This is a really interesting video and I'm so happy to see slinging being taking seriously and being investigated with experimental archaeology but, I have to say, your slinging style is far from optimal and honestly, from the accounts I've seen of slingers in antiquity, not at all historically accurate or all that effective in a battlefield scenario. Slinging is a very difficult skill but I know for a fact that there are very skilled slingers that would be very interested in assisting in experimental archaeology.
Balearic slingers were trained from birth,[1] so expecting a team of untrained archaeologists to throw as good as one of them would be too much to ask. Granted, there weren’t many Balearic slingers in the Roman legions, so ideally they would do an overarm throw. Source(s): 1. Driel-Murray, Carol van (1989). Roman Military Equipment: The Sources of Evidence : Proceedings of the Fifth Roman Military Equipment Conference. B.A.R. p. 270. ISBN 978-0-86054-613-9.
Great job on the construction, but as others have pointed out, without someone who knows at least a little bit about how to use a sling effectively, any experimental data is suspect. Unfortunately, you see this all too often in the academic literature around slinging, where someone with little to no experience picks it up, awkwardly lobs a few stones, and uses those results to judge the capabilities of the sling. Even though this video is nearly a decade old already (as of this writing), and there are more good resources and examples of truly excellent slinging than ever before, I still have yet to read any good academic experimental data (as of January 2023) on slinging that corresponds to the abilities I've seen, both firsthand and on other forums. Of course, I doubt I've been exhaustive, as so much of the literature is behind obscenely expensive paywalls (which is its own discussion), but I think the fact still stands that the academic study of slinging is still behind the abilities of the community practicing it. It might not seem as a big deal, but the overall effect has been the practical erasure of slinging from much of the historical record. If academics don't take the sling seriously, then they're not going to see the evidence of it as readily as one who realizes how truly ubiquitous it was throughout history. Look for instance at how often probable slingstones are misidentified as "charm stones" "gaming stones" "lemon-shaped stones" "cooking stones" or simply "function unknown" - or even simply ignored. This seems to be more of an issue with North American archeology - but again, if you're not familiar with it, then most of the evidence left behind are just stones. Again though, I applaud the National Museum of Slovenia for doing this!
I’ve seen some good videos done by irongoober . From distance throwing to having a force meter on his wrist to see what kinds of energy is created at moment of release. Plus he’s pretty good.
I came to comment on the painful to watch slinging and was glad to see that was one of the main topics here. honestly though while experienced slingers would be ideal for this; at the very least these researchers could have learned the basics… the inconsistent full-arm spin followed by random uncontrolled release is so painfully awkward to watch. and man those are some serious projectiles! I wouldn’t wanna be anywhere near that guy while he spins that thing…. not trying to catch a lead turd in the eye
Nice video!!! The sound of the incoming bullets is really terrifying. However I want to point out a couple of historical inconsistencies that you might want to consider retesting. The first is that most Roman Glandes were lead between 50-90g with the average at 70g. So your clay bullets at ~25g are too light and would bleed energy and speed much faster than Roman Glandes did. A better substitute would be either 2 or 3oz lead fish weights. The 2nd thing to consider changing would be the casting technique. Romans employed Rhodian and Belearic slingers. The Rhodian used the Greek technique while the Belearic used the Belearic technique.
I think you misunderstood, but maybe i misunderstood, but they didn't use clay bullets in this video the whole first half of the video is them casting lead bullets, which they were using in the second half when they were doing the slinging. They did do a tiny bit of clay work but that was to make the molds which they cast lead bullets in.
@Glande again I am not an expert, but that looks just like the ancient ones they pulled from the drawers in the beginning, and those were lead so my guess is that lead tarnishes or rusts to that grayish color, and that that particular bullet we see there is tarnished. Sadly we may never be sure unless we somehow get another primary source, such as one of the scientists from this video or perhaps we would be able to fins something they published on this research.
@@KristopherBel Nor am I :-) I used to sling for 7 years and have gone through some resources and I assume it from the shape as the lead bullets look more pointy. Would love to see such a study with experienced slingers like those who are on the Balearic islands. In fact there is plenty of original lead ammo in the drawers of different museums. I think you are right that they were also using original lead ammo.
They should have painted them neon pink. Then it would have been easier to see them in the grass. Just a quick once over with a spray can could have made their work a lot easier.
interesting method though considering the amount of flashing in the clay mold, i almost imagine that the mound would be formed by pressing two cakes of clay around the glandes, then cutting it open again to add the channels.
I kinda hope that your workingspace was better ventilated the this video makes it seem… lead smelting and casting are „outside activities“ in my book …
Dear mister, hallo, Im italy, video molto interessante che riproduce fedelmente la riproduzione dei plumbea utilizzati dai nostri antenati romani in combattimento contro i loro nemici, invece avrei qualcosa da ridire circa la fionda ed il modo Co cui viene lanciato il proiettile, ora per correttezza bisogna specificare che gli antichi romani per lanciare quei proiettili accuminata in piombo, utilizzavano tre tipi di fionda appositamente fatte per lo scopo, in pelle, la striscia, ed anche in tessuto, che permetteva l'utilizzo del proiettile nella maniera giusta, ovvero di punta, diversamente verrebbe meno l'efficacia appunto del plumbeo, che come lei ha voluto dimostrare, si è sempre incastonato nella sagoma trasversalmente e non di punta come dovrebbe, questo è quanto emerge appunto dai dettami, tramandatici dagli storici del tempo, e giunti fino a noi che ne conserviamo ancora la tradizione, questo scrivo per dovere di giusta informazione oltre che archeologica, pure scientifica, visto che di quello ci occupiamo........etc.....Saluti From italy sardinya gonare
Gran trabajo. Somos un grupo de honderos de España. Estaríamos interesados en leer el estudio al completo. Gracias. Odlično delo Smo skupina slingers iz Španije. Zanima nas, da berejo celotno študijo. Hvala
honestly, youd have better luck and more accurate results just grabbing 3 0z lead bank sinkers (fishing ling weights) painting them bright orange and you could even tie a neon ribbon on the end without impacting total trajectory too much. There are plenty of reports of slingers in the field casting ammo by pressing their thumbs into the beach so its not like you,re sacrificing historical consistency. also id reference some other slinging channels such as practical paracord, tods workshop, or wannabe bushcrafter for some tips on slinging style. 7 years late but a wealth of resources are now available.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
great reproductions but you should hire a skilled slinger for this job , it seems your not slinging fast enough for historical analysis
This is a really interesting video and I'm so happy to see slinging being taking seriously and being investigated with experimental archaeology but, I have to say, your slinging style is far from optimal and honestly, from the accounts I've seen of slingers in antiquity, not at all historically accurate or all that effective in a battlefield scenario. Slinging is a very difficult skill but I know for a fact that there are very skilled slingers that would be very interested in assisting in experimental archaeology.
Balearic slingers were trained from birth,[1] so expecting a team of untrained archaeologists to throw as good as one of them would be too much to ask.
Granted, there weren’t many Balearic slingers in the Roman legions, so ideally they would do an overarm throw.
Source(s):
1. Driel-Murray, Carol van (1989). Roman Military Equipment: The Sources of Evidence : Proceedings of the Fifth Roman Military Equipment Conference. B.A.R. p. 270. ISBN 978-0-86054-613-9.
Great job on the construction, but as others have pointed out, without someone who knows at least a little bit about how to use a sling effectively, any experimental data is suspect. Unfortunately, you see this all too often in the academic literature around slinging, where someone with little to no experience picks it up, awkwardly lobs a few stones, and uses those results to judge the capabilities of the sling. Even though this video is nearly a decade old already (as of this writing), and there are more good resources and examples of truly excellent slinging than ever before, I still have yet to read any good academic experimental data (as of January 2023) on slinging that corresponds to the abilities I've seen, both firsthand and on other forums. Of course, I doubt I've been exhaustive, as so much of the literature is behind obscenely expensive paywalls (which is its own discussion), but I think the fact still stands that the academic study of slinging is still behind the abilities of the community practicing it.
It might not seem as a big deal, but the overall effect has been the practical erasure of slinging from much of the historical record. If academics don't take the sling seriously, then they're not going to see the evidence of it as readily as one who realizes how truly ubiquitous it was throughout history. Look for instance at how often probable slingstones are misidentified as "charm stones" "gaming stones" "lemon-shaped stones" "cooking stones" or simply "function unknown" - or even simply ignored. This seems to be more of an issue with North American archeology - but again, if you're not familiar with it, then most of the evidence left behind are just stones.
Again though, I applaud the National Museum of Slovenia for doing this!
I’ve seen some good videos done by irongoober . From distance throwing to having a force meter on his wrist to see what kinds of energy is created at moment of release. Plus he’s pretty good.
I came to comment on the painful to watch slinging and was glad to see that was one of the main topics here.
honestly though while experienced slingers would be ideal for this; at the very least these researchers could have learned the basics… the inconsistent full-arm spin followed by random uncontrolled release is so painfully awkward to watch.
and man those are some serious projectiles! I wouldn’t wanna be anywhere near that guy while he spins that thing…. not trying to catch a lead turd in the eye
it was pretty painful to watch lol
I use every form of slinging. I have been hunting with my sling since age 11 I'm 58 now. I use longer ropes for more power.
Need some glow-in-the-dark fluorescent paint on those projectiles
На самом деле снаряд получает колоссальное вращение по оси, как нарезная пуля. Такие снаряды не стоит недооценивать.
Nice video!!! The sound of the incoming bullets is really terrifying. However I want to point out a couple of historical inconsistencies that you might want to consider retesting. The first is that most Roman Glandes were lead between 50-90g with the average at 70g. So your clay bullets at ~25g are too light and would bleed energy and speed much faster than Roman Glandes did. A better substitute would be either 2 or 3oz lead fish weights. The 2nd thing to consider changing would be the casting technique. Romans employed Rhodian and Belearic slingers. The Rhodian used the Greek technique while the Belearic used the Belearic technique.
I think you misunderstood, but maybe i misunderstood, but they didn't use clay bullets in this video the whole first half of the video is them casting lead bullets, which they were using in the second half when they were doing the slinging. They did do a tiny bit of clay work but that was to make the molds which they cast lead bullets in.
@@KristopherBel There is a clay bullet or a pebble at 8:39.
@Glande again I am not an expert, but that looks just like the ancient ones they pulled from the drawers in the beginning, and those were lead so my guess is that lead tarnishes or rusts to that grayish color, and that that particular bullet we see there is tarnished. Sadly we may never be sure unless we somehow get another primary source, such as one of the scientists from this video or perhaps we would be able to fins something they published on this research.
@@KristopherBel Nor am I :-) I used to sling for 7 years and have gone through some resources and I assume it from the shape as the lead bullets look more pointy. Would love to see such a study with experienced slingers like those who are on the Balearic islands.
In fact there is plenty of original lead ammo in the drawers of different museums. I think you are right that they were also using original lead ammo.
Great video. Yip - big problem is finding the lead bullets again, they dig deep in soft earth.
Call a Balearic slinger for help
What weight are the lead glandes?
I recently took interest in ancient weapons like the sling and have made one. This guy's name caught my eye. Maybe we are cousins.
They should have painted them neon pink. Then it would have been easier to see them in the grass. Just a quick once over with a spray can could have made their work a lot easier.
Agreed, and also safer to handle. Bare skin readily absorbs lead during contact.
interesting method
though considering the amount of flashing in the clay mold, i almost imagine that the mound would be formed by pressing two cakes of clay around the glandes, then cutting it open again to add the channels.
I kinda hope that your workingspace was better ventilated the this video makes it seem… lead smelting and casting are „outside activities“ in my book …
Excellent video! Going to be trying this soon though PPE is needed people. Masks especially those fumes are no joke
Hammer 👍👍👍
Lead fumes are toxic. No mention of ventilation I would also be wearing gloves if handling many.
Dear mister, hallo, Im italy, video molto interessante che riproduce fedelmente la riproduzione dei plumbea utilizzati dai nostri antenati romani in combattimento contro i loro nemici, invece avrei qualcosa da ridire circa la fionda ed il modo Co cui viene lanciato il proiettile, ora per correttezza bisogna specificare che gli antichi romani per lanciare quei proiettili accuminata in piombo, utilizzavano tre tipi di fionda appositamente fatte per lo scopo, in pelle, la striscia, ed anche in tessuto, che permetteva l'utilizzo del proiettile nella maniera giusta, ovvero di punta, diversamente verrebbe meno l'efficacia appunto del plumbeo, che come lei ha voluto dimostrare, si è sempre incastonato nella sagoma trasversalmente e non di punta come dovrebbe, questo è quanto emerge appunto dai dettami, tramandatici dagli storici del tempo, e giunti fino a noi che ne conserviamo ancora la tradizione, questo scrivo per dovere di giusta informazione oltre che archeologica, pure scientifica, visto che di quello ci occupiamo........etc.....Saluti From italy sardinya gonare
i did same experiment with clay bullets. its really hard to find after shoutings.
The shoot pattern, I’m sorry but you ain’t eating anything tonight
Gran trabajo. Somos un grupo de honderos de España. Estaríamos interesados en leer el estudio al completo. Gracias.
Odlično delo Smo skupina slingers iz Španije. Zanima nas, da berejo celotno študijo. Hvala
I paint mine yellow…so much easier to find.
honestly, youd have better luck and more accurate results just grabbing 3 0z lead bank sinkers (fishing ling weights) painting them bright orange and you could even tie a neon ribbon on the end without impacting total trajectory too much. There are plenty of reports of slingers in the field casting ammo by pressing their thumbs into the beach so its not like you,re sacrificing historical consistency. also id reference some other slinging channels such as practical paracord, tods workshop, or wannabe bushcrafter for some tips on slinging style. 7 years late but a wealth of resources are now available.
I prefer 5 0unce egg sinkers besides the center hole occasionally produces a awesome whistle
Paint them fluorescent and that is not how you use a sling.
Das Problem. Diese formen sind zu ungenau für eine Massenproduktion. Die Nachbearbeitung dauert zu lange.
By all means get a better sling and sling thrower. The bold dude is maybe at 30% of the real potential
Cringy slinging lol please call an actual slinger next time
Poor slinging technique.
Iiiuu ur ioooiîiiuuuoioy
English please! Don't waste time here
The music no n9 no no