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Just because everyone pays taxes into the state no more means that the state is the embodiment of the people, than if Tesco axquires a monopoly over foodstuffs, and everyone shops at Tesco, means that Tesco is the embodiment of the people. If the state owns an industry it doesn't mean that the voter has "democratic control" over that industry.
The remark Bogdanor makes about Benn and Concorde is ill-informed. Benn took over the Concorde project after it had begun and, although he was against it and had his concerns, he didn't want to make a hundreds of thousands of people unemployed by cancelling the program.
Very strange that Benn should describe a train where someone offers cups of tea from a Thermos, one family looks after another family's children, and someone promises to phone someone else's son to let him know his mum will be late, everyone gets chatting and pitches in, as a socialist train. Until the toppling of Lansbury in 1935 that might have well been a socialist train - everyone pitching in to help one another. Like the old co-ops and even the working men's clubs movements. Post-1935 socialism in the UK replaced self-help and mutual aid with the state. On a real "socialist train" in the UK in the 80s, the person who wanted a cup of tea would have waited for the guard to bring round the tea. The family who needed their kids looking after would have waited for the guard to look after them. The woman who needed her son phoning would have waited for the guard to phone him. The guard would have done none of these tasks - everyone would have received an equally poor service ("The blessing of socialism is the equal sharing of misery" - Churchill). No one would have lifted a finger to do anything for anyone else, because "it's the guard's job" or rather "it's the government's job". The idea that we help our friends, our family, our neighbours, rather than waiting for the state to do it, is alien to British socialism in the post-war era.
Harold Wilson described him as getting more and more juvenille as he ages. Thank heavens this ( well meaning ) albeit DELUDED politician was never allowed to implement more of his left wing agenda which does nothing other than spread the POVERTY not the wealth. Just checkout any country in the world where socialism has been allowed to prevail.
+DHTCF Leave it conservatives to believe in "market forces", "profit motives"and "invisible hands" yet accuse Liberals of engaging in "magical thinking"
Thank you very much for making this available to everyone.
Really enjoyed this. Watched the whole thing.
Soon! - We're working out how best to up the quality of our videos, and hopefully today we'll be able to find the key and get back up to speed with everything. Sorry to make you wait!
Tony's legacy is live and well. Corbyn is a good heir.
Rest In Power
Tony is a true Englishman ❤ love from 🇮🇳
I would love to know what he would say about the government we have today 🤦♂️
may he rest in peace
Dkgidg sumoccupy humour v CBGB CG I fink DL plum high
4:38- 9:39 mins MINT! :) What a loss of an icon in British Politics today... RIP
adrenobrit ols
Late Mr. Tory Ben was a true reformist who ever born in Britain .
Great video really enjoy Professor Bogdanor and his lectures. When is the next one on Sir Keith Joseph going to be put up?
He was a genius and a prophet.
Huh hour hut park u have no response yoy
Awesome, thanks a lot for the reply.
Just because everyone pays taxes into the state no more means that the state is the embodiment of the people, than if Tesco axquires a monopoly over foodstuffs, and everyone shops at Tesco, means that Tesco is the embodiment of the people. If the state owns an industry it doesn't mean that the voter has "democratic control" over that industry.
The remark Bogdanor makes about Benn and Concorde is ill-informed.
Benn took over the Concorde project after it had begun and, although he was against it and had his concerns, he didn't want to make a hundreds of thousands of people unemployed by cancelling the program.
After the act of 1963 was passed, Benn reappeared in the HOC😀
Very strange that Benn should describe a train where someone offers cups of tea from a Thermos, one family looks after another family's children, and someone promises to phone someone else's son to let him know his mum will be late, everyone gets chatting and pitches in, as a socialist train. Until the toppling of Lansbury in 1935 that might have well been a socialist train - everyone pitching in to help one another. Like the old co-ops and even the working men's clubs movements.
Post-1935 socialism in the UK replaced self-help and mutual aid with the state. On a real "socialist train" in the UK in the 80s, the person who wanted a cup of tea would have waited for the guard to bring round the tea. The family who needed their kids looking after would have waited for the guard to look after them. The woman who needed her son phoning would have waited for the guard to phone him. The guard would have done none of these tasks - everyone would have received an equally poor service ("The blessing of socialism is the equal sharing of misery" - Churchill). No one would have lifted a finger to do anything for anyone else, because "it's the guard's job" or rather "it's the government's job". The idea that we help our friends, our family, our neighbours, rather than waiting for the state to do it, is alien to British socialism in the post-war era.
A bit of democratic understanding.
Good lecture, misguided subject
It
Tony Benn has spent his whole life being wrong, and has gotten wronger and wronger with time!
Harold Wilson described him as getting more and more juvenille as he ages. Thank heavens this ( well meaning ) albeit DELUDED politician was never allowed to implement more of his left wing agenda which does nothing other than spread the POVERTY not the wealth. Just checkout any country in the world where socialism has been allowed to prevail.
scabycat What country do you come from.?
+DHTCF Not as wrong as your usage of that word.
+DHTCF Leave it conservatives to believe in "market forces", "profit motives"and "invisible hands" yet accuse Liberals of engaging in "magical thinking"
+DHTCF unlike today's politicians, at least he wasn't boring.