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Yes, those challenges are definitely real. To be fair, Vaesen does provide some support in form of Countdowns - a series of escalating events that you can trigger at appropriate times that push the story forward and get the players to act. These definitely helped, but didn't completely solve my issues.

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Can you elaborate?

@@MirkoFroehlich ruclips.net/video/kWrPxY8iImE/видео.htmlsi=_v6QrpytnRNeXlWh

Ah, got it - thanks for the pointer!

@@MirkoFroehlich Theres a dnd creator named Xp To Level 3. and he made a very good fallout d20 system

I like 2d20 better than XP to lvl 3 Even with the core books problems I feel the system captures what fallout feels like mechanically better. Just my 2 cents

Thanks for the feedback, glad it was helpful! I hope you have fun with Vaesen.

Wow, you actually managed to combine at least 4 different turn order procedures into one. Respect! 😆

Interesting! Can you elaborate on what it is about Cyberpunk 2020/Red that makes it a good fit for Fallout? I've considered other Cyberpunk games, but dismissed these because their focus (and skill lists etc) tend to be quite different from post-apocalyptic games (that are more about survival, resources, etc.).

Thanks for the feedback, glad it was useful for you!

@@DigitalHobbitRPG Are you planning on making a video about Traveller system? Or comparing it to other systems about adventures in space?

Good idea, but I don't have any experience with the Traveller system. At some point I might still make a video overview of various sci-fi games, including Traveler - but it likely wouldn't be very in-depth.

I'll take a closer look. At first glance, it looks like a comprehensive fan created game. I can't imagine it's officially endorsed by Bethesda, though, as the license is currently owned by Modiphius. So it seems similar to the many other fan made Fallout systems out there. But I could be wrong. :)

@@DigitalHobbitRPG he originally cot premission regarding direct language when he started streaming the game roughly 2 years ago

I came across it, but don't own it. I do own Kevin Crawford's other games, and find them a bit dense. But I've heard people mention Other Dust as a good option.

You certainly could - and from Jason's comment it sounds like there was a fan made attempt at that. Personally, I think emulating the vibe is more important than replicating the detailed mechanics of the game.

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Interesting, thanks for sharing! I can't find much info about that d100 game. It looks like one Fallout pen and paper game that was under development was ultimately released as the d20 based Exodus game, but not sure if that's the same thing.

Exodus was supposed to be, I think the Fallout Pen and Paper is just fan made and not official so you won’t find it on DrivethruRPG or anything

Ah, got it! Makes sense.

Thanks! I'll have to take a look at those Tim Cain videos - sounds fun! I actually never had a chance to play GURPS myself. It sounds like it's not for me given my preference for lightweight systems these days, but I probably would have enjoyed it back then. Perhaps what we really need is a post-apocalyptic Warlock! game, to join Warpstar! and Wetwired! in the series. Perhaps "Wastewalker!" or "Warwrecked!" or something.

@@DigitalHobbitRPG haha, yeah, it must have crossed Greg’s mind at least once. I like “Wastewalker!” 👍

Thanks for the feedback, glad you enjoyed it!

Thanks! And yes, looking forward to seeing the Shadowdark torch rule in action in Sean's West Marches game soon.

Guilty. :) Hand-waving (with some common sense) is my default. But some of these other systems (like slot based inventory) are a great option when this really matters for your game. I just recently rolled up a Shadowdark character for our West Marches campaign and can already tell how I'll have to make some difficult choices once we come across some treasure and other items that might compete with my precious lantern oil. It'll be great!

Thanks! And yes, there's a lot to like about it.

@@DigitalHobbitRPG Take a peek at Worlds Without Number at some point -- it's a pretty neat take on slot inventory as well.

Oh, will do! Good to finally have a reason to crack open that massive tome... 😅

Great to hear you're enjoying it. Have fun with your next Vaesen mystery!

Thank you! And I feel the same. Their production value is top notch. Great artwork, evocative settings, good layout, etc. Many of my RPG friends love the YZE games, and I really _want_ to like them.

Thanks for the feedback! You're right, in hindsight I should have covered how to play Vaesen - at least the core mechanic. I can recommend this overview that some friends made: ruclips.net/video/HuRUr27nSV4/видео.htmlsi=Y5Z6ztwxdGeGvzQm

A ring binder with the most important pages might help, or even just sticky tabs in the book. Honestly, the rules really aren't that difficult. The challenge is more around the published adventures.

Ah, you're right - it looks like I forgot to add the links. I added them to the video description now. Thanks for letting me know!

Yes, I agree. And my sense is that the game is probably "good enough" for someone who's experienced in running mysteries and horror games, in spite of its rough edges. But it doesn't exactly make it easy or smooth for others, like myself.

I think the structure they provide is intended to help with that, but when there's so much to track it doesn't help enough.

Agree 100%.

Thank you! 😊

It depends on the game for me, but in this case that would have been my preference, especially since many of the underlying myths date back much further.

@@DigitalHobbitRPG Part of what's going on in Vaesen is using the church as a source of conflict as well, though. They're not the "good guys," and are in fact slightly bound up with the schism in the Society!

Yeah, I've mostly come to terms with that. I just don't like that some of the actual Vaesen are tied to the church, such as the Church Grim.

Why?

@@AnonAdderlan If you're asking why I don't like that some of the Vaesen are tied to the Christian church: The conflict between the "old ways" and the "new ways" is at the heart of Vaesen. And many of the Vaesen (Giants, Trolls, Vaettir, Ghosts, etc.) date back to old Nordic folklore, long before Christianity. I feel that having Vaesen tied to relatively recent history (in the form of Christianity) weakens that focus of the struggle between the old and the new.

I think Vaesen occupies a slightly weird space. On the one hand, adventures are fairly structured. On the other hand, the tools that it provides to help with this are fairly limited. It definitely could be more helpful.

Thanks for the comment! It's all relative. And yes, my YZE experience is limited: Vaesen is the only one I've run, but I've played a few one shots (e.g. Tales from the Loop, Coriolis, The Walking Dead). In terms of crunch, I'd rank it just below D&D 5e or Savage Worlds, and on par with 2d20 or Cortex Prime. My sweet spot these days is lower - e.g. EZD6, Warlock!, or Outgunned. I don't mind crunch when it really adds to the experience. But I was surprised how much crunch Vaesen combat involved, for example, given that combat is very much not the focus of the game (I only had 1 proper fight in 11 sessions). E.g. the initiative system felt completely unnecessary to me.

I also enjoyed the review, thanks! But in your comment you put 2D20 on the same level as Y0E, I’m a bit confused and I wonder how you came to this conclusion. 2D20 have different meta currencies- how does that put them at the same level?

@@SteveDahlskog Thanks for the comment. By "same level", I'm purely referring to the level of crunch / complexity. I feel that YZE often gets touted as very lightweight, but in my opinion its complexity is about on par with the 2d20 system and a few others. Yes, 2d20 heavily uses metacurrencies and feels quite different from YZE.

Oh, I like that! Seems nice and simple. I really do need to take a closer look at his games. I've heard great things about his systems (and know they hugely influenced other game designers as well), but the settings haven't appealed to me as much.

@@DigitalHobbitRPG yeah, I think that’s a pretty common reaction and kinda what led to Cairn. People wanting a more familiar fantasy adventure setting.

@@DigitalHobbitRPG Well -- Mausritter is in this branch! Also, yeah, it's cool in EB, where being overloaded means your Hit Protection goes to zero. Dangerous stuff!

Thanks for the kind words!

Just be glad that I'm tracking my ammo in your Fallout game! 😅

Thank you, that's great to hear, and very much what I was hoping for! I hope you have a great time with Vaesen.

Thanks for the feedback! And who knows, your experience might end up being different. I have a lot of friends that greatly enjoy running and playing Vaesen.

Yes, I love how Warlock! handles this. It's really a nice, simple, and elegant system. I haven't played Into the Odd etc. yet, but have heard great things.

Nice try! :) Perhaps a teaching moment, to describe how RPGs are all about being creative and bringing your own ideas to life. Or just start with the adventure in the box and run yours after that. :)

BTW, based on your username, do you happen to be the person that wrote Griff's Vale? If so, that's a great setting / adventure!

@@DigitalHobbitRPG haha, yes, thank you! I did try and explain that creating your own things are a big part of this type of game (and that I’ve done a fair amount of it to varying degrees of success) but she wanted to bring out that beautiful cloth Free League map and I can’t fault her for that. She’s interested in trying to figure out how to make her own though so we’ve decided to make something together. She had a lot of fun with dice drop mapping from the recent issue of Knock!. 🙂

Definitely can't blame her for wanting to play the adventure from the beautiful cloth map. Great to hear you're successfully raising another RPG gamer!

@@DigitalHobbitRPG it’s a labor of love! I’m also happy the algorithm showed me your channel, I’ve been enjoying it. Look forward to the next.

Great to hear, thanks for the comment!

Thanks for the feedback! Yes, games with a lighter tone are my sweet spot as well. I actually do enjoy somewhat grim settings, but my actual gameplay will almost certainly be more lighthearted and fun.

This is the only YZE game I've run so far, although I've played in a few other one-shots. I definitely want to experience a few more for comparison. I believe in some, pushing only risks a condition, but doesn't guarantee it. Tales from the Loop seems a bit more easy going, for example. I'm optimistic about the new Coriolis game that they just kickstarted, which seems to be very exploration focused and has multiple stress tracks.

@@DigitalHobbitRPG Curiously, three of the lighter YZE games (Tales from the Loop, Things from the Flood, and Vaesen, all designed by Nils Hintze) have the some of the most punishing versions of the Push mechanic. That is, a condition is automatically checked. Vaesen is a brilliant design to my eye, and I love playing and running it -- but I really dig the YZE vibes generally. There *are* a few glitches in the rules that could be cleaned up. (Less detailed / structured combat, the goofy take a condition to see if you can avoid a condition thing, and... maybe some advice on throttling the XP.)

I didn't realize that Tales from the Loop has the same harsh push mechanic. And I don't have experience running any other YZE games. There are still some games I'm curious about trying at some point (especially the upcoming Coriolis, but possibly also Alien and Bladerunner).

Definitely not the only one! 😅 Honestly, one of the things I love about the hobby is how broad it is these days. So many different types of games and preferences. So there's no need for us to all enjoy the same games. And figuring out those preferences is part of the fun for me.

Great to hear you're enjoying Vaesen. Totally agree about homebrew being easier to run, especially for this type of game.

Fair point, thanks for sharing this!

Thanks, Wayne! Totally agree. And I'm glad I ran it.

Thank you! Yes, while I often think I have a good sense of whether I'll like a game after reading it, I can't really know until I get it to the table.

Damn, must have been some pretty good gameplay…

That sounds fun! And yes, it definitely can be a fair amount of work. I've experimented with different styles of running games, but ultimately landed on a mostly "theater of the mind" approach, so I typically don't create battlemaps. That's made prep more manageable for me.

I'm the same! I ran a few TSR modules in the first year of a five year campaign I ran in AD&D, then robbed bits and pieces... then went 100% homebrew. I *still* haven't played Keep on the Borderlands, though I'm trying to rectify that right now with a PbP game I joined. I too run more published stuff than ever before, but I think there's another reason for that: I'm pretty big into the OSR, and many modern OSR modules are *great*, really leading the industry in terms of layout, clarity, usability and creativity. That last point is what draws me in -- the ideas in these new modules are just fabulous, and things I just cannot come up with on my own.

Somewhat similar here, although my very first games were modules (for The Dark Eye). We quickly switched to Homebrew. I ran WFRP 1e for a few years, and I think this was all homebrew. KULT after that, as well. I picked up the Goodman Games versions of the classic modules. Maybe I'll run some of them with a modern ruleset like EZD6 or Shadowdark at some point. But as someone who didn't grow up playing D&D, I don't really have nostalgia for these. I'm more drawn towards more recent OSR modules.

That seems like a great way to go. What are you running on Point of Order these days?

In @PointOfOrderDnD, we are using a homebrew world that I've concocted, but I've borrowed some plot ideas and encounter mechanics from published adventures.

Where's the fun in that? :)

@@DigitalHobbitRPGI can actually get behind it for one-shots and the like. Just not my preferred cup of joe.

@@DigitalHobbitRPGjust as long as you don't play it PbP🤮 it's okay! 😉😛😆

Oh, shots fired! 😅

Ah, but in that crown jewel of a way to play RPGs, you could actually take the time to do it justice!

I agree, the two formats are really complementary. A good reading device makes a big difference (I bought myself a nice 12" tablet, which has hugely improved my PDF reading experience, and I even used this to run an in-person convention game for a game that hasn't delivered the print books yet). I still prefer print books for actual reading, but digital is key for reference and prep purposes.

There are many different playstyles. Many groups prefer to play more tactical games, using maps and miniatures. A VTT can help replicate that experience when playing online. Even with more narrative focused games, or traditional games but using theater of the mind instead of maps and minis, a VTT can be helpful to share character sheets and dice rolls. There's nothing wrong with preferring to use VTTs, and I do sometimes use VTTs myself. I'm just pointing out some more lightweight alternatives that I think work well with many games. Go with whatever option feels most natural to you. :)

Thanks, Hoos! 2024 seems off to a good start. Looking forward to playing some games together this weekend at BSer Con!

Yes, Owlbear Rodeo is great. Although I tend to use it on those few occasions where I mostly play theater of the mind (using Google Sheets and Discord) and just very rarely need a map. The downside is that at that point you're juggling at least three different windows/tabs (Discord, Owlbear, and Google Sheets or a form-fillable PDF). So if I consistently need these elements, I'm more likely to go a step further and use a VTT like Foundry that also handles character sheets (and in case of Vaesen, also has all the game's content fully integrated, making it easy to pull up NPCs, upgrade characters, etc.).

Thanks! Of course, after I posted the video, I thought of a bunch of other things I should have mentioned in my reflections about 2023. Oh, well... :)