He's literally said you can't be proud of something you haven't accomplished yourself, this includes something your ancestors have done. He's attacked the alt right with variations of this argument several times. Overall, it's just sad to see him do the same to the alt right that sjw's do to him, although I can understand why he's doing it for pragmatic reasons. I understand why he's attacking the alt right, at times, and it's not because of any real intellectual reasons so the weird thing is it's not even really worth debating.
I think you're getting stuck on semantic issues - he is extremely proud of Christianity; he did not build that. Clearly there is more to his argument than the reductionist "you simply cannot be proud of anything you yourself did not do" - Perhaps offer some evidence for your claim and then we can get the context correct etc. I havn't even seen Peterson attack the alt right that much - he just criticises their emphasis on group identity rather then individualism, which is a fair critique.
Here's one tweet where he says just that in regards to your race: twitter.com/jordanbpeterson/status/935378533077020672 One could ask him right back if he's accomplished something himself why should he be proud of Christianity, like you say, by his own logic. It's pretty obvious this doesn't line up, and I can understand why he falls into this trap but that doesn't make it right. I think it can be fair to critique someone for putting to much emphasis on group identity, but it's a very vague critique and I also think it can be fair to critique someone for putting to much emphasis on individualism, even by his own "philosophy" the individual rejuvenates the state and the state gives order for the individual. This is very much in line with the alt right thinking on the state and the individual.
Heres his tweet for reference: "Those who have accomplished something as individuals feel no need to be proud of their race..." He is not saying, you cannot be proud of your race. He is saying if you have actual achievements in your life, being proud of being born in a specific group(something you did not choose to do, nor are you responsible for it) seems ridiculous. And yeah I guess, too much emphasis on the individual is not paramount; but it is simply "leftist thinking" to want be categorised and judged as a group rather than as a person. It feeds into intersectionality and SJWism. Truly mentally lacking.
I'm proud of my ancestors. We conquered the west and created just about everything you have today. We came and conquered lesser people, like has been done throughout all of history, throughout all of the animal kingdom, throughout all of nature, but now were supposed to feel bad for it..? We're supposed to feel bad turning a bunch of savages onto the path of humanity? Yeah, okay..
That's exactly what Richard is on about. I'd bet this months rent if you asked Richard what he was referencing this is the exact tweet he's referencing. Fact is plenty of people who have accomplished something as individuals feels and have felt pride in their race, their ancestors, their family or even other groups they belong to.
Proverbs 27:2 *Let another praise you, and not your own mouth; a stranger, and not your own lips.* Depends of what people think proud means. How can someone be proud of something he did not achieve? That's literally like a rich brat being proud of the millions it just inherited from mommy and daddy. There is a difference between being proud of something you achieved or liking and being connected to your own race/culture/family and wanting to preserve the line. I'm proud of certain men in my cultures history but not of myself. Pride is not something good it's a bad trait, only if others are proud of you it becomes something good. I don't like Jordan Peterson either heard him say stupid crap. He is a downwatered, weakling and something is off about him. Proverbs 16:5 *Every one that is proud in heart is an abomination to the LORD: though hand join in hand, he shall not be unpunished.*
Meister summed it up - You're taking this one time he is critiquing being proud of things you didn't do and acting like therefor one must be disconnected from their past etc. Sure Peterson says some off things - Name me one public speaker/intellectual(or atleast someone who speaks alot like he does in public) who hasn't said atleast one off thing. Name one.
It says quite a bit about this boy masquerading as a man, when he mocks somebody. I'm admittedly a Dr. J.P. fan, (It's Doctor Peterson, show some respect to your superiors) but bias aside, he doesn't debate people who's opinions have already been dismissed by the overwhelming majority of humankind. While some old, washed up, stubborn, blind to the truth men refuse to hang up the gloves when its clearly past their time to all but those standing in his corner, it isn't necessary for the in his prime, current pound for pound champ to jump in the ring and beat him to death to prove what the majority of the world can clearly see. Your ideas are washed up, you cling to an ideology that puts those like yourself somewhere amongst the upper echelons because you know deep down that no matter how many circles you talk around the average mind, you'll never have the capability to spar amongst the truly great thinkers of this world. Past, current, or future. We all want to be the alpha, unfortunately, sometimes you're born a beta. Know your role and do what you can to move the species forward. Anything else is nothing more than an ego driven attempt at fullfilling a void where your self worth is supposed to be. Mommy didn't give enough hugs, daddy didn't play enough catch. Spencer represents the negatives that inevitably will arise when you live in a republic that is truly free in each individual's own pursuit of happiness. Some don't understand that liberty is only to be pursued until it impedes on another's right to do the same. Absolute freedom is nothing more than a moral less, lawless, gunslingers approach to success. Unfortunately, losers never accept what they can do to create change in their small segment of existence. Their bitterness often radiates through with hatred and ignorance. It's a shame that we must admit scum like this are even the same species, gifted with the same critical thinking skills as those who have truly changed this planet for the betterment of the whole.
Why doesn't he start with where everyone should start with the impression? Start with Kermit the frog, practice with "dominance hierarchy" and "figuratively speaking", then pepper it with references to Disney films. JBP is great, BTW. Humor only furthers his message.
mymentor No not really. The "you sound like this"-argument is a classic example of a response from someone who's either incapable of articulating or someone who has nothing of substance to say. I haven't seen Peterson doing it. So...
It is quite straightforward for someone to have nothing of substance to say and also not imitate other people's speech, as if that had to be pointed out. Peterson being such an example. I have no issue with any and all criticism of a vile little specimen such as Richard Spencer, however.
That voice is spot on lol
And his critique is spot on too, you can definitely be proud of your ancestors.
Peterson doesn't say not to be proud of them though. He is attacking a Strawman!
He's literally said you can't be proud of something you haven't accomplished yourself, this includes something your ancestors have done. He's attacked the alt right with variations of this argument several times.
Overall, it's just sad to see him do the same to the alt right that sjw's do to him, although I can understand why he's doing it for pragmatic reasons. I understand why he's attacking the alt right, at times, and it's not because of any real intellectual reasons so the weird thing is it's not even really worth debating.
I think you're getting stuck on semantic issues - he is extremely proud of Christianity; he did not build that. Clearly there is more to his argument than the reductionist "you simply cannot be proud of anything you yourself did not do" - Perhaps offer some evidence for your claim and then we can get the context correct etc.
I havn't even seen Peterson attack the alt right that much - he just criticises their emphasis on group identity rather then individualism, which is a fair critique.
Here's one tweet where he says just that in regards to your race:
twitter.com/jordanbpeterson/status/935378533077020672
One could ask him right back if he's accomplished something himself why should he be proud of Christianity, like you say, by his own logic.
It's pretty obvious this doesn't line up, and I can understand why he falls into this trap but that doesn't make it right.
I think it can be fair to critique someone for putting to much emphasis on group identity, but it's a very vague critique and I also think it can be fair to critique someone for putting to much emphasis on individualism, even by his own "philosophy" the individual rejuvenates the state and the state gives order for the individual.
This is very much in line with the alt right thinking on the state and the individual.
Heres his tweet for reference:
"Those who have accomplished something as individuals feel no need to be proud of their race..."
He is not saying, you cannot be proud of your race. He is saying if you have actual achievements in your life, being proud of being born in a specific group(something you did not choose to do, nor are you responsible for it) seems ridiculous.
And yeah I guess, too much emphasis on the individual is not paramount; but it is simply "leftist thinking" to want be categorised and judged as a group rather than as a person. It feeds into intersectionality and SJWism. Truly mentally lacking.
Don't talk about my DAD like that!!! 😡
Dear Richard, Spencer, please follow, "Rule #9 Assume the person you are listening to might know something you don't." The book is a masterpiece.
how will he ever recover!?
I'm proud of my ancestors. We conquered the west and created just about everything you have today. We came and conquered lesser people, like has been done throughout all of history, throughout all of the animal kingdom, throughout all of nature, but now were supposed to feel bad for it..? We're supposed to feel bad turning a bunch of savages onto the path of humanity? Yeah, okay..
Would almost be a good point if he wasn't attacking a ... *strawman*.
twitter.com/jordanbpeterson/status/935378533077020672
Here's a tweet where he says just that.
"Those who have accomplished something as individuals feel no need to be proud of their race..."
Thats hardly what Richard is on about lol
That's exactly what Richard is on about. I'd bet this months rent if you asked Richard what he was referencing this is the exact tweet he's referencing.
Fact is plenty of people who have accomplished something as individuals feels and have felt pride in their race, their ancestors, their family or even other groups they belong to.
Proverbs 27:2
*Let another praise you, and not your own mouth; a stranger, and not your own lips.*
Depends of what people think proud means.
How can someone be proud of something he did not achieve? That's literally like a rich brat being proud of the millions it just inherited from mommy and daddy.
There is a difference between being proud of something you achieved or liking and being connected to your own race/culture/family and wanting to preserve the line. I'm proud of certain men in my cultures history but not of myself.
Pride is not something good it's a bad trait, only if others are proud of you it becomes something good.
I don't like Jordan Peterson either heard him say stupid crap. He is a downwatered, weakling and something is off about him.
Proverbs 16:5
*Every one that is proud in heart is an abomination to the LORD: though hand join in hand, he shall not be unpunished.*
Meister summed it up - You're taking this one time he is critiquing being proud of things you didn't do and acting like therefor one must be disconnected from their past etc.
Sure Peterson says some off things - Name me one public speaker/intellectual(or atleast someone who speaks alot like he does in public) who hasn't said atleast one off thing. Name one.
It says quite a bit about this boy masquerading as a man, when he mocks somebody. I'm admittedly a Dr. J.P. fan, (It's Doctor Peterson, show some respect to your superiors) but bias aside, he doesn't debate people who's opinions have already been dismissed by the overwhelming majority of humankind. While some old, washed up, stubborn, blind to the truth men refuse to hang up the gloves when its clearly past their time to all but those standing in his corner, it isn't necessary for the in his prime, current pound for pound champ to jump in the ring and beat him to death to prove what the majority of the world can clearly see. Your ideas are washed up, you cling to an ideology that puts those like yourself somewhere amongst the upper echelons because you know deep down that no matter how many circles you talk around the average mind, you'll never have the capability to spar amongst the truly great thinkers of this world. Past, current, or future. We all want to be the alpha, unfortunately, sometimes you're born a beta. Know your role and do what you can to move the species forward. Anything else is nothing more than an ego driven attempt at fullfilling a void where your self worth is supposed to be. Mommy didn't give enough hugs, daddy didn't play enough catch. Spencer represents the negatives that inevitably will arise when you live in a republic that is truly free in each individual's own pursuit of happiness. Some don't understand that liberty is only to be pursued until it impedes on another's right to do the same. Absolute freedom is nothing more than a moral less, lawless, gunslingers approach to success. Unfortunately, losers never accept what they can do to create change in their small segment of existence. Their bitterness often radiates through with hatred and ignorance. It's a shame that we must admit scum like this are even the same species, gifted with the same critical thinking skills as those who have truly changed this planet for the betterment of the whole.
Jordan Cuckerson ETERNALLY BTFO HOW WILL HE RECOVER LMAO
Why doesn't he start with where everyone should start with the impression? Start with Kermit the frog, practice with "dominance hierarchy" and "figuratively speaking", then pepper it with references to Disney films. JBP is great, BTW. Humor only furthers his message.
Love it. Lol
Left humor
Richard Spencer is such a light weight.
Donny Roys Same reason a heavyweight wouldn't waste his time on a lightweight.
Donny Roys he has already written about its bafoonery, so why would he waste his time?
Much like Peterson then.
mymentor No not really. The "you sound like this"-argument is a classic example of a response from someone who's either incapable of articulating or someone who has nothing of substance to say.
I haven't seen Peterson doing it. So...
It is quite straightforward for someone to have nothing of substance to say and also not imitate other people's speech, as if that had to be pointed out. Peterson being such an example. I have no issue with any and all criticism of a vile little specimen such as Richard Spencer, however.
Terrible