The confusion with English terms "conscript" and "reservist" in Finnish context is a translation and concept issue. We tend to translate "varusmies" into "conscript", but really it means someone who is in process of getting mandatory military training. "Varusmies" are not used in combat operations, barring very particular exceptions, as their training is not complete. "Reservist" is correctly translated from "reserviläinen". This is someone who has completed their training, is living a civilian life and are available for wartime deployment. The English meaning of "conscript" as citizen obligated to serve in the military would be "asevelvollinen", someone obligated to bear arms. The Finnish wartime force consists of reservists, but not "varusmies" conscripts. To add to the confusion women can voulenteer to become "varusmies" conscripts, which will make them "asevelvollinen" and after the training is complete, a reservist.
Indeed and especially the military, like in the English version of the PDF "A guide for getting ready for military service" uses "conscript" as a translation for "varusmies", even specifically mentioning "female conscripts" and indeed, once the female volunteer has entered the barracks, she will be in the same training and in the same legal position as the male conscripts (except there's this 30 day "this was not good idea, I'll bail out" option men do not (officially) have, unsure if that is actually used very often). So it's not like a modern version of Lotta Svärd or anything like that. Especially the Voluntary military service for women should not be confused with the Voluntary National Defence, which is a state-sanctioned system of training not only reservists but also civilians to be prepared for all kinds of cases of "serious disruption and exceptional circumstance".
Yeah word conscript is often associated with idea of sending waves of untrained conscripts to war, but conscription exists for us precisely so it does not happen - everyone is already trained for when war happens. Ironically training untrained conscripts to war happens more to countries with professional militaries, because they don't have massive trained reserve to rely on. Now ofc Finnish conscripts are not as good as experienced professionals. But conscription itself is still just method of acquiring recruits, not definition of quality. Finland is not Soviet Union, and Finnish conscripts regularly train against professionals from other western countries, and have been, ironically, described as "professional".
One correction though, if a war was to break out, conscripts would no doubt be used in war time operations. They are legally mandated to participate in combat operations defending Finland, so as long as it is determined that their training is up to the task, they are going to be used. We have conscript readiness units, who are literally our first line of defence if an attack happens. They are already used in peace time duties that could be hairy, for an example when the Eagle S tanker was detained last week in the Gulf of Finland, Finnish Navy was present with one Rauma-class missile boat. And that boat has conscript sailors onboard.
@foleymaj The field army consists of reservist "asevelvollinen" conscripts. "Varusmies" conscripts, barring the mentioned readiness units, have not completed their training and it would be unlikely for them to be thrown into combat, at least en masse.
Thank you Chieftain for making multi part series of my birth country tank museum. When I moved to Canada and than USA. I can speak from experience. For me it was very hard to learn fluent English. It’s almost impossible to get rid of Finnish accent. Thank you letting Timo speak. At some parts I can see him being frustrated, as he is trying communicate his thoughts in English. Happy and safe New Year 2025 everyone
1:16:58 "How do you pull a stuck KV." In a Finnish book there is a photo of a KV-1 being towed by two tracked tractors: 14.5 ton Catepillar D7 and 11.2 ton Stalinets S-65. In Finnish army the lack of powerful towing vehicles was a big issue for a very long time, both for tank recovery and artillery towing. In Winter War they even had to leave behind BT tanks as they were just too heavy. Then in 1944 some units had to leave behind their heaviest artillery guns as only very slow tractors could have moved them. Those were few and many of them had been moved to dig the Salpa-line. After the war some better tracked vehicles were bought, though the road speed and fuel consumption were considered too bad. Meanwhile powerful and heavy enough trucks got too large and their cross-country mobility was too poor, even on forest roads. The needs weren't truly satisfied until the domestic two and three axel MASI trucks and 155mm guns with APU. By the way the BT-42 was build with great hindsight: It is the only true Christie tank able to accommodate lieutenant colonel Moran.
To answer the question at 1:03:00 , I'd say Finland is an infantry country. Or perhaps a country of the regular soldier, as we have a lot of memorials and monuments that commemorate the soldiers raised from whichever local area you happen to be. It is a citizen military after all.
Well, considering the geography and the kinds of threats Finland has faced (and is likely to face in the future), that makes sense. Finland doesn’t need much of a Navy or Air Force, certainly less than most other nearby countries facing the same kinds of threats, so your average Finn can reasonably expect to become a ground pounder during their service. Also, from my limited experience, Finns aren’t big on elitism so ground pounders are seen as the backbone of the military rather than as the bottom of the barrel like in some other countries’ militaries.
@markfergerson2145 Well, there is a relatively strong Air Force, with 64 F-35A on order and the Navy surprisingly isn't actually that small, compared to what other countries have on the Baltic sea. But for sure the Army has a solid degree of primacy exactly for the reasons you stated.
@@Iceman_zZz In a political sense Finland is really close to being an island, so a respectable navy isn't that surprising. The few small (and long) roads up north aren't enough to supply the nation in case of crisis.
The reason why snorkeling was "just tested" (as he said), in Finland is that our riverbeds are generally muddy and not rocky or sandy like in central Europe where the soviets were thinking to use their tanks. There is great risk of getting stuck underwater trying that same trick in Finland.
32:30, I think thats something he remembers wrong. While big portion of T72s that Finland used were bought from stockpiles of former East Germany in early 1990s, the first 63x T72s were bought/delivered from Soviet Union between 1984-1986
Winter war joke was- Soviets were accusing Finns receiving weapons from secretly from unknown neutral nation. It was Soviets themselves sending weapons to Finland, by soldiers refusing to fight in freezing cold.
@@Mal0Imperzia I wouldn't say endless, the count of modern captured tanks in working condition was always quite low (sources I find easily claim "about a dozen" typically). The T-26s were more plentiful, there were over 100 in the end of war, but they were basically useless against the T-34s.
44:24 This is the case only for 2A4's, which are nowdays mostly used as an infantry support element in case of there being enemy armour on the battlefield. We do have big battlegroups of 2A6's (sometimes including 2A4's) that very much conduct the same kind of operations and assaults you might see in the United States Army, albeit with finnish finesse added on
Main Battle Tanks yes I guess...Because UK is planning to reduce their tank numbers from 227 to 148 by 2027, and since Finland has 200 MBTs, that is gonna be very soon the case if it isnt already that Finland has more MBTs. UK has 3x the number of IFVs though, although those too are being replaced/phased out by smaller number of new IFVs and larger number of armoured personnel carriers
@Servoxyl Having a tiny army when you are an island is much more of a deterrent when you have a decent sized navy. I will remind you that currently there is a ground war in Europe. Evil is on the march, in Europe and threatening in Asia. It might be time to pay attention and increase the military to a credible level.
@@Balnazzardi Operational tanks I think we only have about 150 anyway already. The others aren't "operational" which I guess means they are in need of repair or are being used as spare parts.
@@Punisher9419The amount of Leopard 2 main battle tanks and specialist combat vehicles such as engineering variants based on the chassis that Finland has bought alltogether is about 240 from memory. A number of them are converted into specialist vehicles and a few are stored for spare parts. 200 is the often cited official figure for operational main battle tanks.
My wife is from Finland and from a little town called Hamina. There's a StuG III on a pedestal outside a UN peacekeeping museum, in incredibly good condition considering it's outside
A huge thank you to Timo and Nicholas for this fascinating glimpse into Finland's history :-) Looking forward to a deeper dive into Parola and the Finnish armor collection!
I've always been fascinated by Finnish weapons, from small arms to armor. They took Russian/Soviet weapons and made them some much better than what they were.
About the close range fighting in Finland: as a crunchie my expected fighting range was 0-75m, rarely farther than that outside western Finland or cities
I remember the sudden interest BT-42 got after the Girls und Panzer episodes. I think it was strange enough happening to also be reported in Finnish National Media Yle.
Don't remember seeing it in media, but apparently it made meaningful impact in getting donations for constructing the building the tank is currently in. Before it was kept outside.
I am pleased to be catching up with Finnish military history. There are several Finnish YT personalities I like and Finland is now a NATO ally. It is good to hear how our northern flank is doing.
The Pasi also had a competitor before entering service, as Valmet had also provided a prototype APC (which can also be found in the museum). The international gun/military scene probably knows Valmet rifles, but they also made a lot of agricultural tractors (those who have played My Summer Car are familiar with a very classic model). So, they indeed created a Panssari-Valmet. It was based on a tractor, not any tractor but the quite weird looking and commercially failed six-wheeler Valmet 1502. Like usually is the case with farm tractors, the rear axles had no suspension. The ride must been "interesting" for the guys in the back when going highway speeds.
There was a T-34 I think on display at my garrison in Dragsvik when I did my national service as an anti-tank squad leader. There was also the shell of a T-26 that we practised our anti tank skills on as well which may now be in Parola.
The GDR didnt actualy build there own tanks, of the 549 T-72 inherited by the Bundeswehr 133 were build in the USSR, 156 in Poland and 260 in the CSSR acordig to an request of information to the Geeman Federal Goverment.
@mbr5742 there acually was one armoured vehicle build in some numbers in the GDR, the so called SK-1 based on the Garant 30k chassis, but they we're relegated to Party militia use by the early 60s
14:20 Yugoslavia also had same deals with Soviets, they constantly owed money and where paying in oil and wepons. Croatia had last payment from Russia in late 90s/early 2000s, we got many new Mi-117 helicopters. Not bad. Debt was than leveled.
well, thank you japanese anime for providing rooves over these historical tanks! ill bet they could crowdfund to restore those unique vehicles. im sure tank enthusiasts across the globe would help out.
9:35 pardon, im just an accountant and not even long in the job (in general) what is considdered a good payment nowadays? And did he mean in general or compared to the rest of the army?
In general, compared to other options young man (or woman these days) could have. One well known perk of the peacekeeping missions used to be the imported cars. Cars used to be quite expensive in Finland, with the special car tax adding some like 30% over what the sticker price would have normally been. But if you worked abroad and could prove that you had this car, you had used it as your personal vehicle during this time and also earned enough money on the gig to buy it (i.e. not bought a very expensive car with savings gathered before the gig), you could also import it tax free and register normally in Finland. There was some limitations, I think you had to keep it some time after importing and most notable, you had to actually use it on the mission (or at least somehow you needed to get some mileage and signs of normal use on it), which apparently caused some issues considering the situations peacekeepers were needed to begin with. (One guy tells in a newspaper that while he was in the UNIFIL mission in Lebanon in the 80s, he travelled to Germany, bought a new Mercedes and drove it to Israel, where he got some storage space for it)
1:08:17 actually his saying the engraved stone tank obstacle fits the finnish character seems spot on. it represents defense from outside attack which one could say finnland did masterfully. so it seems very fitting.
True, but the correct answer to Chieftains question would have been war cemetery (sankarihautausmaa), which exists in each and every town, and is the site of memorial services.
Muzzle brakes are fantastic things. As long as you aren't standing next to whatever happens to be using it at the time. Even the relatively tame 5.56 is very unpleasant to be next to when fitted with one. So I can only imagine the absolute joy of a couple pounds of powder lighting off in the tank next to you.
It is unfortunate there is no StuG in Finland with the modifications they added in late 1944, despite how many of them there are left. The concrete armor and side logs were stripped off after the war. Only the one sold to Bovington has received those back.
Thanks to both of you for a very informative tour! Upon reflection, it's not surprising that the USSR did not sell their best tanks and ammo to a potential next-door adversary.
Thanks Nicholas for another great year. Here's to ongoing success and all the best for 2025!
2 дня назад
34:16 ish. Many of the East German T-72 were license produced in Poland and the CSSR I think. Maybe those werent quite up to the soviet standard? Or maybe the soviets took speical care with the tanks build for Finnland because they knew those would be seen by the west?
Ye some were build in Poland, some in former Czechoslovakia. I think lot of it had simply to do with cutting down manufacturing costs down to as minimum as possible and the other part was that Soviets always wanted to have the superior versions of the tanks to themselves. Kind of like when they refused to sell Finland the best possible ammunition for T72s. So even if former Warsaw pact countries made have had similar ammunition that Soviets had, those T72s still had weaker armor, firing control and were more prone to malfunctions. I mean consider the situation where Soviets went to Hungary or Czechoslovakia during Cold War to stop any unrest. If Warsaw Pact countries had turned against their regimes/Soviet Union, Soviets always wanted to have the upper hand/superior equipment in such situations. And even the tanks that we did buy from Soviet Union, were the exported T72M Or M1 versions, which were similarly equipped and armored as the very first T72A/Ural models, but inferior to later Soviet upgraded models in both armor and firing control systems. Thats why the upgrades that Finland made to T55s actually made them better (atleast in terms of armament and firing control) compared to our T72s
The T-34 muzzle brake is not a postwar modification. There are photos of this specific tank with the brake on in mid 1944. When they were talking about Russia being a tank country, USA being a plane country and Britain being a ship country, and what kind of country Finland is? The answer would be "artillery country". Finland has a very long history with artillery systems and techniques. Finland still has the largest artillery in western Europe.
Especially novadays, when compared to other western minded European countries. I believe that is still not enough, but on paper the figure for artillery pieces was last year staggering 1690. That is perhaps somewhat less impressive when one remembers that about a half of that are heavy mortars.
@@brlbrlbrlbrl D-30 is among the best towed light howitzers there are. They are quicker to set up than 105mm equivalents and although they lose some advantage in range and the 122mm grenade does a load of hurt on target.
Id still argue that Finland is an infantry country since artillery is generally not considered cool (and they are the butt end of the jokes in our conscription culture). The average finnish monument would probably be a winter geared jaeger with a rifle and maybe a molotov cocktail. Or often with a Suomi KP
@@Jaggaraz218 I find the Molotov cocktail trope to be affront to my anti-tank esteem. We use hollow charges these days. In all seriousness, infantry is nothing without artillery and artillery can achieve nothing without infantry.
The GDR did not build any T-72s itself. If the tanks that came from there were worse built, then it was because the Russians had sold their scrap to them or perhaps they were licensed constructions from Poland or Czechoslovakia that were perhaps worse?
A guy i know was in the GDR tank rgt that received T72s. The russian and cssr made one where ok(ish). By those from poland, they assumed outright sabotage
I know the representative of Parola is not a native English speaker, but boy, it's like pulling teeth to get responses ... but carry on they did! Appreciate the look at an often overlooked history.
@@paulfarace9595 He clearly had some difficulty understanding some of the questions. Unfortunate, but I'm sure the comments will do their job and add the missing details as we go.
Decades ago one of my students who served in the Finnish border Jaegers up in Lapland told me that during his days as a conscript, whenever the drill sergeants thought the men showed signs of slacking off, they had them crawl through the snow and throw (I assume inert) Molotov cocktails or (definitely inert) satchel charges at a target T-34 "sotka" that stood on the training grounds. I hope that poor tank has now been taken off the range and restored for posterity.
As long as you are only practicing with a BMP, it is probably a very practical vehicle. So it may well be that the Finns like theirs. But as soon as someone shoots back, you pay the price for the ability to swim.
Finland has approximately 187,000 lakes within its borders, then all the rivers and swamps on top of that. you also pay the price for not having ability to swim.
@thechieftain 20:28 I'm curious.Did the curators radiator break, as he seems to be leaking water from his arm and pocket? :D It's obvious he's not peeing himself, but it looks more like something funny happened before the cut, did a soda blow in his arms or somtehing? :D
Captain... the trees are speaking Finnish! No problem, we now have them exactly where we want them... But Captain... one of them is speaking Finnish with a lisp. Well comrade... we are now truly f--k'd.
@@electraglide2818Barely related to this topic, but interesting to certain audiences none the less. The ultimately modified Finnish Mosin must be the 7.62 TKIV 85 which is chambered in 7.62x53R. I bet that not a whole lot of people in the world besides Finnish reservists can claim to have shot with this peculiarity.
T55 was very good tank in 50s and 60s. Also T72 was good in 70s. Much much cheaper then american tanks at that time we talk about 10 to 12 soviet tanks for 1 american. Also BMP1 was amazing in 60s abd 70s. Btadleys didnt arrive until 80s and cost 25 times more then BMP1.
True Soviet tanks were good for their time.However from 80s onwards the western tanks/IFVs have been superior. Even so we FInns still use modernized BMP2s although they are likely gonna be replaced by newest version of CV-90 in next decade
Happy to see that the Finns with the T-55M was inspired by Oddball (from the film Kelly's Heroes) and put a sleve over the gun barrel to make it look bigger. But sad to hear that Timo don't explain to Nick that the reason for the big turret of the BT-42 was so it could be used for a sauna where the tankers could have a good time with viina while screaming "vittu perkele saatana" (the most used words in the Finnish language ;) )
In theory, yes. But it was one of the questions I asked the troopers when I was doing my video there, and they observed that the majority of the training was geared to UN type missions.
@michaelmulligan0 I mean, it's understandable that training would be geared towards the most likely actual use. We had the same problem in the US. After a brief grounding in conventional ops, it was realized that no matter the theory requirements, new LTs would be thrown into low intensity ops and training geared towards that.
On behalf of all Finns I do have to apologize for the attrocious level of English spoken by the expert. I feel a tremendous amount of potential was wasted because he continuously misunderstood what The Chieftain was asking or lacked the language skills to properly explain things. I wish they had a guy with better English skills do this.
Thank you Chieftain for making multi part series of my birth country tank museum. When I moved to Canada and than USA. I can speak from experience. For me it was very hard to learn fluent English. It’s almost impossible to get rid of Finnish accent. Thank you letting Timo speak. At some parts I can see him being frustrated, as he is trying communicate his thoughts in English. Happy and safe New Year 2025 everyone
Thank you The Chietain. Appreciate your efford to promote and indroduce Finnish armour history. Hello from effing Finland.
One lesson learned during WW2, is you don't eff with Finland! ^-^
Where exactly is Effing, Finland located? Can't seem to find it on the map. Is it anywhere near Perkele or Paska?
The confusion with English terms "conscript" and "reservist" in Finnish context is a translation and concept issue.
We tend to translate "varusmies" into "conscript", but really it means someone who is in process of getting mandatory military training. "Varusmies" are not used in combat operations, barring very particular exceptions, as their training is not complete.
"Reservist" is correctly translated from "reserviläinen". This is someone who has completed their training, is living a civilian life and are available for wartime deployment.
The English meaning of "conscript" as citizen obligated to serve in the military would be "asevelvollinen", someone obligated to bear arms.
The Finnish wartime force consists of reservists, but not "varusmies" conscripts.
To add to the confusion women can voulenteer to become "varusmies" conscripts, which will make them "asevelvollinen" and after the training is complete, a reservist.
Indeed and especially the military, like in the English version of the PDF "A guide for getting ready for military service" uses "conscript" as a translation for "varusmies", even specifically mentioning "female conscripts" and indeed, once the female volunteer has entered the barracks, she will be in the same training and in the same legal position as the male conscripts (except there's this 30 day "this was not good idea, I'll bail out" option men do not (officially) have, unsure if that is actually used very often). So it's not like a modern version of Lotta Svärd or anything like that.
Especially the Voluntary military service for women should not be confused with the Voluntary National Defence, which is a state-sanctioned system of training not only reservists but also civilians to be prepared for all kinds of cases of "serious disruption and exceptional circumstance".
@@mikkoolavijarvinen3653 The whole thing translates pretty poorly, but is in fact quite straightforward when you consider it in the intended language.
Yeah word conscript is often associated with idea of sending waves of untrained conscripts to war, but conscription exists for us precisely so it does not happen - everyone is already trained for when war happens. Ironically training untrained conscripts to war happens more to countries with professional militaries, because they don't have massive trained reserve to rely on.
Now ofc Finnish conscripts are not as good as experienced professionals. But conscription itself is still just method of acquiring recruits, not definition of quality. Finland is not Soviet Union, and Finnish conscripts regularly train against professionals from other western countries, and have been, ironically, described as "professional".
One correction though, if a war was to break out, conscripts would no doubt be used in war time operations. They are legally mandated to participate in combat operations defending Finland, so as long as it is determined that their training is up to the task, they are going to be used.
We have conscript readiness units, who are literally our first line of defence if an attack happens. They are already used in peace time duties that could be hairy, for an example when the Eagle S tanker was detained last week in the Gulf of Finland, Finnish Navy was present with one Rauma-class missile boat. And that boat has conscript sailors onboard.
@foleymaj The field army consists of reservist "asevelvollinen" conscripts. "Varusmies" conscripts, barring the mentioned readiness units, have not completed their training and it would be unlikely for them to be thrown into combat, at least en masse.
Thank you Chieftain for making multi part series of my birth country tank museum. When I moved to Canada and than USA. I can speak from experience. For me it was very hard to learn fluent English. It’s almost impossible to get rid of Finnish accent. Thank you letting Timo speak. At some parts I can see him being frustrated, as he is trying communicate his thoughts in English.
Happy and safe New Year 2025 everyone
I love the finnish accent in English. We worked a lot with Finns after 2005 on the OL3 power plant. It was always a very funny time with these guys.
1:16:58 "How do you pull a stuck KV."
In a Finnish book there is a photo of a KV-1 being towed by two tracked tractors: 14.5 ton Catepillar D7 and 11.2 ton Stalinets S-65.
In Finnish army the lack of powerful towing vehicles was a big issue for a very long time, both for tank recovery and artillery towing. In Winter War they even had to leave behind BT tanks as they were just too heavy. Then in 1944 some units had to leave behind their heaviest artillery guns as only very slow tractors could have moved them. Those were few and many of them had been moved to dig the Salpa-line.
After the war some better tracked vehicles were bought, though the road speed and fuel consumption were considered too bad. Meanwhile powerful and heavy enough trucks got too large and their cross-country mobility was too poor, even on forest roads. The needs weren't truly satisfied until the domestic two and three axel MASI trucks and 155mm guns with APU.
By the way the BT-42 was build with great hindsight: It is the only true Christie tank able to accommodate lieutenant colonel Moran.
To answer the question at 1:03:00 , I'd say Finland is an infantry country. Or perhaps a country of the regular soldier, as we have a lot of memorials and monuments that commemorate the soldiers raised from whichever local area you happen to be. It is a citizen military after all.
Or maybe an artillery country as Finland has quite many artillery pieces?
@PaintsAreOp Absolutely. But when it comes to monuments, it's infantry/regular soldier thing.
Well, considering the geography and the kinds of threats Finland has faced (and is likely to face in the future), that makes sense. Finland doesn’t need much of a Navy or Air Force, certainly less than most other nearby countries facing the same kinds of threats, so your average Finn can reasonably expect to become a ground pounder during their service. Also, from my limited experience, Finns aren’t big on elitism so ground pounders are seen as the backbone of the military rather than as the bottom of the barrel like in some other countries’ militaries.
@markfergerson2145 Well, there is a relatively strong Air Force, with 64 F-35A on order and the Navy surprisingly isn't actually that small, compared to what other countries have on the Baltic sea. But for sure the Army has a solid degree of primacy exactly for the reasons you stated.
@@Iceman_zZz In a political sense Finland is really close to being an island, so a respectable navy isn't that surprising. The few small (and long) roads up north aren't enough to supply the nation in case of crisis.
The reason why snorkeling was "just tested" (as he said), in Finland is that our riverbeds are generally muddy and not rocky or sandy like in central Europe where the soviets were thinking to use their tanks. There is great risk of getting stuck underwater trying that same trick in Finland.
32:30, I think thats something he remembers wrong. While big portion of T72s that Finland used were bought from stockpiles of former East Germany in early 1990s, the first 63x T72s were bought/delivered from Soviet Union between 1984-1986
thank you Mr Timo Teräsvalli for showing us all around!
Never realized what his last name was before reading this. Translates to steel wall or rampart. Nomen est omen, as they say
Russia. The biggest supplier of tanks to countries they are invading since 1939!
Polka intensifies
Winter war joke was- Soviets were accusing Finns receiving weapons from secretly from unknown neutral nation. It was Soviets themselves sending weapons to Finland, by soldiers refusing to fight in freezing cold.
Its insane how many tanks the finns captured, they literally just got endless anounts of tanks from 39 to 44 and had AMPLE ammo and fuel.
no. they got 9 t34 in entire wars. finland lost both wars with many many died and had to give lots of territory to soviet@@Mal0Imperzia
@@Mal0Imperzia I wouldn't say endless, the count of modern captured tanks in working condition was always quite low (sources I find easily claim "about a dozen" typically). The T-26s were more plentiful, there were over 100 in the end of war, but they were basically useless against the T-34s.
44:24 This is the case only for 2A4's, which are nowdays mostly used as an infantry support element in case of there being enemy armour on the battlefield. We do have big battlegroups of 2A6's (sometimes including 2A4's) that very much conduct the same kind of operations and assaults you might see in the United States Army, albeit with finnish finesse added on
His last name, Teräsvalli, means literally "steel wall". A suiting name for a tank officer!
Finland probably has more operational tanks then the UK does these days.
Main Battle Tanks yes I guess...Because UK is planning to reduce their tank numbers from 227 to 148 by 2027, and since Finland has 200 MBTs, that is gonna be very soon the case if it isnt already that Finland has more MBTs. UK has 3x the number of IFVs though, although those too are being replaced/phased out by smaller number of new IFVs and larger number of armoured personnel carriers
Well, the UK is an island. A large ground force isn’t quite as important for an island nation. Unless of course you are into nation interventions.
@Servoxyl Having a tiny army when you are an island is much more of a deterrent when you have a decent sized navy. I will remind you that currently there is a ground war in Europe. Evil is on the march, in Europe and threatening in Asia. It might be time to pay attention and increase the military to a credible level.
@@Balnazzardi Operational tanks I think we only have about 150 anyway already. The others aren't "operational" which I guess means they are in need of repair or are being used as spare parts.
@@Punisher9419The amount of Leopard 2 main battle tanks and specialist combat vehicles such as engineering variants based on the chassis that Finland has bought alltogether is about 240 from memory. A number of them are converted into specialist vehicles and a few are stored for spare parts. 200 is the often cited official figure for operational main battle tanks.
My wife is from Finland and from a little town called Hamina. There's a StuG III on a pedestal outside a UN peacekeeping museum, in incredibly good condition considering it's outside
It was restored in 2003 and these days it's under shelter. There are couple of books by Andreas Lärka, which tell the history of each Finnish StuG.
A huge thank you to Timo and Nicholas for this fascinating glimpse into Finland's history :-)
Looking forward to a deeper dive into Parola and the Finnish armor collection!
Thank you The Chietain! We are proud that you made these episodes about Finnish armor history!
Kiitos tästä.
I've always been fascinated by Finnish weapons, from small arms to armor. They took Russian/Soviet weapons and made them some much better than what they were.
About the close range fighting in Finland: as a crunchie my expected fighting range was 0-75m, rarely farther than that outside western Finland or cities
I remember the sudden interest BT-42 got after the Girls und Panzer episodes. I think it was strange enough happening to also be reported in Finnish National Media Yle.
Don't remember seeing it in media, but apparently it made meaningful impact in getting donations for constructing the building the tank is currently in. Before it was kept outside.
Whenever I see anything related to Finland, three things come to my mind. Metal, Sisu and Talvisota ❤❤❤
Im going there soon! Cool to learn more about this awesome museum! Thank you for the great videos!
Very interesting! Although, some points lost in translation, I feel :)
Classic Finnish conversationalist
I am pleased to be catching up with Finnish military history. There are several Finnish YT personalities I like and Finland is now a NATO ally. It is good to hear how our northern flank is doing.
1:48 - The muzzle-brake on the Ps.231-1 was present already in 1944.
1:21:42 and those cartoon watchers will happily give you money to restore a tank from the show they like.
The Pasi also had a competitor before entering service, as Valmet had also provided a prototype APC (which can also be found in the museum). The international gun/military scene probably knows Valmet rifles, but they also made a lot of agricultural tractors (those who have played My Summer Car are familiar with a very classic model). So, they indeed created a Panssari-Valmet. It was based on a tractor, not any tractor but the quite weird looking and commercially failed six-wheeler Valmet 1502. Like usually is the case with farm tractors, the rear axles had no suspension. The ride must been "interesting" for the guys in the back when going highway speeds.
There was a T-34 I think on display at my garrison in Dragsvik when I did my national service as an anti-tank squad leader. There was also the shell of a T-26 that we practised our anti tank skills on as well which may now be in Parola.
You've found an amazing resource at Parola. What an interesting and knowledgeable tanker!
The GDR didnt actualy build there own tanks, of the 549 T-72 inherited by the Bundeswehr 133 were build in the USSR, 156 in Poland and 260 in the CSSR acordig to an request of information to the Geeman Federal Goverment.
Well I guess a tank with a 2-stroke engine and Duroplast hull would be less than welcome :)
@mbr5742 there acually was one armoured vehicle build in some numbers in the GDR, the so called SK-1 based on the Garant 30k chassis, but they we're relegated to Party militia use by the early 60s
When i was in army 96-97 in Mikkeli. It was only place where btr 60 was in service and there was two btr 80 in storage.
14:20 Yugoslavia also had same deals with Soviets, they constantly owed money and where paying in oil and wepons.
Croatia had last payment from Russia in late 90s/early 2000s, we got many new Mi-117 helicopters. Not bad.
Debt was than leveled.
Happy New Year!
Could you consider not using the premiere feature? It's annoying to have a newly uploaded video act as if it's a live stream even though it's not.
Really cool stuff, hope they get the money to overhaul some of these rarer pieces.
well, thank you japanese anime for providing rooves over these historical tanks! ill bet they could crowdfund to restore those unique vehicles. im sure tank enthusiasts across the globe would help out.
9:35 pardon, im just an accountant and not even long in the job (in general) what is considdered a good payment nowadays? And did he mean in general or compared to the rest of the army?
Peacekeeper's salary starts at 2 759,04€ a month + 28,70€ - 80,00 tax-free extra a day depending where they've been send.
In general, compared to other options young man (or woman these days) could have.
One well known perk of the peacekeeping missions used to be the imported cars. Cars used to be quite expensive in Finland, with the special car tax adding some like 30% over what the sticker price would have normally been. But if you worked abroad and could prove that you had this car, you had used it as your personal vehicle during this time and also earned enough money on the gig to buy it (i.e. not bought a very expensive car with savings gathered before the gig), you could also import it tax free and register normally in Finland. There was some limitations, I think you had to keep it some time after importing and most notable, you had to actually use it on the mission (or at least somehow you needed to get some mileage and signs of normal use on it), which apparently caused some issues considering the situations peacekeepers were needed to begin with. (One guy tells in a newspaper that while he was in the UNIFIL mission in Lebanon in the 80s, he travelled to Germany, bought a new Mercedes and drove it to Israel, where he got some storage space for it)
1:08:17 actually his saying the engraved stone tank obstacle fits the finnish character seems spot on. it represents defense from outside attack which one could say finnland did masterfully. so it seems very fitting.
True, but the correct answer to Chieftains question would have been war cemetery (sankarihautausmaa), which exists in each and every town, and is the site of memorial services.
Muzzle brakes are fantastic things. As long as you aren't standing next to whatever happens to be using it at the time. Even the relatively tame 5.56 is very unpleasant to be next to when fitted with one. So I can only imagine the absolute joy of a couple pounds of powder lighting off in the tank next to you.
It is unfortunate there is no StuG in Finland with the modifications they added in late 1944, despite how many of them there are left. The concrete armor and side logs were stripped off after the war. Only the one sold to Bovington has received those back.
1:25:00 actually track width is not the same but russian tracks are only 4 millimeters narrower
I saw the BT42 when i visited Finland, they were having a photoshoot with girls on it... I don't remember anything else from the museum
6 tanks towing a command tank... This is Santa sled, Finnish version 😁
Thanks to both of you for a very informative tour!
Upon reflection, it's not surprising that the USSR did not sell their best tanks and ammo to a potential next-door adversary.
Thanks Nicholas for another great year. Here's to ongoing success and all the best for 2025!
34:16 ish. Many of the East German T-72 were license produced in Poland and the CSSR I think. Maybe those werent quite up to the soviet standard? Or maybe the soviets took speical care with the tanks build for Finnland because they knew those would be seen by the west?
Ye some were build in Poland, some in former Czechoslovakia. I think lot of it had simply to do with cutting down manufacturing costs down to as minimum as possible and the other part was that Soviets always wanted to have the superior versions of the tanks to themselves. Kind of like when they refused to sell Finland the best possible ammunition for T72s. So even if former Warsaw pact countries made have had similar ammunition that Soviets had, those T72s still had weaker armor, firing control and were more prone to malfunctions. I mean consider the situation where Soviets went to Hungary or Czechoslovakia during Cold War to stop any unrest. If Warsaw Pact countries had turned against their regimes/Soviet Union, Soviets always wanted to have the upper hand/superior equipment in such situations.
And even the tanks that we did buy from Soviet Union, were the exported T72M Or M1 versions, which were similarly equipped and armored as the very first T72A/Ural models, but inferior to later Soviet upgraded models in both armor and firing control systems. Thats why the upgrades that Finland made to T55s actually made them better (atleast in terms of armament and firing control) compared to our T72s
The T-34 muzzle brake is not a postwar modification. There are photos of this specific tank with the brake on in mid 1944.
When they were talking about Russia being a tank country, USA being a plane country and Britain being a ship country, and what kind of country Finland is? The answer would be "artillery country". Finland has a very long history with artillery systems and techniques. Finland still has the largest artillery in western Europe.
Especially novadays, when compared to other western minded European countries. I believe that is still not enough, but on paper the figure for artillery pieces was last year staggering 1690. That is perhaps somewhat less impressive when one remembers that about a half of that are heavy mortars.
@@herptek And a bit under 500 of the 700ish towed pieces are 122mm D-30 howitzers from the 60's, so not exactly the best possible.
@@brlbrlbrlbrl D-30 is among the best towed light howitzers there are. They are quicker to set up than 105mm equivalents and although they lose some advantage in range and the 122mm grenade does a load of hurt on target.
Id still argue that Finland is an infantry country since artillery is generally not considered cool (and they are the butt end of the jokes in our conscription culture).
The average finnish monument would probably be a winter geared jaeger with a rifle and maybe a molotov cocktail. Or often with a Suomi KP
@@Jaggaraz218 I find the Molotov cocktail trope to be affront to my anti-tank esteem. We use hollow charges these days.
In all seriousness, infantry is nothing without artillery and artillery can achieve nothing without infantry.
The GDR did not build any T-72s itself. If the tanks that came from there were worse built, then it was because the Russians had sold their scrap to them or perhaps they were licensed constructions from Poland or Czechoslovakia that were perhaps worse?
A guy i know was in the GDR tank rgt that received T72s. The russian and cssr made one where ok(ish). By those from poland, they assumed outright sabotage
52:25 thanks dad lol 😅🙈❤
I know the representative of Parola is not a native English speaker, but boy, it's like pulling teeth to get responses ... but carry on they did! Appreciate the look at an often overlooked history.
I know right? I'm a Finn myself and I find it extremely frustrating to wait my country man to form a sentence.
@@jonnekallu1627Don’t be embarrassed or anything. We already know that Finns prefer action over talking.
Ah it is also some nerves i think, he tries his best and its still very informative, you can set the video speed a bit higher if that helps.
@@paulfarace9595 He clearly had some difficulty understanding some of the questions. Unfortunate, but I'm sure the comments will do their job and add the missing details as we go.
Give him a break dude, he's good for being of that age.
I loved his story on the East German bought stuff. Somehow I can believe his story about the workshop guys.
Hope you had a great chrismas
1:03:20 We have bunker monuments. A lot bunkers.
39:35 Jägermeister :D
Der Mann hat Geschmack!
Decades ago one of my students who served in the Finnish border Jaegers up in Lapland told me that during his days as a conscript, whenever the drill sergeants thought the men showed signs of slacking off, they had them crawl through the snow and throw (I assume inert) Molotov cocktails or (definitely inert) satchel charges at a target T-34 "sotka" that stood on the training grounds. I hope that poor tank has now been taken off the range and restored for posterity.
Snow chains on a Xa-180 are the best armor on the bucket
42:26 could we make the same argument in Ireland?
Not good tank country ?
A lot of minor rivers, hills & mountains
Fun fact: his name Timo Teräsvalli can be translated as Tim Steel Wall, which is quite a suitable name for a tanker.
great video 5/5
Least awkward Finnish conversation
As long as you are only practicing with a BMP, it is probably a very practical vehicle. So it may well be that the Finns like theirs. But as soon as someone shoots back, you pay the price for the ability to swim.
Finland has approximately 187,000 lakes within its borders, then all the rivers and swamps on top of that. you also pay the price for not having ability to swim.
So, the finnish people here in the Nordics, are the introverts of our scandinavian brothers. But still a highly interesting video :)
@thechieftain 20:28 I'm curious.Did the curators radiator break, as he seems to be leaking water from his arm and pocket? :D It's obvious he's not peeing himself, but it looks more like something funny happened before the cut, did a soda blow in his arms or somtehing? :D
you can ses bottle on the right
Finns: * add muzzle brake *
Russians: "NYET, TANK IS FINE."
01:19:58
Säkkijärven Polkka starts playing
Mikko, hidari!
Good job chieftain, any finn that I've known aren't exactly talkers, nor have a sende of humor, very reserved. Until u get them drinking.
Btw, the guys lastname translates to Steelwall
1:03:00 Finns also have a british warship as a monument, in Kokkola since 1854. ruclips.net/video/me8U2LtNVlw/видео.html
The first (soviet) T-72s came to Finland in 1984. We bought more from DDR in the 90's.
You need to get on BlueSky and defend your good name!
ISU-152 T-34/85 Panzer4 and just littlebit about Sturm.... Little dissapoint of that...
Captain... the trees are speaking Finnish!
No problem, we now have them exactly where we want them...
But Captain... one of them is speaking Finnish with a lisp.
Well comrade... we are now truly f--k'd.
not only we bring armor in peace keeping mission, we bring sauna with us.
First batch T - 72 tanks arrive to Finland 1984 - 1985.
lol, not use to hearing so many naughty words in these vids
Finns will be Finns. No filters.
The Finns took and improved the Mosin rifle.
Finns take what they need from their environment and make something better. Even in war.
@@ABrit-bt6ce Yep that was my point.
@@electraglide2818Barely related to this topic, but interesting to certain audiences none the less. The ultimately modified Finnish Mosin must be the 7.62 TKIV 85 which is chambered in 7.62x53R. I bet that not a whole lot of people in the world besides Finnish reservists can claim to have shot with this peculiarity.
Finland always in a tough spot because of Russia .
luckily russias (and ukraine, never forget 1940) combat doctrine has always been ass. they're easy to beat if they have no idea what they're doing
It's an interesting topic, but sometimes it feels like watching two different videos at the same time. Playback speed again 1.5
1:38:00 wow so much to see :D
T55 was very good tank in 50s and 60s. Also T72 was good in 70s. Much much cheaper then american tanks at that time we talk about 10 to 12 soviet tanks for 1 american. Also BMP1 was amazing in 60s abd 70s. Btadleys didnt arrive until 80s and cost 25 times more then BMP1.
True Soviet tanks were good for their time.However from 80s onwards the western tanks/IFVs have been superior. Even so we FInns still use modernized BMP2s although they are likely gonna be replaced by newest version of CV-90 in next decade
Happy to see that the Finns with the T-55M was inspired by Oddball (from the film Kelly's Heroes) and put a sleve over the gun barrel to make it look bigger. But sad to hear that Timo don't explain to Nick that the reason for the big turret of the BT-42 was so it could be used for a sauna where the tankers could have a good time with viina while screaming "vittu perkele saatana" (the most used words in the Finnish language ;) )
Finland has mooses :)
8:49 Irish are trained to do both
In theory, yes. But it was one of the questions I asked the troopers when I was doing my video there, and they observed that the majority of the training was geared to UN type missions.
@ yes scenarios will often include a peace support operation but not exclusively
@michaelmulligan0 I mean, it's understandable that training would be geared towards the most likely actual use. We had the same problem in the US. After a brief grounding in conventional ops, it was realized that no matter the theory requirements, new LTs would be thrown into low intensity ops and training geared towards that.
It was touched near the end but NATO membership is going to bring big changes.
On behalf of all Finns I do have to apologize for the attrocious level of English spoken by the expert. I feel a tremendous amount of potential was wasted because he continuously misunderstood what The Chieftain was asking or lacked the language skills to properly explain things. I wish they had a guy with better English skills do this.
He's not the best guy to be interviewed in English. But he's ok.
1st, 29 December 2024
Thank you Chieftain for making multi part series of my birth country tank museum. When I moved to Canada and than USA. I can speak from experience. For me it was very hard to learn fluent English. It’s almost impossible to get rid of Finnish accent. Thank you letting Timo speak. At some parts I can see him being frustrated, as he is trying communicate his thoughts in English.
Happy and safe New Year 2025 everyone
excellent point !