I cannot thank Ivan enough to fix this car and gave it a new life. The days of not knowing when/whether it would start were gone. It was embarrassing to keep cranking while at a gas station or anywhere else for 5+ minutes without success. I wish I had sent the car to PHD 3 years ago. I think very few mechanics have the patience, skill and talent to handle tough-to-fix cars. Ivan is definitely one of those.
@@JD-iu3vithat actually showed one of the most precious and rare attributes of being a mechanic - honesty - by telling you how things were actually fixed
@@calholli Nope, but the repairs are done by the time he uploads the first video. If he says "yesterday this car was towed in" it means yesterday when he shoots the video, not when he uploads! :)
Great diag and partial fix Ivan. One quick, cheap, and not so dirty way to test for a bad or inconsistent ground connections between the engine block, or transmission case, and body is to take a bog standard jump lead, clip one end to a clean spot on the engine/transmission and clip the other end to a clean bolt on the body, or even directly to the battery negative terminal. If that works you can chase down where the ground straps are and clean/replace them, or even add some more if desired.
You guys remember the one that SEMA auto had a while back where one of those particular ground straps on I don't know what vehicle it was had broken h was causing strange issues
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics very true. Given the modern car is basically a computer, or 3, on wheels, and computers are known for their serious dislike of power fluctuations, most "weird" issues, from a Christmas tree dash to the all light bingo of the flashing rear lights, or rapid indicator flashing, is usually down to bad grounds or power connections, which are always a pain in the ass to track down.
Ivan, you definately a Master Tech and has so much patience. Excellent video and learned so much from your previous videos. Plase keep it up. Absolute genius.
So the initial look saw no hacks jobs like the other Volvo, but it was even worse when it's not obvious. It took time and all is well. Great job Ivan I enjoyed this journey
It is nice that your friend could give you some insight to the cause of the problems plaguing the Volvo. Now, I hope the owner will address the rest of the issues caused by the former work done to the vehicle.
Ivan, you impress with each diagnosis and repair. I really like that you typically wrap up with careful thinking … like a lessons learned session. Also, I would never have thought to epoxy that broken holder for the crank position sensor but it makes sense and saves your customer the cost of a replacement and the time to source one. Thanks for bringing us along for the ride.
Definitely an interesting case study and shows the importance of good grounds. I bought a couple of those pilot brushes after your other video where you used one and have already used it a couple of times. It works great and I highly recommend getting one. I recently used it to clean up the ground connection on my flat bed trailer and now the lights work as they should.
You are a 'tenacious kind of guy'. Many, and that includes me, would have given up a long time before we went that far. You're a good technician. Two thumbs up.
Hey. I love your videos. I live in Cyprus but am from UK. I had years repairing tvs in my shop. You are very patient guy. I had so many sleepless nights thinking about issues I left in the shop which I could not diagnose. You are clever man. I wish I had your patience. Customer is always right 😂
The rabbit hole of bad power grounds, but this was very elaborate, because the sensor was right in the middle of the ground path. Great job, Ivan! Now on to problem #2 - start/stall. It sounds like fuel thirsty but, who knows - you always surprise me with odd causes :-)
Ivan, your channel and your humility are infectious. I came across an s80 with the t6. And as it came out of your mouth about the tsb, I went "oh, yeah..I remember that." I had the same symptoms. However, I gave up on it because I didn't want to reseat the transmission which is what the tsb says to do. And, I'll be damned to find you discovered it was just the shitty ground wire connections. I didn't fix it and donated the car. Arrgh I with I had it back now. It was mad fast when it worked.
My wife's 2004 Volvo XC90 has been having the same issue you've discussed.... you provided an excellent detailed approach to diagnostics. Thank you so very much! ROCK ROQUÉ
I've got similar signal codes from the crank sensor and coil packs when I purchased it. Currently tracing all wires from sensors to the ecu to check for continuity issues. But this video was helpful to add some depth to the task and avoid missing important checks, especially the ground wires. Much respect from Cape Town, South Africa
Talking earths reminded me of a mistake I made replacing the starter on my Metro (UK). All ok till I went out in the evening with the headlights on. Next thing I know, the throttle pedal gets sticky so without thinking, I gave it a tap with my foot to rev it. The pedal went to the floor and stayed there, the car accelerated of down the road at full throttle, eventually I stood on the brakes but it still kept going. Just before I ran off the road at a corner, I turned off the ignition and just ran up the verge a bit as the steering lock came on!. After changing my trousers, I found that I had not connected the starter earth causing the current to flow up the throttle cable. OK till I turned the headlights on, causing it to get so hot the cover melted seizing the cable at full throttle. Could have quite serious but now an amusing story for the lads. Enjoy lol.
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics I remember dipping the clutch and it sounded like the engine would explode causing a bit of a panic, so then the not to effectual braking with the clutch engaged, then the 'just turn it off idea'. Its a lot easier to think straight when your not in a panic lol! I think it played on my mind that the wife had totaled our main car with weeks till insurance payout and the metro was all we could afford so I couldnt afford to 'break' it and the runaway engine noise sounded terminal and expensive.
I have watched all your videos since last December, you live in a salt state or heavy corrosion area, I don't remember you ever adding any redundant grounds or jumper cables from the battery GND to the engine block for example, maybe you have? I lived in Japan for 20 years and repaired many ground problems with an EARTHING KIT and found the problem by jumping the engine to the battery or body/chassis and the Tokyo area is more famous for salt sea air and surface corrosion. Throwing on a set of jumper cables is one of my first steps. Thank you for the hundreds of awesome videos, hope to meet you when I move back to the USA someday in the near future, currently in the Philippines. Out of 200 technician/diagnostician (no DIYers) Channels, you are my #1, cheers.
Well, it wouldn't be PHAD if there's part 3, lol. Interesting diagnosis! Bad ground! Not bolting up all the parts back in is sloppy work!! Great to see it fired right up! Awesome part 2!! Great video Ivan!
Great work, including knowing who to chat with and the need for more info! Think about this: in our daily lives, what do we interface with that is more complicated than a vehicle? Computers and cell phones operate in much more ideal conditions, and don't interface with anything mechanical!
First of all congratulations, you fixed it, this is a totally surprising one where any part can be replaced easily, bcuz of no service info😇 Great work as usual BRO😍
Great case study Ivan. I really enjoy watching you apply engineering logic and principles in your work. It’s fantastic. I’m guessing very few auto techs would be able to track down a bad ground like you did even if you got a tip from a friend.
Great video Ivan as always, it's good to have people in the industry that we can talk to. Todays vehicles are so complex that even the simple bad ground can cause so many issues. Going to watch part 3 .
Ivan! As working in automation industry from long time and plc programmer i noticed proximity sensor is mounted in a plastic housing instead of metal..as i know these sensors if you mount it in a electrically noisy environment it gose nuts even small magnetic field disturb its performance thats why 3 wire proximity switch is better and most use that now.cheers waiting for final results
Great diag. Supports importance of good grounding with all the electronics on new cars. 1 volt drop on ground during crank was a clue. Wonder what that would have been if scope ground was at Battery? Ivan usually shoots for less than 1/2 volt ground drop. Adding another ground strap to engine bolt may be beneficial to prevent future problems when age and corrosion come to call again. Maybe also check ground wire to ECM ground point from body and ground at Battery to body. Can’t wait for part #3.
Ivan, I have a 2004 Volvo V 70, a few years ago I had a cranking starting issue. I searched it, and finally came across to one Internet conversation that said the starter when it wears out, starts to draw more amperage and interferes with the crank sensor wire, I replaced the starter and all the problems were fixed. Anyhow the crank sensor wire is very close to the starter and the electronic interference causes crank issues. The ground for the starter and shielding for the crank wire is important. You stumbled on some thing that not many people know about at all, very good diagnosing skills you have.
Many would throw parts in...many would call it a bust, no fix.......This proves the need for thinking outside the box...ground control to Major Ivan...well done
A wise -old- young Russian gentleman once had a RUclips channel, and he often said *Powers and Grounds* . Hmm, who could that be. 😆 - I'm enjoying this one Ivan. Good Job!
I see your having some fun Ivan. It would suck if the job was easy. I can count on both hands the cars I thought I was done with weren’t done with me yet. It’ll be interesting to see what ya find next episode of PHAD👍
Not that I would have ever found this... My 2010 Yamaha fjr1300. As a known similar problem to such an extent that the previous owner to me had the entire wiring harness rebuilt ... My bike has like 7 known ground places that you have really have to watch out for corrosion... I also used to own a 91 Corvette... It was also known for a few suddenly had problems with the engine not starting you had to really take a look at the ground first.... Again I would never offend the problem you did on the Volvo even with this information in the back of my head. Awesome job my friend
I wrenched for 45 yrs. plus and learned you can't take nothing for granted. Who would have thought the starter cranks over fine but it still wasn't a good enough ground! Good job!!
Maddening! I'm sure owner paid good $$$$ to get the rear main seal fixed, only to have a half-assed repair. Bolts left off bell housing causing other issues. smh. Fortunate to have other Volvo there and helpful to have friend to drop some valuable tsb knowledge on you. Kudos to the commenter on first vid mentioning ground contacts. I'll be checking next one. Seems you may have a Va. Volvo diagnosis/repair pipeline going. 😀
Thanks Ivan, another good example of logical circuit analysis. Two symptoms pointed toward that degrading circuit (aka ground): 1. The problem degraded with time, 2. the problem changed with temperature of the engine. (These are small signal sensors, so the signal strength seen at the computer was degrading by means of common mode noise.) When the customer paid for an oil seal and received the car with an issue ( long crank time before start ) they should have insisted on analysis. Of course, with the sloppy work that you found I expect the customer may have not received any satisfaction.
Wow) the extra injectors pulse surprised me, never seen that before (diesel engine -yes, gasoline- no). It’s good to know. That’s why PHAD is my favorite yt channel. Free awesome knowledge, who wouldn’t like to get it?
I am 78 years old. I learned when I was around 12 that good grounds mean everything when you are dealing with a mere 12 volts. Resistance can defeat 12 volts, and newer cars use a lousy 5 volts for a ref voltage. I remove and clean the ground straps on my trucks every year. I coat them with anti-seize and tighten them securely.
Also, pls think about Installing some "Ground Strap" connectors between the engine and the transmission housing....amybe a few more locations....You Decide! You never quit, you always WIN!!!
Years ago we had a 4.6 in a mustang come in after an engine install we found the wiring for the can link to close to the alternator moved to the correct routing and ran fine
Had a Subaru setting a code for the upstream 02 sensor which the dealer replaced. Car ended up here & i found both engine to subframe grounds rotted off. Replaced both grounds & the O2 sensor cleared! Nice diag Ivan I feel your pain!
Ground problems. Good old ground problems! Throw in electronics with a "sensitive" ground point or "must see this absolute no-higher ground point"(such as no higher above ground than 10mv) and here we go with "not-so-fancy" brackets allowing extra micro volt and micro amp drops, all equaling a long crank/hard start. Where others would have quit, YOU are persistent! Very Good Fix Ivan, Very Good Fix ! ! ! I need to make a diagnostic chart for a hard or no start, using this video's steps. I've only seen a few like this at work before retirement, but when dealing with milivolts, miliamps, micro volts and micro amps, every electrical connection is on the list of potential problems. ESPECIALLY DURING CRANKING! My apology for the long comment.
Eric O is really good with finding ground problems but I think even this one would have had him stumped.Cheers. It will be good to see what is stopping it idle now.
I have seen a bad ground cable/connection or even a failing starter motor cause a long crank and or not start on volvos. But I have never seen missing eng/trans bolts and poor contacts causing it so that’s a first for me. I’ll keep it in mind when doing things like clutches or diagnostics 👍.
Ground faults are always interesting. I once encountered that on a car of a friend - turning left caused it to misfire and eventually it also misfired when running. When I connected test probes it started to behave correctly and I finally isolated that to bad grounding of engine ECU.
Its always convenient when you have the right tool in stock to make a job go smoothly like the pilot brush and ratcheting end wrench. That pilot brush might just be the norm when cars come in for repairs...first thing, clean up those grounds once determined by visual inspection. Time for an oil and filter change and maybe a fresh tank of gas. Tire pressures likely need looked into.
I had a similar ground happen with a 03 Ram that had a Daimler PCB. The grounds had to be impeccable for it to start. The least bit of corrosion and it failed to start. Cleaned the main Ground from frame to engine block . . . and BINGO it started and ran like new.
NOW it really getting interesting,IVAN.I think for a minute there you were actually speechless when it started right up.I thought i saw your chest puff up and the LOOK of WONDERMENT.I felt like what the hell,it couldn't be just the ground could it? I'm guessing here but i thought maybe the flywheel is bent or rust or the sensor ? i would myself take a heat gun to the sensor while scanning it to see if that changes when heated.OH also did you test the ohms on both sensors?Are They only hall effect or what?This video is great cause we can see it's a very tough case to pin down a in your face cause like the crusty s or broken wire,it's how i learn the most,thanks buddy
At minute 6:29 I see Ivan you had the ckp sensor inside a magnet tray, that is very danger for the sensor I have seen it multiple times before whem you place them near to any magnet devise , the magnet on the sensor can chage polarity and give you inverted sigal messing with the computer clock programming. Nice case study thanks for sharing 6:29 g 👍
I can’t believe the shoddy mechanics out there. When I was in business and had a shop I took pride in my work. Maybe it’s because I was an aircraft mechanic before I worked on cars and had extreme discipline in reassembly. Now I am too old to do this work and I have to rely on Mickey Mouse to fix my cars. I would go nuts thinking they left bolts out of my cars. Ivan I see you were raised right and have the same ethics that I had. If you were an aircraft mechanic I would never worry about the plane I am flying in. You are one heck of a great mechanic.
Nice find Ivan. I'm shocked that this is not a TSB. Because it happens A LOT. If you separate the engine from the trans, you absolutely have to clean the mating surfaces before you put them back together. And securing all the case bolts is necessary. All the engine electronics get the bulk of the ground through that mating surface. Sure, there are a couple of support grounds from the valve cover to the body, but they are not enough to overcome the draw from the starter. I've spent nearly 13 years working on nothing but those Volvo's. So if you need a spot of advice, I believe I can be of help. The last issue has to be one of 2 things. Either the MAS is bad. Which is kind of rare. Or there is a massive air leak somewhere after the MAS housing, to the throttle body. Most likely, one of the boost hoses have come off or has broken. I'm really looking forward to part three. You're in my wheelhouse now and this is great stuff for me. Thanks for sharing Ivan.
Excellent diagnosis Ivan. Thanks for taking us through the details. It might be worth cleaning the grounds on the other Volvo before it goes back to its owner?
Quite common on European cars, the ground cable goes from battery earth to the body then continues onto the transmission or engine block. This is a failure point because the engine rocks and gradually the strands in the cable by its fixing start to break (Audi VW group, Peugeot Citroen Renault and Nissan ). In virtually every case I had to deal with a new battery had been fitted. On my own Citroen as a precaution I installed a cable from the battery to the cylinder head and one to the body , I did notice the lights were brighter.. Also Volvo were close to Renault and shared some parts. It was quite common to have bad crank sensors , easy to diagnose as there was no rev counter flicker, so much so many kept a spare sensor and 10mm spanner in the glove box !!
a local garage had a citroen berlingo diesel in similar problem they fired a blunderbus at it got me there cleaned battery connections every where and grounds and term 50 on starter sorted the problem as looking at signal on ckp very weak after not a big difference but enough the garage could not belive what it was ps love you vids
I would add another earth from main earth to bell housing with jump lead. Bad maf can also make car run poor . I know you're a top notch tech .But I like to add a comment every now and then.😁
For all the DIY mechanics out there, the first thing I do when I get a new/used vehicle is locate ALL the grounds I can get to. Remove them, clean to nice clean metal, lube the connectors and the body grounds, bolts, etc., with NO-OX-ID and re-attach. Unless the cables snap off, or are cut off, you've eliminated any grounding problems forever. When you replace starters, etc, use the NO-OX-ID on all those connections as well.
Ivan, I see this issue becoming more commonplace as auto technology advances. Noise on the line is corrupting the data feeding into the ECU. It becomes worse when the impedance for the data inputs at the ECU are higher. Ferrite beads, twisted pair and bypass capacitors are often not designed into the circuit due to profit margins. That starter is producing a ton of noise from the brushes arcing and Volvo is relying solely on the ground connection to shunt that noise. I might suggest a ground strap between the transmission and the engine and also a 0.1uF capacitor right at the positive connection of the starter and the other capacitor lead connected to a ground bold (again at the starter) to give that noise a dead short. This will keep the noise from propagating through the data lines. It forms a RC type low pass filter. Without that capacitor (actually should be one inside the starter....but that's another story), it is up to the very low impedance of the ground connection to provide an easy path for the noise to go to ground an not to the ECU. The problem is, even if there is a low DC ohmic value on the ground, there is generally higher ohmic value at RF (noise) due to wire length (inductance). This was a GREAT video series. Wishing you continued success. 😎👍
I had a similar fight with a Nissan recently. Would loose signal to the back half of the truck . All grounds looked good all grounds passed load tests, but during cranking when i couldn't catch it on my testing equipment i would loose ground . Spent an entire day chasing it then just decided to run a battery ground back to the f.p ground and walaa . Runs like a champ. Ive now built an 8ag 15ft jumper to test with lol.
I cannot thank Ivan enough to fix this car and gave it a new life. The days of not knowing when/whether it would start were gone. It was embarrassing to keep cranking while at a gas station or anywhere else for 5+ minutes without success. I wish I had sent the car to PHD 3 years ago. I think very few mechanics have the patience, skill and talent to handle tough-to-fix cars. Ivan is definitely one of those.
You're lucky to be close enough to send it to him! Did you find him via RUclips?
Or friends that have Volvo knowledge.
@@dans_Learning_Curve Yes. We are almost 200 miles apart but well worth it.
@@JD-iu3vithat actually showed one of the most precious and rare attributes of being a mechanic - honesty - by telling you how things were actually fixed
Very few mechanics are able to diagnose performance problems with cars. The reality is there aren’t many quality mechanics
Ivan, if there’s only one thing I ever learned from watching you, is to CLEAN THE GROUNDS!
I am glad there will be a part three. I thought there is probably more mistakes made by the previous mechanic.
I'm not! I want everything in one video. I hate waiting another day!
@@johnnyblue4799 At least he doesn't make us wait a week
@@kerrylewis2581 I'd riot next to his shop! :)))
@@johnnyblue4799 He doesn't always fix it in one day.
@@calholli Nope, but the repairs are done by the time he uploads the first video. If he says "yesterday this car was towed in" it means yesterday when he shoots the video, not when he uploads! :)
Crazy how sensitive some components can be to ground current flow. Nicely done Ivan.
Poor grounding is always a lurking problem, especially up there in the rust belt. Thanks for the lesson, Ivan. Love your channel! 👍
Great diag and partial fix Ivan.
One quick, cheap, and not so dirty way to test for a bad or inconsistent ground connections between the engine block, or transmission case, and body is to take a bog standard jump lead, clip one end to a clean spot on the engine/transmission and clip the other end to a clean bolt on the body, or even directly to the battery negative terminal. If that works you can chase down where the ground straps are and clean/replace them, or even add some more if desired.
Usually yes, but this was a very special case that I can't quite explain haha
You guys remember the one that SEMA auto had a while back where one of those particular ground straps on I don't know what vehicle it was had broken h was causing strange issues
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics very true.
Given the modern car is basically a computer, or 3, on wheels, and computers are known for their serious dislike of power fluctuations, most "weird" issues, from a Christmas tree dash to the all light bingo of the flashing rear lights, or rapid indicator flashing, is usually down to bad grounds or power connections, which are always a pain in the ass to track down.
@@generaldisarray A3? I know mine only has one but hasn't even come across like a BMW that had like 12 different modules?
@@deepsquat600 and they seem to put all the modules/computers in the most idiotic places where moisture, etc is most likely to get into them
Ivan, you definately a Master Tech and has so much patience. Excellent video and learned so much from your previous videos. Plase keep it up. Absolute genius.
This is one of your best finds, I was so incredibly curious to see this part 2.
So the initial look saw no hacks jobs like the other Volvo, but it was even worse when it's not obvious. It took time and all is well. Great job Ivan I enjoyed this journey
How true!!
It is nice that your friend could give you some insight to the cause of the problems plaguing the Volvo. Now, I hope the owner will address the rest of the issues caused by the former work done to the vehicle.
Morning dude ! Good old fashioned sunday morning entertainment good to see someone whos walks the walk..
Your Mastery of skill in diagnosing is mind blowing! You are a master diagnostic super hero!
Ivan, you impress with each diagnosis and repair. I really like that you typically wrap up with careful thinking … like a lessons learned session. Also, I would never have thought to epoxy that broken holder for the crank position sensor but it makes sense and saves your customer the cost of a replacement and the time to source one. Thanks for bringing us along for the ride.
Always learning. Inquisitive, honest, sharing. Thanks again for all you do.
Definitely an interesting case study and shows the importance of good grounds. I bought a couple of those pilot brushes after your other video where you used one and have already used it a couple of times. It works great and I highly recommend getting one. I recently used it to clean up the ground connection on my flat bed trailer and now the lights work as they should.
You are a 'tenacious kind of guy'. Many, and that includes me, would have given up a long time before we went that far.
You're a good technician. Two thumbs up.
Hey.
I love your videos.
I live in Cyprus but am from UK.
I had years repairing tvs in my shop.
You are very patient guy.
I had so many sleepless nights thinking about issues I left in the shop which I could not diagnose.
You are clever man.
I wish I had your patience.
Customer is always right 😂
You are full of surprises Ivan great job 🎉
A PHAD morning video is always entertaining. Thanks Ivan.
The rabbit hole of bad power grounds, but this was very elaborate, because the sensor was right in the middle of the ground path. Great job, Ivan!
Now on to problem #2 - start/stall. It sounds like fuel thirsty but, who knows - you always surprise me with odd causes :-)
Ivan, your channel and your humility are infectious.
I came across an s80 with the t6. And as it came out of your mouth about the tsb, I went "oh, yeah..I remember that." I had the same symptoms. However, I gave up on it because I didn't want to reseat the transmission which is what the tsb says to do. And, I'll be damned to find you discovered it was just the shitty ground wire connections.
I didn't fix it and donated the car. Arrgh I with I had it back now. It was mad fast when it worked.
That has to be the most humbling diag ever! Great job!
My wife's 2004 Volvo XC90 has been having the same issue you've discussed.... you provided an excellent detailed approach to diagnostics. Thank you so very much! ROCK ROQUÉ
Powers and GROUNDS 🙂
Great vid, Ivan!!
As a subscriber i dont know why u dont get a million views i remember seeing you on SMA 8 yrs ago good work
I've got similar signal codes from the crank sensor and coil packs when I purchased it. Currently tracing all wires from sensors to the ecu to check for continuity issues. But this video was helpful to add some depth to the task and avoid missing important checks, especially the ground wires. Much respect from Cape Town, South Africa
Grounds, and electrical connections in general, seem more important with all the computers nowadays. Great work, Ivan!!
Talking earths reminded me of a mistake I made replacing the starter on my Metro (UK). All ok till I went out in the evening with the headlights on. Next thing I know, the throttle pedal gets sticky so without thinking, I gave it a tap with my foot to rev it. The pedal went to the floor and stayed there, the car accelerated of down the road at full throttle, eventually I stood on the brakes but it still kept going. Just before I ran off the road at a corner, I turned off the ignition and just ran up the verge a bit as the steering lock came on!. After changing my trousers, I found that I had not connected the starter earth causing the current to flow up the throttle cable. OK till I turned the headlights on, causing it to get so hot the cover melted seizing the cable at full throttle. Could have quite serious but now an amusing story for the lads. Enjoy lol.
Can you just shift to neutral to stop the acceleration? 😁
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics I remember dipping the clutch and it sounded like the engine would explode causing a bit of a panic, so then the not to effectual braking with the clutch engaged, then the 'just turn it off idea'. Its a lot easier to think straight when your not in a panic lol! I think it played on my mind that the wife had totaled our main car with weeks till insurance payout and the metro was all we could afford so I couldnt afford to 'break' it and the runaway engine noise sounded terminal and expensive.
Ground is ground the world around....except when it isn't ground! Great job.
I have watched all your videos since last December, you live in a salt state or heavy corrosion area, I don't remember you ever adding any redundant grounds or jumper cables from the battery GND to the engine block for example, maybe you have? I lived in Japan for 20 years and repaired many ground problems with an EARTHING KIT and found the problem by jumping the engine to the battery or body/chassis and the Tokyo area is more famous for salt sea air and surface corrosion. Throwing on a set of jumper cables is one of my first steps. Thank you for the hundreds of awesome videos, hope to meet you when I move back to the USA someday in the near future, currently in the Philippines. Out of 200 technician/diagnostician (no DIYers) Channels, you are my #1, cheers.
As a tech myself. Mostly ford. I really enjoy your videos. Please please keep filming !!! We need you !!
Well, it wouldn't be PHAD if there's part 3, lol. Interesting diagnosis! Bad ground! Not bolting up all the parts back in is sloppy work!! Great to see it fired right up! Awesome part 2!! Great video Ivan!
Another genius diagnostic. Kudos.
Good morning all. Great video as always
Great work, including knowing who to chat with and the need for more info! Think about this: in our daily lives, what do we interface with that is more complicated than a vehicle? Computers and cell phones operate in much more ideal conditions, and don't interface with anything mechanical!
First of all congratulations, you fixed it, this is a totally surprising one where any part can be replaced easily, bcuz of no service info😇
Great work as usual BRO😍
Good hunting Ivan! I often will add additional grounds, especially with trunk mounted battery, on older vehicles (Miatas).
Great diagnostic. You called me the regional Saturn Astra tech. I think you have become the regional Volvo tech.
Great case study Ivan. I really enjoy watching you apply engineering logic and principles in your work. It’s fantastic. I’m guessing very few auto techs would be able to track down a bad ground like you did even if you got a tip from a friend.
Amazing diagnostics. Genious!
Dit is een interessant massa probleem bedankt voor de informatie ℹ️ geweldig gedaan ✅
Great video Ivan as always, it's good to have people in the industry that we can talk to. Todays vehicles are so complex that even the simple bad ground can cause so many issues. Going to watch part 3 .
This was by far not a "simple" bad ground 😉
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics 100% agree was much more but that ground did not help.😁
Excellent job Ivan.
Ivan! As working in automation industry from long time and plc programmer i noticed proximity sensor is mounted in a plastic housing instead of metal..as i know these sensors if you mount it in a electrically noisy environment it gose nuts even small magnetic field disturb its performance thats why 3 wire proximity switch is better and most use that now.cheers waiting for final results
My early Mazda's also have that low voltage signal on the cam and crank sensors. Thanks Ivan!
Loyal fun and student from Kenya
Your videos educate me alot
Enjoying the Volvo series of fixes!! Ivan is becoming a Volvo expert!! LOVING it! Yah, I'm a Volvo fan-girl, so yah! haha Merci
Great diag. Supports importance of good grounding with all the electronics on new cars. 1 volt drop on ground during crank was a clue. Wonder what that would have been if scope ground was at Battery? Ivan usually shoots for less than 1/2 volt ground drop. Adding another ground strap to engine bolt may be beneficial to prevent future problems when age and corrosion come to call again. Maybe also check ground wire to ECM ground point from body and ground at Battery to body.
Can’t wait for part #3.
Ivan, I have a 2004 Volvo V 70, a few years ago I had a cranking starting issue. I searched it, and finally came across to one Internet conversation that said the starter when it wears out, starts to draw more amperage and interferes with the crank sensor wire, I replaced the starter and all the problems were fixed. Anyhow the crank sensor wire is very close to the starter and the electronic interference causes crank issues. The ground for the starter and shielding for the crank wire is important. You stumbled on some thing that not many people know about at all, very good diagnosing skills you have.
Many would throw parts in...many would call it a bust, no fix.......This proves the need for thinking outside the box...ground control to Major Ivan...well done
A wise -old- young Russian gentleman once had a RUclips channel, and he often said *Powers and Grounds* . Hmm, who could that be. 😆 - I'm enjoying this one Ivan. Good Job!
I'd definitely torque to spec all accessible bellhousing bolts, given that some were missing altogether...
Great work and diagnosis!
I see your having some fun Ivan. It would suck if the job was easy. I can count on both hands the cars I thought I was done with weren’t done with me yet. It’ll be interesting to see what ya find next episode of PHAD👍
Your patience is extraordinary.
This one really tested my patience haha
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics 👍🙂
Not that I would have ever found this... My 2010 Yamaha fjr1300. As a known similar problem to such an extent that the previous owner to me had the entire wiring harness rebuilt ... My bike has like 7 known ground places that you have really have to watch out for corrosion... I also used to own a 91 Corvette... It was also known for a few suddenly had problems with the engine not starting you had to really take a look at the ground first.... Again I would never offend the problem you did on the Volvo even with this information in the back of my head.
Awesome job my friend
I wrenched for 45 yrs. plus and learned you can't take nothing for granted. Who would have thought the starter cranks over fine but it still wasn't a good enough ground! Good job!!
Great video Ivan and I have already checked my Volvo 3.0 -ve straps! All good thankfully and no bolts missing from my bell housing! 👍
How many miles on your car? How close to Ivan do you live?! LoL 😅
@@dans_Learning_Curve mine has just 130,000 miles but I live in the UK so too far away from Ivan . 🤣
Maddening! I'm sure owner paid good $$$$ to get the rear main seal fixed, only to have a half-assed repair. Bolts left off bell housing causing other issues. smh. Fortunate to have other Volvo there and helpful to have friend to drop some valuable tsb knowledge on you. Kudos to the commenter on first vid mentioning ground contacts. I'll be checking next one. Seems you may have a Va. Volvo diagnosis/repair pipeline going. 😀
Amazing work he does to figure it out.
Thanks Ivan, another good example of logical circuit analysis.
Two symptoms pointed toward that degrading circuit (aka ground): 1. The problem degraded with time, 2. the problem changed with temperature of the engine. (These are small signal sensors, so the signal strength seen at the computer was degrading by means of common mode noise.)
When the customer paid for an oil seal and received the car with an issue ( long crank time before start ) they should have insisted on analysis. Of course, with the sloppy work that you found I expect the customer may have not received any satisfaction.
Great diagnosis as usual and great test performed!
Wow) the extra injectors pulse surprised me, never seen that before (diesel engine -yes, gasoline- no). It’s good to know. That’s why PHAD is my favorite yt channel. Free awesome knowledge, who wouldn’t like to get it?
I am 78 years old. I learned when I was around 12 that good grounds mean everything when you are dealing with a mere 12 volts. Resistance can defeat 12 volts, and newer cars use a lousy 5 volts for a ref voltage. I remove and clean the ground straps on my trucks every year. I coat them with anti-seize and tighten them securely.
Also, pls think about Installing some "Ground Strap" connectors between the engine and the transmission housing....amybe a few more locations....You Decide! You never quit, you always WIN!!!
Thanks for the shoutout Ivan. I’m a Volvo fanatic and I’m glad I could help. Awesome video!
I still want scope proof of why the ECM wasn't happy with the original CKP signal 😂
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics test it out
It’s nice to have a known good signal for scope work, more so when your working on something unfamiliar.
Interesting case, nice to see the ground fixed but I guess there's more problems.
Years ago we had a 4.6 in a mustang come in after an engine install we found the wiring for the can link to close to the alternator moved to the correct routing and ran fine
Had a Subaru setting a code for the upstream 02 sensor which the dealer replaced. Car ended up here & i found both engine to subframe grounds rotted off. Replaced both grounds & the O2 sensor cleared! Nice diag Ivan I feel your pain!
I just pulled a 2.5 for a rear main and torque converter seal. Both of those grounds crumbled when touched.
Those little braided straps? They are pretty useless lol I just pull off the remains. How does that have anything to do with the oxygen sensor? 🤔
Ground problems. Good old ground problems! Throw in electronics with a "sensitive" ground point or "must see this absolute no-higher ground point"(such as no higher above ground than 10mv) and here we go with "not-so-fancy" brackets allowing extra micro volt and micro amp drops, all equaling a long crank/hard start.
Where others would have quit, YOU are persistent!
Very Good Fix Ivan, Very Good Fix ! ! !
I need to make a diagnostic chart for a hard or no start, using this video's steps.
I've only seen a few like this at work before retirement, but when dealing with milivolts, miliamps, micro volts and micro amps, every electrical connection is on the list of potential problems. ESPECIALLY DURING CRANKING!
My apology for the long comment.
I can't believe you found that. Good job.
Great video Ivan ,your amazing .
I suppose I shouldn't be. But I'm amazed at just how many cars you repair that come down to almost criminal work from another shop/mechanic!
Your amazing you have such a great knowledge of automobiles
*You’re
Epic case study well done man!
Thanks Josiah!
Eric O is really good with finding ground problems but I think even this one would have had him stumped.Cheers. It will be good to see what is stopping it idle now.
I have seen a bad ground cable/connection or even a failing starter motor cause a long crank and or not start on volvos. But I have never seen missing eng/trans bolts and poor contacts causing it so that’s a first for me. I’ll keep it in mind when doing things like clutches or diagnostics 👍.
Keep calm, and check your powers and grounds. 👑
Ground faults are always interesting.
I once encountered that on a car of a friend - turning left caused it to misfire and eventually it also misfired when running. When I connected test probes it started to behave correctly and I finally isolated that to bad grounding of engine ECU.
Its always convenient when you have the right tool in stock to make a job go smoothly like the pilot brush and ratcheting end wrench. That pilot brush might just be the norm when cars come in for repairs...first thing, clean up those grounds once determined by visual inspection. Time for an oil and filter change and maybe a fresh tank of gas. Tire pressures likely need looked into.
I had a similar ground happen with a 03 Ram that had a Daimler PCB. The grounds had to be impeccable for it to start. The least bit of corrosion and it failed to start. Cleaned the main Ground from frame to engine block . . . and BINGO it started and ran like new.
NOW it really getting interesting,IVAN.I think for a minute there you were actually speechless when it started right up.I thought i saw your chest puff up and the LOOK of WONDERMENT.I felt like what the hell,it couldn't be just the ground could it? I'm guessing here but i thought maybe the flywheel is bent or rust or the sensor ? i would myself take a heat gun to the sensor while scanning it to see if that changes when heated.OH also did you test the ohms on both sensors?Are They only hall effect or what?This video is great cause we can see it's a very tough case to pin down a in your face cause like the crusty s or broken wire,it's how i learn the most,thanks buddy
At minute 6:29 I see Ivan you had the ckp sensor inside a magnet tray, that is very danger for the sensor I have seen it multiple times before whem you place them near to any magnet devise , the magnet on the sensor can chage polarity and give you inverted sigal messing with the computer clock programming. Nice case study thanks for sharing 6:29 g 👍
I can’t believe the shoddy mechanics out there. When I was in business and had a shop I took pride in my work. Maybe it’s because I was an aircraft mechanic before I worked on cars and had extreme discipline in reassembly. Now I am too old to do this work and I have to rely on Mickey Mouse to fix my cars. I would go nuts thinking they left bolts out of my cars. Ivan I see you were raised right and have the same ethics that I had. If you were an aircraft mechanic I would never worry about the plane I am flying in. You are one heck of a great mechanic.
Nice find Ivan. I'm shocked that this is not a TSB. Because it happens A LOT. If you separate the engine from the trans, you absolutely have to clean the mating surfaces before you put them back together. And securing all the case bolts is necessary. All the engine electronics get the bulk of the ground through that mating surface. Sure, there are a couple of support grounds from the valve cover to the body, but they are not enough to overcome the draw from the starter. I've spent nearly 13 years working on nothing but those Volvo's. So if you need a spot of advice, I believe I can be of help.
The last issue has to be one of 2 things. Either the MAS is bad. Which is kind of rare. Or there is a massive air leak somewhere after the MAS housing, to the throttle body. Most likely, one of the boost hoses have come off or has broken. I'm really looking forward to part three. You're in my wheelhouse now and this is great stuff for me. Thanks for sharing Ivan.
I have concluded that it's a miracle these run at all.
Excellent diagnosis Ivan. Thanks for taking us through the details.
It might be worth cleaning the grounds on the other Volvo before it goes back to its owner?
Thanks for the info.
thanks for good video,and thanks to your friend!
Have this cam signal error on my mercedes (changed both cam and crank sensors), mabybee i need to chase my grounds too, thanks for this!
Quite common on European cars, the ground cable goes from battery earth to the body then continues onto the transmission or engine block. This is a failure point because the engine rocks and gradually the strands in the cable by its fixing start to break (Audi VW group, Peugeot Citroen Renault and Nissan ). In virtually every case I had to deal with a new battery had been fitted. On my own Citroen as a precaution I installed a cable from the battery to the cylinder head and one to the body , I did notice the lights were brighter.. Also Volvo were close to Renault and shared some parts. It was quite common to have bad crank sensors , easy to diagnose as there was no rev counter flicker, so much so many kept a spare sensor and 10mm spanner in the glove box !!
There's an old TSB about this, I couldn't find it on VIDA, but its there.
EDIT: never mind, just read the video description and got to 16:45.
a local garage had a citroen berlingo diesel in similar problem they fired a blunderbus at it got me there cleaned battery connections every where and grounds and term 50 on starter sorted the problem as looking at signal on ckp very weak after not a big difference but enough the garage could not belive what it was ps love you vids
I would add another earth from main earth to bell housing with jump lead. Bad maf can also make car run poor . I know you're a top notch tech .But I like to add a comment every now and then.😁
I agree adding another ground strap to trans / block bolt could prevent future problems when age and more corrosion happens.
For all the DIY mechanics out there, the first thing I do when I get a new/used vehicle is locate ALL the grounds I can get to. Remove them, clean to nice clean metal, lube the connectors and the body grounds, bolts, etc., with NO-OX-ID and re-attach. Unless the cables snap off, or are cut off, you've eliminated any grounding problems forever. When you replace starters, etc, use the NO-OX-ID on all those connections as well.
Damn) I can’t believe that this xc90 has the same typical issue as ancient 850 had 🤯 mind blown
Wow! Really crazy, calling a friend can make all the difference sometimes!
Maybe I’d run a #4 wire from the engine block to the batt neg, bonded to the trans and body along the way.
Ivan, I see this issue becoming more commonplace as auto technology advances. Noise on the line is corrupting the data feeding into the ECU. It becomes worse when the impedance for the data inputs at the ECU are higher. Ferrite beads, twisted pair and bypass capacitors are often not designed into the circuit due to profit margins.
That starter is producing a ton of noise from the brushes arcing and Volvo is relying solely on the ground connection to shunt that noise. I might suggest a ground strap between the transmission and the engine and also a 0.1uF capacitor right at the positive connection of the starter and the other capacitor lead connected to a ground bold (again at the starter) to give that noise a dead short. This will keep the noise from propagating through the data lines. It forms a RC type low pass filter. Without that capacitor (actually should be one inside the starter....but that's another story), it is up to the very low impedance of the ground connection to provide an easy path for the noise to go to ground an not to the ECU. The problem is, even if there is a low DC ohmic value on the ground, there is generally higher ohmic value at RF (noise) due to wire length (inductance).
This was a GREAT video series. Wishing you continued success. 😎👍
I had a similar fight with a Nissan recently. Would loose signal to the back half of the truck . All grounds looked good all grounds passed load tests, but during cranking when i couldn't catch it on my testing equipment i would loose ground . Spent an entire day chasing it then just decided to run a battery ground back to the f.p ground and walaa . Runs like a champ. Ive now built an 8ag 15ft jumper to test with lol.