Traditional Pattern Knives: The Congress
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- Опубликовано: 5 ноя 2024
- The Congress knife dates back to at least the early 19th century. The knife was originally used for testing bales of cotton and tobacco in the Southern United States but gain popularity as an excellent knife for whittling.
Fascinating video. Didn't know that about Lincoln's knife.
Thanks. Glad you enjoyed it.
Congress Pattern are my favourites! Thank you, Tobias! 🤗❤️👍👋🇺🇸🇬🇧
Great history lesson! You should become a history teacher! You are very pleasend to listen to. Like a "Bob Ross". 🌷
Great video. Lots of interesting info
Thanks. Glad you enjoyed the video!
That slim Case congress has a sheepfoot main, and a spear main on the other side. The spear main was obviously used a lot more by it's original owner, due to having more wear, that wore out some of the cutting edge. Yes, many congress knives did indeed come with this blade configuration. Perhaps the most popular, highly sought after, and most valuable is the Case big congress ( I can't recall the pattern number at the moment ) that was made in it's original form from the 1920's up through the 1960's I believe. It also had the sheepfoot main and spear main. Sometime later, Case totally changed this big congress, by downsizing all of the blades to it's present form.......which is really sad. Because all 4 blades were drastically downsized, it made it easier & less costly to produce that knife. The older ones made in the 1920's in mint condition are worth around $7000, depending on the handle material used. Extremely rare to find one in mint condition these days........thus the high value.
hi Tobias, enjoyed your video! I read a story once, along time ago that Abe Lincoln was walking down the street and stopped a man and told him that he was given his congress knife and told that if he ever met a man uglier than himself he was supposed to give it to that man! and he did just that!! Lincoln was said to have had a wonderful sense of humor! also, years ago I was talking to a case rep and I was asking about multiple blades on folders, he told me that a lot of patterns had them because they were work knives and instead of stopping to sharpen them during the day workmen would just use the second blade and sharpen them when they got home. I don't know, but made sense to me at the time. at any rate, I enjoy all you videos, thanks for putting the time in to make them for us! Tom
thomas burgeson, the Case rep is 100% correct, at least when it comes to the Muskrat! This is precisely why it has two Identical clip blades.
I know in the case of the Stockman is was because the cattle hand had different tasks to work on so it was the right blade for the right chore. But obviously the right blade is often just the sharpest blade!
Funny story about Abe Lincoln. Thanks for sharing.
@@KnifeChatswithTobias I am glad to share with you! And thanks again, so many times people dont know or understand where the origins of something came from, your histories of these tools help everybody learn!!!👏👏👏👏👏🇺🇸
This video was super interesting and informative! I don’t have a Congress yet but that will change. Really loving the gorgeous bolsters and blade selection on that White Tail Lincoln, that one is my favorite of this group. I like the 5 blade Congress too with that large clip point! By the way you did a really smooth job of turning that pen into a coping blade on the 3 blade RR, looks like it was manufactured that way not a DIY. Being winter I have a lot of downtime from work and am thoroughly enjoying watching all these great vids of your extensive and amazing collection!
Glad you enjoyed the video. The six blade is by far my favorite Congress. Why that Congress Whittler didn't come with a coping blade is beyond me.
@@KnifeChatswithTobiasI now have (from EBay) a Marbles MR480 Black Stag Bone Congress Whittler. It has a nice swedged spear point, swedged pen blade and a great coping blade that by far is getting the most use of the three! It also has half stops and the pull is fantastic, a good 7 but not a nail breaker. No worries whatsoever with the blades closing on fingers but the choils allow a good grip to prevent that anyway. It’s a great whittling knife and it was ridiculously cheap! Not sure if it’s newer or older than your modded RR. It’s not on SMKW. I agree, two pen blades is a head scratcher. If you happen to run across an MR480 grab it, it won’t disappoint!
Re: camilus two blades "congress" knife. According to The Standard Knife Collector's Guide, fourth ed., By Roy Ritchie and Ron Stewart...this particular pattern knife with two blades is a "Senator" ppg. 37.
Below that illustration is a Congress pattern knife with 4 blades. They both have the same handle pattern which makes me think that because of this the tag of "Senator" is somehow being lost or forgotten.
Great videos by the way ! I really like history behind these traditional pocket knives. 😁
I've never thought of this as a Senator. But I guess it could be! It used to be the senator was swell center pen knife. These days they call that a Half Whittler some times. Thanks for the info!
I am not sure how i had missed this one for so long. Congress pattern is a favorite of mine but of all the thoughts i had heard on why its called a congress none really made sense until now. Thank you for the information.
Nice collection of knives.
Tim Vest, thanks and thanks for subscribing.
Great video. I recently bought a Congress pattern Painted Desert Rough Ryder, and I am impressed how compact the whole package is. The Brown Stag bone Congress by RR has a spear point main blade, which I like better than two sheepsfoot blades. I've seen some RR mini Congress knives, but they look like the blade length might be too small. Kind of like my Victorinox classic blade. I hardly ever use it, but carried it for decades. I use the file, and scissors more than anything else.
That was a great video and I loved the history you inserted. I had recently read about President Lincoln’s congress knife.
Glad you enjoyed it. When possible I try to give an historical context to the various traditional patterns. The Congress is especially interesting because it was knife made for the Southern Plantations yet was in the pocket of the man who abolished slavery on the day he was assassinated! Thanks for watching. I really appreciate your comments!
Love the different varieties of them
Great video!
Just this week I got my Titanium series Rough Rider congress with smooth bone scales, what a beautiful piece!! I'm also really liking that buckshot scaled congress from Colt.
Great review Tobias and really nice collection of congress knives🔪👍
Thanks you and thanks for watching. Glad you enjoyed it!
Love that classic collapse at the end! Not a pattern I collect but I do have one lol!
Now I’m interested in the “Kentucky Congress” my family might enjoy that one!
Steve H, no doubt the name “Kentucky” was added to help sell the knife but it is an interesting knife. I’ve been on the look out for a better quality version of it but haven’t found one. This is one reason why I think it is a recent pattern created by Frost.
I’d love to see a higher quality production version of the knife. I’d also love to see a pre-WWII version to find out it had been around before Frost.
I always check The SMKW “specials” everyday and what do I see not one but two congress knives. What are the odds of that?
A lot of what they carry in that pattern is Frost. Might have been a Kissing Crane and maybe a few Rough Rider
I'm pretty sure that Kissing Crane has some type of affiliation with Bud-K. That 6 blade Congress I showed was by White Tail Cutlery, a Frost company. It is a surprisingly well made knife. The stag is exceptional and it the over all build is excellent. Yes its 440 Stainless but it was a really great $20 knife. I think they moved over to their Bear and Bull or Hen& Rooster line
Amazing and very interesting video. Enjoying learning about the origin and uses of traditional pattern pocket knives.
Good Evening Tobias loved your history of the Congress family and I finally tracked down a Genuine Kentucky Congress. I would have really liked a Pride White Bone one but I managed to get a MOP Steel Warrior .The Warrior/Pride Kentuckies are identical unlike the Frost which have different blade placement within the Congress and the large Clip point a tad smaller.Thank you for letting me see this beautiful wee Gem😉
Great video! Thank you! I had not heard about the difference in naming between the slim and high. Also, you touch on it, but as a knife collector and accumulator who grew up in Illinois, I still find it interesting how this is very much a Southern knife which fits with tobacco and cotton production.
After I saw this I started looking for a Congress Then I saw Stephan Schmalhaus video on Case Congress and really had to have one Finally was able to purchase a Boker Germany…pretty but still want a Case
Cool! Good luck hunting down a Case Congress! I don't recall them making one in the last few years.
Looks like I’m in luck and so are you!
Great video on the congress knife. I do think that case sheepfoot blade was re shaped. You could also file the kick a bit on the sheepfoot blade so the point is hidden.
Travis Perry, I think you are correct about the Case. Glad you enjoyed the video. Thanks for watching and your thoughts and advice.
Great video thanks. I have a Boker Tree Brand with 4 different blades, sheep's foot, pen, coping and spey, call the Carver's Congress Whittler mage in Sloligen Germany. It would be even better if it had the wharncliff and clip point added. Also have a knife from Great Eastern Cutlery Farm & Field #62 Pocket Carver that is traditional 3 blade congress style but has a 2 inch wharncliff main blade and 2 small 1 inch carver blades that are the same. Both great pocket knives.
Tobias have you ever seen the Abe Licon pocket knife ivory handle 6 blades Shetfield blades that is looked really great !
Nice video !!!
I have only seen photos of it. It’s a fabulous knife
Enjoyed it buddy, good look at the Congress, :)
ramblers69, thanks. Glad you enjoyed it!
Interesting. Thanks!
Dang learned some cool history!
Glad you enjoyed it. Thanks for dropping by!
Thanks, interesting information. I just purchased a Marbles 4 blade congress marked "Germany." It's a high boy with eyelash nail nicks, beautiful stag covers with super fit and finish. It's heavy and 4.25 inches closed. I paid $77.00 yesterday at a gun and knife show. Looks new and never sharpened. Good deal? Know anything interesting about it? Seller claimed it is "vintage." Thanks again.
I have a 2005 case Congress with a similar blade selection . Sheep foot, a long spear or drop point ,coping blade in front and a pen on the back .
64052 . I like it so much I wanted one with round bolsters and lower blades so it's easier to carry . I have a GEC tidoute easy pocket on the way from SMKW . Can't wait to see it . Going to be my first GEC .
I have a really old and beat up Case Congress. I really need to get a new one. I wish the GECs were four blade. I'm just not sure I want to get one.
Nice video Tobias. I would love to get my hands on a good big congress knife.
vinniesdayoff, depending on what you want to pay, Queen’s #32. Jumbo Congress is on the big size (4 inches closed)
Or if you’re on a budget, Marbles has two Congress patterns. One at 3 3/4 inches and another at just over 4 inches.
The queen is in the $60-200 range
The Marbles are under $20.
Case and GEC have also made 4 inch Congress from time to time.
vinniesdayoff, depending on what you want to pay, Queen’s #32. Jumbo Congress is on the big size (4 inches closed)
Or if you’re on a budget, Marbles has two Congress patterns. One at 3 3/4 inches and another at just over 4 inches.
The queen is in the $60-200 range
The Marbles are under $20.
Case and GEC have also made 4 inch Congress from time to time.
I'm on a budget but I'm salivating at a Queen with amber stag bone handles that is for sale in the UK. Are Queen a good company Tobias?
Queen is an excellent company with a long and storied past. It recently filed bankruptcy. Hopefully, someone will pick up the name and it will carry on as a quality product. Most of their knives feature either D2 steel or a high quality 420HC that is on par with Buck.
Be VERY careful about your choice to open both blades riding on the same back spring, because the back springs were NOT heat treated & designed to do that. It is the #1 reason for broken back springs, because you are bending both ends of the same back spring at the same time, which creates far too much tension on that single back spring. Trust me. If a certain congress knife ( or other pattern that shares 2 blades on the same back spring ) happens to be equipped with half-stops ( and quite a few were ), then it is safe to open the first blade to it's half stop position, and then open the other blade, because the half-stop position relieves the tension on the back spring. If ya wanna open both blades of a congress that has cammed blade tangs, that share the same back spring, make sure you open the first blade all the way open, to relieve the spring, before opening the other blade. Dealers always opened all the blades part way simply to display all the blades. But it is wise to refrain from doing that altogether.
I’d always assumed that the Congress term was a a risqué reference to the interlocking of two pairs of ‘legs’! Or do I just have a dirty mind!
Slick Slicers, well that definitely makes the pattern seem a tad more interesting! The term does refer to the joining or coming together!
Very informative video. I never knew they were called Congress models. My grandmother gave me one back in early 70s. She bought it from Budapest, Hungary but is made by Hoffritz and marked Hoffritz on top line, Solingen on middle line and Germany on the bottom line. It has stag scales. nickel silver rounded bolsters and I assume carbon steel four blades - two sheepfoot, coping and pen. It measures about 3 5/8” closed. It recently came back into my possession after 50+ years. My cousin found it in grandma’s attic and sent it to me. Do you know anything about Hoffritz brand and how old do you think it is? I got it brand new like I said in 72-73 first time. Nowadays is still in very good condition but the blades have a dark patina. Thanks
Wow! That sounds like an amazing knife. I don't know much about hoffritz. What I do know is they were the reseller of Victorinox Swiss army Knives in the US So you will see Hoffritz on the tangs and scales of older SAKs that were sold in America. It was actually an American Retail chain located in NY from 1920-1975. I know they sold more than just Swiss Army Knives and they definitely had knives made in Solingen. I wasn't aware, the Hoffritz brand was also sold in Europe but it does make sense.
What congress does rough ryder currently have available that you would recommend?
My favorite pattern. I have heard it is one of the hardest knives to make right due to the amount of blades that share a spring. Which is the one in the back with the big cat on it? Wish you had shown it off.
I'll try and do a video on the one. It is by Marbles in their Wildlife Series. Not sure if it is still made or not. Thanks for watching!
How Long have you been Collecting "CASE" Knives ?
Interesting vid Tobias - I'm just getting into these having been recommended by Slick Slicers.
Just one question if I may: why would someone want an identical (sheep foot) blade at each end of the knife? Is it one for food and one for other things? Or for two people sharing? Or in case one gets broken/blunt? I'm intrigued...
My guess would be for when a guy went to sample cotton or tobacco he would always open a sheepfoot blade and not have to worry about getting the wrong blade. If that makes sense.
It looks like the 6 blade knife had 3 back springs, doesn’t it?
Just checked, the six blade congress, as well as the five blade "Kentucky" congress have three back springs. It does make them a little less pocket friendly.
i do not agree with the idea the congress was a tobacco knife as this pattern that was popular in areas that had little to no tobacco farming , it is a pattern that lends its self to wood and leather work
It's the history of the knife. It was how it was marketed out of England for sales in America. It proved useful in all sorts of the work including wood work and leather work simply because it has the blades that proved very useful for whittling, leather work and even rope work. It quickly proved extremely popular in the Southern Regions of the US (tobacco/cotton plantations) but not nearly as popular in the more urban areas. But I'm not arguing your point. You are quite correct. It was ideal for whittling and leather work.
@@KnifeChatswithTobias I would prefer to call it a discussion rather than and argument , I have often heard the tobacco idea in the collector community never have seen any period proof from 1800 to 1940 that it was marketed as a tobacco knife myself , but I might be wrong and would gladly except being proven wrong , Take care
@@harold42501, My comment "not arguing your point" is just a phrase. I suppose it would been more even to say, "I'm not disagreeing with you" I was going off of what I read from several sources. The history of the congress could also be more myth than fact, similar to what you see when it comes the history of the Trapper. No offense taken and hopefully I did not offend you, It was not my intention.
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That Camillus has synthetic/simulated abalone handles.......not real abalone.
I hate the congress knife pattern, they wont lay right in your pocket..