The RE-5 was heavy for several reasons, not least being that it was actually 1000cc by any normal measure, it had very heavy counterweights to offset the single rotor, and it was built using many of the same parts as Suzuki's 750cc 'water buffalo' 2-stroke, 3-cylinder water cooled machine of the same era. As for the odd turn of phrase, I wonder if translation artifact is involved, like 'The RE5 was massive, resulting in the high weight'? [Weight (a force) being the product of mass times acceleration (usually of gravity)... F=ma]
I used to own an RE 5. You still have to push it down manually. First cycle I owned that a mtn bike didn't look like a Peterbilt in the rearview mirrors.
My dad had that cluster in a parts lot he bought. (We do a bunch of swap meets when things are normal)...I thought it was super unique so I asked what it was for. That day I learned rotary engine's in bikes is a real thing
there are companys dedicated to that, but mostly for aviation or low power duty. and companies like pac in Australia wich build "race" rotary using Mazda housings. its getting harder and harder to make a Rotary legal cause of emission rules, rotary's by design use/burn oil every cycle like a 2 stroke does, they are smelly and smoky and are not fuel efficient and they kill trees or whatever, therefore your local green party will not allow them. (therefore noone is willing to do a real mass production)
Alex Hickey you can get a new rotary... but they are designed for gocarts. i bet your talking rotary as in for cars or pick-up trucks. the problem is no company could make money. the motor ready to go would cost $10,000 to 20,000 for a fresh new rotary cause there just is no real demand. i do think the rotary is a good fit for bikes. i could see a company make a lets say 0.25L or 0.40L 2 rotor turbo street bike or a rotary motor scooter like a vespa.
Making Rotary powered Bikes to order is like producing a Hyper-Car. Motorcycle with a Wankel engine would be Pagani Zonda in the motorcycles world, where Ducati is like a Ferrari.
BlueRonin true a good rotary bike in todays world would be like a Koenigsegg one:1. But it happens to be one of the only places a rotary would makes sense being that bikes dont rely on low tq or rpm.
I like bikes, but in a way other than cars. These rotor motorcycles are really super special. Big thumb up for all of those manufacturers who would like to revive the rotor engine. That's not happening today any more, but the creations you've made keep on living in Visio Racer videos! 😃👏
Almost 50 years ago I had a shop teacher in a small engine class who tore apart a rotary engine for the class and explained how superior it was to the piston engine we all used. It made a lot of sense to me. I'm no mechanic, though I dabble, and love motorccyles. I've always wondered myself why motorcycles didn't use these. But now I see it was tried.
The Norton F1 is a favourite. This model won the Isle of Man TT motorcycle race in 1992. The engine was then developed for aircraft use by Mid West Engines, then sadly handed over to a German company. I have the manuals, but no engine (yet). [Aussie in BC]
In high school we had a Sachs rotary engine on a small dyno; it was at the time also used as a snowmobile engine in some Arctic Cat models during the 70s.
Imagine how much oil you would need if harley made a rotary bike... (get it?...because harleys are notorious for leaking oil, and rotaries are notorious for consuming it.....I'll see myself out...) I'd still take a rotary bike over a harley any day, no matter the oil consumption
your_local_emo engines burn oil by nature rotary is more in the 2stroke family anyway they would be cheap to repair and fix if they were more common but being that they never caught on the parts and labor are higher
Your most interesting film yet, when it started I kept saying to myself "Norton! Norton! Norton!" Your English is getting better, though Norton borrowed the transmission from Yamaha not "by" . My mum when I was a child had a Citroen GS, I never knew the motor made it into a bike, thank you.
I'm surprised rotary bikes aren't more common. If it's like the Rx7's rotary, it'll be easy to work on and last longer because rotaries don't like to be babied and bike's usually see a lot of abuse. Only I issue I can see is the oil consumption problem that plagued the Wankel.
Another reason they may be uncommon is because of cooling. Because there's a combustion every rotation, it could get hot, and the rider of the bike is right above the engine. That could be very uncomfortable.
The only one of these bikes I have actually seen and heard is the Suzuki RE-5. This "original" has the "space-age" circular concept within the styling. (Note the curved cover over the gauges) This didn't go over too well in the USA and the next year, it had more conventional styling. I am in Washington State in the USA and, in the early 80s, there was a guy who ran an RE-5 in motorcycle road racing. The biggest problem was putting it in the correct classification because the displacement of a rotary is different from a reciprocating engine. A "500cc rotary" acts bigger than a "500cc reciprocating" i.e. much more power per cc of displacement. It was first put in the 600cc Production class (up to 600cc factory stock bikes) and ran away and hid from everyone. It was then put into the 550cc Modified Production class (Production bikes with a set of modifications allowed so they had more power) and it still ran away and hid from everyone. So, it was put in Open Production (1000cc+ factory stock bikes) and it was about even with bikes like the Kawasaki KZ1000 and Suzuki GS1000. The RE5 had an open megaphone exhaust which was put on the bike for Modified Production and it was allowed to stay on in Open Production. Rotaries are absolutely the loudest motorcycles with open pipes. (Ask about Mazda rotary race cars! *There's* some noise!) Harley-Davidsons can make a heck of a noise with open pipes but the RE-5 was much, much louder than open pipe H-Ds. The track (Pacific Raceways outside Seattle) has a 1/2 mile straight and, when the bikes went by, it would be a bunch of stock sounding bikes, this loud BRAPPPPP of the RE-5 at 8-9000 RPM and then more stock bikes! I think it was a combination of the rider not having a lot of ability or money and the bike being a little too offbeat to do any real tuning because, the next season, it did not come back. Quite a memory though! I think the motorcycle world is a little too conservative to adopt something as radical as the Wankel. There really was no specific advantage to the rotary except it could make a lot of power for displacement but many motorcyclists couldn't get their heads around the idea that there were no pistons going up and down.
+Westside Flyer Thank you for sharing that. It brings back warmest memories of my red RE-5! At the time I rode it, I had a friend with a 1200-cc Harley and I used to have fun at 50 mph telling him to pick any gear while I used top gear (5th). When we rolled on the throttles, I always left him well behind! If considered in terms of the air/fuel mixture moved per revolution of the crankshaft, the RE-5 would compare most closely to a 1000-cc 4-stroke twin. That is *part* of why it had such massive torque. The use of ports instead of poppet valves also plays a role, making Wankels 'breathe' better. My fully-stock RE-5 would go 50 mph in 1st gear, which it achieved in about 50 feet. From a dead stop against large "superbikes" of 1100-cc, I would be half a block down the street before the "superbike" stopped slipping his clutch. It was like riding a catapult. Man, was that fun!
I had a rotary snowmobile, a 1975 Arctic Cat 295 Panther. The biggest differences I noticed were the idle is weird, "rup, rup, rup," it's very smooth when you're running around, and it has fantastic low end torque. Also, the exhaust gets so hot it glows red, normal for a rotary. All in all, it's one of my favorite vintage sleds. If you ever get a small rotary, always use Shell Rotella T as your mixing oil, otherwise the apex seals will carbon up and it will quit. It's possible there are other oils that work as well in a rotary, but that's the standard one to use.
Rotaries are heavy chew fuel wear rotor tips blow coolant seals and generally are slow by comparison 2 strokes on the other hand are none of those things and are the sweetest of all engines .
I loved watching the Norton race, as well as being fast it sounded amazing. The growl of a 4 strike but the frantic revving if a 2 stroke. I remember Trevor Nation (works rider) doing a burnout, waving to the crowd through the smoke, unaware of the fire that was starting thanks to an oil leak. Bonkers but brilliant bikes.
I bought a 1989 Norton Commander (588cc rotary) from the factory and had it flown out to NZ, an absolute bike before its time, smooth, fast handled well and reasonably economical. I went from CHCH to Gore in 4 hrs back in the day overtaking a mufti south of Balclutha at over 200kph, rode it around Pukekohe on the weekend celebrating 100 years of Norton about 1992 and down the back straight the speedo was a touch over 150 mph, (note mph not kph), Best one was when I lent it to a mate to ride from Twizel to Tekapo and he didn't realise the speedo was in MPH, he came back to see why I was taking so long on his Triumph after getting to Tekapo very quickly
in the early 80's , i was a motorcycle mechanic apprentice and at college we rebuilt a suzuki re5 to get our rotary engine qualification, was only 1 of 5 re5's in australia at the time, probably the only one now , its at bald hills tafe college brisbane. also a rare beast was the 750/4 honda with a 2 speed auto gearbox, rare as rocking horse shit!
VisioRacer: You just blew my mind. I did not know that Norton made a rotary. I was once offered to buy a Hercules W-2000. The price was ridiculous. Other than that, the bike was known as " The widowmaker'. Torque over was a major problem with this bike. Turning a right hand corner and than accelerating caused the byke to torque over to the right. Making it hard to pull out of the corner. Causing the rider to make an excessive right hand turn. A crash results. I'm glad I didn't have the money to buy it, or I would be dead.
A Rotary would be great in a modern sport bike. Great power to weight ratio, emissions controls are less stringent on a bike, and sub-par fuel consumption isn't such a big deal on a toy.
Awesome video as usual man! Been watching your content for a while now, and it honestly just keeps on getting better. And screw the haters who give you shit for the accent - it's not like you can help it, it's human nature. Peace out.
I remember the late Robert Dunlop winning races on the Norton rotary in the NW200 in years 1990 and 1991. I think the bike won other races as well. Loved the sound of it as I had a good close view of Robert on the Norton at the NW 200 races.
I had a 1975 RE5- heavy on juice when pushed,handled well even though very heavy- but so smooth when cruising around 90 mph riding two up- the mirrors never vibrated you could see behind you at any speed- still miss it.
I have only two questions. 1) Where do find the ideas for your videos and 2) how much time do you spend researching this stuff daily to release a video? Would also like to say, keep up the great work. I love your content.
The ideas often come from you or the internet, sometimes it just comes to my mind out of nowhere. If I hurry myself, I can do a video in two days, normally it is three.
i claim being old when i remember the suzuki being at the dealers and actually getting to ride one. it was a very strange bike in both sound and power delivery. brakes were a chuckle and because of very little engine braking like a two stroke they were toast after about 10 minutes of hard riding.....at least as hard as the suspension would allow.. not too bad for a bike of it's time though.
Back when I was in college I read in a bike magazine about Norton F1. The company was trying to revive famous Norton name with this. First time actually hearing this engine and seeing it drive.🙂
The RE5 was only heavy for a 500cc, certainly no where near what a Gold Wing is. But this weight was low which meant for an excellent center of gravity and superb handing, quite unlike the 2-strokes of the day. Although top speed was only around 110 mph they were surprisingly peppy and unimaginably SMOOTH, with no distortion in the mirrors at all from idle to redline. It's biggest crime was being so very mechanically different from traditional motorcycles.
There's someone in a local club (of which I'm a member) who has a W-2000. If only an enthusiast can know one or two rotary powered motorcycles, what does knowing an owner of a W-2000 make me? Just a note, the club actually focuses on old cars, but motorcycles are also welcome.
I wonder if these motor cycle rotary engine has the bad constant failing apex seal problem like in Mazda rotary engines? Might as well go for 2 cylinder engines if you want the brappy sound.
Love the 588 Norton racer . Saw them several times in JPS livery and later with Brian Crighton Norton racing at cadwell Park. No better sound ever than those things roaring round echoing in the Lincolnshire wolds , the popping and burbles as they decelerated was awesome too .. not much engine brake like a regular piston engine I beleive so hard on the brakes !!!!
Lack of engine braking was just one of many problems with the engine design... hard to believe that Norton and Crighton carried on so long with this doomed failure. It ruined Norton twice, Crighton Racing was a failure too.
Another interesting video, thanks. I wonder why more of these engines are not used in bikes. Are they too difficult to service, or too costly to make, I wonder?
The German "W" is pronounced like the English "V". I once owned a 1975 Mazda with a Wankel engine. It was very fast for its day and the engine was almost as smooth and quiet as an electric motor. Unfortunately, the Wankel engine is significantly less efficient than an Otto-cycle engine which is why very few cars are made with the Wankel engine.
I understand Suzuki designed new rotor tips that kept the Wankel alive. That is why the DKW needed 2-stroke oil. It used the original tips that did not last. Suzuki also fixed the other big problem of the exhaust gas extreme temp. with designed exhaust pipes. I was looking maybe to buy one in '74 but bought the GT 750 instead.
You'll have to excuse me because I know nothing about rotaries and less about bikes but it seems like rotaries and super bikes would be a match made in heaven
F1is my favourite but I would love a classic to ride everyday .when the rotary Norton was racing back in the 80s the nortons use to make the piston powered bikes look like they was going backwards.brian crieghton is the man who put the rotary nortons ahead of the game Brian deserves the credit .i met him at Ashbourne where there was a Norton day and he is one of the nicest people they you wish to meet as he was down to earth as he spoke to me and what an interesting man he is .
You're the best man! I've been watching you for years and this is one of my favorite shows of all time throughout all sources of media. Keep doing a great job man.
Is the F1RCW the one built by Crighton? Frame looks like it, and the guy starting it looks like Crighton. He built the 700 W (200hp), most recently he built the CR 700. Each built by hand, so sadly not production. A few videos on him floating around. I would love to have one, the sound is vicious.
I saw one Norton Rotary bike while I was in the U.K. but did not get a chance to get up close or ride it. It was a clean design and sounded pretty good. what caught me was I and several friends were riding our Norton's at the time and this bike joined up with us. Turned out to be a employee that was out testing it at the time. They claim that the rotary has to many problems for a production to make it profitable but I think it is because the regular piston engine manuf were afraid of it. Who knows?
Sachs, under their own name in the early 70s produced an enduro bike with a Wankle and leading link front suspension. A friend owned one and I believe it was 250cc, but I've never found any info about the bike on the net.
true! Seen it ones in the streets. Beautiful from the right site (always shown in pics) not so much from the left site; very nice green colour and with timeless styling. btw: its pronounced in Dutch as "Vain" with the "ee" as "ai" in the English"pain"
I would like to have ridden them all, but only had one. As the former owner of the same 1st-year (red and round) RE-5 as shown, I have some preference for the Suzuki. Despite being a single-rotor engine, it was incredibly smooth and reasonably powerful. It was not at all tiring to ride it 500 miles (800 km) in a single day, once I put a full fairing on it. It and I were very comfortable cruising at 80 mph (130 kph), which it could reach in 2nd gear. It had an amazing amout of torque, even at 2000 rpm. Downsides? It was heavy, not overly powerful, and sucked up fuel like a car despite being only 500cc. In cold weather, I had to run it on choke for about 3 miles, during which time it got a whopping 12 miles per gallon! (about 5 kilometers per liter = 20 L/100km). It could be hard to start, requiring a high cranking rpm. It was somewhat prone to fouling the sparkplug. Overall, I think Wankel engines should be small to reduce the mileage penalty of so much swept area, and turbocharged to still make good power.
So fun fact. Rotary engines officially measure engine size by the biggest chamber only. That means that if you made a 50cc licence restricted rotary engine it would have the power of a 180cc 1 cyl
They stopped production of the Comotor without notifying Van Veen in advance, so he was stuck in the middle of production without time to even try to switch over, A couple of years back they realised they had more than enough spare parts to build around 10 new bikes. They sold for about €85000 ex taxes
I don't know id anyone has post for it: but they are 9 bikes with rotary engine!! The 9 was an italian manufacturer: SWM who made trial bike (gille burgat won in it the world trial championship in 1981)
in the 90’s at the north west 200, a norton f1 famously hit 20,000rpm after a mishift, and the rider revved it out to 28,000rpm before changing up, and it finished the 7 lap, 63 mile race with no issues, and ran again later that day
@@joelm442 Not with the 1:3 gear ratio between the triangular piston (rotor) and the eccentric-crankshaft When a Mazda 13b hits the redline at 9,000 rpm indicated on the tachometer, the rotor is only spinning at 3,000 rpm... slower than many Diesel engines.
As a rotary fan, I must say this was a real pleasure to make. Which one do you like the most? For me, the F1 was joy to listen and looks the best!
VisioRacer they all sound nice in my opinion
VisioRacer Do a video about the best sounding tractors engines.
by far the best
No, you can't. A PP 26B FTW for me :)
VisioRacer and a 20b bridge port turbo for me
Glad you didn't spoil those sounds with some lame music. Thanks heaps great collection of bikes.
Try You Tube for WIZNORTON RACING CLASSIC TT F1 ON BOARD KIRK
MICHAEL TO SULBY
"The RE5 was heavy, resulting in the high weight..."
Interesting 🤔
Now you know for sure it was a massive bike.
... and even more important: I won't forget ;)
go ez on him Heinz he may have a funny accent but he comes up with the coolest videos (for his age lol(
it,s lucky you have a twit to boost your knowledge then
The RE-5 was heavy for several reasons, not least being that it was actually 1000cc by any normal measure, it had very heavy counterweights to offset the single rotor, and it was built using many of the same parts as Suzuki's 750cc 'water buffalo' 2-stroke, 3-cylinder water cooled machine of the same era. As for the odd turn of phrase, I wonder if translation artifact is involved, like 'The RE5 was massive, resulting in the high weight'? [Weight (a force) being the product of mass times acceleration (usually of gravity)... F=ma]
never heard of rotary motorcycles but I can already tell it's gonna sound amazing as fuck
Try You Tube for WIZNORTON RACING CLASSIC TT F1 ONBOARD KIRK
MICHAEL TO SULBY
Haha same man I could hear it in my head before I even clicked
noob
Look up the Hercules w2000 ..even though I'm 4 years to late 😂
Check out Norton foray with em
7:03 as people are fighting over 2 and 4 stroke dirt bikes. ill be like. bitch i got a rotary dirt bike lol
Well, this is awkward.
Well in general consensus. When people discuss two and four stroke engines, they usealy are referring to the reciprocating piston engine design.
rotary engines are 4 stroke technically.
Well you'll have a 3 stroke!
1 stroke dirt bike-
Have you ever seen a fkin instrument cover pop open?? How cool is that??
I used to own an RE 5. You still have to push it down manually.
First cycle I owned that a mtn bike didn't look like a Peterbilt in the rearview mirrors.
I came here just to comment that haha so amazing.
The killers human
My dad had that cluster in a parts lot he bought. (We do a bunch of swap meets when things are normal)...I thought it was super unique so I asked what it was for. That day I learned rotary engine's in bikes is a real thing
That rotary engine sound is so amazing
It truly is a music to my ears, I love rotary.
the first one sounds like a 2 stroxes...does it uses 2t oil?
Esspecially the Idle Sound is like a muscle car
A rotorbike..
Correct sir
I see what you did there!👍🏻👩🏼👍🏻
Doritos on wheels!
OH MY GOD-
What an absolute genius
I've ridden the Norton Interpol 2 here in the USA. It was a B E A S T..
jdmeaux haha fuck USA
Someone needs to set up a company dedicated purely to making rotary engines
there are companys dedicated to that, but mostly for aviation or low power duty. and companies like pac in Australia wich build "race" rotary using Mazda housings.
its getting harder and harder to make a Rotary legal cause of emission rules, rotary's by design use/burn oil every cycle like a 2 stroke does, they are smelly and smoky and are not fuel efficient and they kill trees or whatever, therefore your local green party will not allow them. (therefore noone is willing to do a real mass production)
Frietpan I meant companies who make rotary engines that could be sold to the public for use
Alex Hickey you can get a new rotary... but they are designed for gocarts. i bet your talking rotary as in for cars or pick-up trucks. the problem is no company could make money. the motor ready to go would cost $10,000 to 20,000 for a fresh new rotary cause there just is no real demand. i do think the rotary is a good fit for bikes. i could see a company make a lets say 0.25L or 0.40L 2 rotor turbo street bike or a rotary motor scooter like a vespa.
Making Rotary powered Bikes to order is like producing a Hyper-Car. Motorcycle with a Wankel engine would be Pagani Zonda in the motorcycles world, where Ducati is like a Ferrari.
BlueRonin true a good rotary bike in todays world would be like a Koenigsegg one:1. But it happens to be one of the only places a rotary would makes sense being that bikes dont rely on low tq or rpm.
I like bikes, but in a way other than cars. These rotor motorcycles are really super special. Big thumb up for all of those manufacturers who would like to revive the rotor engine. That's not happening today any more, but the creations you've made keep on living in Visio Racer videos! 😃👏
BRAP BIKES
Deivi Y BRAAAAAAAAAAAP STUTUTUTU
Deivi Y BRAP CYCLES
BRRAAAAPPPPAAAAAAAA SUTUTUututu. :D
Armadilyo MOTORBRAPS
Aka 2 strokes
That Suzuki's dash is SO COOL.
Very!
I agree it looks just like the one in my crx
It only had 6 miles
Almost 50 years ago I had a shop teacher in a small engine class who tore apart a rotary engine for the class and explained how superior it was to the piston engine we all used. It made a lot of sense to me. I'm no mechanic, though I dabble, and love motorccyles. I've always wondered myself why motorcycles didn't use these. But now I see it was tried.
These are Wankel engines, not rotary engines
The Norton F1 is a favourite. This model won the Isle of Man TT motorcycle race in 1992. The engine was then developed for aircraft use by Mid West Engines, then sadly handed over to a German company. I have the manuals, but no engine (yet). [Aussie in BC]
In high school we had a Sachs rotary engine on a small dyno; it was at the time also used as a snowmobile engine in some Arctic Cat models during the 70s.
Imagine how much oil you would need if harley made a rotary bike...
(get it?...because harleys are notorious for leaking oil, and rotaries are notorious for consuming it.....I'll see myself out...)
I'd still take a rotary bike over a harley any day, no matter the oil consumption
your_local_emo engines burn oil by nature rotary is more in the 2stroke family anyway they would be cheap to repair and fix if they were more common but being that they never caught on the parts and labor are higher
Yeah, or Triumph!
Saying rotaries are notorious for burning oil is like saying airplanes are notorious for needing jet fuel.
lol
100th like
Your most interesting film yet, when it started I kept saying to myself "Norton! Norton! Norton!" Your English is getting better, though Norton borrowed the transmission from Yamaha not "by" .
My mum when I was a child had a Citroen GS, I never knew the motor made it into a bike, thank you.
Rotaries+Bikes=match made in heaven!
well it didint succeed =/
Ragimund VonWallat The reason the rotary motor doesn’t succeed is because it has very little tolerance. Slightly out in the thing runs like shit
I'm surprised rotary bikes aren't more common. If it's like the Rx7's rotary, it'll be easy to work on and last longer because rotaries don't like to be babied and bike's usually see a lot of abuse. Only I issue I can see is the oil consumption problem that plagued the Wankel.
Another reason they may be uncommon is because of cooling. Because there's a combustion every rotation, it could get hot, and the rider of the bike is right above the engine. That could be very uncomfortable.
dekoldrick also it drinks fuel alot.
its extremely inefficient and difficult to improve as Ive heard.
The oil comsumption and not a fuel efficient engine
dekoldrick easy to work on HAHAHAHAHAHA good one
The only one of these bikes I have actually seen and heard is the Suzuki RE-5. This "original" has the "space-age" circular concept within the styling. (Note the curved cover over the gauges) This didn't go over too well in the USA and the next year, it had more conventional styling. I am in Washington State in the USA and, in the early 80s, there was a guy who ran an RE-5 in motorcycle road racing. The biggest problem was putting it in the correct classification because the displacement of a rotary is different from a reciprocating engine. A "500cc rotary" acts bigger than a "500cc reciprocating" i.e. much more power per cc of displacement. It was first put in the 600cc Production class (up to 600cc factory stock bikes) and ran away and hid from everyone. It was then put into the 550cc Modified Production class (Production bikes with a set of modifications allowed so they had more power) and it still ran away and hid from everyone. So, it was put in Open Production (1000cc+ factory stock bikes) and it was about even with bikes like the Kawasaki KZ1000 and Suzuki GS1000. The RE5 had an open megaphone exhaust which was put on the bike for Modified Production and it was allowed to stay on in Open Production. Rotaries are absolutely the loudest motorcycles with open pipes. (Ask about Mazda rotary race cars! *There's* some noise!) Harley-Davidsons can make a heck of a noise with open pipes but the RE-5 was much, much louder than open pipe H-Ds. The track (Pacific Raceways outside Seattle) has a 1/2 mile straight and, when the bikes went by, it would be a bunch of stock sounding bikes, this loud BRAPPPPP of the RE-5 at 8-9000 RPM and then more stock bikes! I think it was a combination of the rider not having a lot of ability or money and the bike being a little too offbeat to do any real tuning because, the next season, it did not come back. Quite a memory though!
I think the motorcycle world is a little too conservative to adopt something as radical as the Wankel. There really was no specific advantage to the rotary except it could make a lot of power for displacement but many motorcyclists couldn't get their heads around the idea that there were no pistons going up and down.
+Westside Flyer Thank you for sharing that. It brings back warmest memories of my red RE-5! At the time I rode it, I had a friend with a 1200-cc Harley and I used to have fun at 50 mph telling him to pick any gear while I used top gear (5th). When we rolled on the throttles, I always left him well behind! If considered in terms of the air/fuel mixture moved per revolution of the crankshaft, the RE-5 would compare most closely to a 1000-cc 4-stroke twin. That is *part* of why it had such massive torque. The use of ports instead of poppet valves also plays a role, making Wankels 'breathe' better. My fully-stock RE-5 would go 50 mph in 1st gear, which it achieved in about 50 feet. From a dead stop against large "superbikes" of 1100-cc, I would be half a block down the street before the "superbike" stopped slipping his clutch. It was like riding a catapult. Man, was that fun!
Back in the day, if your RE-5 had a problem and you took it to the dealer, they would swap out the engine and send the defective one back to Japan
Your videos are getting better and better!
"it was heavy, resulting in high weight"
Thanks Kanye, very cool
Every 60 seconds in africa a minute passes. Think about that
2:15
Never seen a Rotary before that hesitates to rev up quickly
Wankel engines
5:17 sounds like a galloping horse.. I love it.
These Motorcycles must've been the Gas Guzzlers of their Era.
But still Rotary Wankel is a legend engine in Automobile industry.
Great work Mate!
I had a rotary snowmobile, a 1975 Arctic Cat 295 Panther. The biggest differences I noticed were the idle is weird, "rup, rup, rup," it's very smooth when you're running around, and it has fantastic low end torque. Also, the exhaust gets so hot it glows red, normal for a rotary. All in all, it's one of my favorite vintage sleds. If you ever get a small rotary, always use Shell Rotella T as your mixing oil, otherwise the apex seals will carbon up and it will quit. It's possible there are other oils that work as well in a rotary, but that's the standard one to use.
It's the brap sound, not rup. The most common words when talking about the rotary. The more aggressive porting you have, more it braps.
Thanks
Wankels and 2 strokes get a bum rap as far as I am concerned. Small engines that make good power are fun.
I agree
I agree two
I agree 3
2 stroke for life
Rotaries are heavy chew fuel wear rotor tips blow coolant seals and generally are slow by comparison
2 strokes on the other hand are none of those things and are the sweetest of all engines .
Sweet. I was familiar with the Suzuki, Hercules/DKW street model, and a couple of the Nortons, but the others were new to me.
The problem with the Norton F1 was the original bikes were fitted with crap Yamaha XJ900 forks, fitted to a beautiful Spondon alloy beam frame.
The idling sounds like 3 cylinder. Actually reminds the DKW 3 cylinders 2 stroke of 1950-60.
I loved watching the Norton race, as well as being fast it sounded amazing. The growl of a 4 strike but the frantic revving if a 2 stroke. I remember Trevor Nation (works rider) doing a burnout, waving to the crowd through the smoke, unaware of the fire that was starting thanks to an oil leak. Bonkers but brilliant bikes.
borrowed by Yamaha or from Yamaha?
from his english is not great since he did explain it's not his first language
Yes, it is a mistake I've found a little too late. Sorry about it
Puffalupagus360 i think we all know what he meant
SuperMechguy no I was genuinely curious if Yamaha had licensed a transmission design from another motorcycle manufacturer.
Puffalupagus360 oh I understand now
Thanks for sharing !
A lot of modells and brands I did no know about.
And I´ve been riding bikes for like 35 years.
I bought a 1989 Norton Commander (588cc rotary) from the factory and had it flown out to NZ, an absolute bike before its time, smooth, fast handled well and reasonably economical. I went from CHCH to Gore in 4 hrs back in the day overtaking a mufti south of Balclutha at over 200kph, rode it around Pukekohe on the weekend celebrating 100 years of Norton about 1992 and down the back straight the speedo was a touch over 150 mph, (note mph not kph), Best one was when I lent it to a mate to ride from Twizel to Tekapo and he didn't realise the speedo was in MPH, he came back to see why I was taking so long on his Triumph after getting to Tekapo very quickly
Rotary motorcycles are an interesting concept to me. Thanks for this list!
in the early 80's , i was a motorcycle mechanic apprentice and at college we rebuilt a suzuki re5 to get our rotary engine qualification, was only 1 of 5 re5's in australia at the time, probably the only one now , its at bald hills tafe college brisbane. also a rare beast was the 750/4 honda with a 2 speed auto gearbox, rare as rocking horse shit!
VisioRacer: You just blew my mind. I did not know that Norton made a rotary. I was once offered to buy a Hercules W-2000. The price was ridiculous. Other than that, the bike was known as " The widowmaker'. Torque over was a major problem with this bike. Turning a right hand corner and than accelerating caused the byke to torque over to the right. Making it hard to pull out of the corner. Causing the rider to make an excessive right hand turn. A crash results. I'm glad I didn't have the money to buy it, or I would be dead.
A Rotary would be great in a modern sport bike. Great power to weight ratio, emissions controls are less stringent on a bike, and sub-par fuel consumption isn't such a big deal on a toy.
Nice. Only The Hercules GS was new to me. You just have to love the Van Veen OCR1000!
Awesome video as usual man! Been watching your content for a while now, and it honestly just keeps on getting better. And screw the haters who give you shit for the accent - it's not like you can help it, it's human nature. Peace out.
The last bike sounds like a 4 stroke at low RPM and an 2 stroke at high revs. Amazin stuff.
I remember the late Robert Dunlop winning races on the Norton rotary in the NW200 in years 1990 and 1991. I think the bike won other races as well. Loved the sound of it as I had a good close view of Robert on the Norton at the NW 200 races.
I had a 1975 RE5- heavy on juice when pushed,handled well even though very heavy- but so smooth when cruising around 90 mph riding two up- the mirrors never vibrated you could see behind you at any speed- still miss it.
The capacity of 588 cc was not accepted by the FIM. Transmission was borrowed FROM Yamaha, not by!
Luckily the FIM were not as dumb as the fanboys and knew the Norton sucked in a burns 1760cc of air and fuel with every revoution!!
These engine's are hell for the environment
Love that Norton at the start and visio even your English syntax is funny it always make me smile...
I have only two questions. 1) Where do find the ideas for your videos and 2) how much time do you spend researching this stuff daily to release a video?
Would also like to say, keep up the great work. I love your content.
The ideas often come from you or the internet, sometimes it just comes to my mind out of nowhere. If I hurry myself, I can do a video in two days, normally it is three.
OK, here is an idea...and apologize if you have done it before.....Most powerful v8s NOT released in America.
i claim being old when i remember the suzuki being at the dealers and actually getting to ride one. it was a very strange bike in both sound and power delivery. brakes were a chuckle and because of very little engine braking like a two stroke they were toast after about 10 minutes of hard riding.....at least as hard as the suspension would allow.. not too bad for a bike of it's time though.
I think, this channel's contents are like MR SLAV (but automotive). I like both of them.
Back when I was in college I read in a bike magazine about Norton F1.
The company was trying to revive famous Norton name with this.
First time actually hearing this engine and seeing it drive.🙂
The RE5 was only heavy for a 500cc, certainly no where near what a Gold Wing is. But this weight was low which meant for an excellent center of gravity and superb handing, quite unlike the 2-strokes of the day. Although top speed was only around 110 mph they were surprisingly peppy and unimaginably SMOOTH, with no distortion in the mirrors at all from idle to redline. It's biggest crime was being so very mechanically different from traditional motorcycles.
Norton rotary is finest sounding engine I ever heard .
watched them race in early nineties, astonishing bikes .
There's someone in a local club (of which I'm a member) who has a W-2000. If only an enthusiast can know one or two rotary powered motorcycles, what does knowing an owner of a W-2000 make me?
Just a note, the club actually focuses on old cars, but motorcycles are also welcome.
Norton Commander was the early 90's DOS file manager. Was it related to the bike?
LOL!
bet the bike was a hell of a lot faster!
Hello. I am 54 years old and never read about some bikes described here. Congrats, once more a awesome video!
Imagine putting a turbo on one of these :D
There's a very distinctive sound when 2stroke oil burns with petrol that I will never forget. RIP rotaries.
The van Veen sounds like a old 323 hatch with a Bridgeport 12a in it at idle haha.
Sounds like a crappy old Citroën Comotor... probably because it is.
3:56 ... quite possibly the coolest exhaust pipe ever.
I wonder if these motor cycle rotary engine has the bad constant failing apex seal problem like in Mazda rotary engines? Might as well go for 2 cylinder engines if you want the brappy sound.
Look on the Norton Commander and Yamaha XJ 600. they have got the same dashboard, wheels, brake calipers, and probably much more.
Love the 588 Norton racer . Saw them several times in JPS livery and later with Brian Crighton Norton racing at cadwell Park. No better sound ever than those things roaring round echoing in the Lincolnshire wolds , the popping and burbles as they decelerated was awesome too .. not much engine brake like a regular piston engine I beleive so hard on the brakes !!!!
Lack of engine braking was just one of many problems with the engine design... hard to believe that Norton and Crighton carried on so long with this doomed failure. It ruined Norton twice, Crighton Racing was a failure too.
Another interesting video, thanks.
I wonder why more of these engines are not used in bikes.
Are they too difficult to service, or too costly to make, I wonder?
Late answer but it's probably because rotaries tend to be really hard to cool properly and bikes have a tough time with cooling to begin with.
i love rotary engine, and this video is all i want
The German "W" is pronounced like the English "V".
I once owned a 1975 Mazda with a Wankel engine. It was very fast for its day and the engine was almost as smooth and quiet as an electric motor. Unfortunately, the Wankel engine is significantly less efficient than an Otto-cycle engine which is why very few cars are made with the Wankel engine.
I understand Suzuki designed new rotor tips that kept the Wankel alive. That is why the DKW needed 2-stroke oil. It used the original tips that did not last. Suzuki also fixed the other big problem of the exhaust gas extreme temp. with designed exhaust pipes. I was looking maybe to buy one in '74 but bought the GT 750 instead.
a rotor 125cc would be amazing
and mount it to a motard
M4tty official channel minibike
Cobster [DANK] Wilson no a bike you can drive at 16 years old and a motard is the lightest model
M4tty official channel what's a motard ;)
if im guessing....hes referring to the ducati
0.50 engine was borrowed FROM Yamaha....van veen sounded like a mouse!! thank you for a great video
All hail the Norton Commander. Notice the Vauxhall Nova, Opel Corsa A, tail lights turned upside down.
You'll have to excuse me because I know nothing about rotaries and less about bikes but it seems like rotaries and super bikes would be a match made in heaven
Just a heads up, you added the Norton Interpol 2 twice in this video.
F1is my favourite but I would love a classic to ride everyday .when the rotary Norton was racing back in the 80s the nortons use to make the piston powered bikes look like they was going backwards.brian crieghton is the man who put the rotary nortons ahead of the game Brian deserves the credit .i met him at Ashbourne where there was a Norton day and he is one of the nicest people they you wish to meet as he was down to earth as he spoke to me and what an interesting man he is .
I rode an RE5 back in the day it was very different and sounded rather strange
they are like a combination of both 4 stroke and 2 stroke engine. sounded like a 4 stroke inline-4 and produce smoke and power like a 2 stroke
You're the best man! I've been watching you for years and this is one of my favorite shows of all time throughout all sources of media. Keep doing a great job man.
Ufff that rev roar 0:55 🤌
Is the F1RCW the one built by Crighton? Frame looks like it, and the guy starting it looks like Crighton. He built the 700 W (200hp), most recently he built the CR 700. Each built by hand, so sadly not production.
A few videos on him floating around. I would love to have one, the sound is vicious.
Just a load of old Norton spares cobbled together, Crieghton and Gilo are a scam
Norton commander looks like the body parts are all connected even fairing? Cool!
Trivia fact for the day. Stuart Copeland the Drummer for the pop group "The Police" used to have a RE5.
Anyone know of a website for the Sachs kc31 engine disassembled I'd curious to see how they built their style of rotary engine.
Interesting to know that motorcycles also used rotary engines
I saw one Norton Rotary bike while I was in the U.K. but did not get a chance to get up
close or ride it. It was a clean design and sounded pretty good. what caught me was
I and several friends were riding our Norton's at the time and this bike joined up with
us. Turned out to be a employee that was out testing it at the time. They claim that
the rotary has to many problems for a production to make it profitable but I think it is
because the regular piston engine manuf were afraid of it. Who knows?
Sachs, under their own name in the early 70s produced an enduro bike with a Wankle and leading link front suspension. A friend owned one and I believe it was 250cc, but I've never found any info about the bike on the net.
Really? That's nice.
My favourite has always been the Van Veen OCR 1000. 2nd is All Nortons. Thank you for putting these together 😊
true! Seen it ones in the streets. Beautiful from the right site (always shown in pics) not so much from the left site; very nice green colour and with timeless styling.
btw: its pronounced in Dutch as "Vain" with the "ee" as "ai" in the English"pain"
You forgot one.
The old Horex also had Rotary engines.
Did it? What model was it?
And soviet IZh Vega, but it's a small-scale production for State security
ROTARY bikes are like the perfect bikes, high revving, less vibration than a normal engine, which is very important imo and of course BEST SOUND
I would like to have ridden them all, but only had one. As the former owner of the same 1st-year (red and round) RE-5 as shown, I have some preference for the Suzuki. Despite being a single-rotor engine, it was incredibly smooth and reasonably powerful. It was not at all tiring to ride it 500 miles (800 km) in a single day, once I put a full fairing on it. It and I were very comfortable cruising at 80 mph (130 kph), which it could reach in 2nd gear. It had an amazing amout of torque, even at 2000 rpm. Downsides? It was heavy, not overly powerful, and sucked up fuel like a car despite being only 500cc. In cold weather, I had to run it on choke for about 3 miles, during which time it got a whopping 12 miles per gallon! (about 5 kilometers per liter = 20 L/100km). It could be hard to start, requiring a high cranking rpm. It was somewhat prone to fouling the sparkplug. Overall, I think Wankel engines should be small to reduce the mileage penalty of so much swept area, and turbocharged to still make good power.
Why not to sell rotary based bikes to the fans. Just for the great sound.
That's not a good business
Because they are shit.That is why they are dead in all automotive markets.
Rotary motorcycles. So you can brap on two wheels!
1 wheel
you dont need a rotary to brap on two wheels
@@jamesgaskin7757 Rotary engines make a brap sound though.
@@skylerbond56 so do 2 strokes...
@@Thecowboy69997 Yep, and I also treat mine like a 2 stroke as it helps lubricate the Apex seals and keep them running slightly cooler
The sound of that first Norton though! Braaap Braaap!
keep up the great content
So fun fact.
Rotary engines officially measure engine size by the biggest chamber only. That means that if you made a 50cc licence restricted rotary engine it would have the power of a 180cc 1 cyl
They stopped production of the Comotor without notifying Van Veen in advance, so he was stuck in the middle of production without time to even try to switch over,
A couple of years back they realised they had more than enough spare parts to build around 10 new bikes.
They sold for about €85000 ex taxes
That Suzuki RE5 is a very unique bike
So bad ass hearing that sound come from a bike. I never even thought to use one. They’re so small
I don't know id anyone has post for it: but they are 9 bikes with rotary engine!!
The 9 was an italian manufacturer: SWM who made trial bike (gille burgat won in it the world trial championship in 1981)
2:10
that speedo kinnda flashes me more than the bike itself.
Here in Holland 1 company named van Veen.
Build 1974, 38 bikes.
engine block from Comotor.
in the 90’s at the north west 200, a norton f1 famously hit 20,000rpm after a mishift, and the rider revved it out to 28,000rpm before changing up, and it finished the 7 lap, 63 mile race with no issues, and ran again later that day
The engine is only turning at 1/3 of that rpm.
@@sandervanderkammen9230 It’s still 28,000rpm. For example, you wouldnt say a Mazda RX-8 redlining at 3,000rpm when it’s indicated redline is 9,000.
@@joelm442 Not with the 1:3 gear ratio between the triangular piston (rotor) and the eccentric-crankshaft When a Mazda 13b hits the redline at 9,000 rpm indicated on the tachometer, the rotor is only spinning at 3,000 rpm... slower than many Diesel engines.