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Do you use smaller reinforcement rings on the batter side?

My Starclassic maple made in japan didn't do that. I could tune them almost however.

What's the music playing in background at beginning? Artist/song name etc

It became a fashion, ....i quess the main idea is,that with gaskets the lug would be not mountet directly to the shell,so the shell can vibrate more freely...but i think too,that this is complete bullshit....if a peace of rubber or plastic is mouted to a shell...or an acoustic guitar...if it is doing anything noticabel at all,it will somehow dampen the shell...if you lay a few gasket on a mounted drumhead,what will possible be the effekt. But it is deep in the head of a lot of drummers....like the theory of the evolution of animals from simple to complex.... all by itself....

Will the tension rods still go straight into the lugs without the gaskets compensating any "height differences" between shell and hoop?

I have two vintage ludwig sets. Had precision drum do the edges. Big improvement. Also have new classic maple set . The edges are perfect so easy to tune.

In the 80's Sonor made vulcanised fibre gaskets, wich were wayyyy better than "modern" rubber ones.

So this is what you do on this channel? evaluate bearing edges?

Learned a ton about bearing edge production!

Very interesting video. I'm an up and coming drum maker, and your video makes me consider ditching the gaskets on my projects.

On a scale of 1 to 10. How would you rate each of these tom's bearing edges? Would they need any repair?

Jeff Kirsch: YOU SHALL NOT PASS. Sticker: I beg to differ.

well, you need gaskets coz of soft shells... poplar shells in old school were a little tough with the veneers as well.. but gaskets should come with a 3 layer system.. rubber/type of metal/rubber.. idk

Must be a rock set because they are a rocking.

Hi Jeff thanks for the videos, how can I email you?

Spot on, simplified + showing the obvious edge defects on a flat surface.

Umm i think you mean how china stole American technology

I bought a Tama Starclassic Maple (made in Japan...) in 2004. The 12" tom is more difficult to tune than the other toms. The best way I can describe it, is that it sounds like it has a Moongel on it. The tuning range is lousy. I have tried different heads, hoops, and even changed the tom suspension to no avail. I have often wanted to break this stupid tom. Today I pressed on the head all around the bearing edge and noticed that in some (many) places the head didn't rest on the bearing edge... I think I finally found the problem... I was going to sell it and buy a Ludwig Classic Maple, but now I think I'll have all the bearing edges recut. At least then I'll know everything is perfect. The Ludwig might have the same problem, who knows... 🤪

Hey Jeff, this specific TAMA Starclassic B/B finish ("Ruby Fade Figured") was an exclusive for Guitar Center back in the early 2010s. The sound of this kit is the best from where I reside and tuning stability is amazing! Nothing comes close. Thanks for your work on this. Now unto our final project with my initial Tama Imperialstar. I messaged on on IG & SMS. Looking forward to your response. Thanks!

I have a set of Tama Granstar ‘87 w/ power toms(8,10,12,13,16). Long time ago I was thinking of getting another kit to replace it and someone convinced me to recut the edges to 45° (tops and bottoms). It took some risk to do it and I was very nervous but they came out great. It was like a new kit sharper sound, better tuning and range(especially with thinner heads). It made them a lot better imo. I didn’t cut the bass drum edges I left that alone was happy w/ the sound. I’m glad I got the toms recut and still have them.

The 45 degree works for snare drums, but Tom's and bass drums need more contact with the head . Fully rounded on the Gretch broadcaster sounds like a thump. Pearl reference kind of gets it right.

The bearing edges are a mess, i have examined different high end drums from multiple brands. They all have defects, sometime covered up with wood putty if u look close. When you take off the mounting screws you can see badly they were drilled. This has become a rubbish world full of marketing madness... !!

I'm a custom drums builder/ vintage drum restorer ( copper city custom drums rome ny ) .... the bearing edges make a huge difference in tuning n full round tone of the shells to get the maximum tone outta the drum Yes the edges doesn't have to be totally flat to get a good sound ...BUT ....WHY NOT ?! .....why have a really good shell n soo ok decent edges ? Why not have it perform to the max ? Are you gonna put a lil 2 barrel carburetor on a bored out big block drag motor ? Ive redone edges on high end kits , mid to low end kits and vintage kits .....every time it makes a huge difference and I stand by that outta experience As far as the 5, 6 7 thousand dollar drumsets made today I think it's totally wrong to send it outta the factory with not totally flat edges, just shows how much marketing they throw in ur face but yet at the end of the day a guy in his garage with a router n a flat glass n a good eye makes it sound better I think it's very important to educate people on the importance of the bearing edges , ive proved to people over n over again when they bring me drums they get in tune and then tune them up after I edge them ....instantly they become a believer

What's the point of this video brother

Dw puts two different edges on there shells

Looks like you got yourself a vintage screwdriver there.

gorgeous kit

sup Jeff!

hey bro's/guys/drummers there , i am a new sub for ya and i am a oldschool 80's drummer here and i love talking drums n music n such + i am looking for a cheap project kit/set , please message me or email me asap , i am in central pa though , thanks n we'll talk soon > tom !

Bearing edges dont even need to be that flat. Too much attention these days on laser flatness.its not neccesary. You think they had em flat in the 50s,6070s? Ppl where smoking cigs in the factory with more kn their mind than flat bearing edges, yet vintage is all the rage, and they sounded great. It doesnt need to hold water like a fish tank. Were talking about a maliable drumhead place on an edge and air moves thriugh it. If they needed to be perfect and flat and geometric and squared we wouldnt put an air vent in them. If sustain is the ultimate goal nobody would ever use concert toms. Ppl got all this stuff ass backwards

I recently had bearing edges redone on a high-end kit, and tuning became so much easier, and like you said, I could go lower. It is a little disappointing to buy a 5K kit and realize that things aren’t perfect. Is the unleveled edge issue a thing with all manufacturers? Or are there some better than others?

Bring me a made in BC Mexico pacific kit. I will give you back a DW kit with flat edges.

Yamaha is garbage now. I bought a new RC kit and immediately returned it, it was un-tuneable and sounded horrible. So incredibly disappointing, but that’s what happens when you move production from Japan to China and change the most recorded bearing edge in history. 👎

My Ludwig kit has lock washers when mounting the lug. No impressions on the shells. I do know from cleaning my drums that I can't remove the gaskets, I think they were put on when the lacquer was still tacky. My view on why they are there is unwanted noise. I have a kit from the 60's that doesn't have gaskets. They sound great to the ear but under mics there are weird sounds that come from the lugs. So to improve on that problem plastic inside the lugs, no more springs and gaskets is what fixed the problem. The resonate sound can easily be achieved by head choice and tuning. The moment anything touches the shell even the lug casings things change. It's the nature of the beast. Don't overthink it, just play them!

He ain't lying. I recut the edges on all the drums I buy and it makes a HUGE difference.

I wonder, why isn't all bearing edges symmetrical 45 degree cut? That seems like the best for any kind of head. What benefit does it offer to have the contact point close to the outer edge? Seems like risk without any reward. Couple of millimeters of extra vibrating diameter doesn't seem significant enough to justify risking some type of head not fitting properly.

Thanks for sharing, man! I'm trying this in a few weeks and I had no idea how to do it 🙌🏽

Damn you really got me thinking now, lol so its either endless amount of gasket/lugs replacementa and re tunning, or the possibility of a broken tom?

What is the torque value for a modern day Lug on a Ludwig Black Beauty?

Makes sense Jeff. I have this same PDP kit in emerald fade and love it. Bought it new in 2008. I would put this kit up against any high end big money kit any day. It tunes up nice and easy but I do notice a slight playability factor where the stick response just doesn’t feel optimal compared to a set I played with a round over edge. I want to cut a slight round over on the outside myself. Do you have an email I can contact?

Hard or soft wood has to be a factor to consider.

I had problems with my full length tama luggs snapping I the centre. So I made gaskets out of automotive gasket paper and that seems to have done job. Been 2 years since. No problems whatsoever even with turning. With the gasket paper it confirms to the lugg and the shell. Cut the paper oversize to the lugg. Hole punch for screws. Fix the lugg to the shell and then I carefully cut around the lugg.

It also appears that those oval lugs were flat on their base rather than designed with a radiused underside that would sit perfectly flush to shell. That doesn’t seem like a recipe for success.

Damn that Bop Kits really Rocks!😂

Jeff, I still love this video. I was just looking at my Gretsch gaskets tonight. They’re so comin off!

It's weird that the PDP Centerstage, a step or two lower of a model shows it as a hybrid birch wood on some sites while others just say Poplar wood.

In this case the lug fixing holes are too close to the edge of the lug .... Causing a weakness and failure of the ply around the hole.... Once the ply starts to fail it will continue to fail....

Helps a lot! I have a Keller kit that is locally built and the fabricator always said that gaskets are bad but never explained why... Still, my drums are very hard to tune, but that is another issue...

all I see out there is 3/8" thick I'm thinking buy a 14" to put inside a 13" but they are also 2.5" deep That's too wide .....

ash preferred