thanks for your work on this video! a couple of notes: - the zh in zhang hao is pronounced like a hard j. - 30:21 zhang hao also got to do two mnet performances, one for tomboy and one for over me. - can't find the time stamp again but you mentioned a couple of times that gyuvin has no filter. i don't think this is necessarily true. gyuvin is very entertaining on variety shows for sure but he also consistently demonstrates that he has extremely high emotional intelligence and his responses to both fan and interview questions are always extremely thoughtful. - 1:02:23 i don't think gunwook started the dance club! i think he was the first boy to join, though. for his "rock festival" vlog he went back to his old school and mentioned that he was part of the 2nd generation of the group and now they're on the 7th. - 1:12:42 it's before this but in the matthew block. i get what you're saying about matthew being ethnically korean and therefore not global in the same sense as chinese or japanese trainees who have no connection to korean culture at all, but i think this is a very, like, western perspective. if you talk to anyone who is part of the korean diaspora, they'll tell you that koreans born and raised in korea see and treat them as different. i'm not saying being ethnically korean didn't help him at all, but it's not the equivalent of being korean from korea. being korean-candadian was still overall a disadvantage. - 1:47:54 i'd like to push back on the idea that there's ever a girl group dominated market. despite the relative success of groups like new jeans and aespa at the end of 4th gen, boy groups still greatly outsell girl groups and outperform in most other metrics, as well. - 1:54:47 hoo boy no, solo stans and antis are a massive problem for this group, especially on twitter. the problem with survival show groups is that after debut people still tend to hang on to their one pick mindset, which has definitely been the case for zb1. zb1 fans are constantly mass emailing wakeone, mass trending tags, sending protest trucks, and more over perceived slights to their favorite members, circulating spreadsheets comparing each members' solo promotional activities, etc. the toxicity did not end with the show. - 2:00:00 takuto actually didn't get eliminated early at all, he got eliminated in the second to last round! he was in supercharger!
Aw no way! I’ve been criticised for pronunciation before so I even looked up ZH’s… still managed to get it wrong 😭 thanks for being nice about it though. I’m also sure Gyuvin has incredibly high emotional intelligence - that’s one of the reasons he has so many friends and fans. He’s very in control of his filter, but when he decides to turn it off it is GONE 😂 and he’s definitely a big sweetie. Definitely hate about Matthew - I’ve mentioned in other comments but he kind of can’t win - he’s not ‘properly’ Korean and he’s not ‘properly’ international… his being ethnically Korean would have benefitted him more than other international trainees, but not as much as other Korean trainees. I think he was decently high on Korean one picks which probably had at least a bit to do with being ethnically Korean. Yes boy groups do outsell and often put perform girl groups, but I would point to things like lots of girl groups winning daesangs and going viral internationally in 2022-2023 as an indication that girl groups were, not so much ‘dominant’ as ‘more prominent’ at that time. But yeah they’ve never consistently outsold bgs. Solo stans and fandom drama are an issue for ZB1, but you’ve got to remember that I am coming into this from a Kepler perspective, and compared to them, ZB1 is nothing imo. It’s mostly contained to Twitter which is nice for those like me who don’t use Twitter. I’ve also talked about the same factors in survival show groups you mentioned - in episode 3 ☺️ With Takuto, I don’t mean that he was eliminated early as such, more so that no ‘dozens’ made it to the finale. I hope this clarifies some things. Thanks for your polite corrections and thanks for watching!
@@dragonintheorb Sure, thanks for the clarification. I would say the anti/solo stan issue is really not contained to Twitter, though. It's out there in real life with people constantly physically contacting Wakeone, sending protest trucks against specific members (Jiwoong and Hanbin, for example), antis sending them hate/threats (several members, notably Hanbin, have responded publicly to some of the messages they've received), major fanbases boycotting album sales, etc. It may not be as bad as what Kep1er is experiencing, girl groups always have it worse in that regard, but it's just not true to say it's not bad or doesn't exist.
That’s true - I don’t mean to dismiss it. I mean, like you said, people tried to get Jiwoong kicked out. But I will stand by my opinion that it’s nowhere near as bad as Kepler and I don’t think it will have a big effect on ZB1’s sales- and since most people seem to compare it to Kepler, it seems much better since, well, it is better compared to Kepler.
@@dragonintheorb Again, I'm not disagreeing that Kep1er have it worse. Of course they do, because girl groups have to deal with regular fan BS and also the added layer of misogyny. But that's not what you were saying in the video. You weren't saying "there's still fan conflict but it's not as bad as Kep1er." What you said in the video was "the toxicity just died" after debut. That's what I take issue with because it's not true. Pretending like, since it's not as bad as Kep1er, there must not be any issues at all, isn't helpful to ZB1.
Ah I see. I didn’t realise that’s what you meant. Although I didn’t say it in the video, I was thinking about it in relation to Kepler - and compared to Kepler I WOULD say ZB1’s toxicity ‘died’. It was hyperbole and I thought that was obvious 😅 I’ve been told it’s hard for people to understand my exaggerations with my tone of voice. As far as the internal fandom - I believe I mentioned in this video (or maybe it was one of the Kepler ones) that I am certain large pockets of ZB1 toxicity exist, but that I personally haven’t been exposed to them - hence I wasn’t able to make a judgement on the nature/main points of that toxicity. At the end of the day I think it’s relatively easy to avoid ZB1 drama - or at least, it is for me on the English-speaking internet, as opposed to when BP finished airing - hence my exaggeration of ‘died’. I hope that helps clarify.
That’s true, and thankfully most Zeroses agree, but it can still be fun to speculate. The only person I would genuinely remove if I had the opportunity is Yujin - for his own mental health and safety. I’m incredibly opposed to minors on survival shows in particular.
@@dragonintheorb yuehua would've made him debut in evnne anyway:( i'm glad he's in zb1 surrounded by the ppl he loves and take care of him, ofc his mental health is important but i can tell he's genuinely happy
I feel so bad about how people treat matthew regarding being a korean who was born and raised in Canada. People don't count him in as foreigner bcs he is ethnically korean but at the same time koreans don't fully consider him as korean becase he's not fluent in korean and knows a little less about korea. Well officially, as a group, the consider matthew as a foreigner which we call the globalz. And the most annoying part is, even tho it was cleared in this video that it wasn't matthew's fault, but the hate he got from it was really so unnecessary. Also about matthew's rank, Seokryudan (matthew's fans), especially japanese fans of matthew, flew their way to korea to increase matthew's korean votes. Matthew fans may not be that massive but WE ARE DEDICATED ABOUT HIM. we do not play about matthew and we will protect him at all cost.
Yes it’s a big shame because he can’t win, as you said - he’s not really considered global and he’s not really considered Korean. But at the end of the day he’s succeeding in life, and that makes me happy. I didn’t know people flew to Korea to get him more Korean votes, but I’m not too surprised. Survival shows do that to people. In the end he debuted so I hope it was worth it 🎉
i really love how you touch on the queer aspects of the group because i think that zerobaseone wouldn’t have been the group it is, nor nearly as popular, without its integration with queer culture. i had actually been wanting to do my own research on the topic since boys planet concluded, because i think (at least, to me) it reads off as a stepping stone towards the celebration of queer identity in mainstream kpop. it would’ve been also very beneficial to contextualize zerobaseone’s queer-associated image with boys planet, particularly with the inherent queer nature of program as i believe that also contributed greatly to the group’s largely queer following. you mentioned how mnet leaned into jiwoong’s BL background, as well as repeatedly putting the spotlight on hanbin’s background with the historically-queer dance style of waacking, but i feel that there are also many queer aspects of the show which need to be mentioned: for instance, the constant discussions about men falling for other men is very notable. we most evidently see it surrounding jiwoong, with seowon’s alleged crush on him and bak doha even saying “i might actually fall for a man”. now, i can’t determine whether those comments and jokes were poking fun at the possibility of being gay or making fun of it, but the frequency of those comments are definitely much more notable in boys planet in comparison to produce 101 s2 and produce x 101, especially as they’re more direct references to the idea of being gay. furthermore, a lot of the bp trainees openly exhibited queer behaviours. alongside haobin, haruto and wang zihao are another ‘ship’ born from the show. although they didn’t receive as much screentime as haobin, they still similarly read off as a romantic pair to many fans, with haruto even referring to zihao as ‘my husband’. i remember park hanbin being a huge topic regarding potentially queer trainees on my side of the internet for a variety of reasons: him allegedly saying he wasn’t interested in women, as well as his predebut dance videos (which, if you haven’t seen, are arguably more feminine and ‘provocative’(?) than zh’s dance vids). although both of those examples regard the image surrounding boys planet, as they regard pre-program and post-program content and comments, park hanbin continues to be evidence of queer influence within the image which boys planet created (or planned to create) for itself, shown in his reading battle (as in the queer slang term) with woongki in planet camp tour. on the topic of woongki, he is what i believe to be a great example of the queer nature of boys planet. i sort of see him as a combination of jiwoong and hao, as mnet depicted him in a way which emphasized his queer behaviours (for instance, the abundance of screentime during the 3rd mission dedicated to him calling other trainees attractive and even claiming ownership of them in a romantic context) whilst also becoming a ‘face of the show’ through an emphatically feminine image, through his iconic viral dance battle and, what i would argue enshrined him as a face of the show, planet camp tour which he hosted with seowon, another notoriously feminine trainee. i also want to clarify this isn’t to say that any feminine trainee is queer, and i heavily disagree with that stereotype as well. i will say that boys planet had an abundance of femininely-expressing trainees (note: i’m using the term feminine very loosely here), which is also what i believe draws a largely queer fanbase. my point here is that what i think makes boys planet, and inherently zerobaseone, “weird” is that the program didn’t shy away from its queer influences and queer-influenced trainees, and in fact, leaned into them to further promote the show. whether it was a deliberate move to attract the largely queer demographic of kpop fans or to simply display the program’s nuance, there’s no denying that mnet’s display of the queer undertones within boys planet and zerobaseone’s images are deliberate. (sorry to ramble, i just find it really interesting that the current queerly-perceived image of zerobaseone could also be a direct result of boys planet’s imagery itself, making the queer fanbase of boys planet naturally transfer to zerobaseone)
Well said! Yes it’s definitely partially a result of Boys Planet and how it was run/portrayed. Unfortunately, since this video was about ZB1, not Boys Planet, I wasn’t able to discuss other trainees like Haruto and Woongki - but in the somewhat distant future I do intend to discuss the editing and production of the show, which is where I will be able to discuss those trainees in more depth.
I’m sorry 😞 I know the least about him out of all of the members. He’s a great variety personality and I think he fills a great role in the group where he can do anything he wants. I think he’ll have a great career after ZB1. He’s also a big grower (as in he’s grown on me a lot). As I said I think he’s also THE representation of ZB1’s weirdness. I’m convinced that Gyuvin stans make the world go round.
ZB1 is such a immersive group, I don't know how to phrase it differently. Once you get into the group, they have this certain allure to them which makes you curious to know more about them. Their personalities, their togetherness and functionality as a group, everything is so harmonic. Even the members individually have this air and talent about them and each of them have an interesting backstory which brought them where they are. And of course their music holds so much depth in it and versatility. They are incredible
I really appreciate your honest analysis and as a Gunwook one pick I agree a lot with your notions about him. There's something so insanely eager about him, and you can really tell he aims to be recognized and praised and thrives off of it; it's super endearing to see. In a more broad context, I feel like a lot (not all of course, but a sizable amount) of idols that debuted in 4th gen were ill-equipped to be an idol (skill wise or knowledge wise) or were becoming idols for more vain motivations (the recognition, power, money vs. wanting to be an idol for the performance aspect or for fans). Gunwook is refreshing in the sense that he takes being an idol seriously, is mastering his craft, and you can just tell he isn't in it for the vain aspects of idolhood but for the performance aspect of it. I've written essays about his uniqueness and I probably will for years to come. I don't think I've ever adored an idol as much as him and would love to discuss more about him with you because his perspective and skillset fascinates me. He probably has the most potential I've ever seen in kpop and I've been into kpop for nearly a decade. If I had to respectfully critique this video I would say delving more into Taerae would be super beneficial when it comes to the queer aspect and highlighting that attribute of ZB1. Planet Camp Tour, for example, was the start of showcasing him in a non-basic light outside of being a solid vocalist. Post-debut, he's the most flamboyant member of ZB1 and probably one of the most in all of kpop. I genuinely think his representation, with Hao and Hanbin of course, is one of the biggest impact ZB1 has: normalizing 'stereotypical' queer mannerisms, jokes, and proximity. Making gay jokes, calling each other 'diva', a term used almost exclusively in the Korean LGBTQ+ scene and all Koreans know that, showcasing tender love toward one another and flirting with one another at a rate far higher than all other kpop groups, walking around with "limp wrists', etc., is creating a huge wave of acceptance towards differences in the industry and among the greater kpop fanbase. Their representation of being unabashedly themselves and not fully conforming, and embracing their pasts (such as Jiwoong openly discussing his BLs) means a lot. There are also already newer male rookies discussing Hanbin's waacking skills and so many other idol professionals discussing his skills, which inherently means they are interacting with a dance style enriched in queer culture. As a felow member of the queer community, it's so beautiful to see the slow start of normalization occur. Regarding the future of ZB1, I have no doubt they'll always have a high level of success. I don't think WakeOne is being smart with the strategic choices of title tracks, and I'm not sure if they'll win as many awards this time around during the award season, but they'll always be solid. I go back and forth whether or not I want them to renew after 2.5 years or go their separate ways, but I'm sure all members will at least reach a mild level of success for the rest of their careers. I could talk endlessly about the pros and cons of how WakeOne is managing them, but that's another discussion that would take a long time to flesh out but if you are interested in my yapping I'd love to share. Thank you for making this! It was a great watch and listen.
Yeah I definitely agree with you about Gunwook! He has the determination and skill to succeed, and he seems to have a wonderful attitude to life and a genuine heart. I could praise him forever 🥰 I tend to pick biases and one picks by leadership skills and personality/attitude, so it’s no wonder he was such a strong one pick for me. Thank you for your critique - you’re right, I should have talked more about how Taerae and the group as a whole have done a lot to normalise more queer-coded and feminine-coded behaviour among idols and Korean men. Please believe me when I say that I don’t take Taerae’s contributions lightly - he’s amazing. And I also agree about Hanbin - the fact that ZB1 and their members are becoming pretty well known and inspiring other trainees is so amazing. I also have issues with ZB1’s management, but it’s far better than Kepler’s imo. I don’t think I mentioned it in this episode, but I definitely mentioned it in Minsiodes 4+5 - I really hope ZB1 are successful enough to disband and have a lasting impact on the industry. You’re more than welcome to rant and discuss here! As you can see, I’m no stranger to discussions of excessive lengths. Thanks for watching ☺️
idk if the focus of this video was mainly Boys Planet, but I feel like shimkongz (ricky gyuvin) should've gotten a mention in the romance section. Even though the pair wasn't popular on the show, mainly bc neither of them really got much screen time or story, they shot up in popularity after debut and arguably have surpassed ppusamz (Matthew Jiwoong) in popularity. I remember at one point on twitter they won or almost won a pair popularity poll against haobin with like over 5k votes
Ooof almost winning against Haobin is pretty powerful. Yeah I did mainly focus on Boys Planet content and I don’t remember them having much there, but it is good to know for the future, thanks ☺️
I remember not being interested in bp999 but seeing Ricky on my timeline because orbits (Loona's stans btw) kept calling him Him Lip (Kim Lip but male) lmao
This video is soooo important. ZB1 is quite an interesting group. I also think Boys Planet 999 is probably the best reality competition we got, the roster is just insane, that's why I feel like we are quite happy with the result, we got sooo many great options for this group, it was the first time I didn't feel we got 5 big personalities in the show an the rest are NPC, around 17/20 contestants are really iconic and did such a great job as being part of a piece of entertainment. Part of the frustration for some of the guys that didn't make it disappeared with the debut of EVNNE, that is also quite an INSANE lineup, really great. I still feel that Yujin is too young for ZB1 and is kinda awkward for me, like... WAAAAY TOO YOUNG. Yoo Seungeon fits PERFECTLY for the concept and vibe but I fear he would be kinda overlooked since the vocal line is already full between Hanbin, Hao, Tae and Matthew, he is the main vocalist of EVNNE so I think that deal was way better for him. Junhyeon would be such a chaos, amazing pick, sad he didn't make it. I don't like to ship or speculate about Idol's sexuality but C'MON, Hanbin, Zhang Hao, Ji Woong and Matthew being so openly fruity is so important for the medium, I'm just living. MOTHER.
Thank you! MOTHER I also think ZB1 are a fascinating group (as you can tell). They don’t do anything super different or novel, but they are more extreme and I think that’s what makes them bizarre. I also thought BP was good - probably because of a combination of factors including X1 fans wanting another group, talented trainees, and people being prepared for the worst after Kepler (so anything we got would have been better). My ideal lineup as I don’t think I have mentioned is in rough order; Gunwook-Zhanghao-Taerae-Hui-Hanbin-Matthew-PHanbin-Keita-Hwanhee, but what we got is great too, and Seungeon would have been amazing too. I also really liked Sunghwan and Jongwoo. At the end of the day, Yujin is too young for sure, and I feel the show has had a big impact on his psychology - but people like him and he’s a cute maknae so of course he got in. EVNNE is deifinitely a reason people weren’t as upset. Thanks for watching ☺️
@@dragonintheorb :3 Something I also think is really interesting about the group is their dynamics, you can see how well they interact, the familiarity, it shows a lot on interviews, reminds me of Mamamoo, Seventeen, Stray Kidz and Oh My Girl. Jongwoo not getting in was quite a surprise for me, I was like, If Jiwoong makes it, Jongwoo goes with him. It also would fill the lack of main rapper. But yeah, in general, quite happy with ZB1.
AS A GEONPPANGDAN I'M SO HAPPY TO SEE THIS! A lot of people have misunderstood him (includingmymomsadly) :C Also I'm so glad to see someone who also sees themselves on him 😊
Lmao I'm pretty sure Gunwook is my bias wrecker and he was my top 5 if not top 3 in Boys Planet. I kid you not I also did not witness the host still talking to Gunwook, when he was walking up. I was also confused when I found out. Like how I miss that lol, but you brought me back to that moment. I had already fully emotionally prepared myself for him not making it because I knew for a fact he would still debate and would 100% be my bias in that GROUP, But that really scared me I was so happy. Gyuvin's reaction was literally me, and then I froze. No Idea what happened after!
Very interesting video! enjoyed your opinions on this and I agree with majority of it. But here's some more info - Mathew, gunwook and hao were the most popular trainees during the show in Japan despite not being Japanese. (Keita never was, he had a huge global fanbase tho) The reason is gap moe aka duality. They're often referred as ktl/jelly pop trio by intl fans and minasangz by jp and kr fans. - boys planet was a flop in China and no trainee had a huge following. And the one that was the most popular among them was yujin and not hao, it was even announced in the show during elimination. Hao rose in fame and has a huge fanbase now only after winning the show. - hao was the designated g group member of the group by literally every Korean fan since the start of the show. Every live performance he gained himself kfans, evident in the results of him winning every live voting. Also he fit their beauty standards to a T. I believe hao's success is due to huge global fanbase + Japanese fanbase + Korean fanbase and ofc Chinese fanbase although it wasnt big that time. He is loved everywhere. - both Ricky and taerae didnt have considerable screentime in the show and only got to the group by super viral moments. Both of them were also among the trainees that got people's attention during pre show pr videos, Ricky internationally (his catchphrase) and taerae domestically (his church oppa image). Imo Ricky getting a good chuck of kfans is when he went to see the ads, a lot of people fell for his lovelicky image. And taerae had that whole man in love moment and he was fixed as the main vocal of the group by everyone. - F4 visual group that consisted of hanbin, jiwoong, yujin and gyuvin. It was formed during pre show and these trainees were already anticipated by the people before the show even aired. These 4 were constantly considered as the important members of the group by kfans regardless of their skill level and were usually associated wth each other. - like you said, the friendship arc greatly contributed to Mathew's screentime. If I remember correctly he was around rank 34 during pre show and rose to rank 2 during first elims. The screentime showed both his friendship with a trainee (who was anticipated by the public before the show) and his skills (his viral giiiirlll~) but Mathew also went though a huge hate during say my name because of both his storyline and his rigging controversy which had him drop to 9th rank before finale. That's just showed how his casual fans dropped him as it was a 6 or 3 pick voting system that time and his 1 pick pulled through in finale. - gunwook was a well liked trainee, his pre show clip got viral on youtube shorts (it has like 10m+ views). But kfans had divided opinions on him and slowly it changed throughout the show. He was a trainee that had already proved how talented he is, his main thing to show off was that he was also a young, cute teenage boy. And the editing of the show favoured him ofc. - haobin as a pair was expected to interact due to the them both being the centres of the show but mnet only capitalized on that when they became teammates in tomboy and it got even more crazy when it was confirmed that they were already friends way before by both the eliminated trainess and hanbin's mom herself lol -after a year with zb1, the most popular ship duos (internationally) are haobin, shimkogz, pussamz and recently matwook. - also fun fact 6/9 members were always in the top 9 throughout the show. (Excpet for Ricky, Taerae and gunwook who were also part of top 9 at some point in the show) which just shows why zb1 as a group was accepted easily.
Ahh thank you for such a detailed comment! Yes I think I said to someone else - but for some reason gap moe didn’t even occur to me, however I would definitely agree that it was a factor. A lot of anime characters (including to a small extent canon Bakugo and to a large extent fandom Bakugo) have the gap moe appeal to, so tehnically I wasn’t wrong I guess…. I would disagree that Hao had a big fanbase only after the show - I mean, there’s a reason he ranked 1st. Unless you’re referring to his popularity in China? In which case I have no connection with/knowledge of Chinese fans so I’ll have to take your word for it 😅 Would agree with you on Hao’s success! I would also say a big reason Taerae got in is because every single bit of screen time he got, he was praised for being a great vocalist - and people were on the hunt for a vocalist after Kepler. That said, I would disagree with you that they both didn’t have considerable screen time - they weren’t main characters of the show like Hanbin and Hao, but for every group they were in, they were almost always a big focus of said group - Ricky especially in Back Door and Rush Hour, and Taerae had a story/was featured for Man in Love, and Switch. So yeah, I guess not ‘considerable’, but very large compared to many trainees. I don’t have much to say about your other stuff - would generally agree, it’s just stuff that I neglected to mention 😳🫢🫣 tbh the research quality of this video is mediocre, I did NOT expect it to be seen by so many people. But thanks for your additions!
@@dragonintheorb yes I was referring to his Chinese fanbase during the actual show! The show wasn't big at all there, so the following for the trainees in general were very weak and the trainees that got attention were the yuehuaz especially yujin > hao > ricky. His current c-fanbase is huge for a rookie group thanks to the exposure he got after winning the show as a Chinese. Ah I failed to mention this, ofc compared to other trainees they did have screentime but i was comparing them to other zb1 members who had favourable edits on the show, so I'd say it is not considerable in that regard. Also ofc the video is already long as it is, you cant cover everything. But you've worked on hard this! I enjoyed hearing your thoughts about it.
I see, thanks for the clarification on everything. Yes Hao winning definitely would have had a MASSIVE impact in China. Well, I mean, it could well have been longer - I don’t shy away from long videos as you may be able to see. But I’m glad you enjoyed it anyway 😊
1:48:08 there is more stuff besides just the heterophobic thing that proves he's actually gay but it's been hidden by fans who want to protect him in the still very conservative countries of korea and china. so there's that too, like big fans interested in his past will soon find many... interesting posts he made predebut
1:55:08 zeroses still have a huge akgae problem to the point we like to joke about us not getting into fanwars with other groups because we're too busy fighting amongst ourselves. the most notorious pair are, of course, rosins vs allindans (or hao/hanbin fans). the constant back and forth any time anything remotely scandal-able comes up is both hilarious a depressing. rosins accused hanbin of "forcing hao to carry him" during a part of the sweat choreo, and having "malicious intent", when you can see that he never leans his full body on to him. I've blocked so many akgaes but they still find their way to me anyway. this fandom is SO divided and fights about favouritism, erasure, line distribution and the like consistently plague it. once you find your way into akgae arguments you can never back out lmao
1:59:46 Matthew is insanely popular in Japan lol, and since their Japan debut Ricky has been gaining attention (120k likes on jp twt within a day or two)
37:11 I feel like he has said even more insane stuff than just 'boogers' (and you can tell from my username just who I focus on lmao) but especially with Ricky he goes off the rails. prime example one: proudly announcing on bubble that he smothered ricky saying "I love you" until Ricky said it back, announcing they now have a two-way love and then sending a photo of Ricky's ass prime example two: offering Ricky an ice cream, and after Ricky took a bite, saying "because it has his saliva on it, it's more delicious". prime example three: his absolute obsession with spanking people - and especially Ricky, with it happening many times *during performances* I find it fascinating that when zb1 had just formed everyone touted Ricky as somewhat gay because of his 'obsession' with jiwoong, before quickly discovering that gyuvin and Ricky had an insanely close bond before BP that was just never shown. they've said that they would have never survived training without each other, and Ricky answered a fan question about their relationship by saying "we're like boyfriends to each other", quickly adding that he didn't want to be mistaken, and then going on to write 'soulmates' as his final answer. and then, of course, the wedding rings. gyuvin, in typical gyuvin fashion, gave Ricky a cheap little toy ring as a birthday gift (and that's not a drag, they're clearly very close friends), and then Ricky gave gyuvin a Gucci ring in return for his birthday, as well as saying that he's "the only one who can give gyuvin happy memories". gyuvin then showed the ring on a live and said he thinks Ricky gave it to him to ask him to marry him (very confusing string of pronouns, sorry). in fact, one of Gyuvin's nicknames for Ricky is "Kim Ricky", and he explicitly said in a fansign that it's his name and Ricky's put together. tldr: I've exposed myself as a huge shimkongz fan, but also this group is just so gay once you get into them. in fact, there's even more 😭
continuing off my previous (ridiculously long) comment, there's a ship for literally everyone in this group, and I find it impressive how affectionate and open the members are to joking about actually dating. Matthew has now gathered what I affectionately call his harem of jiwoong, gunwook and taerae. jiwoong is obviously a carry over from BP and infact ppusamz (their chemi name) fans had been suffering a drought of content until recently because of mattparkz and bbangiz, the two new Matthew ships on the block gunwook and Matthew have, as you probably know, shown a LOT of physical affection with each other. I vividly remember that one live where yujin read out a comment asking if they (gw and mt) were dating, and their response was to cuddle into each other. (and then hanbin joked about him and jw being involved, who then 'cheated' on him with taerae). in a very recent post, gunwook also just. made out with matthew's standee, like mouth on mouth. bbangiz (Matthew and taerae) don't get off scott free though. Matthew has enough love for everyone and that includes the several almost-kisses he has with taerae. and hell, maybe he has, because in the 'of course' game they played, his first question to taerae was, and I quote, "you know how my lips taste, right?", which is pretty insane to me. zb1 is a certified gay as hell group, gay past, gay present, and probably gay future. queer fans have also mentioned their own identities to them and the boys who they talked to were all very supportive. I genuinely don't think there's a more insanely queer group out there, and yes I'm including onlyoneof
As a gw fan i think its definitely worth watching wild idol or at least his cuts from it bc it really contexualizes why he came roaring into bp the way he did 😂. my favorite aspect of wild idol was that it was much more forgiving and even encouraging of competitive behavior, confrontation, and honest displays of negative/complicated emotion than your typical mnet fare where you're rewarded for putting on a veneer of docile, self-effacing humility 24/7.
Also he wasnt exactly criticized for lacking confidence through the whole show. Thats a misunderstanding from people who didnt watch it. Despite being the youngest person who made it past ep 3, he was always good at (respectfully) speaking up against older contestants when needed, which i always liked about him since i know how ingrained the age hierarchy is over there. he also performed really well in the musical challenges which required quick thinking, technical skill, and yes, confidence. they learned and practiced choreos with no mirrors, sang/rapped live ten feet away from their judges, and presented self-written lyrics and performances they had less than a day (and sometimes just 30 minutes) to come up with. He was certainly a bit meeker back then, but he was also younger and less experienced (and since he looked relatively younger people treated him as such 😢 but that's another topic).
this is all to say, he came into bp with a wild idol mindset, which explains why producers were drawn to him (his character was different from everyone else and he was willing to put on a show), why some viewers were intimidated and even put off by him (the hate train in korea was real bad), and also why others got what he was about and loved him for it (if you're familiar with j-fan tastes, then you'll know why they in particular liked his intense ass 😂 the gap moe cuteness that came later and won everyone else over was just a nice surprise for them).
Omg I didn’t consider gap moe good point! Yeah tbh I think it’s pretty obvious I didn’t watch the show. I kind of want to, but I’ve never got around to it - other than a few Gunwook clips. This is mostly the impression I get from others online - I saw a lot of his Wild Idol fans complain that they thought he had a personality change - they were upset that he came off so strong when he’d been, supposedly, more timid and cute on Wild Idol. A few of them were even hating on him for it 🙁 God forbid a guy uses his experiences to become a stronger and better person! 😂
@@dragonintheorb parts of the show are boring, i mean all the physical challenges are gimmicky and needlessly rough, but it definitely feels more raw than your average idol survival, so it depends on your tastes whether its worth bothering with. after all, the group that came from it just disbanded :(. lots of very talented and driven contestants were on it, and the average age being older meant for a more talented and experienced average contestant. Did you happen to come across that unhinged reddit rant about his 'personality change'? LOL idk why that shows up so prominitely in his search. Anyway, if a person managed to watch the entirity of wild idol and come away from it thinking he is just a cute, shy, unconfident maknae all sunshine, well, I question their media literacy is all i can say 🤔 bc thats waaayyy underselling him as a person. even at 16 he had so much drive to both prove and improve himself, hes never had to make sweet maknae his whole personality ykwim 😅 (although he is that too)
Haha yes I am talking about that. I found it bizarre too, even though I didn’t watch Wild Idol. As people in the comments pointed out - people tend to be quite different at 16 and 18, and even IF you did get the idea that his whole personality on Wild Idol was cute baby maknae, those aspects still showed on Boy’s Planet?!?!? He was definitely the cute maknae of Tomboy and En Garde, and to a lesser extent Jelly Pop. Those aspects were definitely still there, he just went in with, as you said, a Wild Idol, or stronger mindset. Lol. That rant was so unhinged, and I’m sure other people agree with it - but thankfully most people disagreed.
I love this analysis! ❤ As a fellow gunwook's one picker, I remember being on cloud 9 when he ranked 5. I was at my internship site when the final live was broadcasted, told my sister at home to make sure to watch the show for me & vote for him. I screamed a little whe i got her text saying he made it into the group and excused myself to the restroom to do my happy dance 😭 I watched the show for Gunwook but gradually fell in love with all zerobaseone members. Cherishing their precious remaining time tgt becomes my mission now 💙
Cloud 9 is definitely how I’d describe it! I get remnants of that feeling to this day whenever I see him smile… I was and am still way too invested in his career. 😅
I say it in my head as ‘gon pan dan’, and I looked it up later and I think what I was thinking is right, just a very Australian accent to give to a Korean word.
Your reaction on gunwook was mine for ricky like i thought our only chance was 9th place so when he was 4th i literally froze im so happy all that months of voting payed off
Yeah I was also surprised for Ricky - but he did have a super strong image and has risen/been top 9 previously so I guess we should have seen it coming.
This is such a great vid!! I’ve only recently started to get into boy groups, zb1 being one of them, but I was wondering if you had watched iland-2 and if you did, what were your thoughts on it
Thank you for your comment! Yes I did watch I Land 2 and I will probably make a video about it after my videos on Girls Planet. I thought it was mega rigged and manipulative (even more than GP and BP). There were definitely some interesting editing moments but mostly it was interesting how the PDs/editors had almost 100% control over the final group in the end.
30:40 He has experienced backlash mostly from kfans - His costar had to archive the photos of them together during the show and both his and Jiwoong's companies had to release notices that they would legally go after harassing posters on forums. Also not sure I would agree that Jiwoong got a significant edit after his introduction in episode 2. He didn't really get any story himself but he was a 'side' character in Matthew's arc during Love Killa and Say My Name. A lot of people even forgot that Jiwoong led Back Door K team (even though their group cheer was just his name for unexplained reasons).
Ahh thanks for this! I didn’t know about the backlash but it really doesn’t surprise me. I think the fact that I, and many other people, didn’t know about it, and the fact that Mnet were still okay advertising him that way, still says something about how odd Boy’s Planet was. And yeah, I wouldn’t say that he had a big edit after that, but he always had that enduring reputation.
I’m also not sure if it’s true, but I wouldn’t be surprised. He’s definitely knowledgeable and wise enough to do his best to manipulate the editing before it even happens. That said, I’ve never been sure how it would prevent evil editing? I guess the idea is that, if he changes his hair clips often, fans can see that the clips came from different times and were out of context - but that wouldn’t prevent evil editing, it would just help debunk it…? And a good chunk of people who watch a show blindly believe evil editing, so it may not even have worked? I suppose it’s a good preventative measure which is far better than nothing, but I think what really helped him not be evil edited was that he did everything perfectly, associated himself with popular trainees in positive ways, didn’t argue with anyone etc.
@@dragonintheorb Yes I think you're right, Hao did everything perfectly to avoid it, but with how much of a perfectionist he is I think that as an extra security measure it's not bad. I imagine that all the chinese trainees must have gone with the idea that it was a possibility that it could happen to them. But i think it's a good idea use the hair clips because it prevents editors from being able to take different clips and put them together without the public noticing. After so many "produces" the fans are mostly aware of the evil edit, even those new to the format understood it quickly. In fact, there was a lot of talk about that in my medias. For example, in the first chapters there were cut reactions because you can saw members sitting and in the second they were no longer there. Even in Ricky's evil edit you could see clips where a member had a bracelet and then didn't have it and then it appeared again, it was dismissed so quickly! I don't know if it was a peculiarity of my social media, but in general I didn't see much discussion about the evil edits, in general they cleared up pretty quickly
Yeah an extra security measure is definitely good. It really depends on where you are, as far as evil edits are concerned. I’ve noticed a lot of people on K-pop Discords, tiktok and such seem to fall for it with very little critical thinking - but a lot of those people are also VERY young and new to survival shows. Reddit and Twitter seem to have a mix of people who do and don’t use critical thinking. But even though we see a lot of people online criticising Mnet, I think the fact that people’s ranks go down after evil editing shows that a good number ir even majority of people must believe it - for instance, Cai Bing’s rank dropping after her evil edit, and the same with Matthew. I think Ricky’s rank also dropped but I don’t quite remember.
ok i have to disagree on your point about matthew getting a boost due to being a korean in g group. i'm not sure if you're aware, but homeland koreans quite dislike overseas koreans. they don't see them as korean at all and view them as too whitewashed, and other overseas korean idols have had the same issue such as anton from riize. even now most ot8 kzeroses are specifically antis of matthew and make rude comments on his accent, his body, and his lack of knowledge of certain things due to growing up in canada. directly to his face on his lives. so i really don't think being ethnically korean gave him any points with korean viewers.
I see your point and several people have said this, and it’s definitely true - however, I don’t think it erases his ‘Korean privilege’ as such. Matthew was still very highly ranked in Korea, which is part of my evidence for why Korean fans must have liked him - and they tend to like Korean trainees more than international ones. I get the impression that the hierarchy for them goes Korean > Korean diaspora + Japanese people > Chinese people > SEA + others. So I think that he would have been in a worse position than Korean born trainees, but in a better position than, for instance, Jay, or the Vietnamese/Thai trainees. At the end of the day, I’ll stick with what I said about the whole situation kind of sucking for Matthew since he’s invalidated from both sides. I hope that helps clarify my opinion. I would be curious if you know of any prominent anti-Matthew OT8 accounts and could share @s? You may see from my channel history that I’m very interested in OT8s lol.
@dragonintheorb if i remembered usernames i'd give you some but unfortunately they tend to fill me with autistic rage due to him being my ult of ults so i tend to block them on sight 😭😭 i also forgot to mention that one of the biggest factors of matthew doing so well was due to yaebin's promotion of him on tiktok and instagram. she was already an influencer with enough following to secure sponsorships and brand deals so she had quite a platform to introduce to the show and to matthew despite her audience and content not being particularly kpop related, and most seokryus now credit her for being one of the biggest reasons he even debuted. we worked hard but yaeby worked 10 times harder and it really paid off in the end.
Haha that’s okay! I understand the rage. I’ve just been reaching out feelers because I think ZB1 OT8s are much harder to find and are much less centralised than Kepler OT8s. And yes, definitely agree about Yaeby. I’m not sure if I’d credit her with his debut/a big reason of his debut, because a lot of people didn’t know she existed since she was pretty separate from the show, and she wouldn’t have influenced those people, but she definitely worked hard and would have had some kind of impact.
You also need to know another reason why Gunwook made it into the lineup is because he was under, Jellyfish and if you don't know that's MNET FAVORITE COMPANY, MNET HAS FAVE LABELS and reason why Jellyfish is their, number 1 fave is because MNET and Jellyfish worked together in kpop industry, shared profits, PROMOTIONS, budget etc... until they cut off their ties in 2019 but that partnership and friendship still exist between them, even if they are no longer working togehter so that's why if you see Jellyfish trainee female, or male in this show's competing ALWAYS EXPECT 1 OR 2 to make it into the group it always happens even if they are lacking, this only did not happen in Produce X 101 with Kim Minkyu he was mostly popular because of his, visuals and lacked in skills cause he was more of the actor you should, check his fancam perfomance of NCT U- 7TH SENSE like he constantly kept looking at the camera wide open wide, eyes as he looked like he is threatened by someone it became a meme and it was pretty funny but over time he did improved and in finals he ranked 12th, he was only 1 spot of making to X1 but he was competing with Lee Eunsang from Brand New Music for 11 and final spot and MNET knew if he would made it in the lineup instaed of Eunsang fans would see there was some rigging with the votes so they purposely let him not make it BUT HE COULD HAVE, but they played it safe so they would not get caught but at the end of the day guess what THEY WERE EXPOSED AND CAUGHT EITHER WAY WITH RIGGING. So yeah don't let this think that i don't like my POOKIE BEAR GUNWOOK that's my boi i followed since Wild Idol and he had talent and everything deserving for the group.
Uh… you seem to have some leftover anti-Minkyu resentment? I mean, it’s no secret that Mnet like Jellyfish and their trainees, and it is true that they’ve picked a few to promote each season - in Kepler Dayeon and in ZB1 Gunwook who was also directly related to Dayeon by himself and producers. It’s unfortunately just the way these shows are run, and I don’t think either Dayeon or Gunwook would have got in without the editing, but they also both showed themselves to be talented.
@dragonintheorb don't think i hate Minkyu or something i just brought Minkyu cause PD X 101 is the only show where Jellyfish trainee did not make it final lineup but of course he could definetly
I didn’t say hate, I said resentment. I don’t think you hate him either. I mean, to me it seemed odd that the bulk of your comment was about Minkyu, and about Jellyfish, which was pretty much entirely unrelated to my video. The fact that it was all one sentence and had parts in caps came off as ranting, which adds to that impression.
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thanks for your work on this video! a couple of notes:
- the zh in zhang hao is pronounced like a hard j.
- 30:21 zhang hao also got to do two mnet performances, one for tomboy and one for over me.
- can't find the time stamp again but you mentioned a couple of times that gyuvin has no filter. i don't think this is necessarily true. gyuvin is very entertaining on variety shows for sure but he also consistently demonstrates that he has extremely high emotional intelligence and his responses to both fan and interview questions are always extremely thoughtful.
- 1:02:23 i don't think gunwook started the dance club! i think he was the first boy to join, though. for his "rock festival" vlog he went back to his old school and mentioned that he was part of the 2nd generation of the group and now they're on the 7th.
- 1:12:42 it's before this but in the matthew block. i get what you're saying about matthew being ethnically korean and therefore not global in the same sense as chinese or japanese trainees who have no connection to korean culture at all, but i think this is a very, like, western perspective. if you talk to anyone who is part of the korean diaspora, they'll tell you that koreans born and raised in korea see and treat them as different. i'm not saying being ethnically korean didn't help him at all, but it's not the equivalent of being korean from korea. being korean-candadian was still overall a disadvantage.
- 1:47:54 i'd like to push back on the idea that there's ever a girl group dominated market. despite the relative success of groups like new jeans and aespa at the end of 4th gen, boy groups still greatly outsell girl groups and outperform in most other metrics, as well.
- 1:54:47 hoo boy no, solo stans and antis are a massive problem for this group, especially on twitter. the problem with survival show groups is that after debut people still tend to hang on to their one pick mindset, which has definitely been the case for zb1. zb1 fans are constantly mass emailing wakeone, mass trending tags, sending protest trucks, and more over perceived slights to their favorite members, circulating spreadsheets comparing each members' solo promotional activities, etc. the toxicity did not end with the show.
- 2:00:00 takuto actually didn't get eliminated early at all, he got eliminated in the second to last round! he was in supercharger!
Aw no way! I’ve been criticised for pronunciation before so I even looked up ZH’s… still managed to get it wrong 😭 thanks for being nice about it though.
I’m also sure Gyuvin has incredibly high emotional intelligence - that’s one of the reasons he has so many friends and fans. He’s very in control of his filter, but when he decides to turn it off it is GONE 😂 and he’s definitely a big sweetie.
Definitely hate about Matthew - I’ve mentioned in other comments but he kind of can’t win - he’s not ‘properly’ Korean and he’s not ‘properly’ international… his being ethnically Korean would have benefitted him more than other international trainees, but not as much as other Korean trainees. I think he was decently high on Korean one picks which probably had at least a bit to do with being ethnically Korean.
Yes boy groups do outsell and often put perform girl groups, but I would point to things like lots of girl groups winning daesangs and going viral internationally in 2022-2023 as an indication that girl groups were, not so much ‘dominant’ as ‘more prominent’ at that time. But yeah they’ve never consistently outsold bgs.
Solo stans and fandom drama are an issue for ZB1, but you’ve got to remember that I am coming into this from a Kepler perspective, and compared to them, ZB1 is nothing imo. It’s mostly contained to Twitter which is nice for those like me who don’t use Twitter. I’ve also talked about the same factors in survival show groups you mentioned - in episode 3 ☺️
With Takuto, I don’t mean that he was eliminated early as such, more so that no ‘dozens’ made it to the finale.
I hope this clarifies some things. Thanks for your polite corrections and thanks for watching!
@@dragonintheorb Sure, thanks for the clarification. I would say the anti/solo stan issue is really not contained to Twitter, though. It's out there in real life with people constantly physically contacting Wakeone, sending protest trucks against specific members (Jiwoong and Hanbin, for example), antis sending them hate/threats (several members, notably Hanbin, have responded publicly to some of the messages they've received), major fanbases boycotting album sales, etc. It may not be as bad as what Kep1er is experiencing, girl groups always have it worse in that regard, but it's just not true to say it's not bad or doesn't exist.
That’s true - I don’t mean to dismiss it. I mean, like you said, people tried to get Jiwoong kicked out. But I will stand by my opinion that it’s nowhere near as bad as Kepler and I don’t think it will have a big effect on ZB1’s sales- and since most people seem to compare it to Kepler, it seems much better since, well, it is better compared to Kepler.
@@dragonintheorb Again, I'm not disagreeing that Kep1er have it worse. Of course they do, because girl groups have to deal with regular fan BS and also the added layer of misogyny. But that's not what you were saying in the video. You weren't saying "there's still fan conflict but it's not as bad as Kep1er." What you said in the video was "the toxicity just died" after debut. That's what I take issue with because it's not true. Pretending like, since it's not as bad as Kep1er, there must not be any issues at all, isn't helpful to ZB1.
Ah I see. I didn’t realise that’s what you meant. Although I didn’t say it in the video, I was thinking about it in relation to Kepler - and compared to Kepler I WOULD say ZB1’s toxicity ‘died’. It was hyperbole and I thought that was obvious 😅 I’ve been told it’s hard for people to understand my exaggerations with my tone of voice. As far as the internal fandom - I believe I mentioned in this video (or maybe it was one of the Kepler ones) that I am certain large pockets of ZB1 toxicity exist, but that I personally haven’t been exposed to them - hence I wasn’t able to make a judgement on the nature/main points of that toxicity. At the end of the day I think it’s relatively easy to avoid ZB1 drama - or at least, it is for me on the English-speaking internet, as opposed to when BP finished airing - hence my exaggeration of ‘died’. I hope that helps clarify.
boys planet was truly a ‘you had to be there’ experience. i miss that era a lot,, but i do adore zb1
zb1's lineup is perfect as it is. we don't need anyone else besides the ones that made it 💙
That’s true, and thankfully most Zeroses agree, but it can still be fun to speculate. The only person I would genuinely remove if I had the opportunity is Yujin - for his own mental health and safety. I’m incredibly opposed to minors on survival shows in particular.
@@dragonintheorb yuehua would've made him debut in evnne anyway:( i'm glad he's in zb1 surrounded by the ppl he loves and take care of him, ofc his mental health is important but i can tell he's genuinely happy
I feel so bad about how people treat matthew regarding being a korean who was born and raised in Canada. People don't count him in as foreigner bcs he is ethnically korean but at the same time koreans don't fully consider him as korean becase he's not fluent in korean and knows a little less about korea.
Well officially, as a group, the consider matthew as a foreigner which we call the globalz.
And the most annoying part is, even tho it was cleared in this video that it wasn't matthew's fault, but the hate he got from it was really so unnecessary.
Also about matthew's rank, Seokryudan (matthew's fans), especially japanese fans of matthew, flew their way to korea to increase matthew's korean votes. Matthew fans may not be that massive but WE ARE DEDICATED ABOUT HIM. we do not play about matthew and we will protect him at all cost.
Yes it’s a big shame because he can’t win, as you said - he’s not really considered global and he’s not really considered Korean. But at the end of the day he’s succeeding in life, and that makes me happy.
I didn’t know people flew to Korea to get him more Korean votes, but I’m not too surprised. Survival shows do that to people. In the end he debuted so I hope it was worth it 🎉
i really love how you touch on the queer aspects of the group because i think that zerobaseone wouldn’t have been the group it is, nor nearly as popular, without its integration with queer culture. i had actually been wanting to do my own research on the topic since boys planet concluded, because i think (at least, to me) it reads off as a stepping stone towards the celebration of queer identity in mainstream kpop.
it would’ve been also very beneficial to contextualize zerobaseone’s queer-associated image with boys planet, particularly with the inherent queer nature of program as i believe that also contributed greatly to the group’s largely queer following. you mentioned how mnet leaned into jiwoong’s BL background, as well as repeatedly putting the spotlight on hanbin’s background with the historically-queer dance style of waacking, but i feel that there are also many queer aspects of the show which need to be mentioned: for instance, the constant discussions about men falling for other men is very notable. we most evidently see it surrounding jiwoong, with seowon’s alleged crush on him and bak doha even saying “i might actually fall for a man”. now, i can’t determine whether those comments and jokes were poking fun at the possibility of being gay or making fun of it, but the frequency of those comments are definitely much more notable in boys planet in comparison to produce 101 s2 and produce x 101, especially as they’re more direct references to the idea of being gay.
furthermore, a lot of the bp trainees openly exhibited queer behaviours. alongside haobin, haruto and wang zihao are another ‘ship’ born from the show. although they didn’t receive as much screentime as haobin, they still similarly read off as a romantic pair to many fans, with haruto even referring to zihao as ‘my husband’. i remember park hanbin being a huge topic regarding potentially queer trainees on my side of the internet for a variety of reasons: him allegedly saying he wasn’t interested in women, as well as his predebut dance videos (which, if you haven’t seen, are arguably more feminine and ‘provocative’(?) than zh’s dance vids). although both of those examples regard the image surrounding boys planet, as they regard pre-program and post-program content and comments, park hanbin continues to be evidence of queer influence within the image which boys planet created (or planned to create) for itself, shown in his reading battle (as in the queer slang term) with woongki in planet camp tour.
on the topic of woongki, he is what i believe to be a great example of the queer nature of boys planet. i sort of see him as a combination of jiwoong and hao, as mnet depicted him in a way which emphasized his queer behaviours (for instance, the abundance of screentime during the 3rd mission dedicated to him calling other trainees attractive and even claiming ownership of them in a romantic context) whilst also becoming a ‘face of the show’ through an emphatically feminine image, through his iconic viral dance battle and, what i would argue enshrined him as a face of the show, planet camp tour which he hosted with seowon, another notoriously feminine trainee.
i also want to clarify this isn’t to say that any feminine trainee is queer, and i heavily disagree with that stereotype as well. i will say that boys planet had an abundance of femininely-expressing trainees (note: i’m using the term feminine very loosely here), which is also what i believe draws a largely queer fanbase. my point here is that what i think makes boys planet, and inherently zerobaseone, “weird” is that the program didn’t shy away from its queer influences and queer-influenced trainees, and in fact, leaned into them to further promote the show. whether it was a deliberate move to attract the largely queer demographic of kpop fans or to simply display the program’s nuance, there’s no denying that mnet’s display of the queer undertones within boys planet and zerobaseone’s images are deliberate.
(sorry to ramble, i just find it really interesting that the current queerly-perceived image of zerobaseone could also be a direct result of boys planet’s imagery itself, making the queer fanbase of boys planet naturally transfer to zerobaseone)
Well said! Yes it’s definitely partially a result of Boys Planet and how it was run/portrayed. Unfortunately, since this video was about ZB1, not Boys Planet, I wasn’t able to discuss other trainees like Haruto and Woongki - but in the somewhat distant future I do intend to discuss the editing and production of the show, which is where I will be able to discuss those trainees in more depth.
someone cooked here
Love this analysis. But you didn’t do ma boi gyuvin justice. He is talented and super sweet. Zb1 wouldn’t be the same without him.
I’m sorry 😞 I know the least about him out of all of the members. He’s a great variety personality and I think he fills a great role in the group where he can do anything he wants. I think he’ll have a great career after ZB1. He’s also a big grower (as in he’s grown on me a lot). As I said I think he’s also THE representation of ZB1’s weirdness.
I’m convinced that Gyuvin stans make the world go round.
@@dragonintheorb gyuvin is super sweet and healing for fans too. And I totally see your point. Was just joking. Hope you make more videos about them🫶🏼
Don’t worry I’m sure I will 🥰👍
ZB1 is such a immersive group, I don't know how to phrase it differently. Once you get into the group, they have this certain allure to them which makes you curious to know more about them. Their personalities, their togetherness and functionality as a group, everything is so harmonic. Even the members individually have this air and talent about them and each of them have an interesting backstory which brought them where they are. And of course their music holds so much depth in it and versatility. They are incredible
I really appreciate your honest analysis and as a Gunwook one pick I agree a lot with your notions about him. There's something so insanely eager about him, and you can really tell he aims to be recognized and praised and thrives off of it; it's super endearing to see. In a more broad context, I feel like a lot (not all of course, but a sizable amount) of idols that debuted in 4th gen were ill-equipped to be an idol (skill wise or knowledge wise) or were becoming idols for more vain motivations (the recognition, power, money vs. wanting to be an idol for the performance aspect or for fans). Gunwook is refreshing in the sense that he takes being an idol seriously, is mastering his craft, and you can just tell he isn't in it for the vain aspects of idolhood but for the performance aspect of it. I've written essays about his uniqueness and I probably will for years to come. I don't think I've ever adored an idol as much as him and would love to discuss more about him with you because his perspective and skillset fascinates me. He probably has the most potential I've ever seen in kpop and I've been into kpop for nearly a decade.
If I had to respectfully critique this video I would say delving more into Taerae would be super beneficial when it comes to the queer aspect and highlighting that attribute of ZB1. Planet Camp Tour, for example, was the start of showcasing him in a non-basic light outside of being a solid vocalist. Post-debut, he's the most flamboyant member of ZB1 and probably one of the most in all of kpop. I genuinely think his representation, with Hao and Hanbin of course, is one of the biggest impact ZB1 has: normalizing 'stereotypical' queer mannerisms, jokes, and proximity. Making gay jokes, calling each other 'diva', a term used almost exclusively in the Korean LGBTQ+ scene and all Koreans know that, showcasing tender love toward one another and flirting with one another at a rate far higher than all other kpop groups, walking around with "limp wrists', etc., is creating a huge wave of acceptance towards differences in the industry and among the greater kpop fanbase. Their representation of being unabashedly themselves and not fully conforming, and embracing their pasts (such as Jiwoong openly discussing his BLs) means a lot. There are also already newer male rookies discussing Hanbin's waacking skills and so many other idol professionals discussing his skills, which inherently means they are interacting with a dance style enriched in queer culture. As a felow member of the queer community, it's so beautiful to see the slow start of normalization occur.
Regarding the future of ZB1, I have no doubt they'll always have a high level of success. I don't think WakeOne is being smart with the strategic choices of title tracks, and I'm not sure if they'll win as many awards this time around during the award season, but they'll always be solid. I go back and forth whether or not I want them to renew after 2.5 years or go their separate ways, but I'm sure all members will at least reach a mild level of success for the rest of their careers. I could talk endlessly about the pros and cons of how WakeOne is managing them, but that's another discussion that would take a long time to flesh out but if you are interested in my yapping I'd love to share.
Thank you for making this! It was a great watch and listen.
Yeah I definitely agree with you about Gunwook! He has the determination and skill to succeed, and he seems to have a wonderful attitude to life and a genuine heart. I could praise him forever 🥰
I tend to pick biases and one picks by leadership skills and personality/attitude, so it’s no wonder he was such a strong one pick for me.
Thank you for your critique - you’re right, I should have talked more about how Taerae and the group as a whole have done a lot to normalise more queer-coded and feminine-coded behaviour among idols and Korean men. Please believe me when I say that I don’t take Taerae’s contributions lightly - he’s amazing. And I also agree about Hanbin - the fact that ZB1 and their members are becoming pretty well known and inspiring other trainees is so amazing.
I also have issues with ZB1’s management, but it’s far better than Kepler’s imo. I don’t think I mentioned it in this episode, but I definitely mentioned it in Minsiodes 4+5 - I really hope ZB1 are successful enough to disband and have a lasting impact on the industry.
You’re more than welcome to rant and discuss here! As you can see, I’m no stranger to discussions of excessive lengths.
Thanks for watching ☺️
I love how much you praised Gunwook and really highlighted his journey!
idk if the focus of this video was mainly Boys Planet, but I feel like shimkongz (ricky gyuvin) should've gotten a mention in the romance section. Even though the pair wasn't popular on the show, mainly bc neither of them really got much screen time or story, they shot up in popularity after debut and arguably have surpassed ppusamz (Matthew Jiwoong) in popularity. I remember at one point on twitter they won or almost won a pair popularity poll against haobin with like over 5k votes
Ooof almost winning against Haobin is pretty powerful. Yeah I did mainly focus on Boys Planet content and I don’t remember them having much there, but it is good to know for the future, thanks ☺️
I remember not being interested in bp999 but seeing Ricky on my timeline because orbits (Loona's stans btw) kept calling him Him Lip (Kim Lip but male) lmao
Well , we all love their weirdness
Tell me about it 😂😅
This video is soooo important.
ZB1 is quite an interesting group. I also think Boys Planet 999 is probably the best reality competition we got, the roster is just insane, that's why I feel like we are quite happy with the result, we got sooo many great options for this group, it was the first time I didn't feel we got 5 big personalities in the show an the rest are NPC, around 17/20 contestants are really iconic and did such a great job as being part of a piece of entertainment.
Part of the frustration for some of the guys that didn't make it disappeared with the debut of EVNNE, that is also quite an INSANE lineup, really great.
I still feel that Yujin is too young for ZB1 and is kinda awkward for me, like... WAAAAY TOO YOUNG. Yoo Seungeon fits PERFECTLY for the concept and vibe but I fear he would be kinda overlooked since the vocal line is already full between Hanbin, Hao, Tae and Matthew, he is the main vocalist of EVNNE so I think that deal was way better for him. Junhyeon would be such a chaos, amazing pick, sad he didn't make it.
I don't like to ship or speculate about Idol's sexuality but C'MON, Hanbin, Zhang Hao, Ji Woong and Matthew being so openly fruity is so important for the medium, I'm just living. MOTHER.
Thank you! MOTHER
I also think ZB1 are a fascinating group (as you can tell). They don’t do anything super different or novel, but they are more extreme and I think that’s what makes them bizarre.
I also thought BP was good - probably because of a combination of factors including X1 fans wanting another group, talented trainees, and people being prepared for the worst after Kepler (so anything we got would have been better).
My ideal lineup as I don’t think I have mentioned is in rough order; Gunwook-Zhanghao-Taerae-Hui-Hanbin-Matthew-PHanbin-Keita-Hwanhee, but what we got is great too, and Seungeon would have been amazing too. I also really liked Sunghwan and Jongwoo. At the end of the day, Yujin is too young for sure, and I feel the show has had a big impact on his psychology - but people like him and he’s a cute maknae so of course he got in.
EVNNE is deifinitely a reason people weren’t as upset.
Thanks for watching ☺️
@@dragonintheorb :3
Something I also think is really interesting about the group is their dynamics, you can see how well they interact, the familiarity, it shows a lot on interviews, reminds me of Mamamoo, Seventeen, Stray Kidz and Oh My Girl.
Jongwoo not getting in was quite a surprise for me, I was like, If Jiwoong makes it, Jongwoo goes with him. It also would fill the lack of main rapper.
But yeah, in general, quite happy with ZB1.
AS A GEONPPANGDAN I'M SO HAPPY TO SEE THIS! A lot of people have misunderstood him (includingmymomsadly) :C
Also I'm so glad to see someone who also sees themselves on him 😊
Aw thank you! What did your mum misunderstand lol? Did you watch the show together? If so, that’s cute!
Lmao I'm pretty sure Gunwook is my bias wrecker and he was my top 5 if not top 3 in Boys Planet. I kid you not I also did not witness the host still talking to Gunwook, when he was walking up. I was also confused when I found out. Like how I miss that lol, but you brought me back to that moment. I had already fully emotionally prepared myself for him not making it because I knew for a fact he would still debate and would 100% be my bias in that GROUP, But that really scared me I was so happy. Gyuvin's reaction was literally me, and then I froze. No Idea what happened after!
Haha I’m glad my experience is relatable. I’m sure at least several thousand of his fellow fans had the exact same reaction
im gubwook fans since wild idol and seeing him in BP tbat he change ang grow well makes me proud of my baby. ❤ Thank u
Very interesting video! enjoyed your opinions on this and I agree with majority of it. But here's some more info
- Mathew, gunwook and hao were the most popular trainees during the show in Japan despite not being Japanese. (Keita never was, he had a huge global fanbase tho) The reason is gap moe aka duality. They're often referred as ktl/jelly pop trio by intl fans and minasangz by jp and kr fans.
- boys planet was a flop in China and no trainee had a huge following. And the one that was the most popular among them was yujin and not hao, it was even announced in the show during elimination. Hao rose in fame and has a huge fanbase now only after winning the show.
- hao was the designated g group member of the group by literally every Korean fan since the start of the show. Every live performance he gained himself kfans, evident in the results of him winning every live voting. Also he fit their beauty standards to a T. I believe hao's success is due to huge global fanbase + Japanese fanbase + Korean fanbase and ofc Chinese fanbase although it wasnt big that time. He is loved everywhere.
- both Ricky and taerae didnt have considerable screentime in the show and only got to the group by super viral moments. Both of them were also among the trainees that got people's attention during pre show pr videos, Ricky internationally (his catchphrase) and taerae domestically (his church oppa image). Imo Ricky getting a good chuck of kfans is when he went to see the ads, a lot of people fell for his lovelicky image. And taerae had that whole man in love moment and he was fixed as the main vocal of the group by everyone.
- F4 visual group that consisted of hanbin, jiwoong, yujin and gyuvin. It was formed during pre show and these trainees were already anticipated by the people before the show even aired. These 4 were constantly considered as the important members of the group by kfans regardless of their skill level and were usually associated wth each other.
- like you said, the friendship arc greatly contributed to Mathew's screentime. If I remember correctly he was around rank 34 during pre show and rose to rank 2 during first elims. The screentime showed both his friendship with a trainee (who was anticipated by the public before the show) and his skills (his viral giiiirlll~) but Mathew also went though a huge hate during say my name because of both his storyline and his rigging controversy which had him drop to 9th rank before finale. That's just showed how his casual fans dropped him as it was a 6 or 3 pick voting system that time and his 1 pick pulled through in finale.
- gunwook was a well liked trainee, his pre show clip got viral on youtube shorts (it has like 10m+ views). But kfans had divided opinions on him and slowly it changed throughout the show. He was a trainee that had already proved how talented he is, his main thing to show off was that he was also a young, cute teenage boy. And the editing of the show favoured him ofc.
- haobin as a pair was expected to interact due to the them both being the centres of the show but mnet only capitalized on that when they became teammates in tomboy and it got even more crazy when it was confirmed that they were already friends way before by both the eliminated trainess and hanbin's mom herself lol
-after a year with zb1, the most popular ship duos (internationally) are haobin, shimkogz, pussamz and recently matwook.
- also fun fact 6/9 members were always in the top 9 throughout the show. (Excpet for Ricky, Taerae and gunwook who were also part of top 9 at some point in the show) which just shows why zb1 as a group was accepted easily.
Ahh thank you for such a detailed comment!
Yes I think I said to someone else - but for some reason gap moe didn’t even occur to me, however I would definitely agree that it was a factor. A lot of anime characters (including to a small extent canon Bakugo and to a large extent fandom Bakugo) have the gap moe appeal to, so tehnically I wasn’t wrong I guess….
I would disagree that Hao had a big fanbase only after the show - I mean, there’s a reason he ranked 1st. Unless you’re referring to his popularity in China? In which case I have no connection with/knowledge of Chinese fans so I’ll have to take your word for it 😅
Would agree with you on Hao’s success!
I would also say a big reason Taerae got in is because every single bit of screen time he got, he was praised for being a great vocalist - and people were on the hunt for a vocalist after Kepler. That said, I would disagree with you that they both didn’t have considerable screen time - they weren’t main characters of the show like Hanbin and Hao, but for every group they were in, they were almost always a big focus of said group - Ricky especially in Back Door and Rush Hour, and Taerae had a story/was featured for Man in Love, and Switch. So yeah, I guess not ‘considerable’, but very large compared to many trainees.
I don’t have much to say about your other stuff - would generally agree, it’s just stuff that I neglected to mention 😳🫢🫣 tbh the research quality of this video is mediocre, I did NOT expect it to be seen by so many people. But thanks for your additions!
@@dragonintheorb yes I was referring to his Chinese fanbase during the actual show! The show wasn't big at all there, so the following for the trainees in general were very weak and the trainees that got attention were the yuehuaz especially yujin > hao > ricky. His current c-fanbase is huge for a rookie group thanks to the exposure he got after winning the show as a Chinese.
Ah I failed to mention this, ofc compared to other trainees they did have screentime but i was comparing them to other zb1 members who had favourable edits on the show, so I'd say it is not considerable in that regard.
Also ofc the video is already long as it is, you cant cover everything. But you've worked on hard this! I enjoyed hearing your thoughts about it.
I see, thanks for the clarification on everything. Yes Hao winning definitely would have had a MASSIVE impact in China.
Well, I mean, it could well have been longer - I don’t shy away from long videos as you may be able to see. But I’m glad you enjoyed it anyway 😊
since I'm gunwook fan i was so happy watching this video thank u
1:32:05 hanbin did actually mention he was interested in and may have gone into psychology had he not become an idol lol
1:48:08 there is more stuff besides just the heterophobic thing that proves he's actually gay but it's been hidden by fans who want to protect him in the still very conservative countries of korea and china. so there's that too, like big fans interested in his past will soon find many... interesting posts he made predebut
1:55:08 zeroses still have a huge akgae problem to the point we like to joke about us not getting into fanwars with other groups because we're too busy fighting amongst ourselves.
the most notorious pair are, of course, rosins vs allindans (or hao/hanbin fans). the constant back and forth any time anything remotely scandal-able comes up is both hilarious a depressing. rosins accused hanbin of "forcing hao to carry him" during a part of the sweat choreo, and having "malicious intent", when you can see that he never leans his full body on to him. I've blocked so many akgaes but they still find their way to me anyway.
this fandom is SO divided and fights about favouritism, erasure, line distribution and the like consistently plague it. once you find your way into akgae arguments you can never back out lmao
1:59:46 Matthew is insanely popular in Japan lol, and since their Japan debut Ricky has been gaining attention (120k likes on jp twt within a day or two)
37:11 I feel like he has said even more insane stuff than just 'boogers' (and you can tell from my username just who I focus on lmao) but especially with Ricky he goes off the rails.
prime example one: proudly announcing on bubble that he smothered ricky saying "I love you" until Ricky said it back, announcing they now have a two-way love and then sending a photo of Ricky's ass
prime example two: offering Ricky an ice cream, and after Ricky took a bite, saying "because it has his saliva on it, it's more delicious".
prime example three: his absolute obsession with spanking people - and especially Ricky, with it happening many times *during performances*
I find it fascinating that when zb1 had just formed everyone touted Ricky as somewhat gay because of his 'obsession' with jiwoong, before quickly discovering that gyuvin and Ricky had an insanely close bond before BP that was just never shown. they've said that they would have never survived training without each other, and Ricky answered a fan question about their relationship by saying "we're like boyfriends to each other", quickly adding that he didn't want to be mistaken, and then going on to write 'soulmates' as his final answer.
and then, of course, the wedding rings. gyuvin, in typical gyuvin fashion, gave Ricky a cheap little toy ring as a birthday gift (and that's not a drag, they're clearly very close friends), and then Ricky gave gyuvin a Gucci ring in return for his birthday, as well as saying that he's "the only one who can give gyuvin happy memories". gyuvin then showed the ring on a live and said he thinks Ricky gave it to him to ask him to marry him (very confusing string of pronouns, sorry).
in fact, one of Gyuvin's nicknames for Ricky is "Kim Ricky", and he explicitly said in a fansign that it's his name and Ricky's put together.
tldr: I've exposed myself as a huge shimkongz fan, but also this group is just so gay once you get into them. in fact, there's even more 😭
continuing off my previous (ridiculously long) comment, there's a ship for literally everyone in this group, and I find it impressive how affectionate and open the members are to joking about actually dating.
Matthew has now gathered what I affectionately call his harem of jiwoong, gunwook and taerae.
jiwoong is obviously a carry over from BP and infact ppusamz (their chemi name) fans had been suffering a drought of content until recently because of mattparkz and bbangiz, the two new Matthew ships on the block
gunwook and Matthew have, as you probably know, shown a LOT of physical affection with each other. I vividly remember that one live where yujin read out a comment asking if they (gw and mt) were dating, and their response was to cuddle into each other. (and then hanbin joked about him and jw being involved, who then 'cheated' on him with taerae). in a very recent post, gunwook also just. made out with matthew's standee, like mouth on mouth.
bbangiz (Matthew and taerae) don't get off scott free though. Matthew has enough love for everyone and that includes the several almost-kisses he has with taerae. and hell, maybe he has, because in the 'of course' game they played, his first question to taerae was, and I quote, "you know how my lips taste, right?", which is pretty insane to me.
zb1 is a certified gay as hell group, gay past, gay present, and probably gay future. queer fans have also mentioned their own identities to them and the boys who they talked to were all very supportive. I genuinely don't think there's a more insanely queer group out there, and yes I'm including onlyoneof
As a gw fan i think its definitely worth watching wild idol or at least his cuts from it bc it really contexualizes why he came roaring into bp the way he did 😂. my favorite aspect of wild idol was that it was much more forgiving and even encouraging of competitive behavior, confrontation, and honest displays of negative/complicated emotion than your typical mnet fare where you're rewarded for putting on a veneer of docile, self-effacing humility 24/7.
Also he wasnt exactly criticized for lacking confidence through the whole show. Thats a misunderstanding from people who didnt watch it. Despite being the youngest person who made it past ep 3, he was always good at (respectfully) speaking up against older contestants when needed, which i always liked about him since i know how ingrained the age hierarchy is over there. he also performed really well in the musical challenges which required quick thinking, technical skill, and yes, confidence. they learned and practiced choreos with no mirrors, sang/rapped live ten feet away from their judges, and presented self-written lyrics and performances they had less than a day (and sometimes just 30 minutes) to come up with. He was certainly a bit meeker back then, but he was also younger and less experienced (and since he looked relatively younger people treated him as such 😢 but that's another topic).
this is all to say, he came into bp with a wild idol mindset, which explains why producers were drawn to him (his character was different from everyone else and he was willing to put on a show), why some viewers were intimidated and even put off by him (the hate train in korea was real bad), and also why others got what he was about and loved him for it (if you're familiar with j-fan tastes, then you'll know why they in particular liked his intense ass 😂 the gap moe cuteness that came later and won everyone else over was just a nice surprise for them).
Omg I didn’t consider gap moe good point!
Yeah tbh I think it’s pretty obvious I didn’t watch the show. I kind of want to, but I’ve never got around to it - other than a few Gunwook clips. This is mostly the impression I get from others online - I saw a lot of his Wild Idol fans complain that they thought he had a personality change - they were upset that he came off so strong when he’d been, supposedly, more timid and cute on Wild Idol. A few of them were even hating on him for it 🙁
God forbid a guy uses his experiences to become a stronger and better person! 😂
@@dragonintheorb parts of the show are boring, i mean all the physical challenges are gimmicky and needlessly rough, but it definitely feels more raw than your average idol survival, so it depends on your tastes whether its worth bothering with. after all, the group that came from it just disbanded :(. lots of very talented and driven contestants were on it, and the average age being older meant for a more talented and experienced average contestant.
Did you happen to come across that unhinged reddit rant about his 'personality change'? LOL idk why that shows up so prominitely in his search. Anyway, if a person managed to watch the entirity of wild idol and come away from it thinking he is just a cute, shy, unconfident maknae all sunshine, well, I question their media literacy is all i can say 🤔 bc thats waaayyy underselling him as a person. even at 16 he had so much drive to both prove and improve himself, hes never had to make sweet maknae his whole personality ykwim 😅 (although he is that too)
Haha yes I am talking about that. I found it bizarre too, even though I didn’t watch Wild Idol. As people in the comments pointed out - people tend to be quite different at 16 and 18, and even IF you did get the idea that his whole personality on Wild Idol was cute baby maknae, those aspects still showed on Boy’s Planet?!?!? He was definitely the cute maknae of Tomboy and En Garde, and to a lesser extent Jelly Pop. Those aspects were definitely still there, he just went in with, as you said, a Wild Idol, or stronger mindset. Lol. That rant was so unhinged, and I’m sure other people agree with it - but thankfully most people disagreed.
I love this analysis! ❤ As a fellow gunwook's one picker, I remember being on cloud 9 when he ranked 5. I was at my internship site when the final live was broadcasted, told my sister at home to make sure to watch the show for me & vote for him. I screamed a little whe i got her text saying he made it into the group and excused myself to the restroom to do my happy dance 😭 I watched the show for Gunwook but gradually fell in love with all zerobaseone members. Cherishing their precious remaining time tgt becomes my mission now 💙
Cloud 9 is definitely how I’d describe it! I get remnants of that feeling to this day whenever I see him smile… I was and am still way too invested in his career. 😅
59:27 i never tryed to pronounce 'geonppangdans' i always say 'gpds' short and easy😭
I say it in my head as ‘gon pan dan’, and I looked it up later and I think what I was thinking is right, just a very Australian accent to give to a Korean word.
Your reaction on gunwook was mine for ricky like i thought our only chance was 9th place so when he was 4th i literally froze im so happy all that months of voting payed off
Yeah I was also surprised for Ricky - but he did have a super strong image and has risen/been top 9 previously so I guess we should have seen it coming.
9:16 SCREAMED WHEN I SAW HIM I loved him way back from the first ep😔❤️
Relatable ☺️🎉
This is such a great vid!! I’ve only recently started to get into boy groups, zb1 being one of them, but I was wondering if you had watched iland-2 and if you did, what were your thoughts on it
Thank you for your comment!
Yes I did watch I Land 2 and I will probably make a video about it after my videos on Girls Planet. I thought it was mega rigged and manipulative (even more than GP and BP). There were definitely some interesting editing moments but mostly it was interesting how the PDs/editors had almost 100% control over the final group in the end.
30:40 He has experienced backlash mostly from kfans - His costar had to archive the photos of them together during the show and both his and Jiwoong's companies had to release notices that they would legally go after harassing posters on forums. Also not sure I would agree that Jiwoong got a significant edit after his introduction in episode 2. He didn't really get any story himself but he was a 'side' character in Matthew's arc during Love Killa and Say My Name. A lot of people even forgot that Jiwoong led Back Door K team (even though their group cheer was just his name for unexplained reasons).
Ahh thanks for this! I didn’t know about the backlash but it really doesn’t surprise me. I think the fact that I, and many other people, didn’t know about it, and the fact that Mnet were still okay advertising him that way, still says something about how odd Boy’s Planet was. And yeah, I wouldn’t say that he had a big edit after that, but he always had that enduring reputation.
I don't know if it was true or not but I loved Hao wearing cute hair clips to avoid evil editing.
I’m also not sure if it’s true, but I wouldn’t be surprised. He’s definitely knowledgeable and wise enough to do his best to manipulate the editing before it even happens.
That said, I’ve never been sure how it would prevent evil editing? I guess the idea is that, if he changes his hair clips often, fans can see that the clips came from different times and were out of context - but that wouldn’t prevent evil editing, it would just help debunk it…? And a good chunk of people who watch a show blindly believe evil editing, so it may not even have worked? I suppose it’s a good preventative measure which is far better than nothing, but I think what really helped him not be evil edited was that he did everything perfectly, associated himself with popular trainees in positive ways, didn’t argue with anyone etc.
@@dragonintheorb Yes I think you're right, Hao did everything perfectly to avoid it, but with how much of a perfectionist he is I think that as an extra security measure it's not bad.
I imagine that all the chinese trainees must have gone with the idea that it was a possibility that it could happen to them.
But i think it's a good idea use the hair clips because it prevents editors from being able to take different clips and put them together without the public noticing.
After so many "produces" the fans are mostly aware of the evil edit, even those new to the format understood it quickly.
In fact, there was a lot of talk about that in my medias.
For example, in the first chapters there were cut reactions because you can saw members sitting and in the second they were no longer there.
Even in Ricky's evil edit you could see clips where a member had a bracelet and then didn't have it and then it appeared again, it was dismissed so quickly!
I don't know if it was a peculiarity of my social media, but in general I didn't see much discussion about the evil edits, in general they cleared up pretty quickly
Yeah an extra security measure is definitely good.
It really depends on where you are, as far as evil edits are concerned. I’ve noticed a lot of people on K-pop Discords, tiktok and such seem to fall for it with very little critical thinking - but a lot of those people are also VERY young and new to survival shows. Reddit and Twitter seem to have a mix of people who do and don’t use critical thinking. But even though we see a lot of people online criticising Mnet, I think the fact that people’s ranks go down after evil editing shows that a good number ir even majority of people must believe it - for instance, Cai Bing’s rank dropping after her evil edit, and the same with Matthew. I think Ricky’s rank also dropped but I don’t quite remember.
ok i have to disagree on your point about matthew getting a boost due to being a korean in g group. i'm not sure if you're aware, but homeland koreans quite dislike overseas koreans. they don't see them as korean at all and view them as too whitewashed, and other overseas korean idols have had the same issue such as anton from riize. even now most ot8 kzeroses are specifically antis of matthew and make rude comments on his accent, his body, and his lack of knowledge of certain things due to growing up in canada. directly to his face on his lives. so i really don't think being ethnically korean gave him any points with korean viewers.
I see your point and several people have said this, and it’s definitely true - however, I don’t think it erases his ‘Korean privilege’ as such. Matthew was still very highly ranked in Korea, which is part of my evidence for why Korean fans must have liked him - and they tend to like Korean trainees more than international ones. I get the impression that the hierarchy for them goes Korean > Korean diaspora + Japanese people > Chinese people > SEA + others.
So I think that he would have been in a worse position than Korean born trainees, but in a better position than, for instance, Jay, or the Vietnamese/Thai trainees.
At the end of the day, I’ll stick with what I said about the whole situation kind of sucking for Matthew since he’s invalidated from both sides.
I hope that helps clarify my opinion.
I would be curious if you know of any prominent anti-Matthew OT8 accounts and could share @s? You may see from my channel history that I’m very interested in OT8s lol.
@dragonintheorb if i remembered usernames i'd give you some but unfortunately they tend to fill me with autistic rage due to him being my ult of ults so i tend to block them on sight 😭😭
i also forgot to mention that one of the biggest factors of matthew doing so well was due to yaebin's promotion of him on tiktok and instagram. she was already an influencer with enough following to secure sponsorships and brand deals so she had quite a platform to introduce to the show and to matthew despite her audience and content not being particularly kpop related, and most seokryus now credit her for being one of the biggest reasons he even debuted. we worked hard but yaeby worked 10 times harder and it really paid off in the end.
Haha that’s okay! I understand the rage. I’ve just been reaching out feelers because I think ZB1 OT8s are much harder to find and are much less centralised than Kepler OT8s.
And yes, definitely agree about Yaeby. I’m not sure if I’d credit her with his debut/a big reason of his debut, because a lot of people didn’t know she existed since she was pretty separate from the show, and she wouldn’t have influenced those people, but she definitely worked hard and would have had some kind of impact.
You also need to know another reason why Gunwook made it into the lineup is because he was under, Jellyfish and if you don't know that's MNET FAVORITE COMPANY, MNET HAS FAVE LABELS and reason why Jellyfish is their, number 1 fave is because MNET and Jellyfish worked together in kpop industry, shared profits, PROMOTIONS, budget etc... until they cut off their ties in 2019 but that partnership and friendship still exist between them, even if they are no longer working togehter so that's why if you see Jellyfish trainee female, or male in this show's competing ALWAYS EXPECT 1 OR 2 to make it into the group it always happens even if they are lacking, this only did not happen in Produce X 101 with Kim Minkyu he was mostly popular because of his, visuals and lacked in skills cause he was more of the actor you should, check his fancam perfomance of NCT U- 7TH SENSE like he constantly kept looking at the camera wide open wide, eyes as he looked like he is threatened by someone it became a meme and it was pretty funny but over time he did improved and in finals he ranked 12th, he was only 1 spot of making to X1 but he was competing with Lee Eunsang from Brand New Music for 11 and final spot and MNET knew if he would made it in the lineup instaed of Eunsang fans would see there was some rigging with the votes so they purposely let him not make it BUT HE COULD HAVE, but they played it safe so they would not get caught but at the end of the day guess what THEY WERE EXPOSED AND CAUGHT EITHER WAY WITH RIGGING.
So yeah don't let this think that i don't like my POOKIE BEAR GUNWOOK that's my boi i followed since Wild Idol and he had talent and everything deserving for the group.
Uh… you seem to have some leftover anti-Minkyu resentment?
I mean, it’s no secret that Mnet like Jellyfish and their trainees, and it is true that they’ve picked a few to promote each season - in Kepler Dayeon and in ZB1 Gunwook who was also directly related to Dayeon by himself and producers. It’s unfortunately just the way these shows are run, and I don’t think either Dayeon or Gunwook would have got in without the editing, but they also both showed themselves to be talented.
@dragonintheorb don't think i hate Minkyu or something i just brought Minkyu cause PD X 101 is the only show where Jellyfish trainee did not make it final lineup but of course he could definetly
I didn’t say hate, I said resentment. I don’t think you hate him either. I mean, to me it seemed odd that the bulk of your comment was about Minkyu, and about Jellyfish, which was pretty much entirely unrelated to my video. The fact that it was all one sentence and had parts in caps came off as ranting, which adds to that impression.