Russia's New Secret Weapon Against Ukraine? 75 Year Old Biplanes!
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- Опубликовано: 12 дек 2022
- Russia appears to be about to use a new secret weapon against Ukraine - but it's not a jet or missile, but rather a 75-year-old biplane transport plane. Find out the bizarre story here...
Dr. Mark Felton FRHistS, FRSA, is a well-known British historian, the author of 22 non-fiction books, including bestsellers 'Zero Night' and 'Castle of the Eagles', both currently being developed into movies in Hollywood. In addition to writing, Mark also appears regularly in television documentaries around the world, including on The History Channel, Netflix, National Geographic, Quest, American Heroes Channel and RMC Decouverte. His books have formed the background to several TV and radio documentaries. More information about Mark can be found at: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Fe...
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Credits: US National Archives; Library of Congress; David Andruczyk; FlugplatzNohra; Anna Zverera; Igor Dvurekov; Vitaly V. Kuzmin; Aeroprints.com
![Russia's Monster Plane That Actually Flew | Kalinin K-7 [Aircraft Overview #11]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/44vniEeXmn8/mqdefault.jpg)
This is why, although most modern militaries have moved away from these systems, sophisticated self-propelled AA gun systems, like the Gepard, are still an important part of a layered AA defense, as their munitions are far cheaper and can still easily handle such targets.
In a long enough war you’ll see the clock start ticking backwards in terms of armaments
@@CARBONHAWK1 i wonder when they will get to slings and wooden clubs?
Using them as decoy drones is a waste. They are still useful for transport, communications, and aerial ambulance duties. What I have been surprised by is that neither side has been using "bed check charlie" aircraft like during WWII and Korea where low and slow biplane aircraft equipped with flame dampeners and mufflers were used to bomb enemy airfields and encampments in nuisance raids. Drones have partially assumed that role but they lack the payload of something like the AN-2.
WWIII is either going to involve no guns, or _all_ the guns.
@@CARBONHAWK1 You only see that in those unable to mange production of equipment. Russia does not have the infrastructure and never has.
My buddy did a parachute jump out of this Antonov, 7 years ago at the age of 92. He was even allowed to fly as a co-pilot when he showed his pilot's license from 1941. At that time he flew He111 and Ju52. He is now 99 years old and still very fit for his age.
Sounds like quite a gentleman.
@@JimmyCarter.
He is a good-hearted person..👍
your buddy is awesome
Ask him if he likes older women. My wife's grandmother just turned 100 and still lives alone in a condo, drives and works part time in a library and is quite active.
@@g.k.1669
😅
He is married..
He also goes to the sauna and gym every week. 💪
I'm an American living in Russia. There's an air-force base near where I work. I often see these planes flying around dropping paratroopers for training. This has actually been going on for years, not just after the war started. In any case, one time they were practicing landing on apartment buildings. One guy missed the roof our building and got caught on an air-conditioner on it's side about 8 floors up. Fortunately some kids opened their bedroom window and pulled him through and he was OK.
That's a great story. I'm a New Zealander , I plan to move to Russia soon. I almost have the language cracked.
@@louiekiwi Enjoy that lol
Get out of there man, while you still can, lmao.
@@ReddoFreddo why? Russia seems to not be the woke distopia the US has become, nor facing the economic hardships the US and EU are facing, despite how much your evening news programme insists on "the sanctions are crippling Russia".
@louiekiwi ah Yes move to where they dislike Westerners intensely and have an Authoritarian leader. Seems smart. What could possibly go wrong?
AN-2 was the first plane of the Croatian Air Force in 1991, dropping improvised 'boiler bombs' and supplying ground troops. It was so effective, the enemy had to bring in the modern rocket system against this true legend of an airplane
I was just about to say that!
😂
Using a 1940s aircraft, in large numbers, against a nation like the US, France, Britain, etc. WOULD exhaust a lot of their high end missiles. But Ukraine, despite being supplied by NATO nations with surpluses, still is largely 1970s - 90s in equipment, so the Ukrainians wouldn't struggle too long to improvise the necessary machine gun contraptions needed to deal with this slow, low flying WWII plane.
A lot of the very basic but powerful machine gun platforms that came into being since the collapse of the USSR are way more able than the crude machine guns used when the AN-2 was built.
And, as others noted, the older Germany machine gun contraption in their Gepard tank like platform... even if it doesn't have great range, in strategic place, its sophisticated, radar-guided firing automation means most AN-2 that are on their descent to their assigned targets (electrical stations & grids, hospitals, gov't buildings, civic buildings, etc, crucial rail exchanges, etc) would be shot to pieces easily.
Relying on one modern and expensive weapon system (S-300, Starsreak, MANPAD, the Patriot, etc,) is not going to easily defeat an old technology like the AN-2, in the hundreds, rigged with a lot of explosives. It'd have to be a concentric or multi layers of defense, with some being taken out by a few very expensive missiles, while others by bullets from platforms like the Gepard....
Larger drones that could stay up in the air for hours, with sophisticated surveying cameras, also will have to come into play. Ukraine's not in short of the various drone these days. So, knowing that the Russians are intending to deploy these 1940s bi-planes, the Ukrainians surely must have been working on an improvised set of solutions, too.
@@kiabtoomlauj6249 really good report, but An-2 max altitude is 4000+ meters. So if Ukranians adopt AA artillery tactics, Russians would send double amount of drones on different altitudes, or altogether avoiding low altitude trajectories
@@ivflash6363 at 4000 meters....50 cal machine guns will be shooting down lots of low &slow real easy....quads and gatling 50's even C-130's flying outside orc air offenses would have a field day popping them out of the air. Unfortunately, the US hasn't sent the Spectre gunships ...yet! But the massive numbers of small caliber cannons and ammo can easily thwart these low& slow air threats.
in Republic of Korea Airforce, here AN2 is considered to be a "stealth" transport used by North Korea to send special forces units or kamikazes. They can fly low and land on golf courses, country roads, mudflats etc. We do exercises for countering North Korean air invasions and hundreds of AN2s mixed in with mig 15s and mig 19s makes it really difficult to find out the real threats like mig 21, mig 23 and su24.
Also it really soaks up missiles if we are lazy with target allocation
The Norks used to use the An-2's predecessor, the Polikarpov Po-2, which due to largely wooden construction had a very low radar signature. That combined with An-2 style slow speed made it very difficult to shoot down since fighters would stall and fall out of the sky if they went slow enough to have it in their gunsights long enough to hit it.
remember that one time the CIA chased down a couple AN-2’s in a UH-1 shooting them down with an AK-47? fun times..
@@IrishCarney Norks! So simple and so elegant (and like the Ruz, so fitting)! Hurting from laughing. Do not know how I missed that one. Thanks for increasing my vocabulary, and the laughs.
My best guess is Russia will use a hoard of An-2s, drones, loitering munitions, cruise missiles, and tactical jets as part of a SEAD blitz campaign over a week. Your anecdote gives this theory credibility. Only time can tell.
That was in Laos during the Vietnam war
These were used in Vietnam, actually Laos to bomb a secret US Radar site. At least one was shot down by an Air American helo whose crew chief used an AK-47. A strange but true story; worthy of your channel!
Is this the same AN2 equipped outfit that had rocket-pods attached to the wings?... the 'civilian' helicopter use sounds familiar. Definitely worthy of investigation.
@@alfnoakes392 yes and no, or so I think. They actually dropped mortar bombs through tubes installed in the fuselage. I have actually been very close to the site!
They were also used by North Vietnam to attack South Vietnamese patrol type boats which were raiding along the North Vietnam coastline. One night when the boats were expected to raid and it was thought the AN-2's would show up to attack them, a section of Navy Skyraiders (which I led) was assigned as CAP (combat air patrol) for the boats. We were to be radar vectored by the northern Tonkin Gulf picket destroyer to intercept and attack the AN-2 with our 20mm cannons. Both the boats and the AN-2 were no shows and we ended up only boring holes in the night sky for 2 hours or so.
@@philiphymel19 that would have been an interesting and one-sided combat! 👍
I think the Huey crew chief used an Uzi, but the rest of the report is correct, as far as I know. It's on one of the pages of a CIA calendar. The chopper was an Air America bird.
decoy drones are indeed a clever re-purposing of these old birds, but it will be sad to see their finite remaining numbers so diminished as they are indeed vintage beauties
Rode in one many years ago. It rattled horribly and was rather breezy but the engine ran perfectly and to be honest it was a delightful throwback to an earlier era. There is no doubt in my mind these craft will carry out their missions.
Till some 18yr old kid points an AK at it lmfao
@@terranwars3504 Someone points a weapon system at it then all bets are off.
@@terranwars3504 I doubt an AK would really do any damage. Probably take 1000 rounds to take it down. Thats if you can even hit it.
@@todcarter110 Right, let's say not an AK, a heavy machine gun on AA tripod... they'd fall quicker out of the air than during the famous turkey shot and not a single valuable Missile used... or just a self propelled and independently operating AA platform like the Gepard... made for that
@@paddypleiner5518 or Shilka, perhaps
I saw one of these at an air display nearly 30 years ago, there was a stiff breeze blowing across the runway, the pilot flew into the wind reducing the ground speed almost to zero then cranked the rudder to the left and seemed to be flying sideways using the throttle to keep just above stall speed ... for something so bulky the performance was majestic.
75 years? All pilots are zombies. they just fought world war two and were then sent directly to Ukraine.
Yep, headwind is one of the AN-2's worst enemies
Yeah I saw one of those at an air show a few years ago, took off into a headwind and flew down the runway in front of the spectators at walking pace.
A German of ww2 vintage used to pull that off raly well in an old biplanes think his name was Udent or something like that
I have seen one like that flying about 7-8 years ago. It was in Pskov. I think they where still using them to train the paratroopers that are stationed there.
When I went to Dutch Airborne school on the Island of Texel, the school's assigned Jump plane was down for its annual service. The CO of the school made some calls, and an AN-2 that was owned by a Dutch local on Texel was asked if we could use it. After 3 days of waiting for the winds to drop below 15knots ...we all got our 5 jumps in two hectic, fast days. It was surreal wearing my US kit, at Dutch Jump school, jumping out of an ancient Russki biplane. Slow, stable, solid. On my Graduation Jump day after my 5th Jump, the Cadre was kind enough to let me fly the last 3 sorties for my classmates. Good times!
The An 2 honestly is one of the strongest working aircraft in history that thing is impressive. Still see it flying all over Eastern Europe and the Middle East.
We have a AN-2 at my airstrip. This aircraft is actually incredible. We use it for base jumps and tourist flights. It is hard to stall, and absolutely a beast to people that don't know planes can go without their engine running. Amazing video though. (Yeah I just wanted to nerd out about the plane I maintain)
cool story bro. keep up with the fake stories
Awesome story! Not sure why the guy above me said it's fake. It would be ridiculous to lie about something specific like this.
@@Jac0bIAm clearly he just dislikes anything fun
@@Jac0bIAm Ikr. It's not like he talking about some super-secret Xperimental spooky black plane or anything. It's a mother trucking AN-2 - a Toyota F40 plane equivalent. People use them for crop dusting and sky diving by the thousand.
@@ChiekoGamers at least he has stories to tell rather then being toxic online
"War is waste." Beautiful old classic biplanes that could be in service all over the world doing a multiplicity of things from general short hop transport to serving flying clubs, instead get turned into bombs.
With Russia's history of gross corruption I wouldn't want to be on a plane that's 4-5 decades old and barely maintained...
@@ilaser4064 AND ONLY ONE ENGINE!
@@peterkiviat9969 💯
There was a ad hoc squadron of Antonovs that were flying out of Osijek in eastern Croatia. They were flying low level attacks against Jugoslav army in Vukovar with any kind of IED they could cobble together. There were like 5 survivors of that time. Met the one pilot in 96 while they were parked near Slavonski Brod doing agricultural work. Took us up for a spin dropping fertilizer. Beast of an aircraft.
sry all it is in croatian:
ruclips.net/video/M24pwikME8M/видео.html
Small world, i flew in one of these in 96. Zagreb to Sarajevo. Good platform.
@@gunner678 Right on. 🙂
They are a beast. Air brakes hissing and the roar of that engine. Love em.
There is one AN-2 still flying over from time to time over Osijek for pest control (mosquitoes). 20 years ago, 4-5 of those flew above the city for the same reasons.
It was Lithuanian aircraft builder and constructor Antanas Gustaitis planes.
Puts me in the mind of the de Havilland Canada DHC-2 Beaver, a (monoplane) Canadian counterpart also of 1940s vintage. Versatile, strong, reliable, well-suited to both military and civil utility roles. The US Army bought hundreds.
A Canadian icon, the last of more than 1,600 was built in 1967. A great many are still in service, including Harrison Ford's. It's his go-to plane, which he flies more than any other. (That's right, Harrison Ford adores his Beaver.)
While in the US Army, I jumped from a Beaver four times. What a treat! I recall that Beaver every time I see an AN-2.
Actually a Canadian company in BC bought original plans for beaver and otter aircraft so they can be remade to modern production standards with modern avionics.
i think Canada Post had a stamp with the Beaver on it
@@glengarbera7367 viking air?
Did he keep his license after landing on a taxiway?
I have skydived from a Antonov AN2, it is probably one of the most safest planes in the world, considering its age. I just love this plane, its so slow and stable, like a tractor.
I flew in one in Augsburg, Germany.
It has a cockpit floor that is about half a meter higher than the cabin.
What fascinated me was that in the forward cabin bulkhead there were openings where the control cables came out, ran over rollers upward to the cabin roof, over another roller set along the cabin roof and in the area of the wings the aileron cables were distributed sideways and elevator and rudder cables went to the back.
All nice in the open, so that you could have super-easy access for control.
The B-17 bomber i flew on had the same.
My daughter flew in one while holidaying in Cuba. The flight became rather hairy when they ran into bad weather and her companion, who spoke Spanish, could understand the conversation between the two pilots.
@@meijiturtle3814 The plane is so slow that landing on a water or a field is not a problem, the only real risk would be a lighning hiting it as its not made from metal so people in it are not protected like in metal plane where metal surface of the plane act like a Faraday cage...
There is an old joke that tower/air trafic like to do to the AN-2 pilots, they asking them did they took an old metal bucket with them. If the pilot knows the joke then he gonna say: Yes, we have a bucket onboard so we are visible on the radar screen.
Also in bad weather the bucket can be used for passengers that gonna get sick as the plane will be shaking a loot, but crashing is not so easy...
Ingenius ruzzian design, so ahead of it's time !
The accessible cable arrangement is the fore runner of HUD displays we use today.
You see any passenger could reach up and help guide the aircraft while the pilot was staring at the 1950's gauges, trying to discern which ones were actually working !
Thanks for posting !
@@Bialy_1the fuselage is aluminum monocoque…
Shame, AN2s are gorgeous and iconic aircraft...
STOLS in my opinion contrast favorably with helicopters .
Just left the same comment!
It was Lithuanian aircraft builder and constructor Antanas Gustaitis planes.
It's still a gorgeous and iconic aircraft. I hate 1930-1940s Germany but I still love their aviation. I just ignore the symbols like I will ignore the Z/V/O or whatever letter Russia makes up next on these AN-2s. I just have respect for the engineering involved.
@@johnwinter2252 it's more the case we're going to potentially lose all those airframes and parts...
No problem! Germany has equipped Ukraine with Gepard anti-air-tanks. Those are older models from the 1970s using cannons against planes. (Their radar and electronics have been updated.) They are good enough against those biplanes, and operate only at the cost of heavy bullets.
"Germany has equipped Ukraine with Gepard anti-air-tanks....They are good enough against those biplanes, and operate only at the cost of heavy bullets."
Only if they happened to be within their short range of fire they have. Ukraine is a huge country and Russian drones can come in from all directions.
Banderite bot.. Russia is unstoppable, over 40 countries United cannot even defeat Russia ..
Like 12 to 20 systems?
Good luck with that.
no problem germany doesn´t produce the munition for the gepard, switzerland does and guess what they want to stay neutral so gepard with no munition becomes a very heavy and expensive paper weight
I like how the cockpit glass forms a bit of a "bay window" on both the right and left, allowing the crew to look behind the plane fairly easily. Nice feature, have never seen such a thing. That way they can better observe loading and unloading, and crop spraying etc.
Interesting! I also have never seen that on any other plane. Creates drag but very useful for this type of slow moving plane.
I flew this plane on the right seat last summer during flight practice in our university. And this plane is extremely stable and easy to fly - you don’t need to control it, you just direct it to desired heading. It’s just like flying very stable FPV plane.
Also the only traditional fixed wing plane that does not have a stall speed. The AN-2 can actually remain in controlled flight while flying backwards if the headwinds exceed the speed of the aircraft.
@@FusionAmoeba Well any aircraft can do that.
@@FusionAmoeba Literally any plane can do that. It is Windspeed over the Wings, not absolute speed to the ground that maters.
@@canuckprogressive.3435 Tell that to a pilot of a Bowing 747 and see what he says !
@@welshpete12 I bet he could do it in slow flight in the jetstream!
1:30 that take off run was so short. I assume they had a considerable head wind, but my word. That was impressive.
My thoughts exactly. That’s STOL material
A great airplane, like the old DC-3.
The Bismarck was attacked and hit by Fairey Swordfish biplane torpedo bombers from the aircraft carrier HMS Ark Royal, also considered old planes at the time, but there slow speed and agility made them well suited to the task.
From the return of trench warfare to biplanes, this war is slowly regressing into WW1 isn’t it?
That one saw the Russian government collapse, so let's hope history repeats.
Keep making videos I've been watching them for so long you've definitely made this year a whole lot better
AN-2 is terrific plane. Lands and takes of everywhere. Flies slow and low enough to be missed by most radars. Fabric covered. Basis of parachute training....welll.... in half of the world. With modern avionics (and silenced engine...a bit) this *IS* monster of utility for special forces.
It sucks.
The AN-2 is basically a tractor with wings. It's not built for comfort, but it's built to allow it to land basically anywhere that's reasonably flat.
@@meskisable Great argument dude
Totally agree 💯 every gear has its place
@@meskisable you may say that, but it was a real work horse back in the day and much like the DC3 lasted well beyond its anticipated lifetime. Think you don't know much about planes dude.
Just outside of Kharkiv there is an old Soviet airplane boneyard of mostly stripped old aircraft in an overgrown field. It is one of my young nephew's favorite places to visit (or was, before the war) There is a couple of these old AN-2s planes there, ("Ants" they are called) missing most of their parts, but he likes them the best and climbs in them and pretends to fly them.
Actually this type of plane is still in use for agriculture, used for transport and crop dusting. They are sturdy planes.
We hope the war ends soon and Alexi can go back to being an 8 year old boy.
Sounds like Ukraine needs some more Gephard AA systems. The AN-2s are easy picking for bullets.
There are aircraft boneyards all over, you can see one flying into Odessa.
I wonder if the larger Phoenix Ghost drone might also be used in an anti-air capacity to counter these things. Hell maybe Switchblade would also do if it struck the font of one of these planes.
Even if Switchblade or Phoenix Ghost isn’t as cheap as a couple Gepard rounds they’re a lot easier to field and their use wouldn’t expose the locations of other high-value assets. Javelins and the like would also work but they’re more expensive than either Phoenix Ghost or Switchblade and should probably be saved to wipe out more heavily armored vehicles.
I watched a few weeks ago where a air transport company was using them to fly. Sorry I don't remember the towns names. The river was ?? Taya, I am sorry on the name.
Always interesting - thank you.
Very interesting how old and slow can confuse and defeat new and expensive. Thanks Mark. Love your content.
Antonov AN-2 the tractor of the skies. Easy to repair and can land and start from almost anywhere. Sad to see, that these planes get thrown away like that...
Я летал на таком. АН-2 может производить посадку без работы двигателя,это великолепный планер
Excellent points.
Thank you Mark.
What a shame to destroy these beautiful classic aircraft as expendable decoys.
It's not as if the world is about to run out of them.
It's as if the Bundeswehr suddenly decided to use the Ju-52 again. Great video!
The Junkers looks like a modern marvel compared to this thing.
@@kevinfox1780 I bet the Russians would not say no to some free Fieseler Fi 156 Storch's lol.
@@MusMasi They wouldn’t say no to some Fi 103’s (which would fit their tactical operations perfectly).
You've got me wondering how an updated Ju-52 with propjet engines might perform! Although a propjet intallation in the nose might be a bit of a noise issue!
Warfare has become so advanced that we are looping all the way back around to biplanes again
This makes me sad. An2s are amongst my favorite airplanes. They are incredibly safe and easy to maintain. And they were originally designed in Ukraine, albeit under Soviet domination, but they are a Ukrainian design nonetheless.
Yes, I agree! Sad to see them used this way.
Its Novosibirsk design airplane produced in Kiev
it was designed before antonov moved to kiev
Up close, they are actually pretty large, however, hard for even modern radars to reliably detect. Anecdotal - participating as a data collector in an exercise in the late 90s to explore procedural IFF issues, I got the opportunity to first hand observe inside a Patriot control van during an engagement cycle. A lot of activity, and several fast movers were easily spotted and (simulated) dispatched. As I was stepping out of the van to have a smoke break, I looked up to see an OPFOR AN-2, merrily flying along at about 250 feet, right over the Patriot deployment site. I exchanged a wave with the fellow looking out the open back door. Went back inside to verify - nope, they had not detected, much less targetted it.
I wonder if being fabric covered also gives it the same advantage the Swordfish biplanes had when they attacked the _Bismarck_. Many of the shells fired at them passed through without exploding.
Military radar will pick these up easy, it’s the opposite of a stealth aircraft. They’ll get shot down by stingers easy
velocity too low for detection otherwise targeting overloaded with civvie recreational planes is my guess.
the puroblem there was no calibration for lead for such low velocities the manufacturers of AA weapons (some Bofor, some Mauser) had never anticipated WW1 era speeds.
@@markiobook8639And that’s where the old M2 browning comes in
I was a US Army officer in South Korea during the 1980's. The AN-2 was considered a threat as a likely means for North Korea to insert special operations in plain clothes to conduct sabotage and even mislead fleeing refugees to choke bridgeheads. We thought this plane was ancient way back then.
How can this plane be more of a threat than any other plane during a cease fire?
@@ililililili9726 because they could paint it in ordinary farmer livery and pretend it’s normal farmers who accidentally went off course while dusting their crops when in reality they’re parachuting the best commandoes (although “best” is rather questionable) deep into enemy lines.
@@therealspeedwagon1451 k thanks
The An-2 is slow and low and can even fly backwards. Air defense radars cannot detect them normally.
@@Another-Address those air craft are to be considered "bomb trucks" and with JDAM-ER.....the masses of bombs delivered could rival Linebacker and Linebacker II from the Vietnam era. Imagine you want a breakthrough to exploit with a large fast mechanized force..."carpet bombing" as was done to break through the hedgerows of Normandy. This time though, the bombers would not have to fly over the target but high enough and far enough away from any threat from the orcs...then launch their tonnage of JDAMS and blow everything from Bakhmut to Azov Sea back to Hell where they came from. Once they get to the coast, The Putin Bridge will become the Kaput'n Bridge! and the entirety of all Ukrainian lands will be within the firepower of thousands of tons of ordnance.
Reminds me of how there were some bi planes able to torpedo some ship because they flew too slow for the AA guns to hit.
Mark your work is superb. I love you videos as history has always been of great interest to me.
Mark lies to you in every video. In this video he lied about the use of these planes by Azerbaijan. I suspect he knows the truth but chooses to hide it. Azerbaijan did not send them to Armenia, they were attacking Artsakh Republic. There were no Azeriturk pilots jumping off these planes right before dropping them on targets. Instead, Israel converted these planes into fully operational drones which they used to detect Artsakh air defense positions and target them with Israeli made and operated suicide drones. I suspect Russians learned from this Israeli tactic and made the same modifications to their An-2s.
In 2003, the unit I was assigned to found one of these at Baghdad International, dissassembled it and shipped it back to the States in the back of a C17. I rode back with it.
Based!!! What happened to it once it got stateside?
@@freedomfalcon recycled for scrap metal
Thanks Dr. Felton!
The AN-2 Is a tough bird. There's a guy here who takes one to airshows and does aerobatics with his.
It could have been a heavy fighter bomber in WWII. It could be something like a scaled down version of American AC47 or AC130 Gunships.
you mean like the first anti-infantry and materiel Junkers Ju87 B's, D's and G (tank buster) and the Henschel Hs129?
Yeah Germany already invented the entire US arsenal including cluster munitions, flying wings, drones, guided missiles, air-to-air missiles and fuel-air explosives. Time for USA to make something their captured Germans didn't invent.
Don't think you know what a fighter bomber is.
A few years ago, a German flew an AN 2 across the Atlantic via Scotland, Iceland, Greenland and Canada on to NYC. In the end he flew down the Hudson River and over the Statue of Liberty. Shows what these old ladies are capable of.
The An2, a most wonderful plane! For things like fire fighting, they have a stall speed of 25mph. So, pinpoint accuracy of water drop is a no brainer with these aircraft. Yet, they can also achieve a very fast dive that would throw off anti aircraft missiles. That, along with flares and also traveling at a slow speed, many missiles would not even hit them, they would either chase the flares or zip by because their onboard guidence system would be thinking that it should be traveling faster than it is.
That's not how SAMs work. This bi plane would be instantly killed by modern missiles let alone primitive ones. Even shoulder launched systems will be more than capable of downing these planes, just like how they are easily capable of downing drones and suicide drone craft. Modern systems can easily distinguish targets from flares through a variety of means these days.
@@anonypersona3189: Drones and other modern craft travel much faster than these planes and if it is traveling near it's stall speed, the computers that are programmed for faster targets will not fare so well with a very slow target. Even shouolder launched missiles still are programmed for much faster craft.
@@sonofeloah You said it could fly too fast for missiles, not too slow. Though I'm sure most manpads can still hit a helicopter when hovering. That's 0 mph, in case you can't work it out.
@@himoffthequakeroatbox4320: I said it could achieve a very fast dive. Most any type of projectile or aircraft in a steep dive would be traveling too fast to get a missile lock on it. In normal flight, it can travel at a very slow speed so that the high speed movement of the missiles with their guidance system programmed for fast moving object might not even recognize it as an aircraft and fly right on by.
@@sonofeloah*cough* AA gun *cough* machine gun how about if that more lower than helicopter so...
Makes perfect sense, why use a multi million $$ modern aircraft to flush out anti aircraft defences when you can do the same with something only worth a few hundred thousand $$. Plus these planes require less labour intensive maintenance, less pilot training and can land on roads or fields.
you can do it cheaper than that just attach radar beacons to descent size model R?C planes and send them in
Why didn't the Americans think of this during the Iraqi freedom war.
Oh that's right their equipment actually did what it was supposed to.
This is another clue that the Russian military is nothing more than a paper tiger and they're running out of paper.
*Only a few hundred thousand dollars? These planes don't cost nearly that much.
@@keithmoore5306 The thing is, I don't think that many, if any RC planes have that great of a range. Because of that, you can't send them far enough to get to anywhere wrohtwhile.
Azerbaijan did this on a large scale when they launched their invasion in 2020
How fascinating, thanks Mark
“Haha Gepard go BRRRRRRR”
-some one
Thank you Dr. Felton. Happy Holiday Season.
I feel very sad for the sacrifice of the beautiful AN2 in this role. They are eternal planes..
Brilliant ingenuity.
Good Video/Info.
When I saw the Biplane.
I was thinking the Russians were reinstating the Night Witches.
I've flown the An-2 MANY time over Cherno.
It's a formidable beast!
Great video by the way!
Very interesting
It seems the logical response is to dust off WW2 style flak guns and anti-air batteries that don't rely on million dollar missiles, pairing them with the more expensive systems.
That tactic of jumping of the plane right before reaching it's target could be something coming directly from red alert series
Although I was always wondering how no one has thought of converting older aircrafts to" suicide drones "🤔
IIRC John F Kennedy’s elder brother was killed testing out something similar in WW2
It was practiced, but not used operationally by the US during WW2. Beaten up bombers, like B-17 loaded with explosives was to be flown near the target, then the pilot will bail out and the plane will either be controlled by operator in another one, or just crash into target using autopilot. Check "Operation Aphrodite".
Germans in WW2 had a project, I believe "Mistletoe" that strapped smaller planes loaded with explosives, to a larger "mothership"
The big plane would fly it up and out to the target, then use explosive bolts to detach the suicide drone.
@@mattbite Didn't they have planes attached to other planes in WWII and one plane would be detached near the target and guided by the other plane to crash into it?
@@internetbodhi1009 didn't the Japanese do something similar but the *drone* was well manned?
Cheers Dr
Back in 2002, I visited Moscow to see some friends and they had arranged a trip to take a parachute jump at a nearby VDV military base (Воздушно-десантные войска России, ВДВ, romanized: Vozdushno-desantnye voyska Rossii, VDV).
I qualified as a freefall skydiver in 1983, so I tagged along with them as they took the course and although the instructor explained everything to them in Russian, I barely understood a fraction of what he said, but knew what he was teaching them. I jumped with them and the aircraft used on that military base was an old Antonov An-2 fitted with skis and wheels. The parachutes were conventional rounds with L slots to steer and a front mounted reserves. They used static lines for deployment and I was first out of the aircraft. I went through the rear door and spread to help the parachute open and it did, but my friends could not see this and they did not know that everything went fine. I saw them coming down after I'd landed in the snow, 1 metre thick, it was the middle of January. The An-2 was noisy, but it was a real pleasure to jump from such an aircraft. I've since realized that they are relatively cheap and there are plenty of them, but doubt that there will be many in Russia after the conflict ends.
Thank you, keep up the good work, love your content ❤
I need to admit something to you ...
I tried to wipe your profile picture off my screen with my index finger before I realized what's going on ..
@@SlavMarine gotcha
My grandfather was a pilot during the soviet times and he flew with an AN-2 (kukuruzņik)
What is the best translation to English for that? Corn thing?
In poland the kukuruznik however is used for the Polikarpov Po2. It mans sth alike the corn thing, suggesting it is a kind of crop duster.
@@aGentleUser Yup, first time i see someone calling AN-2 a "Kukuruźnik" - in Poland we call AN-2 just "Antek" :)
@@aGentleUser i knew it as well
@@frost3027 corner idk
That is a smart way to break and exhaust your enemy military budget on the cheap.
Great news, keep up the good work 💪
A wonderful plane and workhorse, if used in anger should be re-named An-2 War horse! Saw one up and close during an air show, and i was surprised by its sheer size. A machine from another world, totally love it!
Another brilliant video thanks 😊
Thanks brother I do love your channel
Enjoyed your video and I gave it a Thumbs Up
I've done lots of sports parachute jumps from the Antonov-2 in Europe. It may be slow but it's reliable.
So?
Before retiring earlier this year, my daily commute took me past a small airport that borders Québec highway 20. For the past several years a yellow AN-2 has been based there. What videos don't render is how big this thing really is.
This. I saw one _up close and personal,_ a few years ago, at an airfield in Austria. It was considerably larger than I had imagined, and extremely LOUD!
a friend of mine had one and we flew in it quite a bit he crashed it last year here in california all survived but the plane didnt tank of a plane and very thirsty on fuel
Indeed. Never see one myself but they look pretty chunky.
@CaptHollister Really? Where?
@@ADAPTATION7 A Beloeil, le long de la 20.
It's a wonderful documentary coverage about an AN2 biplane that suspects use as drones by Russian military efforts against Ukraine. Nowadays, thanksDr. Mark Felton for sharing its
It gets more hysterical by the day! 😂😂😂
The U.S. Army already anticipated this scenario back in the 1980s and did radar testing at White Sands at the same time with Russian Radar units against MIG-15, MIG-17, MIG-21 and PF series to see what the signature looked like on the screen. The AN2 did not show up at all and passed though the range without being detected on the Russian Radar sets of that time period. This is the reason the German flakpanzer Gepard are being moved into target areas to deal with this threat.
That's because the radars have a speed filter to ignore flying objects that are flying below the stall speed of most threat aircraft. This allows the radar to not pick up fast moving cars and birds. Lower the speed filter and the AN-2 shows up just fine
Why those cheeky bastards
Well here's the answer for Ukraine, a good forward observer/aircraft spotter system. Don't trust the radar 100%, get some eyeballs on the target before you expend that expensive ordnance. Once an AN-2's been identified send an attack helicopter (if they have any) to shoot it down with gunfire, or bring it down with good old barrage flak. As an aside, it was barrage flak that brought down most American military aircraft over North Vietnam, not SAM's.
A good and interesting video Dr. Felton on a completely unexpected subject!
imagine if they bought piston engine fighters back into service to deal with these? It wont happen but it would be............interesting I guess.
That's basically how the Shaheds are being shot: they are slow and loud, vulnerable even to small arms - there are footages of Ukraininans downing them with ye old Kalashnikovs - and their only value is to make Ukraininas spend more valuable equipment to intercept them. But Antonov will apparently be even easier to shoot down with ye good old stinger, with which the frontline is now quite saturated. Armenians had no time to adapt - Ukraininas already have more than enough experience.
I woud have thought good old fashioned radar controlled (or othewise)Triple AA would have been the answer to that or a good old fashioned Bofors as once fitted to British Minesweepers,modern weaponry being the Chain Gun or Gatling Gun.
@@MusMasi There's a number of propeller-driven counter-insurgency aircraft on the market now, not piston-engined but propjet engined. Those would be ideal. They're also reasonably priced and easy to maintain.
@@wayneantoniazzi2706 something like the Pucura or whatever its called from Argentina? I just remember because they used a version of it in the Falklands war and I think its still used by some south american countries.
Great idea
@Mark Felton it would be very interesting to compare WW2 war in Ukraine with current war. It seems that the same cities are being disputed (maybe due to terrain of the battle field)
This channel never disappoints!
Well that's interesting, and worrying.
Months ago I wondered about the utility of the US providing the Cessna O-2 Skymaster, Rockwell OV-10 Bronco, or the Cessna OA-37 Dragonfly, for battlefield transport / insurgency / ground support in Ukraine. I didn't think of using old aircraft as cheap drones packed with explosives, but why not?
Another example why the world really should properly support Ukraine now - the longer this war goes on the more dangerous it becomes.
I used to live near a small airport and aircraft would line up for the runway and descend just 10 m - 20 m above our house. Never would I have expected to see and hear this old clunky radial beast, it looks a lot bigger in person!
Very clever idea
Marvelous stuff and delivered in a completely neutral style. Bravo!
You definitely have a way of turning the screws of thought on interesting topics Mr Felton
great idea
This is proof that brains and not bloated military budgets is what makes real difference!
If it wasn't so sad it would be hilarious
Ukraine has 300 Soviet-origin ZSU-23-4 Shilka self-propelled anti-aircraft gun systems, and now 30 newer Gepard systems from Germany. These systems have cannons that fire shells into the air that are either intended for direct impact, or are set to wait a specific time and then explode in the air to send shrapnel in all directions so that a direct hit is not necessary. These shells are far cheaper than missiles and Ukraine would be wise to use them instead.
ukraine had.....
@@Melkor54 From Ukrainian videos i know they got newest Polish Pilica short range AA systems that using old ZU-23-2 cannons with modern radars, optical electronic systems and digital control of the gun movement...
They also should have plenty of old ZU-23-2 that are manualy operated and perfect for helicopters and this type of target. Poland new subcaliber ammunition for 23mm have effective range of 3000m...
Does that not mean that these countries are at war with Russia?
Regarding the Gepard: If only the ammo wouldn't be produced by and in Switzerland, and ONLY there, as far as I know. Sadly, the Gepard doesn't use run off the mill ammo.
This is a massive problem for supply, as Switzerland doesn't want this very ammo delivered to war areas, because it sees it's neutrality endangered by that. Somehow I do ask myself: Why do they even produce it, of they don't want to deliver it, when it's needed the most?
That's something our current German government and the ones before it got heavily flamed for this year. What if we ourselves got directly into a war again? Would Switzerland supply us then or would they by then argue as well, that they are neutral and choose to not supply us with the ammo it's been contracted to build for our weaponry?
It's been discussed (I believe) to get the production lines back in our country or in our country at all, but that's something you can't do within a few weeks or months.
@@wiedapp Please inform yourself again. Ammo used by Gepard can be produced in at least 4 places in the world.
Resourceful indeed
Me playing war thunder trying catch these planes is like a deadly goose chase
Simple problems require simple solutions I would think, Gepards would be able to easily deal with these planes using regular ammo which would be a lot cheaper, alternatively Stingers would be everywhere offering a pretty cheap and effective counters as well so I think the effectiveness of these planes would be pretty limited.
Think if Russia would seriously use this approach then NATO could supply them with some old school anti-air weaponry as well.
A stinger might be more expensive than a plane like this making that a loss as far as attrition goes. I dont think nato needs to supply anything. There are many soviet aa guns like the zu-23-2 I think
2x 23mm would be even cheaper, and there is more of it in Ukraine.
Currently one new stinger missile costs between 400 000 to 500 000 USD. Back in the 1980s the price was only 40 000 USD, but inflation and possibly upgrades have made them more expensive.
Gepards use air-burst ammunition, not ordinary rounds. For night time (when most of the attacks/strikes happen) they will also require some tracer rounds as well. Combine that with the fuel costs (to constantly relocate them depending on what needs to be protected) and unfortunately it is not cheap at all to combat suicide vehicles.
The best solution for all sides is to negotiate a ceasefire, like the Ukrainian strategy for the last 8 years. Currently they seem to not be willing to negotiate and think they might survive the winter on just propaganda and Western weapons.
However heat, water, electricity and food would be key during the next few months.
@@spinningsquare1325 Think a Stinger missile is like $40k, which is no money at all when it comes to a war, and probably worth it tenfold as not only do you need to consider the value of the target you're shooting, but also the damage that target can do, which is easily millions worth of damages to infrastructure and of course human life, which would even make a million dollar missile a good trade if it wasn't for the limited number of them.
yeah, 30 gepards would easily cover hundreds of kilmoters of front line and t border. they will surely work all the time as well and all spare parts from 70s germany would also be widely available in ukraine all the time so they will be reliable as hell./
The Antonov AN-2 was basically a Russian Stearman, a sturdy single engined Bi-Plane first built in the 1920s as a commercial aircraft for mail routes and as a military trainer. Both planes have a reliable rotary engine, sturdy airframe and bi-wings for short take offs and maneuverability. There are still a lot of bi-planes flying as dusters everywhere in America, and as bush transporters in Alaska. Sometimes an old design lives on simply because it was a good design to begin with!
Not really! The An-2 weighs about 4x the Stearman, has a powerplant producing about 3x the hp, and carries more than a dozen pax enclosed rather than just 2 in open cockpits. They are both biplanes, with radial engines, and both very popular but the similarities end there I'm afraid. Yes the Russians copied western tech but not in this case, the An-2 is a unique aircraft. Stall speed 27kts ffs!!!
@@Paul-dv4dr The idea of a reliable aircraft that could take off and land on short, rough airstrips was what the Stearman was designed for. The AN-2 was designed for the same reason, but with a bigger payload. It seems weird that in our modern world there is still a place for biplanes!
They have radial engines. The cylinders rotate with the prop on rotary engines. The crankshaft rotates with the prop on radial engines.
@@filster1934 I've always called them rotaries because of the crankshaft arrangement. But then I'm a mechanic not an aircraft expert.
A few months ago I had to go hospital because I essentially broke my brain and could not sleep at all or stop panicking for a second (I won’t go into why, some people might be able to guess), but I discovered mark Felton videos, and going through pretty much every one of his videos was the only thing that kept me sane and gave me some sort of relief. I will never forget that as it was horrific but these videos were the only positive thing about it, and I imagine I will not forget that either.
Wow this is fascinating
Answer was found months ago, around the time of drone swarms. Flak ammunition and its variants.
What is old is new again!
Love the AN-2. Saddening to see it used like this.
Decoys
Me and the boys rushing with i-15 against jets in War thunder
Someone once commented that they have Mark's theme music as the ringtone for their stepmother. That was over a year ago and I still hear it every time 😅
This recycling of old technology is genius and a great tactic. But the Flakpanzer Gepard cares little if it is a missile or a biplane.
But, do they have ammunition?
There are 20 to 30 Gepards, range of them is up to 2km. Whil that cover 1000km of the front?
Thats the reason why sometimes even ukranian drones pass thru russian AA system.
The proper question is how many Gepards they will need. Ukraine does not have enough to cover more than Kiev if you consider their range and their low numbers overall. The entire point of these drones is to require more manpower and expense to purchase more conventional Anti-Aircraft as well as observers.
War is more often won in the factory and farm, not the battlefield.
That's why the US was the deciding factor in World War II.
Not Russia
bedroom as well
25 years ago I worked (as an engineering intern) at an aircraft factory in Canada. We made tiny 2 seater planes with bombardier snowmobile engines. They were small enough to not require a pilots license. The Indian Airforce bought up our entire production capacity for years. They would take our tiny planes, put a little missile on each one and send them to patrol the borders against the jet fighters that Pakistan had purchased. India could buy a thousand of these little planes for the cost of one single fighter jet, and it was really the missiles that did the work anyway... The little planes could cover a lot more ground, flew slower for better visibility, etc. Excellent strategy. As far as I know, the jet fighters always chickened out when facing hundreds of air born missile launchers.
That's quite interesting, thank you for sharing that
Very bright!