Saxon Greene school is designed, by big oil from the early 1900’s, to create a class of people who can think just enough to follow orders so you can work, or consume.
tucker smoak Tell me about it, I did the same until Grad school in Engineering. It doesn't give me any sense of satisfaction or achievement but when I see other 4 GPA people at work, I just find their knowledge and understanding much worse than somebody like me ... so I don't understand what's the point!
That's how I got through school. I saw no use for the bullshit they tried to cram in our skulls, so cheating seemed to be the only answer. I pretty much got c's and d's in everything but math, which I got a's in because I saw areas where I could apply it to life.
Same, i used to cheat in exams i even made a pen that if you pull out a part on the side it will show you a paper with the answers lol, i really hate education system, is really boring in a lot of subjects and it doesn’t catch my interest at all. When I’m at home i get so much knowledge by my own, through books and internet.
I'm an INTP. I've always had average/above average grades, never perfect, not because I don't understand the material, but because once I learn something, I normally want to just move on instead of practicing it through homework, so I may do well on tests, but do horrid in homework and project assignments because of lack of effort. One awful consequence from this, is the stigma behind gpa and standardized test scores, I've had a few people back in high school belittle me because of my grades, even though, I've had many others become absolutely bewildered by my mathematical and programming skills, but of course, having low grades means you're stupid in this society right? That's exactly what ticks me off about the school system, people who often are brilliant in their fields of interest get belittled because of poor grades, thus dis encouraging them to proceed in life. For the most part, don't care what others think, but others might not feel like I do. I guess it's just one of those INTP existential crises that make you feel like you failed in life.
As an INTP, I actually did very well in high school, but I HATED every minute of it. I did almost nothing but daydream in class, then just sort of taught myself how to do the homework and pass the tests.
@@nathansmith4211 If INTP type are not as rare as INFJ type and they struggle, how badly feels school for INFJs? Could you tell me why school was bad for You? I'm INTP, asking out of curiosity
I'm an INTP and I was ALWAYS overlooked, school became a game of how I could outsmart the system instead of actually taking part, whether that be hacking the admin computer system or hacking the lunch que system. After years of getting bored of pretending to comply I just up and outed, now I'm homeschooled and am learning 10000000 times more! Did French for 3 years, learnt nothing, did French for 1 week at home and I can have a conversation in it.
+Angelo Parkour Same here basically. I got depressed and starting skipping school because i felt like i wasn't learning anything. I was in a very bad public school in the ghetto. One day i just dropped out and decided to homeschool myself. I started off with a 4th grade level of mathematics, and within 9 months, i'm now at a 10th grade level. Calculus, Astronomy, Classical and modern physics- it's on the horizon baby. That public school can take it's crappy earth space science and american history and shitty math class and shove it up it's figurative arse.
Oh gosh, public school... It sucked, I barely graduated and had to start at a community college afterwards. I used to think I was the problem, but now I am finishing law school. Pretty obvious that the school failed, not me. Hang in there my INTP brothers and sisters.
This is incredibly accurate. I spent all of public school reading and doodling. The information, the lectures, the homework...irrelevant. I developed my intelligence on my own terms. Our school system is useless to someone like me.
YES. I hate the fact that my teacher is telling us to give the effort to impress HIM instead of doing it to impress ourselves. This man is aggressive if some of us fails and starts reminding us how bad we are and how much we suck, but in reality, he is the teacher, that's his own effort, his own teaching methods that has caused us to be at the level we are at.
The most frustrating thing is when teachers won't give back assignments or test, instead they just tell you what mark you got and you have no way of seeing what mistakes you made. It such a slap in the face. They're essentially saying "I don't care. Your learning doesn't matter at all. You don't matter. Only your grades do".
I am an INTP with ADHD. This is a perfect description of my day, especially the whole "playing with my thoughts" type of thing. I never really thought it had anything to do with my personality type- but perhaps I was overlooking that. I have been really frustrated recently with my schooling, finding my papers, and handing things in on time. I'm still surprised I wasn't held back this year.
i'm an intp and i often feel like i'm repressed or stuck in school. it doesn't feel safe to answer or ask questions and my ability level feels about the same for each class through the years. they may just be banging the "p" out of me
Public school is set up to educate the most students in the way that works for most of them. Since very few people in a population are INTP, the educational style isn't really set up to accommodate them. I really did not get much out of school. When I was a kid I would get excited when I would learn about something and I couldn't wait to talk to a teacher about it to learn more, only to have the teacher treat me like I was a smart ass and it absolutely killed my enthusiasm for learning for many years. Thank goodness I learned the joy of learning through self study and kept learning about the world. It is a trait that has stayed with me long after school and I never really stopped trying to learn about the world and educate myself. In school I was bored and only paid enough attention to pass my classes because I would have already read the textbook end to end in the first few months of class and it was so boring learning at the slow rate everyone else needed to learn. Being burned by classrooms like that turned me off of classroom learning all together and forced me to learn how to teach myself. Even now as an adult, when I teach somebody I do not do it as a classroom style learning. I create course material, provide it to the people I am teaching, but it's just there for reference later. The actual teaching is open discussions and asking the students questions, getting them engaged, having a conversation with them instead of giving them a lecture. It keeps them from zoning out, doing their laundry list while you read a power point presentation. Basically the best way I know how to teach and to learn is to do the exact opposite of what a public school does in a classroom.
I know that feel. While my teachers weren't necessarily the culprit, there's nothing more annoying for someone to stop you and say "We all know you're smart. Stop already."
Yeah. The same thing. One time in 2nd grade, they told me the dumb ... conclusion they gained as they noticed I was watching out of the window all the time, although knowing the answers not trying to give them: "We know you're intelligent, but you always hide that and do [insert random thing they don't want you to do] instead of what you're told!" - "Well, how do you know what I'm hiding, when I hide it good enough to recognise I do so?", I asked. No satisfying answer was given to that, I thought, if they think I'm intelligent, they should just rate it by some formula or so, give me the score I deserve and leave me alone. They didn't. Public school sucks. I had to visit 7 of them and it was the fucking same every time - one week I'm the new one, the other weeks I'm the weird one. We spent six months just for binomial formlars. It's one sheet of paper you have to learn there, and if you don't understand it, just learn it (although this is dumb, six months to do so is enough, no matter how stupid one is...). That was 8th grade and the last little drop that convinced me never to do homework again and it worked out. I read all the answers from an empty sheet, until 12th grade in physics I did do nothing at all at home. Smartass or not, that don't matter. If people call themselves teachers and claim having the right to tell me or others what to do, what I have to know, how I have to find out, they should be smarter than me or at least know more than I can find out just by reading the little bit I find interesting anyway that is taught in school within one week in pre-internet-times (1989 to 2003). 14 years of 60 % waste of time, 30 % of getting in some kind of trouble and 10 % of something I can find out on my own much better. 14 years to find out engineering is a cool thing. Oh well, I knew THAT before, maybe nothing else but that for sure (if you aksed me what job I wanna have, my answer was "Inventor" - that's pretty close I think). Well, doing nothing gets boring, and in 8th grade five or six russians were put into my class and we developed a habit of exposing our math teacher's poor performance every lesson (they - some of them - totally fitted the prejudice of the russian who plays chess and is good at math, science and all that ... maybe they wrestled with bears, I don't know...) and she went mad about that. With a more friendly teacher I'd feel sorry today, but I don't have to, she deserved that (and even more - gets too long for a youtube comment if I tell it all...). In english (I'm from germany) I got my freshly divorced teacher (she really didn't care about anything that time) to watch Beavis and Butt-head with us as they asked me why my english was way better than theirs, and it was nothing more than I am not stupid as shit, but I replied I watched a lot of shows in english original, especially them, and we should have a glance at it, maybe it could work out. It did, we learned how to insult each other really seriously. Biology sucked that much in school I didn't learn anything about it until a few years after. I even attended in christian religion although I didn't like the teacher, nor did I like the god nor the book, just for the fun of seeing an invalid argumentation fail time after time, receiving the second worst grade (a 5, in germany it counts from 1 to 6, the lower, the better) and laughing at this virtuose teacher when I received my graduation allowing me to attend grades 11 to 13 - which he didn't believe could happen. Funny guy, somehow he got to think I'm really stupid. In general, I share the opinion of the video. Thinking and asking, yourself or whoever knows better, applying logic to logical problems, finding a solution instead of reproducing one you've seen other people find - just doesn't happen in regular school. You have to get your mind busy by yourself, they won't, they not don't even care, it's worse. Often I was told I wasn't supposed to think at all, but to do whatever I'm told to. Make a generation of obedient cocksuckers ... and another, another, another. Frank Zappa once said something like "The shit is floating already up to our chins, and no one dares to move to avoid any motion." - he's totally right with that one ... how did we get here? We all went to school! Shorter: you have to find a funny way of wasting your time there, as it is wasted anyway.
Oh, I love ur brain! So happy to know more people with the same opinion as me.. The problem with society these days is that they don't want to think for themselves and so they are gullible.. Yes, I agree, it's very dangerous.. They tend to do crazy stuff, here in Indonesia, things get even uglier with the election, ISIS, etc. I only have like 2 persons who agree about this in real life, so I'm excited when I watched this video..
This video feels like what I've been trying to say to people around me for years, and the last couple minutes reminded me of a quote (from Voltaire, i think) "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities", seems rather frightening that school seems to condition us (intentionally, or otherwise) to make it so easy to believe absurdities. I think one of the major things schools need to do is go back to the Trivium (Grammar, Logic, Rhetoric, in that order) because it seems to me a lot of this problem, is that schools are focusing almost exclusively on rhetoric, with just enough logic to know it exists, and just enough grammar to regurgitate information that we've already heard.
Hi Y'all. I'm an INTP who has been struggling on this earth with daily life for about three decades. Most info about what I have found relating to these struggles stems from poor public schooling and parental child-rearing. All of you are SO right about public school. My own observations about public school are that it has been created, run, and managed by people who are predominantly ESTJs and ESFJs. It seems that these people want to create a civilization that is ONLY populated by people of these types and ONLY people with a left-liberal understanding about everything. To most INTPs (and similar types) it should be increasingly obvious what kinds of disasters would/are occurring because foolhardy people desire to create an impossible world in which only a few kinds of people are needed. This venture cannot be successful because a multitude of problems and issues exist and will likely occur in the future that require a broad multitude of skills to master. Since public schooling was founded in the mid-1800's and became widespread in the 20th century we can see the bitter fruit that has been brought about by it and the slow, but ever increasing destruction of civilizations since those times. Anyway, that's just my observations about the situation that is unfolding. No offense to ESFJs, ESTJs, or other kinds of people that have, want to, or are maturing to become caring, well-rounded individuals.
Our education system was modeled after the Prussian model which used behaviorism to condition people mentally. Public school isn't about getting a good education and expanding your horizons, it's only purpose is social conditioning. All one has to do is look up the quotes and writings of the people who funded and engineered public schooling to realize that it's only purpose was and still is, a nefarious one.
This is very true. I'm final year of studying to become a teacher, and I'll make a point of it to engage in critical thinking with the learners. Not always, but when I can. I feel all learning styles should be accommodated.
You literally just voiced everything I think about every single dang day as a high school INTP but could never sum up. 👏👏👏Man-your the definition of awesome. 😳
This is so relatable, but you all probably know. Jung's psychological types and their accuracy... at least especially when it comes to INTPs. It's simply fascinating, but also sad, which I don't entirely dislike since thanks to the Si I value melancholy and nostalgy, shadows of what thinks were or could have been. However, this function causes me also a lot of pain, I'm constantly "forgetting stuff" which I actually never payed attention to, due to the selective ADD I also suffer from. I love my private world in all its complexity, so difficult to externalize and draw linguistically. That leads me to the third trait he refers to: not being understood. Everything regarding social relationships always ends in failure. Deep down I feel really lonely, though I highly prize time for myself. And about school... well, I'll probably just drop out. I hope I'll be able to make a living without being obliged to make huge efforts in areas of study that don't interest me at all. Anyway, I've been feeling quite emo lately too and there's nothing better than feeling a sense of belonging. In the internet I feel a bit freer, a bit lighter not having to deal with the outside world for too much time. It's exhausting, but you obviously feel sorely lonesome. And no, I have no friends, at least not close ones. Well, this had no internal cohesion, I'll be prepared for the bombs. I hope that you can relate to my experience, I know it's an utter relief. P.S.: Sorry for my english, I'm a Spaniard.
The public school system definetely failed me. The stuff was literally too boring, too worthless/pointless or too easy for me to be able to engage in or give any effort to and I struggled very badly. I was told that I would amount to nothing but a class clown who would flip burgers for the rest of my life. Finally in early middle school a third party organization came in and tested kids like me and I tested in the highest IQ bracket (genius). From then on I knew in my heart that the public school system is intentionally that way to suit an agenda to mold a society the way the elites want to. It's the strangest thing to experience the least amount of self worth growing up and then figure out that you have more to give to society than most. If I didn't have good parents, I really would have been messed up for life.
I did horrible in public school despite being very intelligent. It wasn't even that I wasn't social. It was the actually system that ruined it for me. In 3rd grade my school wanted to send me to a creative arts magnet school but my parents chose not too let me go... smh
yes, i agree completely. in school i always just ponder my thoughts instead of paying attention. i also have dyslexia and dyscalculia. so i am bad at math and reading. school sucks.
I am an INTP and I can totally relate to your assessment of our personality type. Public school does not offer a variety of teaching styles that cater to the different learning styles of students who sit in their classrooms. I wonder if there would be fewer disciplinary problems in schools if more students found a teaching style that is conducive to their learning style. I think students would be a lot happier, well-disciplined, and more passionate about learning and become more academically successful.
I`m doing pretty well at my private school, where luckily the teachers actually respect my intellect, and although I`m one of the best physicists I know I can still flop at a science test, simply because I didn`t give the answer they wanted, not because it wasn`t correct.
I'm more of self study and home study INTP...I had a hard time finishing mandatory education because of the rules and regulation that was not really nourishing for the brain. How does trying to please the teacher to get good grades or being a teacher's pet help you in the future? Maybe it does but it does not for long. Anyway, College was harder because it took me 7 years to realize that I was more suited to distance education than classroom based learning. I got better grades that way and spared myself those snore fest scolding from teachers who have authority and control issues. :/
I did the bare minimum in high school. And that was when I even bothered to show up. After I had a breakthrough I talked to nobody. I witnessed so many become fashioned into consumer slaves without one inkling of free thought. I couldn't understand why my peers accepted things unquestioningly. Or how they adopted a manufactured persona that was fed to them. We were there to lap up the bullshit and I wasn't having any of it. Unwittingly I would go but not without leaving my brain at home. Or missing the first two classes conveniently. I'd saunter in through the front entrance just as a class would end so as not to draw suspicion. Every second there was hell. I sat at a desk to look good and that's it. School is beyond useless.
Hello friend, I like this subject. And you mention indoctrination. Which mirrors many of my observations of the education system. Limits'n stuff, so I'll just state the current point where I'm at: School is not, in fact, to educate. It's to enforce an obedient lifestyle that doesn't question authority. Society wants drones, not scientists. And I think that puts me into an agreeing stance.
You’re absolutely right, most of this stuff is inferred but towards the end (around @ 7 mins or so), you make very good points. Its also interesting to think about how public school has affected our culture after its establishment. Like before public school there were so many opportunities available to everyone and people would actually do things and make stands, now everyone just leaves all the decisions to authority. It’s really bad, adults are really just grown children now. While public school can bring a more organized system and has led to a manufactured and high advancement, it will all crash soon because of the inability to think. There is nothing super practical about public school and it’s just daycare that molds you into a system which later on causes great unhappiness and high unproductivity.
I'm an ENTP and I struggle with the same problems. Public school in America is complete bullshit and doesn't encourage people to think or reason. So much more emphasis is put on grades than actual learning. I hate the widely held belief in our culture that getting good grades makes you intelligent or vise versa. I've been diagnosed with ADHD just because I don't fit the typical SJ mold. School is just so fucking boring and tedious, it's completely unstimulating to me and I refuse to waste time on it. Creative thinkers, especially of the xNTP personality type don't learn in the way public school teaches us, and are likely to encounter issues with authority. I have to take adderall to even somewhat pay attention to repetitive, menial tasks that I don't gain anything from at all. And even then I still get bad grades, despite having an IQ in the top 2% of the population. The public education system truly has failed us.
Like others have said: thank you so much for making this video! And I hope you consider making more videos like these sometimes. This is what I've wanted to talk about and share with people for a very long time, but I've failed to find myself fitting in anywhere to talk about it (and still be taken seriously), even online, and instead I'm kinda giving up on life - but videos like these restores some hope in me, that maybe there's more people like you out there that I might connect with!
I’m an INTP, and I was homeschooled. This education style was right up my alley, so much so that when I was given the choice to go to high school, I chose to continue homeschooling instead(eventually I just went to community college during my junior year of high school and that was great too). If any of you guys ever have XNTP kids I highly recommend homeschooling them because we are able to educate ourselves through our passions and interests. I have an ENTP brother and he does pretty well in this too, but he has to do a bunch of extracurricular activities to fill up his Extrovert Battery. My mom, who is an ambivert NTP, homeschooled us because she thought the education system was messed up. Yeah, she had to give us a basic schedule to make sure we’d test ok on the SATs, but we learned so much on our own time because we’re naturally curious people. My sister on the other hand, would probably do pretty well in a school-like system because she’s an ambivert STJ, so she loves the structure and memorization and lists(ew). I really think it depends on the person, but I also think the the public school system is a “One Size Fits Nobody” kinda deal.
Abraham Lincoln Charles Darwin Albert Einstein Sir Isaac Newton These are famous INTP's who were failures at school (Abraham Lin. was exception cuz he didnt go to school much)~~~~ They were never failure the society was just too stupid to accept their ideologies. The system of judging people who write whats written on the book; by the book ; till the boundaries of the bookish knowledge are treated with respect & we are treated like dirt; harassed as losers by parents , society, & bullies. The Education system around the world SUCKSS!!!!! As an INTP really makes me want to cry :'( at least cry in my heart/head. I am an INDIAN being in a 3rd world country with huge population It's quite HELLISH if you're an INTP here (the standard treating people like dirt is just magnified 5x 6x 10x,etc. worse than in any western country). :'( I REALLY hate education system. Its less EDUCATION more like creating simple single minded CLONES.
Some of them did pass great but in general yeah they all did horrible in school and people looked down on them and without them everything would be so different
Homework killed me in public school. I saw the homework as tedious and work for the sake of work, as well as buffer points for kids that do bad on tests so they can still pass them for effort.
I'm definitely an INTP and even though a lot of people at University of Michigan tell me I'm smarter than most people they know there, I didn't get accepted. I'm an Eagle Scout, played sports throughout high school, passed 4 AP tests (Calculus (4), Statistics (5), Micro Econ (5), Macro Econ (5), and was in drumline. The only reason I didn't get accepted to Michigan is because I A. Had a 3.4 GPA (88% average) Took honors classes and AP classes, got C's 3 or 4 times because I didn't always do as they said. Go B. I'm a slow reader: ACT scores Science: 32 Math: 31 English: 28 Reading: 21 Total: 28 (Bottom 25%ile at Michigan.) Now I'm thinking about dropping out of college because I'm recognizing so many different business opportunities that college won't even teach me to go after. I'm pretty sure INTP's and ENTP's struggle the most outside of the academic setting, more so than the other rationalist types (ENTJ's and INTJ's). This is because the primary and secondary functions are introverted thinking and extraverted intuition, we learn better doing our own exploration into what's true and important, and not having someone force us to believe something is so.
I completely 100% agree with this. I'm in my junior year of high school and ive been regurgitating information for so long and i'm tiring of it. Im starting to take notice of the faults in society and I'm so done with public school. I've thought about this so much but i trip up when i question the majority. Us as INTPs feel this way about the system, but we are a minority. If this assimilation works for the majority of the world, who are we to want change in an entire massive system when we are such a small demographic. Every war is fought for an end result and there are casualties along the way. Not everyone is an INTP. Not everyone can function in a world without some sort of social conditioning. It sucks, but i think its better the way it is.
Wow! I did bad in school. I really felt like everyone had something I wasn't born with, because school seemed to come so easily to them. I figured I just wasn't smart enough. As an adult I have realized it wasn't really about not being smart at all. I'm homeschooling my kids, this is our 4th year, and I always find things that make me grateful I homeschool them but this video is definitely a big one! I think my oldest is an ENTP, and academics always came very natural to her. Do ENTPs do well in school?
so true. I recently got into trouble with my high school english teacher for asking too many questions and questioning them in front of the class. she told me, I should just stop asking questions, so basically to believe every thing I'm told .
You just described my 15 y.o. son to a T. Right now, we're trying to get him outside his head. He's been depressed because he's tired of accommodating down to his peers and unable to find meaningful friendships. He'll go to public school for the first time in 6 years, specifically for the social component, though I think he will be bored to tears. Hopefully he'll make a few friends first. :-P
I am an INTP in the public school system and you really expressed my opinion on it. I get good grades, and I've been lucky enough to actually have a few classes this year that actually encourage critical thinking (AP Language class taught by a definite NT), but the system is shit. Towards the end when you talked about how education is so much more than just getting a job and then elaborated I was thinking "AMEN".
Well said. I'm an INTP and I graduated HS in 2001. Sadly nothing has really changed. I was bored in school, saw how much of a waste it was and I'm stubborn as I don't just follow orders. Any class or part of a class I found interesting I did very well but otherwise I did enough to pass. As you say not everyone learns the same way and public education caters to a certain type of learning/person which means INTP types lag behind. A solution is going to a school dedicated too your learning style and or home schooling. If I was to become a parent I would understand my child and cater to them and their learning style. I agree that public education is to mold a particular type of society and we're seeing the results of that now this is why public education is terrible and will continue to be poor.
got into so much trouble in public school and private schools because i never accepted anything at face value, so i had to constantly ask the teachers why learning certain things were important, or how they knew that the history we were being taught was correct, what was the proof during my religion classes. i hardly ever did homework, only book reports i would do was if we got to choose our own book, which i usually had to convince my teachers that i read the book and wrote the report myself. i've always had a problem with simple math, like multiplication, long division, finding the lowest common denominator. I always wished that I could just get grades based on tests instead of counting homework and class participation. it wasn't until I got to college that I decided this is not the right place for me. entry tests were great, except the math 1 exam, which i nearly failed, but on math 2 and 3 i had passed with flying colors despite never learning functions, calculus and trig in HS. despite doing so well on higher math, i was put into remedial math (basic 5th grade algebra) and even my teacher couldn't understand why i was put there and advised me to only come in on test days since i completed all homework assignments in the first week, i was excused from all other classes.
I agree with this so much! I've been so frustrated with how the school system works. As an INTP I was classified as learning disabled, just because I process information differently. Even though my IQ tested 134 at the time. Even college feels like its not even about learning, its just about having the security of getting a degree so you can be an over qualified McDonald's worker. I don't feel like I'm learning anything, and that's really disappointing to an INTP.
I just learned about Myers Briggs and discovered that I'm an INTP. In everything I've read, it's an extremely accurate profile of myself. This video is the TRUTH. Going into my senior year of high school, I had a 1.7 GPA. School bored me to tears and I spent my teens building a fairly successful online business. My parents couldn't understand why I was smart but such a poor student. I tried to explain it exactly as you have in this video. I thought it was just a very personal quirk until now...
Lol, intp moment 4:56: "What is it for???". Good points, though. Public education is a clusterfuck. I do like the idea of holding off and learning one's personality preferences, then going to a school tailored to your learning style. The shortened school cycle would offset the extra costs involved with customized programs.
wow this is so helpful. i have been trying to find out which type i am, i thought i might be infj or infp but now it makes so much sense and it is pretty obvious now that i am intp! while i was in school i didnt do so well and now i realize why!
Holy crap! As people here have said before, this puts to words how I has always felt. I feel so fucked over, my rare INTP mind has been put to waste, & it bugs me to the core how everyone is also completely ignorant to the truth you said in this video.. so sad...
I understand how you feel, I'm doing a lot better at university than I did at high school. Never the less, INTP's can do quite well if somebody pushes them to do the boring stuff, I think it's more about perseverance than anything. Then again I went to public school in Australia and things might be different here.
This is how I made it through public school --> In my junior and senior years I skipped all of my classes (except Calculus and Film Editing and of course test days). I was almost held back from graduating based on my absences, but luckily some very very very understanding teachers and a wonderfully enlightened school dean stepped in to prevent that. It also helped that through independent study I was able to hold a 4.6, all honors and 9 APs... - the story of a very lucky INTP female.
My public school education was always troubled. First of all, I pretty much went through summer school every other year because I would fail. I daydreamed a lot. Counselors advised my parents to put me on Ritalin, they refused. I grew up thinking that I was stupid. I tried fitting in with many different groups in school, the jocks, the gangsters, all types of weirdos. Like other INTP s I did question everything, which made me popular with authority figures. As a kid I use to think of a lot of technical stuff. I thought of so many inventions that were just ideas in my head, which later in life, I found out that someone actually invented that already. Public school failed me back then, and it failed me now as an employee. I work on electronics, and administrators resist change even to this day. Now, as an adult, I realize that it's all about politics, at least in the workplace. For example, In my department, I work on Intercoms, sound systems, and energy controls. I have experience with burglar & fire alarms, and brought the idea of integrating both of those devices to the schools intercom. I used to install lockdown button in schools before it even was called "lockdown". Integrating these systems would mean that once the lockdown button is pushed, a louder-higher pitch alarm will ring through the intercom's speakers, trip the burglar alarm to send a lockdown message to the school's police department, trip the fire alarm demagnetize the hallway doors and locking them once they shut. All of this would have kept intruders from gaining access to classrooms, and other areas where students are.Well anyway, we contract out out fire alarm work, because we are not licensed, and out burglar alarm department is controlled by a power hungry chief of school police. So despite integrating all of these systems because it would make the schools safer, and because it makes sense. Administrators would prefer to play politics,and let people hold on to the power of being able to tell people "no" when they are asked for their ID cards to be granted access to certain doors. Any whooters fuck public education,they have failed society and I believe that is why they have all of this competition from charter schools. Thanks for reading my rant and have a good day.
This is so true, i have a cousin who's really gifted musically and artistically and she's not stupid by any means but she does horrible in school because she's not very good at just memorizing things and her parents think she's being lazy and they belittle her for it. and I think this is happening to so many people everywhere. I wish that everyone could just know that they're worth something even if they do get terrible grades.
Rage I feel... soo much... I can't believe how much ignorant could be every person that was the people around me that time at school. I wish I could know more things about me when I was kid.... Well I guess the majority wins and we have to find our way out.
Hi. Intp here. Well, I started good at elementary school, but dropped off after the first year of secondary school. I struggled and struggled, and ended up into a language based school. I did bad there too, and was told (and believed) that I was going to lose a year, which eventually happened. But thanks to that, I was able to learn much more. But depression started, the fear that I was going to fail once again got tthe better of me, and just managed to get to the next year. I had to go to another school because of the situation I was in, and finally graduated. It was one of the most proud situations in my life. But you want to know what's the best part? When learning French, English, and Spanish, I was told that I was not made for it, but once I graduated, I learned it myself from 0. I was so surprised when I heard an interview with subtitles and could comprehend it without being able to see ( very poor vision, I need glasses).
This was me! I went to a private school in Australia and I'm guessing it would've been better than public school in the US and Australia. My school report cards always said I had way more potential than my grades showed, but I was bored out of my skull much of the time. Plus I was pretty immature. Now I've gone back to university part-time at 40 I'm far better equipped, mentally speaking to get more out of it and challenge what is being taught. It's fun to challenge the authoritative figures with logic and force them to (try to) justify the content of their lessons and readings. People like Stefan Molyneux and John Taylor Gatto are great catalysts for stimulating critical thought. Tomacity, sounds like you might be familiar with the websites School Sucks Project (Brett Veinotte) and Tragedy & Hope (Richard Grove), am I right?
I was a bit of the reverse. I had no interest in school outside of math until Grade 3 when I had to do a science project and found one about making a game using electrical circuits. For some reason it amazed the hell out of me and I stayed in AP/honors classes until college. Highschool in general was too easy and didn't prepare me for college, and the way some courses (like calculus) are taught I found it to be useless. Calc was good example, you spend an hour and a half copying notes verbatim off a teacher's board while they give you some formulas to use without explaining how or why they work in some instances and not in others. They then give you questions that you basically need to solve multiple times until you see a pattern of when those tools give you a right answer, and when they don't. It was pretty bullshit.
In public school, I could do fractions, multiply, divide, and that was it. I couldn't do math beyond that. I even struggled with percentages. In HS they even put me in a basic algebra class, twice, and I still didn't get it. So stayed in "bone-head" classes mostly through public school. In community college, same thing with math. But I did complete all the other community college program for transfer. I managed to transfer to a 4 yr college. But there, I was automatically enrolled in a mandatory algebra. There was no teacher, so to speak. I just got a phone # and office # if I had questions...the book set was in the book store. Make an appointment when ready to take the final. In the dorm, I set down with the first book and voila, I friggin' cake-walked through it, all 5 books, finished it early (I couldn't believe how simple it was! -and NO TEACHER), then aced the final. That was spring '72. That summer I took analysis, and Trig/pre-Calc., also acing them, cake-walk. In short, I have a perfectly normal math capable mind. And public school is the dysfunction.
I almost didn't graduate because I misread the grad requirements and thought it meant I didn't need to take Math 12. I went from almost failing AP Math 10 (shit teacher, didn't teach me jack) to passing Pre-Calc with a B in about 3 weeks of work through Continuing Ed. Side note: my mom was on my case hard, telling me I should spend every waking hour working on it. After breezing through it at the pace I wanted (like 2-3 hours a day; her schedule: 6 hrs in building, 4 hours "study" at home), I ended up figuring out a system where I could leave the building a half hr after being dropped off, go play video games at my house for 4 hours, then go walk through a park for an hr before heading back home. I ended up designing a schedule to determine what I should tell her I had been working on, complete with figuring out what I should say was "hard" or what I had failed to understand that day so she could give me the usual speech to feel like she did her duty before I was forced to chat online rather than game during the evenings. I think I spent more effort to get out of work than I did working. And yep. I think I'll need to teach myself college courses, been thinking about going back to school. I'd have done it sooner but they won't allow you to just challenge all of the coursework, and you have to live locally.
Yeah, I used to write huge blog posts when I got home which compiled all of my thoughts that I'd collected during the day. Also, I think not engaging INTPs is what causes our procrastination problems because we're effectively taught that making an effort isn't going to be worth it.
It's frustrating for me as a student, as everything seems to be focused on college as the end-all-be-all of existence. We are encouraged to work out butts off for some distant idea so we can work our butts off for another distant idea (jobs) so we can work our butts off for another distant idea (retirement). And all of these distant ideas are in the name of a good life, but then you wake up one day and you're old and the only (not so) distant idea you have left is death. But thats another thing.
As an INTP in high school I defiantly agree. Why memorize everything? Why not question? I know that right now I can beat nearly every politician in a logical debate. Yet we get in trouble for challenging them, no matter how correct we are. I believe that we can soon reverse this. We are being subjugated, and throughout history the subjugated always rise. This problem will only be commbatted with a social revolution. Maybe we're next to rise.
Exactly! The reason so many people have no idea what they want to do with their life is because they don't get to experience anything relevant until college and by the time you do figure it out you have a bunch of money spent on credits you don't need.
I ended up getting a 4.0 in my senior year and just BARELY making the minimum requirement for college. Did decent in college. a 3.6. I think it was a bit easier because the curriculum is more focused on what you're interested in and, depending on the field you're studying, is more about creation (like mine) than regurgitation.
School was the place where my thoughts came to place.But when I tried to pay attention, I always got distracted by anything or even fell asleep. Fitting was a fail. I was friends with only a couple of people. Lots of people thought I was dumb, but later on they thought I was a genius. Whatever, school is not my thing.
I have two problems with school; distraction/laziness and slow working. It's also a part of the distraction, partly. I too find that if I intuitively understand something, I know it better than everyone else, but it takes me a while to get there and until then I'm floundering. As my math teacher put it, I want to know the 'why', not the 'how. Because when I understand why the how is just the next logical step. I can figure it out for myself. But most teachers won't teach the why.
Or rather, what you say is very similar to it - that much of society is a social conditioning system. When you talk about the media being there to simplify and control, that's thinking about mass culture (as opposed to popular culture; mass culture is the marxist term but they're the same thing). You have very good ideas in this video.
Here's a loosely translated quote by Renee Fuller: "If we look stubbornly at the rainbow of intelligence through monochromatic filter, many minds will be presumed as colorless". It's something about general IQ tests and schools, too. Also good to read "The learning revolution" by Gordon Dryden and Jeannette Vos - I wish we could learn in these ways as presented there one day... But hell no, Poland will be the last country which will implement a new educational system, even in some small private schools... So the best way for me (as INTP) would be staying at home and studying on my own - but this is impossible.
What you said about school only being useful for getting a job. That's the biggest problem I found with many students and my own family. The value that my parents especially shoved down my throat was: "Make money, follow the dream," regardless of how constantly over my entire life I told them I didn't give a fuck about that.
I hated middle school. Especially 8th grade science because I expected more from it. Im a freshman now and I take notes in biology and recycle the paper the same day. I still have a high 90 average. Ive never done really well in math but I am now finding out that it isn't me but the way its taught. Algebra 1 is boring but im forcing myself to do the work and kind of make a game out of doing it fast. Now my grades have gone up alot and its not as bad because I never have homework because of this but its still not good.
Sounds like your on the right track. I graduated with a 2.2 gpa in high school, and used to mostly just escape through reading a lot. Have you read "The Closing Of the American Mind" by Allan Bloom? you sound like you would totally get what he wrote. I've never read anything else that was even close to how definitively he exposes the failure of our western education system. It was a gripping read. And this was coming from a tenured professor at the university of chicago back in about 1989.
and with physics and chemistry lessons, I just wish they would be taught by the same teacher, or just simply two teachers teaching both physics and chemistry at once and so the material don't feel so isolated or disconnected especially with atoms etc
Some people might not "find" themselves until after they've entered the workplace. Depending on the job, the structure at work might be different at work than it is in school. At work one can spend days, months, and even years perfoming basically the same tasks over and over. At school it can be difficult sometimes for some people to keep up with the subject matter when it becomes replaced with new material.
As for myself, I don't think my position would be any different had I went to a private school instead. I'd still be jobless, friendless, and unable to further my education. It's a bit off topic but I don't know of anything that could have helped me in school. Debilitating social anxiety is so hard overcome. But anyway... I really want public schools to succeed and get education back on track.
I'm a senior in high school and it failed me so badly i literally hate public school all we do is book work and the problem with that is that all we do in take it in and not much we can do after and even asking a simple question everyone gets mad AND YES its corrupt especially in bigger cities like LA or NY because people can take advantage. Our superintendent got paid double of what the president made.. the district was called Centinela School district
+Rita Sharma In Singapore it is also the same. The main difference is that the fist national exams are taken at age 12. Then you go again at 16 ad again at 18. Not to mention you are expected to start studying from the year before at least. 2 years if you are competitive.
Is it weird for me as an intp I started to adapt by also learning to memorize during college and I graduated those memorize knowledge are now gone cause I'm not particularly interested some of it. And it's hard for me to backed up my knowledge especially during interviews because of my fucked up communication skills During high school I really doubt myself thinking I'm not smart even though my friends tells me I am. When there is a scholarship program in our school for a certain university I took it. What really boost my self esteem a little is that the one classmate I had which I think of as my rival and I really think he is so smart failed the exam while I passed. It's really surprising for me. Guess that's really the perks of an INTP we have so much general knowledge.
Tomacity (Rast) I agree that a few years of early schooling could be condensed but only one year is a stretch as there are many children. including me probably, who can't learn this in one year. My history teacher told us who to vote for and his biased opinion of the political parties when most of us were old enough to vote, I didn't blindly accept his view as I had noticed that in lessons he frequently gave his biased accounts of issues but I am sure other students thought he was always right.
Is it weird for me as an intp I started to adapt by also learning to memorize during college and I graduated those memorize knowledge are now gone cause I'm not particularly interested some of it. And it's hard for me to backed up my knowledge especially during interviews because of my fucked up communication skills
Went to a magnet school, but didn't take aps or worry about sats much. I felt like all I needed was a sandbox to play with , a pal or two to talk with, and a bunch of books. So applying to colleges now, my instinct is simply do what seems natural and logical, rather than demonstrating ambition. Mt teachers tell me I'm smart, and that I'm a fool.
the ages of k-8 are important for developmental growth. Young kids learn faster actually, and the information solidifies. the Younger you start learning things, the more you can actually know in the long run. We just need to teach these young kids differently, not wait to teach them.
It's not a public skill problem. It's more like INTP's way of learning is simply too different that the one that school imposes which make it a boring and uninteresting place ( However, I could survived well by not going there at all unless for the exams and learning at my own pace alone at home. Best decision of my life )
I think I work slow but once I know something I know it better than anyone else. My knowledge becomes instinctual almost like a reflex. And from that intuitive place I work my magic. And yes teachers a lot of teachers just regurgitate material and when you question them or have a smart question they just ignore bc they don't know how to respond.
I am an INTP. My view is: Public school is the 'dog park' of our society. It's about socialization and conditioning. As a side bonus they lent me some books with some useful information in them.
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An unstimulated INTP is a sad INTP.
Quoted you, tweeted that.
Saxon Greene school is designed, by big oil from the early 1900’s, to create a class of people who can think just enough to follow orders so you can work, or consume.
There isn't many of us....which is why they don't cater to us
Hi
Same for INFP
I bullshited and cheated my way through high school. It was more interesting to me to find ways around doing the work than actually doing the work.
tucker smoak Tell me about it, I did the same until Grad school in Engineering. It doesn't give me any sense of satisfaction or achievement but when I see other 4 GPA people at work, I just find their knowledge and understanding much worse than somebody like me ... so I don't understand what's the point!
tucker smoak hello soul brother.
That's how I got through school. I saw no use for the bullshit they tried to cram in our skulls, so cheating seemed to be the only answer. I pretty much got c's and d's in everything but math, which I got a's in because I saw areas where I could apply it to life.
Same, i used to cheat in exams i even made a pen that if you pull out a part on the side it will show you a paper with the answers lol, i really hate education system, is really boring in a lot of subjects and it doesn’t catch my interest at all.
When I’m at home i get so much knowledge by my own, through books and internet.
Fr bruh
What sucks is group work. And monotony.
Toa Innodence hear hear
Hate this
Tbh I can be ok with group work it just depends who’s in the group 🤔
Im a INTP, I hated school, i hated homework, I didn’t do it. I always tested well though. I barely graduated.
I'm an INTP.
I've always had average/above average grades, never perfect, not because I don't understand the material, but because once I learn something, I normally want to just move on instead of practicing it through homework, so I may do well on tests, but do horrid in homework and project assignments because of lack of effort.
One awful consequence from this, is the stigma behind gpa and standardized test scores, I've had a few people back in high school belittle me because of my grades, even though, I've had many others become absolutely bewildered by my mathematical and programming skills, but of course, having low grades means you're stupid in this society right?
That's exactly what ticks me off about the school system, people who often are brilliant in their fields of interest get belittled because of poor grades, thus dis encouraging them to proceed in life.
For the most part, don't care what others think, but others might not feel like I do.
I guess it's just one of those INTP existential crises that make you feel like you failed in life.
Ninjamaster333 I'm in the same case bro :(
Same. Actually trying this year
Same I've been overthinking whether im an intp or not because i have low grades
same
As an INTP, I actually did very well in high school, but I HATED every minute of it. I did almost nothing but daydream in class, then just sort of taught myself how to do the homework and pass the tests.
Same I'm in high school and I hate it but I teach myself at the very last minute so I have average grades
Same
Same
INFJ here and I completely relate. 💯 Very well articulated
@@nathansmith4211 If INTP type are not as rare as INFJ type and they struggle, how badly feels school for INFJs?
Could you tell me why school was bad for You?
I'm INTP, asking out of curiosity
I'm an INTP and I was ALWAYS overlooked, school became a game of how I could outsmart the system instead of actually taking part, whether that be hacking the admin computer system or hacking the lunch que system. After years of getting bored of pretending to comply I just up and outed, now I'm homeschooled and am learning 10000000 times more! Did French for 3 years, learnt nothing, did French for 1 week at home and I can have a conversation in it.
+Angelo Parkour Same here basically. I got depressed and starting skipping school because i felt like i wasn't learning anything. I was in a very bad public school in the ghetto.
One day i just dropped out and decided to homeschool myself. I started off with a 4th grade level of mathematics, and within 9 months, i'm now at a 10th grade level. Calculus, Astronomy, Classical and modern physics- it's on the horizon baby.
That public school can take it's crappy earth space science and american history and shitty math class and shove it up it's figurative arse.
+Hero✩Lydragius yeh man, love your perseverance!
Angelo. So true. I spent much of my time doing my own learning and purposely not studying the school work. I thought I was the only one.
@@mstep4553 You aren't there are thousands of intps who love / and actually do that ..
Exactly
Oh gosh, public school... It sucked, I barely graduated and had to start at a community college afterwards. I used to think I was the problem, but now I am finishing law school. Pretty obvious that the school failed, not me. Hang in there my INTP brothers and sisters.
thank you that motivated me
this gives me hope honestly
That sounds a lot like me
This is incredibly accurate. I spent all of public school reading and doodling. The information, the lectures, the homework...irrelevant. I developed my intelligence on my own terms. Our school system is useless to someone like me.
YES. I hate the fact that my teacher is telling us to give the effort to impress HIM instead of doing it to impress ourselves. This man is aggressive if some of us fails and starts reminding us how bad we are and how much we suck, but in reality, he is the teacher, that's his own effort, his own teaching methods that has caused us to be at the level we are at.
The most frustrating thing is when teachers won't give back assignments or test, instead they just tell you what mark you got and you have no way of seeing what mistakes you made. It such a slap in the face. They're essentially saying "I don't care. Your learning doesn't matter at all. You don't matter. Only your grades do".
I am an INTP with ADHD. This is a perfect description of my day, especially the whole "playing with my thoughts" type of thing. I never really thought it had anything to do with my personality type- but perhaps I was overlooking that. I have been really frustrated recently with my schooling, finding my papers, and handing things in on time. I'm still surprised I wasn't held back this year.
i'm an intp and i often feel like i'm repressed or stuck in school. it doesn't feel safe to answer or ask questions and my ability level feels about the same for each class through the years. they may just be banging the "p" out of me
Public school is set up to educate the most students in the way that works for most of them. Since very few people in a population are INTP, the educational style isn't really set up to accommodate them. I really did not get much out of school. When I was a kid I would get excited when I would learn about something and I couldn't wait to talk to a teacher about it to learn more, only to have the teacher treat me like I was a smart ass and it absolutely killed my enthusiasm for learning for many years. Thank goodness I learned the joy of learning through self study and kept learning about the world. It is a trait that has stayed with me long after school and I never really stopped trying to learn about the world and educate myself. In school I was bored and only paid enough attention to pass my classes because I would have already read the textbook end to end in the first few months of class and it was so boring learning at the slow rate everyone else needed to learn. Being burned by classrooms like that turned me off of classroom learning all together and forced me to learn how to teach myself. Even now as an adult, when I teach somebody I do not do it as a classroom style learning. I create course material, provide it to the people I am teaching, but it's just there for reference later. The actual teaching is open discussions and asking the students questions, getting them engaged, having a conversation with them instead of giving them a lecture. It keeps them from zoning out, doing their laundry list while you read a power point presentation. Basically the best way I know how to teach and to learn is to do the exact opposite of what a public school does in a classroom.
I know that feel. While my teachers weren't necessarily the culprit, there's nothing more annoying for someone to stop you and say "We all know you're smart. Stop already."
Yeah, but Socrates got the hemlock cocktail.
Winter Matherne
Nobody likes a smart ass......except INTP's lol.
Socrates just didn't keep the right company.
OMG story of my life! So glad there are people like us. Gotta find a way to stick it to the man now that we know
Yeah. The same thing.
One time in 2nd grade, they told me the dumb ... conclusion they gained as they noticed I was watching out of the window all the time, although knowing the answers not trying to give them: "We know you're intelligent, but you always hide that and do [insert random thing they don't want you to do] instead of what you're told!" - "Well, how do you know what I'm hiding, when I hide it good enough to recognise I do so?", I asked. No satisfying answer was given to that, I thought, if they think I'm intelligent, they should just rate it by some formula or so, give me the score I deserve and leave me alone. They didn't.
Public school sucks. I had to visit 7 of them and it was the fucking same every time - one week I'm the new one, the other weeks I'm the weird one. We spent six months just for binomial formlars. It's one sheet of paper you have to learn there, and if you don't understand it, just learn it (although this is dumb, six months to do so is enough, no matter how stupid one is...). That was 8th grade and the last little drop that convinced me never to do homework again and it worked out. I read all the answers from an empty sheet, until 12th grade in physics I did do nothing at all at home.
Smartass or not, that don't matter. If people call themselves teachers and claim having the right to tell me or others what to do, what I have to know, how I have to find out, they should be smarter than me or at least know more than I can find out just by reading the little bit I find interesting anyway that is taught in school within one week in pre-internet-times (1989 to 2003). 14 years of 60 % waste of time, 30 % of getting in some kind of trouble and 10 % of something I can find out on my own much better. 14 years to find out engineering is a cool thing. Oh well, I knew THAT before, maybe nothing else but that for sure (if you aksed me what job I wanna have, my answer was "Inventor" - that's pretty close I think).
Well, doing nothing gets boring, and in 8th grade five or six russians were put into my class and we developed a habit of exposing our math teacher's poor performance every lesson (they - some of them - totally fitted the prejudice of the russian who plays chess and is good at math, science and all that ... maybe they wrestled with bears, I don't know...) and she went mad about that. With a more friendly teacher I'd feel sorry today, but I don't have to, she deserved that (and even more - gets too long for a youtube comment if I tell it all...).
In english (I'm from germany) I got my freshly divorced teacher (she really didn't care about anything that time) to watch Beavis and Butt-head with us as they asked me why my english was way better than theirs, and it was nothing more than I am not stupid as shit, but I replied I watched a lot of shows in english original, especially them, and we should have a glance at it, maybe it could work out. It did, we learned how to insult each other really seriously.
Biology sucked that much in school I didn't learn anything about it until a few years after. I even attended in christian religion although I didn't like the teacher, nor did I like the god nor the book, just for the fun of seeing an invalid argumentation fail time after time, receiving the second worst grade (a 5, in germany it counts from 1 to 6, the lower, the better) and laughing at this virtuose teacher when I received my graduation allowing me to attend grades 11 to 13 - which he didn't believe could happen. Funny guy, somehow he got to think I'm really stupid.
In general, I share the opinion of the video. Thinking and asking, yourself or whoever knows better, applying logic to logical problems, finding a solution instead of reproducing one you've seen other people find - just doesn't happen in regular school. You have to get your mind busy by yourself, they won't, they not don't even care, it's worse. Often I was told I wasn't supposed to think at all, but to do whatever I'm told to. Make a generation of obedient cocksuckers ... and another, another, another. Frank Zappa once said something like "The shit is floating already up to our chins, and no one dares to move to avoid any motion." - he's totally right with that one ... how did we get here? We all went to school!
Shorter: you have to find a funny way of wasting your time there, as it is wasted anyway.
Oh, I love ur brain! So happy to know more people with the same opinion as me.. The problem with society these days is that they don't want to think for themselves and so they are gullible.. Yes, I agree, it's very dangerous.. They tend to do crazy stuff, here in Indonesia, things get even uglier with the election, ISIS, etc.
I only have like 2 persons who agree about this in real life, so I'm excited when I watched this video..
I'm happy for you as well! That's why I made this video. I hope you stay safe over there. The world is crazy right now.
This video says everything I have ever wanted to express about the education system but haven't been able to put into words. Thank you.
This video feels like what I've been trying to say to people around me for years, and the last couple minutes reminded me of a quote (from Voltaire, i think) "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities", seems rather frightening that school seems to condition us (intentionally, or otherwise) to make it so easy to believe absurdities. I think one of the major things schools need to do is go back to the Trivium (Grammar, Logic, Rhetoric, in that order) because it seems to me a lot of this problem, is that schools are focusing almost exclusively on rhetoric, with just enough logic to know it exists, and just enough grammar to regurgitate information that we've already heard.
Hi Y'all. I'm an INTP who has been struggling on this earth with daily life for about three decades. Most info about what I have found relating to these struggles stems from poor public schooling and parental child-rearing. All of you are SO right about public school. My own observations about public school are that it has been created, run, and managed by people who are predominantly ESTJs and ESFJs. It seems that these people want to create a civilization that is ONLY populated by people of these types and ONLY people with a left-liberal understanding about everything. To most INTPs (and similar types) it should be increasingly obvious what kinds of disasters would/are occurring because foolhardy people desire to create an impossible world in which only a few kinds of people are needed. This venture cannot be successful because a multitude of problems and issues exist and will likely occur in the future that require a broad multitude of skills to master. Since public schooling was founded in the mid-1800's and became widespread in the 20th century we can see the bitter fruit that has been brought about by it and the slow, but ever increasing destruction of civilizations since those times.
Anyway, that's just my observations about the situation that is unfolding. No offense to ESFJs, ESTJs, or other kinds of people that have, want to, or are maturing to become caring, well-rounded individuals.
Our education system was modeled after the Prussian model which used behaviorism to condition people mentally. Public school isn't about getting a good education and expanding your horizons, it's only purpose is social conditioning. All one has to do is look up the quotes and writings of the people who funded and engineered public schooling to realize that it's only purpose was and still is, a nefarious one.
This is very true. I'm final year of studying to become a teacher, and I'll make a point of it to engage in critical thinking with the learners. Not always, but when I can. I feel all learning styles should be accommodated.
You literally just voiced everything I think about every single dang day as a high school INTP but could never sum up. 👏👏👏Man-your the definition of awesome. 😳
Once a teacher complained to my parents that I was asking too many questions
This is so relatable, but you all probably know. Jung's psychological types and their accuracy... at least especially when it comes to INTPs. It's simply fascinating, but also sad, which I don't entirely dislike since thanks to the Si I value melancholy and nostalgy, shadows of what thinks were or could have been. However, this function causes me also a lot of pain, I'm constantly "forgetting stuff" which I actually never payed attention to, due to the selective ADD I also suffer from. I love my private world in all its complexity, so difficult to externalize and draw linguistically. That leads me to the third trait he refers to: not being understood. Everything regarding social relationships always ends in failure. Deep down I feel really lonely, though I highly prize time for myself. And about school... well, I'll probably just drop out. I hope I'll be able to make a living without being obliged to make huge efforts in areas of study that don't interest me at all.
Anyway, I've been feeling quite emo lately too and there's nothing better than feeling a sense of belonging. In the internet I feel a bit freer, a bit lighter not having to deal with the outside world for too much time. It's exhausting, but you obviously feel sorely lonesome. And no, I have no friends, at least not close ones.
Well, this had no internal cohesion, I'll be prepared for the bombs. I hope that you can relate to my experience, I know it's an utter relief.
P.S.: Sorry for my english, I'm a Spaniard.
The public school system definetely failed me. The stuff was literally too boring, too worthless/pointless or too easy for me to be able to engage in or give any effort to and I struggled very badly. I was told that I would amount to nothing but a class clown who would flip burgers for the rest of my life. Finally in early middle school a third party organization came in and tested kids like me and I tested in the highest IQ bracket (genius). From then on I knew in my heart that the public school system is intentionally that way to suit an agenda to mold a society the way the elites want to. It's the strangest thing to experience the least amount of self worth growing up and then figure out that you have more to give to society than most. If I didn't have good parents, I really would have been messed up for life.
Public school goes against all INTPs priniciples
I did horrible in public school despite being very intelligent. It wasn't even that I wasn't social. It was the actually system that ruined it for me. In 3rd grade my school wanted to send me to a creative arts magnet school but my parents chose not too let me go... smh
yes, i agree completely. in school i always just ponder my thoughts instead of paying attention. i also have dyslexia and dyscalculia. so i am bad at math and reading. school sucks.
I am an INTP and I can totally relate to your assessment of our personality type. Public school does not offer a variety of teaching styles that cater to the different learning styles of students who sit in their classrooms. I wonder if there would be fewer disciplinary problems in schools if more students found a teaching style that is conducive to their learning style. I think students would be a lot happier, well-disciplined, and more passionate about learning and become more academically successful.
I`m doing pretty well at my private school, where luckily the teachers actually respect my intellect, and although I`m one of the best physicists I know I can still flop at a science test, simply because I didn`t give the answer they wanted, not because it wasn`t correct.
I'm more of self study and home study INTP...I had a hard time finishing mandatory education because of the rules and regulation that was not really nourishing for the brain. How does trying to please the teacher to get good grades or being a teacher's pet help you in the future? Maybe it does but it does not for long. Anyway, College was harder because it took me 7 years to realize that I was more suited to distance education than classroom based learning. I got better grades that way and spared myself those snore fest scolding from teachers who have authority and control issues. :/
INTP The Independent Scholar.
I did the bare minimum in high school. And that was when I even bothered to show up. After I had a breakthrough I talked to nobody. I witnessed so many become fashioned into consumer slaves without one inkling of free thought. I couldn't understand why my peers accepted things unquestioningly. Or how they adopted a manufactured persona that was fed to them. We were there to lap up the bullshit and I wasn't having any of it. Unwittingly I would go but not without leaving my brain at home. Or missing the first two classes conveniently. I'd saunter in through the front entrance just as a class would end so as not to draw suspicion. Every second there was hell. I sat at a desk to look good and that's it. School is beyond useless.
Hello friend, I like this subject.
And you mention indoctrination.
Which mirrors many of my observations of the education system.
Limits'n stuff, so I'll just state the current point where I'm at:
School is not, in fact, to educate. It's to enforce an obedient lifestyle that doesn't question authority.
Society wants drones, not scientists.
And I think that puts me into an agreeing stance.
You’re absolutely right, most of this stuff is inferred but towards the end (around @ 7 mins or so), you make very good points. Its also interesting to think about how public school has affected our culture after its establishment. Like before public school there were so many opportunities available to everyone and people would actually do things and make stands, now everyone just leaves all the decisions to authority. It’s really bad, adults are really just grown children now. While public school can bring a more organized system and has led to a manufactured and high advancement, it will all crash soon because of the inability to think. There is nothing super practical about public school and it’s just daycare that molds you into a system which later on causes great unhappiness and high unproductivity.
I'm an ENTP and I struggle with the same problems. Public school in America is complete bullshit and doesn't encourage people to think or reason. So much more emphasis is put on grades than actual learning. I hate the widely held belief in our culture that getting good grades makes you intelligent or vise versa. I've been diagnosed with ADHD just because I don't fit the typical SJ mold. School is just so fucking boring and tedious, it's completely unstimulating to me and I refuse to waste time on it. Creative thinkers, especially of the xNTP personality type don't learn in the way public school teaches us, and are likely to encounter issues with authority. I have to take adderall to even somewhat pay attention to repetitive, menial tasks that I don't gain anything from at all. And even then I still get bad grades, despite having an IQ in the top 2% of the population. The public education system truly has failed us.
Like others have said: thank you so much for making this video! And I hope you consider making more videos like these sometimes. This is what I've wanted to talk about and share with people for a very long time, but I've failed to find myself fitting in anywhere to talk about it (and still be taken seriously), even online, and instead I'm kinda giving up on life - but videos like these restores some hope in me, that maybe there's more people like you out there that I might connect with!
I’m an INTP, and I was homeschooled.
This education style was right up my alley, so much so that when I was given the choice to go to high school, I chose to continue homeschooling instead(eventually I just went to community college during my junior year of high school and that was great too). If any of you guys ever have XNTP kids I highly recommend homeschooling them because we are able to educate ourselves through our passions and interests. I have an ENTP brother and he does pretty well in this too, but he has to do a bunch of extracurricular activities to fill up his Extrovert Battery. My mom, who is an ambivert NTP, homeschooled us because she thought the education system was messed up. Yeah, she had to give us a basic schedule to make sure we’d test ok on the SATs, but we learned so much on our own time because we’re naturally curious people.
My sister on the other hand, would probably do pretty well in a school-like system because she’s an ambivert STJ, so she loves the structure and memorization and lists(ew). I really think it depends on the person, but I also think the the public school system is a “One Size Fits Nobody” kinda deal.
Abraham Lincoln
Charles Darwin
Albert Einstein
Sir Isaac Newton These are famous INTP's who were failures at school (Abraham Lin. was exception cuz he didnt go to school much)~~~~ They were never failure the society was just too stupid to accept their ideologies. The system of judging people who write whats written on the book; by the book ; till the boundaries of the bookish knowledge are treated with respect & we are treated like dirt; harassed as losers by parents , society, & bullies.
The Education system around the world SUCKSS!!!!!
As an INTP really makes me want to cry :'( at least cry in my heart/head.
I am an INDIAN being in a 3rd world country with huge population It's quite HELLISH if you're an INTP here (the standard treating people like dirt is just magnified 5x 6x 10x,etc. worse than in any western country).
:'(
I REALLY hate education system. Its less EDUCATION more like creating simple single minded CLONES.
Some of them did pass great but in general yeah they all did horrible in school and people looked down on them and without them everything would be so different
Edit: I am a shy ENTP (´･_･`)
Homework killed me in public school. I saw the homework as tedious and work for the sake of work, as well as buffer points for kids that do bad on tests so they can still pass them for effort.
I'm definitely an INTP and even though a lot of people at University of Michigan tell me I'm smarter than most people they know there, I didn't get accepted. I'm an Eagle Scout, played sports throughout high school, passed 4 AP tests (Calculus (4), Statistics (5), Micro Econ (5), Macro Econ (5), and was in drumline. The only reason I didn't get accepted to Michigan is because I A. Had a 3.4 GPA (88% average) Took honors classes and AP classes, got C's 3 or 4 times because I didn't always do as they said. Go B. I'm a slow reader: ACT scores Science: 32 Math: 31 English: 28 Reading: 21 Total: 28 (Bottom 25%ile at Michigan.) Now I'm thinking about dropping out of college because I'm recognizing so many different business opportunities that college won't even teach me to go after. I'm pretty sure INTP's and ENTP's struggle the most outside of the academic setting, more so than the other rationalist types (ENTJ's and INTJ's). This is because the primary and secondary functions are introverted thinking and extraverted intuition, we learn better doing our own exploration into what's true and important, and not having someone force us to believe something is so.
I completely 100% agree with this. I'm in my junior year of high school and ive been regurgitating information for so long and i'm tiring of it. Im starting to take notice of the faults in society and I'm so done with public school. I've thought about this so much but i trip up when i question the majority. Us as INTPs feel this way about the system, but we are a minority. If this assimilation works for the majority of the world, who are we to want change in an entire massive system when we are such a small demographic. Every war is fought for an end result and there are casualties along the way. Not everyone is an INTP. Not everyone can function in a world without some sort of social conditioning. It sucks, but i think its better the way it is.
intp.. i dropped out haha
Me too.
+lol what Me too matey. Me too.
Me too...
Me too, thanks to the internet I was able to self-teach and I took a test after and got the certification anyways.
lol what
in my country should study at University to get jobs :(
Wow! I did bad in school. I really felt like everyone had something I wasn't born with, because school seemed to come so easily to them. I figured I just wasn't smart enough. As an adult I have realized it wasn't really about not being smart at all. I'm homeschooling my kids, this is our 4th year, and I always find things that make me grateful I homeschool them but this video is definitely a big one! I think my oldest is an ENTP, and academics always came very natural to her. Do ENTPs do well in school?
so true. I recently got into trouble with my high school english teacher for asking too many questions and questioning them in front of the class. she told me, I should just stop asking questions, so basically to believe every thing I'm told .
Same but with my college teacher basically wasnt entitled to have my own opion and question her way of teaching.
Thank you for making a group chat for intps it motivates us knowing about people like us ...
You just described my 15 y.o. son to a T. Right now, we're trying to get him outside his head. He's been depressed because he's tired of accommodating down to his peers and unable to find meaningful friendships. He'll go to public school for the first time in 6 years, specifically for the social component, though I think he will be bored to tears. Hopefully he'll make a few friends first. :-P
I am an INTP in the public school system and you really expressed my opinion on it. I get good grades, and I've been lucky enough to actually have a few classes this year that actually encourage critical thinking (AP Language class taught by a definite NT), but the system is shit. Towards the end when you talked about how education is so much more than just getting a job and then elaborated I was thinking "AMEN".
Well said. I'm an INTP and I graduated HS in 2001. Sadly nothing has really changed. I was bored in school, saw how much of a waste it was and I'm stubborn as I don't just follow orders. Any class or part of a class I found interesting I did very well but otherwise I did enough to pass. As you say not everyone learns the same way and public education caters to a certain type of learning/person which means INTP types lag behind. A solution is going to a school dedicated too your learning style and or home schooling. If I was to become a parent I would understand my child and cater to them and their learning style. I agree that public education is to mold a particular type of society and we're seeing the results of that now this is why public education is terrible and will continue to be poor.
got into so much trouble in public school and private schools because i never accepted anything at face value, so i had to constantly ask the teachers why learning certain things were important, or how they knew that the history we were being taught was correct, what was the proof during my religion classes. i hardly ever did homework, only book reports i would do was if we got to choose our own book, which i usually had to convince my teachers that i read the book and wrote the report myself. i've always had a problem with simple math, like multiplication, long division, finding the lowest common denominator. I always wished that I could just get grades based on tests instead of counting homework and class participation. it wasn't until I got to college that I decided this is not the right place for me. entry tests were great, except the math 1 exam, which i nearly failed, but on math 2 and 3 i had passed with flying colors despite never learning functions, calculus and trig in HS. despite doing so well on higher math, i was put into remedial math (basic 5th grade algebra) and even my teacher couldn't understand why i was put there and advised me to only come in on test days since i completed all homework assignments in the first week, i was excused from all other classes.
I agree with this so much! I've been so frustrated with how the school system works. As an INTP I was classified as learning disabled, just because I process information differently. Even though my IQ tested 134 at the time. Even college feels like its not even about learning, its just about having the security of getting a degree so you can be an over qualified McDonald's worker. I don't feel like I'm learning anything, and that's really disappointing to an INTP.
I just learned about Myers Briggs and discovered that I'm an INTP. In everything I've read, it's an extremely accurate profile of myself. This video is the TRUTH. Going into my senior year of high school, I had a 1.7 GPA. School bored me to tears and I spent my teens building a fairly successful online business. My parents couldn't understand why I was smart but such a poor student. I tried to explain it exactly as you have in this video. I thought it was just a very personal quirk until now...
Lol, intp moment 4:56: "What is it for???".
Good points, though. Public education is a clusterfuck. I do like the idea of holding off and learning one's personality preferences, then going to a school tailored to your learning style. The shortened school cycle would offset the extra costs involved with customized programs.
wow this is so helpful. i have been trying to find out which type i am, i thought i might be infj or infp but now it makes so much sense and it is pretty obvious now that i am intp! while i was in school i didnt do so well and now i realize why!
Holy crap! As people here have said before, this puts to words how I has always felt. I feel so fucked over, my rare INTP mind has been put to waste, & it bugs me to the core how everyone is also completely ignorant to the truth you said in this video.. so sad...
I understand how you feel, I'm doing a lot better at university than I did at high school. Never the less, INTP's can do quite well if somebody pushes them to do the boring stuff, I think it's more about perseverance than anything. Then again I went to public school in Australia and things might be different here.
This is how I made it through public school --> In my junior and senior years I skipped all of my classes (except Calculus and Film Editing and of course test days). I was almost held back from graduating based on my absences, but luckily some very very very understanding teachers and a wonderfully enlightened school dean stepped in to prevent that. It also helped that through independent study I was able to hold a 4.6, all honors and 9 APs... - the story of a very lucky INTP female.
My public school education was always troubled. First of all, I pretty much went through summer school every other year because I would fail. I daydreamed a lot. Counselors advised my parents to put me on Ritalin, they refused. I grew up thinking that I was stupid. I tried fitting in with many different groups in school, the jocks, the gangsters, all types of weirdos. Like other INTP s I did question everything, which made me popular with authority figures.
As a kid I use to think of a lot of technical stuff. I thought of so many inventions that were just ideas in my head, which later in life, I found out that someone actually invented that already.
Public school failed me back then, and it failed me now as an employee. I work on electronics, and administrators resist change even to this day. Now, as an adult, I realize that it's all about politics, at least in the workplace. For example, In my department, I work on Intercoms, sound systems, and energy controls. I have experience with burglar & fire alarms, and brought the idea of integrating both of those devices to the schools intercom. I used to install lockdown button in schools before it even was called "lockdown". Integrating these systems would mean that once the lockdown button is pushed, a louder-higher pitch alarm will ring through the intercom's speakers, trip the burglar alarm to send a lockdown message to the school's police department, trip the fire alarm demagnetize the hallway doors and locking them once they shut. All of this would have kept intruders from gaining access to classrooms, and other areas where students are.Well anyway, we contract out out fire alarm work, because we are not licensed, and out burglar alarm department is controlled by a power hungry chief of school police. So despite integrating all of these systems because it would make the schools safer, and because it makes sense. Administrators would prefer to play politics,and let people hold on to the power of being able to tell people "no" when they are asked for their ID cards to be granted access to certain doors.
Any whooters fuck public education,they have failed society and I believe that is why they have all of this competition from charter schools. Thanks for reading my rant and have a good day.
This is so true, i have a cousin who's really gifted musically and artistically and she's not stupid by any means but she does horrible in school because she's not very good at just memorizing things and her parents think she's being lazy and they belittle her for it. and I think this is happening to so many people everywhere. I wish that everyone could just know that they're worth something even if they do get terrible grades.
its kind of ironic though, cause intps are actually more likely to be unhappy with their job and life
Rage I feel... soo much... I can't believe how much ignorant could be every person that was the people around me that time at school. I wish I could know more things about me when I was kid.... Well I guess the majority wins and we have to find our way out.
Hi. Intp here. Well, I started good at elementary school, but dropped off after the first year of secondary school. I struggled and struggled, and ended up into a language based school. I did bad there too, and was told (and believed) that I was going to lose a year, which eventually happened. But thanks to that, I was able to learn much more. But depression started, the fear that I was going to fail once again got tthe better of me, and just managed to get to the next year. I had to go to another school because of the situation I was in, and finally graduated. It was one of the most proud situations in my life. But you want to know what's the best part? When learning French, English, and Spanish, I was told that I was not made for it, but once I graduated, I learned it myself from 0. I was so surprised when I heard an interview with subtitles and could comprehend it without being able to see ( very poor vision, I need glasses).
This was me! I went to a private school in Australia and I'm guessing it would've been better than public school in the US and Australia. My school report cards always said I had way more potential than my grades showed, but I was bored out of my skull much of the time. Plus I was pretty immature. Now I've gone back to university part-time at 40 I'm far better equipped, mentally speaking to get more out of it and challenge what is being taught. It's fun to challenge the authoritative figures with logic and force them to (try to) justify the content of their lessons and readings. People like Stefan Molyneux and John Taylor Gatto are great catalysts for stimulating critical thought.
Tomacity, sounds like you might be familiar with the websites School Sucks Project (Brett Veinotte) and Tragedy & Hope (Richard Grove), am I right?
My first few years (K through 4th) of public school were OK. But beyond that, it was absolutely disgusting. It's a glorified youth warehouse.
I was a bit of the reverse. I had no interest in school outside of math until Grade 3 when I had to do a science project and found one about making a game using electrical circuits. For some reason it amazed the hell out of me and I stayed in AP/honors classes until college. Highschool in general was too easy and didn't prepare me for college, and the way some courses (like calculus) are taught I found it to be useless.
Calc was good example, you spend an hour and a half copying notes verbatim off a teacher's board while they give you some formulas to use without explaining how or why they work in some instances and not in others. They then give you questions that you basically need to solve multiple times until you see a pattern of when those tools give you a right answer, and when they don't. It was pretty bullshit.
In public school, I could do fractions, multiply, divide, and that was it. I couldn't do math beyond that. I even struggled with percentages. In HS they even put me in a basic algebra class, twice, and I still didn't get it. So stayed in "bone-head" classes mostly through public school. In community college, same thing with math. But I did complete all the other community college program for transfer. I managed to transfer to a 4 yr college. But there, I was automatically enrolled in a mandatory algebra. There was no teacher, so to speak. I just got a phone # and office # if I had questions...the book set was in the book store. Make an appointment when ready to take the final. In the dorm, I set down with the first book and voila, I friggin' cake-walked through it, all 5 books, finished it early (I couldn't believe how simple it was! -and NO TEACHER), then aced the final. That was spring '72. That summer I took analysis, and Trig/pre-Calc., also acing them, cake-walk. In short, I have a perfectly normal math capable mind. And public school is the dysfunction.
I almost didn't graduate because I misread the grad requirements and thought it meant I didn't need to take Math 12.
I went from almost failing AP Math 10 (shit teacher, didn't teach me jack) to passing Pre-Calc with a B in about 3 weeks of work through Continuing Ed.
Side note: my mom was on my case hard, telling me I should spend every waking hour working on it. After breezing through it at the pace I wanted (like 2-3 hours a day; her schedule: 6 hrs in building, 4 hours "study" at home), I ended up figuring out a system where I could leave the building a half hr after being dropped off, go play video games at my house for 4 hours, then go walk through a park for an hr before heading back home.
I ended up designing a schedule to determine what I should tell her I had been working on, complete with figuring out what I should say was "hard" or what I had failed to understand that day so she could give me the usual speech to feel like she did her duty before I was forced to chat online rather than game during the evenings. I think I spent more effort to get out of work than I did working.
And yep. I think I'll need to teach myself college courses, been thinking about going back to school. I'd have done it sooner but they won't allow you to just challenge all of the coursework, and you have to live locally.
VERY good points that I have thought of as well (INTP).
Yeah, I used to write huge blog posts when I got home which compiled all of my thoughts that I'd collected during the day. Also, I think not engaging INTPs is what causes our procrastination problems because we're effectively taught that making an effort isn't going to be worth it.
It's frustrating for me as a student, as everything seems to be focused on college as the end-all-be-all of existence. We are encouraged to work out butts off for some distant idea so we can work our butts off for another distant idea (jobs) so we can work our butts off for another distant idea (retirement). And all of these distant ideas are in the name of a good life, but then you wake up one day and you're old and the only (not so) distant idea you have left is death. But thats another thing.
You just said everything that I think of the school system!!
For the INTP, public school is a reformatory penal system.
INTP The Independent Scholar.
As an INTP in high school I defiantly agree. Why memorize everything? Why not question? I know that right now I can beat nearly every politician in a logical debate. Yet we get in trouble for challenging them, no matter how correct we are. I believe that we can soon reverse this. We are being subjugated, and throughout history the subjugated always rise. This problem will only be commbatted with a social revolution. Maybe we're next to rise.
Exactly! The reason so many people have no idea what they want to do with their life is because they don't get to experience anything relevant until college and by the time you do figure it out you have a bunch of money spent on credits you don't need.
I ended up getting a 4.0 in my senior year and just BARELY making the minimum requirement for college. Did decent in college. a 3.6. I think it was a bit easier because the curriculum is more focused on what you're interested in and, depending on the field you're studying, is more about creation (like mine) than regurgitation.
School was the place where my thoughts came to place.But when I tried to pay attention, I always got distracted by anything or even fell asleep. Fitting was a fail. I was friends with only a couple of people. Lots of people thought I was dumb, but later on they thought I was a genius. Whatever, school is not my thing.
I Write down these exact thoughts in my diary last year. now Reading these comments, I realized I'm not only one who did that.
I have two problems with school; distraction/laziness and slow working. It's also a part of the distraction, partly. I too find that if I intuitively understand something, I know it better than everyone else, but it takes me a while to get there and until then I'm floundering. As my math teacher put it, I want to know the 'why', not the 'how. Because when I understand why the how is just the next logical step. I can figure it out for myself. But most teachers won't teach the why.
Or rather, what you say is very similar to it - that much of society is a social conditioning system. When you talk about the media being there to simplify and control, that's thinking about mass culture (as opposed to popular culture; mass culture is the marxist term but they're the same thing). You have very good ideas in this video.
Here's a loosely translated quote by Renee Fuller: "If we look stubbornly at the rainbow of intelligence through monochromatic filter, many minds will be presumed as colorless". It's something about general IQ tests and schools, too. Also good to read "The learning revolution" by Gordon Dryden and Jeannette Vos - I wish we could learn in these ways as presented there one day... But hell no, Poland will be the last country which will implement a new educational system, even in some small private schools... So the best way for me (as INTP) would be staying at home and studying on my own - but this is impossible.
OMG. Where have you been all of my life? I agree 95%.
I want you to know that the titles of the videos sold me immediately.
What you said about school only being useful for getting a job. That's the biggest problem I found with many students and my own family. The value that my parents especially shoved down my throat was: "Make money, follow the dream," regardless of how constantly over my entire life I told them I didn't give a fuck about that.
I have always thought this pin point. I shared this on my FB. EINSTEIN was an INTP.
I hated middle school. Especially 8th grade science because I expected more from it. Im a freshman now and I take notes in biology and recycle the paper the same day. I still have a high 90 average. Ive never done really well in math but I am now finding out that it isn't me but the way its taught. Algebra 1 is boring but im forcing myself to do the work and kind of make a game out of doing it fast. Now my grades have gone up alot and its not as bad because I never have homework because of this but its still not good.
I tend to explain things in a different way than how i was taught even if I could easily just repeat what they said
Same
Sounds like your on the right track. I graduated with a 2.2 gpa in high school, and used to mostly just escape through reading a lot. Have you read "The Closing Of the American Mind" by Allan Bloom? you sound like you would totally get what he wrote. I've never read anything else that was even close to how definitively he exposes the failure of our western education system. It was a gripping read. And this was coming from a tenured professor at the university of chicago back in about 1989.
More people need to see this.
and with physics and chemistry lessons, I just wish they would be taught by the same teacher, or just simply two teachers teaching both physics and chemistry at once and so the material don't feel so isolated or disconnected especially with atoms etc
Great analysis. You have gained an INTP fan
Some people might not "find" themselves until after they've entered the workplace. Depending on the job, the structure at work might be different at work than it is in school. At work one can spend days, months, and even years perfoming basically the same tasks over and over. At school it can be difficult sometimes for some people to keep up with the subject matter when it becomes replaced with new material.
As for myself, I don't think my position would be any different had I went to a private school instead. I'd still be jobless, friendless, and unable to further my education. It's a bit off topic but I don't know of anything that could have helped me in school. Debilitating social anxiety is so hard overcome. But anyway... I really want public schools to succeed and get education back on track.
I'm a senior in high school and it failed me so badly i literally hate public school all we do is book work and the problem with that is that all we do in take it in and not much we can do after and even asking a simple question everyone gets mad
AND YES its corrupt especially in bigger cities like LA or NY because people can take advantage. Our superintendent got paid double of what the president made.. the district was called Centinela School district
+Rita Sharma In Singapore it is also the same. The main difference is that the fist national exams are taken at age 12. Then you go again at 16 ad again at 18. Not to mention you are expected to start studying from the year before at least. 2 years if you are competitive.
Is it weird for me as an intp I started to adapt by also learning to memorize during college and I graduated those memorize knowledge are now gone cause I'm not particularly interested some of it. And it's hard for me to backed up my knowledge especially during interviews because of my fucked up communication skills
During high school I really doubt myself thinking I'm not smart even though my friends tells me I am. When there is a scholarship program in our school for a certain university I took it. What really boost my self esteem a little is that the one classmate I had which I think of as my rival and I really think he is so smart failed the exam while I passed. It's really surprising for me. Guess that's really the perks of an INTP we have so much general knowledge.
Tomacity (Rast) I agree that a few years of early schooling could be condensed but only one year is a stretch as there are many children. including me probably, who can't learn this in one year. My history teacher told us who to vote for and his biased opinion of the political parties when most of us were old enough to vote, I didn't blindly accept his view as I had noticed that in lessons he frequently gave his biased accounts of issues but I am sure other students thought he was always right.
Impressive. I wish I had done the same. Not having a good GPA in highschool can follow you around for a while.
My dad was in the military when he saw my flunking grades. Pretty much he straightened me up with brute force. But college was hell.
Is it weird for me as an intp I started to adapt by also learning to memorize during college and I graduated those memorize knowledge are now gone cause I'm not particularly interested some of it. And it's hard for me to backed up my knowledge especially during interviews because of my fucked up communication skills
Went to a magnet school, but didn't take aps or worry about sats much. I felt like all I needed was a sandbox to play with , a pal or two to talk with, and a bunch of books. So applying to colleges now, my instinct is simply do what seems natural and logical, rather than demonstrating ambition. Mt teachers tell me I'm smart, and that I'm a fool.
the ages of k-8 are important for developmental growth. Young kids learn faster actually, and the information solidifies. the Younger you start learning things, the more you can actually know in the long run. We just need to teach these young kids differently, not wait to teach them.
School was such a sad thing for me tbh
School killed me. What a waste of time. Zero ability to use my critical thinking and quite the social dilemma. Nice analysis 👍
It's not a public skill problem. It's more like INTP's way of learning is simply too different that the one that school imposes
which make it a boring and uninteresting place ( However, I could survived well by not going there at all unless for the exams and learning at my own pace alone at home. Best decision of my life )
I think I work slow but once I know something I know it better than anyone else. My knowledge becomes instinctual almost like a reflex. And from that intuitive place I work my magic. And yes teachers a lot of teachers just regurgitate material and when you question them or have a smart question they just ignore bc they don't know how to respond.
I am an INTP. My view is: Public school is the 'dog park' of our society. It's about socialization and conditioning. As a side bonus they lent me some books with some useful information in them.
I am infj and Public school keep me from creative thinking. They call for me formulaic things.