I found this review really helpful. The chap in the review can play and so we can hear how the instrument really sounds. The small bore slide and giant bell create a sound that I really wouldn't want to re-produce. I think the ideal "superbone" style instrument would need to be a lot more "slide trombone sounding" rather than the slightly chocked sound this horn produces. I know this is nigh on impossible, therefore I am going to keep on practicing my various tonguing techniques to get my speed up!!
Woodwinds: WAIT?! how does my instrument work again? Brass: Ight so imma make it a werid af shape, oh I might had a slide with some valves and some open holes to. *plays* Oh! It works fine
I bought mine when they first came out in the 70's. I was doubling on trumpet, so the transfer was handy with one in each hand. I still use it if I'm the only bone in the group.
I had one back in the '80s. Loved it but had to sell it when funds got low. I'm a trumpet player so it was more of a hobby, but I did get proficient enough to use it on combo gigs and play 3rd trombone in a big band. It was by far the best valvebone I ever played and it helped me learn slide technique as well. Would love to own one again just for nostalgia's sake but they're getting harder to find and I can't afford it right now.
Schmitt Music Trombone Shop Maynard Ferguson played one of these but you can also get a splash of that Juan Tizol Vibe w/ it w/ the Valve Section. It doesn't sound as stuffy as a Normal Valve Trombone because the Hand slide can be used to correct the intonation.
Helpful review. Thanks. I play the trumpet for 30 years and I am thinking about superbone. Not to make effects using valves and slide, cause I dont want to learn to use valves with left hand. Just play like a valve trombone with right hand and slide trompete each one.
It was surprisingly more intuitive then I would have thought; it would take me some time to really get it under my fingers (pun intended!) but I could certainly start to see some of the benefits quickly!
Greetings from Mexico I would like to know what mouthpiece you are using with the superbone or what mouthpiece you could recommend for this instrument 😃🎺
I believe in this particular video I was using a Bach 6 1/2AL small shank. Given the relatively large bore of the Superbone I would probably recommend a mouthpiece in the size range, and probably would not go smaller than a 7C; anything smaller I suspect would restrict the airflow enough that it would not really fill up the instrument as it needs…
That’s pretty sick ngl, at first I thought it was kinda dumb but it looks very useful because you kind of now have a trombone which can play in any key you desire..
Couldn't learn to valve lefthanded. Only french horn players could do this...I think that when Maynard used this he valved a lot (right handed), then went to the slide (right handed). At least that's the way I remember my the half dozen or so times I saw him.
I think I would have a hard time with the ergonomics if I played the valves with the right hand. The valve block is so close to the face that when I try it right handed I can’t actually see anything! To me it feels better with the two handed approach, one just has two wrap their brain around the left-handed valves; I feel like I could do it better with practice, which means that almost anyone could do it!
I just ordered one and im psyched .Now I can tell the girls I have a superbone ! On the real side I think they got the design backasswards though .The valve block should be on right side of the leadpipe and the slide on the left .But what the hell do I know .Very few if any trumpet players can articulate with their left hand .It could have been designed to be more practical but it is what it is .
@@SchmittMusicTromboneShop It's a 1976 Holton tr 395 Superbone in 90% mint .Valve block is like new ,bell a couple minor dings and I'll relaquer it and it will be like brand new .By the way you sound great .Ciao for now !
@@SchmittMusicTromboneShop I just got it .Its a tr395 made in 76 .Mint valve body .I am going to send the bell out to get relacquered. I've been practicing it for about 4 hours a day plus playing my flugelhorn Coronet Yamaha Xeno all at the same time I'm going from my Schilke 40 trombone mouthpiece and working up with all the mouthpieces write up to a one-and-a-half Bach ending up at Eric miyashiro lead mouthpiece and trust me going from trombone to a trumpet it's like going from a fat chick to a skinny chick.
The Holton Superbone has unfortunately been out of production for many years; there are a few companies that have tried to replicate it but they are very mixed (at best) in their performance…
I'm curious... what is a fair market price for one of these? (The Holton TR 395 MF Superbone) Or what is a reasonable "window" .... between x and y? Thanks!
I think they used to be in higher demand in general but I have seen a few lately sell in the $1000-1500 range; the last (and only) one we had in the shop sold for $2500.00 but it was in mint condition...
Now that their becoming more collectible they can go from 2500 to 4000 .Dillons has one for 3500 .And theres anotherone listing for 3800 .I just picked one up for 2100 from a super guy out of indiana .The money I had saved to go to New Orleans this winter , well I saw the superbone deal and , well now I got a superbone and im stuck in upstate N.Y. for the winter .It sucks when you dont have enough money to fullfill your dreams .Well back to the drawing board .
I got mine for 2100 dollars only because the owner wanted it to go to someone that was seriuosly going to use it .And I promised him in 6 months not a trumpet trombone player in the world will dare to stand on the same stage as me .Im on a mission from God yo,lol .Im going to show the universe that Christ is King !
The only one I am aware of is from Wessex and I haven’t had the opportunity to spend time with it. Looking at the initial design it’s hard to say if it is a close analogue to the original; I still say the Superbone is the best playing valve trombone I have ever experienced...
The greatest exponent ever of this instrument was the great Ashley Alexander. His album “Power Slide” with Frank Mantooth big band from 1985 is just phenomenal. Sadly, he died suddenly in 1987. Here’s a clip of him playing live: ruclips.net/video/7leaKOf5WrY/видео.html
Ashley was working with the superbone in the 1970s when he was my jazz band director at the University of Northern Iowa. (He was there three years). It was my understanding that he wrote the manual that Holton sent out with the instrument at that time. It was a wonder to watch and hear him play that - he got to where he could easily use the slide and the valves at the same time, like an F rotor on a standard trombone.
Raul is awesome, but I’ve never come across any videos or recordings of him playing Superbone, which was my point about Ashley Alexander, who recorded extensively with the Superbone. Lots of examples of Raul on both valve and slide, but playing on different horns, never a Superbone that I’ve seen/heard.
So, is this instrument a C instrument or a B-flat instrument or maybe even an F because of the left hand fingering like on a french horn? A euphonium or baritone still sounds better and easier to play! This instrument doesn't even sound like a bass instrument! It sounds more like a muted trumpet!
It's a Bb, A, Ab, G, Gb, F, and E trombone :-) Actually, slightly off because of the way valved instruments are tuned (read up on compensating horns), but close enough. The valve tubing lengths are calculated for first position, so as you go farther out on the slide, the more adjustments you will have to make.
@@SchmittMusicTromboneShop now that I have the super bone and I've been working with it for a few days when I received it the valves were in backwards and it took me some time to figure them out but on most trumpets the numbers for the valves face the player they face the mouthpiece on the super bone the valve numbers face the Bell so after I took the horn apart I'm close inspection by looking at the end of the receiver where the slide goes in and the other end where the Bell attaches I lined up the ports and finally figured it out and there is no information on the internet up here how the valve block is assembled so I'm going to put a video out there about it sound great my brother keep on a good work
The Superbone has unfortunately been out of production for quite a few years. Conn-Selmer still has a handful of Hilton trombones in production; however most of their focus has been placed on horns and background brass...
I found this review really helpful. The chap in the review can play and so we can hear how the instrument really sounds. The small bore slide and giant bell create a sound that I really wouldn't want to re-produce. I think the ideal "superbone" style instrument would need to be a lot more "slide trombone sounding" rather than the slightly chocked sound this horn produces. I know this is nigh on impossible, therefore I am going to keep on practicing my various tonguing techniques to get my speed up!!
Woodwinds:
WAIT?! how does my instrument work again?
Brass:
Ight so imma make it a werid af shape, oh I might had a slide with some valves and some open holes to.
*plays* Oh! It works fine
I bought mine when they first came out in the 70's. I was doubling on trumpet, so the transfer was handy with one in each hand. I still use it if I'm the only bone in the group.
Good for you , their becoming more rare everyday .I just found one in indiana and actuallly ordered it today .Can't wait .oh boy .
I"m thinking about getting one.
If you can find an original at a good price it is absolutely worth picking up IMHO!
I had one back in the '80s. Loved it but had to sell it when funds got low. I'm a trumpet player so it was more of a hobby, but I did get proficient enough to use it on combo gigs and play 3rd trombone in a big band. It was by far the best valvebone I ever played and it helped me learn slide technique as well. Would love to own one again just for nostalgia's sake but they're getting harder to find and I can't afford it right now.
I have been playing tenors and f attachments and I’m thinking about trying out a super bone.
Schmitt Music Trombone Shop Maynard Ferguson played one of these but you can also get a splash of that Juan Tizol Vibe w/ it w/ the Valve Section. It doesn't sound as stuffy as a Normal Valve Trombone because the Hand slide can be used to correct the intonation.
Helpful review. Thanks. I play the trumpet for 30 years and I am thinking about superbone. Not to make effects using valves and slide, cause I dont want to learn to use valves with left hand. Just play like a valve trombone with right hand and slide trompete each one.
I’m playing that song in my jazz band lol love superbone meets the bad man
Unlike most Valve Trombones this one doesn't sound quite as stuffy because the Handslide can be used to correct the intonation.
Awesome!
It's quite a cool tool
Played one years ago. Wish I could have afforded to purchase it. You do have to think differently when playing it.
Yes you do I'm finding that out right now it's a whole different approach what works on trumpet doesn't work on trombone
Just discovered this video... Truly fun, thanks!! Would you say that the balance was well placed on this model?
When I tried a superbone, I found that supporting it with my left hand little finger was painful after a short while.
I bought one in the 1970's (1975?) I was very disappointed in the slide action. It acted like it was always sticky and never cleaned up.
I suck at my euphonium’s valves! :( I’m more used to the trombone’s slide so god help me trying to utilise both at the same time! 😱😱😱
It was surprisingly more intuitive then I would have thought; it would take me some time to really get it under my fingers (pun intended!) but I could certainly start to see some of the benefits quickly!
from looking at your site, it appears you already moved that superbad boy, too.
Yes indeed! Went to a trombonist who had been talking about getting one since the 1970's. It's in a good home!
Stravinsky or Janáček bass trumpet excerpts, please.
It actually sold before I had a chance to try these out!
Greetings from Mexico I would like to know what mouthpiece you are using with the superbone or what mouthpiece you could recommend for this instrument 😃🎺
I believe in this particular video I was using a Bach 6 1/2AL small shank. Given the relatively large bore of the Superbone I would probably recommend a mouthpiece in the size range, and probably would not go smaller than a 7C; anything smaller I suspect would restrict the airflow enough that it would not really fill up the instrument as it needs…
Thanks for the information I always watch your videos, they are great 😃
That’s pretty sick ngl, at first I thought it was kinda dumb but it looks very useful because you kind of now have a trombone which can play in any key you desire..
Great concept.. doesn't work for short arms except to 4th position as it seems even 5 th might be close to where 6th was.
Couldn't learn to valve lefthanded. Only french horn players could do this...I think that when Maynard used this he valved a lot (right handed), then went to the slide (right handed). At least that's the way I remember my the half dozen or so times I saw him.
I think I would have a hard time with the ergonomics if I played the valves with the right hand. The valve block is so close to the face that when I try it right handed I can’t actually see anything! To me it feels better with the two handed approach, one just has two wrap their brain around the left-handed valves; I feel like I could do it better with practice, which means that almost anyone could do it!
OK, I was wrong (imagine that). Maynard fingered left handed. I should've paid closer attention.
No worries! It is a fun instrument and I hope to have another one in the shop again!
Just like the Firebird...
I assume the fingerings are the same as baritone/euphonium? For combo work how would this compare to F & G valves?
I just ordered one and im psyched .Now I can tell the girls I have a superbone ! On the real side I think they got the design backasswards though .The valve block should be on right side of the leadpipe and the slide on the left .But what the hell do I know .Very few if any trumpet players can articulate with their left hand .It could have been designed to be more practical but it is what it is .
Thanks for watching! What model Superbone are you getting?
@@SchmittMusicTromboneShop It's a 1976 Holton tr 395 Superbone in 90% mint .Valve block is like new ,bell a couple minor dings and I'll relaquer it and it will be like brand new .By the way you sound great .Ciao for now !
@@SchmittMusicTromboneShop I just got it .Its a tr395 made in 76 .Mint valve body .I am going to send the bell out to get relacquered. I've been practicing it for about 4 hours a day plus playing my flugelhorn Coronet Yamaha Xeno all at the same time I'm going from my Schilke 40 trombone mouthpiece and working up with all the mouthpieces write up to a one-and-a-half Bach ending up at Eric miyashiro lead mouthpiece and trust me going from trombone to a trumpet it's like going from a fat chick to a skinny chick.
Este modelo de Holton, que precio tiene actualmente y si incluye envío a México 🇲🇽. Saludos
The Holton Superbone has unfortunately been out of production for many years; there are a few companies that have tried to replicate it but they are very mixed (at best) in their performance…
What fingering that you use to play the valve?
The valves use the same Bb fingerings as baritone/euphonium/valve trombone :)
Interesting
I'm curious... what is a fair market price for one of these? (The Holton TR 395 MF Superbone) Or what is a reasonable "window" .... between x and y?
Thanks!
I think they used to be in higher demand in general but I have seen a few lately sell in the $1000-1500 range; the last (and only) one we had in the shop sold for $2500.00 but it was in mint condition...
Now that their becoming more collectible they can go from 2500 to 4000 .Dillons has one for 3500 .And theres anotherone listing for 3800 .I just picked one up for 2100 from a super guy out of indiana .The money I had saved to go to New Orleans this winter , well I saw the superbone deal and , well now I got a superbone and im stuck in upstate N.Y. for the winter .It sucks when you dont have enough money to fullfill your dreams .Well back to the drawing board .
I got mine for 2100 dollars only because the owner wanted it to go to someone that was seriuosly going to use it .And I promised him in 6 months not a trumpet trombone player in the world will dare to stand on the same stage as me .Im on a mission from God yo,lol .Im going to show the universe that Christ is King !
Are there any companies that make decent superbones anymore? All I can find are ones from Levante...
The only one I am aware of is from Wessex and I haven’t had the opportunity to spend time with it. Looking at the initial design it’s hard to say if it is a close analogue to the original; I still say the Superbone is the best playing valve trombone I have ever experienced...
Believe it or not... try Amazon. I think they have at least a couple choices.
The James Morrison Schagerl Superbone is an option.
Medini Superbone is a cheap alternative if you are really curious of the slide/valve design. It's one of the options on Amazon. $279 -$499.
The greatest exponent ever of this instrument was the great Ashley Alexander. His album “Power Slide” with Frank Mantooth big band from 1985 is just phenomenal. Sadly, he died suddenly in 1987. Here’s a clip of him playing live: ruclips.net/video/7leaKOf5WrY/видео.html
Ashley was working with the superbone in the 1970s when he was my jazz band director at the University of Northern Iowa. (He was there three years). It was my understanding that he wrote the manual that Holton sent out with the instrument at that time. It was a wonder to watch and hear him play that - he got to where he could easily use the slide and the valves at the same time, like an F rotor on a standard trombone.
You guys. Do you know Raul de Souza?
Raul is awesome, but I’ve never come across any videos or recordings of him playing Superbone, which was my point about Ashley Alexander, who recorded extensively with the Superbone. Lots of examples of Raul on both valve and slide, but playing on different horns, never a Superbone that I’ve seen/heard.
@JL-bu8bz Not personally, of course, but we love his playing!
So, is this instrument a C instrument or a B-flat instrument or maybe even an F because of the left hand fingering like on a french horn? A euphonium or baritone still sounds better and easier to play! This instrument doesn't even sound like a bass instrument! It sounds more like a muted trumpet!
It's a Bb, A, Ab, G, Gb, F, and E trombone :-) Actually, slightly off because of the way valved instruments are tuned (read up on compensating horns), but close enough. The valve tubing lengths are calculated for first position, so as you go farther out on the slide, the more adjustments you will have to make.
Sell me this instrument PLEASE!
If only we had another! Sorry!
I had the first two iterations of the SB. What I remember most is the unbearable ergonomics. It simply kills the left hand!
I have only spent limited time with the SB but I can absolutely see this being an issue! What's the old saying, "built for speed, not for comfort..."
@@SchmittMusicTromboneShop now that I have the super bone and I've been working with it for a few days when I received it the valves were in backwards and it took me some time to figure them out but on most trumpets the numbers for the valves face the player they face the mouthpiece on the super bone the valve numbers face the Bell so after I took the horn apart I'm close inspection by looking at the end of the receiver where the slide goes in and the other end where the Bell attaches I lined up the ports and finally figured it out and there is no information on the internet up here how the valve block is assembled so I'm going to put a video out there about it sound great my brother keep on a good work
Is this the only trombone that the Holten brand is now making?
The Superbone has unfortunately been out of production for quite a few years. Conn-Selmer still has a handful of Hilton trombones in production; however most of their focus has been placed on horns and background brass...