@@Atlas_DXUlt Right! 😃 And then he, himself, ends up getting accidentally locked-in because of it. Some kinda pastiche to those ancient Greek tragic plays, or something...
I've worked in the industrial field for 15 years and I think I know the answer to your paradox with the loto locks. A given employer may have thousands of these locks on their site at a given time (sometimes 10+ per employee), and possibly use millions of locks over the course of their business lifetime. You absolutely cannot have a key that matches a lock anywhere else than that one lock it is tied to, that is a big insurance and safety problem. So the more pins allows for more key variations. Also, people are constantly sticking their keys into the wrong locks accidentally, and so the higher quality core allows for less chance that they will force the lock open before they realize it is the wrong lock. I do this multiple times a shift, because I have several locks issued to me with many similar keys and I typically just go through them until I find the one that opens (I know I should label them). The more pins means there is more variety for the keys and less chance of a duplicate on site. The higher quality core, which is in all likelihood regulated by law, means less chance of someone forcing a very old lock open. The reason the quality of the housing is so poor is intentional. You want to be able to cut or even smash the lock off in a hurry if you have to. Maybe there is an emergency and you think of a way to operate the machine in order to try to save someone who is injured. Also, more benignly, people leave for home with their locks on machines all the time on accident handing off to other shifts. So you don't want some sort of monster lock on there that you can't get off without the key. The cheap build makes buying them much more affordable for employers, when they buy thousands of these at a time. They are not security locks, they are safety locks. High volume that must meet stringent safety standards (6 pins) for various reasons, but are not meant to be undefeatable in all circumstances.
As far as why there are stronger locks with shitty keys and cores, that seems pretty easy thing to answer. Most of these locks are all fairly cheap and sold at hardware stores, likely bought by soccor moms and the like to keep their shed closed or maybe a dirt bike or something chained up. You don't want some petty incompetent thief to be able to smash the lock open or cut it open easily when you're not around. But if you misplace or lose the key over the winter time while you're not using whatever you have locked up, you also don't want it to be an impossible task for a locksmith to open your lock. Maybe you could even pick the lock yourself. Also more pins means more points of failure outside during rain and rust and exposure to elements. In short, the customer gets what they want. These decisions aren't being made by masterlock. They're being made by masterlock's largest customer base.
@@j37j2 "They're being made by masterlock's largest customer base." True yet false :) You assume the customer base is informed and makes a reasoned decision ...
@@j.p.vanbolhuis8678 I don't think its unreasonable to assume that the insurance companies who require these locks can make informed decisions, when they are the ones who lobbied the government for these regulations in the first place. There's no one person or organization who comes up with these ideas. The market evolves until it meets what is best.
@@j37j2 Well, trouble is, masterlock does advertise a lot of easily defeatable locks as "unpickable". Assuming you're ignorant (not stupid per se, just not a locksmith), you might rightly assume that lock is enough, even if it's actually garbage. "High security" locks defeated in a single second, where the average consumer may simply not know about such weaknesses and may reasonably demand a lock that, well, locks something. When the consumer is lied to, an educated decision isn't exactly easy.
As a safety professional I can explain the paradox. This is the best LOTO lock because the likelihood of mistakenly taken a lock off with a similar key is very low and uet it is very easy to remove by force when an employee goes home and locks out critical machinery. There are procedures in place to cut a lock and Noone not even management can unlock the lock without destroying it. These are Industry standard and in my carreer I have never seen the other locks he has shown. This lock is ideal to its purpose.
Brings back bad memories of working for a certain large online retailer.. I used to randomly select one engineer for a LOTO audit weekly, the locks used are the same as this one. Remember: locks only keep the honest people out.
Then explain why its full of security Pins, and it has more of them than the Locks they rate the highest on their Security Scale (which only have standard Pins)?
@@unitrader403 there's a little more to it than what Justin Ford said but not much. First, job sites where LOTO locks like this are used can have machines that are multiple stories tall and during annual scheduled maintenance can have dozens of contractors and hundreds of workers on site. Amongst those hundreds is usually one asshole who thinks the rules don't apply to him and knows how to force a typical lock with pressure on the hasp and a dead blow hammer so he can turn on a light in a crawl space. He might even keep a bump key or rake in his pocket. Locks of these types should be impossible to manipulate into opening without a key but should show damage at any attempt to brute force open so anyone walking by would notice it's been messed with. The danger isn't that the lock was brute forced open and it's obvious after the fact (no valuables stolen) The danger is someone doesn't know the lock was picked or jimmied and goes into the danger area.
@@matthewsullivan9598 This still does not answer the question why Masterlock does not use these cores in their highest rated products even though these Cores are objectively more secure...
@@unitrader403 Cost. More pins=more money. It takes more manufacturing steps and security pins take more fine machining. I think lawyers have an impact as well. If the actual core fails or is defeated on a LOTO lock someone might die. That's huge liability to the company. If the core fails or is defeated on an expensive high security lock and your garage gets ransacked it sucks for you but you're not likely to sue Master Lock for millions. People pay a premium for a tough LOOKING lock without knowing how good the core is so why waste money on the core? I'm not defending I'm explaining and I get frustrated by it too. Yet it makes sense from the business side.
I'm a chemical operator and I do lotos essentially daily. We have all 3 locks in this video mentioned. The plastic body is by far my favorite for its light weight (we often have to carry 30-50 at a time) and it's ability to endure weather and corrosion. We work with HCL, sulfuric acid, h2s, chlorine etc and the other locks in the video pretty much always get siezed closed in our harsh environment. The plastic ones can remain in a lockout for months and will unlock months later without issue whereas the metal ones often have to get cut off due to corrosion.
I can see that happening given the conditions. My work gave us American Lock 1100s but of course being aluminum bodied they get beat up pretty quickly after being carried around all night. Mine have gone from being red to having no finish on it at all so I think the plastic bodied would hold up better lol
Did u have separate lockout boxes, basically said locks are associated with a particular box set so locks 1-12 box A4 labeled for that box, the keys for those go into that box and that box is locked by your personally labeled lock and you only carry the one key for that particular box granted sometimes multiples for several boxes but no need to carry 30 keys around.
@@vinces8209 It's not the keys he's carrying around, it's the locks. On any given piece of equipment you could have literally hundreds of lockout points, every single one of them has to have a lock, and there's only gonna be two or maybe three guys if you're lucky handling all of it.
Imagine robbing his house and seeing a safe with 20 locks on it. You spend a full day getting in and your realize he just has locks that protect his locks..
The lockout lock has probably saved lots of lives. Many years ago I was developing electronic sign control software with a fellow named Jimmy. When the electricians were working on the sign (3 phase, 400 Amp service), they would put a lock on the breaker box and put the key in their pocket. Jimmy would invariably want to test something and would run over to the breaker and try to turn on the power while the electricians were up a ladder and inside the sign.
As an industrial electrician, I've seen a good amount of contractors leave site permanently without taking off their LOTO locks. Therefore their locks needed to be cut off. Assuming this is the reasoning for the low security exterior.
the additional pin(s) are not for more security, it's to reduce the odds that someone will accidentally have a duplicate lock in a multiple person lockout situation. complex operations can have a dozen or more LOTO locks on one piece of equipment.
That makes a ton of sense. Another comment also suggested the weak body is specifically so you can easily cut it off in the fairly common event a contractor finishes and leaves while forgetting to remove the lock.
@@johnrobertson7583This isn't for a personal lock. This is for a facility that has a to a dozen different electrical boxes and dangerous areas that need to be locked up and therefore buy these guys
Master Lock is just trying to balance their locks. If a lock had maxed out stats, that would be overpowered. Therefore they balance their locks with strength and weaknesses to promote variety in the lock meta.
I can just imagine lpl watching the notebook with mrs. Lpl and while she’s bawling her eyes out he’s just quietly saying to himself “click out of 3, ooh 4 is binding” 💀💀
I use those plastic LOTO locks at my job everyday, and the reason why we use them is because they can be broken open pretty easily if someone forgets to take them off and leaves with the key. Not sure if that's why they're designed that way, but at work they're pretty much just to remind someone that an area or piece of equipment is locked out.
This video is hilarious for several reasons: 1. The fact that he has a keychain full of locks instead of keys 2. The fact that he picks those locks just for fun while watching movies 3. The fact that he said "I know a lot of you are probably thinking..." followed by some random lock picking jargon.
@@nekoprincess4130 Yeah, I actually thought 182 was a parody until I watched a few more of his videos (and compared them to other skilled pickers like Bill).
Coming from someone who has over a decade in the oilfield industry, my guess behind the plastic body would be for economic purposes. These are used as safety tools to keep someone from starting up a unit, rather than keeping someone out of your belongings. Considering companies purchase these sometimes in hundreds or even thousands at a time, the plastic must save some money. Not to mention how often they get lost or stolen by employees.
Then why make it such an advanced lock? He says it's got 6 pins, with security pins. Then goes through all the expensive locks, and none of them have anywhere near as good security on pins.
@@chris24678 Making the lock tough to pick means it can't be removed easily by non-destructive means without its key, which should thwart any unauthorized removal of it since a destroyed lock would provide evidence of such.
Reason: it's a breakaway lock. It is made to be snapped off with a simple tool, like a pair of pliers, in a hurry. The sophisticated core is a deterrent. It's there to ensure the lock wasn't removed in a malicious way. If you don't have they key, but someone is getting cooked alive because a valve didn't hold or a line blew, you need to secure a line NOW. No time to find the guy with the key; you can bypass it in a hurry. If it was a simple lock, it could be picked easily and quickly by someone with malicious intent. So the core is there to help raise the question: "Why was the LOTO removed?", if it was removed improperly.
@@dimanetov1807 Those locks are difficult to cut. If you lose the key and you want access to your property, you'll need to hire a professional locksmith. Simpler core = more cances your local locksmith will be able to open it in a reasonable amount of time and not cost you an arm and a leg. Of course, this **does** open up the danger of thieves with simple tools and a passing knowledge on lockpicking....
Sorry, but that is a stupid reason. You NEVER lock something what could be so impotant that it could save a person or a proces. I am a electrician, I lock switches so there is NO WAY that someone turns the switch on, If you work with valves and you don't want anyone to turn it on, you lock it. Locking things keep you safe, if you lock something that could save someone's life you are STUPID, don't use a lock, use a permanent human watch, who can turn something ON in case of an emerency. Like you say, no time to find the guy with the key, you can bypass it in a hurry,..... yeah, by finding the guy with the pair of pliers ????
It has far more to with variety and cost. Having that many pins means that many more possible combinations, and if you have a company with 100s of people who need LOTO locks, you need to have a unique key for each person. The plastic body just makes it cheap.
If there was an incident at a LOTO job site and tampering was suspected, a broken or cut lock is far more obvious than one that had been picked. When my sig is on a LOTO, the last thing I want is someone to easily pick the lock, cycle the power, pop the lock back on and exit the area. That could make an investigation very difficult.
I can definitely appreciate why LOTO locks are designed as they are but having the ability to buy a padlock for conventional purposes with a core in that style would definitely be a selling point. Their 10/10-rated puck locks with absolutely terrible comb-pickable cores is a good use-case for this. It's an easily identifiable target if someone sees one and has ill intentions. If they know what they're doing it's open season.
As somebody in the construction industry the best reason I can give is if something happens to that worker who has the key and the key is lost, a set of bolt cutters can get everything up and running again with minimal effort. Most of the time these locks are nearby sensitive switches and equipment and you don't need to be struggling to get them off.
I've worked with LOTO locks for years, and can comment on why the design is great for me and my coworkers. The shackle is un-hardened so an authorized Safety team member can use standard bolt cutters to chop it if someone's lost their key. Additionally, we use these so often that we wear them on our belt, so the lightweight plastic-exterior design really helps to not tear up your pants or bounce around too much. Finally, we use these locks several times per day for years, so perhaps the extra pinning helps the keys stay firmly in place when we're walking around with the key in, or continue to safely function. Or perhaps there was some court case where someone picked a lock and someone got hurt. I'm not totally sure, but that's the information I have!
I’m here to back this up as well. Everything he says here I can attest to. I work with automated robots, which require constant trouble shooting. This requires a lockout every time I have to enter the automated cell, I use this same exact loto lock as many as 50 times in one 12 hour shift.
So true, plus the Weight hanging off a MCC mains power switch handle. When you have scissors plates and 20 locks hanging off one, all that weight over time can damage the switch mechanism internals. the new plastic locks came out after 2 people died and 3 injured because the switch was damaged energizing a conveyor that they were working on. Early 2000's in Australia.
I am a non-lock picking lawyer who does labor arbitrations and thus I know a fair amount about LOTO practices. All those reasons are spot on. Also note that The “one man one lock“ practice means you can have 10+ locks hanging off the same switch if it’s a big project. Size and weight matters. Finally, on the management side, no one ever got in trouble for paying an extra dollar for an LOTO lock so I won’t be surprised if someone at master lock just said, what the heck put the good core in there we can charge extra for it ;-).
Thanks for all the specific insights, very interesting, but I don't think that was ever an issue. Everyone can imagine why plastic locks could be useful, problem mentioned is more at why they did not put such a good core (as LPL claims, I got no clue about it) on any of the premium locks that are supposed to provide more security when they obviously are able to make it :P
You wake up and front doors open the cat is in the now open safe and that box in the attic full of mags your grandpa lost the key to 23 years ago is layed out for the world to see.
I'm sure he would also give his neighbors better locks to challenge his sleep walking self cause an easy lock that can be raked open in moments is no fun past the first time
Lockout tag out is practiced mostly by electricians for "locking out" electrical circuits aka turning them off and then tagging it with name and phone number. If this circuit was somehow to get turned on while getting worked on someone could die. Not designed for anti theft. Power tools are every where. I could cut the shackle off with my linemens aka side cutters. Other companies make lockout tag out locks with a picture of the person attached on shackle with "Do not turn on, my family depends on me" written on lock body.
@@seno5530 It happens more than you think For example in the USA alone, between 1992 and 1999 (i.e. 7 or 8 years) there were ~2500 fatal occupational electrocutions. Most of these (i'd guess upwards of 98%) occur on low voltage circuits. So that is about ~300 per year over this period.
They are also used in Underground mining for locking out dangerous equipment, if you need to go into the area that has been locked out you have to lock on first, and everyone needs to personally remove their danger lock before the equipment can be re-energised. they are for protecting human life from accidents, not for protecting valuables from thieves.
@Nick Paul My man came back to the exact same comment a week later just to double down on calling "Se No" an idiot. What an absolute chad. edit: Unless they deleted their comment. Fuck, I'm tired, idk why that wasn't my first thought.
As otherwise mentioned, we use these for safety in the oilfield for, "Lock out, tag out" of valves and pumps when equipment is shut in or being serviced. Where these are used can often be bypassed with a wrench or screwdriver to disassemble the handle or leaver leaving the lock intact. What I leaned from this vid is that they have great cores that will help prevent accidents and serve their purpose perfectly. Well done LPL, always interesting and informative.
A lot of people here seem to be missing his point quite dramatically. He's not saying it's inherently stupid that these LOTO locks have really good cores and terrible bodies, he's saying that it's crazy that all the other locks Master Lock make for actual security purposes have terrible cores when this clearly shows that they have the technology and knowledge to produce some really good ones. He's saying that it's weird to waste these really good cores on locks where it doesn't matter as much at the expense of their security cores
It's simple, really. it's all about liability and lawyers. They would more likely get sued over someone's death than the theft of a bicycle. So, they go with the cheaper option where possible. Not mysterious at all.
@@videodistro I would also say that someone less familiar with locks would judge the lock purely based off of its looks. Because of this they can get away with selling tough looking locks with weak cores
Most people don't pick locks, they cut them. Now if you are in a factory where 1000 people have LOTO locks, you definitely don't want multiple copies of a key floating around.
The solution to this big problem is : put your name on the lock. If there is a lock with your name on it on the LOTO stack: remove it. If there isn't: do not remove a lock. Not even if you tried all 100 locks with all of your 10 keys.
They only needed the 6pin core to meet industry security standards (thus the other LOTO locks without the 6pin core). They have no such requirements for "civilian" locks. In reality, a lock isn't really that much more secure with a "better" core. Forced entry through lock picking is extremelyyyyyyy rare outside of low skill methods like raking and bump keys. If someone had the skill and patience to "properly" pick your 5pin, he most likely also has the skill and patience to pick a 6pin with security pins. Most people try to break the lock, thus the sturdy body on the more expensive locks. Putting any more effort into the core then the bare minimum to combat low skill attacks is just a waste of money for the R&D.
This was probably done to provide as many possible key variations to prevent multiple people from having the same key, since it’s a lockout lock and they are generally key different. It provides an extra level of safety to ensure a lock isn’t accidentally removed and equipment re-energized.
Omg!!! I have been trying to pick my loto lock for years. Just on my breaks and such. Today I finally did it after watching how you did yours. Thank you. It’s so exciting to watch it finally turn. Lol.
We use this exact lock at my workplace working on trains. We often have to carry around 3+ of these when going out to jobs. It is very light so convenient to carry. If we had to carry those solidbody locks around it would get really difficult so I can understand why the design is so lightweight. They are very reliable I've been using the same ones for 10+ years.
These looks are placed on lockout switches that are generally power switches made of plastic and I think it's more to do with electric insulation and anti tamper than security as the switches can be removed very simply with a screwdriver
As a former LOTO supervisor, I can chime in on this one. The 6 pins core allows for a larger number of pin combinations which means that my 375 locks all had a different key. Although my department had the lion’s share of these locksets, my company had other departments & sections that each had their own LOTO locksets, each with their own keys. That way, unless you had the key, you couldn’t open the lock. These locks are only there as a reminder that the device is not to be operated. As such, there is no need for the locksets to have hardened shanks or body. The problem is that keys get misplaced, lost, or even broken. After a thorough investigation, the only resort may be to cut the lock The LPL didn’t work for us and a locksmith would cost more than buying a new lock. It’s all about economic options.
That's a very great point and i do get why the body would be weaker for easier cutting. It may also explain why some hardened locks have weaker cores so that it can be picked easier aside from cutting it which would be way harder. But the point of the Paradox he makes it the same point you've said. Masterlock has proven they have the knowledge and capability to make great lock bodies and strong cores, but they haven't extended much on that regard which always leave most of their locks a lot of exploits. In specific cases there are great uses for weak body and strong cores or vice versa but i think the point here is that generally, Masterlock has proven they can do better but is unknown as to why they don't.
I was thinking along this line. Lock out locks are to give the service tech the confidence to know that his key is unique and no one will come and remove the tag because their key fits, while his hands are in the machine They're not concerned with people lock picking the lock or needing to break it.
@@iAmKilljoy Fair point and i think i get it a lot better now. Thanks for clearing it up and although i get the point of a lock having its own weakness for certain areas, I didn't think about it nor was knowledgeable enough for its uses. Thanks!
I want to see the LPL review movies based on how many locks he was able to pick during the running time. A better movie will be more distracting meaning less locks picked. I think it would be a really good scale.
I don't want it out of any numbers divisible by 5. That being said, this sort of idea would be great. Have a Livestream movie or show while he picks locks would be fun too.
We use these at my work alot, the only reason I can think would be a good reason it has strong core. The reason would be that you don't want someone discreetly opening the lock, if someone snaps or breaks the lock it's totally disabled and clearly something is wrong, while if they pick it then flip the switch then re-lock it , then it could be perceived as still working properly but it's actually an unsafe scenario
If they have malicious intent but are planning ahead, couldn't they just break off the lock, flip the switch, and then put on a new LOTO lock of the same type - either one grabbed from storage, or one they purchased themselves?
The strong core is so the wrong key does not accidentally open the wrong lock by the ignorant new guy on the crew . The weak housing is so the lock can be busted open in an emergency. I worked in the engine room of a commercial tugboat, we had these all over the place.
I would add that in the environment that these are being used, tools to "break" the lock are so readily available, the need for an extremely robust body/shackle isn't the top priority for design.
You all are missing the point, why in the hell would they not have this same core in their other locks instead of having the rest of their lineup which are used to prevent theft have these cores or similar?
The most secure part of these locks, honestly, is the LOTO policy that goes with it. When trying to remove an LOTO lock without a key is a fireable offence without several pages of paperwork, it doesn't need to be pick/break proof. We had a bit of a problem with people confusing which lock was theirs since sometimes machines can have upwards of six locks on them. I bought a sheet of stickers from the dollar store and it looks odd, but it works.
This particular video still resonates with me when looking for a lock. This video is the single reason I have watched so many LPL and BB videos. This single core has shown me how a lock intended for a $150 bicycle can be made secure enough to protect several thousands. I use this knowledge to smith my own locks, as well as play with home made picks. I even have a set of my own home made pins. About 40 total between key/driver pins and bags of almost every manufactured pin size. I'm every bit of a low level hobbyist, and I can make better locks from my scrap bin than what master sells.
in Australia these loto locks are the standard because technicians lives are at stake. industry standards require a lock that is difficult to tamper with but possible to remove. the theory is that it is too difficult for someone to pick open and remove then have someone switch on or turn the valve and later claim the lock wasn't on then replace the lock back to the switch. but is easily cut off if the lockout lock is left behind. so it's made to easily detect brute force attacks but remain strong against non damaging attacks or tampering.
The plastic is both non-conductive and non sparking. Both are really important in an industrial environment. The six pins probably have to do with the number of key combinations possible. I use them a lot at work.
No doubt some else has said the same thing, but there is a very simple reason to have a difficult to pick but easy to break padlock. This padlock is used for SAFETY purposes. It is much much easier to break it than to pick it. As such, it's clear as day if/when someone unauthorized removes it. (There is no 'master key'). Either the worker with the key removes it, or someone else breaks it off. And because it's locked out for the worker's protection, that can have some serious consequences. Trust me - even in a company where they take safety seriously, the skilled tradesman inside the machine can and will put 'hands on' the person that removed his lock. I know this firsthand. Was working overtime, in a 2,000 lb press fixing a die. I hear the press starting up while I'm inside it. I slid out as fast as I could, and came around the press to see the blood drain out of someone's face. I chased them out of the building seeing red. (Fyi, I deliberately let them run faster. I didn't want to hurt them, but I did want to scare them.)
This one jumped out at me because I'm manage safety in a semiconductor lab. I think we have a "little column A, little column B" thing. 1. Weight. This is a factor, not because of carrying them, but because you might need to attach it to something small. For example a household style circuit breaker, a heavy lock could damage the breaker or the devices used to attach to the breaker. I have seen cases where the LOTO loop on a valve was broken through over time by the lock hanging on it. There are also cases where multiple locks are attached to the same point and you don't want 10 pounds hanging from even a robust point. 2. Cost, these locks go missing, get cut, get damaged, as someone who has to maintain a budget I can't spent $10000/year on locks. These buggers are expensive anyway, so if Master saves me $5/lock I'm grateful. 3. "Strength" defeating a LOTO usually results in termination, so they don't have to be strong. Seeing a red lock generally implies "mess with me and get fired", that's where its true strength is. 4. Secure core. I think the high end core is for good reasons, as I mentioned a decent sized site could go though a lot of these, I keep 25 new ones in my desk at all times, the EH&S manager probably has 100. So a decent core means more randomized keying. You don't want the wrong key to work, not when the result could be death (or many many deaths if it involves toxic gas release ). You also don't want the core to wear and allow the wrong key to work. Finally, despite the threat of termination, you don't want it defeated too easily, key bumping etc. 5. Authorized defeating. People lose keys, we have had people leave town on vacation and forget to switch locks, sometimes a LOTO can be in place for years. So the lock should be easy to cut when appropriate. It's also possible the lock is in a position so that you can't access the hasp so being able to cut the body easily helps in these cases. Anyway, that's just my 2 cents from 35 years in industry.....
I agree with everything you said. At my previous work, as an industrial electrician, we could easily have 200-300 locks or more used during a single day during maintenance shutdowns on all the production lines. Electricians, mechanics, safetey officers, production personnel, external contractors and more. Many locks got cut and replaced with new ones for a variety of reasons during a year so a good number of combinations on the cores are essential. These red ones are only one type, we used them for electrical LOTO points, there are others with different coloured shells that represent different kind of energies you lock out, e g blue, yellow and green. I'm pretty sure all of the different colours have the exact same cores.
What would be the point of defeating them at a work place? I mean apart from trying to kill or hurt someone why would someone do it? And if for mentioned by me reasons then termination would be this person least problem.
@@forthphoto my thought exactly, if something is locked a worker probably wouldn't unlock it unless their intent is harm or malicious, in which case a plastic body wouldn't suffice. Having high core security doesn't make sense to me at all if the lock body does not live up to appropriate standards.
I actually would prefer my LOTO lock this way, were I still working in a field where I needed one to well, keep me alive. Cutting off a LOTO lock is a really big deal, legally, a serious OSHA violation, so on the rare occasions it has to be done, tons of documentation and management reports. Way too many workers got killed without LOTO locks, so OSHA fines are serious when they're tampered with. But then, there's the wiseass who'd try to pick one... The dead core tends to foul up a novice, the quality core defeats a novice. My first took me a few tries when I was starting out, then popped through in a few minutes on the first success. Counterintuitively, the dead core actually makes releasing a false set or overset easier without necessarily dropping already set pins... But, for a novice, a tight lock full of security pins is like Homer Simpson trapped in a yard full of rakes. ;)
The empire actually designed the Death Star very well however, and even in the Star Wars unversae, it was very unlikely that it would be defeated. Even within the force, it’s very unlikely that the exhaust pipe could have been defeated.
@@JohnSmith-fq3rg Nor did the rebels. Those turrets where designed to fight capical ships. That is why they where to slow in turning and fireing to hit the nimble starfighters.
I doubt you’ll see this but, I work in an industrial setting and my guess would be that like you said they wanted a core with plenty of options, maybe a factory with thousands of employees and each employee expected to carry multiple locks, but being a LOTO lock you don’t need security you just need a glorified sign saying somebody is inside this machine. You do however need to be able to remove the lock easily if the owner loses a key, breaks the key or say they go home and forget to remove the lock. I know the keys aren’t exactly delicate but if you lock and unlock a locks dozen times a day every day for years on end the keys eventually get worn pretty heavily. I’ve had multiple locks cut off machines for all these reasons.
XD If that worked, I'd just get a sticker that said that. But no no it's for Lockout Tagout for work purposes :p cause sometimes idiots are like "hurp derp, it says it's broken but it turns on anywys!" since it's not locked and then a huge problem occurs. :
I had a buddy in the Navy, he was a radar technician. He secured all power and did all of his lockout tagout procedures properly before he entered into one of the high power radar arrays to do some work. Here comes some jackass who flips a power switch for it and electrocutes my buddy. Somehow he survives. Dude no has almost zero motor control in his body now and is permanently 100% disabled. Do not ignore tags or locks that say danger on them.
The reason for the core is because you can potentially have 20+ people locked out at one time; we did it at one of my old jobs. With the generic 4-pin Master cores, you could definitely have some overlap where someone's key accidentally works on the wrong lock and they unlock the wrong lock...which could be deadly if you have multiple control panels. This is just their way of making sure keys and locks don't get mixed up.
It shouldn't be deadly if the employees take some responsibility and actually reading who's tag on the lock. Here in sweden we don't have any LOTO requirement at all (except for public accessible spaces, example: A grocery store, or lobby, or whatever area that is not secured, where LOTO is required). Instead all responsibility falls on the employee which turns on a breaker switch without carefully checking the danger zone. In sweden, isolation switches that are used to isolate a circuit during maintenace even has a warning sign that it may not be turned off for any other purpose than safety - because then people knows that if the switch is turned off, it should not be turned on again by anyone else than the one who turned it off. (so if you turn off a machine during a vacation, you should NOT use the maintenace switch, but rather use a non-maintenace isolation switch for that)
Sebastian Nielsen - Tagging is still generally required by most companies so locks still in use can be ID'd to whomever is still missing. Using a group lockout box is the main reason lock security is important, because there's only one lock on the main panel...it only takes one genius to jam his key in the main panel lock, while there is potentially multiple locks still on the group lockout box.
This sounds plausible. I had to do some work at at a railway maintenance facility that required a broad shutdown of equipment (particularly the 1500vDC). The LOTO procedure before we could start was over 4 hours and involved hundreds of boards and circuits. With cheap locks (e.g. 4 pin) it would almost certainly be possible for a key to release more than one lock and allow an accident. This was a joint Private/Government environment where OHS considerations were extremely strict (even working 1 meter up required an enclosed platform, no ladders were allowed) so I could definitely see them having a "lock safety guide"
Exactly: You can open the wrong lock by mistake in normal operations so the core has to be great; you're very unlikely to physically defeat the lock by mistake, so the lock construction is not important .
As a complete noob starting picking today, I used one of these as my first lock, as well as a random Brinks lock I found. I would just like to mention for the Master Model 410 LOTO lock, once picked, do NOT over rotate the core past 90 degrees, for if you do you will drop all of the key pins into the lock body. Spoken from experience, that satisfying clunk of a lock picked followed by the jingle of all 6 key pins falling out filled me with a lot of emotions. Lesson learned. Thankful this video was here for reference. As for the core, can confirm, 5 spools and 1 double serrated on 5. Also, picking using LPL Genesis Set.
Friendly reminder if you see one of these out in the wild: Do Not Touch! My dad's an electrician and was working in a factory being gutted and renovated, and of course had turned off power and locked out the breaker panel using a similar lock. Turns out that the offices attached to the factory weren't wired correctly when it was built, and one guy lost power to a single outlet in his office. He decided that was Unacceptable and so walked into the construction site, snagged some bolt cutters from somewhere, and Cut The Lock Off The Breaker!! My dad was, at the time, on the top of an 8foot ladder cutting through a 6inch conduit with a reciprocating saw. In short order he found himself flat on his back 3 feet from his ladder holding a now very dead saw, complete with smoldering saw blade. He needed stitches in the back of his head, and thank gods that's all he needed. If the power had been turned on ever 30 seconds earlier his hand would have still been directly on the bare conduit! He would not have survived that. Those locks are so absolutely important and should NEVER BE TOUCHED if in use.
Feels like it's almost a tamper-proof seal in a lot of ways, it's easy to bust open in an emergency if needed, but not easy to open without any trace ie picking
Why the hell would anyone pick a LOTO lock? As far as I understand, it's only there to tell people not to turn on the equipment, in case they don't see the warning sign or something.
@@23Scadu Hmm this locked machine turned on, bobby was up in the control tower, when it happened and was last on the scene after it was all over, the machine is locked in the off position. What an accident! Bobby's innocent!
That's amazing how a similar lock that's used in my work industry has a plastic body, when you can go grab several types of tools or battery powered devices and just cut the body away! I like knowing I'm protected fully when I'm the one inside doing work and relying on these type of locks!
I would say that they design most locks now for saw, angle grinder, pry attacks which Master has been pretty decent with. They just don't see the picking as a main attack possibly. At least they don't seem to be focused on that side of it. But it is a little concerning when they have these nice 6 pin cores available cheaply and they chose to put a 4-5 pin basic core in all the top "Magnum" series.
My heart dropped to see the thumbnail with your name on it, showing the lock i trust my life and limbs to everyday. After watching I left more than content. Thanks from one on the line LPL.
@@ralanham76 I bought one, and it broke within a week, after I picked it open, once, and very easily, (This was after trying, and failing, to open it on previous days.) I then operated it a couple of times with the key, after which it failed to stay locked. I'm fairly new to lock picking, so was understandably surprised at how easily it could be picked (not raked) open. Would not trust my life to such fragile locks, and shall not be buying another one in a hurry.
@@RWBHere These things don't need to be pick proof. They're used on industrial equipment so someone doesn't walk by and hit the electrical disconnect while you're working on the machine. If someone is trying to pick the lock then they are literally, actively trying to murder you.
@@louisradico1511 Not only that, but they would have to pick the lock off of the equipment that you are working on. Chances are that someone would see that person trying to pick a lock off of the energized equipment and go WTF lol. Picking is pointless anyway, anytime someone loses the keys, we just cut it off with bolt cutters. Much faster and less hassle.
From the viewpoint of someone who’s a novice with locks but experienced with industrial equipment, here’s my take: 1. 6 pin core to increase the total number of key combinations. Repeating key combinations within a plant or even a company is usually a no-go. 2. High security pins because industrial equipment can vibrate A LOT. I have first hand seen a lock open on its own due to nothing more than vibration. 3. Plastic body because it is non-conductive (some other lockouts have rubberized coatings).
Master Lock: This is our highest security core. Customer: Oh, then this goes into water treatment facility locks? Master Lock: No, those get weaker cores, as they already have a strong body. Customer: Uhm, okay... So what is this used for then? Master Lock: Our LOTO Padlock. Customer: What would that be? Master Lock: It's a fancy Post-it, basically.
Masters are good locks in 99% of situations, their physical security is very good and TBH how many break-ins do you hear about where the lock was picked? Core wise then yes they couldn't really do much worse.
I use these locks daily for my equipment. These locks have plastic bodies so they can be more easily destroyed. LOTO procedure prevents anyone, besides the person who applied the lock, from using it. If a person of missing and the lock needs to be removed there is a lot of paperwork and a lot of attempts to get ahold of the employee in question (so that we’re sure that they aren’t locked inside the equipment.) afterwards a pair of box end wrenches can be used to blow out the non hardened shackle. Or alternatively, bolt cutters are used as well. But the main reason is to make sure that the lock is difficult to pick, but easy to destroy.
Glad that I saw this video. My grandaughter-in-law needed to chain and padlock the driveway gate while my grandson was working a shutdown and this was the type of lock that she found in their tool shed. I was skeptical cuz it looked so plastic and flimsy. Glad to know that it isn't flimsy.
same actually watching this video because I felt counter rotation and thought I must be wrong because its just a plastic lock I happened to have in the garage, also thought I must have miscounted the pins lol
Same here. First one to give up on and first one to cut open to look. First and the last one I tried to put back together with only tweezers and my pick tools. No longer a set
Everyone is mentioning the fact you can break the loto lock quickly but also the way the beefier locks look is intended to be a deterrent by making the lock look harder to pick then it actually is and to promote security though obscurity, one's designed for use in safety and the other is designed to trick a consumer base into thinking the lock is secure
I have used many loto locks, it’s nice that these are less able to be key racked when your trying to figure out why your key isn’t working because it’s not your lock.
@@3FIGNEWTONEATR So another question poped in my mind while watching this. With the weight of ALL the locks he's got, how high are rated the floor of the buildings he live/work in? 500 kg/m2 ? 😁
And probably with options...like a master combo that can be shimmed or a chinese 6 key magnetic double dimple with triple trapping and an explosive...depending on whether its quick Twosie or a 15 minute strain session...
As a former crew chief at a factory, our dept. had like 150ish of these. every once in a while you would have someone drop a key down a flume, or grate etc. and need to get one of these off of something. (After filling out a bunch of paperwork and whatnot, to get the OK to do so) we found out really quick the best way to get these open was a big old set of channel locks, and squeeze the shit out of them from both sides, along the seam. they fly apart and it takes literally about 1 second.
Your videos are quite fascinating. The answers to your questions are simple. Master sells these things by the hundreds of thousands, and the sets of 6 locks for each worker is supposed to be unique so that no other worker on the site can open the lock. The fragile construction is so that if the worker has flown home and cannot return to remove the lock he forgot to remove at the end of shift, then a supervisor can use a bolt cutter to remove the lock. There are usually disciplinary action taken against a worker that had his lock forcefully removed by management. This is the case in Australia where people are quite anal about safety precautions.
I've smashed a ton of these locks as a PLC programmer. Millwrights or electricians do some work, forget the lock and then go home leaving a machine in a locked state for the next shift. We call the name on the back, get verbal confirmation the machine is safe to run and smash it off with a hammer. Saves lots of time removing locks but I suppose everyone involved needs to respect the kind of honor system there.
As a union electrician myself, I appreciate you stating that you call the number BEFORE smashing the lock. It’s EXTREMELY important no one ever removes one of these without direct contact and approval from the name or company written on the lock
Im an electrician and we use the plastic loto’s alot. Its good to know they’re difficult to pick. Usually the device it’s attached to is all plastic (breaker lockout) and can be broken off easily. What keeps most trades from screwing with them is you can get some hefty jail time for tampering with one.
I worked at several power plants as an operating technician and one of our duties was to secure equipment that needed maintenance, that could involve chaining and locking valves, removing fuses and open breakers etc and they all needed to be locked down and a sign with the correct work order number. The locks was all the same and all of the us technicians had the same key, so when the job was done anyone of the technicians could remove the locks when the job was done. The jobs could take hours, days or weeks so it would probably someone else then then one that had secured the equipment earlier that would be on duty. For all sake I could had found, say a faulty pump, switched over to a spare and then written a rapport on it and then secured it for the maintenance crew that would take care of it at day time. No one removed the locks without an ok from the maintenance crew as it could spell disaster and even life threatening danger.
It is a desirable feature for these locks to be relatively easy to break. Many times locks needed to be broken when an employee left the facility without removing their lock. A supervisor was allowed to break the lock after locating the employee and verifying that they were no longer at the site. Usually these locks were used with hasps that were even easier to break than the locks. As far as I know, these locks are not useful beyond compliance with OSHA regs.
I was going to say that. Also the employee could drop the key somewhere irretrievable. Also the locks should be inexpensive and unlikely to have common keys and resist accidental raking despite a maint-dept having large numbers of them.
mjenk20236 I've had to use one of these and I believe that is the case. I dropped it about five feet once and the shell came clean apart; it's not fusion-welded or anything, literally two halves of a clamshell with a couple pins for aligning them with each other and some light adhesive to keep them together. I taped it back together. As for the extra security, it's to help ensure your key is actually being used on YOUR lock. But on the backside a label is provided where you're supposed to write your name; it also comes in several colors, mine was yellow, here we have a red, and I've seen blue before. An ounce of caution will go much further than any lock core in making sure you remove the correct lock -- does it have your name, is it the color you were assigned, are you sure you're at the panel you are responsible for? It would also be feasible to provide multiple locks to each person if they will be working on more than one zone. Use different colors or something, or stamp serials on the shackle and each matching key. Finally, a fatal mistake I have seen is for multiple personnel working in one zone to daisy-chain their locks off each other. There are group lockouts with multiple holes for each lock to be installed and ensures every lock must be removed before it can be energized, use them!! A six-hole group pad can be made to fit many more, just daisy-chain the group pads off each other until the necessary amount of holes is had. If even one lock exists anywhere on the chain, ultimately the one on the equipment will not open.
wow, where I work if you leave your lock on a tool/machine you will be called back in to unlock it. You could lose your cert and or get written up if they have to pull out the bolt cutters and have a huge ordeal.
Nailed it. Bigger yellow ones are usually on the hasps. They aren't meant to not be broken into, just so you need to fill out a form and check the machine is clear. They're for saving fingers not property
The reason it has a seemingly secure pin setup is so that there can be MANY different keyed locks on a GIANT job site, so there are less chances of keyed alike locks, because if someone unlocked the wrong padlock, someone could die. If someone does lose their key, the bolt is easy enough to cut if everyone onsite agrees the lock should be cut. I believe, that the design and choice of features are specifically designed to suit the needs of certain buyers. I’ve seen all of them at different job sites, there is no security threat inside the job site, which is why a plastic body is ok. Great video!
1:36 Perfectly shows the difference between LPL and a normal pro locksmith. Professionals learn lockpicking for work, and usually only what they need to know for most jobs. People like LPL (experts and enthusiasts) do this for fun, at literally any time or place, and they end up with way more practice and odd knowledge as a result. Similar logic also applies to most industries.
Masterlock R&D: “We just designed the most secure lock EVER!” The Board: “So it’s flawless?” Masterlock R&D: “YES!” The Board: “Garbage, throw it out.”
"Hey, take a break from the locks for a minute and come watch a movie with me" "Sounds good, I'll meet you there!" *takes a chain of ten locks to the couch*
These lock out tag out locks are usually only used for personal safety, like where I work if the bailer compactor is malfunctioning, we put it on there so nobody can operate it and potentially get hurt. Not really a scenario where somebody is going to try to pick the lock or break it. What’s to gain from it? Hurting or potentially killing somebody else? I just don’t see the reason anybody would want to try to get this lock off in that situation for some kind of gain. The only reason I can think of is that if the key is somehow lost we would be able to break off the lock with relative ease instead of spending the money to hire a locksmith or something like that.
I use these, and there is a good reason. The locks are tricky to pick for most people so removal is always destructive if the key isn't available. This is a safety feature. It's about the LO/TO policy of the company using the lock. The plastic lock combines a cheap to buy and replace (when it's inevitably cut) lock with maximum key combinations to minimize the chance of a duplicate in an organization.
He comes back 5 minutes later “Hello yes this unshielded keyway allowed me to simply insert a sheet of metal and turn the keyway, buy something that isn’t mater lock quality.”
It is the key design. It is different than most other keys on a key ring. Makes it easier for LOTO use. The soft metal makes it easier for bolt cutters when a key is lost.
The loto lock is designed to save lives from equipment start up, hence why we only get 1 key for it. Id assume the plastic housing is for weight purposes as we use upto 6 personal locks.
![[631] Master Lock 875/975 Decoded WITHOUT ANY TOOLS !](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/bfDPtt-bnAI/mqdefault.jpg)
![[631] Master Lock 875/975 Decoded WITHOUT ANY TOOLS !](/img/tr.png)
![[480] The Top Ten Nastiest Keyways (In My Collection)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GncYzuRMtb8/mqdefault.jpg)
![[593] Gallium vs. Titalium - Abus Padlock Meets a Gruesome End](/img/1.gif)
The LPL Paradox: he's Master Lock's biggest customer as well as their biggest enemy.
A true nemesis, like Moriarty to Holmes.
A true nemesis, like 33° to ice
A true nemesis, like spicy food and my colon.
A true nemesis, like my grades and my parents
@@samobrien4046 Jamal, is that you!?
“Honey is everything okay? You haven’t picked a lock for hours”
Houuuu must be a Bad day
"I've just grown so bored with all of them. ...Is there no one to surpass my power?..."
LPL hasn't picked a lock in hours.
Mrs LPL: I bet he's thinking about other women.
LPL: Man that paracentric keyway really has me stumped.
@@bentonrp he goes as far as to making a lock even he can't beat/j
@@Atlas_DXUlt Right! 😃 And then he, himself, ends up getting accidentally locked-in because of it.
Some kinda pastiche to those ancient Greek tragic plays, or something...
At the movie theater: "sir, do you want some popcorn?"
"No, do you have some LOTO padlocks?"
Yeah, right?
I was concerned but then he said on the couch and it made more sense.
I've worked in the industrial field for 15 years and I think I know the answer to your paradox with the loto locks.
A given employer may have thousands of these locks on their site at a given time (sometimes 10+ per employee), and possibly use millions of locks over the course of their business lifetime. You absolutely cannot have a key that matches a lock anywhere else than that one lock it is tied to, that is a big insurance and safety problem. So the more pins allows for more key variations. Also, people are constantly sticking their keys into the wrong locks accidentally, and so the higher quality core allows for less chance that they will force the lock open before they realize it is the wrong lock. I do this multiple times a shift, because I have several locks issued to me with many similar keys and I typically just go through them until I find the one that opens (I know I should label them).
The more pins means there is more variety for the keys and less chance of a duplicate on site. The higher quality core, which is in all likelihood regulated by law, means less chance of someone forcing a very old lock open.
The reason the quality of the housing is so poor is intentional. You want to be able to cut or even smash the lock off in a hurry if you have to. Maybe there is an emergency and you think of a way to operate the machine in order to try to save someone who is injured. Also, more benignly, people leave for home with their locks on machines all the time on accident handing off to other shifts. So you don't want some sort of monster lock on there that you can't get off without the key. The cheap build makes buying them much more affordable for employers, when they buy thousands of these at a time.
They are not security locks, they are safety locks. High volume that must meet stringent safety standards (6 pins) for various reasons, but are not meant to be undefeatable in all circumstances.
As far as why there are stronger locks with shitty keys and cores, that seems pretty easy thing to answer. Most of these locks are all fairly cheap and sold at hardware stores, likely bought by soccor moms and the like to keep their shed closed or maybe a dirt bike or something chained up. You don't want some petty incompetent thief to be able to smash the lock open or cut it open easily when you're not around.
But if you misplace or lose the key over the winter time while you're not using whatever you have locked up, you also don't want it to be an impossible task for a locksmith to open your lock. Maybe you could even pick the lock yourself. Also more pins means more points of failure outside during rain and rust and exposure to elements.
In short, the customer gets what they want. These decisions aren't being made by masterlock. They're being made by masterlock's largest customer base.
@@j37j2 "They're being made by masterlock's largest customer base."
True yet false :)
You assume the customer base is informed and makes a reasoned decision ...
@@j.p.vanbolhuis8678 I don't think its unreasonable to assume that the insurance companies who require these locks can make informed decisions, when they are the ones who lobbied the government for these regulations in the first place.
There's no one person or organization who comes up with these ideas. The market evolves until it meets what is best.
I was going to say the exact same thing. Glad someone figured it out :)
A lock out lock isn't for security. It's to stop operator error.
@@j37j2 Well, trouble is, masterlock does advertise a lot of easily defeatable locks as "unpickable". Assuming you're ignorant (not stupid per se, just not a locksmith), you might rightly assume that lock is enough, even if it's actually garbage. "High security" locks defeated in a single second, where the average consumer may simply not know about such weaknesses and may reasonably demand a lock that, well, locks something. When the consumer is lied to, an educated decision isn't exactly easy.
Don’t mind me while I pick these locks during the film.
"we had a little false set there.. nice click out of 5..."
Ummmm sir, can you be quiet please
@@SirTomFoolery hahahahhahah😂😂😂
I never understand anything of the piking part
Rotating on 1 he's set... 2 is binding
SURE THING CAN WE WATCH BROTHER
These locks are hard to pick. So hard in fact, I pick a whole ring of them while I pay attention to other things.
I too sometimes inadvertently pick my nose open when I have a nasal congestion, but locks? Holy
@@ginger88895 I laughed so hard reading both of you :D
@@ginger88895 LMAO
Yeah… I loved that remark….
That was sooo funny😂
As a safety professional I can explain the paradox. This is the best LOTO lock because the likelihood of mistakenly taken a lock off with a similar key is very low and uet it is very easy to remove by force when an employee goes home and locks out critical machinery. There are procedures in place to cut a lock and Noone not even management can unlock the lock without destroying it. These are Industry standard and in my carreer I have never seen the other locks he has shown. This lock is ideal to its purpose.
Brings back bad memories of working for a certain large online retailer.. I used to randomly select one engineer for a LOTO audit weekly, the locks used are the same as this one. Remember: locks only keep the honest people out.
Then explain why its full of security Pins, and it has more of them than the Locks they rate the highest on their Security Scale (which only have standard Pins)?
@@unitrader403 there's a little more to it than what Justin Ford said but not much. First, job sites where LOTO locks like this are used can have machines that are multiple stories tall and during annual scheduled maintenance can have dozens of contractors and hundreds of workers on site. Amongst those hundreds is usually one asshole who thinks the rules don't apply to him and knows how to force a typical lock with pressure on the hasp and a dead blow hammer so he can turn on a light in a crawl space. He might even keep a bump key or rake in his pocket. Locks of these types should be impossible to manipulate into opening without a key but should show damage at any attempt to brute force open so anyone walking by would notice it's been messed with. The danger isn't that the lock was brute forced open and it's obvious after the fact (no valuables stolen) The danger is someone doesn't know the lock was picked or jimmied and goes into the danger area.
@@matthewsullivan9598 This still does not answer the question why Masterlock does not use these cores in their highest rated products even though these Cores are objectively more secure...
@@unitrader403 Cost.
More pins=more money. It takes more manufacturing steps and security pins take more fine machining. I think lawyers have an impact as well. If the actual core fails or is defeated on a LOTO lock someone might die. That's huge liability to the company. If the core fails or is defeated on an expensive high security lock and your garage gets ransacked it sucks for you but you're not likely to sue Master Lock for millions. People pay a premium for a tough LOOKING lock without knowing how good the core is so why waste money on the core? I'm not defending I'm explaining and I get frustrated by it too. Yet it makes sense from the business side.
I'm a chemical operator and I do lotos essentially daily. We have all 3 locks in this video mentioned. The plastic body is by far my favorite for its light weight (we often have to carry 30-50 at a time) and it's ability to endure weather and corrosion. We work with HCL, sulfuric acid, h2s, chlorine etc and the other locks in the video pretty much always get siezed closed in our harsh environment. The plastic ones can remain in a lockout for months and will unlock months later without issue whereas the metal ones often have to get cut off due to corrosion.
I can see that happening given the conditions. My work gave us American Lock 1100s but of course being aluminum bodied they get beat up pretty quickly after being carried around all night. Mine have gone from being red to having no finish on it at all so I think the plastic bodied would hold up better lol
Did u have separate lockout boxes, basically said locks are associated with a particular box set so locks 1-12 box A4 labeled for that box, the keys for those go into that box and that box is locked by your personally labeled lock and you only carry the one key for that particular box granted sometimes multiples for several boxes but no need to carry 30 keys around.
@@vinces8209 It's not the keys he's carrying around, it's the locks. On any given piece of equipment you could have literally hundreds of lockout points, every single one of them has to have a lock, and there's only gonna be two or maybe three guys if you're lucky handling all of it.
Imagine sitting in a theater and the guy infront of you is just sitting there with a keychain full of locks, slowly picking them
Would probably ask him to share
Jackmjedi lmao when he said “I take it with me while watching a movie”, I thought he meant in a movie theater too. Haha
*quickly
I imagine him being asked for some Netflix and chill and he first goes to grab his chain of locks before heading out.
I'd probably ask him what he is doing and if friendly conversation on it.
Imagine robbing his house and seeing a safe with 20 locks on it. You spend a full day getting in and your realize he just has locks that protect his locks..
Those are decoy locks locked in a decoy safe. He keeps his real locks hidden somewhere else locked with real locks
And inside the safe... more locks
But will he use the bad locks to "secure" the good locks in the safe, or use the good locks to secure the bad locks?
@@ytfakemail i suppose that is the great philosophical question of our time.
@@ytfakemail the LPL safe lock paradox
The lockout lock has probably saved lots of lives. Many years ago I was developing electronic sign control software with a fellow named Jimmy. When the electricians were working on the sign (3 phase, 400 Amp service), they would put a lock on the breaker box and put the key in their pocket. Jimmy would invariably want to test something and would run over to the breaker and try to turn on the power while the electricians were up a ladder and inside the sign.
As an industrial electrician, I've seen a good amount of contractors leave site permanently without taking off their LOTO locks. Therefore their locks needed to be cut off. Assuming this is the reasoning for the low security exterior.
also it’s a lot cheaper, which is important since they’re often bought by the hundreds
@@kjellcampbell7668also chemical resistances
Never thought of that. That is an extremely reasonable assumption. I bet you're correct.
Netflix and Pick?
Goes to the dates house - “You got any good locks I could take a look at?”
No, my last boyfriend was the LPL, and he picked my chastity belt in about 45 seconds. The rest of the night was much longer. I mean, um... sure?
@@osco4311 45 seconds, that must have been an amazing lock
.......... And now I have date ideas!
@@cameronjadewallace well see this story online soon...
888 likes
when youre construction worker in a dangerous place with a switch that could kill you and you hear "number 4 is binding, got a little click of him"
🤣😆🤣😆🤣
😂😂😂😂
Bruuuh this needs more likes
hat tbh I didn't even know that it had this many likes til you replied lmao
*confused tom face*
the additional pin(s) are not for more security, it's to reduce the odds that someone will accidentally have a duplicate lock in a multiple person lockout situation. complex operations can have a dozen or more LOTO locks on one piece of equipment.
That makes a ton of sense.
Another comment also suggested the weak body is specifically so you can easily cut it off in the fairly common event a contractor finishes and leaves while forgetting to remove the lock.
YOUR lock is supposed to have YOUR name on it....YOUR key isnt supposed to be inserted in someone elses lock...that makes two tons of sense...
@@johnrobertson7583This isn't for a personal lock. This is for a facility that has a to a dozen different electrical boxes and dangerous areas that need to be locked up and therefore buy these guys
Masterlock: A maker of fine practice locks for lock picking hobbyists.
Master Lock is just trying to balance their locks. If a lock had maxed out stats, that would be overpowered. Therefore they balance their locks with strength and weaknesses to promote variety in the lock meta.
Underrated comment
I literally thought this, my brain is so full of trash from video games and ttrpgs.
I was thinking the same thing. But is still a really retarded thing to do in Outside.
lmao they do it so they can sell more locks
Waiting for one one that has maxed out Intelligence and Strength
LPL doesn’t have a set of house keys. I imagine he just brings his picks everywhere and hotwires his car every morning
Bwahahaha lmao lol omg hahahaha
MacGyver, is that you?
By the way, has he ever picked car doors locks or even ignition?
@@LucasMartinsS Be did pick a trunk lock of some Mazda
Steering still locks up... .
I can just imagine lpl watching the notebook with mrs. Lpl and while she’s bawling her eyes out he’s just quietly saying to himself “click out of 3, ooh 4 is binding” 💀💀
I use those plastic LOTO locks at my job everyday, and the reason why we use them is because they can be broken open pretty easily if someone forgets to take them off and leaves with the key. Not sure if that's why they're designed that way, but at work they're pretty much just to remind someone that an area or piece of equipment is locked out.
Could you imagine sitting down with your husband to watch a romantic movie and you hear “2 clicks from 3, 4 is binding” very quietly
"Honey, what are you doing? Turn and face me"
..." a little counter-rotation on 5..."
@@KF1 a big false set on 6...
In bed …
I bet mrs.LPL can lol
I shouldn't find it as funny as i do. Thank you very much for making me laugh
This video is hilarious for several reasons:
1. The fact that he has a keychain full of locks instead of keys
2. The fact that he picks those locks just for fun while watching movies
3. The fact that he said "I know a lot of you are probably thinking..." followed by some random lock picking jargon.
But fuck that cord is robust!
😂
whaha thx for the laugh, great list lol
Lookup video 182 and you'll see how many keychains of locks he has
@@nekoprincess4130 Yeah, I actually thought 182 was a parody until I watched a few more of his videos (and compared them to other skilled pickers like Bill).
Coming from someone who has over a decade in the oilfield industry, my guess behind the plastic body would be for economic purposes. These are used as safety tools to keep someone from starting up a unit, rather than keeping someone out of your belongings. Considering companies purchase these sometimes in hundreds or even thousands at a time, the plastic must save some money. Not to mention how often they get lost or stolen by employees.
Then why make it such an advanced lock? He says it's got 6 pins, with security pins. Then goes through all the expensive locks, and none of them have anywhere near as good security on pins.
@@chris24678 Making the lock tough to pick means it can't be removed easily by non-destructive means without its key, which should thwart any unauthorized removal of it since a destroyed lock would provide evidence of such.
Reason: it's a breakaway lock. It is made to be snapped off with a simple tool, like a pair of pliers, in a hurry. The sophisticated core is a deterrent. It's there to ensure the lock wasn't removed in a malicious way. If you don't have they key, but someone is getting cooked alive because a valve didn't hold or a line blew, you need to secure a line NOW. No time to find the guy with the key; you can bypass it in a hurry. If it was a simple lock, it could be picked easily and quickly by someone with malicious intent. So the core is there to help raise the question: "Why was the LOTO removed?", if it was removed improperly.
Ok, that explains the weak lock with the good core. But why the strong locks with worse cores?
@@dimanetov1807 Those locks are difficult to cut. If you lose the key and you want access to your property, you'll need to hire a professional locksmith. Simpler core = more cances your local locksmith will be able to open it in a reasonable amount of time and not cost you an arm and a leg.
Of course, this **does** open up the danger of thieves with simple tools and a passing knowledge on lockpicking....
@@dimanetov1807 they didn't listen to the LPL 🤣
Sorry, but that is a stupid reason.
You NEVER lock something what could be so impotant that it could save a person or a proces.
I am a electrician, I lock switches so there is NO WAY that someone turns the switch on, If you work with valves and you don't want anyone to turn it on, you lock it.
Locking things keep you safe, if you lock something that could save someone's life you are STUPID, don't use a lock, use a permanent human watch, who can turn something ON in case of an emerency.
Like you say, no time to find the guy with the key, you can bypass it in a hurry,..... yeah, by finding the guy with the pair of pliers ????
It has far more to with variety and cost.
Having that many pins means that many more possible combinations, and if you have a company with 100s of people who need LOTO locks, you need to have a unique key for each person. The plastic body just makes it cheap.
He doesn't like movies that don't have a lot of tension.
HAYOOOOOOOOOOO
But he has a liking for shackles.
Some people have a hard time picking a movie...
🏆
HA HA HA HA HA😂
Him picking locks while watching movies as practice totally explains why he can pick a lock in 30 seconds and say, "that's a good security lock"
He's got a talent for it, too.
he also tries to pick the locks a couple times before he films
I wouldn't be surprised if he is picking locks during sex
@@ludaka972BG chastity belt is no challenge.
@@danhammond8406 what others call a chastity belt he calls foreplay.
If there was an incident at a LOTO job site and tampering was suspected, a broken or cut lock is far more obvious than one that had been picked. When my sig is on a LOTO, the last thing I want is someone to easily pick the lock, cycle the power, pop the lock back on and exit the area. That could make an investigation very difficult.
I can definitely appreciate why LOTO locks are designed as they are but having the ability to buy a padlock for conventional purposes with a core in that style would definitely be a selling point. Their 10/10-rated puck locks with absolutely terrible comb-pickable cores is a good use-case for this. It's an easily identifiable target if someone sees one and has ill intentions. If they know what they're doing it's open season.
As somebody in the construction industry the best reason I can give is if something happens to that worker who has the key and the key is lost, a set of bolt cutters can get everything up and running again with minimal effort. Most of the time these locks are nearby sensitive switches and equipment and you don't need to be struggling to get them off.
I've worked with LOTO locks for years, and can comment on why the design is great for me and my coworkers. The shackle is un-hardened so an authorized Safety team member can use standard bolt cutters to chop it if someone's lost their key. Additionally, we use these so often that we wear them on our belt, so the lightweight plastic-exterior design really helps to not tear up your pants or bounce around too much. Finally, we use these locks several times per day for years, so perhaps the extra pinning helps the keys stay firmly in place when we're walking around with the key in, or continue to safely function. Or perhaps there was some court case where someone picked a lock and someone got hurt. I'm not totally sure, but that's the information I have!
I’m here to back this up as well. Everything he says here I can attest to. I work with automated robots, which require constant trouble shooting. This requires a lockout every time I have to enter the automated cell, I use this same exact loto lock as many as 50 times in one 12 hour shift.
So true, plus the Weight hanging off a MCC mains power switch handle.
When you have scissors plates and 20 locks hanging off one, all that weight over time can damage the switch mechanism internals.
the new plastic locks came out after 2 people died and 3 injured because the switch was damaged energizing a conveyor that they were working on.
Early 2000's in Australia.
I am a non-lock picking lawyer who does labor arbitrations and thus I know a fair amount about LOTO practices. All those reasons are spot on. Also note that The “one man one lock“ practice means you can have 10+ locks hanging off the same switch if it’s a big project. Size and weight matters. Finally, on the management side, no one ever got in trouble for paying an extra dollar for an LOTO lock so I won’t be surprised if someone at master lock just said, what the heck put the good core in there we can charge extra for it ;-).
Thanks for all the specific insights, very interesting, but I don't think that was ever an issue. Everyone can imagine why plastic locks could be useful, problem mentioned is more at why they did not put such a good core (as LPL claims, I got no clue about it) on any of the premium locks that are supposed to provide more security when they obviously are able to make it :P
Felix Safford never claimed to be one, only stated that i use this lock at my place of employment and my experience with it.
Imagine him sleepwalking and picking all locks in the neighbourhood
While mumbling to himself "this is the lockpickinglawyer and today we are showing how easy it is to open my neighbors doors"
You wake up and front doors open the cat is in the now open safe and that box in the attic full of mags your grandpa lost the key to 23 years ago is layed out for the world to see.
Click on 1 small click on 2 3 is binding
I'm sure he would also give his neighbors better locks to challenge his sleep walking self cause an easy lock that can be raked open in moments is no fun past the first time
Lol
Lockout tag out is practiced mostly by electricians for "locking out" electrical circuits aka turning them off and then tagging it with name and phone number. If this circuit was somehow to get turned on while getting worked on someone could die. Not designed for anti theft. Power tools are every where. I could cut the shackle off with my linemens aka side cutters.
Other companies make lockout tag out locks with a picture of the person attached on shackle with "Do not turn on, my family depends on me" written on lock body.
Holy moly, how dramatic!
@@seno5530 It happens more than you think
For example in the USA alone, between 1992 and 1999 (i.e. 7 or 8 years)
there were ~2500 fatal occupational electrocutions.
Most of these (i'd guess upwards of 98%) occur on low voltage circuits.
So that is about ~300 per year over this period.
They are also used in Underground mining for locking out dangerous equipment, if you need to go into the area that has been locked out you have to lock on first, and everyone needs to personally remove their danger lock before the equipment can be re-energised. they are for protecting human life from accidents, not for protecting valuables from thieves.
@Nick Paul My man came back to the exact same comment a week later just to double down on calling "Se No" an idiot. What an absolute chad.
edit: Unless they deleted their comment. Fuck, I'm tired, idk why that wasn't my first thought.
As otherwise mentioned, we use these for safety in the oilfield for, "Lock out, tag out" of valves and pumps when equipment is shut in or being serviced. Where these are used can often be bypassed with a wrench or screwdriver to disassemble the handle or leaver leaving the lock intact. What I leaned from this vid is that they have great cores that will help prevent accidents and serve their purpose perfectly. Well done LPL, always interesting and informative.
A lot of people here seem to be missing his point quite dramatically. He's not saying it's inherently stupid that these LOTO locks have really good cores and terrible bodies, he's saying that it's crazy that all the other locks Master Lock make for actual security purposes have terrible cores when this clearly shows that they have the technology and knowledge to produce some really good ones. He's saying that it's weird to waste these really good cores on locks where it doesn't matter as much at the expense of their security cores
It's simple, really. it's all about liability and lawyers. They would more likely get sued over someone's death than the theft of a bicycle. So, they go with the cheaper option where possible. Not mysterious at all.
@@videodistro I would also say that someone less familiar with locks would judge the lock purely based off of its looks. Because of this they can get away with selling tough looking locks with weak cores
Most people don't pick locks, they cut them. Now if you are in a factory where 1000 people have LOTO locks, you definitely don't want multiple copies of a key floating around.
The solution to this big problem is : put your name on the lock. If there is a lock with your name on it on the LOTO stack: remove it. If there isn't: do not remove a lock. Not even if you tried all 100 locks with all of your 10 keys.
They only needed the 6pin core to meet industry security standards (thus the other LOTO locks without the 6pin core). They have no such requirements for "civilian" locks. In reality, a lock isn't really that much more secure with a "better" core. Forced entry through lock picking is extremelyyyyyyy rare outside of low skill methods like raking and bump keys. If someone had the skill and patience to "properly" pick your 5pin, he most likely also has the skill and patience to pick a 6pin with security pins. Most people try to break the lock, thus the sturdy body on the more expensive locks. Putting any more effort into the core then the bare minimum to combat low skill attacks is just a waste of money for the R&D.
Sees video name: masterlock
Sees length: 7 minutes
Nonono, this can't be right.
@dustybroom16 you must be fun at parties
@dustybroom16 you would be fun at parties
@dustybroom16 Just take the L and move on
What a wonderfully irrelevant flame war we have here! Please, do go on.
Wait what happened here?
This was probably done to provide as many possible key variations to prevent multiple people from having the same key, since it’s a lockout lock and they are generally key different. It provides an extra level of safety to ensure a lock isn’t accidentally removed and equipment re-energized.
Since it's a reasonably tough lock to pick, it's also not easy to remove non-destructively, so any malicious removal of it's likely to be discovered.
Omg!!!
I have been trying to pick my loto lock for years. Just on my breaks and such.
Today I finally did it after watching how you did yours. Thank you.
It’s so exciting to watch it finally turn. Lol.
Woman: Hey, wanna watch Netflix and Chill?
LockPickingLawyer:
**Grabs ring full of Lockout Locks**
Bro he has a wife
@@bennettgraham9637 would you like me to put "Wife" instead of "Woman"?
M.Anthony C. You don’t need to change it
Donald Trump you’re an imposter the real Donald Trump isn’t autistic
sabretechv2 you sure bout that?
'I can't believe he didn't cry at titanic'
LPL: 'Okay, nice click on 3'
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣omfg such an underrated comment
He would opened that gate instantly, in stead of needing to dive for the keys on the floor!
All he needed was Rose her hairpin🤣
At the end of the movie the LPL has the Heart of the Ocean in his pocket…. Safe was easy pick.
@@DealerDream82 na he'd have a pile of old british padlocks in the safe
We use this exact lock at my workplace working on trains. We often have to carry around 3+ of these when going out to jobs. It is very light so convenient to carry. If we had to carry those solidbody locks around it would get really difficult so I can understand why the design is so lightweight. They are very reliable I've been using the same ones for 10+ years.
These looks are placed on lockout switches that are generally power switches made of plastic and I think it's more to do with electric insulation and anti tamper than security as the switches can be removed very simply with a screwdriver
As a former LOTO supervisor, I can chime in on this one. The 6 pins core allows for a larger number of pin combinations which means that my 375 locks all had a different key. Although my department had the lion’s share of these locksets, my company had other departments & sections that each had their own LOTO locksets, each with their own keys. That way, unless you had the key, you couldn’t open the lock. These locks are only there as a reminder that the device is not to be operated. As such, there is no need for the locksets to have hardened shanks or body. The problem is that keys get misplaced, lost, or even broken. After a thorough investigation, the only resort may be to cut the lock The LPL didn’t work for us and a locksmith would cost more than buying a new lock. It’s all about economic options.
That's a very great point and i do get why the body would be weaker for easier cutting. It may also explain why some hardened locks have weaker cores so that it can be picked easier aside from cutting it which would be way harder.
But the point of the Paradox he makes it the same point you've said. Masterlock has proven they have the knowledge and capability to make great lock bodies and strong cores, but they haven't extended much on that regard which always leave most of their locks a lot of exploits.
In specific cases there are great uses for weak body and strong cores or vice versa but i think the point here is that generally, Masterlock has proven they can do better but is unknown as to why they don't.
Also the plastic body resist possible electrical discharge.
I was thinking along this line. Lock out locks are to give the service tech the confidence to know that his key is unique and no one will come and remove the tag because their key fits, while his hands are in the machine
They're not concerned with people lock picking the lock or needing to break it.
@@iAmKilljoy Fair point and i think i get it a lot better now. Thanks for clearing it up and although i get the point of a lock having its own weakness for certain areas, I didn't think about it nor was knowledgeable enough for its uses.
Thanks!
@@davidmenasce6614 If they're not concerned with people picking it why would it sport 6 security pins over standard pins?
I want to see the LPL review movies based on how many locks he was able to pick during the running time. A better movie will be more distracting meaning less locks picked. I think it would be a really good scale.
He will need to stock up for Ben-Hur.
I rate this film 5 picks out of 10
I don't want it out of any numbers divisible by 5.
That being said, this sort of idea would be great.
Have a Livestream movie or show while he picks locks would be fun too.
It would have to be ratio though
😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂
LPL is the type of person to open their house locks with a lock pick instead of the keys
We use these at my work alot, the only reason I can think would be a good reason it has strong core. The reason would be that you don't want someone discreetly opening the lock, if someone snaps or breaks the lock it's totally disabled and clearly something is wrong, while if they pick it then flip the switch then re-lock it , then it could be perceived as still working properly but it's actually an unsafe scenario
If they have malicious intent but are planning ahead, couldn't they just break off the lock, flip the switch, and then put on a new LOTO lock of the same type - either one grabbed from storage, or one they purchased themselves?
When you're watching a movie with the boys and one of em just starts picking locks
suddenly fixes long broken door knob
The guy in front of you just says “1 is loose, 2 is binding; click out of him, got a tiny click out of 3...”
Hey, gotta grind experience points to level up Destruction spells sometime
Pretty badass tbh
And then the second one Is hacking a computer, the third one Is hotwiring car And the fourth one Is hacking a keypad
The strong core is so the wrong key does not accidentally open the wrong lock by the ignorant new guy on the crew . The weak housing is so the lock can be busted open in an emergency. I worked in the engine room of a commercial tugboat, we had these all over the place.
But this doesn't explain why the strong core is not also available in the strong housing LOTO locks. That is the "paradox."
@@WalterBurton the theory of marginal returns?
I would add that in the environment that these are being used, tools to "break" the lock are so readily available, the need for an extremely robust body/shackle isn't the top priority for design.
You all are missing the point, why in the hell would they not have this same core in their other locks instead of having the rest of their lineup which are used to prevent theft have these cores or similar?
@@Alex-ve1og It is their option to sell whatever, and our option to buy whatever. Why make it more complicated?
The most secure part of these locks, honestly, is the LOTO policy that goes with it. When trying to remove an LOTO lock without a key is a fireable offence without several pages of paperwork, it doesn't need to be pick/break proof. We had a bit of a problem with people confusing which lock was theirs since sometimes machines can have upwards of six locks on them. I bought a sheet of stickers from the dollar store and it looks odd, but it works.
This particular video still resonates with me when looking for a lock.
This video is the single reason I have watched so many LPL and BB videos.
This single core has shown me how a lock intended for a $150 bicycle can be made secure enough to protect several thousands.
I use this knowledge to smith my own locks, as well as play with home made picks. I even have a set of my own home made pins. About 40 total between key/driver pins and bags of almost every manufactured pin size.
I'm every bit of a low level hobbyist, and I can make better locks from my scrap bin than what master sells.
the body of a peasant but the heart of a knight, this little lock would be a nice movie protagonist
Bruh
KnightSoul Wow! How’d you think of that! 👍
All the peasant need is to put on a nicer armor. Btw nice username
LOL
Dreamworks: *furiously taking notes*
in Australia these loto locks are the standard because technicians lives are at stake. industry standards require a lock that is difficult to tamper with but possible to remove. the theory is that it is too difficult for someone to pick open and remove then have someone switch on or turn the valve and later claim the lock wasn't on then replace the lock back to the switch. but is easily cut off if the lockout lock is left behind. so it's made to easily detect brute force attacks but remain strong against non damaging attacks or tampering.
It's the same here in the USA. A special "lock removal procedure must be followed and documented each time a safety lock is removed.
Best answer. Everyone else seems to address only half of the issue and get hung up on key diversity, or emergency destruction. Thanks.
I don't understand why anyone would consider this "difficult to tamper with".
Cory Goodman like LPL said, its one of their best cores and full of security pins. Ergo not likely to be picked by an amateur
This does make the most sense. People tend to forget about the A-holes in the world who would do something like that.
The plastic is both non-conductive and non sparking.
Both are really important in an industrial environment.
The six pins probably have to do with the number of key combinations possible.
I use them a lot at work.
No doubt some else has said the same thing, but there is a very simple reason to have a difficult to pick but easy to break padlock.
This padlock is used for SAFETY purposes. It is much much easier to break it than to pick it. As such, it's clear as day if/when someone unauthorized removes it. (There is no 'master key').
Either the worker with the key removes it, or someone else breaks it off. And because it's locked out for the worker's protection, that can have some serious consequences.
Trust me - even in a company where they take safety seriously, the skilled tradesman inside the machine can and will put 'hands on' the person that removed his lock.
I know this firsthand. Was working overtime, in a 2,000 lb press fixing a die. I hear the press starting up while I'm inside it. I slid out as fast as I could, and came around the press to see the blood drain out of someone's face. I chased them out of the building seeing red. (Fyi, I deliberately let them run faster. I didn't want to hurt them, but I did want to scare them.)
This one jumped out at me because I'm manage safety in a semiconductor lab. I think we have a "little column A, little column B" thing. 1. Weight. This is a factor, not because of carrying them, but because you might need to attach it to something small. For example a household style circuit breaker, a heavy lock could damage the breaker or the devices used to attach to the breaker. I have seen cases where the LOTO loop on a valve was broken through over time by the lock hanging on it. There are also cases where multiple locks are attached to the same point and you don't want 10 pounds hanging from even a robust point. 2. Cost, these locks go missing, get cut, get damaged, as someone who has to maintain a budget I can't spent $10000/year on locks. These buggers are expensive anyway, so if Master saves me $5/lock I'm grateful. 3. "Strength" defeating a LOTO usually results in termination, so they don't have to be strong. Seeing a red lock generally implies "mess with me and get fired", that's where its true strength is. 4. Secure core. I think the high end core is for good reasons, as I mentioned a decent sized site could go though a lot of these, I keep 25 new ones in my desk at all times, the EH&S manager probably has 100. So a decent core means more randomized keying. You don't want the wrong key to work, not when the result could be death (or many many deaths if it involves toxic gas release ). You also don't want the core to wear and allow the wrong key to work. Finally, despite the threat of termination, you don't want it defeated too easily, key bumping etc. 5. Authorized defeating. People lose keys, we have had people leave town on vacation and forget to switch locks, sometimes a LOTO can be in place for years. So the lock should be easy to cut when appropriate. It's also possible the lock is in a position so that you can't access the hasp so being able to cut the body easily helps in these cases.
Anyway, that's just my 2 cents from 35 years in industry.....
I agree with everything you said. At my previous work, as an industrial electrician, we could easily have 200-300 locks or more used during a single day during maintenance shutdowns on all the production lines. Electricians, mechanics, safetey officers, production personnel, external contractors and more. Many locks got cut and replaced with new ones for a variety of reasons during a year so a good number of combinations on the cores are essential. These red ones are only one type, we used them for electrical LOTO points, there are others with different coloured shells that represent different kind of energies you lock out, e g blue, yellow and green. I'm pretty sure all of the different colours have the exact same cores.
What would be the point of defeating them at a work place? I mean apart from trying to kill or hurt someone why would someone do it? And if for mentioned by me reasons then termination would be this person least problem.
@@forthphoto my thought exactly, if something is locked a worker probably wouldn't unlock it unless their intent is harm or malicious, in which case a plastic body wouldn't suffice. Having high core security doesn't make sense to me at all if the lock body does not live up to appropriate standards.
@@forthphoto The point is so no one else unlocks a lock by mistake. It has nothing to do with malintent.
This is exactly why the lock exists.
Fun fact: The way Master Lock makes their locks is very similar to the way the Empire makes their death stars.
I don't see any anti starfighter laser turrets lining the keyway though...
I actually would prefer my LOTO lock this way, were I still working in a field where I needed one to well, keep me alive.
Cutting off a LOTO lock is a really big deal, legally, a serious OSHA violation, so on the rare occasions it has to be done, tons of documentation and management reports. Way too many workers got killed without LOTO locks, so OSHA fines are serious when they're tampered with.
But then, there's the wiseass who'd try to pick one... The dead core tends to foul up a novice, the quality core defeats a novice. My first took me a few tries when I was starting out, then popped through in a few minutes on the first success.
Counterintuitively, the dead core actually makes releasing a false set or overset easier without necessarily dropping already set pins...
But, for a novice, a tight lock full of security pins is like Homer Simpson trapped in a yard full of rakes. ;)
The empire actually designed the Death Star very well however, and even in the Star Wars unversae, it was very unlikely that it would be defeated. Even within the force, it’s very unlikely that the exhaust pipe could have been defeated.
@@vladiiidracula235 you sound just like Han Solo in the first movie.
@@JohnSmith-fq3rg Nor did the rebels. Those turrets where designed to fight capical ships. That is why they where to slow in turning and fireing to hit the nimble starfighters.
I doubt you’ll see this but, I work in an industrial setting and my guess would be that like you said they wanted a core with plenty of options, maybe a factory with thousands of employees and each employee expected to carry multiple locks, but being a LOTO lock you don’t need security you just need a glorified sign saying somebody is inside this machine. You do however need to be able to remove the lock easily if the owner loses a key, breaks the key or say they go home and forget to remove the lock. I know the keys aren’t exactly delicate but if you lock and unlock a locks dozen times a day every day for years on end the keys eventually get worn pretty heavily. I’ve had multiple locks cut off machines for all these reasons.
I always love watching his videos, it's my asmr when I want to relax
"Do not remove"
People trying to break in: *darn*
XD If that worked, I'd just get a sticker that said that.
But no no it's for Lockout Tagout for work purposes :p cause sometimes idiots are like "hurp derp, it says it's broken but it turns on anywys!" since it's not locked and then a huge problem occurs. :
Yeah a huge problem or someone gets crushed or something...
Cue the “this sign can’t stop me because I can’t read” meme
Swiper no Swiping!
I had a buddy in the Navy, he was a radar technician. He secured all power and did all of his lockout tagout procedures properly before he entered into one of the high power radar arrays to do some work. Here comes some jackass who flips a power switch for it and electrocutes my buddy. Somehow he survives. Dude no has almost zero motor control in his body now and is permanently 100% disabled. Do not ignore tags or locks that say danger on them.
The reason for the core is because you can potentially have 20+ people locked out at one time; we did it at one of my old jobs. With the generic 4-pin Master cores, you could definitely have some overlap where someone's key accidentally works on the wrong lock and they unlock the wrong lock...which could be deadly if you have multiple control panels. This is just their way of making sure keys and locks don't get mixed up.
It shouldn't be deadly if the employees take some responsibility and actually reading who's tag on the lock. Here in sweden we don't have any LOTO requirement at all (except for public accessible spaces, example: A grocery store, or lobby, or whatever area that is not secured, where LOTO is required). Instead all responsibility falls on the employee which turns on a breaker switch without carefully checking the danger zone. In sweden, isolation switches that are used to isolate a circuit during maintenace even has a warning sign that it may not be turned off for any other purpose than safety - because then people knows that if the switch is turned off, it should not be turned on again by anyone else than the one who turned it off. (so if you turn off a machine during a vacation, you should NOT use the maintenace switch, but rather use a non-maintenace isolation switch for that)
Sebastian Nielsen - Tagging is still generally required by most companies so locks still in use can be ID'd to whomever is still missing. Using a group lockout box is the main reason lock security is important, because there's only one lock on the main panel...it only takes one genius to jam his key in the main panel lock, while there is potentially multiple locks still on the group lockout box.
This sounds plausible. I had to do some work at at a railway maintenance facility that required a broad shutdown of equipment (particularly the 1500vDC). The LOTO procedure before we could start was over 4 hours and involved hundreds of boards and circuits. With cheap locks (e.g. 4 pin) it would almost certainly be possible for a key to release more than one lock and allow an accident. This was a joint Private/Government environment where OHS considerations were extremely strict (even working 1 meter up required an enclosed platform, no ladders were allowed) so I could definitely see them having a "lock safety guide"
Responsibility is good; idiot-proofing is better.
Exactly: You can open the wrong lock by mistake in normal operations so the core has to be great; you're very unlikely to physically defeat the lock by mistake, so the lock construction is not important
.
As a complete noob starting picking today, I used one of these as my first lock, as well as a random Brinks lock I found. I would just like to mention for the Master Model 410 LOTO lock, once picked, do NOT over rotate the core past 90 degrees, for if you do you will drop all of the key pins into the lock body. Spoken from experience, that satisfying clunk of a lock picked followed by the jingle of all 6 key pins falling out filled me with a lot of emotions. Lesson learned. Thankful this video was here for reference.
As for the core, can confirm, 5 spools and 1 double serrated on 5.
Also, picking using LPL Genesis Set.
Friendly reminder if you see one of these out in the wild: Do Not Touch!
My dad's an electrician and was working in a factory being gutted and renovated, and of course had turned off power and locked out the breaker panel using a similar lock. Turns out that the offices attached to the factory weren't wired correctly when it was built, and one guy lost power to a single outlet in his office. He decided that was Unacceptable and so walked into the construction site, snagged some bolt cutters from somewhere, and Cut The Lock Off The Breaker!! My dad was, at the time, on the top of an 8foot ladder cutting through a 6inch conduit with a reciprocating saw. In short order he found himself flat on his back 3 feet from his ladder holding a now very dead saw, complete with smoldering saw blade. He needed stitches in the back of his head, and thank gods that's all he needed. If the power had been turned on ever 30 seconds earlier his hand would have still been directly on the bare conduit! He would not have survived that. Those locks are so absolutely important and should NEVER BE TOUCHED if in use.
You have officially scared me with that caribiner full of locks that you use to practice picking while watching a movie.
We all have our ways on keeping busy.
he's a box away from a houdini act
@@Adam-ln4og How do you keep busy?
@@VladZ972 I work 2 jobs, hit the gym, and write books.
@@Adam-ln4og So you’re saying you don’t keep a carabiner full of locks to practice on to keep busy?
Feels like it's almost a tamper-proof seal in a lot of ways, it's easy to bust open in an emergency if needed, but not easy to open without any trace ie picking
@@ts757arse agreed, although in this case "leave a mark" would mean a sheared shackle or broken lock body
Why the hell would anyone pick a LOTO lock? As far as I understand, it's only there to tell people not to turn on the equipment, in case they don't see the warning sign or something.
@@peterstepanov8062 To make it look like an accident?
This is an exceptionally thoughtful observation, and I deeply resent your having thought of it first.
@@23Scadu Hmm this locked machine turned on, bobby was up in the control tower, when it happened and was last on the scene after it was all over, the machine is locked in the off position. What an accident! Bobby's innocent!
That's amazing how a similar lock that's used in my work industry has a plastic body, when you can go grab several types of tools or battery powered devices and just cut the body away! I like knowing I'm protected fully when I'm the one inside doing work and relying on these type of locks!
I would say that they design most locks now for saw, angle grinder, pry attacks which Master has been pretty decent with. They just don't see the picking as a main attack possibly. At least they don't seem to be focused on that side of it. But it is a little concerning when they have these nice 6 pin cores available cheaply and they chose to put a 4-5 pin basic core in all the top "Magnum" series.
Panic mode; Wiring up a 3 phase relay when you hear this from the breaker box,
“Number 2 feels good, 3 is binding”
Or worse, three phase motor connected to a conveyor belt system. You got both electrical and sheer force there.
:D
Aw ship... LoL, cringe!
As an industrial electrician, I found your comment to be hilarious.
My heart dropped to see the thumbnail with your name on it, showing the lock i trust my life and limbs to everyday. After watching I left more than content. Thanks from one on the line LPL.
This is what I was thinking that the reason why it's so hard to open it because power switches can be deceivingly small
@@ralanham76 I bought one, and it broke within a week, after I picked it open, once, and very easily, (This was after trying, and failing, to open it on previous days.) I then operated it a couple of times with the key, after which it failed to stay locked. I'm fairly new to lock picking, so was understandably surprised at how easily it could be picked (not raked) open. Would not trust my life to such fragile locks, and shall not be buying another one in a hurry.
I’ll take ‘things that didn’t happen’ for 200, Alex.
@@RWBHere These things don't need to be pick proof. They're used on industrial equipment so someone doesn't walk by and hit the electrical disconnect while you're working on the machine. If someone is trying to pick the lock then they are literally, actively trying to murder you.
@@louisradico1511 Not only that, but they would have to pick the lock off of the equipment that you are working on. Chances are that someone would see that person trying to pick a lock off of the energized equipment and go WTF lol. Picking is pointless anyway, anytime someone loses the keys, we just cut it off with bolt cutters. Much faster and less hassle.
From the viewpoint of someone who’s a novice with locks but experienced with industrial equipment, here’s my take:
1. 6 pin core to increase the total number of key combinations. Repeating key combinations within a plant or even a company is usually a no-go.
2. High security pins because industrial equipment can vibrate A LOT. I have first hand seen a lock open on its own due to nothing more than vibration.
3. Plastic body because it is non-conductive (some other lockouts have rubberized coatings).
Master Lock: This is our highest security core.
Customer: Oh, then this goes into water treatment facility locks?
Master Lock: No, those get weaker cores, as they already have a strong body.
Customer: Uhm, okay... So what is this used for then?
Master Lock: Our LOTO Padlock.
Customer: What would that be?
Master Lock: It's a fancy Post-it, basically.
I think master lock exists just to troll this man.
I think it's the other way around.
@@dffgacha7452 I agree: This man exists to be trolled by MasterLock.
2 outta 10.
You might say they are Master baiters.
Masters are good locks in 99% of situations, their physical security is very good and TBH how many break-ins do you hear about where the lock was picked? Core wise then yes they couldn't really do much worse.
**LPL at the movie theater concessions**
“Hi what can I get for you?”
“I’ll take a large carabiner of locks please”
“..........”
"Hold the wafer cores
& 2 BOXES OF MILK DUDS
"Oh and I forgot my rake, do you have any rakes...? No?"
That's exactly what ran through my head, some dude at a movie theater picking locks. SSSHHHHHH!
@@jasonsprouse2803 Maybe that's what he practicing....not picking the lock, but picking it quietly :)
I use these locks daily for my equipment. These locks have plastic bodies so they can be more easily destroyed. LOTO procedure prevents anyone, besides the person who applied the lock, from using it. If a person of missing and the lock needs to be removed there is a lot of paperwork and a lot of attempts to get ahold of the employee in question (so that we’re sure that they aren’t locked inside the equipment.) afterwards a pair of box end wrenches can be used to blow out the non hardened shackle. Or alternatively, bolt cutters are used as well. But the main reason is to make sure that the lock is difficult to pick, but easy to destroy.
Glad that I saw this video. My grandaughter-in-law needed to chain and padlock the driveway gate while my grandson was working a shutdown and this was the type of lock that she found in their tool shed. I was skeptical cuz it looked so plastic and flimsy. Glad to know that it isn't flimsy.
It is flimsy. You can almost break it with your bare hands. It's not for security.
Yeah you should watch the video again...with the volume up...
Imagine how many locks he goes through during a single movie...
Imagine how many locks he could pick while watching Avengers Endgame
@@RoyalSlashOasis why
Depends on whether he likes the movie, I suppose. "I rate this 30 out of 30 locks"
(That's bad by the way)
The answer is all of them. Literally every single one in the world
"Hobbit" and "Lord of the Rings" marathon back to back. He'd probably break his locks and picks by that point.
I picked up one of these when I first started. because it was plastic I thought it would be a easy open. boy was I wrong.
1956willys4x4 well now you have a practice lock
same actually watching this video because I felt counter rotation and thought I must be wrong because its just a plastic lock I happened to have in the garage, also thought I must have miscounted the pins lol
A hammer will open this in seconds.
Bad Samaritan no, it was more like 23, but it was still quick
Same here. First one to give up on and first one to cut open to look. First and the last one I tried to put back together with only tweezers and my pick tools. No longer a set
Everyone is mentioning the fact you can break the loto lock quickly but also the way the beefier locks look is intended to be a deterrent by making the lock look harder to pick then it actually is and to promote security though obscurity, one's designed for use in safety and the other is designed to trick a consumer base into thinking the lock is secure
I have used many loto locks, it’s nice that these are less able to be key racked when your trying to figure out why your key isn’t working because it’s not your lock.
Something tells me he has another whole ring of locks in his bathroom for when he’s sitting on the toilet
Theres probably just locks everywhere. He doesnt do light reading, just light picking lol
@@3FIGNEWTONEATR So another question poped in my mind while watching this. With the weight of ALL the locks he's got, how high are rated the floor of the buildings he live/work in? 500 kg/m2 ? 😁
And probably with options...like a master combo that can be shimmed or a chinese 6 key magnetic double dimple with triple trapping and an explosive...depending on whether its quick Twosie or a 15 minute strain session...
He probably has to pick a lock to open the WC.
Hey you down in front - "STOP MAKING SO MUCH NOISE WITH THAT DAMN PILE OF LOCKS!!"
*LPL just beans him in the head with the now unlocked lock*
"no problem. That was the last one"
LPL: No problem I'll do your lock later
@@miokujou ooofff
As a former crew chief at a factory, our dept. had like 150ish of these. every once in a while you would have someone drop a key down a flume, or grate etc. and need to get one of these off of something. (After filling out a bunch of paperwork and whatnot, to get the OK to do so) we found out really quick the best way to get these open was a big old set of channel locks, and squeeze the shit out of them from both sides, along the seam. they fly apart and it takes literally about 1 second.
Normal people: Concentrate on the movie or sitting on their phone.
LPL: Opens Master Locks for practice
2:28 This part always sounds like a really bad day at the dentist.
got me laughing out loud really hard!
XD
"Oh sorry, I was just practicing picking this lock while examining your teeth"
Or a good promotional day at a brothel
Nobody:
LPL: Here is my keychain of the 7000 master locks I pick on the daily
~2019
lockchain*
Hilarious and original.
500 reps in the morning and evening
Your videos are quite fascinating. The answers to your questions are simple. Master sells these things by the hundreds of thousands, and the sets of 6 locks for each worker is supposed to be unique so that no other worker on the site can open the lock. The fragile construction is so that if the worker has flown home and cannot return to remove the lock he forgot to remove at the end of shift, then a supervisor can use a bolt cutter to remove the lock. There are usually disciplinary action taken against a worker that had his lock forcefully removed by management. This is the case in Australia where people are quite anal about safety precautions.
I love that you will keep your hands busy during a movie with your hobby/craft. I do the same!
I've smashed a ton of these locks as a PLC programmer. Millwrights or electricians do some work, forget the lock and then go home leaving a machine in a locked state for the next shift. We call the name on the back, get verbal confirmation the machine is safe to run and smash it off with a hammer. Saves lots of time removing locks but I suppose everyone involved needs to respect the kind of honor system there.
Easiest way to remember the remove the lock is to lock your car keys to the lock when you lockout a machine.
As a union electrician myself, I appreciate you stating that you call the number BEFORE smashing the lock. It’s EXTREMELY important no one ever removes one of these without direct contact and approval from the name or company written on the lock
Should always get a written agreement over a verbal one
I forget my lock all the time... millwright here.
Good way to get yours keys stolen
Netflix and chill means a whole different thing for the LockPickingLawyer
*GetPicks and Chill
@@B.McMillan93 this man deserves a prize
Netflix and P I C K L O C K S
Netflix and pick
I mean, have you seen his wife's beaver?
Im an electrician and we use the plastic loto’s alot. Its good to know they’re difficult to pick. Usually the device it’s attached to is all plastic (breaker lockout) and can be broken off easily. What keeps most trades from screwing with them is you can get some hefty jail time for tampering with one.
I worked at several power plants as an operating technician and one of our duties was to secure equipment that needed maintenance, that could involve chaining and locking valves, removing fuses and open breakers etc and they all needed to be locked down and a sign with the correct work order number. The locks was all the same and all of the us technicians had the same key, so when the job was done anyone of the technicians could remove the locks when the job was done. The jobs could take hours, days or weeks so it would probably someone else then then one that had secured the equipment earlier that would be on duty. For all sake I could had found, say a faulty pump, switched over to a spare and then written a rapport on it and then secured it for the maintenance crew that would take care of it at day time.
No one removed the locks without an ok from the maintenance crew as it could spell disaster and even life threatening danger.
It is a desirable feature for these locks to be relatively easy to break. Many times locks needed to be broken when an employee left the facility without removing their lock. A supervisor was allowed to break the lock after locating the employee and verifying that they were no longer at the site. Usually these locks were used with hasps that were even easier to break than the locks. As far as I know, these locks are not useful beyond compliance with OSHA regs.
I was going to say that.
Also the employee could drop the key somewhere irretrievable. Also the locks should be inexpensive and unlikely to have common keys and resist accidental raking despite a maint-dept having large numbers of them.
mjenk20236
I've had to use one of these and I believe that is the case. I dropped it about five feet once and the shell came clean apart; it's not fusion-welded or anything, literally two halves of a clamshell with a couple pins for aligning them with each other and some light adhesive to keep them together. I taped it back together.
As for the extra security, it's to help ensure your key is actually being used on YOUR lock. But on the backside a label is provided where you're supposed to write your name; it also comes in several colors, mine was yellow, here we have a red, and I've seen blue before. An ounce of caution will go much further than any lock core in making sure you remove the correct lock -- does it have your name, is it the color you were assigned, are you sure you're at the panel you are responsible for?
It would also be feasible to provide multiple locks to each person if they will be working on more than one zone. Use different colors or something, or stamp serials on the shackle and each matching key.
Finally, a fatal mistake I have seen is for multiple personnel working in one zone to daisy-chain their locks off each other. There are group lockouts with multiple holes for each lock to be installed and ensures every lock must be removed before it can be energized, use them!! A six-hole group pad can be made to fit many more, just daisy-chain the group pads off each other until the necessary amount of holes is had. If even one lock exists anywhere on the chain, ultimately the one on the equipment will not open.
wow, where I work if you leave your lock on a tool/machine you will be called back in to unlock it. You could lose your cert and or get written up if they have to pull out the bolt cutters and have a huge ordeal.
All you need is a claw hammer to break off a plastic masterlock.
Nailed it.
Bigger yellow ones are usually on the hasps. They aren't meant to not be broken into, just so you need to fill out a form and check the machine is clear.
They're for saving fingers not property
LPL: "...or in some sort of zone of danger."
Sterling Archer: *inhales*
Hey Takel.....Hey Takel.....Takel....Takel..........TAKEL!!!!!!
would you call it a... DANGERZOOOONEEEEE?
The reason it has a seemingly secure pin setup is so that there can be MANY different keyed locks on a GIANT job site, so there are less chances of keyed alike locks, because if someone unlocked the wrong padlock, someone could die. If someone does lose their key, the bolt is easy enough to cut if everyone onsite agrees the lock should be cut. I believe, that the design and choice of features are specifically designed to suit the needs of certain buyers. I’ve seen all of them at different job sites, there is no security threat inside the job site, which is why a plastic body is ok. Great video!
1:36 Perfectly shows the difference between LPL and a normal pro locksmith. Professionals learn lockpicking for work, and usually only what they need to know for most jobs. People like LPL (experts and enthusiasts) do this for fun, at literally any time or place, and they end up with way more practice and odd knowledge as a result.
Similar logic also applies to most industries.
Masterlock R&D: “We just designed the most secure lock EVER!”
The Board: “So it’s flawless?”
Masterlock R&D: “YES!”
The Board: “Garbage, throw it out.”
@mmmmmcatboys i sware i just saw you or someone with your pfp somewhere
"Hey, take a break from the locks for a minute and come watch a movie with me"
"Sounds good, I'll meet you there!"
*takes a chain of ten locks to the couch*
These lock out tag out locks are usually only used for personal safety, like where I work if the bailer compactor is malfunctioning, we put it on there so nobody can operate it and potentially get hurt. Not really a scenario where somebody is going to try to pick the lock or break it. What’s to gain from it? Hurting or potentially killing somebody else? I just don’t see the reason anybody would want to try to get this lock off in that situation for some kind of gain. The only reason I can think of is that if the key is somehow lost we would be able to break off the lock with relative ease instead of spending the money to hire a locksmith or something like that.
I use these, and there is a good reason. The locks are tricky to pick for most people so removal is always destructive if the key isn't available. This is a safety feature. It's about the LO/TO policy of the company using the lock. The plastic lock combines a cheap to buy and replace (when it's inevitably cut) lock with maximum key combinations to minimize the chance of a duplicate in an organization.
In e movie theater:
People kissing each other for the first time
LPL: Click out of two 😂😂
Lockpickinglawyer at cinema popcorn stand:
Hello could i get a padlock to pick during the movie?
He comes back 5 minutes later
“Hello yes this unshielded keyway allowed me to simply insert a sheet of metal and turn the keyway, buy something that isn’t mater lock quality.”
It is the key design. It is different than most other keys on a key ring. Makes it easier for LOTO use. The soft metal makes it easier for bolt cutters when a key is lost.
The loto lock is designed to save lives from equipment start up, hence why we only get 1 key for it. Id assume the plastic housing is for weight purposes as we use upto 6 personal locks.