A university degree in IT is not primarily designed for the job market in the same way as vocational training, for instance. Instead, the degree is aimed at preparing you for research, where you need a strong foundation in skills like math, physics, and other core theoretical disciplines. This background is essential in research contexts, where a deeper understanding and ability to develop new methodologies or theories is required. For this reason, I wouldn’t agree with your video. It seems you may have misunderstood the purpose of the degree if you think that studying a science is primarily intended to prepare you for a job. Rather, the degree focuses on building a foundation for research and deeper theoretical understanding, not on immediate job readiness.
Great video, Theveloper. Looking forward to your next upload! I hit the thumbs up button on your content. Keep up the excellent work. Your perspective on the value of a computer science degree is refreshing. How do you think the rise of online coding boot camps is influencing the traditional educational pathways for aspiring software engineers?
Thanks for making the job application process less competitive for the rest of us! In today's market, it is hard to get a job and when you have a degree you have better chances. Besides, If you want to someday in your career to do anything intellectually interesting and challenging (rather than write websites with React till death) you can't get around getting a degree. And one question for the author: If you think a degree is worthless, why did you went through 4 years of one of the hardest degree programs and didn't quit? The degree is worthless, isn't it?
It really depends on your location. I had a part time job as a software engineer while studying, for which the degree was not important at all. Now that I got my degree (2 months ago) I started working at a more prestegious place, which does put a lot of emphasis on degrees. Those kinds of companies (at least here in the Netherlands) also offer (way) higher wages. So it can definitly be woth it. I will say that I learned very little during my computer science education. I was already a self taught programmer before, and really not that much new stuff was taught to me (concurrency was really the only topic that felt very new for me). So it depends on the kind of job you want to pursue, at the same time, a degree is not only for your carreer right now, even down the line, if you have some formal education, it will put you ahead of many applicants, even if it is in a completely seperate field. The thing is, lots of students seem to think that once they get their degree, that they have proven themselves to an employer. Getting a degree is really only the first step, now it is time to gain experience. So I really would not say your CS Degree is worthless, but at the same time it is definitly not worth as much as universities want you to believe.
If you are a self driven individual with a drive to create your own software, I think its worthless. If you are just a dude who wants to be a random mook at a company, I do think a college degree is super valuable to get hired by a 50 year old boomer who doesn't really know much about computer science. Some companies will certainly filter out your resume completely if you mark down that you have no formal educaiton.
I deeply hate people that put yt videos with titles like yours. If you're ambition in life is to being a front-end developer maybe ur right. But Wtf, think about, for example, the amount of linear algebra, statistics, numerical analysis that you find in AI degrees in these years. Certain concept are not easy at all, and having someone that can explain that in an easier way is useful. AI is the best examples, but degree like cybersecurity or data science are not that less.
Thanks for the feedback. I really appreciate it! This is my channel, so I share my honest thoughts, which is reflected in how this video is structured and titled. While recording, I fully expected some disagreement, and that's perfectly fine - everyone is entitled to their own opinion, right? From my experience, most of the math and physics concepts I studied at university haven't been particularly relevant to my work in developing infrastructure for cloud storage. The IT field is vast and extends far beyond just AI. For instance, I've never heard a DevOps or Cloud engineer say, "Yeah, unoriented surface integrals are really useful in my job." When it comes to AI, you don’t need to know advanced concepts to use AI models. That’s why APIs exist - to make these tools accessible. The point is, not everyone needs to understand how every layer of a model works, some just need the API to create something innovative. So yes, in my opinion, it depends on your passion and specialization. But it's not the case that linear algebra, statistics, or other math-related subjects are always necessary in IT.
@TheveloperX Don't put an AI degree under that light, there are levels and levels of applying understanding and building things. AI it's not just recognizing dog images. It's like saying "I'm a cybersecurity expert, I downloaded an antivirus", nah bro, u need a good circuit and machine code understanding.
To not mention HPC jobs, operational research jobs. Naaah man, ur title is too clickbaity or u probably never followed a decent course in your academic years
"I've had some subjects that aren't related to computer science, like math, physics, psychology..." It's called computer science. SCIENCE. Math is absolutely crucial to understand for computer scientists. If you didn't want to learn math or physics you should have just done a bootcamp course... If you just wanted to code you should have gone into software engineering. And as someone who also studied in Poland and had no truble finding a job after my uni, the reality is that the person behind this video probably jst went to a school that's low in the rankings and generally doesn't provide good education. At no good school would they ever force you to take psychology - ever
Hi Tomek, thx for feedback ! ,,Math is absolutely crucial to understand for computer scientists,, - It really depends on what you mean by "computer scientist," right? I’ve never heard a DevOps engineer say, "Yeah, unoriented surface integrals are really useful in my job." But if you’re building AI models daily or working as an embedded software engineer, then sure, the situation might be different. My point is that not everyone needs an advanced level of physics or math to be a successful software engineer. And it’s not just about "coding." Software engineering and IT as a whole encompass software design and architecture, testing, DevOps, cloud infrastructure, and countless other areas where physics isn’t a necessity.
@@TheveloperX Computer scientist is someone who does computer science, and computer science is a subfield of mathematics originating under Alan Turing. As someone studying Mathematics and Computer Science I'm glad the programming ended in the first year and we are now talking about important things like Turing Machines and Finite State Automata, and creating and proving the correctness of advanced algorithms. In fact in Australia I'm sad that they don't go further into the theoretical computer science side. I teach some one of the first year units in programming and I'm always trying to add actually important ideas outside of the realm of programming, such as advanced mathematics or theory of computation. If you wanted to learn software development or software engineering, I don't understand why you chose a theoretical computer science degree. I believe this is what @noahjoyner8232 was saying, and it's what I'm trying to reflect. This all being said I also understand that due to misconceptions, computer science is now spanning further into the engineering discipline and so your statements make more sense, but with computer science's origins beginning in mathematics, I don't see this argument holding up the nicest. There is your other argument where even if you chose something more aligned to software development or software engineering, would you have learnt what you needed in the workforce, and this is a question very dependant on your university and also your ideal job. I feel like every single CS student and engineer should know how a computer works, even if they don't use that knowledge, but should they know the internals of how to create a computer? Possibly not. There is a line and every university is different. You also said you were learning advanced mathematics for CS, I'm going to be honest I believe you're an outlier with the amount of (non-discrete) mathematics you learned for your CS degree, most universities just require a discrete mathematics unit (including at least basic set theory), which is very useful for being able to prove algorithms are correct and a necessity for a CS degree. I don't know what you learned for your degree, but I fail to believe you didn't do a proof based algorithms (data structure and algorithms) unit, which is basically the major area of study in the CS degree. In any regard, I guess you're right in asking "What do you mean by computer scientist?" It's just that I believe your ideas land closer to the software engineering side over the theoretical CS side. I do like your points about getting a job is largely based upon skill over degree (especially in US it seems like a degree is like an addiction where a degree is a necessity for any job whatsoever, irrespective of debt being taken out), however I can't comment as much as I aim my focus primarily on academia, research, and teaching, over the current job market, especially since I consider myself a mathematician doing computer science, as opposed to a software developer aiming to become a software engineer. This was long, however I hope my statements were fair.
A university degree in IT is not primarily designed for the job market in the same way as vocational training, for instance. Instead, the degree is aimed at preparing you for research, where you need a strong foundation in skills like math, physics, and other core theoretical disciplines. This background is essential in research contexts, where a deeper understanding and ability to develop new methodologies or theories is required. For this reason, I wouldn’t agree with your video. It seems you may have misunderstood the purpose of the degree if you think that studying a science is primarily intended to prepare you for a job. Rather, the degree focuses on building a foundation for research and deeper theoretical understanding, not on immediate job readiness.
Great video, Theveloper. Looking forward to your next upload! I hit the thumbs up button on your content. Keep up the excellent work. Your perspective on the value of a computer science degree is refreshing. How do you think the rise of online coding boot camps is influencing the traditional educational pathways for aspiring software engineers?
Thanks for making the job application process less competitive for the rest of us!
In today's market, it is hard to get a job and when you have a degree you have better chances.
Besides, If you want to someday in your career to do anything intellectually interesting and challenging (rather than write websites with React till death) you can't get around getting a degree.
And one question for the author: If you think a degree is worthless, why did you went through 4 years of one of the hardest degree programs and didn't quit? The degree is worthless, isn't it?
Welcome to the club.....
It really depends on your location. I had a part time job as a software engineer while studying, for which the degree was not important at all. Now that I got my degree (2 months ago) I started working at a more prestegious place, which does put a lot of emphasis on degrees.
Those kinds of companies (at least here in the Netherlands) also offer (way) higher wages. So it can definitly be woth it.
I will say that I learned very little during my computer science education. I was already a self taught programmer before, and really not that much new stuff was taught to me (concurrency was really the only topic that felt very new for me).
So it depends on the kind of job you want to pursue, at the same time, a degree is not only for your carreer right now, even down the line, if you have some formal education, it will put you ahead of many applicants, even if it is in a completely seperate field.
The thing is, lots of students seem to think that once they get their degree, that they have proven themselves to an employer. Getting a degree is really only the first step, now it is time to gain experience.
So I really would not say your CS Degree is worthless, but at the same time it is definitly not worth as much as universities want you to believe.
1/4 stayed for a degree ( CS ) in Greece and most of us it takes us 6-7+ Years to finish it
If you are a self driven individual with a drive to create your own software, I think its worthless. If you are just a dude who wants to be a random mook at a company, I do think a college degree is super valuable to get hired by a 50 year old boomer who doesn't really know much about computer science. Some companies will certainly filter out your resume completely if you mark down that you have no formal educaiton.
Agree, in some cases CS degree is useful
,,get hired by a 50 year old boomer who doesn't really know much about computer science,, 🤣
I deeply hate people that put yt videos with titles like yours.
If you're ambition in life is to being a front-end developer maybe ur right.
But Wtf, think about, for example, the amount of linear algebra, statistics, numerical analysis that you find in AI degrees in these years. Certain concept are not easy at all, and having someone that can explain that in an easier way is useful.
AI is the best examples, but degree like cybersecurity or data science are not that less.
Thanks for the feedback. I really appreciate it! This is my channel, so I share my honest thoughts, which is reflected in how this video is structured and titled. While recording, I fully expected some disagreement, and that's perfectly fine - everyone is entitled to their own opinion, right?
From my experience, most of the math and physics concepts I studied at university haven't been particularly relevant to my work in developing infrastructure for cloud storage. The IT field is vast and extends far beyond just AI. For instance, I've never heard a DevOps or Cloud engineer say, "Yeah, unoriented surface integrals are really useful in my job."
When it comes to AI, you don’t need to know advanced concepts to use AI models. That’s why APIs exist - to make these tools accessible. The point is, not everyone needs to understand how every layer of a model works, some just need the API to create something innovative. So yes, in my opinion, it depends on your passion and specialization. But it's not the case that linear algebra, statistics, or other math-related subjects are always necessary in IT.
@TheveloperX Don't put an AI degree under that light, there are levels and levels of applying understanding and building things. AI it's not just recognizing dog images.
It's like saying "I'm a cybersecurity expert, I downloaded an antivirus", nah bro, u need a good circuit and machine code understanding.
Those two are the best example of something worth of a uni degree, for the other IT things I'm more or less OK with your takes.
To not mention HPC jobs, operational research jobs.
Naaah man, ur title is too clickbaity or u probably never followed a decent course in your academic years
dad came back with milk... and brought the whole dairy!!
"I've had some subjects that aren't related to computer science, like math, physics, psychology..." It's called computer science. SCIENCE. Math is absolutely crucial to understand for computer scientists. If you didn't want to learn math or physics you should have just done a bootcamp course... If you just wanted to code you should have gone into software engineering. And as someone who also studied in Poland and had no truble finding a job after my uni, the reality is that the person behind this video probably jst went to a school that's low in the rankings and generally doesn't provide good education. At no good school would they ever force you to take psychology - ever
You're missing the point. If math is so crucial than why are there no more math heavy jobs? You literally dont need a CS degree to work for mcdonalds.
There is a disconnect between what universities want out of students and what corporations/jobs are looking for.
Hi Tomek, thx for feedback !
,,Math is absolutely crucial to understand for computer scientists,, - It really depends on what you mean by "computer scientist," right? I’ve never heard a DevOps engineer say, "Yeah, unoriented surface integrals are really useful in my job." But if you’re building AI models daily or working as an embedded software engineer, then sure, the situation might be different.
My point is that not everyone needs an advanced level of physics or math to be a successful software engineer. And it’s not just about "coding." Software engineering and IT as a whole encompass software design and architecture, testing, DevOps, cloud infrastructure, and countless other areas where physics isn’t a necessity.
@@noahjoyner8232 Ive heard this over and over again, can someone PLEASE call all the Uni's and tell them what companies actually need
@@TheveloperX Computer scientist is someone who does computer science, and computer science is a subfield of mathematics originating under Alan Turing. As someone studying Mathematics and Computer Science I'm glad the programming ended in the first year and we are now talking about important things like Turing Machines and Finite State Automata, and creating and proving the correctness of advanced algorithms. In fact in Australia I'm sad that they don't go further into the theoretical computer science side. I teach some one of the first year units in programming and I'm always trying to add actually important ideas outside of the realm of programming, such as advanced mathematics or theory of computation.
If you wanted to learn software development or software engineering, I don't understand why you chose a theoretical computer science degree. I believe this is what @noahjoyner8232 was saying, and it's what I'm trying to reflect. This all being said I also understand that due to misconceptions, computer science is now spanning further into the engineering discipline and so your statements make more sense, but with computer science's origins beginning in mathematics, I don't see this argument holding up the nicest.
There is your other argument where even if you chose something more aligned to software development or software engineering, would you have learnt what you needed in the workforce, and this is a question very dependant on your university and also your ideal job. I feel like every single CS student and engineer should know how a computer works, even if they don't use that knowledge, but should they know the internals of how to create a computer? Possibly not. There is a line and every university is different.
You also said you were learning advanced mathematics for CS, I'm going to be honest I believe you're an outlier with the amount of (non-discrete) mathematics you learned for your CS degree, most universities just require a discrete mathematics unit (including at least basic set theory), which is very useful for being able to prove algorithms are correct and a necessity for a CS degree. I don't know what you learned for your degree, but I fail to believe you didn't do a proof based algorithms (data structure and algorithms) unit, which is basically the major area of study in the CS degree.
In any regard, I guess you're right in asking "What do you mean by computer scientist?" It's just that I believe your ideas land closer to the software engineering side over the theoretical CS side. I do like your points about getting a job is largely based upon skill over degree (especially in US it seems like a degree is like an addiction where a degree is a necessity for any job whatsoever, irrespective of debt being taken out), however I can't comment as much as I aim my focus primarily on academia, research, and teaching, over the current job market, especially since I consider myself a mathematician doing computer science, as opposed to a software developer aiming to become a software engineer.
This was long, however I hope my statements were fair.
What a neighbor do when they already got 80k in debt