DUNE: SPICE WARS - TIER LIST | What's the Best Faction in Dune Spice Wars?
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
- Dune Spice Wars Tier List ranking House Atreides, House Harkonnen, the Smugglers and the Fremen gameplay in Dune: Spice Wars! In this video, following my Dune Spice Wars faction guide, I am evaluating and ranking the four factions currently in Dune Spice Wars (early access release version, released on Steam on April 26). I rank Atreides, Harkonnen, Smugglers and Fremen according to their faction abilities, playstyles, strengths, units and councilors. This Dune: Spice Wars tier list was tricky for me because I consider the factions fairly balanced, yet incredibly nuanced. Shiro Games have done a great job at balancing the Factions in Dune Spice Wars so far, although I argue there are a few winners and perhaps one or two weaker factions in the current meta. Thanks for watching! #DuneSpiceWars #Dune #Strategy #Gaming #Review #TierList
Contents - if you're a filthy skipper:
0:00 - Dune Spice Wars Tier List
0:35 - House Atreides
5:50 - House Harkonnen
11:50 - Smugglers
17:20 - Fremen
My tier list creation here: tiermaker.com/create/dune-spi...
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Video Information
Title: DUNE: SPICE WARS | The Ultimate Tier List - Ranking Every Faction in Dune Spice Wars
Tags: dune spice wars,dune: spice wars,dune spice wars gameplay,dune spice wars tier list,dune spice wars factions,dune spice wars review,dune spice wars fremen,dune spice wars atreides,dune spice wars harkonnen,dune spice wars smugglers,dune game,shiro games,dune strategy game,dune spice wars release,dune spice wars multiplayer,dune spice wars early access,dune spice wars reddit,tier list,dune tier list,strategy games,best faction dune spice wars,dune,4x,rts 
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I think you're a bit off with some of your Harkonnen councilor ratings. Specifically Piter De Vries. That guy is insanely powerful because he allows you to start the game with Stealth Drones. A unit that doesnt cost manpower or water. Meaning that you can expand early without having to worry about any of those resources. And the manpower you can invest into militia or harvesting crews. Another strong benefit of Piter is that your Stealth Drones dont have a supply limit anymore, meaning that they can pick up far away Hegemony / crashed ornithopters without any issues. Something noone else can do.
Wonderful points as always - also reassuring to know they’re even more powerful than I’d mentioned 😁
Ah, of course you like the Harkonnen! They always give my Freman a problem in the early game for exactly the reasons you outlined! They are so powerful early on. But you know it, the Fremen have a better military once they hit 10k hegemony so you better kill em off early!
All great points. But w the harks they are hard to figure out these little tricks on your own. I would add to the stealth drones that they are amazing for sniping enemy spice production crawlers or facilities out gathering spice (especially the fremen's little camps out near the spice with low armor and medium HP). Two little stealth probes could literally cripple unwary human opponents when we get multiplayer and for now can cripple spice for CPU players (I hear if u miss 3x payments as smugglers and the saudakaur come to collect taxes out of your arse, not sure about other factions). You could probably use them to snipe undefended villages etc. fairly easy as well, I don't think they have supply issues that bad.
@@darthruin8851 I would say the fremen always have the better military myself, just in terms of strength per unit at least.
I'm really afraid when this game gains multiplayer. It's literally going to devolve into old Saturday all day Risk games. Everyone yelling at each other while trying to destroy each other. It's going to be glorious lmao 🤣
😂😂
That's what I always loved about Risk. Everyone's in a bad mood cause they blame every other player for dragging out their loss. Also pretty low effort as far as brain power, so easy to just chill while you play
Yeah this is literally why my family no longer plays monopoly. That game turns into a blood sport in this house lol.
Wait, you’re definitely confusing the Shai hulud temple with the other fremen war temple. The shai hulud temple provides a 20% bonus all resources in the region and surrounding region, and it can be built in any region unlike the fremen war temple. Having this available from the start of the game can really jumpstart your economy if you build it in your second or third region in a key location. Otherwise, the shai hulud temple is unlocked at the bottom of the tech tree in a path that’s probably bad for rushing, so you’d likely unlock it far into the late game.
Plus, I think that advisor has a few perks that are hard to quantify. Knowing where the spice is immediately can help with aggressive expansion, especially with Stilgar. Also, even though scouting doesn’t take up too much time, it still costs time, so making it so your ornithopters can instead scout out other regions, resources, or discoveries can also be an unquantifiable jumpstart to your economy and knowledge of the game.
Good call about the temple - I did misquote the stats on it! Nice to have it early, even without the extra unlocks the tech provides.
I remain unconvinced that revealing spice a few moments before a scout can find it adds much value though.
@@JumboPixel no worries! I’m not too concerned with the tier list. I just really like that shai hulud temple, both mechanically and thematically.
@@JumboPixel Man, I think you are drastically underrating the spice reveal. I get to my third and fourth spice fields consistently faster than relying on dumb luck. I can see right away where the concentration of spice is and begin my expansion push before I even see the territories. Plus with the early temples... you basically spend the early game sitting with your CHOAM trade meter on max Solari and still have spice to trade away.
@@mithroch I think the combo with the temple is especially. Grab 2 spice fields that are close to each other and build the temple and you have more money than anyone else in the early game. Then just buy some resources from the AI and build out your mainbase (+4 armor to all is awesome) then go heavy on the military and take over the world ...
@@mithroch I agree. They're really underestimating the power in shaping early game decisions. You know where to move and settle from the jump. You'll likely be first to settle multiple spice fields and get authority bonuses to snowball expansion. Super underrated trait.
What? Shai-Hulud Temple is a massive 20% bonus to everything. Like literally every single resource you produce. It's MASSIVE. The Spice for combat power is a completely different temple.
The spice field authority is also incredibly helpful for rapid expansion and late game helps offset the Sietch alliances. The alliances can provide things like a 50% reduction to Warrior cost and recruitment time, man power boost as recruitment centers are crazy upkeep, and 3 research centers.
Smugglers late access to the Landsraad is also a positive and a negative.Landsraad standing gives you influence, helps with spice to cash conversion, and has one other bonus I can't recall. However since they start low they actually get a debuff out the gate which can hurt extremely bad depending on the timing. But 50 free votes is 50 influence that can be spent on other resolutions or on your Audit operation.
Landsraad* I can’t fathom how you could think it’s spelled „Laandstrad“.
Same, 20% production bonus which also applies to neighbouring regions is potentially the biggest economy boost in the game from a single building, lmao
I think it's important to note that Shai-Hulud Temple stacks with Spice Silos. The games I've played, I've tried to have basically support-base villages that were giving the buffs from Shai-Hulud Temple, Maintenance whatsits, Military Base (for defense; it buffs militia as well as your mobile units), and maybe Spice Silos. I'll admit that it sucks if you lose control of that region, but it does make for a really productive region cluster.
@@seanheath4492 I forgot to mention that because you are totally on target. It means that Fremen can take zones without any exploitable resources and make them in support power houses. This helps offset the fact Fremen get 3 people on spice harvesters instead of the normal 4. Well that and never having to worry about worm attacks.
@@Moochewmoo I can speak from personal experience that, while Fremen spice harvesting won't _attract_ worms, if a worm gets drawn to a battle, it'll hang around and happily eat your spice harvesters if they're close enough. Had that happen a couple of times because a village I was attacking was basically right next to one of my spice fields.
Atreides! Atreides! Atreides! 🦅
More seriously I view the peaceful annexation as more of a good defensive consolidation bonus. With limited resources you'll always been having to prioritize where to put your Frontline units so having that option in the mid-game once you define your borders against the other players during the early expansion can be useful, encouraging you to be bold and set up a sphere of influence that you can then fill out with annexation later.
Atreides needs reworks, as the enemy will just break treaties with you. The tactics to alliance with sietches are weaker than expected. Waste water to get relations and ally them to get +5 gold per sietch versus building and expand?
@@The80sWolf_ The times I have played with Atreides, I seem them to expand way more than the other factions, IDK why are you asking they lost in comparison with others... even if you never attack a neutral village, in long terms, they have more cities than the IA at insane difficulty... IDK why... to me, Atreires are the expansionist faction... opposite to Smugglers... Atreires and Fremen are expansionist
@@bso1538 I concur, especially if you go with Gurney as your advisor, you have a really good early game unit to expand hard with right from the start or Duncan who lessens the authority cost. Atreides is an expansion and then defensive focused faction that you can outlast your opponents with in the late game via the Landsratt or authority.
Peaceful anexation is great as during very early game you can scout for spice land and take it. Typically I have 2-3 lands as opening and than next 2-3 lands the one with the spice across the map with space port to get there if needed. You start making ridiculus amount of spice and money from choam trade and can also use it for trade for precious and most dangerous to you resources from other factions, like intel and influence.
Peaceful anexation is also very good because you can selectively pick up those remote locations with spice very early without conquering other lands just to get there - because this costs authority which is very limiting resource in game, especially over time when everything costs very high and entire game slows down for all factions becaue they can't afford to capture every single town. While others typically would have to shorten the path by capturing other lands on their way... Atreides in end game can just peacefully capture something on the opposite side of the map.
Peaceful anexation is exceptionally good if properly used. Seize by force everything within units reach and selectively most lucrative land across entire map via peaceful anexation. You can have instead of defined borders 2-4 locations all over the place which allows you then to further expand in any of these locations if needed, and instead of connecting them by land just connect them by space ports.
@@michup86 Interesting concept, also you can use the pacific anexation as an attack, per example, in the late game if you are playing on a large map, the map still not whole captured by factions, if an enemy faction left the back gate open, you can pick that land and make an spaceport and take the whole army in a offensive to the enemy base or important towns of the enemy economy... interesting quote... but is not only that, in the late game when you lose towns you can reconquest them "pacificly" and the cost is halved, so... you lose one terrain, but in the same time you are getting 4 back to your control... the enemy should need to retake those agains... which makes hard to defeat an Atreides factions via elimination... you don't need to move troops around, so... you can even capture an enemy captured town that you loses 15 days ago (without them noticing it)... and take the enemy that is near it by surprise using the local advantage... I mean, the Atreides can lack on atk force like the Smugglers, but they have a great particularity...
Smuggler military is actually pretty baller, they just take a little more finesse than right-clicking a single deathball. I think their bad rep comes from the starting Scavenger, who is really made for bullying militias for that sweet hegemony and resources. Sure, their tanking ability gets outpaced by other militaries, but it's really a stopgap measure in the first place, with the point of their regeneration being the sustain to go on pretty deep pillaging raids.
But aside from them? Hit and run single wreckers turn any invasion into a Vietnam-like quagmire, giving Atreides a run for their money in defensive capacity. Especially when paired with the MVP Snipers, with their huge damage, huge range *and* stealth. Free Company, Drones and Mercs give you the perfectly tanky beatsticks to throw on the frontline (not quite as tanky as, say, Atreides, but hitting pretty hard). Between costing, respectively, water, fuel cells and pure cash you can never really be resource-locked out of filling out your army, you can adapt. All the while they each bring useful quirks: Free Company can do stealth raids with Snipers and has its attack bonus just work with no need for elaborate setups (without overinvesting in stealth, like Fremen kind of do imo, I think there's some real diminishing returns in how much stuff ends up unlocking stealth for the very same units). Drones play nice with your defensive setup and are worm-immune, so they can be used to bog down enemy troops in the danger zone. The buffed mercs can be built and airdropped really, really quick - by the mid-late game that they appear, with your massive Solari generation it's really just a matter of choosing to sacrifice the next CHOAM share for a military get out of jail free card. *And* you can get a discount on your big boys through the contraband events.
Also, since their prowess is more into dishing out damage rather than tanking it, I feel it makes them get more value out of Landsraad troops and Mercs if they manage to get them.
The supply gimmick makes them really strong defensively, which is a fitting focus for a faction encouraged to play somewhat tall, cherrypicking the best provinces and blowing their authority on underworlds. They're weaker on the attack, but... they really aren't, as you've got the underworlds to debuff your enemies and provide enough passive intel to sling operations like you're Harkonnen. One problem they do have is that the Fremen military kind of does hard counter them. It's unfortunate, but as Shiro keeps adding factions perhaps they won't be a guaranteed opponent.
Really good break down of the Smugglers, which are quickly becoming my personal fave. I'll have to use their free company more next time I play them!
Amazing video really great work, please keep it up!
I like the factions the game has so far but would love to see more factions. Here are some ideas for morefactions:
5. Bene Gesserit - with a focus on spying
6. House Corrino (the Emperor) - with his sardaukar military
7. The MAFEA- with a solari and taxes focus
8. The Tupile- (former houses who have already been defeated) but come back for revenge (with whatever focus)
9. The Space Guild (trading focus)
10. The Robots- A robotic faction who has survived the Butlers Dschihad
I think you have a few things incorrect about the Fremen. You didn't mention that their spice production is never interrupted. More important, the true strength of the Fremen is the Fedakyn warriors. To succeed with the Fremen, you must focus on Hegemony for the troop attack bonus. This means that in the HQ, you need to go after buildings that help with that... go for anything that boosts your Hegemony. The Sand Killer ability is a MUST pick. If you aren't using guerilla tactics with the Fremen, you don't know how to use them. To get the sand killer bonus, your troops just have to be a short distance apart.... so when in battle, micro manage their positions and favor sending one or two of them behind front lines to attack ranged troops... but keep them a short distance apart for the extra attack bonus. Also, since using worms to travel is limited (I'm always at ZERO) , that extra 10% speed is a MUST. When your territory is getting larger and you are grouping your forces for major offensives, leaving a single Fedakyn warrior to defend a clump of your cities in case of rebellion is a MUST.... that sand killer bonus and ability to march that troop quickly around the map to fight off rebellions is priceless.... at most you may have to do a supply drop on that single unit to keep it alive long enough to win the battle. Also, the Fedakyn have great armor and HP... so supply drops make such a massive impact. 6 Fedakyn warriors will defeat an enemy hq without needing to retreat just by dropping continuous supply drops.
BTW, I beat this game on INSANE mode, max map, max worms, max storms several times now with the Fremen. I ALWAYS go for domination victory but almost every single time, I end up with a Hegemony or Political victory. I saw you attempt to defeat INSANE mode recently with the Fremen... you had that game won but you lost because you didn't launch a mass attack on the enemy HQs with the Fedakin/Supply Drop strategy
KEY TO WINNING WITH FREMEN:
1) Go for Sandkiller/10% speed and then grab the +1 Authority/faster Seitch officers
**Remember, the Fremen are all about Hegomny, Fedakyn, Seitch bonuses and Spice Production
2)Starting out, you need a strong economy to support your eventual unbeatable military. You are going to build a strong military no matter what victory type you want. In other words, your priority is spice fields, plascrete, villages with manpower production and WATER PRODUCTION (SEICH TRADING) as your primary targets. You will need at least 3 spice fields to flourish... 5 spice fields should give you victory
3) Continuing on with building a strong economy, that is your research focus early.... you want to boost your spice collectors to at least 3 man crews. There is NO point in researching military this early on because you can't afford a big enough Fedakyn army yet to make a difference (you only need a couple for the military base and some command points early on). You need to be able to field at LEAST 6 Fedakyn before you can start demolishing HQs with ease. (better to have 8 though, yea?). You only need to research Development and Spy techs to unlock the necessary HQ buildings for the bonuses I outlined
4) build 3 economic buildings in one district inside of your HQ for the Hegemony bonus (remember, your troops get attack bonus for Hegemony!). Build 2 military buildings in one district for the attack power boost... make sure you build a barracks somewhere in your HQ and a command post... it's all about troops attack power!
5) Research the tech that gives you influence based on your troop power... it's a no brainer! If you followed these 5 steps, you win the game if you have any kind of strategic ability. Added tip, don't launch attacks unless you have built a military base in a neighboring region for another 20% boost (broker record here but like I said, attack power/Hegomony, Spice
Game is over at this point. All you have to do here is have confidence and attack whoever is giving you a problem.
The PROBLEM with the Fremen is starting out. The Harkonen start off with a stronger military then you and they know it. They LOVE killing you early. The trick is to keep pillaging whatever neutral village sits between your boarders because they never attack unless your borders are touching. So keep pillaging that village with ONE sand killer boosted Fedakyn and it buys you all the time you need to establish your economy. They can't take control of a village that is always burning.
That's it... you will win 8 out of 10 times on INSANE mode doing this. Bad spawns next to the Harkonen where you get smacked around before you set-up your economy is a FAIL
Excellent points, feels almost a cheating hehe!
Did em all in my first play with the Fremen (Stilgar + Mother Ramallo), RNG was kind enough for me, it was a blast.
The second one, I went for Domination victory only, for my surprise the playthrough went even better!
What’s ur take on the donkey unit and missile turret
@@LV-sp6ci I don't use the Donkey unit... it may be useful? I just don't see the point of using command points on them, when it may mean having less Fedakyn
The missile turrets are best used in situations where you have two or more villages in range of each other. On one play through, I had 3 villages in a triangle formation so I was able to build 3 turrets all within range of each other. The enemy had no chance because they would be slammed by 3 turrets all at one time if they even tried to step foot there.
So I pulled up a saved game to look at the UNIT STATS of the Fedakyn I am using with all the boosts:
60 power
10k health
20 armor
Sandkiller bonus: +20% power +2 armor
against all odds bonus: +10% unit power +2 armor
Military base bonus: +20% power
gear drop bonus +50 health regen
Hegemony bonus: +10 power (12k Hegemony)
HQ barracks bonus: +20% health + 20% regen
HQ command post bonus: +20% attack bonus
HQ district bonus (military): +2 attack bonus
***This is my 6 man Fedakyn attack army that is currently sitting on the Harkonen HQ with continuous supply drops
This is why the Fremen RULE
@@darthruin8851 there is a tech that lets you build 2 missile turrets in a village
Great vid!
Hi there Jumbo, thanks as always for these videos, i've been following them (i learnt for you the absolute exploit that the poison + pacifism combo is) and i wanted to discuss some things with you:
1º About Atreides military: I think their sinergy is probably the best one in the game, every unit buffs each other, the healing probe is amazing... i think they are the perfect faction to turtle up and dominate trough the landsraad council. 1 village with turrents + barracks and the wardens alone gives a lot of armor and power, even more pairing them with warriors, snipers and heavy weapons guys.
2º About Harkonnen sacrifising their agents: I thought this would be an absolute waste of an agent but yesterday i went for the assassination ending and let me tell you something... when you sacrifice an agent, the operation becomes impossible to detect for the enemy. So if you kill one of your agents in the third assassination operation the enemy won't be able to do anything to avoid it (as far as i know, since it's undetectable it bypasses the 3 agents in counterespionage).
3º Harkonnen military: I kinda have the feeling that the point of having those grenadiers that hurt your units is to lower all your warriors health to 50% so they start wrecking havoc? I feel like Harkonnen units are meant to be very suicidal.
4º Smugglers units: I feel like they are good, but their drainage of supplies should be buffed a bit (since all they do is getting more powerful as the supplies of the enemy go lower).
5º I think you forgot that the smugglers have a very horrible debuff, and it's not paying taxes two times, which basically releases one of your cities by a sardaukar attack. Pair this with the chance that they attack a spice production city and you are pretty much done for. I know this is situational, but in one match i failed twice to pay the taxes with the fremen, and trust me i was glad i wasn't playing as smugglers. Failing to pay taxes twice doesn't have to mean game over, but it weights way more with the smugglers, i believe.
6º Fremen counselors: I picked Chani and let me tell you i laughed my ass off when every resolution that i knew it would pass spawned rebelions in the other 3 factions. Pair this in end game when the enemy is more or less done for and they will lower their chances to recover even more.
7º Fremen units: A lot of people laughs at the caravan but let me tell you, that thing is going to be strong in multiplayer. You can basically take your units wherever you want disregarding supplies, and if someone is trying to find them, you can make them invisible so it's perfect for a secondary strike force to hit and run tactics. And the worm allows you to run over deep desert to attack far away territories, it's just delicious.
8º Fremen bonuses: They don't need to recall harvesters from sandworms, they never get attacked.
All said, thanks for the video, i think i agree with most of it and thanks to give some love to this amazing universe that is Dune.
I disagree on 3rd Smugglers Councilor - merchants scale very well into late game. Basically 1 Merchant = 1 infiltration layer = 1% bonus. 2 Merchants will give you 2nd level infiltration and 2% each = 4 in total. And 3 merchants on 3rd Infiltartion level will give you 9% bonus. Given 15 Merchant limit you can have up to +54% Solari production, but more realistically in mid game you will have 40-45%. Thats a massive bonus and you can ramp up agent training time very quickly to 500% + have some from events and resolutions.
In my last run on insane difficulty I had up to 2k net solari under 1h of game time having just 3 spice regions. And with current state of diplomacy you can buy any stuff from other factions, including spice to pay the bribe or rob them off from influence to win the votes in council.
I second this, having 1 level of infiltration + Merchants is incredibly useful
Yea it gets insane.
There is more to faction then the initial faction bonus. The unit roster is also a big part of balance.
Harkonnens and Fremens are busted af, but I tend to think that Atreides are actually weaker than Smugglers. They are like jack of all trades but loose in every aspect to other factions. Weaker economy, weaker army, no pillages. Their strong side is supposed to be diplomacy, but the diplomacy itself is broken and can be abused by any other faction. In the end all they have is moderately decent 5k and 10k Hegemony bonuses.
I'd dispute that the Atreides army is weaker than the other factions. The overlapping defensive auras and gunner debuffs make them brutal in big fights. The smugglers are the side who have a really lacking set of units. Scavengers can't keep up with other basic troops, meaning you get pushed around early, and the supply mechanics are hard to setup for little payoff.
I disagree completely. Fremens fall off late game. And their feydakins don't make up for it. Not having atomics is also very brutal.
You're not correctly exploiting their peaceful annexation ability if you don't find that a major bonus. Many tricks can be done with that. And it lets you dual expand when you would otherwise only be able to single expand (assuming you're maxing authority to expand fast).
@@MrJimmibambo Get your feydakins fully boosted up like in one of the comments above. The stats get wild. 60 attack, 20 armor, 1000HP or so. True killers. A double or triple strength unit.
Duncan true bonus is the ability to stop raids on your villages. By making fremen like you.
I would say Atreides are a defensive faction. Their units have a lot of defense bonuses.
Similar to Harkonen being agressive and having many agressive bonuses and favoring a low hp playstyle with their drug ability.
I like the Harkonen flexibility, from gathering extra resources to military to spies to even politics. They are good at everything.
I played smugglers 2x and saw those events so rarely. Thats why you spam mercenaries with them to tank and abuse your range. I agree with them being the money boyz, but Harkonen can outproduce them in other resources aside from money.
Fremen are the only ones who can cross the desert areas and not die. I wish the fremen could make a sietch go wild and spawn a army to atack your enemies. Or be able to ambush enemies with a worm. I noticed I get a lot of hegemony with them. Authority needs a little rework, I end up with 500 always and dont know what to do with it. I dont know how to use Otherym.
I dnt agree with fremen being easy to play. I would say they are the hardest. Because they are so different.
gotta love the spice wars :))) thx for the vid
How stupidly wrong am I? Let me know! ;)
top unit list... spoiler: Infiltrator number 1... tell me, how a unit that deals 100 damage can cost just 2 pop... insane
I have a bit of a different playstyle than you - I am a rapid expansionist. I find that authority is the most important resource in the early to midgame (insane difficulty). Then if you have a lot of territory that you annexed with that authority, you can use your powerful eco to win using any victory condition you want. As a result, my ranking is fremen>smugglers>harkonnen>atreides. Harkonnen are very powerful, but I don't like that I have to devote part of my military to constantly putting down rebellions that result from using oppression ability. Fremen get bonus authority from spice fields and paying bribes. Smugglers get huge authority discounts from having lots of water and using operations.
You got some details wrong but no... overall you correctly placed Harkonen and Fremen on top
@@apechi11 Your playstyle works well on large maps but on small map... not so good. You can't expand if you are unlucky and the Harkonen HQ is 10 feet from yours. That authority is valuable on large maps... but on small maps it caps out and is a waste
Is it just me or is it comedic for there to be a tier list of only 4 things?
The Fremen's last councillor synergises naturally with the Fedeykin, effectively meaning you can have these speedy 1-dude armies who can deal with being outnumbered easily because of their natural ability to get armour and power from being outnumbered. If they're by themselves they get Sand Killers and the Fedeykin get buffs from outnumbering, PLUS the wormriding means you can terrorise and harass your enemies easily, liberate a village potentially, and then piss off back on your worms.
With the Fremen i think it would be worth to mention the Fedaykin which are the best units in the game. Especially if you have Otheym. I consistently beat 4 or 5 militia villages with a single one. They are the only faction who does multi pronged attacks very well. You can attack 3-4 villages at once.
With the fremens, you can combine bazaar with any military building in a 2 slot headquarter emplacement, to achieve +4 flat power bonus on everything.
that's what I use mine for, but now I will probably build bazaar for the tech in early game, demolish it, then get the +4 dmg if I want to go military victory, or am somehow behind and getting attacked (I'm always in the lead over the CPU now).
Will you do a tier list of all the units in game ?
Like all the units, militias, lanstrad units, mercenary, etc. If you can use it, it gets a ranking.
I agree, I made my first post before listening just to see how my opinions would match up and I think it's pretty much the same. You thought of a tier system and I thought of 1 through 4 system but eventually still got the same results.
next guide is a troop guide? xD Im in love to how versatile the fremen units are and how well the hakonnen synergise... the first mellee one do more damage the less hp they have and the ranged ones to aoe damage that also damage your units...
Freeman are number 1 to me. Their slow supply drain, lack of managing harvesters or needing fuel, worm movement and naturally stronger units make them exceptional at expanding past just 1 tile at a time. Naturally you think they don't get political power but influence builds just like everyone else and I was able to dominate and eliminate House Atriedies then used all my influence and got the dune governorship.
2nd is debatable to me but I'm going to say Atredies, because that peaceful annexation is almost busted tbh. You can which double expand. You can also annex a spot on the other side of the map you'd never be able to get too, build an air field and fly troops over and pincer the other factions. Or just take a spice field that the AI somehow just forgets 1 or 2 and leaves them neutral.
Or Harkonnen because peaceful annexation is almost busted but oppression is quite literally busted in the early game. I literally rushed a domination in like 1 hr and 6 mins of gameplay it's that busted lol
Second these points, Fremen are top tier and feel the most natural at Insane difficulty. Harkonen troops die like flies on insane early game, same for smugglers. I also feel the AI is unhinged when playing Fremen, another reason to pick them.
@@kraz007 Oh man Freman absolutely murder me on insane lol, I try really hard to get positive appeal with them...when they adjust the AI and it actually starts taking advantage of the bustedness that is the worms I'll probably never win again lol
@@Killa_Kamz On insane, I favor fast expand to three spice fields for the extra spice and authority with the Fremen. With any other faction, this becomes too extended and impossible to defend, especially against Fremen who have less suppy drain and will punish you.
Just to let you know, the harkonnen ability to sacrifice an agent to help out on missions can be invaluable to assassination missions (hurries them super fast, and makes them unstoppable basically, 3x of them to knock out an enemy).
The temple for the fremen gives adjacent regions and the one containing it gain a % resource buff
Good list and reasoning dude! What do you guys think about House Corrino?
I wish there was an updated video for this list. The thing is your ranking depends on the win condition you want. It'll be very hard for the freman to get a political win for example. TBH, unless hegemony win is disabled you're most likely to win/loss on that anywyas.
I think you might really be sleeping on all the pillaging bonuses Smugglers get. I think Harkonnen is definitely S, but you should swap Atreides and Smugglers rankings. Don't forget that constant pillaging+barracks means easy max-rank army. Smuggler units might be kinda trashy by default but the sniper hits hard in swarms and you can easily focus down enemies in the lategame. Combine how good operations can be with the raw influence generation that Smugglers can output and you're looking at a faction that's solid in every area. Nothing on Harkonnen, of course.
I disagree with Piter de Vries, i think he is amazing. In addition to the others' points, also because you can easily build 5 ornithopters up to midgame and have the map explored very early and THEN they aren't useless as with others, instead you get 5 free intel production in addition to the ability to scout enemy movement. Also probes are very cheap in terms of command points so sometimes you can send them off to scout too. Edit. I say "free", 4 solari is a much smaller upkeep than the intel building, so it's definitely a benefit.
I'm still new and have only played House Atrides once so far bare in mind! But....
Something about the peaceful annixation tha surprised me - since there's a modifier for plundering increasing cost, I was really expecting a liberating bonus to be in place when you release oppents villages - that would decrease time and cost to annex then, maybe also applied if you fight off attackers. Would be cool to punish lightly defended contests territory's by instead of plundering them, repeatedly liberating them, for a quick cheap peaceful annexation. I really hope they add that in future, right now it's just... kinda a big 'but why would I bother' compared to annexing.
When talking about mother Romallo for the Fremen, you mistook the Shai Hulud temple for the ceremonial caves. The Shai Hulud temple actually gives bonus resources on production and is very useful! I think the Fremen are actually very good and got done a bit dirty 😅
More factions are on the works, do you think you'll update this if and when it comes out?
great video, I think Smugglers should be A tier with Atreides down to B. The versatility the underworld hq give is amazing. They are a late game powerhouse, build up economy picking up passive research, and then baller out either with mercs into exploding villages, or all that influence & intel gain into just going political assassination route whilst sitting back defending with big economy and visibility from the underworld HQs
Solid list, agreed with most of it.
Fun fact tho, first game I ever won was as fremen and somehow got elected governor, even though my villages where rebelling, I managed to achieve the political victory.
By total accident. Didn't think I'd win the vote.
smuggler in fact scale the most in late game, diplo-victory he can increase max influence with +100 district bonus, and 20-60 for each main base underground base, making theoretical max influence 780, mad influence, gold, income with first advisor even after nerf, then most importantly guaranteed 5 votes from minor house to bounty, which i always earn 200+ votes. You can also go assassin route, 100% agent escape chance, +10 infiltration which means one free level, all in one building, mad intel income if so desire.
---I find it strange that the Smugglers would be lower due to them being economic, but the main point of their demo teams is to destroy enemy supplies which in turn gives their melee extra attack based on how depleted the enemy is. For enemy player/AI (not neutrals they dont really travel) Having a single bomb will auto kill most armies within 15 secs once they run out of supply. Also it has been noted that Smugglers (at least in single skirmish i dont know in MP) start next to the Polar Region which gives you the massive 50 water boost and the water trade tech makes extra money based off surplus water. Should you attain the Water Guild Position in the Laandsrad that would mean 100% of surplus water is free money that you can build in every village. This would mean that the Lingar councilor is pretty much broken in the early game when combined with the 1st councilor as you could just rapidly expand an illegal network into a neighboring opponent and steal from his economy or alternately conquer him for his resources.
---I love the Harkonnen as well but i need more experience in using their troops on medium to get any good use. It should also be stated that Oppression increases water production as well spice/manpower. Should one invest in Spectral Imaging as Peter De Vries your invisible ornithopeters cant be attacked in addition to raabban giving militia bonuses. It shouldnt be hard to achieve +40% production of spice in a single field and then use Oppression to make it a whopping 420%. Now imagine if other factors like crews or CHOAM standing came into play....(drools in gold).
---As for the Fremen the second councillor in conjuction with either the 3rd or 4th is more important than one might realise at least initially. The way i view him is basically as a free agent in Arrakis infiltration as that is what he provides so in theory he is lvl4 Arrakis infiltration which is highly useful in finding those Sietches (this also means no more raids on your stuff). However one must note that his bonuses to Authority only apply to spice fields which the Elderly woman helps to locate. One could in theory focus their tech progress to maximizing Spice Profits and thus plan their conquests to the already located spice fields and gain an early money advantage over the opponents which you can use for military, economic, or trading/bribery in MP matches. This also makes the 3-4 councilors as a solid warmonger combo. A final thing of the Fremen is that their first advantage of -30% supply usage is doubled to -60% with PanaCompass and Spectral Imaging could use any spare or lazy ornithopters to squeeze an extra 20% spice (which if youve invested in it tech wise should at least be 4x its worth) or escort an army for -80% supply usage.
---I know nothing of Atreides other than building 5 workshops.
Before watching: For me it's Atreides - B, Harkonnen - S, Fremen - S, Smugglers - A.
This game has the hype still, but i think it will lose luster soon. By the time they update/patch anything it will be to late. This game needs to add other houses, like house Corrino. You could also add Ordos, which were used in the movie and the old games to help move the space guilders around. In the old Games, they had there own fortune to mine space on the side as a candidate..
I thought that too, but even when I think just this little multiplayer map woudl have lost its luster and been played out, I still want to play more lol. Always love dune, always love arrakis, so I guess I'll be thinking about Dunecrack from now on.
I use one vanguard unit with every army. Place them behind trooper and/or house guard units and vanguard will become absolute demons in combat over the course of the battle.
Hitting a faction with a Landsraad rebellion then immediately hitting them with another through operations while simultaneously worming in to liberate a key military base feels so good. A fremen hello if you will.
I haven't tried that but it does seem rather nice. You can also tie up their military with a cease fire on top of all that, and maybe get an extra liberation.
for me is atreides faction has a good units and durable fighting capability, Im play as atreides with 5 landstraad,3warden and 2 drone can win the battle plus supply probe
For me smuglers should be a A tier, just for the sniper unit. It is a bit OP as of the current state of the game. I guess they will be nerfed. Also their underworld mechanism is not to be taken lightly. Well surely not the most powerfull faction, but the nicest to play. On the same note, I really like the Attreide units, with the stacking bonus.
....The fact that House Ordos doesn't even appear as a playable side make them the best faction. For a house composed of insidious smugglers, hiding under the guise of house walloch, they are well hidden.
Surprised nobody picked up on it but you switched your fremen buildings. The mother gives the +20% to all resources building, not the caves. While it's nice to have, it doesn't change all that much as you can get that building with bazar boost fairly fast and knowing where all the spice fields are doesn't mean you can waltz in there and take them. Still you might prefer Chany for free rebelions on top of the must have that is the last guy.
I think someone already has in the comment here - but good call nonetheless
I almost find Thufir agents a stronger espionage force than the Harkonnen.
My first win was a Hegemony win with the Smugglers. Was surprised that only 1.7% of peeps got that achievement. Harrkonnen is next.
My games don't seem to last until the full 25k hegemony limit. Either me or the others are getting rekted by domination and eliminating everyone else or by the governor of Dune charter political win.
can you make a separate tier list for multiplayer (before/when it comes out)
probably Fremens, because have strongest units from start and have best mobility without arfields (which take building slots), probably best players will be play combination intel (for combat) with military with necessary economy
@@markogrofcierny8237 Fremens is definitely gonna be a staple. but do you think the main mode will be 1v1? im thinking 2v2 is probably gonna be the main mode
@@anonoumos it'll have 1 v1 and 2 v2, there's talks they're adding a 5th faction too
Harkonnen is a huge pick indeed lmao
I think they change a lot of factions
maybe I suck with harkonnen or insane is harder than I thought cause Harkonnen units do not scale like any of the other units in the game in my experience lol
Fremen authority is pretty awesome
I think you need to go and play fremen some more. You have no clue about them rubbishing on some of the best councilors in game yet still place them in S tier.
Well a new tier list is in order, the game has been rebalanced.
I thought oppression led to more revolts against the Harkonnan? Was that not the drawback with them? 😅
Not at all ! Killing rebels helps to train your troops and give you Hegemony (and intel with Feyd).
Setting up Rebel farms is really great as Harkonnen.
@@selaven It can be but you never know when a rebellion will happen. So it means if you oppress cities and they're spread out you are in for a bad time. Any units putting down rebellions aren't holding the line making a awesome opportunity to move in and start sacking boarder cities. Also until the rebellion is put down the city is at half production which doesn't matter for most resources, however loss of water and fuel cells can lead to a massive doom spiral that's hard to correct.
@@Moochewmoo Choosing the rights locations to oppress is indeed important, but not too difficult. Basically you need an airport going from the front line to the oppressed regions and be careful about water.
@@selaven Fair play I can absolutely respect that. I think I got turned off of it from having a bad experience when I first picked up the game.
@@Moochewmoo most of the time I only oppress 2 regions, but that maybe because I'm not cruel enough to be an effective leader. :'D
So I pulled up a saved game to look at the UNIT STATS of the Fedakyn I am using with all the boosts:
60 power
10k health
20 armor
Sandkiller bonus: +20% power +2 armor
against all odds bonus: +10% unit power +2 armor
Military base bonus: +20% power
gear drop bonus +50 health regen
Hegemony bonus: +10% power (12k Hegemony)
HQ barracks bonus: +20% health + 20% regen
HQ command post bonus: +20% attack bonus
HQ district bonus (military): +2 attack bonus
***This is my 6 man Fedakyn attack army that is currently sitting on the Harkonen HQ with continuous supply drops
This is why the Fremen RULE
You should double the HQ district bonus by using the bazaar for even more ass kicking. +4 attack bonus instead of +2. Should boost your guys to like 65 power I would guess. I didn't crack 60 myself, but I got like 48 the other day.
Smuggler third counciler should be like the atreides one and just ADD the Merchant trait. not replace the single trait you get.
I would say I agree, but that would get super busted really fast, you already end up with like 40-50% total boost mid-game to your money just by sacrificing your agent traits.
Being trying to win in Insane Difficulty with Atreides and They simply cant do it... I tryed to achieve a Diplomatic Victory but Harkonnen and Fremen dont give a f about the sietch they just steamroll everyone and win by Hegemony and Military prowess so i cant unlock the Dune Gobernor position and eventually lose.
I think the Gobernor Position needs to have more relevant requirements to be unlocked, because you can limit Atreides Diplomatic win condition by just ignoring the sietch tribes...
Overall, agree 100% with the Tier List
The 10k bonus allows Atreides to ignore the sietch requirement. You only need standing. They are the only faction who can somewhat guarantee the victory condition is available.
I won insane difficulty as Atreides first try, so I'm confident that they can win on that difficulty. It wasn't a particularly lucky run. It took an insane amount of defensive micro, and I've never used so many airlifts, but it's certainly possible. I do think that Atreides is the weakest faction by far.
The #1 most important thing was to find a defensive strongpoint near the pole where two villages could cover each other with turrets and then abuse supply drops + truce mechanics + AI supply decision-making. Holding near or at the pole makes it way more likely that enemy factions will attack each other near the edge, which kills two birds with one stone and lets you effectively limit all opponents from a single point. Late-game, I had three separate defensive groups supported by four ornithopters for advance warning, and it was still a pain to defend my territory.
I don't know who that is, but that is not Liet Kynes.
wtf is LANDSSAARD?
The one thing about Otheym worth mentioning that might just be a slight extra point in his favor is he synergizes with the fedaykhin's buff for each enemy attacking them, it's potentially an interesting early game strat to research to fedaykhin relatively early and they can pretty much take on a militia themselves
after using Oppresion your vilage produce less so there is no infinite loop
Can't you just keep oppressing ? I'm pretty sure that if you oppress non-stop your in a loop.
@@selaven You can but the debuff appears to stack. Though how debuff stacks are applied is a bit of a mystery because the tooltips are kinda bad. Does it take chance of rebellion from 2% to 4%? Maybe!
The saving grace is that stacks drop off at once if I recall not progressively.
@@Moochewmoo the debuff stacks but they don't apply their effect when under oppression (with my ridiculous APM I can only manage to get to 4 for a 8% chance of revolt). They also don't disappear all at once but do so one at a time. So once you start oppressing, it's important to keep doing it. You're right about the tooltips tho, they often are unclear !
I'd say atreides are a B, and Harkonnen S tier easily since Free stealth intel, and opression mad bonuses.
Atreides are an S Tier, when it comes to multiplayer now.... you need to redo this list
Love the video, but I think you are really missing how powerful the Atreides can be. Lady Jessica can completely remove an enemies spice stockpile if the enemy doesn't have the authority to spend. Lady Jessica will completely destroy others players early game in multiplayer. 50 influence for a 100 influence Check is op. Think of the mutiplayer potential on these ratings.
You can only impose treaty, not trade.
The Freman are meant for governors of Dune Win 🏆
LandsRaad.... RRRrrr... Raaaaddd... pls :D
The thing is it all depends on how you play the faction so every faction can be S
tear
Love the video, but I think you are really missing how powerful the Atreides can be.
Love the video, but I think you are really missing how powerful the Smugglers can be.
Love the video, but I think you are really missing how powerful the Harkonnen can be.
Love the video, but I think you are really missing how powerful the Fremen can be.
"House Harkonnen Gunners are great for their adjacency bonus!"
Erm, it ain't exactly what I'd call a bonus xD
All demo teams deal splash damage to other enemies. Harkonnen Gunners 'bonus' is that they do splash damage to their own allies as well :D
I've had gunners kill half of my own army by accidentaly shooting at a fleeing unit everyone is chasing just as combat drugs wear off
Aren't you supposed to play each of the factions to have more fun? Why do you need to rank them? It is like when they give you all DLCs for free and you only play one of them.
Yes
Harkonnen are underrated. Go rabban and feyd. Perma oppress your spice villages. Profit.
Wtf where is Paul as a leader
God I hate whatever the obsession is with tier lists. There are fucking 4 of them, just rate them normally 😂
Fremen better than atreidis? Not even close. They're very susceptible to rebellions endgame due to the lack of airfields and ye sthey can come out of nowhere and attack the base. but with the upped base and some turrets rotecting it good luck doing that against entrenched atreides. You will get destroyed by the turrets and their military. I think fremen are strong early mid game and fall off late game dude to not having atomics, air fields and political power. Yes you can do some shenanigans with worms but you ave only 3 uses of it before having to wait for the cd to wear off so... good luck defending against rebellions. They are B or A- where Atreides are S becasue of how turtling potential they have with their unique tech and double turrets and very defensive army with healing drones. Atreides and Harkonnen both are S tier Fremen A- or B+
Ah and peaceful annexetion is one of their best abbilities to snach soem remote spice region which you can connect with airfields while turtling like a pro. I don't think the fremen can match them or harkonnen. Ye sthey are very gimmicky and can do some stealth raids and hit and run playstyle but it's nt easy to pull off and not that strong late game. Fun faction but not S tier
Atreides have so many problems it's upsetting. The reliance on combined arms means they're units suffer unless you have a good mix. This means a multiprong attack is dead before you even start it. Mean while Fremen have a cheap tier 1 unit that will just brutalize your settlement garrison before sacking it and heading off back into the deep desert where you can't follow. Treaties are just awful. They actually hinder the Atredies player and are all gravy for the other party. Atomics are... fine? I guess? But hurt your standing with the Landsraad. Political power is hit or miss. You can't count on getting good resolutions, and if there is a good one better hope the AI doesn't want it too. The bonus votes comes out to like 120 influence every voting. This is nice except you can very easily gain that in between voting sessions.
Freman however can send one basic unit to get rid of rebellions and be just fine. They also get the same double turrets Atredies and Harks do. So if they want they can just trench up as well. Sandworms are insanely good. Do a chain of long raids in someone's region and when things get dicey just sandworm out. Air fields are reactive but worms are proactive.
How exactly are Fremen susceptible to rebellions? They can have exactly 1 Fedaykin chilling somewhere and deal with that by himself. The Fremen are just crazy strong, arguably stronger than the Harkonnen.
Actually Atredies turtles *worse* than Harks do. A 6 stack of oppressed militia are absolute bastards to chew through with the same threat of turrets and airfields. Throw in combat drugs and supply drops and you have an extremely stalled offensive while you get pressured else where either by rebellions in your territory or a straight up counter offensive. Hell even if Harks lose a city they can just reclaim it at half influence due to techs.
Sure you can annex a spice field deep into the map but God help you to hold it and if you do hold it the opportunity cost is massive.
Late game raids for Fremen are just absolute hell. 3 infiltrators shred militia and once they're done with them you sack the settlement, get some free cash, and attack turrets and airfields which have relatively low health and armor. Infiltrators cost all of 2 supply points.
Atredies are like the flagship house of the game, but aside from free votes anything they can do literally every faction can do better. They need tons of help. I'm glad you like them and I seriously hope they get some massive changes while still being the faction you enjoy playing.
@@AStaake1992 I agree with you when it comes to Fremen being stronger than Harkonnen, especially in a potentially MP environment where you can't pause. The less you need to micro, the better. Airfields are also vulnerable to being destroyed, and a drain on the economy.
Our RUclips Jumbopixel also fails to mention the liberate mechanic for Fremen, that gives 1k currency per liberate. Insanely good, and makes hegemony victories for Fremen easy (although I find straight domination victories even easier with skirmisher spam.
Chani and Stillgar councilers scale upwardly with player skill. The more micro and skilled the player is, the more benefit they'll get out of it. Speed is life, letting the player not only outmanuever and win trading upwards in battles (especialy with ranged units paying benny hill vs AI). Intel operations make or break victory, and Chani's buff is a huge deal.
The Bazaar in combination with the two other military buildings buffing units is also insanely good.
Harkonnen Oppression absolutely is strong, but doesn't scale upwardly in a stable fashion. Due to how much micro this game requires, demanding extra attention to unrest/rebellion is a no go for mid to late game, leaving oppresison only best in the early game. When there's a lot going on on the map and you need to pay attention to combat and sand worms etc, you don't have room to do unstable oppressions elsewhere on the map. In practice you'll only do it near your armies and when you have nothing else taking your attention.
Meanwhile Fremen are significantly more hands off with sandworms taking far less attention, virtually no micromanagement of spice harvesters (vs constant sandworm noms), and fewer eco buildings required (no fuel weakness). Shai halud temple is just insanely good with no downsides. Extra speed counciler will literally have enemies dancing under your control, while literal invisibility from various units allows for crazy stealth manuevers and ambushes both in PvE and future PvP.
In short Fremen are good for beginners and advanced players alike, scaling upwardly with skill.
I don't see fremen being that crazy strong. And no I don't think, one feydakin is not gonna take out 5 rebels by himself. I guess I could test that out. But seems a bit unlikely. Too much hp to chew through. but still their mobility is good late game they can turtle yes but what are they gonna do turtling if they can't outpace others with hegemony. And good luck winning if entrenched atreides gets elected as a governor. Trying to capture his entrenched base overseed by at least two turrets and a military base which together with the tech gives their armies 40% power buff Is gonna be painful.
Btw I don't see the problem in combained arms army against spamming one unit as someone mentions.
And fremen not having atomics means they cannot punish a harkonnen or atreides blob while being susceptible to being shreded by atomics themself if they blob to try to take out enemy's base
That's why they're strongest mid to early late game when they worm riding blob is the strongest.
Plus their Culan cwravan is tricky to use and requires much more skill than atreides healing drone is just half of supply drop heal at all times.
Maybe Culans could get something on top of being justa remote kinda village.
And I do hope atreides wardens can give other wardens their armor buff.