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Saddle hunting is a joke

I'm not a heavy arrow guy, but I think I just got stupider listening to that. Tgat was the worst explanation I've ever heard.

Work on your tether height, I’m 6’3 and mines most comfortable about forehead level.. could be why it’s rising up

Hey man great video. I believe what you have been experiencing (i may be wrong here but i do work with physics a bit for my trade) is that you have surpassed arrow efficiency/wieght. this is my opinion here but i believe there is an effiency curve for wieght/speed for what we are realistcally trying to achieve as hunters which is maximum penetration upon impact. my impression of the ashby studies and how they should be interpreted is that the kinetic energy carried by a heavy arrow is greater than that of the lightest fastest arrow. however once you break past efficiency they will become sluggish and slow. 500 odd grains is still not what alot would consider a light arrow i believe it is probably what is most efficient for penetration/speed for your draw length and wieght. are you hunting white tails? im in australia and we hunt mostly fallows red and sambar here two of thos species being quite large so 500+ grain arrows tend to be more ethical and effective for the species we hunt especially as they wallow and cake themselves in mud alot. as far as the mechanical side of things im not a fan as more moving parts are more failure points in my eyes but as far as smaller species i think they may have their place in the world but i feel like you would get the same sort of blood trails from shooting something like a kayuga pilot cut gen 2. there are some really great hunters in australia ad alot of them speak on this podcast called becoming a bowhunter on spotify definetly worth a listen. hope youre gettin a few mate good luck

Do you know the Ashby study is STILL GOING ON ? They've tested EVERY bow, EVERY broadhead, EVERY arrow, etc. You have not proven anything. Where's your report? You can't just make a video saying heavy arrows suck, and saying the Ashby study is just trad stuff, and expect anybody to believe you with no data.

I like how you call it forgiveness for MISTAKES...... well what about FORGIVENESS for the ANIMALS MISTAKES???? You can CONTROL YOURSELF but NOT the animal... this topic is not that complicated but FOR SOME REASON everyone misses the point..... let me dumb it down for you and everyone else who buys into your logic.. The ANIMAL is ALIVE and DOESN'T WANT TO DIE.. so given the chance, the animal can MOVE... thats where the HEAVY ARROW COMES INTO PLAY.... you could have the MOST PERFECT shot in the world and the animal can SCREW IT ALL UP.... SO the heavy arrow is so IF it was to move and mess up your PERFECT SHOT and you HAPPEN to encounter a HEAVY BONE, then you should still get enough PENETRATION to put the animal down instead of wounding it... YOUR LOGIC SAYS THAT YOUR LIGHT ARROW WILL COMPENSATE FOR YOU LACK OF JUDGEMENT...

toe hook the platform next time please, watching that thing move around after you set it gave me the heebie jeebies. and shorten the bridge and lower your tether and it wont ride as bad

Shorten your bridge but 8 inches or so and low your tether to about nose or shoulder height and it won’t ride up nearly as bad.

A 27 year study with over 100 data points on more than 2000 animals vs……”Trust me bro….” Maybe you can convince South Australia to end the ban on bow hunting with your video…..

Looking like jeepers creepers ...😂😂😂😂

I see a lot of controversy over arrow weight and speed vs weight ect, this has been a newer issue for us older hunters. See not all of us but what I consider to be true archery hunters, love the sport of getting up close and personal with the game we hunt. Shooting a buck at 50 plus yds with todays tech is easily feasible, but what about getting that buck within 10-15 yds and making the shot? Takes a whole lot more skill and patience. Now I do not condemn anyone for the long shots, most hunters now never new what it was like before the carbon age and fast cams. We were stuck with slow bows and heavy aluminum arrows, we learned hunting skills that you just do not see today. Pull back your bow with 60 percent let off with a buck at 10yds and not get spooked, we killed a lot of deer once we learned the skills needed and the amount of shot deer not found was way less than i hear today. I can shoot out to 100yds, 60,50 ect but why? So I fling an arrow and hope nothing between me and that deer affects the flight? Nope not going to happen, let him walk and find out what I did wrong to get him closer, that is why it is called hunting not hope and poke. You can shoot all day and group in on a target at 60 yds, but in the field it is a different story. Shoot what fits you and what you are confident with, just remember why we archery hunt, not for long distance but the experience and passion of hunting. I personally like a story of the big one that a hunter let walk because of the conditions or distance than the story of well he was at 70yds and I know I can hit that far so I let it fly. Good luck to all and safe hunting!

Thanks again for watching. Let us know how your season is going in the comment section below. I hope your seasons are going good, things should be picking up very soon.

Thanks for your thoughts. yet you need to do some research and build some raw data. Not going to beat you up here, just tell you, You are wrong. Please read Ashby someone who has done actual research and others like him. You will learn a lot more. He speaks on Compound bows as well. See his live talks. For those on here please choose the arrow that works for you. Use the bow set up that works for you. Everyone has there thoughts yet comes without proper research. All that is said here can be said in the reverse. when telling you, you are wrong

Incorrect.

I’d say heavy arrows start at around 450 grains, so by no means is 450 grains light in my opinion.

nice to see a different point of view.

Ok, so you are aiming 12-18 inches behind the front leg? Why? I have over 30 years of bowhunting experience and would never intentionally aim that far back. Sounds like you should study a&p of wild game animals some, that is back of the lungs and liver shot! I am aiming tight where front leg attaches about 3-4" above bottom of chest, if the animal drops I still get into vitals instead of above them. I switched to heavier arrows 2 years ago and get better arrow flight than I have ever had. I hunt in thick cover usually and 35 yards is a long shot. Being confident in what you are shooting is very important but in my years of working at a commercial bowhunting lodge I definitely saw clients shooting lighter arrows losing more animals because of lack of penetration and we did not allow any expandable broadheads. So I will keep shooting my 681 grain arrows over the 450 grain I used to shoot

You may have some logic into your argument, but there’s too much emotion into your opinions. Your arrogance is prevailing in the comments more than anything. Your insecurities and egotistical tendencies need to be dampened to have a professional opinion, and for people to respect said opinion. In this topic there is so much variability that no one even thinks of. In big woods bow hunting, especially public land, 30 yards may be your opportunity. The deer may be quartered to and you need that extra weight to punch through the shoulder to make an ethical shot. In the case of western spot and stalking, you may have to shoot 60 yards. Then run a mid weight arrow around 500-575. That’d probably be your best option. However, in those situations, a heavy arrow may be better, or a light arrow may be better. There is never a constant. There will never be a constant. No deer will ever react the same way twice. You will never be able to recreate the same shot twice. The positions, yardage, angle, game, habitat, terrain, etc… will always change. Therefore there is no correct answer. Shoot what you wanna shoot, and have fun doing it. Don’t go online bashing people and putting people down because they have a different opinion than you. It makes you look bad, and it doesn’t prove your point. Good luck this season, and happy hunting.

The study is still going on to this day so is it outdated

He’s probably one of those guys that complains every year because they didn’t make a bow with 80lb limbs

Just got the Ted Nugent arrow 400 spine. 9.3 gr. Shoot Hoyt Vector 60#. Love them. And I think these arrows would be good for a Alpha X 30 70lbs also in future.

Couldn't believe what your saying right from the start. You drive a chevy. That in its self means you make alot of mistakes. And bad decisions.

12-18” behind the front leg? Is this a parody? There’s no way you anyone with basic knowledge of whitetail anatomy would take you seriously after that. There are so many other incorrect statements and assumptions in this video, but that one is the only one needed to do so.

Video after Video of arrows with hardly any penitration from shooting light arrows

Good luck this season. I will be shooting my Mathews V3X 29 this year and my bowtech REVOLT . I have hamskea rests on both my bows. They are the best imo. I shoot Easton axis 5mm and they are 420 grains and they work great for me.

Agree with everything said here. Slower recurve then maybe go bit heavier? I will never take even a moderate quartering to shot ever again. Gonna cost me some bucks oh ya, but also won’t have as many sleepless nights and sick for next 3-4-10 weeks.

I haven't killed an animal yet with longbow/recurve. I've learned and still learning theres a difference of target archery and bow hunting. Archery sure light arrows to hit where you need. Hunting, get close to the animal as i can, placement shot, heavy arrows. You dont want to shoot at an animal 60yd 80yd away with a light projectile and wound the animal. That's target archery, not hunting. In my experience, I've shot and do shoot heavy arrows and they lodge/break 2x4 wood. I shoot 650 grain arrow, longbow, with point on distance at 30 yards, no sights. I'd never take an animal at 30 yards with my setup, only 20 yards or under till i see the whites of their eyes. At the end of the day it is the bow hunters duty to tune their bow and arrow, sharpen their broadheads, and most practice shot placement.

If you’re going to bash the Exodus broadheads, at least explain why.

My brother shoots 110 yards very accurately with 580 grains. Tgis video just shows you did not bare shaft tune your bow and not getting perfect arrow flight. You need to accurately display this. Also could out shoot you at real distance . We shoot 90-110 yards 550 plus all day long

I’m three minutes into this video and already noticed a couple of different things. I will post more comments below. This is the video continues instead of just constantly editing this one post. First thing is the claim that he arrows are detriment to accuracy. That isn’t fundamentally true. If that were true, just raising your weight would always make people less accurate. That is not the case, for me, and several other people who have followed the ranch ferry method. Secondly, you claimed that 500 or more grains is considered a heavy arrow and is overkill for thin skinned game such as deer. If that were in fact, the case, no one would have to worry about scapula impacts, and we would always see pass through for those types of set ups. However, we do not. If you watch all of these online, Hunting influencers there is a random mixture of pass-throughs or arrows stopping the animal with mild penetration. If if anything a 400 to 450 grain arrow is more of a roll of the dice set up than it is appropriate.

Wow another know it all. Youngsters telling hunters that know what works that we're wrong.

Such a stupid video

just came across your channel and subscribed. Don't let the negative comments bother you. keep in mind that as far as the youtube algorithm is concerned, even bad comments are good. The more comments you get on a video the more youtube shares it. even if they are negative comments. Good luck with the channel and keep'em coming.

You did prove that you're full of yourself and you suck at shooting. 30 years of research by Ashby and it's still going. You come on RUclips and make a 20 minute video of why you're right and everyone that follows Ashby or anyone else that believes a heavy arrow does has a place in hunting is wrong. Makes no sense at all....Ashby foundation does studies on modern compound crossbows even studies on Barnes bullets to this day. Facts are facts just because you have an opinion doesn't mean its proven. Your shot at 60 sucked with your hunting setup. Then you throw an arrow on that your bow isnt sighted for and shoot a bad shot and think you proved something to the world 😂😂. I shoot 567 grains and if im off by a yard it still hits in the kill zone maybe a inch different. I always shoot a yard or 2 off just to see where i hit if for some reason the animal moves slightly. I love that you through out a challenge to shoot against anyone on a course you setup lol. I think that challenge would be better if it was on a course neither shooter knew anything about. Final thought you say we don't need heavy arrows with todays bows well did you happen to see the Chris Bee video that they used to help ban archery in Western Australia. He had the same take as you and now he is helping people in their quest to ban hunting. Heavy Bullets...Light Arrows makes perfect sense.

Its hard to have faith in your test with the way it was carried out... what i would have done is do a three shot group dialed in and then simply take a couple of steps back and shot another three shot group. I shoot a 1980s compound and only shoots like 250 fps. And at 60 yards i drop about 4 inches per yard and your test looks like 12 inches per yard. I do agree with your testimony, people bought into an idea and then try to justify all there spending on products that fit the idea.

LOL YOU ARE SO WRONG! ITS TAKEN 25 YRS TO TURN IT AROUND BUT FINALLY WE ALL AGREE HEAVY IS BETTER! LIGHT ARROWS SUCK! YOU NEED AT LEAST 500 GRAIN ARROW!

Your whole argument essentially rests on the deer jumping the string. A more quiet bow will result in a whole lot less ducking from the deer. Furthermore at 30 yds you’re talking about a .06 second difference in flight time between heavy and light. That’s not substantial. On top of that you seem to think light arrows get pass throughs at any reliable frequency. They don’t. Your argument is entirely flawed from top to bottom.

I don’t believe that there is any real truth as to which is better, light or heavy set up. I am very fortunate to be in an area where I get to shoot at many different game animals, but I mostly target whitetail deer and wild pigs. I shoot a crossbow due to a severe injury in my cervical spine, my neck. I started shooting a 300gr arrow and a 100gr broadhead. I’ve lost several animals and arrows by shooting a little too far forward and into the thicker portion of the shoulder. All I could do was watch it run off with my arrow sticking out of his shoulder. A friend recommended a heavier arrow set up so I went that route.. a 400gr and a 500gr arrow with a 150gr broadhead. That was back in 2014 and I have recovered every animal I’ve shot with these arrows. My crossbow was shooting 393 fps with the light arrows and now it’s shooting at 341 to 353 fps with the heavier arrows. 90% of my shots are complete pass throughs with the heavier arrow set up…. This may not seem like much, but I’m getting my limit in deer each year, 5 deer….and I’m harvesting between 15 and 25 pigs each year. Yes my arrows are shooting much slower now, but I have not had any animals to duck the arrow or jump it…and Im shooting out to 50 yards. When it comes to arrow/broadhead weights, it is simply user choice.. whatever works best for you is what you need to stick with. For me personally, I’ve increased my success in hunting by multitudes by switching from a light set up to a heavy set up. “A feather will bounce off a window at several hundred miles per hour, but a small stone will blast through it at 10mph” I’ll only use light arrows for target plinking, my heavy arrows will be the only ones in my hunting quiver. Good luck everyone!

That's not how you check the arrow drop. You need to sight the bow in for the heavy arrow, back up 1 yard and shoot again since you are claiming being off by 1 yard causes that much difference. Anyone with any common sense would know, you don't shoot a heavy arrow in a bow sighted in for a light arrow and expect it to hit anywhere near the same spot, especially at 60 yards. Unfortunately this disabled old fart can't prove to be a better shot than you or anyone else, but back in the 80's and 90's when I hunted with a bow, I practiced out to 40 yards, consistently hitting 1-1/2" fluorescent dots, but wouldn't take a shot beyond 25 on an animal. I hunted with what everyone these days call grandpa's bow and arrows. Easton aluminum shafts with fixed 3 blade broadheads, hand sharpened and paper tuned, that weighed about 525grns total and shooting 63lbs. out of a Golden Eagle bow. I always had pass throughs and if I remember correctly my longest track was 45 yards, which really wasn't a track job.

I get pass trough with a 350 grain arrow.

Man, you are just arguing your side of the coin is better. I guess we need to cancel all traditional bow hunting and tell them they don’t matter and that they should use your theories. People will use what they use and that’s the truth. No one cares how good of a shot you are. Everyone is a human and we all make mistakes and shooting a wild animal isn’t exactly scientific reproducible. So, chill out and just enjoy the sport.

Ashby has more time thinking about his research while sitting on the toilet than you have holding a bow in your lifetime.

Wow is all i can say 😂😂😂😂

Until you hunt with a recurve shooting 150fps you know absolutely nothing about how effective a heavy arrow is.... Lol put down the compound and shoot a recurve and tell me a heavy arrow isn't Supreme !!! There's a whole world of traditional archery that you obviously know nothing about...lol Some folks should stick to training wheels with crazy let-off only holding 15 lbs....

Speed vs. reaction time it matters, deer are not that hard to shoot thru IMHO. - W. Liggett

Wow dude you sound pissed at the world... im sorry man.. i shoot a homemade selfbow, 425gr arrow witha 46# draw.. at 20" ... i have blown thru hogs with that setup.. im only 135-140fps with a cut on contact head.. i am at the bottom of the scale when it comes to speed because my draw length is soo short.. i am shooting 27%foc and it really does help when you are lacking in other areas like speed.. but you can get too.much weight also to where it actually would hurt me.. i would not want to drop below 380ish at all in my selfbows.. i think what you should be talking about is the difference between cut on contact heads vs mechanical.. i have seen soo many guys shoiting a 70lb bow and get half penetration if they are lucky with mechanical heads.. and your stuck on weight.. ive seen elk shot with recurves that blow thru with cut on contact heads and then 70lb compound guys get little penetration on a deer with mechanicals.. let people shoot the weight they want to shoot... you should focus more on getting people to hit their mark and use heads that help the hunter instead of gimmicks.. hope you have a good season bro..

I agree with ur theory ! U. Don’t need 5-6-700 grain arrow ! It doesn’t add inches to ur dick at the end of the day!

Where u located!? I shoot 415g total arrow including lighted nock! I’ll shoot with u , no range finders , unknown distances ! We can put targets out to 100 unknown ! I’m shootin a 2003 Hoyt bow with 1 pin! Challenge accepted !im in south louisiana

Over 150 comments on this video and still no one has proved they can shoot better than me. Y’all have attacked my character, appearance and my experience but no one has attacked my shooting ability. Funny how that works. You ask someone to put their money where there mouth is and all of a sudden they’re gun shy. There’s a word for that, coward.

Heavy arrows does drop little quicker but a plus for a heavy arrow setup is forgiving to for a bad shot into shoulder or a quartering to shot because thanga do happen in real world hunting situation to can pull a shot or hit a vegetation and couse arrow to go of course a little thats only plus i see for a heavy arrow setup is to blow through the thick part of shoulder if hits it i shoot 60 pound and about 420g setup fixed head helps with penetration to compared to mechanical in my own experience of hunting little over 30 years but good video on trying to explain i see what your saying if you misjudged yardage a little the faster settup could save you buy 5 to 6 yards inhave shot a faster setup before where i was able to shoot my 20 pen at 30 to with about half inch difference