, because it's so coherent with the rest of the frequency spectrum - something not possible to do in the analogue domain (read: with passive headphones).
Personally, I would love to hear them with the ANC disabled, because my guess is that the low-end would be even 'better' and even more 'punchy', and the slightly recessed treble would 'open up'. But that's just my guess.
Also, I would love to have a Bathys Signature model with Beryllium cones - think an active version of Focal Stellia.
That would have the potential of becoming the 'best' headphones on the market, don't you think? 😃
When I have the time, I plan to make a video comparing Focal Bathys with Focal Stellia.
I have a pair of Stellia as well and I think they sound amazing. I'm lost for hours listening to music on them. 🎵❤️
I've read up on those Focal Stellia and they've had incredible reviews. What HiFi said as you're probably aware that these headphones are most likely the best sounding closed backed headphones to date (the closed back version of the award winning Utopia) And I totally agree, I would love Focal to design a future edition of these great Bathys using Beryllium cones. Next time I'm heading to a hifi shop I'll try and listen to those stellia cans, problem is I'll be tempted to save for a set and my family will have to do without a holiday 😂 Hopefully What HiFi show in Bristol next year will have these in one of their demonstration rooms. Because of my situation at present and not being able to listen to my music on speakers due to young children and the addition of a baby I can justify purchasing a good set of cans. Only recently discovered Focal as I've been more familiar with Sennheiser and B&W but I'm kind of hooked by this make now and excited to see what happens next. I look forward to your next review of the Focal Bathys vs stellia but I won't be surprised if the Stellia blows them out of the water, after all they have a huge price tag! Thanks again
Tried all of these an❤d the 5909 win easily - the sound is incredible and worth the cash if you have it
I totally agree with you on the 5909 and the Bathys sound quality, I own both at the same time and sold my 5909’s never heard the B&W’s
I would be curious to know how the M&D MW 75’s stack up to these heavy hitters.
Those headphones look interesting.
I think I’ve already emailed them about a possible review, but I’m going to email them again. 👍
I would love to see that video.
Me too... 😃
I have now contacted the press department at Master & Dynamic and presented myself, and their Founder & CEO replied within minutes. Now that's professional conduct. 👍
He's going to send me a pair of MW75 headphones for review.
Have a nice weekend!
The Master & Dynamic MW75 headphones are in my possession now, and are 'breaking in' in my control room.
It's going to be really interesting reviewing them. 👍
@@immersivesoundtech Looking forward to your review.
chaps leauge ! hard to make a choice between these really. all great. I owned previously Focal it was sounding good. but i always wonder how ML sounds compared to Bathys :D since I have currently B&W PI7 S2 earbuds. i know their sound signature. I'll probably buy ML 5909 very soon. its making me excited.:)
great review as always thanks for it
I hope my video gave you a little more perspective on which pair of headphones to try out yourself. 👍
Hi, did you faced any headband issues in the px8?
No, I haven't, but some users have.
Can I just say the B&W look great in that colour also dont look like ear defenders like the other two. P.S I am a B&W fan own a few speakers Zeppelin and the Z2
Great video! I would suggest checking out the Edifier Spirit Stax S3 headphone that's a planar magnetic Bluetooth headphone for a lower price.
It would be interesting to have a comparison between the Focal Bathys and the Stax S3.
The Bathys Can Connect to iPhone usb c in DAC mode. The 5909 has the direct digital ability. But Can the 5909 connect to an iPhone via usb c and work as a DAC with their 24/96 converter?
Hi Jesper
I haven't upgraded to iPhone 15 Pro yet, so I don't know if the 5909 can be used that way.
My guess is that they can, but maybe someone else can chime in and answer you question.
I can't wait to throw all our Apple lightning cables in the trash. Just need to save up for four iPhone 15 to cover the whole family.
Ah well... 💵🤩
Thanks
Frederick
I can confirm the 5909's work well with the iPhone 15 Pro through USB-C and sound great (Hi-res, MQA, etc). Because it's passive you don't get the options you get via BT with the app, so no bass enhancement, no volume control or play/pause, but the noise cancelling modes still work using the button on the left ear-cup.
Friend, tell me some headphones or a hi-fi player with physical keys to rewind tracks 10 seconds forward or backward. and not just switching tracks forward back, do such things even exist?
Can one mute the microphone of the focal bathys while on a call or on discord directly from the headphones. Thanks for your help
That’s great!
Anybody any idea why my px8 volume is considerably lower than when i listen via Bluetooth. I am connecting to samsung note 20 ultra. Have double checked all volume limits and nothing is limiting it. Bluetooth sounds great but when i connect usb c to usb c the volume is very low. Any ideas?
Take the B&O H95 to the test and you’ll have a new nr.1! Tweak the EQ slightly to mid-right and you’ll be sold.
Few years on the market now, but still in a league of their own.
Not for nothing still Flossy Carters no.1!
But tastes differ I realize that, just my opinion on headphones after months of testing.
Cheers!
Thanks for your comment!
I have listened to the Bang & Olufsen Beoplay H95 headphones a couple of times, and while nice-sounding, they didn't blow me away.
The filter opportunities are both a blessing and a curse, because as a listener you can really change the sound, and in the hands of a novice user, that might be overwhelming.
I have reached out to Bang & Olufsen and asked for a pair of H95, but they didn't have a pair available for review.
For me, the codecs need to support uncompressed 16 bit/44.1 kHz format before seriously plopping down over $500 for a wireless solution. LDAC is almost there but it needs to 1.5x to support true CD quality. Forget about Hi-Res. That is so far into the future. If I want to enjoy SQ, I sit down and go with the wired solution.
Understood, and I know how you reason.
I want that sound quality too, and LDAC sound great to me, and Qualcomm is releasing apTX lossless soon. Great things are in the making.
That said, I have a blast listening to both B&W Px8 and Focal Bathys via Apple AAC on iPhone. 👍
Will the px8's be able to take advantage of Qualcomm aptx in the future?
@@immersivesoundtechWill the px8's be able to take advantage of Qualcomm aptx in the future?
@@buttoxbrown
I would think it very unlikely, for two reasons.
1) The hardware can’t be updated to include the codec
2) B&W would probably prefer (as they’re primarily an audio device manufacturer, not a software company) to sell you the solution in the form of PX8 version 2 or PX9.
With LDAC, and ApTX Lossless, I wonder how Apple will respond, if at all. They may maintain that the vast majority of people cannot hear any appreciable difference between AAC, and other high bandwidth lossless formats.
Do they support WV files (WavePack)?
Well, WavPack is a lossy or lossless codec for shrinking music files into smaller size - it's not a BlueTooth transmission codec.
It is up to your media player to support WavPack files, if that's what you are using to archive you ripped CDs. 👍
As far as I know, the most supported lossless codec in media players is FLAC - and it works great.
How is the bass on these? Anyone? I have some Focal Clear and they bass on these are very thin. I don´t want to buy these and have two pair of expensive headphones with low bass. Are the Bathys good with techno and electronic music? Because the Clear is not, so I use those for classic and jazz music mostly.
Yes, the Focal Bathys have enough bass for techno och electronic music - and you can adjust it if you need even more. 👍
@@immersivesoundtechThank you. I bought these, and are waiting for them in the mail. Very excited.
what about solitaire t of t+a ? Can I have an opinion ?
Andrea, I have reached out to T+A Elektroakustik and asked about headphones for review, but never heard back from them.
So, no reviews planned of them unfortunately.
Please review the DALI IO12….thank you.
I have a pair of Dali IO-12 headphones ‘breaking in’ in my control room. They are interesting for sure. 😀
A detailed review is planned. 👍
@@immersivesoundtech thank you looking forward to watching it…..they’re $1700 here in 🇨🇦 Canada
@@immersivesoundtechvery interested in hearing your findings on the Dali IO 12. I am considering buying them this week. I tried the ML 5909 with a range of music and needed the volume at maybe 80% or more. Just felt I’d like to have more volume in the tank if required. Hoping the Dalis have a wider volume range. Do you have an initial view on this? Thanks and happy new year.
The Dali IO-12 headphones have a wider volume range compared to the Mark Levison 5909. 👍
Let me know how they work out for you, okay.
All the best
Frederick
Perfect, thank you so much Frederick.
I have an iPhone, I'm looking for a great audio quallity pair of headphones, intending to occasionally use them with wire for lossless audio, can afford only one, which one of these would you recommend me to buy? or should I get a DAC and use wired headphones?
Thanks for watching my review!
If you want a pair of headphones that sound 'fun' och 'musical' then try out the Bowers & Wilkins Px8.
And if you want the most sound quality, wide sound stage and depth then try out the Focal Bathys.
Let me know how they work out for you, okay.
Cheers
Frederick
bardzo dobra recenzja słuchawek pozdrawiam
Thanks for your kind words!
Im the Biggest Headphones Freak out there 🙏,❤🤫
I have all three. focal wins. About after a year the glue on b&w and mL headband has come lose on mine.