+Șefu' cu Caterincă You don't know Sir Docwonder's life! He could have been held against his will and forced to read that literally fictional literal fiction.
i'm going to compare the system to stockholm syndrome. throughout your life the system coerces you. school has a type of stockholm syndrome effect because you are forced to go to it. then again, it's probably a necessary evil to make well rounded individuals. if there is going to be a population increase then it's necessary that the population is atleast competent enough to eventually be independent upon reaching adulthood. once you reach adulthood you won't have anybody holding your hand. you have to adapt to survive.
If you’re here looking for how to write your essay, I actually recommend you zone in on Holden’s sexual abuse. It’s the most overlooked “hidden meaning” in the entire book. I use quotations because it’s not hidden that well at all. It’s just that it’s so barely mentioned that most readers brush it off and act like it didn’t exist. That’s the nature of most books. If a certain event is significant, it is repeated and examined and dissected at several points from several perspectives. But you need to understand that this book was written with an eye towards psychoanalysis. Yes, a typical narrator in a similar situation may usually mention his sexual assault several times throughout the course of a book, but in my experience this is not how most survivors handle their assault. It’s the sort of thing that’s pushed to the back of your mind where it only comes out in times of extreme emotional distress. Not to mention, Holden was most likely assaulted by more than one person. This is evidenced both in the scene with his teacher, as well as with his interaction with women. His memories of Jane is a good place to pull some quotes from to support this argument. Also, you have to understand, that scene where Holden is explaining that he never pushes after a girl says no. He stops immediately and without persistence. He feels some form of shame because of this, as the other male influences in his life have lead him to believe that you’re supposed to keep going after she says no. It’s a very telling line about the time period that Holden was living in, (because yes, this was absolutely a sick and disgusting mindset that was normalized in entirely too many places) the people who surround Holden, and how Holden can have an understanding of consent that is significantly more nuanced than most the other boys and men around him. Finally, I recommend using the prostitute scene and Holden’s refusal to go through with the act. I think Holden really could have been JUST been chickening out, but I also think he was triggered at the potential sexual experience, especially when he has such an adamant refusal to even acknowledge his history of being sexually abused. Pay attention to the way he talks about Maurice and Sunny. Holden can be just as mean to women as he can be to men, but for the most part, his aggression is directed at men. His judgement most of all. Anyway, I used to be someone who thought I didn’t like Catcher in the Rye. I read it in 8th grade, absolutely hated every second of it, and I ended up writing an essay on it. Then I was given a book report the next year as an assignment. So I did it on Catcher in the Rye again. Told myself it was because I already read the book so the report would be easy. Ended up, reading the book again anyway because “oh I need them quotes.” By the time I graduated high school, I had read Catcher in the Rye 5 times and wrote 5 essays about it, all analyzing different aspects of the story. Not going to lie, his sexual assault completely alters the context of his character, and once you’ve really considered it; alongside his dead little brother and his neglectful parents that sent Holden to a mental hospital possibly located all the way in LA. Notice he was going to boarding school at the start of the story. His parents live in New York. So why is Holden saying that his brother, who lives in LA, visits him? Why doesn’t he mention his parents visiting him? In fact, you’ll notice that Holden has a stunning lack to say about his parents for someone who’s supposed to be a teenage boy. This is another aspect of the psychoanalysis that must be considered. Holden refuses to say too many bad things about his parents, NOT BECAUSE THEY’RE GOOD PARENTS! He refuses to say bad things about them because they’ve abandoned him and he hasn’t accepted it. He desperately wants their love and support, but where does Holden end up not even weeks after showing up home? A mental institution in California. Holden is not a hero. He is not a whiny teenager. He is a victim of sexual assault. His brother is dead. His parent’s refusal to even live with him has further deteriorated his trust in adults. His school grades were terrible, yet we know he’s good at English. And why is Holden good at English? Because despite all the things that Holden claims about liking English, what he really liked was having a teacher who gave a damn about him. Holden is desperate for human attention, yet constantly says weird and awkward things to people, not because he doesn’t like them, but because he’s afraid of their rejection. So he rejects them before they can do the same to him. He bleeds for the world around him, but if Holden’s only problem was that he’s too sensitive, then this would be a very different book. Holden has three main traumas. The oldest is probably the sexual assault. The second is his brother’s death. The last is his parent’s abandonment of him. You could write an essay about just one of these and earn an A. Orrr, touch on all these points and really impress. On a personal note: I will say there is a different way to see the “Catcher in the Rye.” Yes, Holden is talking about saving children from adulthood. Obviously, as oddly noble a sentiment this is, it’s unreasonable. Despite the fact that I thought I hated this book, I’ve kept it in mind when I deal with children and people in general. You never know what someone is going through. If they’re being a whiny little douche, there might be a reason behind it. Reasons you might not even want to know. Reasons so dark you wouldn’t even allow yourself to really notice it if it was written in a book. So when you see a child about to head towards the cliff, I hope you point them to the ladder or bridge, waiting just out of sight. I hope you choose to guide. Anyway, thanks for coming to my TEDTalk I guess.
I'd disagree -- it really depends on the way you interpret the things you read. It's not necessarily a "hidden meaning." It's a "gray area" that Salinger refuses to hand to readers on a plate. If, for example, you think that Holden misinterprets Antolini's behavior in Ch 24 (and most evidence in the book supports that he does, in fact, get it wrong in his initial reaction), then you have to call into question Holden's assertions about other things related to sexuality and his past. Notwithstanding his dubious use of numbers -- everything happens to Holden about "20 times" -- we see Holden exaggerate or just flat out lie about these things more than once in the book. He is an UNRELIABLE narrator. For example, when Holden says (I'm paraphrasing) that "people are always doing all that flitty stuff when I'm around," it's MUCH more likely that Holden SEES that and READS that in to people's behavior or words. In fact, I'd argue that there is PLENTY of evidence to suggest that Holden is, if not bisexual, at least very confused about his preferences. It would explain a LOT of his words and actions. And I'll concede that his sexual confusion COULD also stem from abuse... but again, it all depends on how YOU read the book. I think it's interesting that his novel, like the Museum of Natural History, hasn't changed in over 50 years, and that the real DIFFERENCE in our opinions of the book completely stem from WHO'S reading it. Genius piece of symbolism on JD's part. So in general, while it MAY be true that Holden was the victim of some kind of chronic sex abuse as a child, there's no CONCRETE evidence of it, and the things you use as "proof" are all a matter of interpretation, which is EXACTLY the way that Salinger probably wanted it.
That was a wonderful analysis! Thank you. I’d say the whole thing is up for interpretation. Like all first person narration, Holden won’t be completely reliable - there’s no way to know what’s real and what’s not. (I actually really enjoyed this aspect of the book though - how hypocritical Holden could be and how he still a bit confused by the end of the book. It makes him feel more real.) My own interpretation is that Holden has definitely experienced real trauma and this shapes his outlook on life. He’s not a complete asshole - He has a weird way of viewing life but it’s not his fault. And people are making no attempt to empathise with Holden or provide support when he needs it. Saying that, he is no hero - He makes bad choices and pushes people away. He is quite close minded in his own opinions of the people around him or simple things like movies. He complains about “phonies” but is a compulsive liar. And that makes it hard to like him
I absolutely hated this book until after I read it and heard this interpretation. I thought it was pointless. The significance of everything in the book can be explained by his trauma.
You forgot about Allie, his dead little brother. Allie motivates half the shit Holden does and his absence is a negative presence in the book. It is while holding Allie's baseball mitt that Holden has the vision of being the Catcher in the Rye. This was a big thing to leave out. Usually The Thug does such a thorough job, leaving out Allie is something that he should not be allowed to slack on!
nikoincroatia Yep, Holden is holding Allie's baseball mitt when he muses on being the Catcher in the Rye. He is torn because he partly feels like he let Allie "fall off the cliff" but there is an element of envy to how Holden feels about Allie since, as the thug points out, Holden is very unhappy about being forced to grow up and join the "phonies" of the adult world, and by dying, Allie has managed to cheat destiny in a way Holden can't.
Also forgot to mention that Holden says "This isn't the first time something like this have happened to me" when getting creeped on by his former teacher. That is a pretty subtle hint but have a huge impact on the story.
This is mostly true, but it operates on the concession that Holden can be trusted. He's just a kid, afraid to grow up, afraid of responsibility. To get a good understanding of the character, we need to look at the context in which the story was written. Salinger wrote the thing throughout his stay in WWII, a stay which was notably long and hard for Salinger. Most biographers agree that the war probably fucked him up really badly. So it's strange to think that the first thing he does when he gets back is publish this goddamn book about a teenager in NYC, doing a whole lotta nothing for 20 some chapters. When you look at it closely, you start to realize that Salinger put a lot of himself into Holden. Salinger was a guy who was traumatized by the horrors of war. Holden is a teenager who is running from adult responsibility, the same responsibility that creates the horrors and confusion of war. So, catcher is, among other things, a story about the process of coping with the loss of innocence. It's an argument about which route is more damaging, keeping your innocence or losing it. Throughout the book, Holden makes several serious attempts to lose his innocence, whether it's seeing a prostitute or making a genuine human connection with a taxi driver. In every event, that internal struggle remains, and haunts him, because the truth is, Holden never makes the decision, even in the hospital. The book ends with one of the vaguest endings that I've ever read. I think that's what makes the book so hard to analyze. It's vague, it's nuanced, you don't know what Salinger thinks of Holden, you don't know what Holden means all of the time, you don't know what's going on in his head. You're really only left with your impressions, and even those are often weird and sorta vague. That's really what makes Catcher a good book. We can argue about it for days without getting anywhere.
If you really want to know it. It's the kind of book that makes you want to sit down with the goddam author as a friend long after you've read it. But boy, this world full of phonies drives me crazy. It really does. It feels like there's never anyone around to listen.
That's also the reason it's so fascinating to talk to people about this book. The reason Holden is happy as he watches Phoebe on the Carussel changes from person to person is often tied to their own central existential conflict
"He keeps it so real, while ery'body else frontin." Actually, I think Holden is the most fake character in the book, hence the continuous use of him calling everyone out on their falseness. He lies about his virginity, hides from his parents and runs away from reality. I also gather from his tone that he doesn't truly believe almost all of the things he says, even when just narrating the story. He seems afraid to explore that so called "fake world of adults" to truly understand what it means, and thus judges it from a very biased point of view. The teacher caressing his cheek is an example. Sure it could've been signs of pedophilia, but rather than fully confront a man he supposedly respects, Holden quickly bails, most likely being afraid of finding out the truth that someone he respects is surrounded in the ugliness he fears.
It's likely he hates "phony's" so much because he is one himself and he hates that part of him. I like him because he's right, life is full of bs and everyone walks around acting like they know what they're doing when in reality they have no fucking clue. And we all have to play that role, play the game of life and he just didn't want to do it anymore.
+Shady Doorags well, that's kind of what adds to his bluntly honest portrayal. The fact that he's a complete hypocrite. He thinks very much how many teenagers think; having the responsibility of adulthood bare down on him but only having the juvenile mindset and experience of a child to deal with it. He constantly lies because he wants to maintain an illusion that he's some kind of badass rebel, but that part of him is the adulthood slowly creeping in. His actual sincerity comes in when he showcases childlike innocence, like when he just can't bring himself to have sex with the prostitute and when he talks about what the ducks are going to do for the winter. part of his realness is his flaws and his inability to recognize them in himself . . .most of the time anyway, whereas most books would try to maintain an overall ideal, maybe SLIGHTLY flawed but not overbearingly so, vision of the main character, in order to keep you on their side. Besides, Holden is constantly punished for his flaws in the book, so I think it sort of balances out.
TomboTime I think Holden is a great character, I just wouldn't call him an honest one. The difference between him and other adults, according to his point of view of adults, is that he's lying to himself as well as others. He's actually more dishonest in that regard.
+Shady Doorags That's certainly fair, and I also think Holden is a great character. I would just argue that his dishonesty is part of what makes him so real, because EVERYBODY lies every once in awhile (admit it, you do too). At the very least he admits how much he lies and even feels guilt for doing it, like when he lied to that nice lady in the white coat about her son in school, but sometimes he goes to the other extreme and tells more of the truth then what's good for him, like when he calls that preppy girl a pain in the ass (forgive me for not remembering much of the names, it's been a couple years since I read the book and so I'm kind of going off bare bones memory. Feel free to correct me if I remembered anything wrong). All well, agree to disagree and all that.
Why isn't anybody in the comments section channeling their inner Holden Caulfield? For Chrissake these goddam phonies just talk about senseless stuff. It kills me. It really does.
I'm a bit surprised that he didn't mention the fact no one ever listens to Holden, except the reader, because Holden learned from his adventure how to get people to listen to him. Also, I felt the duck question was more figurative than just showing him as compassionate. He asked when the lake freezes over if someone collects the ducks or if they leave themselves. He was really asking when it's time for him to grow up will he have to find his own way or will people help him along. Loved the video
Yeah, that's the argument I'd make with Catcher in the Rye. You're not supposed to like Holden. The point of the book is to understand him, not to like him.
Fun fact: Holden is a compulsive liar and is telling this story to a psychoanalysis. Put two and two together and you get a story about a suicidal teen who wishes he could bring his fantasies to life
It makes me realize high schoolers are too young to really understand most of these books. In retrospect I can see why they are considered classics, but when I was 14-15. they were mostly just boring. A high schooler doesn't understand the fear of not wanting to grow up and stay young forever.. because they aren't grown up and all they've ever been is young..
+Larry Dong There are probably different levels of appreciating the book, I'm sure. As a teenager you will appreciate things about it. I just don't think most people can fully appreciate the message until they're past their teenage years. The message in "The Outsiders" for instance, about "staying gold," always seeing the world through the innocent eyes of a child. I think it's harder for a teenager to understand that message. They might understand it, but they have yet to realize that it gets harder and harder as you grow up! So the message becomes even more powerful when you hear it as an adult. In my opinion..
That's why I really respect this guy for making these videos. He helps gives people an idea of the depth and importance that goes into book analysis by making it fun.
It seems to me that this book is all about the irony of being a teenager. That awkward age in which you are old enough to participate in the "adult" world, but young enough to where you can't understand it. Holden talks about how he thinks everyone else is a "phony" and how he will save kids from growing up in the "phony" society, but he himself is one of the most phony in the book. He talks about how much he hates movies yet watches them, he lies about the sex he has had and pussys out, and many other things. Holden is what he hates.
Holden wasn't some hero in a screwed up world. He acts like a martyr but he adopted a self-isolating philosophy . The social world isn't a simple division between phonies and innocent children.
Keyser Soze No, he is self-isolating. He is trying to prevent a connection because the last time he had a a connection, that was with Allie and ya know, things didn't go so well.
***** What Holden is missing is that while people do fake things and build up defenses, they're all as real inside as he is, and it's worth getting past the fake stuff to get to know them.
Apart from just illustrating that Holden has a gentle soul, I always thought of Holden asking about the ducks as a metaphor for himself, asking what happens to HIM in the dead of winter when the pond freezes over. Still adored this though
"The Catcher in the Rye" is my all-time favorite book, and I was a little weary of where this analysis would go. I was pleasantly surprised by this respectful and hilarious treatment. I've read this book a dozen times, and the hunting cap analogy never occured to me. Brilliant! Holden be trippin', indeed.
Allie’s death hurt Holden so bad, and the perfect memories of Allie only remind Holden that he will grow old and phony. He is so scared of growing older he just wants to seclude himself and never pick up the habits of the adults around him...but Phoebe is still pure in his eyes, and he just can’t let her down. Thankfully she was the person to empathize with Holden.
it can also mean that the reason why he admires his dead brother so much, is because he never reached adulthood and died a kid, untouched by the horrors of society.
This channel is so great cuz this is the type of stuff that gets the lil homies interested in reading. People have forgotten how important it is to expand your mind
". . . Got kicked outta all his classes in his prissy private school. Sept English! Holla!" Almost hand me literally ROFLing. A hand on my desk was my only saving grace.
+Keifbowl Roadrunner And thanks for including the atrocious red hunting cap on Holden's character image. Man, I love this book. Like most "Classic Literature", it's not the easiest read, but I love it every time I read it. And come away with something different. I have to thank my tenth grade English teacher, Mr. Roger Arsht, for turning me on to this. I didn't like it when I first read it, but I've grown to love it. For an easier piece of art to consume with the same basic message, I would suggest "Cecil Brown" by Hank Williams III.
At first I didn’t get it much, but around 50 or so pages in, I started to really understand Holden’s struggles as a character, and by the end of the book, I was really questioning the very idea of a main character in fiction and relating very much to Holden.
You have infused Ebonics with a certain eloquence that I have always suspected could exist, but have never found definitive proof of in today's cultural usage of the dialect. I both applaud you, and impart the sentiment that I hope your masterful linguistic skills are rewarded in every way for their style by cementing you a place in the history of human mentality. Bravo, and may your thuggishness carry you forever into greatness. In short, Props G.
Man! I am subscribing to you IMMEDIATELY. I am going back to school to become a high-school English teacher. And your way of explaining stories is not only raw and funny, but it is REAL. Keep up the great work, Dr. Sweets. And keep getting "twisted." LOL
I find it interesting how, when he wakes to being pet, the thought of someone showing concern for him is so foreign to him. It's as if he doesn't feel like people are allowed to pity him, or how he is not capable of understanding his breakdown has become obvious to those around him. He fails to see that this married person is now awake and losing sleep over his welfare...
This is the point in the story where Holden is showing signs of having contracted tuberculosis. He isn't writing from a psych facility. He's writing from a Tuberculosis treatment center. You could argue Mr. Antolini was checking on him with concern rather than being a pervert.
One of my favorite pieces of literature, ever, upon further review, Thug Notes has covered most of my favs, kudos for great literature Professor!!!🙏✌️📖🥰
I've been subscribed to this channel for about 3 years now (I recently deleted my old account and created this one), and you are still one of my favorites, Sparky!I was subscribed before you did this video, but when you DID this video, it cemented you as one of my favorite RUclipsrs; because this is my favorite book of all time. :)I know this message is a few years overdue, but you are an inspiration. Keep up the good work! :D
***** From Merriam- Webster's Dictionary: " 1a : the principal character in a literary work (as a drama or story)b : a leading actor, character, or participant in a literary work or real event" I understand that the main character can be bad, but protagonist is used just to describe main character. Even Patrick Bateman would be a protagonist, and he was a serial killer.
I read this book when I was in High School for a report, and remember enjoying it. Having seen your analysis of it, I now want to read it again. You sir, are a genius.
I hated reading the book in high school. Reason being, I was a weird confused angry kid too, but I didn't think it made me better than anyone else. I had a hard time finding common ground with anyone too but I felt like "they're all phonies" was an excuse given by Holden so he didn't have try anymore.
First, let me say that this channel is brilliant. Thug Notes? I love it! Second, I read Catcher in the Rye when I was 20 and for me, it was one of the biggest slogs, second only to Atlas Shrugged (even though it was much shorter in length), so this was the first video I searched on your channel. It made up for everything. Thanks for that ; )
List of Books I liked to see covered by Thug Notes at some point 1. The Time Machine by H.G. Wells 2. Carrie by Stephen King 3. The Idiot by Fyodor Dostoyevsky 4. The Trial by Franz Kafka 5. One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest by Ken Kesey 6. Fight Club by Chuck Palahniuk
Mr. Thug Notes, you are perhaps the greatest man I have ever had the pleasure of gazing upon. I was an atheist, but you are the person who has convinced me of the error of my ways, as you are clearly doing God's work.
"That's also how I practically got t.b. and came here for all of their goddam checkups and stuff." That's the actual quote. By moving the word practically you've changed the entire meaning so that it would read as him being in a facility for people with tuberculosis but it is actually a mental hospital. You don't get put in a facility for people with T.B by almost getting T.B, it's just for people that have it
in my reading of the book, its about truth. You begin by trusting his word. In the middle you realise he a pathalogical lair. Finally, you realise that he has some good observations about the world. It makes us question how we know what is true and what isn't. His tangents about the ducks are meaningless. His desire to be the catcher in the rye reveals his disconnection from reality and self-centeredness. There are hints that he might have no sense of belonging in life due to an abused past. The only person he has a secure connection with is his sister; everybody else seems like they are out to harm him. It is an insight into someone with a fragmented identity searching for belonging.
I read this book in high school and loved it, it’s been my favourite book ever since. Couple of years after I read it I watched a movie, the perks of being a wallflower and that became my favourite movie ever since also. Fast forward another few years and I read the book since I enjoyed the movie so much and only then realised it was a more modernised version of the catcher in the rye. They are both still my favourite book and movie of all time
Because he had lifelong deep-seeded psychological problems, as well as a decades long obsession with Lennon, whom he simultaneously adored, envied, and deeply resented. The man was a ticking time bomb. If it weren't Catcher in the Rye, something else would have set him off… but as to why that book specifically… that I couldn't tell you. I watched a bio on Mark David Chapman once. The guy led a pretty miserable life, but it was kind of disappointing to hear his actual justifications for murder, because they're pretty much nonsense. Kind of what you'd expect from a deranged killer, but still.
As a crazy person I can confirm that when you fixate on something, in his case the hypocrisy of modern man, a book or movie or song exposing that for all the world to see is a shocking and fascinating thing. You think that people will react negatively to it. And then everyone smiles and nods and keeps being a hypocrite, which proves to your mind that they aren't even doing it subconsciously, they KNOW and admit it. It wasn't just The Catcher in the Rye, it was the widespread acknowledgement that it was "true". If they had called Holden an infantile whiner who didn't understand the real world or the motivations of anyone other than him, it would probably have pushed Mark Chapman to try to "spread the word" and "open peoples' eyes". Combine that with his feelings of betrayal after reading a book by John Lennon, who in it disses the Beatles, God, and other things Mark loved. He started stewing about celebrities like Lennon who sing "Imagine" but hold immense amounts of wealth and to his mind are posers, hypocrites. His mind was collapsing in on itself, and those two books just gave him a direction to fall. And when you're going mad, you feel your doom approaching, so he thought why not go out by making a point.
You said around 3:38 that Holden "keeps it so real." I don't understand, though I may be misunderstanding your slang. How can you say that Holden keeps it real if he repeatedly and irrationally attempts to shield himself, as well as other young folk, from the "adult world?" To me, it seems like he's deluding himself and is unwilling to face reality. How does this make him realer than everyone else...?
He keeps it real but not in the sense that he is running down the street telling everyone the truth, id like to consider Holden's truth comes from an understanding of what reality actually is, but he also understands that not everyone sees things the way he does. To him phonies are people who lie for their own self betterment, whereas he lies for the betterment of others in most cases, he has a strong conscience and, as the main theme of the book shows, has the desire to preserve innocence, if that's through lying then so be it to him, the kids jumping off the cliff don't know any better, its just his own-given responsibility to make sure they don't fall
Except it IS an interesting books for those who empathize with Holden. The reason I find people don't like it is because they strongly disagree with all of Holden's thoughts and commentary, and that's like 75% of the book.
VivroMori that's true, but for me, it was the language that pushed this book from bad to one of the worst books i've read. if i have to read/hear 'goddam' or 'it killed me' one more time *I'M* going to kill me
It wasn't a ridiculously long book, so I didn't get tired of the repeated phrases. I think he made good use of that literary skill. I think it showed his frustration to everyone and everything even more so. But anyway, thats my two cents, three years later :)
Wow, it's really interesting how much literature is essentially depressing. Was this a phase of literature? I feel like literature of this quality is simply not being allowed anymore.
thug notes made "Catcher" a better book than it actually is. I recommend you read it if you're male and under 22. Females will always hate Holden, because they don't have a lot of free time to wander around being holier than everyone else. Grown men will just cry if they remember their younger selves, and sneer if they don't. It's definitely a good book at the right time and place, just like Zorba the Greek.
I read this as a teen and identified with Holden for the longest time. Also, female. Don't see how my gender can prevent me from enjoying any well-written book.
Read it when I was fifteen, totally identified with Holden, and last I checked I'm female. Gender might be important when it comes to being able to relate certain characters within the context of the story being told, but Catcher in the Rye is certainly not one of them. +Silvio Santos I relate to Eat, Pray, Love about as much as you do because I'm also not a middle-aged white woman whose gone through a recent divorce. And this idea that it's 'impossible' for women to understand a book like Catcher in the Rye that's about the human condition just because the main character is male is ludicrous.
You can identify with Holden regardless of gender. It is all about your mindset and the experiences you've been through. Catcher in the Rye is my all time favorite novel and Holden is one of my all time favorite characters for he (in my opinions) represents older teenagers in a realistic light that no one has been able to master before.
I disagree, I am a female and I love this book. When I first read it as a teen I put myself in Holden's place and thought of how I would feel if my little brother (or big brother or sister) died. I know it would probably drive me stark raving mad for a while anyway. My daughter loves this book too. I can't say we enjoy it but we love it. Oh, that sound weird doesn't it.
What fucks me up about this book is I DO NOT LIKE IT, but I've read it probably ten times. Sure it's a fast read, but why do I keep putting myself through the slog?
Noxshus No. You are a phony and I refuse to back down. I swear it! People like you really depress me. I would call you more names, but I'm not entirely in the mood. It really is terrible.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
I once read a book on Stockholm Syndrome. At first I really hated it, but by the end, it was absolutely incredible.
+docwonder hoffmann That's not how it works. Nobody forced you to read the book, you did it on your own
And yes, i am fun at parties
+Șefu' cu Caterincă You don't know Sir Docwonder's life! He could have been held against his will and forced to read that literally fictional literal fiction.
it's called mere-exposure effect.
i'm going to compare the system to stockholm syndrome. throughout your life the system coerces you. school has a type of stockholm syndrome effect because you are forced to go to it.
then again, it's probably a necessary evil to make well rounded individuals. if there is going to be a population increase then it's necessary that the population is atleast competent enough to eventually be independent upon reaching adulthood.
once you reach adulthood you won't have anybody holding your hand. you have to adapt to survive.
docwonder hoffmann lol
I read this entire book myself, in one sitting, on a rainy sunday.
I didn't smile for weeks.
then you got it.
All of Steinbeck's books are like that.
Your supposed to smile?
lol
Was it because the main character is so unlikable
This dude carrying me through high school reading
same lmao
da real mvp
Yusuf Idres you should actually read the novel, It's a great story.
Dr Drake Ramoray how u know he didn't read it smart ass tired of people being rude for no damn reason
I'm watching this because I love literature. I wish they would do "The Master and Margarita".
If you’re here looking for how to write your essay, I actually recommend you zone in on Holden’s sexual abuse. It’s the most overlooked “hidden meaning” in the entire book. I use quotations because it’s not hidden that well at all. It’s just that it’s so barely mentioned that most readers brush it off and act like it didn’t exist.
That’s the nature of most books. If a certain event is significant, it is repeated and examined and dissected at several points from several perspectives.
But you need to understand that this book was written with an eye towards psychoanalysis. Yes, a typical narrator in a similar situation may usually mention his sexual assault several times throughout the course of a book, but in my experience this is not how most survivors handle their assault. It’s the sort of thing that’s pushed to the back of your mind where it only comes out in times of extreme emotional distress. Not to mention, Holden was most likely assaulted by more than one person. This is evidenced both in the scene with his teacher, as well as with his interaction with women. His memories of Jane is a good place to pull some quotes from to support this argument.
Also, you have to understand, that scene where Holden is explaining that he never pushes after a girl says no. He stops immediately and without persistence. He feels some form of shame because of this, as the other male influences in his life have lead him to believe that you’re supposed to keep going after she says no. It’s a very telling line about the time period that Holden was living in, (because yes, this was absolutely a sick and disgusting mindset that was normalized in entirely too many places) the people who surround Holden, and how Holden can have an understanding of consent that is significantly more nuanced than most the other boys and men around him.
Finally, I recommend using the prostitute scene and Holden’s refusal to go through with the act. I think Holden really could have been JUST been chickening out, but I also think he was triggered at the potential sexual experience, especially when he has such an adamant refusal to even acknowledge his history of being sexually abused. Pay attention to the way he talks about Maurice and Sunny. Holden can be just as mean to women as he can be to men, but for the most part, his aggression is directed at men. His judgement most of all.
Anyway, I used to be someone who thought I didn’t like Catcher in the Rye. I read it in 8th grade, absolutely hated every second of it, and I ended up writing an essay on it. Then I was given a book report the next year as an assignment. So I did it on Catcher in the Rye again. Told myself it was because I already read the book so the report would be easy. Ended up, reading the book again anyway because “oh I need them quotes.”
By the time I graduated high school, I had read Catcher in the Rye 5 times and wrote 5 essays about it, all analyzing different aspects of the story.
Not going to lie, his sexual assault completely alters the context of his character, and once you’ve really considered it; alongside his dead little brother and his neglectful parents that sent Holden to a mental hospital possibly located all the way in LA. Notice he was going to boarding school at the start of the story. His parents live in New York.
So why is Holden saying that his brother, who lives in LA, visits him? Why doesn’t he mention his parents visiting him?
In fact, you’ll notice that Holden has a stunning lack to say about his parents for someone who’s supposed to be a teenage boy. This is another aspect of the psychoanalysis that must be considered. Holden refuses to say too many bad things about his parents, NOT BECAUSE THEY’RE GOOD PARENTS! He refuses to say bad things about them because they’ve abandoned him and he hasn’t accepted it. He desperately wants their love and support, but where does Holden end up not even weeks after showing up home? A mental institution in California.
Holden is not a hero. He is not a whiny teenager. He is a victim of sexual assault. His brother is dead. His parent’s refusal to even live with him has further deteriorated his trust in adults. His school grades were terrible, yet we know he’s good at English. And why is Holden good at English? Because despite all the things that Holden claims about liking English, what he really liked was having a teacher who gave a damn about him. Holden is desperate for human attention, yet constantly says weird and awkward things to people, not because he doesn’t like them, but because he’s afraid of their rejection. So he rejects them before they can do the same to him. He bleeds for the world around him, but if Holden’s only problem was that he’s too sensitive, then this would be a very different book.
Holden has three main traumas. The oldest is probably the sexual assault. The second is his brother’s death. The last is his parent’s abandonment of him. You could write an essay about just one of these and earn an A. Orrr, touch on all these points and really impress.
On a personal note:
I will say there is a different way to see the “Catcher in the Rye.” Yes, Holden is talking about saving children from adulthood. Obviously, as oddly noble a sentiment this is, it’s unreasonable. Despite the fact that I thought I hated this book, I’ve kept it in mind when I deal with children and people in general.
You never know what someone is going through. If they’re being a whiny little douche, there might be a reason behind it. Reasons you might not even want to know. Reasons so dark you wouldn’t even allow yourself to really notice it if it was written in a book.
So when you see a child about to head towards the cliff, I hope you point them to the ladder or bridge, waiting just out of sight. I hope you choose to guide.
Anyway, thanks for coming to my TEDTalk I guess.
THANK YOU SO MUCH
I'd disagree -- it really depends on the way you interpret the things you read. It's not necessarily a "hidden meaning." It's a "gray area" that Salinger refuses to hand to readers on a plate.
If, for example, you think that Holden misinterprets Antolini's behavior in Ch 24 (and most evidence in the book supports that he does, in fact, get it wrong in his initial reaction), then you have to call into question Holden's assertions about other things related to sexuality and his past. Notwithstanding his dubious use of numbers -- everything happens to Holden about "20 times" -- we see Holden exaggerate or just flat out lie about these things more than once in the book. He is an UNRELIABLE narrator. For example, when Holden says (I'm paraphrasing) that "people are always doing all that flitty stuff when I'm around," it's MUCH more likely that Holden SEES that and READS that in to people's behavior or words.
In fact, I'd argue that there is PLENTY of evidence to suggest that Holden is, if not bisexual, at least very confused about his preferences. It would explain a LOT of his words and actions. And I'll concede that his sexual confusion COULD also stem from abuse... but again, it all depends on how YOU read the book. I think it's interesting that his novel, like the Museum of Natural History, hasn't changed in over 50 years, and that the real DIFFERENCE in our opinions of the book completely stem from WHO'S reading it. Genius piece of symbolism on JD's part.
So in general, while it MAY be true that Holden was the victim of some kind of chronic sex abuse as a child, there's no CONCRETE evidence of it, and the things you use as "proof" are all a matter of interpretation, which is EXACTLY the way that Salinger probably wanted it.
I’ll comment on this after I finished the book, brb
That was a wonderful analysis! Thank you.
I’d say the whole thing is up for interpretation. Like all first person narration, Holden won’t be completely reliable - there’s no way to know what’s real and what’s not. (I actually really enjoyed this aspect of the book though - how hypocritical Holden could be and how he still a bit confused by the end of the book. It makes him feel more real.)
My own interpretation is that Holden has definitely experienced real trauma and this shapes his outlook on life. He’s not a complete asshole - He has a weird way of viewing life but it’s not his fault. And people are making no attempt to empathise with Holden or provide support when he needs it. Saying that, he is no hero - He makes bad choices and pushes people away. He is quite close minded in his own opinions of the people around him or simple things like movies. He complains about “phonies” but is a compulsive liar. And that makes it hard to like him
I absolutely hated this book until after I read it and heard this interpretation. I thought it was pointless. The significance of everything in the book can be explained by his trauma.
If this guy and John Green met up to talk about literature together my life would be complete.
Yes. Let's make this happen.
Fo' real? You know this brother's just playin'. He's an actor lol.
luf4rall still, he's an actor who knows his books. john green would go wonderfully with his character
Oh, dude should totally do this, but with The Fault in Our Stars. I'm sure he'd rock the shit out of it!
You forgot about Allie, his dead little brother. Allie motivates half the shit Holden does and his absence is a negative presence in the book. It is while holding Allie's baseball mitt that Holden has the vision of being the Catcher in the Rye. This was a big thing to leave out. Usually The Thug does such a thorough job, leaving out Allie is something that he should not be allowed to slack on!
I don't remember a dead brother
nikoincroatia
Yep, Holden is holding Allie's baseball mitt when he muses on being the Catcher in the Rye. He is torn because he partly feels like he let Allie "fall off the cliff" but there is an element of envy to how Holden feels about Allie since, as the thug points out, Holden is very unhappy about being forced to grow up and join the "phonies" of the adult world, and by dying, Allie has managed to cheat destiny in a way Holden can't.
I agree, the brother was an enormous part of work, his death is pretty much the main reason Holden gets so fucked up later in life.
Also forgot to mention that Holden says "This isn't the first time something like this have happened to me" when getting creeped on by his former teacher. That is a pretty subtle hint but have a huge impact on the story.
nikoincroatia
Then you might want to read the book again, Allie was incredibly important.
this knocks me out. it really does.
It goddam 𝘬𝘪𝘭𝘭𝘴 me.
What is this story about and how did Holden get abused
Certainly it does!
I never noticed the baseball catcher hat thing you pointed out. Thank you, sir.
This is mostly true, but it operates on the concession that Holden can be trusted. He's just a kid, afraid to grow up, afraid of responsibility. To get a good understanding of the character, we need to look at the context in which the story was written. Salinger wrote the thing throughout his stay in WWII, a stay which was notably long and hard for Salinger. Most biographers agree that the war probably fucked him up really badly. So it's strange to think that the first thing he does when he gets back is publish this goddamn book about a teenager in NYC, doing a whole lotta nothing for 20 some chapters. When you look at it closely, you start to realize that Salinger put a lot of himself into Holden. Salinger was a guy who was traumatized by the horrors of war. Holden is a teenager who is running from adult responsibility, the same responsibility that creates the horrors and confusion of war. So, catcher is, among other things, a story about the process of coping with the loss of innocence. It's an argument about which route is more damaging, keeping your innocence or losing it. Throughout the book, Holden makes several serious attempts to lose his innocence, whether it's seeing a prostitute or making a genuine human connection with a taxi driver. In every event, that internal struggle remains, and haunts him, because the truth is, Holden never makes the decision, even in the hospital. The book ends with one of the vaguest endings that I've ever read. I think that's what makes the book so hard to analyze. It's vague, it's nuanced, you don't know what Salinger thinks of Holden, you don't know what Holden means all of the time, you don't know what's going on in his head. You're really only left with your impressions, and even those are often weird and sorta vague. That's really what makes Catcher a good book. We can argue about it for days without getting anywhere.
This was great
If you really want to know it. It's the kind of book that makes you want to sit down with the goddam author as a friend long after you've read it. But boy, this world full of phonies drives me crazy. It really does. It feels like there's never anyone around to listen.
That's also the reason it's so fascinating to talk to people about this book. The reason Holden is happy as he watches Phoebe on the Carussel changes from person to person is often tied to their own central existential conflict
"He keeps it so real, while ery'body else frontin."
Actually, I think Holden is the most fake character in the book, hence the continuous use of him calling everyone out on their falseness. He lies about his virginity, hides from his parents and runs away from reality. I also gather from his tone that he doesn't truly believe almost all of the things he says, even when just narrating the story. He seems afraid to explore that so called "fake world of adults" to truly understand what it means, and thus judges it from a very biased point of view. The teacher caressing his cheek is an example. Sure it could've been signs of pedophilia, but rather than fully confront a man he supposedly respects, Holden quickly bails, most likely being afraid of finding out the truth that someone he respects is surrounded in the ugliness he fears.
he did say "I'm the most terrific liar you ever saw in your life."
It's likely he hates "phony's" so much because he is one himself and he hates that part of him. I like him because he's right, life is full of bs and everyone walks around acting like they know what they're doing when in reality they have no fucking clue. And we all have to play that role, play the game of life and he just didn't want to do it anymore.
+Shady Doorags well, that's kind of what adds to his bluntly honest portrayal. The fact that he's a complete hypocrite. He thinks very much how many teenagers think; having the responsibility of adulthood bare down on him but only having the juvenile mindset and experience of a child to deal with it. He constantly lies because he wants to maintain an illusion that he's some kind of badass rebel, but that part of him is the adulthood slowly creeping in. His actual sincerity comes in when he showcases childlike innocence, like when he just can't bring himself to have sex with the prostitute and when he talks about what the ducks are going to do for the winter. part of his realness is his flaws and his inability to recognize them in himself . . .most of the time anyway, whereas most books would try to maintain an overall ideal, maybe SLIGHTLY flawed but not overbearingly so, vision of the main character, in order to keep you on their side.
Besides, Holden is constantly punished for his flaws in the book, so I think it sort of balances out.
TomboTime I think Holden is a great character, I just wouldn't call him an honest one. The difference between him and other adults, according to his point of view of adults, is that he's lying to himself as well as others. He's actually more dishonest in that regard.
+Shady Doorags That's certainly fair, and I also think Holden is a great character. I would just argue that his dishonesty is part of what makes him so real, because EVERYBODY lies every once in awhile (admit it, you do too). At the very least he admits how much he lies and even feels guilt for doing it, like when he lied to that nice lady in the white coat about her son in school, but sometimes he goes to the other extreme and tells more of the truth then what's good for him, like when he calls that preppy girl a pain in the ass (forgive me for not remembering much of the names, it's been a couple years since I read the book and so I'm kind of going off bare bones memory. Feel free to correct me if I remembered anything wrong).
All well, agree to disagree and all that.
Why isn't anybody in the comments section channeling their inner Holden Caulfield? For Chrissake these goddam phonies just talk about senseless stuff. It kills me. It really does.
I agree, can't stand fake people. Their incessant babbling is unbearable at times.
saint imogen nox 😂😂😂 As an English teacher, I certainly appreciate your humor. Thank you!
saint imogen nox HOLLA
I love how this is a reference to the book. It killed me.
What are you twelve?
This is one of my favorite Character driven naratives of all time. It completely changed how I view literature.
I'm a bit surprised that he didn't mention the fact no one ever listens to Holden, except the reader, because Holden learned from his adventure how to get people to listen to him. Also, I felt the duck question was more figurative than just showing him as compassionate. He asked when the lake freezes over if someone collects the ducks or if they leave themselves. He was really asking when it's time for him to grow up will he have to find his own way or will people help him along. Loved the video
If you can't stand the narrator in this book, you just haven't ever felt this way. That's probably a good thing.
straight up. I wish I didn't love this book.
I can't stand the narrator because I used to feel that way, and I didn't enjoy it.
Yeah, me too. I don't enjoy it either. But I understand it. And you're not always meant to enjoy books, just take something from it
Yeah, that's the argument I'd make with Catcher in the Rye. You're not supposed to like Holden. The point of the book is to understand him, not to like him.
Fun fact: Holden is a compulsive liar and is telling this story to a psychoanalysis. Put two and two together and you get a story about a suicidal teen who wishes he could bring his fantasies to life
Usually your vids on books like these are on point, but this one glossed over a shit ton of important motifs and parts in the book
+805Goodland It is just a five minute video to go over the general book. This isn't for people studying. This is just for entertainment.
These videos are hilarious... I wonder how many people watch these who wouldn't normally be interested in book analysis?
+Joseph Toscano he actually carries me through high school reading
It makes me realize high schoolers are too young to really understand most of these books. In retrospect I can see why they are considered classics, but when I was 14-15. they were mostly just boring. A high schooler doesn't understand the fear of not wanting to grow up and stay young forever.. because they aren't grown up and all they've ever been is young..
+Joseph Toscano You've got it completely wrong. This book is MADE for teenagers.
+Larry Dong There are probably different levels of appreciating the book, I'm sure. As a teenager you will appreciate things about it. I just don't think most people can fully appreciate the message until they're past their teenage years. The message in "The Outsiders" for instance, about "staying gold," always seeing the world through the innocent eyes of a child. I think it's harder for a teenager to understand that message. They might understand it, but they have yet to realize that it gets harder and harder as you grow up! So the message becomes even more powerful when you hear it as an adult. In my opinion..
That's why I really respect this guy for making these videos. He helps gives people an idea of the depth and importance that goes into book analysis by making it fun.
loved it, just wish he made a shout out to holdens dead brother since he had a huge impact in the story
yeah how'd they forget it. and it was a TB institute, not a mental institute
What did holdens brother do?
@@spilega4603 ….he died
@@gabschmerhold dont forget the cast
Your ability to translate what could be boring into something interesting for high school kids, and everyone else, is amazing!
It seems to me that this book is all about the irony of being a teenager. That awkward age in which you are old enough to participate in the "adult" world, but young enough to where you can't understand it. Holden talks about how he thinks everyone else is a "phony" and how he will save kids from growing up in the "phony" society, but he himself is one of the most phony in the book. He talks about how much he hates movies yet watches them, he lies about the sex he has had and pussys out, and many other things. Holden is what he hates.
This book brought me so much comfort when I was going through my Sophomore year.
Holden wasn't some hero in a screwed up world. He acts like a martyr but he adopted a self-isolating philosophy . The social world isn't a simple division between phonies and innocent children.
***** is not self-isolating he just try to make conecction but cant find them, like all of us, maybe you are not beign honest with yourself
Keyser Soze No, he is self-isolating. He is trying to prevent a connection because the last time he had a a connection, that was with Allie and ya know, things didn't go so well.
he wan the connection but it so hard, that way sometimes he keep away
***** What Holden is missing is that while people do fake things and build up defenses, they're all as real inside as he is, and it's worth getting past the fake stuff to get to know them.
Hakajin Nice insight :)
Glad I helped, Ashley. Show 'em that mad knowledge next week!
First!? Btw this is my first time seeing a verified person getting less attention this comment must really be trash.
@@spilega4603 nobody cares stfu
Out of all the books I read during high school, this one is my favorite, and it was optional extra credit for the winter break.
Apart from just illustrating that Holden has a gentle soul, I always thought of Holden asking about the ducks as a metaphor for himself, asking what happens to HIM in the dead of winter when the pond freezes over. Still adored this though
"The Catcher in the Rye" is my all-time favorite book, and I was a little weary of where this analysis would go. I was pleasantly surprised by this respectful and hilarious treatment. I've read this book a dozen times, and the hunting cap analogy never occured to me. Brilliant! Holden be trippin', indeed.
I wish I could play this for my students. They'd love it but their parents wouldn't. Thank you, Wisecrack!
Allie’s death hurt Holden so bad, and the perfect memories of Allie only remind Holden that he will grow old and phony. He is so scared of growing older he just wants to seclude himself and never pick up the habits of the adults around him...but Phoebe is still pure in his eyes, and he just can’t let her down. Thankfully she was the person to empathize with Holden.
What about his dead brother? I always felt like that was important, and had something to do with catching kids jumping off a cliff.
it can also mean that the reason why he admires his dead brother so much, is because he never reached adulthood and died a kid, untouched by the horrors of society.
@@brunoclakDamn, that’s deep
This channel is so great cuz this is the type of stuff that gets the lil homies interested in reading. People have forgotten how important it is to expand your mind
". . . Got kicked outta all his classes in his prissy private school. Sept English! Holla!"
Almost hand me literally ROFLing. A hand on my desk was my only saving grace.
+Keifbowl Roadrunner And thanks for including the atrocious red hunting cap on Holden's character image.
Man, I love this book. Like most "Classic Literature", it's not the easiest read, but I love it every time I read it. And come away with something different. I have to thank my tenth grade English teacher, Mr. Roger Arsht, for turning me on to this. I didn't like it when I first read it, but I've grown to love it.
For an easier piece of art to consume with the same basic message, I would suggest "Cecil Brown" by Hank Williams III.
At first I didn’t get it much, but around 50 or so pages in, I started to really understand Holden’s struggles as a character, and by the end of the book, I was really questioning the very idea of a main character in fiction and relating very much to Holden.
Hell ya. Great idea...keep 'em coming!
You have infused Ebonics with a certain eloquence that I have always suspected could exist, but have never found definitive proof of in today's cultural usage of the dialect. I both applaud you, and impart the sentiment that I hope your masterful linguistic skills are rewarded in every way for their style by cementing you a place in the history of human mentality. Bravo, and may your thuggishness carry you forever into greatness. In short, Props G.
"'CEPT ENGLISH. HOLLA"
Holy shirt, I love this channel.
Man! I am subscribing to you IMMEDIATELY. I am going back to school to become a high-school English teacher. And your way of explaining stories is not only raw and funny, but it is REAL. Keep up the great work, Dr. Sweets. And keep getting "twisted." LOL
My god. You actually made it sound interesting. Nice work.
Love it! just keeps getting better. I think I'll show these videos at work.
To kill a mockingbird is still one of my all time favorites. :)
@@kyoko703 I read To Kill around the same time as 1984, One Flew over the cuckcoo's nest and Animal Farm. Book's like that leave a mark.
I find it interesting how, when he wakes to being pet, the thought of someone showing concern for him is so foreign to him. It's as if he doesn't feel like people are allowed to pity him, or how he is not capable of understanding his breakdown has become obvious to those around him. He fails to see that this married person is now awake and losing sleep over his welfare...
Thats interesting. I never though of it that way.
This is the point in the story where Holden is showing signs of having contracted tuberculosis. He isn't writing from a psych facility. He's writing from a Tuberculosis treatment center. You could argue Mr. Antolini was checking on him with concern rather than being a pervert.
I forgot this existed until it showed up in my recommended. Never thought I'd be nostalgic for the summer of 2013.
Oh hi summer reading.
Love your channel. Your delivery is so intelligent, not over-done or cheesy by any means. Brilliant.
Am I the only one that loves the way he says “Holden chokes like a b*tch!”
One of my favorite pieces of literature, ever, upon further review, Thug Notes has covered most of my favs, kudos for great literature Professor!!!🙏✌️📖🥰
I just finished reading this book, it killed me. It really did!
*(badum tsh)*
You deserve some kind of endless grant for promoting literature the idiosyncratic - but real - way you do. Best to you!
He seems to be a big fan of the kind of books where the hero is "real in a fake world." Please do A Little Princess!
i read this book way ahead of my class and just finished it honestly i think its the greatest book of all time
Once again another winner!!! Awesome!!
Thanks, yo.
It takes a massive amount of courage to hold on to innocence in this world and hardly none at all to grow cold.
Watching these is the only way I can get my boyfriend to talk about literature, so thank you for that. And I love them too!
I’ve never been called a well read baller. I feel a strange sense of having accomplished something great
I've been subscribed to this channel for about 3 years now (I recently deleted my old account and created this one), and you are still one of my favorites, Sparky!I was subscribed before you did this video, but when you DID this video, it cemented you as one of my favorite RUclipsrs; because this is my favorite book of all time. :)I know this message is a few years overdue, but you are an inspiration. Keep up the good work! :D
I find the comments funny because I was named after the protagonist.
just awesome
+Justin Gould protagonist is used to refer to the main character...
***** From Merriam- Webster's Dictionary:
" 1a : the principal character in a literary work (as a drama or story)b : a leading actor, character, or participant in a literary work or real event"
I understand that the main character can be bad, but protagonist is used just to describe main character. Even Patrick Bateman would be a protagonist, and he was a serial killer.
+Joe Mama Savage. :D
A Link In The Park Hello Holden!
This is one of the most entertaining and informative channels I've ever come across on youtube
Sparky my man with his hat backwards. I see what you did there
I read this book when I was in High School for a report, and remember enjoying it. Having seen your analysis of it, I now want to read it again. You sir, are a genius.
I hated reading the book in high school. Reason being, I was a weird confused angry kid too, but I didn't think it made me better than anyone else. I had a hard time finding common ground with anyone too but I felt like "they're all phonies" was an excuse given by Holden so he didn't have try anymore.
This is by far the best channel on this site!
Wow. never thought about the hat thing.
Every Tuesday!
Have you thought about doing Jerzy Kosiński's "The Painted Bird"? That's one crazy-ass book!
First, let me say that this channel is brilliant. Thug Notes? I love it! Second, I read Catcher in the Rye when I was 20 and for me, it was one of the biggest slogs, second only to Atlas Shrugged (even though it was much shorter in length), so this was the first video I searched on your channel. It made up for everything. Thanks for that ; )
List of Books I liked to see covered by Thug Notes at some point
1. The Time Machine by H.G. Wells
2. Carrie by Stephen King
3. The Idiot by Fyodor Dostoyevsky
4. The Trial by Franz Kafka
5. One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest by Ken Kesey
6. Fight Club by Chuck Palahniuk
Mr. Thug Notes, you are perhaps the greatest man I have ever had the pleasure of gazing upon.
I was an atheist, but you are the person who has convinced me of the error of my ways, as you are clearly doing God's work.
I just finish the book, I don't know if it was my edition o what but I do not recall reading about a mental hospital, or is it like a hiden think ?
This is the most amazing way of analyzing books ever!!! I want to read more of the classics just to watch your analysis!!!!
Maaaan where was this dude when I was in high school...
This must be the single greatest idea for a channel that I have ever seen.
I always seem to be ironically alone in the world when I say I really did like this book
You're not, you're just on one side of the fence.
Some people love it and others hate it.
Actually most people love it, that's why it's so famous
You are not alone. Thousands like this book.
"and homeless near a thousand homes I stood, and near a thousand tables pined and wanted food."
@@5itka
Not most.
the way sweets wore his hat is a reference to the book itself.
Love you Thug Notes for your concise, unique delivery of classical literature.
He wasn't in a mental hospital. He was getting treatment for TB and was seeing a therapist...
How do you know?
+DCNOS18 He tells us at the end of chapter one, "that's practically how I got t.b. and came out here for all these goddamn check ups and stuff "
"That's also how I practically got t.b. and came here for all of their goddam checkups and stuff."
That's the actual quote. By moving the word practically you've changed the entire meaning so that it would read as him being in a facility for people with tuberculosis but it is actually a mental hospital. You don't get put in a facility for people with T.B by almost getting T.B, it's just for people that have it
none of what you guys say makes sense. quit reading books.
yeah you do that then....
This is hands down the hottest thang on RUclips! Great work Sparky Sweets.
in my reading of the book, its about truth. You begin by trusting his word. In the middle you realise he a pathalogical lair. Finally, you realise that he has some good observations about the world. It makes us question how we know what is true and what isn't. His tangents about the ducks are meaningless. His desire to be the catcher in the rye reveals his disconnection from reality and self-centeredness. There are hints that he might have no sense of belonging in life due to an abused past. The only person he has a secure connection with is his sister; everybody else seems like they are out to harm him. It is an insight into someone with a fragmented identity searching for belonging.
I read this book in high school and loved it, it’s been my favourite book ever since. Couple of years after I read it I watched a movie, the perks of being a wallflower and that became my favourite movie ever since also. Fast forward another few years and I read the book since I enjoyed the movie so much and only then realised it was a more modernised version of the catcher in the rye. They are both still my favourite book and movie of all time
Man, these videos are fucking great.
I'm a tutor at a high school and I like to show the kids who hate reading your videos!
Thanks.
Haha, I remember reading that 2Pac was a voracious reader so I imagine this is what a book review from him would be like.
Ive never wanted to binge watch a "spark notes" type series more in my whole life ! this is the shiiiiiz!
Just here to say (again) that Thug Notes is amazing. Please don't stop.
I feel like I'm the only guy who like this book....
I loved your channel bro, and that’s the first video I’m watching, btw I loved your job and your style, I wish billions of subscribers to you bro !
damn. even AFTEr learning aobut what this book is about, i still don't get how it could motivate a guy to kill a guy like john lennon
Because John Lennon was the biggest phony of his time. Read his bio
Mn Kv from all ive heard, despite startingt the "peaceful hippie" movement, he use to smack yoko around?
+emil tucker-orr Because the man who killed Lennon was a schizophrenic and had voices in his head
Or make Mel Gibsons character paranoid in "Conspiracy Theory."
The book gets too much credit.
"Slung up in a mental hospital"
I thought it was a "Tuberculosis Rest Home" but...
Ok.....its your story. 😂🙈😂
Soooo, why did a guy kill John Lennon after reading that book?
Because he had lifelong deep-seeded psychological problems, as well as a decades long obsession with Lennon, whom he simultaneously adored, envied, and deeply resented. The man was a ticking time bomb. If it weren't Catcher in the Rye, something else would have set him off… but as to why that book specifically… that I couldn't tell you.
I watched a bio on Mark David Chapman once. The guy led a pretty miserable life, but it was kind of disappointing to hear his actual justifications for murder, because they're pretty much nonsense. Kind of what you'd expect from a deranged killer, but still.
Cool I guess
As a crazy person I can confirm that when you fixate on something, in his case the hypocrisy of modern man, a book or movie or song exposing that for all the world to see is a shocking and fascinating thing. You think that people will react negatively to it. And then everyone smiles and nods and keeps being a hypocrite, which proves to your mind that they aren't even doing it subconsciously, they KNOW and admit it.
It wasn't just The Catcher in the Rye, it was the widespread acknowledgement that it was "true". If they had called Holden an infantile whiner who didn't understand the real world or the motivations of anyone other than him, it would probably have pushed Mark Chapman to try to "spread the word" and "open peoples' eyes".
Combine that with his feelings of betrayal after reading a book by John Lennon, who in it disses the Beatles, God, and other things Mark loved. He started stewing about celebrities like Lennon who sing "Imagine" but hold immense amounts of wealth and to his mind are posers, hypocrites.
His mind was collapsing in on itself, and those two books just gave him a direction to fall. And when you're going mad, you feel your doom approaching, so he thought why not go out by making a point.
nikoincroatia sounds logical and yet insane
diamond lord Crazy people just feel regular and the rest of the world seems to go crazy around them.
You're amazing. I have to read this book by next week for school, and it just wasn't making sense. Your analysis helped me a lot. Keep on keepin' on!
sweet jesus this is great. why are you not insanely famous? oprah winfrey book club eat your heart out.
You have such a gift for clarification and analysis. Simply brilliant.
My english teacher showed us this vid. i have a test in this book tommorow so yeah
ColdKillerz99 wow it must be hard to take a test IN a book. JK
This whole series is just.. Awesome.
You said around 3:38 that Holden "keeps it so real."
I don't understand, though I may be misunderstanding your slang. How can you say that Holden keeps it real if he repeatedly and irrationally attempts to shield himself, as well as other young folk, from the "adult world?"
To me, it seems like he's deluding himself and is unwilling to face reality. How does this make him realer than everyone else...?
He keeps it real but not in the sense that he is running down the street telling everyone the truth, id like to consider Holden's truth comes from an understanding of what reality actually is, but he also understands that not everyone sees things the way he does. To him phonies are people who lie for their own self betterment, whereas he lies for the betterment of others in most cases, he has a strong conscience and, as the main theme of the book shows, has the desire to preserve innocence, if that's through lying then so be it to him, the kids jumping off the cliff don't know any better, its just his own-given responsibility to make sure they don't fall
Ive watched em all and was never disappointed, keep up the good work.
He makes this book sound interesting. That is amazing because NOTHING can make this book interesting. Are you the lord of wordcraft?
Except it IS an interesting books for those who empathize with Holden.
The reason I find people don't like it is because they strongly disagree with all of Holden's thoughts and commentary, and that's like 75% of the book.
VivroMori that's true, but for me, it was the language that pushed this book from bad to one of the worst books i've read. if i have to read/hear 'goddam' or 'it killed me' one more time *I'M* going to kill me
FSUfan1023
But not "sort of" which is used in the book 180 times? But that's just how Holden thinks. I understand what you mean though.
It wasn't a ridiculously long book, so I didn't get tired of the repeated phrases. I think he made good use of that literary skill. I think it showed his frustration to everyone and everything even more so. But anyway, thats my two cents, three years later :)
Thanks for all these Thug Notes videos! You're a real prince, kid. A gentleman and a scholar!
Wow, it's really interesting how much literature is essentially depressing. Was this a phase of literature? I feel like literature of this quality is simply not being allowed anymore.
I remember reading this 20+ years ago in high school. Great review and great analysis! Love these videos!
thug notes made "Catcher" a better book than it actually is. I recommend you read it if you're male and under 22. Females will always hate Holden, because they don't have a lot of free time to wander around being holier than everyone else. Grown men will just cry if they remember their younger selves, and sneer if they don't. It's definitely a good book at the right time and place, just like Zorba the Greek.
I read this as a teen and identified with Holden for the longest time. Also, female. Don't see how my gender can prevent me from enjoying any well-written book.
*****
I'm curious, what's her favorite book?
Read it when I was fifteen, totally identified with Holden, and last I checked I'm female. Gender might be important when it comes to being able to relate certain characters within the context of the story being told, but Catcher in the Rye is certainly not one of them.
+Silvio Santos I relate to Eat, Pray, Love about as much as you do because I'm also not a middle-aged white woman whose gone through a recent divorce. And this idea that it's 'impossible' for women to understand a book like Catcher in the Rye that's about the human condition just because the main character is male is ludicrous.
You can identify with Holden regardless of gender. It is all about your mindset and the experiences you've been through. Catcher in the Rye is my all time favorite novel and Holden is one of my all time favorite characters for he (in my opinions) represents older teenagers in a realistic light that no one has been able to master before.
I disagree, I am a female and I love this book. When I first read it as a teen I put myself in Holden's place and thought of how I would feel if my little brother (or big brother or sister) died. I know it would probably drive me stark raving mad for a while anyway. My daughter loves this book too. I can't say we enjoy it but we love it. Oh, that sound weird doesn't it.
"Wisecrack" with "Thug Notes"...ALOL!!! Your killing it!!
What fucks me up about this book is I DO NOT LIKE IT, but I've read it probably ten times. Sure it's a fast read, but why do I keep putting myself through the slog?
Noxshus Maybe you like it?
alpineradiant You hold your tongue!
Noxshus No. You are a phony and I refuse to back down. I swear it! People like you really depress me. I would call you more names, but I'm not entirely in the mood. It really is terrible.
alpineradiant I can't tell if you realized I was joking and were joking in return, or actually got butthurt...
Noxshus I was joking. My butt doesn't get hurt. I was returning the taunt in a similar fashion the book was written. Just being random. No harm meant.