Fix Cycling Knee Pain // By Listening to your body
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- Опубликовано: 23 фев 2018
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Being able to measure movement in a bike fit is critical, but listening to the other signs and symptoms your body is whispering to you can be extremely helpful in getting to the bottom of your problem.
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Man... I just wanna ride a bike. 😔
@2:50 invaluable advice for myself or anyone with medial knee pain localized in the VMO attachment area (or above the knee/quad tendon area). For the longest time, I felt keeping my saddle lower was helping my knees. When on the contrary, it was increasing the angle of the knee at the top of the pedal stroke, putting more load above the knee. I increased my saddle height and adjusted the fore/aft based on your balance test, and nearly all pain and discomfort dissipated, and I even feel greater power and activation with the glutes. Great information, thank you so much!
I rode 90 miles in 3 days as a beginner cycler and didn’t have any pain on the bike at all… then I went to go try and run and discovered horrible sharp pain at front of knee cap on both knees And am now totally unable to run. It’s worse pain when going down hill… cycling wrecked my knees and there was no warning that it was even happening to me until I tried to run. I am so discouraged
Thats bad.
90 in 3days is a lil too much.
@@shabaazs791 it didn’t seem like too much. I was running 50 miles a week at the time… anyways a theragun on my quads fixed it over 3 days. Massage the quads and rest for few days. What happened was the change in my quads caused petallar tracking issue, once quads loosened up the knee pain at patella was gone…
Thank you! You are a genious!!! After 4 years of pain in the knees, following your instructions, I reduced the cranks by 1 cm and finally the pain disappeared
This was really useful information! Pretty much nailed on my issues, now I’m applying his tactics
great info, thanks
Unfortunately some problems may not cause pain whilst riding, the pain can develop later, even the next day. Makes it hard to figure out that they were caused by riding (may have been doing other activities) and exactly what part of the pedal stroke triggers the issue. A bit like the interconnectedness you talked about, via time rather than through the body.
You sir are very knowledgeable. Thanks!
This is an amazing video. I think you nailed my issue. I have knee pain just above the knee or too much quads load. I have been trying to solve the problem and the problems started coming up because of my new saddle. The rails in the new saddle are short ones and even with the setback seatpost I can't get the saddle back enough. So I started to use a longer stem. I have been on the saddle always quite back and no issues but now my legs (knees) hurting a lot. What I have been doing lately is to set cleats bit more back and maybe releasing load in the upper knee position (helping the angle of the knee). I'm already up on the seat as much as possible. Maybe another seatpost even more setback or cranks to be shorter ones. Thanks! I have very shot legs but very long back and extremely powerful legs. I'm ex powerlifter and I used to squat 180kg x 5 (or 200kg x 3) reps and I was like 63-65kg dude. LOL, I just can't do it anymore like youngster - no thanks :-) The power is still there in my "muscle memory" and develops stronger very fast if I start power exercises. I have been doing some hill training and squats at gym. I have developed a lot of power in just two months but maybe it is just too fast development. I already stopped weight training and just doing easy driving with my bike. There will be bike event coming up in the next month and it will be about 50 km in hilly area. I need to make sure that I'm fully recovered this knee issue. I'm on the right track finding a root cause and the solution though.
Sir! You always solve my problems thanks. Great videos
You are one of the only bike fitters who talk about knee pain caused by to much flexation at the top of the stroke. I have suffered from this for years. The problem is that while the bike manufacturers offer multiple sizes, cranks are too limited in length. I am 5-4, and using a 65mm crank. Too long!! What can I do?
Thanks! Had knee pain and raised my seat. pain went away and power went up!
How do you know when the seats just in the right place?
Def works if you raise your sadle .but then your lower back is gna kill u.loose loose situation lol
What about dirt jump riders? Im suffering from knee pain because of low saddle for 1 year. Im 15
@@meteturhan3505 dirt bikes not designed for cruising or pedaling, or even sitting on the saddle. Get a normal bike for casual riding
Great!
I have no saddle discomfort, no other pain in my body and I got now a very strong knee pain, on the outside of the knee, but I saw it could be my shoes they are soft and might allow for my foot to twist to the side, could that be it ?
Amazing video!! Thanks
Thank you, for fixing my knee pain; I was recomended to move my cleats all the way to the back and that was the cause for numbness on the toes of my right foot and pain on my knee. I just moved them to the position I have used all my life ( or close to it depending on the shoe) and pain and numbness were gone.
Nail on the head! I recently changed from spd cleats to spd-l...boy, I got faster and stronger...in the beginning...now I'm stumbling around, fearful of staircases and craving for a ride but 'knee says no'. Stretching apropriately (with a little help from @Athlean-x -this dude is awesome in putting science into sports) is doin' me great. I talk to my buddy-knee-in-pain every day and I treat it with the best and gentle care I can but OMG, my usually very patient self is being tested to extremes :D THX for SHARING, keep up the GOOD CYCLINGS! Grtz, F.
BTW, the asymmetrical part applies to me too. I got a bike fit, 2 years ago and they advised a shorter crank. Didn't have the money to do so and I seemed to manage the 172.5 well...with the SPD cleats... I struggle with the iliopsoas too, that is, on the opposite side of the kneepain...speaking of 'interdependence'... I love the science behind it...on paper...not on my body :D Cheers!!!
I was diagnosed with chondromalacia and tendinitis grade 3 , on the left side knee. I feel is getting better with exercises that I’ve been doing . My cranks are 67.5 mm is it better if I get shorter cranks ??and shall I put higher my saddle?? Pls help
Hi John. If the hip is impinged on the left which makes max knee flexion difficult, would you expect higher saddle pressure on the opposite side? I.e right? I sometimes get above the knee tendon pain on the left, and saddle discomfort on the right. I think due to a leg length discrepency.
Usually this is the case, yes. Our body uses the opposite sitting area (the right in your case) as its point of contact and stability that it pivots from. Saddle pressure in these cases shows the pressure never really unweighting from that right side through the pedal stroke. There are exceptions (as always) but generally this is how it happens....
I am new watching your channel, so I don’t know how much topics you posted so far... but as I watched few of your channel, I found many beneficial, practical, information & analysis. I have one request about topics. Would you make topics about top 10 crank list based on energy efficiency transfer through from foot to pedal, chain then tires. Because there are many crank from many companies and price is also vary. Or just advice for choosing new crank for up grade. Because crank is crucial part of power in bicycle. Thanks.
What are your thoughts on doing things asymmetrically? My right knee developed some front of the knee pain (the kind where touching the knee cap feels slightly painful) this summer when I went bike touring, partly because I went from riding an unloaded bike one or two hours every other day, to riding ten hours per day, every day, with 40 kilos of camping gear on the bike.
Raising the saddle did only partly solve it, so I moved the cleat back about a mm on the right shoe, so that cleat is now 1 mm further back than the other cleat, effectively increasing the saddle hight for that leg. The pain is now gone, but instead the toes on that foot sometimes point down a lot when I get tired. Good or bad solution?
I'm currently building a new bike and plan to get a shorter crank on that one.
Hello. Some questions. Is this itbs? Last ride, i got pain on the side of my knee. I always get this if i haven’t ridden in a while, like 3 weeks or more. Really painful ride midway to home. But after 2 days, i can ride again pain-free. Saddle height is just about right.
Second question. I experience some toe numbness when doing laps, i get this mid-lap. Only when doing laps. I don’t experience this on long rides. My shoes aren’t tight, just about right. Tried thin and thick socks. I moved the cleats back by around a mm or two. That’s the max i could go, otherwise, severe toe overlap. Yet, toe numbness persists. Goes away when i slow down a bit.
Lefty seeL Have you get done with your first problem, that side pain on your knee?
My story is too same as yours, Need help.
@@nomadicdj Mine just goes away. What happens to me is if i haven't ridden a long while, then i suddenly ride about 60 km or more, i get that outer knee pain, and sometimes cramps too. Knee pain starts on one side, and when i shift more power to the other leg on the ride home, that other leg's outer knee gets painful too. What i do is i use foam roller when i get home, from the outer knee to hips. Afrer a few days i can ride same or longer distances pain-free and with no cramps. This also happened to me when i was into running. Same story, if i haven't run a while and suddenly runs more than an hour, outer knees hurt. But with running, pain and soreness goes away longer.
Your knee issue may be different and if it is, better ask an expert. Article below may be helpful.
www.cyclingweekly.com/fitness/cycling-knee-pain-everything-you-need-to-know-329957
@@leftyseel8658 that's exactly is my story while cycling and running, i mean 100% same story.
Good to hear that you're done with your outer knee pain.
Will those RUclips videos mentioning about how to use roller for lateral knee pain helped out?
@@nomadicdj Rollers help in the recovery, i mean for me it does. Though i learned it not from youtube but from Runner's World magazine. I also elevate my legs, and back when i was running, i put ice on my knees. I haven't ridden for months coz of this pandemic, but once i do, i have to take it easy and ride under 50 km otherwise i'm sure i'll get those knee pain and cramps again.
If it happens to you always, might be bike fit issue.
Do you offer e-consultations for bike fitting?
I only have bit of pain in my right knee
I get knee pain 100% when my saddle is too low and my quads are overloaded, a few mm's change makes it disappear entirely.
Andrew Bedford my knee pain is unchanged by saddle height on my mtb. I’m gonna get some shorter cranks and pray it helps. At 175mm now and I’m only 5’6.5” tall.
A low saddle put a lot of pressure on my quads, overloading them and around my knee.
Kept moving the saddle up now I have more of a equal pressure on my quads and hams after a long ride.
With a low saddle, the next day my quads were very tight, now the tightness is much better.
But make sure you do a 10 to 15min stretch after each ride, just some basic stretches and it will help with your leg flexibility on future rides, i am a new rider and have a cheap ass mountain bike that i use mostly for roads and stretching helps big time.
You are lucky to have solved the issue!
What about dirt jump riders? Im suffering from knee pain because of low saddle for 1 year. Im 15
👍👍👍👍👍
is it possible that there is a mild knee soreness phase to wait through after some bike & cleat adjustments? See if it goes away after a few rides, or is it already confirmation of needing change?
hi coach!
my inseam is 73cm and i am using a 172 crank arm. I feel pain in my left knee, more on the lateral side whenever I ride my bike for 40-50km. How high should my saddle be? Would love to know your recommendation.
40km? 😮
Per day?
@@shabaazs791 usually 3 times per week, ride s ranging from 40, 50, or sometimes 100km
I suffer front knee pain and my saddle is at the correct height i will try shorter cranks and await the outcome i also suffer toe and foot numbness but run flat pedals any advice on this would be great.
DOD THE MOD did the shorter cranks work?
Are your cranks too long? Are you old and a bit frail? I am trying a lot of things
www.bikeforums.net/21204990-post77.html
but at the end of the day, strength helps. You may also try using cleats rather than flat pedals to keep your pedalling on the straight and narrow.
I have looked for years for 160 mm cranks and just can't find a brand that I trust. Do you know of a company that sells 160mm road cranks at at least Ultegra level for not crazy expensive? Now that I write that it sounds like I'm asking a lot.
Did some googling. Looks like Rotor has some good options but they're crazy expensive. it's just weird how slow companies are to pick up the shorter crank movement since it has been going on for about 5 years now. Shimano doesn't produce a 160, nor do most bike brands.
The Cobb cranks work well. They're not like a set of DuraAce but they're certainly more than adequate...
Alan Taylor Farnes I have rotor cranks in 155mm I paid $275 on eBay brand new
I've suffered from knee pain after a staircase fractured my left patella, but I now have a fit that lets me cycle without pain. I really want to upgrade to a new bike in three years as a milestone birthday gift, but I want to preserve the fit I have now on a new bike. Assuming I keep my current seatpost and saddle when I swap, what do I need to check to keep the same fit?
I get knee pain normally, up stairs etc, but recently been trying to tune my bike fit. To add I have new shoes and new cleats and new saddle. So not sure if it's saddle height, fore/aft, or cleat position.
My hips stay still, no real saddle issues except I tend to sit more forward rather than on my seat bones. I have had some foot numbness but not sure if this is due to shoes being too tight (it's not every time)
My feet naturally point out slightly and I have low arches. I don't really want to change my cleats to accommodate this because I actually ride pretty straight and horizontal footed with no issues.
Where should I start?
Nabeel Chaudhry Z
I have no secondary symptoms, simply pain right above my knee.
Yvette G same here. Did you find the source of the problem?
@@MikaelEtienne Yes I did thankfully. First I bought a smaller bike. I'm 5'3 and I was using an extra large bike. After that I lowered the seat on my bike a little bit every day until I got the right height and the knee pain stopped. 😊
I'm 5'8 and using a Large cannondale trail 6. I hope the issue doesnt come from the bike size for me coz i just bought it. I'm still monitoring my pain progression tho.
@@MikaelEtienne I don't personally know anything but you sound much better fitted to your bike than I was.
fffffuuuuu my dura ace compact crankset is too long... i knew it
Could this be the reason for my knee pain OMG. Thanks
I have started cycling today. After sometime my right knee has started hurting while cycling. What should I do?
How does it hurt? Knee side, back or front? I may be able to help you because I have a sore knee too atm.
@@OddysChannel My right knee hurts. Not exactly on the front side but little bit on the right side of the front side. I hope ypu will understand what I have written. If you did not get it then let me know
Also I feel that my knee bones are rubbing each other and they start hurting gradually.
@@umairyasin5951 Yeah sounds like what I have on my left knee. It might be because of how your natural foot position is being angled to an unnatural position because of the pedal. When you walk, is your right foot always positioned forward or is it slightly angled? If it is, the pedal forces your foot to be straight for the duration of your ride and that is why your knee tendon is stretching unnaturally which makes it sore. Watch how you walk with your right foot and then watch how you pedal with it. If the position changes, then the pain is most likely caused because of this sudden prolonged change of foot's angle. Other thing to check is how much your thigh rises when you pedal forward. When your thigh is at the highest point it should be in a 90° degree. If your thigh is well beyond or below 90° degree then that could cause pain to your hip and/or knee too.
@@OddysChannel thnx a lot bro. I'll definitely try these tips. I have started cycling after a very long time. On the first day of my ride I rode the bike for about 20 minutes at slow pace. Then my knee started hurting gradually. And on the same day at the evening time I again rode the bike for a very less time. Then at that moment the pain increased. And now after that my knee hurts after few minutes on my ride.
I am having inner lateral knee pain
move you're cleat in
@@skullyleake4241 you mean cleat out so shoe can go more in towards the cranks?
@@t0malito404 if your knee hurts on the inner knee move the cleat in 1m if it hurts on the outside of the knee move in out 1m if that doesn't help send me a reply
@@skullyleake4241 yeah im having inner (medial) knee pain last 2 weeks, but I think it is because overuse, I was pretty stupid, got carried away and I greatly increased volume and intensity in that period, now I will take a week off and hope that will help.
about the cleats, i moved them towards outside of the shoes so my shoes are closer to the bike and that makes sense to me if I am having inner knee pain, I also naturaly have x shaped legs.
that logic is explained on this picture and that seems correct to me.
www.google.com/search?q=cycling+knee+pain&sxsrf=ALeKk03a12_2JALrVv84tQwxfQB4Xv5TCg:1611940526216&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwix59qz0sHuAhXpCBAIHaqFBTwQ_AUoAXoECBAQAw&biw=1536&bih=754#imgrc=J_Uf6EcZqv3U-M
if I understood you are telling me to do the opposite, if that is the case can you explain me why is that, and maybe link me some source with explanation.
Thanks! :)
@@t0malito404 I fit and work with TT and Iron men and women . Are you on strava.
Saddle pain I suffer especially the perineum? Any advice?? Dont suffer from knee pain thnx
Try pointing the nose of your saddle down just a little to start with.
I have the same issue gets so numb and also though the pressure gives me a slight erection while biking for longer periods. I do also have right knee pain and raised my seat
B Jetlag- i used to get an errection after the numbness went to which was funny at time n others not so. So in the end I had a bike fit n all good 👊🏻
Hey!i have a natural displacement of knee cap slightly to the inside of knee.often had some knee pain and even numbness in toe fingers.what can i do to solve that uncomfortable cituation?
John my left foot points inwards when I ride (because my cleats are setup that way). I don’t walk pigeon toed so why would I ride that way? If I set my cleat “properly” like on my right foot, I will get a lot of left knee pain. Any suggestions?
Two things: take stock of your left hip -- is it causing your foot to turn in. Second, you might be sitting skewed on the saddle -- that can cause one foot (and knee incidentally) to drift in while the other drifts out. Best of luck
Bike Fit Adviser thanks for the suggestions
Rixter, I had the opposite experience. Slight right knee pain (outside of knee), and when I checked the cleats I found that my right cleat was set with different "toe-in" than the left. When I set both nearly straight, knee pain disappeared.
Paul Flory I’ve tried straightening the left foot out a bit, but lots of knee pain. I actually have no pain now, except my IT band acts up if I do a mega ride over 300km
Rixter if you are constantly flirting with pain, it sounds like you need to either limit your ride distances or spend the money and get a fitting from the best fitter you can find, even if it means traveling. I didn't, and ended up straining a psoas because I had stupidly set my saddle too low and too far back. Compared to the weeks of aching and the hours of rehab sessions, the cost of a fitting would have been very reasonable.
i have never has a bicyle fit, i have 3 bikes and when ever i ride them i look at myself in windows of buildings when i cycle past and can usually tell if the bike fits me or if i need to make adjustments. probably not the most scientific method lol
Hi John, I'm interested in subscribing to your premium content. But your sign up page is not secure. This could have several causes, but the most likely ones are you're using an invalid, expired, or self-signed (unverified) SSL certificate. The usual fix is to buy a fully verified SSL certificate and get it installed on your site, which most people do through their web host. I don't enter passwords or use sign-up pages on insecure sites because login credentials and private data can be compromised. No one else should be using your login page either the way it is right now. Plus, Google will punish you for this in search results. I hope you fix this because I'd really like to sign up!
Sir i am knee osteoarthritis patient, can i do cycling please guide me
I've been suffering with patellar tendonitis for 2 months from a lot of cycling on bad bike fits. The @$$hole Dr. Told me i could get back on the bike in two weeks. After two months off the bike, my knees still hurt. Why won't they heal? Cycling is my life. Do I have to retire? Wtf?!?
Dave Bro you just need to do some weight training
I agree with Luke, that strength is likely to be the root cause, but higher saddle, shorter cranks, pedal extenders, wedges, cleats with less float, and pulling on you pedals in the short term and exercise (staircases, squats, curls) should enable you to keep going without having to retire, I hope since I was in the same boat.
www.bikeforums.net/21204990-post77.html
Retire 😂
Are you able to do a remote bike fit? I'm based in Costa Rica and I have gone through 3 bike fits but I still have a significant one-sided saddle discomfort that I've not been able to fix. I also went through your saddle discomfort program but still couldn't nail it. The technology you present on your videos seems much more advanced to what bike fitters use down here. Any chance you can use that technology to help me sort this out remotely, John?
I am from Costa Rica as well and I have knee pain and i went to different bike fitters, no luck :(
Will be nice if you can do some remote fit.
I have knee and glute pain. Have you heard of this?
knee pains occurred when saddle or seatpost is too high.
Nice video how would i find someone like you in my area? Would like to find a person who measures me on my bike. I live in cincinnati ohio
V
Can a too low saddle permanently damage knees?
Depends on how low it is, how often you ride and how much you ride every time. Also too high isn't good either as it can cause hyper extension of the knee which can be a lot worse. Just make sure your knees have a little bend in them. Plus also make sure your seat is as close to parallel to the ground as possible. So not only seat height, but positioning is just as important.
Yeah. Im suffering from knee pain for 7 months. Im riding dirt jump so it is very low saddle and i ride 100-150km a week. But now i cant even ride it. Im home for 1 months and trying to develop my quadriceps. Im 15 and scaring of permanently knee pains. Need some advice.
Does it actually mean, that the correct sadle height is found, based on having the pedal in highest position ?
I resently borrowed a bike that have 172,5 mm crank arms, as opposed to my regular bikes 170 mm's.
After a 160 km ride I had (slight) pain at the front of my knee.
But I'm reluctant to beleive that 2,5 mm makes that mutch difference ??? (2 x 2,5 mm)
The geometry was set up exactely the same on both bikes (although the borrowed bike had a slightly shorter frame, witch was good to my neck and shoulders).
How do I solve right knee pain only in the front of my knee?
And i am searching for bike , so i can cure my knee pain advised by my doctor . While cyclists are complaining about knee pain caused by cycle . Wtf ?
That panelling behind you is triggering :)
Take into consideration over-training and not warming up before a ride!
Stop consuming dairy, dairy can cause bone problems!
Very jumpy editing