Thanks for watching. For the record, I’m not saying the X1Cs are permanent paperweights. They’re just out of commission until I find the time to repair them. I’m perceiving it to be a difficult process given how tightly integrated these machines are, but I might be mistaken. I have reviewed the instructions on the Wiki for replacing the heated bed and it appears to be quite involved, but perhaps it’s easier than it looks. Cost wise, the replacements are very reasonable: around $120 for a full bed assembly.
Bro. You made a video bashing the serviceability of the them without even contacting their support team first? 😂. By stating that nonsense, I assume everything else you said was nonsense.
@ @ it’s all documented on the Wiki, so I know roughly what’s involved. It doesn’t look like an insignificant task which is why I haven’t gotten around to it. Contacting support would just be for a warranty claim to save the cost of the replacement parts.
I do agree with the complexity of disassembly, since I already got the hotend, extruder assembly replaced(after spending couple of hours trying to recover them). The Lidar on X1C makes for a no tune, print anything for prototype purposes(unless you edit a bunch of gcode to bypass unwanted procedures for production). It unnecessarily increases complexity(when lidar/camera error pops up from time to time), and additional time to every print. The best I know was a Lulzbot, with its direct extruder, although it is lost in eternity. I do love P1S's no wifi, no bamboo studio not even registered🤫, but prints like a tank, with just the gcode loaded onto an industrial microsd card, except for one firmware bug(resolved in a later firmware🤯), that can be easily worked around.❤👍
@@ygk3d You also likened Bambu printers to disposable tech, complete with stock footage of shredded circuit boards and allusions to the iPhone's lack of repairability while nuzzling up on Prusa's jock. Then you go after Bambu's "shoddy support" at 10:47, but you said yourself you haven't contacted them. And if/when Prusa goes out of business, I challenge you to find a complete third party toolhead. Or their PCBs. Go ahead, go find them now even. Rethink this video. Consider pulling and fixing it. I won't see anything you ever produce ever again, since I'll be blocking this channel from my recommendations next time I get the chance... (And I own a P1S, an X1C, and an XL). Oh, I see - You'd throw out a P1S if you run into the slightest hiccup. Got it. Dude, you have some brown on your nose. Did Bambu decline to send you review units or something?
@ you’ve misinterpreted. I love Bambu printers. They’re my daily drivers. Perhaps some of my statements were misinterpreted. I wasn’t implying Bambu’s customer service is shoddy, just that Prusa’s is not. And the bit about most tech products being disposable was a general statement of the industry. I’m pretty certain I’ll have sold off all of my current generation printers 5 years from now. They won’t immediately end up as e-waste but eventually the tech will be so dated that nobody will want them. I tried to be pretty even in my assessment here, saying both positive and negative about both brands. If you don’t like my content, that’s your loss.
One thing that gets missed from the conversation also imo is that Prusa is about the only company that’s not based in china, that’s a way bigger deal than people give credit.
Is it? At the end of the day, is the average consumer finding a product that is technically better in almost every way, then scrapping it for something from europe because they hate china. How is DJI doing so well then?
@@morbus5726 Because there is very little competition. You're missing how big DJI is - they have enough resources to build things at huge loss just to test the market, something no one else can do, and getting profitable in drone market is a feat on its own. As a proof, ask people around you (provided you don't live in drone racers neighbourhood) if the know any other company even remotely connected to drones. Most common answer you will hear is Red Bull...
I think you overestimate the market share that Prusa has. According to Prusa, they have never had more than 10% market share. Creality was the company that lost the most market share to Bambu Lab. Prusa is moving towards industry because things like good support or certifications are more important there than in the consumer market. As a company that manufactures in Europe, Prusa can't compete on price unless they fire people and move production to China. So they don't have much of a choice.
I think people sometimes miss one important fact about Prusa Research. The company does not really have any venture capital behind it. If nothing changed 85% of the company is still owned by Průša brothers. It is family business and it is not as profit driven as companies backed by capital investors demanding growth and profit almost at all cost. Dont forget that Prusa i3 is really part of RepRap project and full name is Prusa Mendel i3 with whole design released under GPL license. The "Original Prusa i3" was called original because there where more clones of it then Prusa Research ever built. 😁
@@Keveira So you are saying that company that established desktop 3D printers as what they are today and could not be matched in reliability and print quality for given price for 5+ years lacks vision. Did I understand you wrong or something?
@@Keveira That makes zero sense, professionalism does not depend on the familial status of the founders. "Vision" and "forward-thinking" are just meaningless buzzwords as they are making 3d printers and will continue to release more 3d printers that will incrementally improve on the performance of the previous models.
Nope. According to market date Prusa still had 39% in 2022/2023 and Bambu had 30% along side with Ultimaker. You might not forget that prusa does also sell industrial machines. The consumer market is not really a good way to go for a company because, people don´t want to spend a lot of money, they are far too often picky, you have consumer protection in many countries. In the B2B Area a comany can make much more money.
This guy states that the Prusas just needed a little maintenance to get them going, but the Bambi’s are paperweight because he doesn’t want to do the maintenance..
Prusa is reliable, made in EU/US, mostly open with a open firmware, nobody is using you data for research, and you can trust the team for support and help. That's why you are paying a "premium".
"Reliable" - "you can trust the team for support and help" Hopefully you dont end up having the experience I did when I bought a MK4 at launch and they sent me a total lemon. Full of extruder and heatbed issues and couldnt print a thing. Support dragged me through the ringer for my full warranty period even admitting on record the machine was a lemon but that they wouldnt replace it because, ahem, "its better for *us* to just send you a part than a whole machine." Again, they admitted *on record* that the machine was a lemon but instead of replacing it they just ran out my whole warranty period looking for the one part to replace. I even said I would pay for shipping and send back my busted one, but nope. Now I'm out of warranty buying parts out of pocket just trying to get it to even work. I will never make the mistake of buying Prusa again. On a side note, they do collect data like everyone else under the the whole, "help us improve?" guise. It's up to them to decide how your data "helps them improve" so... I guess pick the answer you want to believe?
@@Giskard_Reventlov Start a 3d print manufacturer in EU or USA and let me know instead of pulling random number. Just send a step file to an american manufacturer for 5k pieces VS china and let me know if the difference is 15% lol
@@Giskard_Reventlov 15% more is not a premium. Companies can pay double or triple for a machine if it's reliable and easy to fix even if it doesn't have the cool features.
There is more to this story. This is a fight between "corporate greed of walled in gardens" and "freedom to own modify and repair". To me its not about the money, (although I do realize it is for almost all consumers) but about the culture of 3d printing and innovation. We have seen what happens when we allow companies to take away right for repair or modify and in the end it ends up costing everything and you own nothing. I own my Prusas outright and its almost impossible for someone to position themself between me and my printers (unless you are in my kitchen) and as an extension I feel own a bit of Prusa brand as well. This is to contrast the feeling of some other companies where you feel exactly the opposite where you do buy the product but all the updates, software or consumables are proprietary and mandatory (think some drone or phone manufacturers). This is why I want to defend Prusa as a brand, you might label it silly, fair enough, but it comes from a deeper set of beliefs of how we need to behave as consumers, and vote with out wallets.
You are absolutely free to do so, but the Bambu Lab enterprise (two companies in China plus Maker World run by a third company in Singapore) was created for business success. The CEO recently said that a million printers were shipped. Something is working...
@@michaels3003 You're missing the point or I don't really get your position. I recently got a Bambu Labs P1S. Really nice printer, really good experience. But what michaels said worries me. What happens if bambu decides that i need to pay a subscription for the apps/online features? A fee for cloud print jobs? I needed to bind my printer to an account for all of the online features. I could still use the SD-Card, but that company has the primary purpose of profit If they decide to switch to subscriptions, I need to pay or inconvenience myself to use a piece of kit that i purchased and i want to own fully.
"corporate greed of walled gardens" - there's nothing inherent to walled gardens that makes them just vacuum up more money than other business models. Otherwise it would be a whole lot more common. Especially since the point of for-profit businesses is, well... If you aren't into the walled garden model, cool, don't invest in any of them. But lets cut down on the nonsense hyperbole. It's so tiring while undermining anything reasonable you have to say.
I hate it when I go to print something with my Bambu Printers and the CEO air drops into my living room between me and my printers. I'm totaling getting a Prusa now.
As a hobbyist of close to 10 years now I was fairly excited when I first heard about Bambu's printers and how easy they would be to use. But due to Bambu Lab's behavior since launching, I will not touch one of their machines. Most of those reasons have been mentioned in this video so no need to restate them here. Instead I will choose to pay a little more and support a company that gives back to the maker community instead of stealing from creators for their own benefit. Not to mention the top notch reliability of a Prusa and the fact I can make any and all repairs myself. Despite my feelings toward Bambu, I am glad they are pushing the market and I would actually recommend one of their lower end models to someone who is simply clueless about 3D printing and just wants to print some fun little toys. Anyone who is more serious about 3D printing as a hobby I would recommend a Prusa. Sort of like the difference of a tabletop player buying figures pre-painted and those who paint miniatures as the hobby itself. I am not a business user so I have no opinions in that regard.
@@Keveira Well, several are mentioned as I said in the video, but here ya go. Firstly they launched with users being forced to send prints through the Internet to their servers in China. Then they had a debacle where many of the printers started printing on their own because of the afore mentioned prints going through their servers. They also incorporate a lot of open hardware design but do not give back to the open hardware community. Then they started a print model web site which was obviously the stolen code base of another popular print model site and in order to populate it they web scraped data and files from other web sites without the permission of the model designers or the sites they scraped from. I don't have to have 3D printers to survive so I choose to have standards for the companies I will buy from. Personally I don't think having those ethics standards is silly.
Your MK3's may be old, and slower, but they are reliable, still working, still getting updates, and have confidence you can buy parts for it for a very long time.
They sat gathering dust for a long time but recently I had a project that could make use of them and they have been slowly but surely cranking out parts.
@@ygk3d Its amazing the comments that you get regarding the Bambu and Prusa printers. One was designed to be fast & inexpensive as its primary, and the other was designed to be sustainable and repairable first. They both serve a purpose, and they are both good printers. I own both too (well, not the CoreOne yet). People just have to be honest what they are getting in the short and long term.
@@ygk3d only gathering dust because you didn't hit the print button on them? even if their slower they still work... this sounds more like poor planing than anything.
I don't know ever since we got our bambu labs I only used our prusa printers once. The immense speed difference and reliable print quality is miles different. We might upgrade our mk3s to the m4 kit which will likely make the machine use able again but the ability to print a quality part for a client 2 to 3x faster is insane value as a company as well as KNOWING it will print 100% or atleast 95% success
Has anyone mentioned the fact that the Prusa Core One is much more compact than most (all?) other printers that offer roughly the same build volume? That makes it very attractive to me as a complement to my current Prusa MK4 and Voron V0.
Is it though? Being able to fit a whole spools speaks to how much space in the sides there is. It doesn't seem notably more compact than anything else and they again go with the weird non uniform xy
@@BeefIngot The space on the sides comes from the Stepper motors which makes printers much bigger than the print bed. They optimize space using which makes the total footprint, including the spool smaller and helps with heating. So, quite a good solution.
@bern71 That doesn't check out given many printers use a wrap around design for the motors. I feel like people bend over to find everything Prusa to be somehow genius
It is not the steppers, is the kinematic that lays on top of the filament rolls. It hast to be bigger than the print bed. Also part of the print head exceeds the sides of the print bed. Prusa basically saw there was space inside the chamber not being used and put it outside keeping the envelope
Prusa needs a 350x350x350 color combo killer and the Core One isn’t it. It’s just a stop gap to a longer term problem. Nobody cares about a nice nook for their filament or a built in tool cabinet. Convenient, but the market doesn’t want gimmicks. They want a bigger build plate and color.
What the community really want is fast and large idex printers. Maybe nobody is saying but till one appear with a volume of +300mm +800mm speed but also doest need any work from the user to align anything and offset is always perfect for both nozzles then everyone will leave these ams systems
I'm hoping they will scale up the Core One to a larger bed size at some point. But it's pretty sweet that they offer an upgrade from Mk4s to Core One, which explains the print volume. And it's nice that they managed to squeeze out a little extra volume on the same plates. As for color, the MMU3 has been performing pretty well for me. They need to improve the usability of that thing; compared to the AMS it is a real pain to load filament into that thing. There's a few aftermarket options to do away with the buffer, which makes for easier loading and a smaller footprint.
Prusa versus Bambu is a religious war. Bambu supplanted Prusa less in technology than they did in conversion of religious fanatics. I don't own either, but I'd never buy any Bambu product because I disagree with their disregard for my privacy and security, as well as their overall disdain for intellectual property. I also don't like how they built their proprietary closed garden atop a mountain of open source development.
Wait so rather than simply replace a part and get a Bambu printer working again you'll just toss it? That seems insane! I have 3 X1C's each with over 1000 hours and no major issues at all. So far I have been able to fix and repair anything needed. Bambu has a great detailed Wiki on how to fix anything on the machine. I started with Prusa and loved them but they are just too $$ for what you get and I just want results and Bambu is doing that at the moment. I am still confused why you can't fix those 2 printers though!
This dude is ridiculous. A force bed sensor is $5. He will sideline a $700 or$1200 printer than spend $5 and follow the wiki or $120 for a new heat bed? but he had no issues dropping 4-5k on an XL and build it ? Me thinks his reasoning is beyond suspect and borders on ridiculous. a single heatbed tile for the XL is $23 x16= $368
@@damiengvideos4337 definitely not tossing them in the bin. Just saying they are unusable until I find time to repair them and I’m a bit intimidated by the process. I’m probably overthinking it. It might not be as bad as I’m anticipating.
@@No0o0o0o0o0 it’s not an issue of cost. It’s an issue of time. I’m perceiving it to be a difficult process given how tightly integrated the printer is. But I could be mistaken. I’ll tackle it at some point and find out.
I hate downtime. Prusa gives me the confidence that I will always get my printers up up and running if they ever go down. I also know I can always get ahold of Prusa support.
The problem is for a given comparable prusa machine you can buy 2 Bambu machines so the confidence (not based in evidence as multiple print farms have shown the Bambus to be just as if not more reliable) dies with the fact you can just have more.
Ignore that guy, hes a certified bambu shill that has zero experience with prusa. Bambu's are referred to as "easy bake vorons" for the very reason that they are considered throwaways when broken.
I actually think this confidence is rather mispaced. There's any number of manufacturers of clone/replacement parts for Bambu given just how popular those machines have become, and if Bambu stops offering genuine well priced replacement parts, there's guaranteed to be more. And on the other hand Prusa sells relatively fewer printers and has also steered hard towards proprietary parts and abandoned open-source hardware - the MK4 and Core One are no longer open source. Between the two Prusa would still be my choice because less locked down, but honestly i would choose neither.
I'm still on the Prusa side of thins. I really don't like the security / privacy concerns with the Bambu, and I already hate how much filament I waste doing multi-color with MMU3. The Bambu wastes a ton more. I'm eyeing an XL5T, but also hoping it gets an update soon.
For me multi head is the only way I’m comfortable doing multi material. I don’t know how people stomach wasting half their filament just for some colors on a sculpture that, let’s be real here, would look MUCH better off a resin printer. Unless you need a design for engineering work I’d say a single filament is probably your best option.
It's not about being first to market, but doing it right. We've seen multiple Chinese manufactured printers that are fire hazards, and their first response was to downplay the danger, and only did something after being called out on it.
I'm still on a Tevo Tarantula... One of those chinese fire hazards... Altough, I don't remember it shipping back in 2017 with a magnetic print bed, a Hemera XS revo extruder, a Misumi linear rail for the bed or any of the other thousand little things I upgraded.
@@krollmond7544 Bambu didn't downplay the danger at all with the A1. The power coord issues were a rarity and were only recalled as a safety precaution. They probably suffered more reputation damage from an over safe A1 recall versus just downplaying the danger.
interesting, how old are the X1C's? I'm curious if there's a change in quality or just flukes, my two have 2,700+ and 1,900+ hours each and I've only had to replace Bowden tubes, cutters, unjam an extruder because I used old brittle filament in it, and clean the lidar camera a bunch of times (in addition to regular leadscrew lubing and maintenance) I guess I'm lucky, but I know people who have entire X1C farms with similar luck
They're maybe a year and a half old. I have others that are still running strong. It's possible that these units were just lemons, because, like you say, many people have far exceeded 1,000 hours of printing with minimal issues.
My X1C is on about 2500 and still working like charm. A1 about 1500 and still no problem, A1 mini about 600+ and no problem. And all parts are on bambu store.
My Bambu has been printing no stop for 46 years now, and it still goes great, no problems no maintainance... This is an absolutely organic comment, and it's perfectly natural that every friggin time anyone mentions a problem with a Bambu printer 90% of the comments are "My Bambu was used to build the piramid of Giza and still works no problem."
Right? I am nearing 3000 hours with my X1 and the only thing I've had to change was a hotend. All parts are listed on the website and a simple video watch shows you how to tear them down and put them back together. It's easy.
There are lots of ways for Chinese companies to get government subsidies. For example, it’s possible to get free office space. If you’re using semiconductors, you can benefit from subsidized domestic chips (China’s response to the US semiconductor embargo was to pump billions of dollars in to domestic chips). There are even ways for companies to recover loses from the government in certain cases. I suspect Bambu is a beneficiary of these subsidies, meaning they are able to sell for low margins in order to win market share and force competitors out of business. This may sound fine, as we consumers are benefiting, but there is a long term threat. China is no longer content making stuff for Western and Japanese brands who then get the lion’s share of the margins. I don’t know that there’s a central government level strategy here, but in any case, the net effect will be Western brands will be forced to close, with significant economic impacts, and a reduction in consumer choice. I also have it on good authority that Bambu uses similar shady marketing tactics as DJI (Bambu is funded by DJI’s investment arm), where they’ll employ people to smear the competition (DJI reportedly has a 50 person “black ops team” who are employed to post negative comments about their competitors). Is this the kind of behavior we want to reward?
@@JonS I'm disappointed to see you spreading such insane conspiracies. It started out fine though I should point out that their initial investments were public and you can see it directly so no reason to assume, but gets really insane by the end. You're at the same level as saying Prusa has a bit farm where funnily enough comments look more like that's true than they've ever looked like that's true for Bambu and they've looked that way from before Bambu ever existed.
@ I was at a company that was on the receiving end of DJI disinformation. One year, customers noticed a strangely large number of negative comments online about our new product. A few of them were able to trace back where they originated from (they weren’t covering their tracks back then). As I said, I have it on good authority that Bambu uses the same tactics. And that good authority is not just a random commenter on the internet.
@@JonS "And that good authority is not just a random commenter on the internet." It most certainly is. Your story quite frankly goes off into the deep end of delusion. It would be equally as believable if you said you worked as a spy for a 3 letter agency; that is to say that there is literally no evidence, proof or reasoning justifying any of this crazy claim.
@@JonS You as far as anyone could possibly discern are simply spreading FUD on the internet. Fanciful stories about proof you pinky promise totally exists but no one else knows about and which cant be shared.
As far as anyone could possibly discern this is simply rumours being spread on the internet. Fanciful stories about proof someone pinky promises totally exists but no one else knows about and which cant be shared.
I had a heat bed sensor problem on my P1S, contacted support and in about a week I had a new heat bed. Took less than an hour to replace and I’m 1000+ hours with it. I’ll buy your X1Cs if you’re gonna throw them out
1k hours and your allready experiencing MAJOR failures in your printer... and you consider that a win? my mk3s+ had 6k print hours when i sold it and was printing allmost like new only changed the nozzle and gave it lube/grease...
@@1bonebreaker1 I don't know why all the people fighting in the comment but I went and looked at what is the heat bed sensor and it was 5$ thing and when I looked at it at prusa website for their printers it was sold out. I'm not fanboy for either companies but I own A1 and I'm happy with it since it was affordable and plug and play I only lubed the Y axis so far since it remind me every month or so. people should stop being fan boys and just let the companies fight to produce better products. if we stick to one side and contune buying without looking logically not emotionally we only getting the short end of the stick if there no competing there is no need for companies to improve their products since they have crazy fanboys who will buy their products even if it's not the best. I would gladly trade my A1 if I was able to get better printer with same price but better features, reliability, and availability of spare parts. and not to forget the ease of use. I only care about my own self as an end user.
My MK3S+ has printed well over 10,000 hours and all it has needed are hotend thermistors and a couple print fans. That is pretty crazy that a Bambu heatbed is shot after a fraction of what my Prusa has done.
For me, prusa takes it for a few specific reasons, if prusa stops existing, much of their machines can be replaced with off the shelf parts, bambu on the other hand is majority proprietary. prusa is made in europe with better working regulations and wages. prusa has great customer care and their up gradability is unbeaten in the market. As well as all that, prusa came from the open-source and built on it. bambu took from the open sauce, made it proprietary, using it to profit for themselves wile giving nothing back. i know my prusa is gonna work and keep printing at a good solid speed reliably, their not the fastest but with relatively little modding they can hold their own. If I need something done quick, i look to my voron .2 that can accelerate at twice the speed of a bambu and is half the price, as well as being completely open source and easily replaceable.
I'm totally with you on the issue, but I think that even European Companies HAVE to be competitive. Their whole market strategy can't be based all on petiness from customers. The same with electric cars unfortunatelly, Volkswagen (Vehicles of the people, literally) is selling EVs for 40k knowing they'll be the only one allowed in 6 years. Why shouldn't I buy a chines SUV EV that cost half the price and is genuinly better? Same with bambu, remember their response didn't come yet to the Prusa Core One. Their printers were released 2 years ago. I honestly think prusia underdelivered here. This printer with no easy multi color printing and somewhat a weirderd build volume already is not up to standard for today. I think the competition is once aganin gonna be blown away. Remember those guys come from DJI. DJI has virtually no competition, they even took on the GoPro market because the Westeners were so fucking incompetent. So too little too late from prusa.
@@lorenzolupica8833 European firms can never compete over the price tag alone, because if you care for your workers and your environment its more expensive then if you do not. Top that with "optimizing the conditions" in a country and you stand no chance. I think Prusa sits in a niche where they cater the needs of tinkerers and the niche is so big, that they can't manufacture enough goods (some Prusament is always sold out). And the tinkerer in me really likes the core one - while it may not be the right thing in a professionell environment, if you have upgraded your MK3 to MK4 and MK4s, you now can go the next step all while owning exactly one printer. So Prusa is not for one to start 3d printing as cheap as possible, but for people who care a bit more about non-shady practices and are up to pay premium for that on their hobby.
Totally agree, just want to add that Prusa was there for 3D printing development pretty much from the start, and if Bambu, Creality, and other even exists is because Prusa did most of the R&D in the first place and everything they've done was Open Source, they allowed the "cheap" 3D printing to be a thing, without them we coul still be stuck in the old rep/rap era where everything about 3D printing was DYI. Yes they are not ahead like they used to be, but products and longevity is good, and until now they never let customer down, with upgrade path after every big design update so you're never completely outdated. Not sure your Bambu X1 can become an X1+ / X2 whenever this thing comes out...
That may have been true at some point, but the "off the shelf components" business ain't true anymore. They aren't open source anymore. If Prusa goes under, unless they release their source, there's no replacing their electronics.
@taylorlandry641 those components are just as good, look at vorons, they are entirely off shelf parts that can beat their proprietary machines. As far as I can see thd only reason they do it is ease of manufacturing and to control the fixability of their products forcing you to buy replacements from them
all BambuLab printers support a LAN-only mode where it is not connected to anything outside of your own local network. You can still send prints over to your printer via the local network but don't have any cloud capability (the App becomes useless). You can also just use the micro SD-card.
Here's my take on my recent dive into the world of 3D printing: Just a few months ago, I decided to finally pull the trigger on buying a 3D printer. It was an exciting time with the Prusa MK4S and Bambu models dominating the market. After doing my research, I found that both printers deliver similar output and quality, though Bambu usually comes at a lower price point. For me, the decision wasn't just about the printer itself. I've always valued open-source principles and the ability to tinker, upgrade, and customize. That's why I went with Prusa. It's a perfect match for someone like me who loves getting hands-on with technology. However, if I were running a business, the equation would change dramatically. Cost versus performance would be the deciding factor, and Bambu would likely be my choice for its economic advantages. Now, here's where my concerns lie with Bambu. They're often compared to Apple in the 3D printing world, aiming to dominate through what could be seen as under-pricing. My worry is what happens once they secure a significant market share. Could they start introducing restrictions? Like, maybe they'll limit printer usage time or charge for each print job? What about making the printer essentially a rental unit - sell it cheaper upfront but then you're paying as you go? And with the NFC technology on their filaments, there's a risk they might restrict you to only using Bambu-branded materials. Given that Bambu isn't just a startup but backed by heavy hitters in Chinese conglomerates with deep pockets, these scenarios don't seem far-fetched. This isn't just about price or technology; it's about control over what we own and how we use it. That's why I appreciate Prusa's commitment to open-source, which not only aligns with my values but also protects against some of these potential future restrictions. It's a lot to think about, but it's clear to me why I made the choice I did.
How is prusa perfect for someone who likes to get hands on? The hardware is closed source. An open source printer like maybe something like sovol would be far more geared towards that. Prusa _used_ to be for open source folks, but havent been for years.
@@BeefIngot Most Prusa printers come as kits that you assemble yourself - it doesn't get much more hands on unless you design your own printer. There are only a few hardware parts that are specific to the printer. Most parts are standard (motors, gears, rods, screws, etc.) or easily printed (all plastic parts). You can get the print files (and at least partial design sources, like SCAD or STEP files) online. You can buy ALL replacement parts for fair prices on their web shop - you could assemble a full functioning printer from their spare parts store. If you feel like it you can even get the designs for their electronics and the sources for their firmware. If I wanted to build another copy of my Prusa MK4 without buying a single part from Prusa: I would have to reverse engineer only 3 hardware parts - main frame, print bed and the aluminium frame of the hot end. None of those would be a real hurdle, but they'd be expensive to make as a one-off. The electronics I could just order from a PCB manufacturer using Prusa's original design files - again the one-off cost would be higher than buying the part from Prusa. Anything else would be cheap standard parts or printed PETG parts with designs downloaded from Prusa. This is the MOST Open Source that I have seen in any complex hardware. What else would you want?
@KonradTheWizzard Assembling the printers is a gimmick that doesn't actually teach you anything of worth to justify the time spent. The savings also don't even bring them in line with the competition. There are many more parts than you've stated that are closed and I would bet that vs Bambulab Prusa is at maybe 40% proprietary vs Bambulabs 60%. Further, consider that the Core one in particular only really has the 2 gimmicky side panels availible open source. Everything else is closed, and anything that 8snt just so happens to be a standardized part such as a bearing or motor. Sovol has truly open source printers where you even get pcb schematics (quite important and something Prusa obfuscate and does not provide). In essence there is a whole lot more open source wise you could want out of a printer.
@@BeefIngot I assembled my own MK4 a few months ago. For me it taught me how it is put together, where to find potential problems and most importantly to not be afraid of taking it apart. For me that is VERY important.
I’m looking to venture into the 3D printing hobby space. With decades in the IT industry, the idea of a Chinese, walled garden, cloud based product is actually terrifying. The Bambu feature set is definitely compelling, but I’m beyond over China’s industrial espionage tactics.
Funny enough, I currently have an Elegoo Neptune 4 pro. Works beautifully and at $210, I would argue better value than the A1 mini. My problem with the market currently is that a few years ago, we talked about every manufacturer. Now we act like there are only 2.
It's crazy that an industry this huge didn't have any companies truly innovating and a brand new company was able to come in and immediately become the new standard of which even the established companies are now chasing.
Unreal take to say they didn’t innovate. They were the first to do force bed probing, lidar, and ams. Not to mention the welded chassis and rfid tags. And before you find some obscure example of someone who did these things first, they clearly integrated it better and refined it since there the first widespread use of any of these. It is the first and borderline still only printer in the world that simply works, and that is what the mass market desired. It went from a toy hobbies used to make little gizmos to a true engineering tool (and also print a hell of a lot more gizmos lol)
Having owned most printers from both Bambu and Prusa, I can confirm both are fantastic - which is best for you depends on use case. If I were to recommend a printer for a home user or even a print farm startup with a budget, I’d probably say pickup a P1S - great quality, speed and ease of use. I also like the ability to chain AMS units for 16 color prints. That being said, I have an issue that requires some of my time to fix on the X1s and P1Ss around once every 100 hours or so (and the purging with the AMS is extremely inefficient - hoping they optimize it more in firmware updates). My XLs and MK4Ss are dead reliable, rarely ever having any kind of issue at all. The experience is a little less user friendly for beginners, but getting better with each update. They are also easy to work on if I do want or need to. If you are more experienced or need as little downtime and material waste as possible, it’s Prusa for me. The upgrade path makes them cheaper in the long run as well. BTW- there is a camera option on the Core One.
These are great points and observations, especially that the plug and play of Bambu appears somewhat of a gimmick where they downstream-ed the time and efforts to keep them running on the back end no one thinks about when impulse buy vs the front end where most consumers keep their undying focus. This is likely the only wave Bambu can keep all the features and specs affordable and competitive.
The purge in Bambu can be manually tuned with test prints as it is filament specific the the particular spools and order you print in. Options are in bs/orca
@ The flaw is in the lack of retraction and the cut point leaving so much in the heatbreak to purge - that needs a firmware fix. They did one fix recently, but it wasn’t enough.
One of the biggest advantages of Prusa is that it is based in Europe, where I also live. This means that their products comply with European regulations, which improves customer security and makes warranty services and returns smoother. Additionally, money stays within Europe, which is important for supporting the local economy. Prusa's factory also provides jobs in the region, contributing to job creation within Europe. Prusa’s device support is also exceptional. For example, my old MK3S printer, which I've been using for several years, still receives updates. This long-term support is a big advantage compared to many other brands. Prusa’s open-source mentality is also a key factor in my decision to buy their products: it gives users the freedom to modify and share their devices, which appeals to those who value openness and community support.
The absolute biggest win for Prusa printers right now is the noise. A lot of us aren't running farms in separate rooms. Or maybe are even forced to have the 3D printer in their office. Then Prusa suddenly becomes your only out of the box FDM printer. I really hope more manufactures will take those things into consideration as well.
As a long time sufferer of the unworkable MMU2 (firmware was simply crap) and the MMU3 (endless tip tuning per filament) I can honestly say that comparing it to the Bambu AMS just shows the massive gap Prusa has in the multi material space. Prusa has nothing. Also the Bambu X1C is not throw away at all ... the parts to fix are easily available on the Bambu website and are really cheap. It's also very easy to work on and service and a very robust unit. Bambu parts are much better priced than Prusa parts. Prusa is just unable to compete on price. That said their work in the OpenSource space is to be commended particularly with their slicer.
Prusa has nothing? They have the XL, which is a lot less wasteful and can achieve actual multi material. The bambu is multi-colour, not true multimaterial.
How did prusa fall so far behind, when they appeared to be leading years back? If prusa himself were an engineer, then maybe things could have turned out different. It hard to support or depend prusa these days with what they are charging. Yeah, they really need to make their multicolor less diy looking, and more hassle free. That alone should be no go in 2025 when buying a 3d printer for multicolor.
They have a similar approach to noctua, give their engineers time to get things perfect so advancement has always been a bit slower, just in a new market with lower cost alternatives from china with actually good performance being pumped out faster and fatser their slower innovation strategy doesn't work as well anymore. That said they still have their european manuafturing and sourcing going for them, I do some times wonder how cheap prusa machines would be if they were made in china instead of europe.@@oneanother1
The MMU2 was a product with a known design defect. I fought with that thing for so many hours. I replaced the logic board, I replaced all of the servos (one by one). I printed custom feeds and pretty much every part from scratch. I contacted support. I started multiple threads. I wasted so much time trying to get that thing working. And the best I got was "keep trying, you'll get it!". No. I didn't get it working because it was a faulty design. And to prove it, I took that little power board from the MMU3 and put it on my MMU2 and it stopped giving the 5 flashing lights. I will never forgive Prusa for that experience. I got my P1S with MMU and it's night and day. In just one year, I have as many hours on my bambu than I was able to achieve with my Prusa in 6 years. I spent so many hours with it fiddling and fighting. skywardsoul, unless you have ever suffered with an MMU2 unit then I don't think you can understand why we see Prusa as a piece of crap. And the XL at $4000 is not a consumer printer, nor is it a competitor to the P1S or the X1C. EDIT: Oh and don't forget the time they told me I needed to flash the firmware, then the zip download for the MMU2 didn't have the right files in it.
If you don't have time to even raise 2 support tickets on the bambu handy app, maybe its time you hire more staff to assist you. Or donate the printers to non-commercial users who could spend the time to fix them and then have a great asset for a new hobby.
It’s a business, not a charity. He isn’t obliged to give it for free when he could recover some cost from a printer form those who are willing to buy a damaged item. Plus, when you write off stuff, sometimes you have to destroy it for the tax reasons.
At my makerspace, when people ask about what kind of printer they should get, I ask them: Which do you want? A printer that you can unbox and print with, or one that teaches you about how they are built and want to learn from? If they are just looking for a set it up and work printer, I tell them to get a Bambu printer. If they want a project and want to know more, I tell them to get a Prusa kit and build it. A Prusa Mk3s was donated to our space and in the month that we've had it, it's been used more and failed less than the Ender 5 and Anycubic machines we have on the bench. And all of this depends on your use case. I do casual 3D printing, with functional parts and some cosplay props. I don't sell my things, so having a quick printer isn't my focus, but it may be for others. I look for accuracy and the ability to print tougher materials, and have been rocking a single toolhead XL since I received my pre-order machine. I do see the mindset of saying that Prusa is meeting Bambu at their level, but even the MK4 seemed more of a "We did the research on making this awesome Nextruder, can we put it on a MK3s and make a faster bed slinger?", while the Core One seems less like "How do we compete with Bambu" and more of a "How do we make a smaller version of the XL out of a MK4?"
So you ask them, do you want a product that works or do you want to stay poor? Seems like the only correct answer is Bambu. Why would you buy something to do a task that doesn’t do the task without significant time investment? I mean unless the dude is designing a better 3d printer, you don’t need to learn about it. A 3d printer is an appliance. You wouldn’t use the same criteria for your stove or TV or lawn tractor. You just buy stuff that works. The days of people who are just inquisitive about 3d printing with plenty of time to waste to print trinkets is over. 3d printing now prints usable things. So it’s time for 3d printers to be treated like an appliance and not a hobby.
The 3D printing community we watched grow & develop is in the middle of another evolution. As a former long standing Prusa fan, I've sold off my Prusa products. At the end of the day, the company that gives us the most features for the best price will win. Until someone beats Bambu at their own game, they will continue to rise to the top. Sure, people care about the morals that developed the community - Prusa was at the forefront of that but for how long will people care? Prusa really screwed up with this release IMO. They had an opportunity to respond strong to Bambu's X1C and what did they do instead? Gave us less features for a considerable amount more than the X1C. The community loyalty that shielded Prusa is coming to an end. Eventually people will stop caring about the past and Prusa will be left behind as another company in history that got too comfortable at the top and stopped innovating (see Blackberry).
@@FarrelClement Many people ore prepared to pay a premium to receive premium features (X1C vs P1S is an example). What the OP has said is correct - Prusa are charging a premium without any value-add, and that's why their hole is getting deeper.
@@FarrelClement prusa didn't even tried. I knew prusa printer since 2017 and until 2019 where I decided to get a printer, they still are not available unless I paid a ridiculous delivery fee (they have no competition during this period). And they have a killer machine Prusa XL but didn't bother to release a price down ver where it would be far more competitive than a X1 clone
That the right mindset for customers. This applies to any other market. If there is competition, there will be better products, but if there is none, companies won't see any need to improve, and this will reflect on us as consumers.
My first 3D printer was an Ultimaker 2e+, hugely expensive, but at the time, it really seemed like the best thing out there. Around the time MK3s came out, I got an Ultimaker 3e, again, hugely expensive, but it really seemed like something else back then! Now, 5 years later, my UM3e is mostly forgotten, it's still here, I still have some 2.85mm filament for it, it still works, but it's features just aren't there. I honestly got jealous when I saw Prusa send out major firmware updates for older printers, heck even the Mini got major boost in performance, yet Ultimaker has abandoned older printers long ago. I'm pretty sure that once I spend my 2.85mm filament, I'll take out all the proprietary parts from that UM3e, and give it a single nozzle head with Trianglelab parts or something like that. I did something similar with UM2e+, and it's still being used. Way back when, I also bought some (much much much) cheaper CR-10s pro's, and with cheap upgrades, they are still running, very reliably. The whole experience thought me to avoid expensive and proprietary stuff. Core One looks super cool, if someone gifted it to me, I'd gladly use it, but I would never buy it. Not when I can get an Infimech Tx and get all the performance I need from it, right out of the box, and if it starts falling behind, it will be very easy to change/upgrade what I feel like. Prusa has its audience, and many fans, so I have no doubt that Core One will sell well, but I fell it's just not interesting enough to justify that price in the current market.
I bought my mother a Bambulab A1, and while the printer prints in much higher quality than my personal MK4S, the plastic parts on it always seem to break. The purge wiper broke within a week, and the webstore also seems to always be out of stock with replacement parts. A week ago, the AMS Lite filament hub broke, and I'm scrambling to fix it before Christmas. I love the metal parts on my Prusa MK4S. The printer feels sturdy, and I haven't had a part break since I got it as a MK4. The Core One hasn't sold me whatsoever, and I thank you for the information and non-biased opinions you have provided in this video.
I am at 1.7k hours and 774 hours across my two x1c printing mostly pretty harsh ABS, ASA, and CF- materials and have needed very minimal maintenance compared to any other printer I have worked with from two Formlabs Fuse 1's, dozens of Lulzbot, dozens of Creality Ender's, several Voron, and a Trumpf TruPrint 5000 The Bambu Lab X1C has needed the least service and has been the most fire and forget of any printer I have experienced, the worst part is greasing the back lead screw, while even on machines that are coming close to $1,000,000 when you factor in all of the accessories, installation, shipping and training, the amount of down time is truly unreal, sometimes 2+ weeks to have a service technician come to service the equipment.
What is mentioned in the video, but seemingly not discussed in any of the comments, is that "excellent" Prusa tech support really still excellent? I had an issue with a loud squicking bed, to which support replied to me if my belts are properly tensioned, "that noise is normal". Given any Prusa at our makerspace, it wasn't. Eventually i fixed it by reprinting all of the bed, but the problem really is that once you start searching around you'll see a stark influx of lackluster support stories over the last few years, both on reddit and their own forum. Not only overlooked problems, but also a lot of handfighting over replacement parts like faulty idlers/bearings and definitions of consumables when people haven't even got to a first proper print. Which brings me to the question; why is this positive stereotype still a given for Prusa? I'm not saying anyone else is doing it better, just that i question Prusa's still being "good".
I have a Bambu X1C with AMs at work, and recommend the Bambu ecosystem to everybody interested in 3D printers because of how incredibly trouble free it has been. The only problems we have had are hot ends breaking when they crash against a part which had failed bed adhesion (but they are cheap to replace) and GF/CF filaments breaking in the AMS a couple times. I should also say that I have only needed to replace hot ends 3-4 times, but that is the failure mode, not wearing out from abrasive filament. We have roughly 2,500 hours on our machine at this point. I ended up buying a P1S w/ AMS for home (and run it in LAN only mode) because of my experience with the X1C. I think my only big reason to go with anybody other than Bambu is to avoid China Cloud Services. For reference, we run almost exclusively Bambu filament (PETG-CF, PAHT-CF, PA6-GF, ASA, TPU-HF, for production; PLA and PETG-HF for tools/fixtures and quick mock-ups).
Prusa had crash detection since MK3S. Bambu breaking hotend when not that rare printing issue occurs is sign of poor design. Bambu is good printer, but in long term reliability Prusa is the winner.
I have a similar experience. I have an X1C and P1S using Bambu filaments. Apart from minor failures (z height detection failure and failure to retract filament), it has been a joy to use the Bambu Labs ecosystem. The printers come with a bunch of the consumables and replacements are inexpensive (wipers, blade cutters, etc). And if you don't want to print from the Bambu Cloud service, you don't have to. Octoprint has preliminary support for Bambu printers and the old SD card works fine as well.
@@jan.bednarik Prusa crash detection has notoriously not worked well since the mk3s. Furthermore, Bambu also has crash detection. Furthermore, the heat break breaking is actually the best point to fail as its the cheapest point to replace.
This is an interesting subject, I personally started with an old Lulzbot Taz 5 that barely worked, but I was able to replace the fried heated bed connector and fix its many other issues. I now own a Bambu X1C and love its worry free operation! That said I don't think it is the best printer in all regards, the lack of open source firmware is annoying, potentially prohibiting, but the fact that all these known printer brands like Prusa, Creality and many others failed to innovate and create an improved product. Instead waiting for Bambu to come along and dominate the market is disappointing. This is a classic case of competition fueled innovation. You can stay brand loyal, but at the end of the day the superior product should prevail, and Prusa nor Bambu are superior product to each other in all respects. If Bambu does nothing else they motivated other companies to innovate their own products.
Even a Prusa fanboy like me, must accept the fact that Prusa just ain't leading the market at this point. They still have many good aspects, but they have been sitting on their hands for too many years until they released the MK4. The relase of Core One isn't a fix to the challenges they face. However, I hope it's the beginning of a new chapter that MIGHT bring them back to a place among the leading pack. I hope that improvements to Core One will follow in rapid succession with features like: - A native and integrated camera, - automated flow calibration, - actively heated chamber, - higher extruder and bed temperatures. - Prusa LINK functionality at the level of Prusa Connect. Also, a lot of great features have existed in Orca for some time and only a few are slowly finding their way to Prusa Slicer (Alpha). Tools for easier filament tuning are still missing in Alpha, but it is nice to finally have multi-beds and paint-on fuzzy skin.
I bought a ELEGOO Saturn 4 Ultra. It’s a phenomenal printer with amazing performance, but they fall short by upselling you their Chitubox software suite which is quite expensive for a slicer. With Prusa, you never get that feeling.
While I view the Prusa as premium product, I actually think they managed to keep the price reasonable considering the feature set. Is it the best deal on the market? Definitely not. I think Qidi probably has the sweet spot for price to high performance. That said, for printing mostly PLA and easier filaments, there are many better deals. Pros and cons to every brand, but I think the Prusa should be in consideration for anyone who wants a well supported, reliable, repairable machine which isn't totally made in China.
@hlop_vmp You are focusing on a single aspect, material type. There are absolutely products which are made from plastic which are more premium and generally superior to metal counterparts and vice versa. Premium also does not just imply quality or performance. Premium is often about a brand and isn't even necessarily a good thing. It can be adjacent to luxury. High quality doesn't always mean better overall. I used the term intentionally to imply the bad and the good. General quality should be high, but they are also charging a premium, if you will.
I have a MK4s Which started out life as a MK3 and I upgraded a couple times. Gonna sit this one out for a year and see what develops; My Prusa really has been flawless though the UI is feels very hobby still. I suspect Bambo will make another X1c in a bigger size at a competitive price; will probably go that direction if they do, though my heart remains with the open source and ongoing slicer development that Prusa does and the others just leech off of. The next big leap is non-planar printing, and waiting impatiently for that....
From what I've heard, parts for Bambu are just as easy to obtain as parts for Prusa, and both are priced reasonably. However, I've also heard that Prusa will be able to provide better support when it comes to repair and trouble shooting advice. If you know how to repair 3D printers, either company will still be a good choice in that regard. Now as far as which brand is more reliable, that honour may belong to Prusa. I tend to think of Bambu printers as being more hobbyist friendly, while Prusa might be the more go-to choice for print farms. Especially, when you realize that Prusa 3D prints parts for their own printers ON their own printers. This means they are doing the beta testing on their new products not their customers. So, it probably comes down to what you want and need in a 3D printer. With Prusa printers and parts now made in the USA (Printed Solid) and possible tariff increases on goods from China, the cost difference between the two is going to evaporate.
The Bambu Wiki is pretty comprehensive actually, so while you may not have an actual human walking you through stuff, information is easy to obtain. Basically every part is available in the shop, at mostly reasonable prices. Bambu does a far better job than most other companies in this regard.
BBL parts are available when in stock, and it seems they’re never in stock, always the “Notify when Available” even then when you do find the time to order its out of stack again.
-Longevity -Customer service -You can just buy the upgrade kit to transform your Mk4 to the Core One so you get the machine for half the price of a comparable new machine I totally see the selling point. Especially professionals who value customer service can't overlook this.
U completely disregard the fact that the Mk4 itself is a overpriced machine. So u in total paying as much as an x1c with the ams. I dont think it is possible prusa fan are all this ignorant, im guessing most are bots now so 010010101101010101
A lot of people ignore these, but the reliability, ease of repair, and expectations of future compatibility from Prusa is amazing. People say they're expressive, and they are, not for someone who just wants to tinker with a 3d printer. But, for someone who wants that quality and the brand behind it, it's worth it. There's no reason so many print farms would have Prusa if they weren't worth it to at least some people.
@@tired5925 The MK4 is expensive yes, but not overpriced for what it offers. They offer an amount of service, quick repairability, and customer service you don't quite get from other 3d printers. I will say, these benefits make it more of a print-farm style printer, than one many people would want as their only printer. It doesn't have the same versatility as an enclosed and multicolor 3d printer, but that's not their target with the device. Their target are people who repeatably want to print quality on the few things they do print, and be able to make repairs and upgrades in the future.
@@dfwdweghom8902 This is correct as stated by Prusa so far. It would be upsetting if there wasn't a specific upgrade kit from MK4 to Core One. You CAN buy the MK4S upgrade for the MK4, but surely a MK4 to Core One conversion shouldn't cost the entire extra 100 USD to do.
30% more build area sounds impressive until you realise it's just all extra height. I pretty much never run out of vertical space but I always want a bigger build plate
For me as a somewhat advanced home user the volume is the deal breaker on the core one. Even 250 cubed is jus limiting, and for small things I run a a1 mini in parallel. Looking forward to that H2D.
If that is the next Bambu (nothing is confirmed till it is). They hinted they were looking at the Prosumer market, not Consumer market for the next printer.And if the patents they filed in the last year or so are anything to go by, it will be something for the business user.
@@alexa5231 H2D is the next printer because it has leaked. Prosumer market is not a thing. Theres just grades for consumer from low end to high end. Whether you are making money from it does not really matter for the manufacturer and industry is entirely different beast. H2D will be a high end, larger printer with a new type of multi filament head/system. I hope it will cost under 2k, but I have not much hope for that.
I think Prusa needs some kind of VVD system or a compact MMU inside a box. That way it could compete with X1C (not P1S). To compete with k2 plus and new generation of big size printer they need something like a “CORE ONE XL” (just a bigger core one with the bed from the XL and that “VVD” multimaterial system). Oh, please add a damm nozzle wiper
What i miss here is that prusa does not just want to let the camera out of their printers. They have to because it´s a patent from Stratasys. They just don´t want to get sued like Bambu and TierTime gets. Chinese manufacturers just don´t care. They just ignore the patent. Honestly. That is not ok. In terms of everything else the core one is in my opinion far superior then the bambu, because of features like easy maintainability, long life span, high precision print quality, the possibility to add a GPIO hackerboard to control a camera, robot arm or RGB LED´s and many more. The Noise level is also way better then with any bambu printer. Last but not least you said that if one machine breaks you throw it away and buy a new one. As far as i remember 3d printing was a technology to prevent exactly that. It´s a technology to be able to repair broken things instead of throwing them away. I mean that´s truly awful to hear. Shouldn´t we take a bit more care about our planet?
Lol. Prusa was like the what 3d printers aspired to be in the early days. A well established 3d printer brand, that could charge that much back then. They fell off big time because they didn't do anything for years. They let all of the Chinese brands surpass them in every way. It doesn't make sense anymore to try to sell expensive 3d printers to the consumer market. Many early brands also bit the dust. At the end of the day, its abou5 marketshare, cause everyone is racing to the bottom. Prusa gonna bite to dust too, if they arent gaining marketshare.
@oneanother1 so buy Chinese if you do not like prusa. You either do not like product or you do. Decision is all yours. If I would be taking to account all those arbitrary "problems" you mentioned I would have a hard time to buy even toilet paper
@@nex7053 well, that is why people are moaning, especially prusa fanboys. If they didn't care, then no moaning. The core one is fine, except the price isn't.
@@oneanother1 well they are not chinese sweatshop employing kids for bowl of rice and building safety nets to prevent suicides. And price is not that bad 30k in CZK is completely ok for locally produced product - it is one third up since when I was buying mk3s but I get full enclosure. Prusa fans are not ones moaning. Those who are moaning would like to have custom made printer to satisfy all their quirks. Prusa fan will understand that prusa is developing open ecosystem of enduser printer with upgradability and interchangeable parts in mind. You maybe can get cheaper bamboo, but when next iteration of printers will be available or new technology you will have to buy new one, but with prusa, you will always have way to do cheap upgrade.
One thing that bothers me about Prusa is their somewhat short-sighted approach. Josef Prusa himself once said that no better printer would come after the MK3. (In terms of price-to-performance ratio, the MK3 was unbeatable compared to competitors at the time.) However, when Bambu released their printer, Prusa launched the MK4 half a year later, claiming that this would be enough. As we know, that wasn't the case. The MK4 now seems like a transitional model that could have been skipped and replaced directly by the Core One, which should have been released right after the MK3. I’ve been wondering what Prusa was thinking at that time. Why didn’t they see the market's direction? Was it a matter of too much pride in their own achievements, or were they simply blind to what customers truly wanted? It seems like Prusa fell behind and didn't react quickly enough.
I got a p1s earlier this year and just picked up an almost brand new mk3s for $200 just because i wanted a prusa.... options and competition are awesome there is a place for both.
Based on what info can we determine the X1C is "poised to be replaced" afaik Bambu has not shown off any new machines at the latest 3d-printing expositions.
With the incoming tarrif on goods imorted from china, and that the Prusa will soon be build is the US these price points may become a mute point. I would like to see your customer service experiences with trying to repair those faulty Bamboo, most people do not have the option of just throwing away a printer.
@@garytfish that will tip the scale for sure. Will be interesting to see how the prices compare once the dust settles. I definitely wouldn’t just throw the printers in the bin but might consider selling them for cheap as is to someone with more time that is willing to repair them. I might consider making a video about the repair process if there’s interest in it.
@@ygk3d The force sensor is $5 and the heat bed is $120. There are step by instructions linked on the product page. You have videos showing the Prusa XL build so I can imagine it isnt a skill issue. Michael from teaching tech has a fantastic debunking video on Bambu repairs so to give up without even an attempt is odd. Would you toss your Prusa machines if a part fails? If I remember you went through a ton of videos troubleshooting,repairing and even kludging together fixes for your Prusa machines.
@ thanks. Definitely not giving up. Just saying they’re not usable without repairs and haven’t had time or desire to dive into that yet. I didn’t mean to imply that they are permanent paperweights.
Just FYI google is dubbing this video if you switch the language on youtube. I was really confused for a moment hearing AI generated slop on this video. All because the language was set to german.
@@ygk3d Honestly, it's not any worse that disassembling a desktop or laptop computer. Just keep track of your screws and take photos as you go for reference.
@@ygk3d Intimidating that you'll lose Prusameters when Josef finds out you took a screwdriver to a printer other than his own brand? You come across as an absolute goddamned shill.
@@ygk3d If you are running a print farm and you are afraid to open a printer, you might need to find someone to do it for you, or perhaps its not the right business for you.
I have two MK4S', and I will upgrade both once the upgrade becomes available. However, I am definitely in the tinkerer category, so it is probably a core (meh?) Prusa customer. My printers started as kits and will remain as long as Prusa releases upgrades. They are basically maintenance-free and produce print after print without any issues. The MMU3 works, and yes, out of the box, it takes up a lot of space, but I have my spools wall-mounted above the printer using rewinding spool holders, and then we're in the AMS-size territory. It's not as slick looking, I'll give you that :)
It feels a little disingenuous to call the X1Cs paperweights because they require maintenance, and then compare them to printers that you have actually performed maintenance on? (Purely on the maintenance/replacement parts, not the speed etc) Maybe I’m misreading that though?
In the one year I've had my P1S, I've put as many hours as I did with my Prusa Mk3(s+) in 6 years. I spend more time printing with Bambu. With the Prusa, it was _constant_ maintenance. Constant.
The force sensors in the X1C are a user replaceable (and pretty inexpensive - $5) parts, so your paper weight could be printing in no time and (almost) no money, the heated bed is also a user serviceable part but its not cheap (around $150, but so are Prusa's heated beds). The real issue with the X1C serviceability is the motion system, there are user-serviceable parts but they are expensive and there are some parts (like the Y axis bearing for example) that are not serviceable at all. Bottom line is - the serviceability of the Prusa printers is unparalleled, but the Bambu is mostly user serviceable but there are some parts that will render you printer useless if worn out.
I find it odd you chose to give up before even attempting to fix the Bambu printers. I got pretty unlucky with my Bambu and wound up with a pretty unreliable printer but through the internet and help with support was able to figure out it was not a force sensor issue but a damaged hotend and bubbled bed sheet. Replace the hotend and bedsheet and printer went back to be smooth as silk
I have an X1C with AMS, it has around 550 print hours. It's been collecting dust for weeks because I keep getting the Tool Head has fallen off error message for no reason. In addition the AMS is no longer recognized. I got a lot of spare parts from Bambu but replacing them is a pain and most of them are not fixing my issues (got my third toolhead cover, why?). I ordered a Core One now as its fitting my needs even better (e.g. printing fully closed PLA/PETG and active temperature control) and i hope for better/more effektiv support.
Brace yourself, a thousand people are about to start replying to you saying that their Bambu works just fine and has a million hours of printing no problem.
" I ordered a Core One now as its fitting my needs even better" Wow you ordered and got a Core one BEFORE they even started shipping(jan 2025). This is $100% a real user...lmao. There are zero reviews, no active printer shipments, but somehow you have one....ok buddy. Which version of unreleased Prusa slicer are you using that has Core One profiles? Josef train your bots better, this is just embarrassing.
As everyone says, it depends on what you want. But for me, it also depends on the “intangibles” … I’m not interested in something that I can’t take apart, flip around, and fix on my own. I want great support when it’s a bit beyond what I can figure out. I want something that, like my MKS3, will be here for years. I want to feel confident in the type of company I’m investing in with my purchase. But that’s just me. YMMV. But I would suggest to anyone who’s out there deciding to make your own opinion. Plenty of folks are looking forward to the Core One. We’re just happy with it so don’t feel a need to rush to the Internet to complain. Happy printing!
Prusa core one doesn't appear to have anything better than the competition, while still trying to charge an arm and leg for it. Prusa needs to face reality, this isn't what consumers want. Their multicolor solution too bulky, and the size of the core one is too small. Prusa missed the mark on this one. I don't know if the prusa fanboys can save prusa this time. The reason its so divided is the prusa fanboys are the only ones who care and comment. Prusa clearly aren't selling as well as they use to, if they have to release a new printer every year.
The Core 1 would probably sell better if it had a printbed of 300mm2 or 3200mm2 and a better multi-color solution, Maybe optional second print head like the RatRigs.
Consisentcy is the Selling point of Prusas, a lot businesse i know have prusas despite them being smaller volume or slower, but theyve had better consistency print to print.
@@DanielLopez-up6os so I guess they havent upgraded to bambulab yet? That's like what I've been seeing a lot of prusa owners doing from the mk3. From a consumer friendly product, well its night and day with multicolor involved. Having a good multicolor printer is the future. I don't mind old school 3d printers, as I'm a tinkerer. For a consumer friendly product, well you need to over a competitive product at a competitive price. Prusa ain't it anymore. They are turning into boutique 3d printers, for the fanboys. They are losing marketshare, because they've priced themselves out of the market.
@DanielLopez-up6os so I guess they havent upgraded to bambulab yet? That's like what I've been seeing a lot of prusa owners doing from the mk3. From a consumer friendly product, well its night and day with multicolor involved. Having a good multicolor printer is the future. I don't mind old school 3d printers, as I'm a tinkerer. For a consumer friendly product, well you need to over a competitive product at a competitive price. Prusa ain't it anymore. They are turning into boutique 3d printers, for the fanboys. They are losing marketshare, because they've priced themselves out of the market.
Some of us are willing to pay for quality, service, and a name.. I am not a Prusa or Bambu labs owner but I appreciate many things about the products they have. I personally would love to own a Prusa or a Bambu, but overall support and quality I would have to say that Prusa hands down wins that one. Prusa will always cost more due to location where the machine is being made has higher cost of living and cost of manufacturing, this is not a deal killer at all. Most folks do a purchase primarily for quality and support. Price is usually not at the top of the priority list if a person deems it to be fair when looking at the overall package.
I have had only minor repairs on my X1C and P1S with minimal maintenance, and over 1700 hours between them (probably more, that was just the last time I remember). One actual part needing replacement, that's it (I have replaced a few others as preventative maintenance). Bambu's parts have stayed in stock, are fairly priced, and even though I found the maintenance on my Enders intimidating, I have gotten pretty comfortable taking apart the AMS, and everything I've had to do so far on the Bambus has been ok. They have not been able to keep their filament as available, and as a tiny business I can't really rely on Bambu filament, so I mostly use a few other brands.
LOL, I have no skin in this game. I'm an engineer who uses 3D printers and used to love PRUSA, but theyve been left far behind by Bambu and dare I say it, Qidi and Creality isnt too far. The new printer is not really worth it compared to the Bambu.. Once the X2 comes out they will be blown out of the water.
The competition between Bambu and Prusa has been great for the 3d print community as a whole. Bambu really shook the foundations and in doing so this has led to a great flood of printers hitting the markets these past two years. I think we have all witnessed many costly mistakes also. Bambu and Qidi and many other companies I do believe have shown us that they need to test more before releasing machines to the market. I do think the machines that get designed in 2025 and beyond will be some extraordinary machines. Will the manufacturers listen to us? I want to see multihead, multicolor, chamber heater, bed temps increased, nozzle temps reaching 450c. Minimum footprint of 380-400 with height of 600. I want to see premium component options for guaranteed accuracy. I would like to see thick solid build plates and fast and easy nozzle changes. Auto bed calibration and flow calibration the norm. Give me those features and take the time and use high quality components and take pride in the wiring job and use a top tier power supply. Surely one of these companies will make it happen. I challenge a company to design a two head solution that can use up to a dozen filaments per head. This can be done, is anyone up to the challenge? How about variable bed angle? So many features I would love to see. Please, before you bring it to market just ensure it is well built and any part is readily available on market launch date as a spare. Quality and the ability to easily repair a machine is the other end of the equation very few get right.
@JTs3DPrints I think the new Bambu HD will be the answer to your questions. Maybe CES.l, but you would know more than me as I'm just an end user. I'm waiting for the new bambu. Ready to pre order. Take my money!
"I have no skin in this game" is a useless statement used to try to trick people into valuing your opinion more as if somehow you're 8mmune for bias. You literally directly go on to describe your "skin in the game". If that's no skin in the game, no one has skin in the game outside of the companies themselves.
Completely lost me at Creality. To even mention Creality in the same paragraph is amusing, given how awful that company is. Their printers tend to be poorly thought out, poorly tested, full of lemons and usually need quite a bit of fixing. Support is sketchy too. Went through years of fighting their rubbish machines, spending most of my time troubleshooting, tuning and fixing, with lots of frustration and months long breaks from printing. Went to Prusa at last, smooth sailing.
Once we get some consumer machines like the X1C with the repairability of Prusas and nozzle temps of at least 350C, beds of 120C+, and chambers reliably north of 60C it feels like the average DIY market is going to go downhill fast. Right now the Creality K2 is close, but it's still Creality. I run a modified Voron Trident and one of the only compelling benefits over current off-the-shelf offerings I still have is higher temps. If Bambu pushed their nozzle to 350C that would be even less of an argument. It's truly crazy how fast the market switched around when the X1C was released. To think I and so many others started on cheap Enders and now we're here only a few years later...
Bambu has all parts easily available through their online store. They have a full wiki to guite you through troubleshooting and repairs. They are absolutely repairable, much more so than most other companies. I really dont get why nobody seems to bother looking if the statements they make actually align with reality.. Sure, open source is noce to have, but not necessary to get a repairable product. I like what Prisa does ethics wise, but that doesn't mean Bambu has to be bad by default.
My main concern is about how long Bambu will provide the replacement parts. While most hobbyists might just buy a new printer in 3-4 years, companies don't want to replace a whole farm if they can't get the replacement parts anymore. I hope that Bambu will keep providing these, but they don't have a track record yet.
Do a google search - "X1C Y axis bearing replacement" and you will understand why the X1C is not fully user serviceable. Its a pity Bambu chose to assemble some parts of their products in a way that prohibits user serviceability, I really hope they will deviate from this path in the future.
I got an MK3 and upgraded over the years to the MK4S. I'm looking forward to upgrading the core one when available. I do fear that Prusa may be usurped by newer companies like Bambu, which would be a shame. I've always had an excellent experience with the company, their products, and their ethos. My gut tells me that a company like Prusa, with the amount of genuine passion shown for their business and community, will find a way to continue their success. Success may not look like being the dominant marketshare holder, but I don't believe they ever were. Their success came from making high quality machines backed by an honest company with a great community. Just my 2 cents.
Ultimately it seems Bambu is likely, and unfortunately, going to leap frog the Core one in all ways, including pricing and overall features, and likley will ship with less lead time and before ther Core one still 😢
I think you're missing a crucial point - what Bamboo is doing is actually expanding the market by offering a cheaper, yet reliable printer that's accessible to newcomers. This includes providing a better community experience for new users who don't have to worry about complex print settings. With Bamboo, if you want something printed, it's as simple as clicking and waiting. In contrast, Prusa hasn't helped expand the low-end/middle market at all by promoting their XL and MK4s+ models with expensive price tags. I'm not even comparing the MMU2 (which is essentially garbage) and AMS by Bamboo - 3D printing has tremendous potential for expansion, but five to six years ago Prusa's decision not to produce cheaper models for the low-end market was a wrong one for this industry.
Another problem is distribution. Prusa doesn't ship from America, and the only distribution it has is through printed solid. Where I live we can simply walk into a shop like microcenter and walk out with a Bambu Lab printer. With a Prusa that costs more than $800., it will get held up in customs and I will have to pay some additional charge to release it at the border. This hasn't been a huge problem when the printer was only $800. like the mk3s etc. but it still really does cut down on the "impulse" buyers.
I would absolutely buy a Core One over a X1C if I needed one of those printers today. I'm not sure I would do the same thing if I needed MMU. That 459$ USD difference is currently around $620 CAD, and let me let you in on a little secret - many of our salaries here in Canada are comparative to those in America BEFORE any conversions. Yet if I was buying any printer today I would still choose the P1S over both. If money was really an issue, then the A1. And if I didn't need a printer right now at all, I would just wait for Bambu Labs next product. I can't imagine the Core One will help Prusa remain competitive. I think it's safe to assume people picking up a printer for hobbyist use will continue to flock to BBL because their entry/mid level products remain on top. I also think many business owners may opt to get the cheaper X1C on the assumption that it's better to save money to buy whatever BBL puts out next rather than invest it in a more sustainable asset that may be far less competitive in just a years time. At the end of the day this product will probably sell best to previous Prusa owners, which isn't a great position to be in for Prusa.
The Core One isn't competing with the X1C, it's competing effectively with the P1S since feature for feature they are pretty much identical.... For the price of the XL you can also get pretty much 2 PROFORGE tool change printers which are made in the UK so that also removes the other "excuse" to go with Prusa.... Prusa should be led to pasture they've dug their own grave and they should lay in it.
I’ve always been curious to what extent Bambu is subsidized by the Chinese government. By analogy, Chinese EV companies are heavily subsidized and it makes it impossible for US and EU companies to compete without tariffs to protect local industry.
I bought a Prusa Mk3 when it first came out. I had a few issues with the kit assembly and Prusa was very helpful in fixing them. I upgraded the machine over time. When Prusa announced the XL, I placed a deposit. However, they didn't deliver, so I bought an X1 Carbon with the AMS. The AMS always jammed, but single filament prints were very nice and quick. Then the machine refused to accept over the air input. It also wouldn't upgrade. Bambu service wasn't helpful. I traded the X1 to my son and got my old MK3 back. My son got the X1 working and loved the accuracy for the small figures he makes. It still wouldn't upgrade. I just bought a Prusa XL 2 head printer. I hope it will be less trouble than the X1. It also will print the larger objects I print and allow engineering grade materials with inexpensive support materials. We'll see, but all this has made me a bigger Prusa fan than before.
Nice video. Ignore the fanboys. I think you laid everything out fairly. I am not a fan of Bambu due to their business practices. I also don't own a Prusa either, but they contribute to the growth and advancement of the community. And for a Trident clone (which is how I see all these commercial CoreXY printers), I think Prusa did provide quite a bit more innovation than any other clones. Not significant, but thoughtful and useful. Reducing chamber volume with inset sides will make a huge difference in chamber heating, sealed filament enclosure, managing chamber temperature during prints, being able to upgrade from an MK4S. That shows Prusa is invested in always offering an upgrade path.
I find it laughable many people point out that we shouldn't purchase yet another Chinese printer and instead favor a European maker. Meanwhile, I'd wager most of the electronics and appliances in their home came from China. Prusa has built a reputation for big promises, lot's of issues/delays and many many fixes to finally deliver a reliable product. Like those XLs and other machines.
Catching up is not enough, unfortunately. Prusa has done some amazing stuff with the Core One, coming off of their bedslinger heritage, but all it has done is close the gap with the competition from years ago. Seeing how fast things move, the Core One will be obsolete within 6 months, if not less.
my question is did you build the prusa's or buy them assembled. itd be wild to say youd rather BUILD a prusa but saying its too intensive to replace a part on your x1.
I started on an ender3 V1, but after many years of that love/hate relationship, it was time to upgrade. My deciding factors were build size and ability to print more exotic filaments. I decided on a Qidi Plus4 and so far, its been flawless. I did replace my SSR board since I live in the US, but that was super easy. I knew about the flaw before I bought it, so it was a nonissue. Multi color is coming next month!
You can build an entire Prusa XL but replacing a $5 force sensor or even a $120 head bed means you have a paper weight? Wut? Did you forget hot to hold a screwdriver and follow step by step instructions?
You've obviously never ran a print farm. This dude is constantly going from machine to machine and the downtime of basically none to replace things. He said FOR NOW. Something that you and other commentors seem incapable of recognizing
@@SiFireHasSpeed I own non but the words play in video make it look like a unbiase comparison but it looks so advertised for Prusa to me to devalue competitors and I don't angry at all.
@@SiFireHasSpeed Thank you for pointing this out! This is exactly what I meant. They're paperweights *for now*. I don't have time to fix them during this busy holiday season. I'll replace clogged nozzles, etc. but an entire heated assembly overhaul is more of an undertaking than I have time for right now.
@@Technobby Advertising for Prusa when I say that their new printer will be instantly dated when Bambu releases their next machine? That's not very good advertising...
Bambus being paper weights after only 1000h must be more of an user error / problem rather then printer problem. As an owner of 3, and printed well over 1000h on each of them with 0 problems and basic maintenance, it sounds very weird to me.
@@ygk3d Not just that, our excange rate. Bambu X1C currently listed at 1,299.00 Canadian. Prusa Core One is 1199 USD, which is over $1,700 CAD without shipping and duty yet! by the time I get a Core One, I could almost buy 2 Bambu X1Cs. I love Prusa... but the need to stand out on more than reliability at that price difference.
@@dfwdweghom8902 won't matter for us Canadians i'm afraid. Again, where bambu has crushed Prusa. Setup of local wharehouses in many contries to offer free shipping, incluidng no extra duty charges!
@@ygk3d What hurts the most is that Prusa's business model makes it so to have their machines UL (or similar internationally recognized) certification, either a local importer or the end user needs to do it themselves. I wanted our uni department to get one but the safety and hazards office refused any machine that didn't have a cert to be plugged in the building's outlets, with good reason (insurance). That would have cost us 500-800$. For one machine. We got a Intertek certified Troodon 2.0 from 3D Printing Canada that was only marginally more expensive than bought direct from Formbot. It seems to be, as far as I know, the same with Bambu though. The local dealers do the certification themselves. I would never buy any consumer-grade 3D printer that's not certified and use it at home because if it did fail and burn my house down, I'd like my insurance to not deny a claim because of it. IMO this is indefensible, both from Bambu and Prusa.
A lot of these comparisons sound to me like the two printers are supposed to somehow be equivalent things aimed at identical potential customers. This is partially true, there are surely people for whom both would work about the same. But there are others. There are people with no technical knowhow who do not want to learn how the thing actually works would never even try to service their printer. Recommend them a Bambu printer and let them throw it away when it breaks. When it works it has the best chance of working right for a user like that. And there is a good chance that by the time it breaks a newer version with some (supposedly) groundbreaking feature will be on the market and very likely "on sale" most of the time so this kind of user will not even be all that mad about the old one breaking down. There are people who like to do something specific that requires a slight customization of the hardware, or maybe just a crazy weird printing profile. Don't even try to sell them a glued together printer with closed firmware etc. Let them have something like a Prusa that can take all that experimentation and when you break it by experimenting the manufacturer still helps you fix it. And you have a good chance spare parts will be available for it six years later and not intentinally priced over half the price of a new printer. There are people who for whatever reason absolutely cannot connect the printer to a network. Their company IT security won't let them, or they are paranoid, or whatever. A printer that loses none of its functionality except having to manually transport print files to it is the right choice for them. And having a physically removable wireless module clearly aims at those customers and might be the only modern printer they can buy. Overall I like that Prusa did not try to just straight copy all the features Bambulab has to make their new printer competitive. I like that they made the new thing be still a Prusa with all the things typical for those and that instead they focused on offering various properties the competition does not have. To target potential customers who would otherwise maybe even buy a Bambu printer but would hate something about it. And as an engineer I admire the design for how they figured out how to keep it user-serviceable to the last bolt while making sure thing go back together aligned square etc. It is one thing to design a printer to be assembled exclusively by trained personel using special jigs and it is a completely different game to make it designed for both fast factory assembly and possible to assemble with just basic tools at home. And it looks like they figured out how to do this while keeping the cost reasonable by using a lot of laser cut and bent sheet metal. And on top of that the printer still looks elegant and not totally industrial despite using such design. Personally I like the balance they have achieved. I suspect many people will not like that as much but also many will. Personally I will not be buying either Bambu or Prusa for myself. I have a 500x500x500 Rat Rig printer, so all those 200-something mm beds seem tiny now that I have gotten used to printing 4kg 600x500x100 parts and similar. And compared how hard assembling, wiring and configuring a V-Core 3.1 used to be assembling the new Prusa kit will be a toy for toddlers 🙂. It would still be fun but all over in a few hours, not days, and you don't even need to study the CAD model to put it together 🙂.
If Prusa can solve the Bambu waste problem without costing over 4 grand they will eat into Bambu in a big way. More european buyers cannot stomach all the needles waste the bambu machines are deigned to produce
There is just no real way to not have a lot of wast with color printing and just 1 nosel . Prusa wont chang that and its also not mean to be used in big scal for that you need a tool changer were BambuLab will kill them in ever matric if they make one
Except its never reliable. Different moisture contents, different ambient temps, Different levels of water retention. Different ages. There are infinite variables to account for. You see those strings from the removed filament? They cause issues... period. Only way to have a reliable experience is to cut your losses. Still has a ton lower waste than CNC
I had an issue with my AMS. I spent maybe a total of 5 minutes with support to get the issue diagnosed. They offered a replacement unit or a part plus a free roll of filament. Even if you're not under warranty, the pressure sensor is $5. There are 3 of them. So, total parts cost is $15. They're located right under the bed - you can see one of them if you just look and the other two are covered by a cable cover. Remove a few screws, replace the sensors and you're up and running.... well, maybe put the screws back, too.
The core1 shares a lot of components with the MK4s. It is kind of an mixture of their AFS printers and the MK4s. The AFS is Prusa's fully automated printfarm which can run up to 18 printers 24/7 (see ruclips.net/video/82ww7ZTpDus/видео.html). Personally I do not like Bambu's closed and patented system and the fact you must use the cloud to be able to use the printers. Printers are build in a way the are hard to repair, but cheap to replace, creating more e-waste than necessary. I'm more a guy of generating the least waste possible. I think the Core1 fits me better than a BambuLab. With the price for the Core1 it is not a bad investment, but for single colour only. For multi colour the Bambu with AMS is better. For multi material with different printing temperatures the Prusa XL is unbeatable.
Would have liked to see Prusa use the AFS build plates instead of the i3 build plates. That would have really given them the build volume to outdo Bambu. But they are looking to slot the Core One into their print farm, sounds like they didn't have the space for a larger footprint.
@@BrainDeath89 Yes, two of them both with 5 tool heads. The performance is much improved since introduction. An XL is faster as a Carbon X1, even in one colour. In multi-colour the XL is much faster. When there are multiple colour changes per layer the XL can go up to double the speed as the carbon X1. Mixing different filaments with different melting temperatures the XL is much faster.
@@logicalfundy Prusa made the choice not to create a totally new machine, but an upgrade of the MK4s. By reusing as much parts as possible the could create upgrade kits for people who want to upgrade their MK 4(s) to a Core One.
The issues with your X1Cs are both due to your heatbed signal cable. On early X1Cs the cable is poor shielding and the wires break. I had to replace all 9 of my signal cables on my 9 early batch X1Cs. 30 min repair and a cheap part.
He said if a bambu fails after 1000 hours he will just replace it. I have an mk3s+ with 274 days of printing, that is 6500 hours and as far as I'm concerned it is better than it was when I bought it, because it arrived as an mk3, then upgraded to s, then s+ not to mention firmware updates over the years. 1000 hours is a joke for a machine to become a paperweight.
Exactly, 1000hr is a joke, I'm glad that most people with bambu are easily over 5k hours with no problems. I'm glad people never extrapolate the results of small sampling to talk about things in general! Oh
@@LilApe true!! don't buy them, buy prusa for 2x-3x the price of p1s and it will deeeeeeeefinitely outlive p1s, and all these crowds of people that are happy with bambu lab are just wrong, and don't understand that they don't like the thing they say they like. They are saying that p1s works great and reliable, but it doesn't. We, prusa users know better. Totally!!
And how many people have a mark 4s. I have a mark 4 so I would need to buy the mk4s upgrade kit as well as the core one upgrade kit if I wanted to upgrade
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for watching. For the record, I’m not saying the X1Cs are permanent paperweights. They’re just out of commission until I find the time to repair them. I’m perceiving it to be a difficult process given how tightly integrated these machines are, but I might be mistaken. I have reviewed the instructions on the Wiki for replacing the heated bed and it appears to be quite involved, but perhaps it’s easier than it looks. Cost wise, the replacements are very reasonable: around $120 for a full bed assembly.
Bro. You made a video bashing the serviceability of the them without even contacting their support team first? 😂. By stating that nonsense, I assume everything else you said was nonsense.
@ @ it’s all documented on the Wiki, so I know roughly what’s involved. It doesn’t look like an insignificant task which is why I haven’t gotten around to it. Contacting support would just be for a warranty claim to save the cost of the replacement parts.
I do agree with the complexity of disassembly, since I already got the hotend, extruder assembly replaced(after spending couple of hours trying to recover them). The Lidar on X1C makes for a no tune, print anything for prototype purposes(unless you edit a bunch of gcode to bypass unwanted procedures for production). It unnecessarily increases complexity(when lidar/camera error pops up from time to time), and additional time to every print. The best I know was a Lulzbot, with its direct extruder, although it is lost in eternity. I do love P1S's no wifi, no bamboo studio not even registered🤫, but prints like a tank, with just the gcode loaded onto an industrial microsd card, except for one firmware bug(resolved in a later firmware🤯), that can be easily worked around.❤👍
@@ygk3d You also likened Bambu printers to disposable tech, complete with stock footage of shredded circuit boards and allusions to the iPhone's lack of repairability while nuzzling up on Prusa's jock. Then you go after Bambu's "shoddy support" at 10:47, but you said yourself you haven't contacted them.
And if/when Prusa goes out of business, I challenge you to find a complete third party toolhead. Or their PCBs. Go ahead, go find them now even.
Rethink this video. Consider pulling and fixing it.
I won't see anything you ever produce ever again, since I'll be blocking this channel from my recommendations next time I get the chance...
(And I own a P1S, an X1C, and an XL).
Oh, I see - You'd throw out a P1S if you run into the slightest hiccup. Got it.
Dude, you have some brown on your nose. Did Bambu decline to send you review units or something?
@ you’ve misinterpreted. I love Bambu printers. They’re my daily drivers. Perhaps some of my statements were misinterpreted. I wasn’t implying Bambu’s customer service is shoddy, just that Prusa’s is not. And the bit about most tech products being disposable was a general statement of the industry. I’m pretty certain I’ll have sold off all of my current generation printers 5 years from now. They won’t immediately end up as e-waste but eventually the tech will be so dated that nobody will want them. I tried to be pretty even in my assessment here, saying both positive and negative about both brands. If you don’t like my content, that’s your loss.
One thing that gets missed from the conversation also imo is that Prusa is about the only company that’s not based in china, that’s a way bigger deal than people give credit.
Is it? At the end of the day, is the average consumer finding a product that is technically better in almost every way, then scrapping it for something from europe because they hate china. How is DJI doing so well then?
@@morbus5726 Because there is very little competition. You're missing how big DJI is - they have enough resources to build things at huge loss just to test the market, something no one else can do, and getting profitable in drone market is a feat on its own. As a proof, ask people around you (provided you don't live in drone racers neighbourhood) if the know any other company even remotely connected to drones. Most common answer you will hear is Red Bull...
So why does that matter? Heck, in fact BECAUSE it’s made in the US, it’s not as cheap as it could be if it had access to cheaper labour.
@@morbus5726 DJI ist also a chinese company. Didn't you know that? DJI is located in Shenzhen just like Bamu Lab.
Good point. Fits with the longevity focus :)
I think you overestimate the market share that Prusa has. According to Prusa, they have never had more than 10% market share. Creality was the company that lost the most market share to Bambu Lab.
Prusa is moving towards industry because things like good support or certifications are more important there than in the consumer market. As a company that manufactures in Europe, Prusa can't compete on price unless they fire people and move production to China. So they don't have much of a choice.
I think people sometimes miss one important fact about Prusa Research. The company does not really have any venture capital behind it. If nothing changed 85% of the company is still owned by Průša brothers. It is family business and it is not as profit driven as companies backed by capital investors demanding growth and profit almost at all cost.
Dont forget that Prusa i3 is really part of RepRap project and full name is Prusa Mendel i3 with whole design released under GPL license. The "Original Prusa i3" was called original because there where more clones of it then Prusa Research ever built. 😁
It's also run like a family... Not as professional, small vision, and not as forward thinking as worldwide professional brands like Bambu
@@Keveira So you are saying that company that established desktop 3D printers as what they are today and could not be matched in reliability and print quality for given price for 5+ years lacks vision.
Did I understand you wrong or something?
@@Keveira That makes zero sense, professionalism does not depend on the familial status of the founders. "Vision" and "forward-thinking" are just meaningless buzzwords as they are making 3d printers and will continue to release more 3d printers that will incrementally improve on the performance of the previous models.
Nope. According to market date Prusa still had 39% in 2022/2023 and Bambu had 30% along side with Ultimaker. You might not forget that prusa does also sell industrial machines. The consumer market is not really a good way to go for a company because, people don´t want to spend a lot of money, they are far too often picky, you have consumer protection in many countries. In the B2B Area a comany can make much more money.
If the Bambu's are paperweights, you can send them to me. I'll pay shipping and handling. I'd hate for them to take up space in your print farm.
same
I second this
This guy states that the Prusas just needed a little maintenance to get them going, but the Bambi’s are paperweight because he doesn’t want to do the maintenance..
@@avatarpthe says it’s not worth doing the maintenance…watch carefully
@@arbjful only its total nonsense. Literally everything on a bambu is easy and pretty fast to replace or fix.
Prusa is reliable, made in EU/US, mostly open with a open firmware, nobody is using you data for research, and you can trust the team for support and help. That's why you are paying a "premium".
"Paying a premium" would be 15%. At double the price, it's calling their customers idiots.
"Reliable" - "you can trust the team for support and help"
Hopefully you dont end up having the experience I did when I bought a MK4 at launch and they sent me a total lemon. Full of extruder and heatbed issues and couldnt print a thing. Support dragged me through the ringer for my full warranty period even admitting on record the machine was a lemon but that they wouldnt replace it because, ahem, "its better for *us* to just send you a part than a whole machine." Again, they admitted *on record* that the machine was a lemon but instead of replacing it they just ran out my whole warranty period looking for the one part to replace. I even said I would pay for shipping and send back my busted one, but nope.
Now I'm out of warranty buying parts out of pocket just trying to get it to even work. I will never make the mistake of buying Prusa again. On a side note, they do collect data like everyone else under the the whole, "help us improve?" guise. It's up to them to decide how your data "helps them improve" so... I guess pick the answer you want to believe?
@@Giskard_Reventlov you can't decide by yourself the right price by pulling a random number from your ass ser 🤣
@@Giskard_Reventlov Start a 3d print manufacturer in EU or USA and let me know instead of pulling random number. Just send a step file to an american manufacturer for 5k pieces VS china and let me know if the difference is 15% lol
@@Giskard_Reventlov 15% more is not a premium. Companies can pay double or triple for a machine if it's reliable and easy to fix even if it doesn't have the cool features.
There is more to this story. This is a fight between "corporate greed of walled in gardens" and "freedom to own modify and repair". To me its not about the money, (although I do realize it is for almost all consumers) but about the culture of 3d printing and innovation. We have seen what happens when we allow companies to take away right for repair or modify and in the end it ends up costing everything and you own nothing. I own my Prusas outright and its almost impossible for someone to position themself between me and my printers (unless you are in my kitchen) and as an extension I feel own a bit of Prusa brand as well. This is to contrast the feeling of some other companies where you feel exactly the opposite where you do buy the product but all the updates, software or consumables are proprietary and mandatory (think some drone or phone manufacturers).
This is why I want to defend Prusa as a brand, you might label it silly, fair enough, but it comes from a deeper set of beliefs of how we need to behave as consumers, and vote with out wallets.
bambo provides a rooted firmware, you have total control and can install your own firmware
You are absolutely free to do so, but the Bambu Lab enterprise (two companies in China plus Maker World run by a third company in Singapore) was created for business success. The CEO recently said that a million printers were shipped. Something is working...
@@michaels3003 You're missing the point or I don't really get your position.
I recently got a Bambu Labs P1S. Really nice printer, really good experience.
But what michaels said worries me. What happens if bambu decides that i need to pay a subscription for the apps/online features? A fee for cloud print jobs?
I needed to bind my printer to an account for all of the online features. I could still use the SD-Card, but that company has the primary purpose of profit
If they decide to switch to subscriptions, I need to pay or inconvenience myself to use a piece of kit that i purchased and i want to own fully.
"corporate greed of walled gardens" - there's nothing inherent to walled gardens that makes them just vacuum up more money than other business models. Otherwise it would be a whole lot more common. Especially since the point of for-profit businesses is, well...
If you aren't into the walled garden model, cool, don't invest in any of them. But lets cut down on the nonsense hyperbole. It's so tiring while undermining anything reasonable you have to say.
I hate it when I go to print something with my Bambu Printers and the CEO air drops into my living room between me and my printers. I'm totaling getting a Prusa now.
As a hobbyist of close to 10 years now I was fairly excited when I first heard about Bambu's printers and how easy they would be to use. But due to Bambu Lab's behavior since launching, I will not touch one of their machines. Most of those reasons have been mentioned in this video so no need to restate them here. Instead I will choose to pay a little more and support a company that gives back to the maker community instead of stealing from creators for their own benefit. Not to mention the top notch reliability of a Prusa and the fact I can make any and all repairs myself. Despite my feelings toward Bambu, I am glad they are pushing the market and I would actually recommend one of their lower end models to someone who is simply clueless about 3D printing and just wants to print some fun little toys. Anyone who is more serious about 3D printing as a hobby I would recommend a Prusa. Sort of like the difference of a tabletop player buying figures pre-painted and those who paint miniatures as the hobby itself. I am not a business user so I have no opinions in that regard.
This is silly. Can you clarify what behaviour it is you don't like?
@@Keveira Well, several are mentioned as I said in the video, but here ya go. Firstly they launched with users being forced to send prints through the Internet to their servers in China. Then they had a debacle where many of the printers started printing on their own because of the afore mentioned prints going through their servers. They also incorporate a lot of open hardware design but do not give back to the open hardware community. Then they started a print model web site which was obviously the stolen code base of another popular print model site and in order to populate it they web scraped data and files from other web sites without the permission of the model designers or the sites they scraped from. I don't have to have 3D printers to survive so I choose to have standards for the companies I will buy from. Personally I don't think having those ethics standards is silly.
3:05 you have a feeling that it's not worth it to try? Why didn't you try and actually come back to us with something more empirical than a feeling
Ya, clicked off at that point. Rest of the video is pointless.
Your MK3's may be old, and slower, but they are reliable, still working, still getting updates, and have confidence you can buy parts for it for a very long time.
They sat gathering dust for a long time but recently I had a project that could make use of them and they have been slowly but surely cranking out parts.
@@ygk3d Its amazing the comments that you get regarding the Bambu and Prusa printers. One was designed to be fast & inexpensive as its primary, and the other was designed to be sustainable and repairable first. They both serve a purpose, and they are both good printers. I own both too (well, not the CoreOne yet). People just have to be honest what they are getting in the short and long term.
What about making them 3.5?
@@ygk3d only gathering dust because you didn't hit the print button on them? even if their slower they still work... this sounds more like poor planing than anything.
I don't know ever since we got our bambu labs I only used our prusa printers once. The immense speed difference and reliable print quality is miles different.
We might upgrade our mk3s to the m4 kit which will likely make the machine use able again but the ability to print a quality part for a client 2 to 3x faster is insane value as a company as well as KNOWING it will print 100% or atleast 95% success
Has anyone mentioned the fact that the Prusa Core One is much more compact than most (all?) other printers that offer roughly the same build volume? That makes it very attractive to me as a complement to my current Prusa MK4 and Voron V0.
Is it though? Being able to fit a whole spools speaks to how much space in the sides there is. It doesn't seem notably more compact than anything else and they again go with the weird non uniform xy
@@BeefIngot The space on the sides comes from the Stepper motors which makes printers much bigger than the print bed. They optimize space using which makes the total footprint, including the spool smaller and helps with heating. So, quite a good solution.
@bern71 That doesn't check out given many printers use a wrap around design for the motors.
I feel like people bend over to find everything Prusa to be somehow genius
It looks so cheap though, stamp steel sheet and thin clear plastics. Have you forgot how their multi color solution looks? Its all over the place.
It is not the steppers, is the kinematic that lays on top of the filament rolls. It hast to be bigger than the print bed. Also part of the print head exceeds the sides of the print bed. Prusa basically saw there was space inside the chamber not being used and put it outside keeping the envelope
Prusa needs a 350x350x350 color combo killer and the Core One isn’t it. It’s just a stop gap to a longer term problem. Nobody cares about a nice nook for their filament or a built in tool cabinet. Convenient, but the market doesn’t want gimmicks. They want a bigger build plate and color.
What the community really want is fast and large idex printers. Maybe nobody is saying but till one appear with a volume of +300mm +800mm speed but also doest need any work from the user to align anything and offset is always perfect for both nozzles then everyone will leave these ams systems
@@tired5925ratrig incoming. It's DIY total kit though.
A lot of people want colour without the waste of Bambu or the cost of the Prusa XL. Whoever solves this will be a key player moving forward
@@tagg8233 I fully agree with this comment!
I'm hoping they will scale up the Core One to a larger bed size at some point. But it's pretty sweet that they offer an upgrade from Mk4s to Core One, which explains the print volume. And it's nice that they managed to squeeze out a little extra volume on the same plates.
As for color, the MMU3 has been performing pretty well for me. They need to improve the usability of that thing; compared to the AMS it is a real pain to load filament into that thing. There's a few aftermarket options to do away with the buffer, which makes for easier loading and a smaller footprint.
Prusa versus Bambu is a religious war. Bambu supplanted Prusa less in technology than they did in conversion of religious fanatics. I don't own either, but I'd never buy any Bambu product because I disagree with their disregard for my privacy and security, as well as their overall disdain for intellectual property. I also don't like how they built their proprietary closed garden atop a mountain of open source development.
Wait so rather than simply replace a part and get a Bambu printer working again you'll just toss it? That seems insane! I have 3 X1C's each with over 1000 hours and no major issues at all. So far I have been able to fix and repair anything needed. Bambu has a great detailed Wiki on how to fix anything on the machine. I started with Prusa and loved them but they are just too $$ for what you get and I just want results and Bambu is doing that at the moment. I am still confused why you can't fix those 2 printers though!
This dude is ridiculous. A force bed sensor is $5. He will sideline a $700 or$1200 printer than spend $5 and follow the wiki or $120 for a new heat bed? but he had no issues dropping 4-5k on an XL and build it ?
Me thinks his reasoning is beyond suspect and borders on ridiculous.
a single heatbed tile for the XL is $23 x16= $368
@@damiengvideos4337 definitely not tossing them in the bin. Just saying they are unusable until I find time to repair them and I’m a bit intimidated by the process. I’m probably overthinking it. It might not be as bad as I’m anticipating.
@@No0o0o0o0o0 it’s not an issue of cost. It’s an issue of time. I’m perceiving it to be a difficult process given how tightly integrated the printer is. But I could be mistaken. I’ll tackle it at some point and find out.
Sounds like KTM ;)
@@ygk3dI feel like criticizing Bambu's repairability without having actually experienced it is a bad move for credibility.
I hate downtime. Prusa gives me the confidence that I will always get my printers up up and running if they ever go down. I also know I can always get ahold of Prusa support.
The problem is for a given comparable prusa machine you can buy 2 Bambu machines so the confidence (not based in evidence as multiple print farms have shown the Bambus to be just as if not more reliable) dies with the fact you can just have more.
The concept of a disposable printer just does not work for me. None of my Prusa printers have become paper weights.
@@narlyb1500 The problem is that it's a myth that it's disposable vs non disposable.
Ignore that guy, hes a certified bambu shill that has zero experience with prusa. Bambu's are referred to as "easy bake vorons" for the very reason that they are considered throwaways when broken.
I actually think this confidence is rather mispaced. There's any number of manufacturers of clone/replacement parts for Bambu given just how popular those machines have become, and if Bambu stops offering genuine well priced replacement parts, there's guaranteed to be more. And on the other hand Prusa sells relatively fewer printers and has also steered hard towards proprietary parts and abandoned open-source hardware - the MK4 and Core One are no longer open source.
Between the two Prusa would still be my choice because less locked down, but honestly i would choose neither.
I'm still on the Prusa side of thins. I really don't like the security / privacy concerns with the Bambu, and I already hate how much filament I waste doing multi-color with MMU3. The Bambu wastes a ton more.
I'm eyeing an XL5T, but also hoping it gets an update soon.
For me multi head is the only way I’m comfortable doing multi material. I don’t know how people stomach wasting half their filament just for some colors on a sculpture that, let’s be real here, would look MUCH better off a resin printer. Unless you need a design for engineering work I’d say a single filament is probably your best option.
What kind of update are you looking for? It's pretty solid now.
@ i was thinking the 4S updates, mainly part cooling.
It's not about being first to market, but doing it right.
We've seen multiple Chinese manufactured printers that are fire hazards, and their first response was to downplay the danger, and only did something after being called out on it.
Like with the A1 recall
@@krollmond7544 They react in right way. I wait for bed and get also 128€ bonus on store..
I'm still on a Tevo Tarantula... One of those chinese fire hazards... Altough, I don't remember it shipping back in 2017 with a magnetic print bed, a Hemera XS revo extruder, a Misumi linear rail for the bed or any of the other thousand little things I upgraded.
@@krollmond7544 Bambu didn't downplay the danger at all with the A1. The power coord issues were a rarity and were only recalled as a safety precaution. They probably suffered more reputation damage from an over safe A1 recall versus just downplaying the danger.
@starflexthe2nd I'm just saying they were recalled, I don't know if they downplayed it or not
interesting, how old are the X1C's? I'm curious if there's a change in quality or just flukes, my two have 2,700+ and 1,900+ hours each and I've only had to replace Bowden tubes, cutters, unjam an extruder because I used old brittle filament in it, and clean the lidar camera a bunch of times (in addition to regular leadscrew lubing and maintenance) I guess I'm lucky, but I know people who have entire X1C farms with similar luck
They're maybe a year and a half old. I have others that are still running strong. It's possible that these units were just lemons, because, like you say, many people have far exceeded 1,000 hours of printing with minimal issues.
My X1C is on about 2500 and still working like charm. A1 about 1500 and still no problem, A1 mini about 600+ and no problem. And all parts are on bambu store.
My Bambu has been printing no stop for 46 years now, and it still goes great, no problems no maintainance... This is an absolutely organic comment, and it's perfectly natural that every friggin time anyone mentions a problem with a Bambu printer 90% of the comments are "My Bambu was used to build the piramid of Giza and still works no problem."
@@ygk3d Honestly, i'd put a little effort into fixing them as: 1) they are costing you money just sitting there 2) Bambu parts are relatively cheap.
I have 1000 hours and no problems
The X1's just need some basic maintenance. Not sure how it could not be worth fixing
Right? I am nearing 3000 hours with my X1 and the only thing I've had to change was a hotend. All parts are listed on the website and a simple video watch shows you how to tear them down and put them back together. It's easy.
The entire heatbed is not "basic maintenance".
@@carlosjosejimenezbermudez9255 let's see what you have to replace after 3000 hours on a Prusa
@@carlosjosejimenezbermudez9255 yesp, neither is the entire XY gantry for a single bad part
it's a bet that the ad revenue from a viewbait move will exceed the cost of the disposed machine
doubt it will work out
There are lots of ways for Chinese companies to get government subsidies. For example, it’s possible to get free office space. If you’re using semiconductors, you can benefit from subsidized domestic chips (China’s response to the US semiconductor embargo was to pump billions of dollars in to domestic chips). There are even ways for companies to recover loses from the government in certain cases. I suspect Bambu is a beneficiary of these subsidies, meaning they are able to sell for low margins in order to win market share and force competitors out of business.
This may sound fine, as we consumers are benefiting, but there is a long term threat. China is no longer content making stuff for Western and Japanese brands who then get the lion’s share of the margins. I don’t know that there’s a central government level strategy here, but in any case, the net effect will be Western brands will be forced to close, with significant economic impacts, and a reduction in consumer choice.
I also have it on good authority that Bambu uses similar shady marketing tactics as DJI (Bambu is funded by DJI’s investment arm), where they’ll employ people to smear the competition (DJI reportedly has a 50 person “black ops team” who are employed to post negative comments about their competitors). Is this the kind of behavior we want to reward?
@@JonS I'm disappointed to see you spreading such insane conspiracies.
It started out fine though I should point out that their initial investments were public and you can see it directly so no reason to assume, but gets really insane by the end.
You're at the same level as saying Prusa has a bit farm where funnily enough comments look more like that's true than they've ever looked like that's true for Bambu and they've looked that way from before Bambu ever existed.
@ I was at a company that was on the receiving end of DJI disinformation. One year, customers noticed a strangely large number of negative comments online about our new product. A few of them were able to trace back where they originated from (they weren’t covering their tracks back then).
As I said, I have it on good authority that Bambu uses the same tactics. And that good authority is not just a random commenter on the internet.
@@JonS "And that good authority is not just a random commenter on the internet."
It most certainly is. Your story quite frankly goes off into the deep end of delusion. It would be equally as believable if you said you worked as a spy for a 3 letter agency; that is to say that there is literally no evidence, proof or reasoning justifying any of this crazy claim.
@@JonS You as far as anyone could possibly discern are simply spreading FUD on the internet. Fanciful stories about proof you pinky promise totally exists but no one else knows about and which cant be shared.
As far as anyone could possibly discern this is simply rumours being spread on the internet. Fanciful stories about proof someone pinky promises totally exists but no one else knows about and which cant be shared.
I had a heat bed sensor problem on my P1S, contacted support and in about a week I had a new heat bed. Took less than an hour to replace and I’m 1000+ hours with it. I’ll buy your X1Cs if you’re gonna throw them out
1k hours and your allready experiencing MAJOR failures in your printer... and you consider that a win? my mk3s+ had 6k print hours when i sold it and was printing allmost like new only changed the nozzle and gave it lube/grease...
@@1bonebreaker1 I don't know why all the people fighting in the comment but I went and looked at what is the heat bed sensor and it was 5$ thing and when I looked at it at prusa website for their printers it was sold out. I'm not fanboy for either companies but I own A1 and I'm happy with it since it was affordable and plug and play I only lubed the Y axis so far since it remind me every month or so. people should stop being fan boys and just let the companies fight to produce better products. if we stick to one side and contune buying without looking logically not emotionally we only getting the short end of the stick if there no competing there is no need for companies to improve their products since they have crazy fanboys who will buy their products even if it's not the best. I would gladly trade my A1 if I was able to get better printer with same price but better features, reliability, and availability of spare parts. and not to forget the ease of use. I only care about my own self as an end user.
@@1bonebreaker1 I'm saying to not cast it aside and it's worth fixing.
@@1bonebreaker1 This is turning into Xbox vs PS again. Bro, stop being elitist.
My MK3S+ has printed well over 10,000 hours and all it has needed are hotend thermistors and a couple print fans. That is pretty crazy that a Bambu heatbed is shot after a fraction of what my Prusa has done.
People portray bambu lab as the ultimate innovator, they just looked at the voron project, and made an extra propietary version of the trident.
For me, prusa takes it for a few specific reasons, if prusa stops existing, much of their machines can be replaced with off the shelf parts, bambu on the other hand is majority proprietary. prusa is made in europe with better working regulations and wages. prusa has great customer care and their up gradability is unbeaten in the market.
As well as all that, prusa came from the open-source and built on it. bambu took from the open sauce, made it proprietary, using it to profit for themselves wile giving nothing back. i know my prusa is gonna work and keep printing at a good solid speed reliably, their not the fastest but with relatively little modding they can hold their own. If I need something done quick, i look to my voron .2 that can accelerate at twice the speed of a bambu and is half the price, as well as being completely open source and easily replaceable.
I'm totally with you on the issue, but I think that even European Companies HAVE to be competitive. Their whole market strategy can't be based all on petiness from customers. The same with electric cars unfortunatelly, Volkswagen (Vehicles of the people, literally) is selling EVs for 40k knowing they'll be the only one allowed in 6 years. Why shouldn't I buy a chines SUV EV that cost half the price and is genuinly better? Same with bambu, remember their response didn't come yet to the Prusa Core One. Their printers were released 2 years ago. I honestly think prusia underdelivered here. This printer with no easy multi color printing and somewhat a weirderd build volume already is not up to standard for today. I think the competition is once aganin gonna be blown away. Remember those guys come from DJI. DJI has virtually no competition, they even took on the GoPro market because the Westeners were so fucking incompetent. So too little too late from prusa.
@@lorenzolupica8833 European firms can never compete over the price tag alone, because if you care for your workers and your environment its more expensive then if you do not. Top that with "optimizing the conditions" in a country and you stand no chance.
I think Prusa sits in a niche where they cater the needs of tinkerers and the niche is so big, that they can't manufacture enough goods (some Prusament is always sold out).
And the tinkerer in me really likes the core one - while it may not be the right thing in a professionell environment, if you have upgraded your MK3 to MK4 and MK4s, you now can go the next step all while owning exactly one printer.
So Prusa is not for one to start 3d printing as cheap as possible, but for people who care a bit more about non-shady practices and are up to pay premium for that on their hobby.
Totally agree, just want to add that Prusa was there for 3D printing development pretty much from the start, and if Bambu, Creality, and other even exists is because Prusa did most of the R&D in the first place and everything they've done was Open Source, they allowed the "cheap" 3D printing to be a thing, without them we coul still be stuck in the old rep/rap era where everything about 3D printing was DYI.
Yes they are not ahead like they used to be, but products and longevity is good, and until now they never let customer down, with upgrade path after every big design update so you're never completely outdated. Not sure your Bambu X1 can become an X1+ / X2 whenever this thing comes out...
That may have been true at some point, but the "off the shelf components" business ain't true anymore. They aren't open source anymore. If Prusa goes under, unless they release their source, there's no replacing their electronics.
@taylorlandry641 those components are just as good, look at vorons, they are entirely off shelf parts that can beat their proprietary machines. As far as I can see thd only reason they do it is ease of manufacturing and to control the fixability of their products forcing you to buy replacements from them
there is one show stopping deal breaking make or break killer issue for me - closed sourced dependance on a Chinese web service is a hard no
all BambuLab printers support a LAN-only mode where it is not connected to anything outside of your own local network. You can still send prints over to your printer via the local network but don't have any cloud capability (the App becomes useless). You can also just use the micro SD-card.
Please explain what you're so afraid of? No conspiracy theories - just evidence-backed facts please.
just put it on a VLAN like all your other IOT devices
Just don't give it network connectivity then, and move on with your day.
@@Denis_v1.0_beta China steals IP.
Here's my take on my recent dive into the world of 3D printing:
Just a few months ago, I decided to finally pull the trigger on buying a 3D printer. It was an exciting time with the Prusa MK4S and Bambu models dominating the market. After doing my research, I found that both printers deliver similar output and quality, though Bambu usually comes at a lower price point.
For me, the decision wasn't just about the printer itself. I've always valued open-source principles and the ability to tinker, upgrade, and customize. That's why I went with Prusa. It's a perfect match for someone like me who loves getting hands-on with technology.
However, if I were running a business, the equation would change dramatically. Cost versus performance would be the deciding factor, and Bambu would likely be my choice for its economic advantages.
Now, here's where my concerns lie with Bambu. They're often compared to Apple in the 3D printing world, aiming to dominate through what could be seen as under-pricing. My worry is what happens once they secure a significant market share. Could they start introducing restrictions? Like, maybe they'll limit printer usage time or charge for each print job? What about making the printer essentially a rental unit - sell it cheaper upfront but then you're paying as you go?
And with the NFC technology on their filaments, there's a risk they might restrict you to only using Bambu-branded materials. Given that Bambu isn't just a startup but backed by heavy hitters in Chinese conglomerates with deep pockets, these scenarios don't seem far-fetched.
This isn't just about price or technology; it's about control over what we own and how we use it. That's why I appreciate Prusa's commitment to open-source, which not only aligns with my values but also protects against some of these potential future restrictions. It's a lot to think about, but it's clear to me why I made the choice I did.
How is prusa perfect for someone who likes to get hands on? The hardware is closed source. An open source printer like maybe something like sovol would be far more geared towards that.
Prusa _used_ to be for open source folks, but havent been for years.
This sounds like it was written using AI from someone at the Prussia marketing office.
@@BeefIngot Most Prusa printers come as kits that you assemble yourself - it doesn't get much more hands on unless you design your own printer. There are only a few hardware parts that are specific to the printer. Most parts are standard (motors, gears, rods, screws, etc.) or easily printed (all plastic parts). You can get the print files (and at least partial design sources, like SCAD or STEP files) online. You can buy ALL replacement parts for fair prices on their web shop - you could assemble a full functioning printer from their spare parts store. If you feel like it you can even get the designs for their electronics and the sources for their firmware.
If I wanted to build another copy of my Prusa MK4 without buying a single part from Prusa: I would have to reverse engineer only 3 hardware parts - main frame, print bed and the aluminium frame of the hot end. None of those would be a real hurdle, but they'd be expensive to make as a one-off. The electronics I could just order from a PCB manufacturer using Prusa's original design files - again the one-off cost would be higher than buying the part from Prusa. Anything else would be cheap standard parts or printed PETG parts with designs downloaded from Prusa.
This is the MOST Open Source that I have seen in any complex hardware. What else would you want?
@KonradTheWizzard Assembling the printers is a gimmick that doesn't actually teach you anything of worth to justify the time spent. The savings also don't even bring them in line with the competition.
There are many more parts than you've stated that are closed and I would bet that vs Bambulab Prusa is at maybe 40% proprietary vs Bambulabs 60%.
Further, consider that the Core one in particular only really has the 2 gimmicky side panels availible open source. Everything else is closed, and anything that 8snt just so happens to be a standardized part such as a bearing or motor.
Sovol has truly open source printers where you even get pcb schematics (quite important and something Prusa obfuscate and does not provide).
In essence there is a whole lot more open source wise you could want out of a printer.
@@BeefIngot I assembled my own MK4 a few months ago. For me it taught me how it is put together, where to find potential problems and most importantly to not be afraid of taking it apart. For me that is VERY important.
I’m looking to venture into the 3D printing hobby space. With decades in the IT industry, the idea of a Chinese, walled garden, cloud based product is actually terrifying. The Bambu feature set is definitely compelling, but I’m beyond over China’s industrial espionage tactics.
Funny enough, I currently have an Elegoo Neptune 4 pro. Works beautifully and at $210, I would argue better value than the A1 mini. My problem with the market currently is that a few years ago, we talked about every manufacturer. Now we act like there are only 2.
Great comment. I also have a Neptune 4 Pro and it's been an excellent and very reliable printer, and a great value.
It's crazy that an industry this huge didn't have any companies truly innovating and a brand new company was able to come in and immediately become the new standard of which even the established companies are now chasing.
Because market was not big enough.
Yep. Fear that shows that Open Source does not automatically mean that innovation really fosters.
Did they innovate? I see nothing in Bambu that wasn't already created in open-source projects. They took all of that, and contributed nothing back.
The innovation happened in the Voron project years before Bambu came about.
Unreal take to say they didn’t innovate. They were the first to do force bed probing, lidar, and ams. Not to mention the welded chassis and rfid tags. And before you find some obscure example of someone who did these things first, they clearly integrated it better and refined it since there the first widespread use of any of these. It is the first and borderline still only printer in the world that simply works, and that is what the mass market desired. It went from a toy hobbies used to make little gizmos to a true engineering tool (and also print a hell of a lot more gizmos lol)
Having owned most printers from both Bambu and Prusa, I can confirm both are fantastic - which is best for you depends on use case. If I were to recommend a printer for a home user or even a print farm startup with a budget, I’d probably say pickup a P1S - great quality, speed and ease of use. I also like the ability to chain AMS units for 16 color prints. That being said, I have an issue that requires some of my time to fix on the X1s and P1Ss around once every 100 hours or so (and the purging with the AMS is extremely inefficient - hoping they optimize it more in firmware updates). My XLs and MK4Ss are dead reliable, rarely ever having any kind of issue at all. The experience is a little less user friendly for beginners, but getting better with each update. They are also easy to work on if I do want or need to. If you are more experienced or need as little downtime and material waste as possible, it’s Prusa for me. The upgrade path makes them cheaper in the long run as well. BTW- there is a camera option on the Core One.
These are great points and observations, especially that the plug and play of Bambu appears somewhat of a gimmick where they downstream-ed the time and efforts to keep them running on the back end no one thinks about when impulse buy vs the front end where most consumers keep their undying focus.
This is likely the only wave Bambu can keep all the features and specs affordable and competitive.
The purge in Bambu can be manually tuned with test prints as it is filament specific the the particular spools and order you print in. Options are in bs/orca
@ The flaw is in the lack of retraction and the cut point leaving so much in the heatbreak to purge - that needs a firmware fix. They did one fix recently, but it wasn’t enough.
How is your setup on the XL and what do you print?
Is it engineering, multimaterial with high accuracy..., or visual consumer stuff
One of the biggest advantages of Prusa is that it is based in Europe, where I also live. This means that their products comply with European regulations, which improves customer security and makes warranty services and returns smoother. Additionally, money stays within Europe, which is important for supporting the local economy. Prusa's factory also provides jobs in the region, contributing to job creation within Europe.
Prusa’s device support is also exceptional. For example, my old MK3S printer, which I've been using for several years, still receives updates. This long-term support is a big advantage compared to many other brands. Prusa’s open-source mentality is also a key factor in my decision to buy their products: it gives users the freedom to modify and share their devices, which appeals to those who value openness and community support.
The absolute biggest win for Prusa printers right now is the noise. A lot of us aren't running farms in separate rooms. Or maybe are even forced to have the 3D printer in their office.
Then Prusa suddenly becomes your only out of the box FDM printer. I really hope more manufactures will take those things into consideration as well.
As a long time sufferer of the unworkable MMU2 (firmware was simply crap) and the MMU3 (endless tip tuning per filament) I can honestly say that comparing it to the Bambu AMS just shows the massive gap Prusa has in the multi material space. Prusa has nothing. Also the Bambu X1C is not throw away at all ... the parts to fix are easily available on the Bambu website and are really cheap. It's also very easy to work on and service and a very robust unit. Bambu parts are much better priced than Prusa parts. Prusa is just unable to compete on price. That said their work in the OpenSource space is to be commended particularly with their slicer.
Prusa has nothing? They have the XL, which is a lot less wasteful and can achieve actual multi material. The bambu is multi-colour, not true multimaterial.
How did prusa fall so far behind, when they appeared to be leading years back? If prusa himself were an engineer, then maybe things could have turned out different. It hard to support or depend prusa these days with what they are charging. Yeah, they really need to make their multicolor less diy looking, and more hassle free. That alone should be no go in 2025 when buying a 3d printer for multicolor.
They have a similar approach to noctua, give their engineers time to get things perfect so advancement has always been a bit slower, just in a new market with lower cost alternatives from china with actually good performance being pumped out faster and fatser their slower innovation strategy doesn't work as well anymore. That said they still have their european manuafturing and sourcing going for them, I do some times wonder how cheap prusa machines would be if they were made in china instead of europe.@@oneanother1
The MMU2 was a product with a known design defect. I fought with that thing for so many hours. I replaced the logic board, I replaced all of the servos (one by one). I printed custom feeds and pretty much every part from scratch. I contacted support. I started multiple threads. I wasted so much time trying to get that thing working. And the best I got was "keep trying, you'll get it!". No. I didn't get it working because it was a faulty design. And to prove it, I took that little power board from the MMU3 and put it on my MMU2 and it stopped giving the 5 flashing lights.
I will never forgive Prusa for that experience. I got my P1S with MMU and it's night and day. In just one year, I have as many hours on my bambu than I was able to achieve with my Prusa in 6 years. I spent so many hours with it fiddling and fighting.
skywardsoul, unless you have ever suffered with an MMU2 unit then I don't think you can understand why we see Prusa as a piece of crap. And the XL at $4000 is not a consumer printer, nor is it a competitor to the P1S or the X1C.
EDIT: Oh and don't forget the time they told me I needed to flash the firmware, then the zip download for the MMU2 didn't have the right files in it.
@@skywardsoul1178which for 5 colors costs the price of like 3 x1c
If you don't have time to even raise 2 support tickets on the bambu handy app, maybe its time you hire more staff to assist you. Or donate the printers to non-commercial users who could spend the time to fix them and then have a great asset for a new hobby.
It’s a business, not a charity. He isn’t obliged to give it for free when he could recover some cost from a printer form those who are willing to buy a damaged item.
Plus, when you write off stuff, sometimes you have to destroy it for the tax reasons.
@@slowcyclist4324 any of these things are better than doing nothing and leaving two expensive machines inoperable.
At my makerspace, when people ask about what kind of printer they should get, I ask them: Which do you want? A printer that you can unbox and print with, or one that teaches you about how they are built and want to learn from? If they are just looking for a set it up and work printer, I tell them to get a Bambu printer. If they want a project and want to know more, I tell them to get a Prusa kit and build it. A Prusa Mk3s was donated to our space and in the month that we've had it, it's been used more and failed less than the Ender 5 and Anycubic machines we have on the bench.
And all of this depends on your use case. I do casual 3D printing, with functional parts and some cosplay props. I don't sell my things, so having a quick printer isn't my focus, but it may be for others. I look for accuracy and the ability to print tougher materials, and have been rocking a single toolhead XL since I received my pre-order machine.
I do see the mindset of saying that Prusa is meeting Bambu at their level, but even the MK4 seemed more of a "We did the research on making this awesome Nextruder, can we put it on a MK3s and make a faster bed slinger?", while the Core One seems less like "How do we compete with Bambu" and more of a "How do we make a smaller version of the XL out of a MK4?"
So you ask them, do you want a product that works or do you want to stay poor? Seems like the only correct answer is Bambu. Why would you buy something to do a task that doesn’t do the task without significant time investment? I mean unless the dude is designing a better 3d printer, you don’t need to learn about it.
A 3d printer is an appliance. You wouldn’t use the same criteria for your stove or TV or lawn tractor. You just buy stuff that works. The days of people who are just inquisitive about 3d printing with plenty of time to waste to print trinkets is over. 3d printing now prints usable things. So it’s time for 3d printers to be treated like an appliance and not a hobby.
The 3D printing community we watched grow & develop is in the middle of another evolution. As a former long standing Prusa fan, I've sold off my Prusa products. At the end of the day, the company that gives us the most features for the best price will win. Until someone beats Bambu at their own game, they will continue to rise to the top. Sure, people care about the morals that developed the community - Prusa was at the forefront of that but for how long will people care? Prusa really screwed up with this release IMO. They had an opportunity to respond strong to Bambu's X1C and what did they do instead? Gave us less features for a considerable amount more than the X1C. The community loyalty that shielded Prusa is coming to an end. Eventually people will stop caring about the past and Prusa will be left behind as another company in history that got too comfortable at the top and stopped innovating (see Blackberry).
Hard for a European company to compete with Chinese costs, unfortunately
@@FarrelClement Many people ore prepared to pay a premium to receive premium features (X1C vs P1S is an example). What the OP has said is correct - Prusa are charging a premium without any value-add, and that's why their hole is getting deeper.
Been a longtime Prusa fan. Completely switched to bambulab. The Prusa premium just isnt worth it.
@@FarrelClement prusa didn't even tried. I knew prusa printer since 2017 and until 2019 where I decided to get a printer, they still are not available unless I paid a ridiculous delivery fee (they have no competition during this period). And they have a killer machine Prusa XL but didn't bother to release a price down ver where it would be far more competitive than a X1 clone
That the right mindset for customers. This applies to any other market. If there is competition, there will be better products, but if there is none, companies won't see any need to improve, and this will reflect on us as consumers.
My first 3D printer was an Ultimaker 2e+, hugely expensive, but at the time, it really seemed like the best thing out there. Around the time MK3s came out, I got an Ultimaker 3e, again, hugely expensive, but it really seemed like something else back then! Now, 5 years later, my UM3e is mostly forgotten, it's still here, I still have some 2.85mm filament for it, it still works, but it's features just aren't there. I honestly got jealous when I saw Prusa send out major firmware updates for older printers, heck even the Mini got major boost in performance, yet Ultimaker has abandoned older printers long ago. I'm pretty sure that once I spend my 2.85mm filament, I'll take out all the proprietary parts from that UM3e, and give it a single nozzle head with Trianglelab parts or something like that. I did something similar with UM2e+, and it's still being used. Way back when, I also bought some (much much much) cheaper CR-10s pro's, and with cheap upgrades, they are still running, very reliably. The whole experience thought me to avoid expensive and proprietary stuff. Core One looks super cool, if someone gifted it to me, I'd gladly use it, but I would never buy it. Not when I can get an Infimech Tx and get all the performance I need from it, right out of the box, and if it starts falling behind, it will be very easy to change/upgrade what I feel like. Prusa has its audience, and many fans, so I have no doubt that Core One will sell well, but I fell it's just not interesting enough to justify that price in the current market.
How can i disable the voice translation?
I bought my mother a Bambulab A1, and while the printer prints in much higher quality than my personal MK4S, the plastic parts on it always seem to break. The purge wiper broke within a week, and the webstore also seems to always be out of stock with replacement parts. A week ago, the AMS Lite filament hub broke, and I'm scrambling to fix it before Christmas.
I love the metal parts on my Prusa MK4S. The printer feels sturdy, and I haven't had a part break since I got it as a MK4. The Core One hasn't sold me whatsoever, and I thank you for the information and non-biased opinions you have provided in this video.
I am at 1.7k hours and 774 hours across my two x1c printing mostly pretty harsh ABS, ASA, and CF- materials and have needed very minimal maintenance compared to any other printer I have worked with from two Formlabs Fuse 1's, dozens of Lulzbot, dozens of Creality Ender's, several Voron, and a Trumpf TruPrint 5000
The Bambu Lab X1C has needed the least service and has been the most fire and forget of any printer I have experienced, the worst part is greasing the back lead screw, while even on machines that are coming close to $1,000,000 when you factor in all of the accessories, installation, shipping and training, the amount of down time is truly unreal, sometimes 2+ weeks to have a service technician come to service the equipment.
What is mentioned in the video, but seemingly not discussed in any of the comments, is that "excellent" Prusa tech support really still excellent?
I had an issue with a loud squicking bed, to which support replied to me if my belts are properly tensioned, "that noise is normal". Given any Prusa at our makerspace, it wasn't. Eventually i fixed it by reprinting all of the bed, but the problem really is that once you start searching around you'll see a stark influx of lackluster support stories over the last few years, both on reddit and their own forum. Not only overlooked problems, but also a lot of handfighting over replacement parts like faulty idlers/bearings and definitions of consumables when people haven't even got to a first proper print.
Which brings me to the question; why is this positive stereotype still a given for Prusa?
I'm not saying anyone else is doing it better, just that i question Prusa's still being "good".
I have a Bambu X1C with AMs at work, and recommend the Bambu ecosystem to everybody interested in 3D printers because of how incredibly trouble free it has been. The only problems we have had are hot ends breaking when they crash against a part which had failed bed adhesion (but they are cheap to replace) and GF/CF filaments breaking in the AMS a couple times. I should also say that I have only needed to replace hot ends 3-4 times, but that is the failure mode, not wearing out from abrasive filament. We have roughly 2,500 hours on our machine at this point. I ended up buying a P1S w/ AMS for home (and run it in LAN only mode) because of my experience with the X1C. I think my only big reason to go with anybody other than Bambu is to avoid China Cloud Services.
For reference, we run almost exclusively Bambu filament (PETG-CF, PAHT-CF, PA6-GF, ASA, TPU-HF, for production; PLA and PETG-HF for tools/fixtures and quick mock-ups).
Prusa had crash detection since MK3S. Bambu breaking hotend when not that rare printing issue occurs is sign of poor design. Bambu is good printer, but in long term reliability Prusa is the winner.
I have a similar experience. I have an X1C and P1S using Bambu filaments. Apart from minor failures (z height detection failure and failure to retract filament), it has been a joy to use the Bambu Labs ecosystem. The printers come with a bunch of the consumables and replacements are inexpensive (wipers, blade cutters, etc). And if you don't want to print from the Bambu Cloud service, you don't have to. Octoprint has preliminary support for Bambu printers and the old SD card works fine as well.
You really shouldn't be running the abrasive filament through the AMS. At least that was what they said originally. Did that guidance change?
@@jan.bednarik Prusa crash detection has notoriously not worked well since the mk3s. Furthermore, Bambu also has crash detection. Furthermore, the heat break breaking is actually the best point to fail as its the cheapest point to replace.
This is an interesting subject, I personally started with an old Lulzbot Taz 5 that barely worked, but I was able to replace the fried heated bed connector and fix its many other issues. I now own a Bambu X1C and love its worry free operation! That said I don't think it is the best printer in all regards, the lack of open source firmware is annoying, potentially prohibiting, but the fact that all these known printer brands like Prusa, Creality and many others failed to innovate and create an improved product. Instead waiting for Bambu to come along and dominate the market is disappointing. This is a classic case of competition fueled innovation. You can stay brand loyal, but at the end of the day the superior product should prevail, and Prusa nor Bambu are superior product to each other in all respects. If Bambu does nothing else they motivated other companies to innovate their own products.
Even a Prusa fanboy like me, must accept the fact that Prusa just ain't leading the market at this point.
They still have many good aspects, but they have been sitting on their hands for too many years until they released the MK4.
The relase of Core One isn't a fix to the challenges they face.
However, I hope it's the beginning of a new chapter that MIGHT bring them back to a place among the leading pack.
I hope that improvements to Core One will follow in rapid succession with features like:
- A native and integrated camera,
- automated flow calibration,
- actively heated chamber,
- higher extruder and bed temperatures.
- Prusa LINK functionality at the level of Prusa Connect.
Also, a lot of great features have existed in Orca for some time and only a few are slowly finding their way to Prusa Slicer (Alpha).
Tools for easier filament tuning are still missing in Alpha, but it is nice to finally have multi-beds and paint-on fuzzy skin.
They really needed a bigger build plate and more colors. That's where the actual value comes from for the end user
I bought a ELEGOO Saturn 4 Ultra. It’s a phenomenal printer with amazing performance, but they fall short by upselling you their Chitubox software suite which is quite expensive for a slicer. With Prusa, you never get that feeling.
While I view the Prusa as premium product, I actually think they managed to keep the price reasonable considering the feature set. Is it the best deal on the market? Definitely not. I think Qidi probably has the sweet spot for price to high performance. That said, for printing mostly PLA and easier filaments, there are many better deals. Pros and cons to every brand, but I think the Prusa should be in consideration for anyone who wants a well supported, reliable, repairable machine which isn't totally made in China.
Your idea of premium is plastic instead of metal, plastic instead of glass, and 3D printed parts?
@hlop_vmp You are focusing on a single aspect, material type. There are absolutely products which are made from plastic which are more premium and generally superior to metal counterparts and vice versa. Premium also does not just imply quality or performance. Premium is often about a brand and isn't even necessarily a good thing. It can be adjacent to luxury. High quality doesn't always mean better overall. I used the term intentionally to imply the bad and the good. General quality should be high, but they are also charging a premium, if you will.
I have a MK4s Which started out life as a MK3 and I upgraded a couple times. Gonna sit this one out for a year and see what develops; My Prusa really has been flawless though the UI is feels very hobby still. I suspect Bambo will make another X1c in a bigger size at a competitive price; will probably go that direction if they do, though my heart remains with the open source and ongoing slicer development that Prusa does and the others just leech off of. The next big leap is non-planar printing, and waiting impatiently for that....
From what I've heard, parts for Bambu are just as easy to obtain as parts for Prusa, and both are priced reasonably. However, I've also heard that Prusa will be able to provide better support when it comes to repair and trouble shooting advice. If you know how to repair 3D printers, either company will still be a good choice in that regard. Now as far as which brand is more reliable, that honour may belong to Prusa. I tend to think of Bambu printers as being more hobbyist friendly, while Prusa might be the more go-to choice for print farms. Especially, when you realize that Prusa 3D prints parts for their own printers ON their own printers. This means they are doing the beta testing on their new products not their customers. So, it probably comes down to what you want and need in a 3D printer. With Prusa printers and parts now made in the USA (Printed Solid) and possible tariff increases on goods from China, the cost difference between the two is going to evaporate.
The Bambu Wiki is pretty comprehensive actually, so while you may not have an actual human walking you through stuff, information is easy to obtain. Basically every part is available in the shop, at mostly reasonable prices. Bambu does a far better job than most other companies in this regard.
BBL parts are available when in stock, and it seems they’re never in stock, always the “Notify when Available” even then when you do find the time to order its out of stack again.
3:00 should be easily replaceable - even cheaper than prusa spare parts
-Longevity
-Customer service
-You can just buy the upgrade kit to transform your Mk4 to the Core One so you get the machine for half the price of a comparable new machine
I totally see the selling point. Especially professionals who value customer service can't overlook this.
U completely disregard the fact that the Mk4 itself is a overpriced machine. So u in total paying as much as an x1c with the ams. I dont think it is possible prusa fan are all this ignorant, im guessing most are bots now so 010010101101010101
Pretty sure there Core One upgrade is only for the 4S. No direct 4 to core
A lot of people ignore these, but the reliability, ease of repair, and expectations of future compatibility from Prusa is amazing.
People say they're expressive, and they are, not for someone who just wants to tinker with a 3d printer. But, for someone who wants that quality and the brand behind it, it's worth it. There's no reason so many print farms would have Prusa if they weren't worth it to at least some people.
@@tired5925 The MK4 is expensive yes, but not overpriced for what it offers. They offer an amount of service, quick repairability, and customer service you don't quite get from other 3d printers.
I will say, these benefits make it more of a print-farm style printer, than one many people would want as their only printer. It doesn't have the same versatility as an enclosed and multicolor 3d printer, but that's not their target with the device. Their target are people who repeatably want to print quality on the few things they do print, and be able to make repairs and upgrades in the future.
@@dfwdweghom8902 This is correct as stated by Prusa so far. It would be upsetting if there wasn't a specific upgrade kit from MK4 to Core One. You CAN buy the MK4S upgrade for the MK4, but surely a MK4 to Core One conversion shouldn't cost the entire extra 100 USD to do.
30% more build area sounds impressive until you realise it's just all extra height. I pretty much never run out of vertical space but I always want a bigger build plate
For me as a somewhat advanced home user the volume is the deal breaker on the core one. Even 250 cubed is jus limiting, and for small things I run a a1 mini in parallel. Looking forward to that H2D.
If that is the next Bambu (nothing is confirmed till it is). They hinted they were looking at the Prosumer market, not Consumer market for the next printer.And if the patents they filed in the last year or so are anything to go by, it will be something for the business user.
@@alexa5231 H2D is the next printer because it has leaked. Prosumer market is not a thing. Theres just grades for consumer from low end to high end. Whether you are making money from it does not really matter for the manufacturer and industry is entirely different beast. H2D will be a high end, larger printer with a new type of multi filament head/system. I hope it will cost under 2k, but I have not much hope for that.
Bambu support has actually been fantastic for me, and I've been a supporter since the kickstarter
I think Prusa needs some kind of VVD system or a compact MMU inside a box. That way it could compete with X1C (not P1S). To compete with k2 plus and new generation of big size printer they need something like a “CORE ONE XL” (just a bigger core one with the bed from the XL and that “VVD” multimaterial system). Oh, please add a damm nozzle wiper
What i miss here is that prusa does not just want to let the camera out of their printers. They have to because it´s a patent from Stratasys. They just don´t want to get sued like Bambu and TierTime gets. Chinese manufacturers just don´t care. They just ignore the patent. Honestly. That is not ok. In terms of everything else the core one is in my opinion far superior then the bambu, because of features like easy maintainability, long life span, high precision print quality, the possibility to add a GPIO hackerboard to control a camera, robot arm or RGB LED´s and many more. The Noise level is also way better then with any bambu printer. Last but not least you said that if one machine breaks you throw it away and buy a new one. As far as i remember 3d printing was a technology to prevent exactly that. It´s a technology to be able to repair broken things instead of throwing them away. I mean that´s truly awful to hear. Shouldn´t we take a bit more care about our planet?
Prusa core one is perfectly fine. Ppl would be moaning no matter what.
Lol. Prusa was like the what 3d printers aspired to be in the early days. A well established 3d printer brand, that could charge that much back then. They fell off big time because they didn't do anything for years. They let all of the Chinese brands surpass them in every way. It doesn't make sense anymore to try to sell expensive 3d printers to the consumer market. Many early brands also bit the dust. At the end of the day, its abou5 marketshare, cause everyone is racing to the bottom. Prusa gonna bite to dust too, if they arent gaining marketshare.
@oneanother1 so buy Chinese if you do not like prusa. You either do not like product or you do. Decision is all yours. If I would be taking to account all those arbitrary "problems" you mentioned I would have a hard time to buy even toilet paper
@@nex7053 well, that is why people are moaning, especially prusa fanboys. If they didn't care, then no moaning. The core one is fine, except the price isn't.
@@oneanother1 well they are not chinese sweatshop employing kids for bowl of rice and building safety nets to prevent suicides. And price is not that bad 30k in CZK is completely ok for locally produced product - it is one third up since when I was buying mk3s but I get full enclosure. Prusa fans are not ones moaning. Those who are moaning would like to have custom made printer to satisfy all their quirks. Prusa fan will understand that prusa is developing open ecosystem of enduser printer with upgradability and interchangeable parts in mind. You maybe can get cheaper bamboo, but when next iteration of printers will be available or new technology you will have to buy new one, but with prusa, you will always have way to do cheap upgrade.
Yes looks perfect
One thing that bothers me about Prusa is their somewhat short-sighted approach. Josef Prusa himself once said that no better printer would come after the MK3. (In terms of price-to-performance ratio, the MK3 was unbeatable compared to competitors at the time.) However, when Bambu released their printer, Prusa launched the MK4 half a year later, claiming that this would be enough. As we know, that wasn't the case. The MK4 now seems like a transitional model that could have been skipped and replaced directly by the Core One, which should have been released right after the MK3.
I’ve been wondering what Prusa was thinking at that time. Why didn’t they see the market's direction? Was it a matter of too much pride in their own achievements, or were they simply blind to what customers truly wanted? It seems like Prusa fell behind and didn't react quickly enough.
I got a p1s earlier this year and just picked up an almost brand new mk3s for $200 just because i wanted a prusa.... options and competition are awesome there is a place for both.
Based on what info can we determine the X1C is "poised to be replaced" afaik Bambu has not shown off any new machines at the latest 3d-printing expositions.
With the incoming tarrif on goods imorted from china, and that the Prusa will soon be build is the US these price points may become a mute point.
I would like to see your customer service experiences with trying to repair those faulty Bamboo, most people do not have the option of just throwing away a printer.
@@garytfish that will tip the scale for sure. Will be interesting to see how the prices compare once the dust settles.
I definitely wouldn’t just throw the printers in the bin but might consider selling them for cheap as is to someone with more time that is willing to repair them. I might consider making a video about the repair process if there’s interest in it.
@@ygk3d The force sensor is $5 and the heat bed is $120. There are step by instructions linked on the product page.
You have videos showing the Prusa XL build so I can imagine it isnt a skill issue. Michael from teaching tech has a fantastic debunking video on Bambu repairs so to give up without even an attempt is odd. Would you toss your Prusa machines if a part fails? If I remember you went through a ton of videos troubleshooting,repairing and even kludging together fixes for your Prusa machines.
@ thanks. Definitely not giving up. Just saying they’re not usable without repairs and haven’t had time or desire to dive into that yet. I didn’t mean to imply that they are permanent paperweights.
Just FYI google is dubbing this video if you switch the language on youtube. I was really confused for a moment hearing AI generated slop on this video. All because the language was set to german.
3:05 Sorry don't by your comment that it is probably not worth fixing ... Bambu sells most parts relatively cheaply... I gladly take them off you lol
@@K8Stuff I’m hoping I’m wrong about that. It’s just an intimidating thought of having to take it apart.
@@ygk3d Honestly, it's not any worse that disassembling a desktop or laptop computer. Just keep track of your screws and take photos as you go for reference.
Bambu also have preety good how to guides.
@@ygk3d Intimidating that you'll lose Prusameters when Josef finds out you took a screwdriver to a printer other than his own brand?
You come across as an absolute goddamned shill.
@@ygk3d If you are running a print farm and you are afraid to open a printer, you might need to find someone to do it for you, or perhaps its not the right business for you.
I have two MK4S', and I will upgrade both once the upgrade becomes available. However, I am definitely in the tinkerer category, so it is probably a core (meh?) Prusa customer.
My printers started as kits and will remain as long as Prusa releases upgrades. They are basically maintenance-free and produce print after print without any issues.
The MMU3 works, and yes, out of the box, it takes up a lot of space, but I have my spools wall-mounted above the printer using rewinding spool holders, and then we're in the AMS-size territory. It's not as slick looking, I'll give you that :)
It feels a little disingenuous to call the X1Cs paperweights because they require maintenance, and then compare them to printers that you have actually performed maintenance on? (Purely on the maintenance/replacement parts, not the speed etc)
Maybe I’m misreading that though?
In the one year I've had my P1S, I've put as many hours as I did with my Prusa Mk3(s+) in 6 years. I spend more time printing with Bambu. With the Prusa, it was _constant_ maintenance. Constant.
I think it’s good that prusa got shaken up, but we should never underestimate the danger of them leaving us alone with Apple-like monstrosity.
The force sensors in the X1C are a user replaceable (and pretty inexpensive - $5) parts, so your paper weight could be printing in no time and (almost) no money, the heated bed is also a user serviceable part but its not cheap (around $150, but so are Prusa's heated beds). The real issue with the X1C serviceability is the motion system, there are user-serviceable parts but they are expensive and there are some parts (like the Y axis bearing for example) that are not serviceable at all. Bottom line is - the serviceability of the Prusa printers is unparalleled, but the Bambu is mostly user serviceable but there are some parts that will render you printer useless if worn out.
I'm pretty sure on my bambu p1s ,I can buy every single part as a spare ?
The Core One looks really cool, but I think they are missing the mark, too many people want something bigger.
While I do too, I do think it might be a vocal minority bevauce people fine with smaller aren't speaking up as they have no complaints.
I find it odd you chose to give up before even attempting to fix the Bambu printers. I got pretty unlucky with my Bambu and wound up with a pretty unreliable printer but through the internet and help with support was able to figure out it was not a force sensor issue but a damaged hotend and bubbled bed sheet. Replace the hotend and bedsheet and printer went back to be smooth as silk
I have an X1C with AMS, it has around 550 print hours. It's been collecting dust for weeks because I keep getting the Tool Head has fallen off error message for no reason. In addition the AMS is no longer recognized. I got a lot of spare parts from Bambu but replacing them is a pain and most of them are not fixing my issues (got my third toolhead cover, why?). I ordered a Core One now as its fitting my needs even better (e.g. printing fully closed PLA/PETG and active temperature control) and i hope for better/more effektiv support.
Brace yourself, a thousand people are about to start replying to you saying that their Bambu works just fine and has a million hours of printing no problem.
" I ordered a Core One now as its fitting my needs even better"
Wow you ordered and got a Core one BEFORE they even started shipping(jan 2025). This is $100% a real user...lmao. There are zero reviews, no active printer shipments, but somehow you have one....ok buddy.
Which version of unreleased Prusa slicer are you using that has Core One profiles?
Josef train your bots better, this is just embarrassing.
@@AmericanVirus-rf1rn He didn't say he'd received it. He said he ordered it. Put on your reading glasses.
@@warwickshaw155 lol
@@AmericanVirus-rf1rn I think you missed a "I hope" in their comment.
As everyone says, it depends on what you want. But for me, it also depends on the “intangibles” … I’m not interested in something that I can’t take apart, flip around, and fix on my own. I want great support when it’s a bit beyond what I can figure out. I want something that, like my MKS3, will be here for years. I want to feel confident in the type of company I’m investing in with my purchase. But that’s just me. YMMV. But I would suggest to anyone who’s out there deciding to make your own opinion. Plenty of folks are looking forward to the Core One. We’re just happy with it so don’t feel a need to rush to the Internet to complain. Happy printing!
Prusa core one doesn't appear to have anything better than the competition, while still trying to charge an arm and leg for it. Prusa needs to face reality, this isn't what consumers want. Their multicolor solution too bulky, and the size of the core one is too small. Prusa missed the mark on this one. I don't know if the prusa fanboys can save prusa this time.
The reason its so divided is the prusa fanboys are the only ones who care and comment. Prusa clearly aren't selling as well as they use to, if they have to release a new printer every year.
The Core 1 would probably sell better if it had a printbed of 300mm2 or 3200mm2 and a better multi-color solution, Maybe optional second print head like the RatRigs.
Consisentcy is the Selling point of Prusas, a lot businesse i know have prusas despite them being smaller volume or slower, but theyve had better consistency print to print.
@@DanielLopez-up6os so I guess they havent upgraded to bambulab yet? That's like what I've been seeing a lot of prusa owners doing from the mk3. From a consumer friendly product, well its night and day with multicolor involved. Having a good multicolor printer is the future.
I don't mind old school 3d printers, as I'm a tinkerer. For a consumer friendly product, well you need to over a competitive product at a competitive price. Prusa ain't it anymore. They are turning into boutique 3d printers, for the fanboys. They are losing marketshare, because they've priced themselves out of the market.
@DanielLopez-up6os so I guess they havent upgraded to bambulab yet? That's like what I've been seeing a lot of prusa owners doing from the mk3. From a consumer friendly product, well its night and day with multicolor involved. Having a good multicolor printer is the future.
I don't mind old school 3d printers, as I'm a tinkerer. For a consumer friendly product, well you need to over a competitive product at a competitive price. Prusa ain't it anymore. They are turning into boutique 3d printers, for the fanboys. They are losing marketshare, because they've priced themselves out of the market.
Some of us are willing to pay for quality, service, and a name.. I am not a Prusa or Bambu labs owner but I appreciate many things about the products they have. I personally would love to own a Prusa or a Bambu, but overall support and quality I would have to say that Prusa hands down wins that one. Prusa will always cost more due to location where the machine is being made has higher cost of living and cost of manufacturing, this is not a deal killer at all. Most folks do a purchase primarily for quality and support. Price is usually not at the top of the priority list if a person deems it to be fair when looking at the overall package.
I have had only minor repairs on my X1C and P1S with minimal maintenance, and over 1700 hours between them (probably more, that was just the last time I remember). One actual part needing replacement, that's it (I have replaced a few others as preventative maintenance). Bambu's parts have stayed in stock, are fairly priced, and even though I found the maintenance on my Enders intimidating, I have gotten pretty comfortable taking apart the AMS, and everything I've had to do so far on the Bambus has been ok. They have not been able to keep their filament as available, and as a tiny business I can't really rely on Bambu filament, so I mostly use a few other brands.
LOL, I have no skin in this game. I'm an engineer who uses 3D printers and used to love PRUSA, but theyve been left far behind by Bambu and dare I say it, Qidi and Creality isnt too far. The new printer is not really worth it compared to the Bambu.. Once the X2 comes out they will be blown out of the water.
The competition between Bambu and Prusa has been great for the 3d print community as a whole. Bambu really shook the foundations and in doing so this has led to a great flood of printers hitting the markets these past two years.
I think we have all witnessed many costly mistakes also. Bambu and Qidi and many other companies I do believe have shown us that they need to test more before releasing machines to the market. I do think the machines that get designed in 2025 and beyond will be some extraordinary machines. Will the manufacturers listen to us?
I want to see multihead, multicolor, chamber heater, bed temps increased, nozzle temps reaching 450c. Minimum footprint of 380-400 with height of 600. I want to see premium component options for guaranteed accuracy. I would like to see thick solid build plates and fast and easy nozzle changes. Auto bed calibration and flow calibration the norm. Give me those features and take the time and use high quality components and take pride in the wiring job and use a top tier power supply. Surely one of these companies will make it happen.
I challenge a company to design a two head solution that can use up to a dozen filaments per head. This can be done, is anyone up to the challenge? How about variable bed angle? So many features I would love to see. Please, before you bring it to market just ensure it is well built and any part is readily available on market launch date as a spare. Quality and the ability to easily repair a machine is the other end of the equation very few get right.
@JTs3DPrints I think the new Bambu HD will be the answer to your questions. Maybe CES.l, but you would know more than me as I'm just an end user. I'm waiting for the new bambu. Ready to pre order. Take my money!
"I have no skin in this game" is a useless statement used to try to trick people into valuing your opinion more as if somehow you're 8mmune for bias.
You literally directly go on to describe your "skin in the game". If that's no skin in the game, no one has skin in the game outside of the companies themselves.
Completely lost me at Creality. To even mention Creality in the same paragraph is amusing, given how awful that company is. Their printers tend to be poorly thought out, poorly tested, full of lemons and usually need quite a bit of fixing. Support is sketchy too.
Went through years of fighting their rubbish machines, spending most of my time troubleshooting, tuning and fixing, with lots of frustration and months long breaks from printing. Went to Prusa at last, smooth sailing.
@@skywardsoul1178 Lost in translation.. Im saying even a shite company like creality isnt too far behind. I would never buy their garbage FYI.
Once we get some consumer machines like the X1C with the repairability of Prusas and nozzle temps of at least 350C, beds of 120C+, and chambers reliably north of 60C it feels like the average DIY market is going to go downhill fast. Right now the Creality K2 is close, but it's still Creality.
I run a modified Voron Trident and one of the only compelling benefits over current off-the-shelf offerings I still have is higher temps. If Bambu pushed their nozzle to 350C that would be even less of an argument.
It's truly crazy how fast the market switched around when the X1C was released. To think I and so many others started on cheap Enders and now we're here only a few years later...
Bambu has all parts easily available through their online store. They have a full wiki to guite you through troubleshooting and repairs. They are absolutely repairable, much more so than most other companies. I really dont get why nobody seems to bother looking if the statements they make actually align with reality.. Sure, open source is noce to have, but not necessary to get a repairable product. I like what Prisa does ethics wise, but that doesn't mean Bambu has to be bad by default.
My main concern is about how long Bambu will provide the replacement parts. While most hobbyists might just buy a new printer in 3-4 years, companies don't want to replace a whole farm if they can't get the replacement parts anymore.
I hope that Bambu will keep providing these, but they don't have a track record yet.
Do a google search - "X1C Y axis bearing replacement" and you will understand why the X1C is not fully user serviceable. Its a pity Bambu chose to assemble some parts of their products in a way that prohibits user serviceability, I really hope they will deviate from this path in the future.
I got an MK3 and upgraded over the years to the MK4S. I'm looking forward to upgrading the core one when available.
I do fear that Prusa may be usurped by newer companies like Bambu, which would be a shame. I've always had an excellent experience with the company, their products, and their ethos.
My gut tells me that a company like Prusa, with the amount of genuine passion shown for their business and community, will find a way to continue their success. Success may not look like being the dominant marketshare holder, but I don't believe they ever were. Their success came from making high quality machines backed by an honest company with a great community. Just my 2 cents.
Ultimately it seems Bambu is likely, and unfortunately, going to leap frog the Core one in all ways, including pricing and overall features, and likley will ship with less lead time and before ther Core one still 😢
I think you're missing a crucial point - what Bamboo is doing is actually expanding the market by offering a cheaper, yet reliable printer that's accessible to newcomers. This includes providing a better community experience for new users who don't have to worry about complex print settings. With Bamboo, if you want something printed, it's as simple as clicking and waiting. In contrast, Prusa hasn't helped expand the low-end/middle market at all by promoting their XL and MK4s+ models with expensive price tags. I'm not even comparing the MMU2 (which is essentially garbage) and AMS by Bamboo - 3D printing has tremendous potential for expansion, but five to six years ago Prusa's decision not to produce cheaper models for the low-end market was a wrong one for this industry.
Another problem is distribution. Prusa doesn't ship from America, and the only distribution it has is through printed solid. Where I live we can simply walk into a shop like microcenter and walk out with a Bambu Lab printer. With a Prusa that costs more than $800., it will get held up in customs and I will have to pay some additional charge to release it at the border. This hasn't been a huge problem when the printer was only $800. like the mk3s etc. but it still really does cut down on the "impulse" buyers.
I paid like $15 to release two MK3S+ from customs and it only added a day to shipping. It's not a big deal.
I would absolutely buy a Core One over a X1C if I needed one of those printers today. I'm not sure I would do the same thing if I needed MMU. That 459$ USD difference is currently around $620 CAD, and let me let you in on a little secret - many of our salaries here in Canada are comparative to those in America BEFORE any conversions.
Yet if I was buying any printer today I would still choose the P1S over both. If money was really an issue, then the A1. And if I didn't need a printer right now at all, I would just wait for Bambu Labs next product.
I can't imagine the Core One will help Prusa remain competitive. I think it's safe to assume people picking up a printer for hobbyist use will continue to flock to BBL because their entry/mid level products remain on top. I also think many business owners may opt to get the cheaper X1C on the assumption that it's better to save money to buy whatever BBL puts out next rather than invest it in a more sustainable asset that may be far less competitive in just a years time. At the end of the day this product will probably sell best to previous Prusa owners, which isn't a great position to be in for Prusa.
The Core One isn't competing with the X1C, it's competing effectively with the P1S since feature for feature they are pretty much identical.... For the price of the XL you can also get pretty much 2 PROFORGE tool change printers which are made in the UK so that also removes the other "excuse" to go with Prusa.... Prusa should be led to pasture they've dug their own grave and they should lay in it.
I’ve always been curious to what extent Bambu is subsidized by the Chinese government. By analogy, Chinese EV companies are heavily subsidized and it makes it impossible for US and EU companies to compete without tariffs to protect local industry.
I like the prusa because they don't steal IP and haven't used slave labor
I bought a Prusa Mk3 when it first came out. I had a few issues with the kit assembly and Prusa was very helpful in fixing them. I upgraded the machine over time. When Prusa announced the XL, I placed a deposit. However, they didn't deliver, so I bought an X1 Carbon with the AMS. The AMS always jammed, but single filament prints were very nice and quick. Then the machine refused to accept over the air input. It also wouldn't upgrade. Bambu service wasn't helpful. I traded the X1 to my son and got my old MK3 back. My son got the X1 working and loved the accuracy for the small figures he makes. It still wouldn't upgrade. I just bought a Prusa XL 2 head printer. I hope it will be less trouble than the X1. It also will print the larger objects I print and allow engineering grade materials with inexpensive support materials. We'll see, but all this has made me a bigger Prusa fan than before.
Nice video. Ignore the fanboys. I think you laid everything out fairly. I am not a fan of Bambu due to their business practices. I also don't own a Prusa either, but they contribute to the growth and advancement of the community. And for a Trident clone (which is how I see all these commercial CoreXY printers), I think Prusa did provide quite a bit more innovation than any other clones. Not significant, but thoughtful and useful. Reducing chamber volume with inset sides will make a huge difference in chamber heating, sealed filament enclosure, managing chamber temperature during prints, being able to upgrade from an MK4S. That shows Prusa is invested in always offering an upgrade path.
Thats the only reason I havent bought a Bambu (their business pracitses).
I find it laughable many people point out that we shouldn't purchase yet another Chinese printer and instead favor a European maker. Meanwhile, I'd wager most of the electronics and appliances in their home came from China. Prusa has built a reputation for big promises, lot's of issues/delays and many many fixes to finally deliver a reliable product. Like those XLs and other machines.
Catching up is not enough, unfortunately. Prusa has done some amazing stuff with the Core One, coming off of their bedslinger heritage, but all it has done is close the gap with the competition from years ago. Seeing how fast things move, the Core One will be obsolete within 6 months, if not less.
my question is did you build the prusa's or buy them assembled. itd be wild to say youd rather BUILD a prusa but saying its too intensive to replace a part on your x1.
not even trying to repair the x1 is insane
I started on an ender3 V1, but after many years of that love/hate relationship, it was time to upgrade. My deciding factors were build size and ability to print more exotic filaments. I decided on a Qidi Plus4 and so far, its been flawless. I did replace my SSR board since I live in the US, but that was super easy. I knew about the flaw before I bought it, so it was a nonissue. Multi color is coming next month!
You can build an entire Prusa XL but replacing a $5 force sensor or even a $120 head bed means you have a paper weight?
Wut? Did you forget hot to hold a screwdriver and follow step by step instructions?
You've obviously never ran a print farm. This dude is constantly going from machine to machine and the downtime of basically none to replace things. He said FOR NOW. Something that you and other commentors seem incapable of recognizing
@@SiFireHasSpeed I own non but the words play in video make it look like a unbiase comparison but it looks so advertised for Prusa to me to devalue competitors and I don't angry at all.
@@Technobby If you think it was an anti-Bambu jab then I cannot save you.
@@SiFireHasSpeed Thank you for pointing this out! This is exactly what I meant. They're paperweights *for now*. I don't have time to fix them during this busy holiday season. I'll replace clogged nozzles, etc. but an entire heated assembly overhaul is more of an undertaking than I have time for right now.
@@Technobby Advertising for Prusa when I say that their new printer will be instantly dated when Bambu releases their next machine? That's not very good advertising...
Bambus being paper weights after only 1000h must be more of an user error / problem rather then printer problem. As an owner of 3, and printed well over 1000h on each of them with 0 problems and basic maintenance, it sounds very weird to me.
I'm curious, running a print farm, what are your thoughts on the more industrial 3D printers from Prusa and the like?
International the Bambu is WAY cheaper and easier to get than Prusa machines (in Canada anyways).
@@marcusone1 the shipping fees and import taxes/duties really hit you when buying a Prusa. And hello from a fellow Canadian 👋
@@ygk3d Not just that, our excange rate. Bambu X1C currently listed at 1,299.00 Canadian. Prusa Core One is 1199 USD, which is over $1,700 CAD without shipping and duty yet! by the time I get a Core One, I could almost buy 2 Bambu X1Cs. I love Prusa... but the need to stand out on more than reliability at that price difference.
Prusa has partnered with Printed Solid in the US to combat this issue, hopefully that comes true
@@dfwdweghom8902 won't matter for us Canadians i'm afraid. Again, where bambu has crushed Prusa. Setup of local wharehouses in many contries to offer free shipping, incluidng no extra duty charges!
@@ygk3d What hurts the most is that Prusa's business model makes it so to have their machines UL (or similar internationally recognized) certification, either a local importer or the end user needs to do it themselves. I wanted our uni department to get one but the safety and hazards office refused any machine that didn't have a cert to be plugged in the building's outlets, with good reason (insurance). That would have cost us 500-800$. For one machine.
We got a Intertek certified Troodon 2.0 from 3D Printing Canada that was only marginally more expensive than bought direct from Formbot.
It seems to be, as far as I know, the same with Bambu though. The local dealers do the certification themselves. I would never buy any consumer-grade 3D printer that's not certified and use it at home because if it did fail and burn my house down, I'd like my insurance to not deny a claim because of it.
IMO this is indefensible, both from Bambu and Prusa.
A lot of these comparisons sound to me like the two printers are supposed to somehow be equivalent things aimed at identical potential customers. This is partially true, there are surely people for whom both would work about the same. But there are others.
There are people with no technical knowhow who do not want to learn how the thing actually works would never even try to service their printer. Recommend them a Bambu printer and let them throw it away when it breaks. When it works it has the best chance of working right for a user like that. And there is a good chance that by the time it breaks a newer version with some (supposedly) groundbreaking feature will be on the market and very likely "on sale" most of the time so this kind of user will not even be all that mad about the old one breaking down.
There are people who like to do something specific that requires a slight customization of the hardware, or maybe just a crazy weird printing profile. Don't even try to sell them a glued together printer with closed firmware etc. Let them have something like a Prusa that can take all that experimentation and when you break it by experimenting the manufacturer still helps you fix it. And you have a good chance spare parts will be available for it six years later and not intentinally priced over half the price of a new printer.
There are people who for whatever reason absolutely cannot connect the printer to a network. Their company IT security won't let them, or they are paranoid, or whatever. A printer that loses none of its functionality except having to manually transport print files to it is the right choice for them. And having a physically removable wireless module clearly aims at those customers and might be the only modern printer they can buy.
Overall I like that Prusa did not try to just straight copy all the features Bambulab has to make their new printer competitive. I like that they made the new thing be still a Prusa with all the things typical for those and that instead they focused on offering various properties the competition does not have. To target potential customers who would otherwise maybe even buy a Bambu printer but would hate something about it.
And as an engineer I admire the design for how they figured out how to keep it user-serviceable to the last bolt while making sure thing go back together aligned square etc. It is one thing to design a printer to be assembled exclusively by trained personel using special jigs and it is a completely different game to make it designed for both fast factory assembly and possible to assemble with just basic tools at home. And it looks like they figured out how to do this while keeping the cost reasonable by using a lot of laser cut and bent sheet metal. And on top of that the printer still looks elegant and not totally industrial despite using such design. Personally I like the balance they have achieved. I suspect many people will not like that as much but also many will.
Personally I will not be buying either Bambu or Prusa for myself. I have a 500x500x500 Rat Rig printer, so all those 200-something mm beds seem tiny now that I have gotten used to printing 4kg 600x500x100 parts and similar. And compared how hard assembling, wiring and configuring a V-Core 3.1 used to be assembling the new Prusa kit will be a toy for toddlers 🙂. It would still be fun but all over in a few hours, not days, and you don't even need to study the CAD model to put it together 🙂.
If Prusa can solve the Bambu waste problem without costing over 4 grand they will eat into Bambu in a big way. More european buyers cannot stomach all the needles waste the bambu machines are deigned to produce
There is just no real way to not have a lot of wast with color printing and just 1 nosel . Prusa wont chang that and its also not mean to be used in big scal for that you need a tool changer were BambuLab will kill them in ever matric if they make one
A multi-head system seems indeed like the only option. Question is whether that can be made affordable..
Except its never reliable. Different moisture contents, different ambient temps, Different levels of water retention. Different ages. There are infinite variables to account for. You see those strings from the removed filament? They cause issues... period. Only way to have a reliable experience is to cut your losses. Still has a ton lower waste than CNC
They already have, It's called the MMU3
I had an issue with my AMS. I spent maybe a total of 5 minutes with support to get the issue diagnosed. They offered a replacement unit or a part plus a free roll of filament.
Even if you're not under warranty, the pressure sensor is $5. There are 3 of them. So, total parts cost is $15. They're located right under the bed - you can see one of them if you just look and the other two are covered by a cable cover. Remove a few screws, replace the sensors and you're up and running.... well, maybe put the screws back, too.
The core1 shares a lot of components with the MK4s. It is kind of an mixture of their AFS printers and the MK4s. The AFS is Prusa's fully automated printfarm which can run up to 18 printers 24/7 (see ruclips.net/video/82ww7ZTpDus/видео.html).
Personally I do not like Bambu's closed and patented system and the fact you must use the cloud to be able to use the printers. Printers are build in a way the are hard to repair, but cheap to replace, creating more e-waste than necessary. I'm more a guy of generating the least waste possible. I think the Core1 fits me better than a BambuLab. With the price for the Core1 it is not a bad investment, but for single colour only. For multi colour the Bambu with AMS is better. For multi material with different printing temperatures the Prusa XL is unbeatable.
Du you own a Prusa XL?
Would have liked to see Prusa use the AFS build plates instead of the i3 build plates. That would have really given them the build volume to outdo Bambu. But they are looking to slot the Core One into their print farm, sounds like they didn't have the space for a larger footprint.
@@BrainDeath89 Yes, two of them both with 5 tool heads. The performance is much improved since introduction. An XL is faster as a Carbon X1, even in one colour. In multi-colour the XL is much faster. When there are multiple colour changes per layer the XL can go up to double the speed as the carbon X1.
Mixing different filaments with different melting temperatures the XL is much faster.
@@logicalfundy Prusa made the choice not to create a totally new machine, but an upgrade of the MK4s. By reusing as much parts as possible the could create upgrade kits for people who want to upgrade their MK 4(s) to a Core One.
The issues with your X1Cs are both due to your heatbed signal cable. On early X1Cs the cable is poor shielding and the wires break. I had to replace all 9 of my signal cables on my 9 early batch X1Cs. 30 min repair and a cheap part.
He said if a bambu fails after 1000 hours he will just replace it. I have an mk3s+ with 274 days of printing, that is 6500 hours and as far as I'm concerned it is better than it was when I bought it, because it arrived as an mk3, then upgraded to s, then s+ not to mention firmware updates over the years. 1000 hours is a joke for a machine to become a paperweight.
Exactly, 1000hr is a joke, I'm glad that most people with bambu are easily over 5k hours with no problems. I'm glad people never extrapolate the results of small sampling to talk about things in general!
Oh
He said that but he didn't call support yet either.
Yeah, its a joke that his two $1500 printers are now paperweights with under 1k hrs. What is this? Creality?
@@LilApe true!! don't buy them, buy prusa for 2x-3x the price of p1s and it will deeeeeeeefinitely outlive p1s, and all these crowds of people that are happy with bambu lab are just wrong, and don't understand that they don't like the thing they say they like. They are saying that p1s works great and reliable, but it doesn't. We, prusa users know better. Totally!!
And how many people have a mark 4s. I have a mark 4 so I would need to buy the mk4s upgrade kit as well as the core one upgrade kit if I wanted to upgrade