How to Make Your Own Flameless Ration Heaters and the science of how they work.
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- Опубликовано: 31 май 2024
- In this video we show how Flameless Ration Heaters and self heating food containers work.
Inside of them is a water activated exothermic chemical reaction. The most common one is magnesium iron alloy and salt. When water is activated it produces magnesium hydroxide and plenty of heat. Less common mixtures include sodium hydroxide and aluminum, magnesium metal and sodium bisulfate, aluminum and calcium hydroxide, and calcium oxide alone with water.
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I don't question the amount research, blood, sweat, and tears, that went into determining the best way to hold up an MRE heater was a Rock or Something.
In the army nobody has common sense. If the paper said a "rock" but all they had was metal jeep parts people would eat that "food" cold.
I assume it was an instruction to the illustrator - "Draw a rock or something"
Please tell us who was the first that comment and like you 🤔 to solve our agony!🤣
Rock or something is the best instruction still, ever.
"Rock or something" has been my favorite instruction for years. Has such a great "-Keep Out-"/"-Or Enter- I'm a Sign Not a Cop" energy
I GUARANTEE you that “or something” was added to the instructions because some soldiers thought they had to eat the food cold because they couldn’t find a rock.
Marines like to eat their glue and crayons cold anyways, so why bother with the extra line?
MARINE: Muscles Are Required, Intelligence Not Essential.
Yes. I remember first aid training and they were getting us to add ideas on how to deprive a phosphorous burn of oxygen. I said mud, one guy flat out said no it has to be water or rags because that's what it said in the book. Me being smarter then than I am now just let it go knowing such a stupid criticism couldn't be a one off and arguing would be a waste of time.
There's so many, many examples of guys being complete nimrods so confidently. When I got out I smoked knowing none of them would ever be my superiors because those types often fail upwards, believing they deserve every part of whatever fiefdom they could control.
It is always my favorite thing to see that on actual military rations.
Imagine not being able to find a rock ...
When I was in the Army in the 90s, it was a running joke in my platoon to test to see if something was "something," based on whether or not an MRE heater would lean against it. If it fell off or flattened, it wasn't something.
Flawless scientific reasoning!
A surprisingly frequent comment/joke when a military member sees that someone has heated an MRE is "Oh, you were able to find a rock or something." Implying that the person making the comment thought the other lacked the intellectual capacity to locate a rock, or suitable substitute.
I usually took off my boots, and used one of them as an "or something" because it's nice to get your feet out of those boots for a few minutes in the middle of watch.
I have so much respect for you guys that serve(d). I know it has become kind of a trite thing to say, but damnnit, I mean it when I say thank you for your service, man.
As for bags, use sous vide bags. They can handle the heat and you can make them any size you want.
Slow cooker or oven cooking bags would do the trick as well. They are made out of nylon.
Having watched your videos since 7th grade, I am happy you're still active on youtube. I'm certain you have inspired many little chemists.
Not just LITTLE chemist's... I've been watching since you were in 7th grade too. ;)
4:04 actually, there are coffee cans that use thermite to instantly heat coffee. The simple trick to make thermite useable for heating food is to encase it in food grade metal, and have it submerged in water; that water is to make sure it doesn't overheat and basically have a meltdown, and that water can be the consumable itself (i.e. a brew or a soup), or you can use that heated water as the cooker.
I came here to mention the same. I found the patent on them. Interesting how they get it to start.
Have you considered ball milling? It is often used to create intermetallic Fe -Mg compounds in the lab, mainly for hydrogen storage. Ball milling reactive metals is not without risk but it is a lot less dangerous than molten Mg.
ya know what? i hadn't thought of that. Once i get a ball mill that's the first thing i'm going to try!
Making a batch of 50/50 magnalium in a propane forge might be the most dangerous thing I've ever done in my driveway. Was quite interesting taking the puck out of the crucible and seeing a layer of fuzzy black carbon on top, I assume from CO2 losing its O2 to the Mg or something like that.
@@NurdRage Maybe use lamp oil as a moisture repellent and spark inhibitor and wash the finished powder with acetone a couple of times?
@@treelineresearch3387you made solid magnalium!?
Bravo sir you're definitely brave with your metal melting
Aluminum is done that way in inert atmosphere. Tumblers with balls make aluminum flakes. It's based on the media, I'm sure powders also, but it isvoutside what I've seen.
While deployed, I once tried to capture the hydrogen from the MREs. The goal was to make a nitrile glove float and/or to make a louder MRE bomb. I couldn't cobble together good enough chemistry hardware to get the job done though. I guess some dreams were never meant to be.
Doing the good work out there.
Brings back memories of post-Katrina in New Orleans, we had so many MREs. Rock or Something is definitely the best propping method! lmao
Wonder if you could make that alloy by slowly adding iron oxide to molten magnesium. The resulting thermite reaction might cause the elemental iron to intermingle with the molten magnesium without having to heat the whole mix to iron melting temp. Only issue is it's tough to melt magnesium without it catching fire. You think the same iron content could work with a MgAl alloy instead of pure Mg? With MgAl you would also get the benefit of being able to easily powderize it with a hammer.
Not a bad idea, although it might be more straightforward to mix iron powder with molten magnesium. But i'm liking the idea of a ball mill as others have suggested. We could mill them together at much lower temperatures and even get it in powder form in one step. Just have to avoid the magnesium dust exploding.
@@NurdRagesounds like it's time to build that inert-gas, positive-pressure ball mill!
Two of my favorite RUclipsrs in the same thread. Nice to see.
Interestingly, Fe is practically insoluble in Mg(l) or Mg(s); the formation of such an alloy is actually an interesting metallurgical problem. I suspect anything that results in a dispersion of Fe(s) in Mg(l) would do, whether by reaction, or somehow managing to blend powder into it. In any case, keep it well stirred until poured?!
Note that combining things, whether as oxides or pure, needs to overcome the metal's surface tension; easier said than done! Perhaps under a cover of NaCl.KCl eutectic (LoSalt is pretty close, of course you can make your own from pure materials more cheaply), some FeCl2 (anhydrous!!) could be added, and the reaction at the Mg surface might produce flecks of Fe that then disperse. (Success can be measured most directly by sectioning and polishing the alloy, with a mild e.g. vinegar etch to identify the Mg versus other stuff. Or, y'know, testing it in the above reaction!) A molten salt cover is also recommended (required, even) to keep the molten magnesium from spontaneously combusting... :)
Perhaps Mg-Cu would do as well? Which will be composed of CuMg2 intermetallic, interspersed between Mg dendrites. Hm, I wonder if CuMg2 has favorable electrolytic parameters itself...
@@T3sl4theres got to be a patented process at some point for making this alloy that we could find to figure out an at home process off of.
You can speed up reaction between aluminium and NaHSO4 by adding NaCl. Formation of [AlCl4]- massively improve reaction rate.
"rock or something" is still the greatest three word phrase in any piece of technical writing ever.
Try vacuum seal bags. The bonus is they are vacuum sealed until you use them. You can make them different shapes. Put your heater in a bag of water you heat that contains a bag with your meal. Like a Sous vide cooker.
Re: sodium hydroxide: If you added more water, it should slow the reaction as it will lower the hydroxide concentration, as well as buffer the heat flux. This should not only work to prevent the generation of hot spots that rupture the bag, but also improve the heat retention, thus the cooking ability.
This would probably require some testing & adding fill lines to the bags.
Alternatively, food saver vacuum ziploc bags should be able to tolerate the heat, keep out moisture during storage, and they come built in with what is effectively a one-way pressure relief valve to prevent splosions.
Tangentally related to the flameless heaters: Years ago I was experimenting (ok, playing with) heat of solution of various chemicals. Ammonium nitrate of course gets cold when dissolved...but what about releasing that heat again by recrystallizing it? I heated it, thinking the heat of crystallization would help dry it, but it never did. I had a damp clump that I couldn't dry. I let it cool completely then I put it in a beaker, covered it with a watch glass, then put it in a vacuum chamber. I thought that the evaporation of water would remove heat from the damp ammonium nitrate faster than the heat released from recrystallization. I was wrong - by a long shot. It essentially exploded when the heating led to runaway steam production. The watch glass was blown off and smashed on the inside of the vacuum chamber. I was SUPER LUCKY that the chamber didn't crack and implode: it wasn't in a cage, and it wasn't even a real bell jar...it was a cookie jar. For PPE I just had safety glasses. I won't do that again! But I suppose I can claim to have "invented" a flameless heater for vacuum conditions...if you don't mind the explosion part.
Another advantage of CaO is that once you're done heating your food you have something to paint your walls with.😁
But I'm too poor to paint and too proud to whitewash...
While i found this fascinating and very well presented, I can't help but think that outside of the military environment, fuel tablets or other methods are almost always a better choice for the average person.
In an emergency for sure; then fuel tablets are always better I would think. But this could be nice for camping in the wild when you live in a place where starting fires or even the use of not completely contained flames is illegal and you don't want to risk a lawsuit. Or in the woods in summer where everything is bone dry and you don't want to risk a wildfire.
100%, If flames are acceptable then use flames.
Maybe miners or gas/oil field workers? If you're already near a potentially explosive atmosphere, a little hydrogen wouldn't hurt, but a flame sure would
Who wants to be average?
But for the average situation, yes.
@@MoxxoM I don't disagree. However, if you know you are going to be in that situation, you'd still be better just buying a few meals with commercially produced heaters.
Still, I really enjoyed seeing how the different methods worked. Very educational.
Just chiming in to double down on the whole "dont seal the vessel" part.
My Dad did a groundskeeping/maintenance job and some jerk used to make little foil+Draino bottles that would "go off" when Dad moved them into a trash bag. He never got hurt becsuse he knew what it was but a pressurized bottle of caustic chemicals is NFG
Very much like the one pot meth reaction which are othen mixed and thrown out along a road , and after a while , the tweaker(s) come back by and pick up any that haven't exploded .
Occasionally , one of the little dears forgets their little toxic Easter Egg and it gets found by some unsuspecting victim .
As for other things you can put in a plastic beverage container and probably shouldn't seal ( calcium carbide , dry ice , etc ) , I find my riding mower is an effective tool for semi safely disarming any " duds " .
A pellet rifle and some distance also works and I have had also had good results with everything from slingshots to large caliber rifles .
YMMV .
BTW , the residue of calcium carbide reacting with water is calcium hydroxide , which will work with aluminum foil to heat food .
I used to make a really redneck contraption that looked like the love child of a citronella bucket candle and a drunken carbide lamp , from empty aluminum cans .
I cut the top off one and kept the bottom .
The second I left whole and pierced a very small hole in the bottom of it .
I would put a handful of carbide in the first partial can , then , push it into the bottom of the second can , and , fill it with water or any reasonable watery liquid .
If all the stars aligned and you were living right , you got a an anomalously tall beer can that would support a flame .
Of course what you also got half the time was a curtain of flame around the base , and on rare occasions , an impressive little boom and you had to start again from scratch .
So my advice was always to carry extra starting materials , especially extra beer .
You cannot be to careful .
I cry when I see you have uploaded a new video
Watching your videos since 10 years❤❤❤😂😂😂
Let's get this out on a tray, Nice
Haha. I've been researching how to make these, and now this is uploaded. There's a reason I love your channel. Thank you!
Thank you for teaching us all the time, I love your videos, and good morning :]
9:00 If you go into the international section of your grocery store and see a bag of white powder labeled "Cal", that's Calcium Hydroxide.
Awesome videoo, highly appreciated and educational 👍👍
Omg nurdrage, i havent seen this channel in ages. Videos were always the coolest.
This is an awesome topic thank you.
By this point, I see that others have already mentioned what I raced on here to tell you... Ball mill. I've been casually researching since you said "alloy" in this video, and just figured out that this must be how the manufacturers of FRHs do it. I live in the Maritimes. I spent time in the CF and have used ration heaters. When Fiona tore through, my preparedness was tested. Did okay, but having ration heaters would make my disaster kit quite a bit lighter and smaller. Since I'm nerdish and very cheap, I like the idea of making them. Keep being awesome!
I really like these useful videos for every day useful chemical reactions. Thanks very much
Very informative my man!!!
Useful info to know thanks.
Great video thanks for sharing
Let's get this out onto a tray. Nice!
Spent a good deal of my time in the Army looking for "something". It was a long running joke that helped kill boredom in the field. We would also send the new troops searching for a box of " grid squares". Ah, the good ol days!
Nurd, I have a bit of a question. Prior to the introduction of these water based heating packets we used to use hexamine fuel tablets. (or at least that's what we were told they were) I don't have anything against the water-reaction heaters. They work quite well for heating up your main meal. But that's all they will do. If you're looking to heat up a cup of water to make that packet of coffee that you got in your MRE your SOL. Whereas; those hexamine tabs + your canteen cup would heat up whatever you want (assuming you have access to water LOL). And the "hexamine" tabs had/have some serious advantages as well, such as energy density (more BTU's per volume), shelf life, weight ECT. However, (as I understand it. I Don't know this to be a fact) they were quite toxic when they were burnt. And they were VERY hydroscopic. If you didn't keep them sealed up tight, they would adsorb water from the air and not burn. My question is as follows - Do you think modern chemistry (the old hexamine formulation was VERY old) could come up with a formulation that would be non toxic And not hydroscopic, while maintaining the other advantages? (energy density ECT) I am very well aware of "solid fuel" tablets offered around the net and places like amazon. But absolutely NONE of them produce a SDS or a contents list for their product/s. And I personally know of one product that was tested and produced Hexavalent Chromium when it was burnt....... As you might guess that's a HARD PASS for me. What's your opinion? Worth exploring? Or stick to making a fire? LOL Thanks
Well... Now I want to discard my wax-dipped hexamine tablets.
But yeah, coating the tablet in wax should reduce the water absorption without reducing the energy density.
@@Kineth1 Have you tried any of your wax covered ones? How did the wax effect it? IE; were they hard to start or slow to take off? Did the wax chip off? Assuming I could find a hexamine tab that I felt comfortable burning in a semi enclosed space (Tent) its seems reasonable to use wax as a vapor barrier. But I would think it would have to be a casting wax of some sort. Something a bit more durable than the basic candle wax. Thanks.
Hexamine was likely banned because you can use it to make explosives. I've never tried it (I don't do energetic chemistry - it's a good way to get dead) but it's supposed to be relatively easy.
@@eclectichoosier5474 Well I learn something new every day. I did not know Hexamine was a/the precursor to RDX and C4 synthesis............ Well shit, scratch that idea. Nurd has had to deal with YT being asshats on much more benign chemistry. I wouldn't ask him to expose his channel to the sensor overloads over hexamine. Especially since its almost guaranteed that some jackass will go running for the hills screaming "their making bombs"............ (shaking my head)..........
I didn't think I'd see a video about this...but its definitely welcome.
From the Tuna Bowl (tuna beans etc), to Idaho potato packs and so much other stuff...there's a lot of off-the-shelf food with mylar/decent packaging that can used with these.
That Steve guy that eats old MRE's needs to see this video! Cool viddy! Steve adds salt to old heaters and they sometimes come back!
you can add ferric chloride in solution which would react to Mg resulting iron; the elemental iron will deposit on magnesium surface; iron salts would therefore act as a catalyst. this could be an option instead of adding iron on top of Mg and NaCl.
I always loved the "Rock or Something" as part of the MRE's I've eaten
We're not going to use thermite to cook our food 😂 love you bro! Best chem RUclips bro ever!
I have a video called The Works Bomb on my own channel using the HCl+AL reaction, in which we poured toilet bowl cleaner over strips of aluminum in a 2-liter soda bottle and screwed the cap on. The explosion of the bottle rupturing from the expanding gas was incredible! I'm glad this is one of the heating methods described here. You could store liquid toilet bowl cleaner next to your ration heating kit if you wanted to use that reaction in particular.
"Can last for decades" - Unless it's an FRH in a US MRE where they barely seem to work even when new... :P
Hooray for the lowest bidder.
Add the salt that comes with the ration usually.
Feels like magic!
I stumbled upon a very simple flameless heating method while trying to make a cheap gravitational Daniell cell: aluminum foil and CuSO4 solution.
There are two stages of the reaction:
- Al reacts w/ CuSO4 resulting Al2(SO4)3 and metallic Cu that _sticks to the foil_ (so the "alloy" is created for you on the spot)
- the Al + Cu foil suspended in a mix of aluminium and copper sulfate solution acts as a shortcircuited cell and the solution soon starts to boil
The transition from one stage to the next is pretty visible. I think that's the cheapest and easiest to obtain method (barring that w/ slacked lime) and the ingredients are quite shelf stable.
(haven't told to many about this method because i don't want the woods littered w/ chemical residues, but I think that ship has sailed)
7:01 You say "You do not want to be eating drain cleaner", but _lutefisk_ -- literally "lye fish" -- is a Nordic... "delicacy" (I use the term loosely) consisting of lye-cured whitefish. It's a traditional part of Christmas feasts in Norway, Sweden, and Finland.
i always
Lets get this out onto a tray. Nice!
I love this channel
Mix 1 part iron 1 part silicon with 7 parts aluminum and 20 parts magnesium. Melt the iron first, add the silicon and aluminum next, then the magnesium in a crucible with argon or nitrogen shielding gas. It is a bit more stable than the magnesium iron alloy. This alloy is super brittle like glass and can be crushed and ball milled. The size you want is about the consistancy of playschool sand. With water it gets hot and makes H2 which you can burn for even more heat, adding an acid or base or a salt like sodium acetate will speed it up a bit.
Previously I saw a video by @Chemteacherphil demonstrating that a certain brand of coffee uses a thermite reaction to generate heat. In fact, if you pour out the coffee and ignite the cartridge it can glow red hot. So it turns out you can use thermite to cook food.
I remember watching a researcher in Japan come up with a seawater battery that also used magnesium. He couldn't get a steady stream of ions (electric current) until he tried some magnesium that had a little calcium impurity in it. I forget what the other electrode metal was, but I think the magnesium was sacrificial, and the other electrode got coated in magnesium salts which stopped the reaction; the calcium impurity helped prevent that coating from sticking to the electrode. It doesn't produce as much electrical power as a lead-acid battery, but it was enough to power a go-kart a respectable distance. The magnesium/calcium electrode could be regenerated with heat, and Japan was surrounded by seawater so the electrolyte was free. Even if it wasn't ideal for automotive uses, you could use a bunch of them as grid batteries because the battery would produce a small amount of electricity for a very long time, kind of like a non-radioactive RTG.
The main downside is that they're primary batteries, so they can't be recharged by putting a voltage across the electrodes and you'd have to replace them as they ran out of charge, which is probably why grid operators are using secondary (rechargeable) battery chemistries. Still, it was kinda cool to see this professor try to come up with alternatives to burning carbon, as there's not a lot of room in Japan for renewable energy farming.
Time to build a ball mill! It’s really how you can get micro and nano scale particles to react evenly. It’s the basis for so much interesting chemical reactions and procedures.
great video! :))
"You don't want to be eating drain cleaner"
There goes Big Chem again, trying to tell people what to do!
XD
"Rock or Something" would be a great band name.
Great video. Years ago I also experimented with ration heaters and found out that a mixture of both aluminium powder and calcium oxide in a ratio of 1:4, toped with double the amount of water can heat up meals quite quickly. For example I mixed 10g of CaO with 40g of Al powder and stored it in teabags to use it I poured in 100ml of water and put my food on top. Well insulated was it enough to heat up 500ml of water to around 85C. For me both easy to get and cheap.
Wondering where you find cheap Al powder?
Maybe "cheap" was the delimiter here....
When I was deployed to Iraq, we had a case of cans of calcium oxide heated nonspecific food. I forget what it was supposed to be, but I was pretty disappointed when it wasn't hot by the time the guys who were having MREs with the flameless ration heaters were finished eating.
Ended up getting fed up, starting a small fire and chipping the can out of the calcium oxide to cook over open flame. Which only put me 5 minutes behind the guys who'd had MREs.
And on that note about immersing you food in the solution, the genius of MREs is the ration, say, spaghetti with meat sauce, is in a sealed foil pouch and can, further, be outside of the FRH bag, but insulated by the box that entree came in. Along with the jalapeno "cheese" spread you traded your buddy for for mixing hot.
Thanks!
Thank you so much!
Could you use the magnesium filings and the iron powder and a bit of citric acid to activate the reaction after adding water as the citric acid would attack the outer oxide layers ? Or aluminium and a bit of baking soda instead of the citric acid to start the reaction ? Thx.
I was really hoping to learn about the "rock or something" physics. They are flameless until they spontaneously combust. When I was a soldier I experienced this a couple times, all though rare it is a possibility.
I can vouch for CaO/H2O! Makes an absolute ton of heat and the resulting Ca(OH)2 helps to keep the water in place.
you used to be able to buy quicklime based "hot can" for camping in the UK, no idea if still sold. It was double walled can & you used a supplied pin to poke in premade holes between the layers. The pin I think burst water packs or just opened the pack and you added external water based upon brand.
Thanks a lot dude, now i really want get a box of mres just for rhe nostalgia of mixing the jalapeno cheese with rhe chilli mac. And those chalky browines...
Steve1989 Channel awaits!
@@Pygar2 its been years since I've heard of them and completely forgot. But thanks for reminding me, it is an interesting theme.
I would say try reusing mylar bags from certain items or you can attain them new I'm sure somewhere and attempt it's Heating this experiment with mylar. Thanks for vid
Hey! Have you looked at the reaction between Aluminium metal and copper chloride?
nice. calcium hydroxide in some 00 gel pill capsules. i think that should keep it from hydroscopically degrading before use
There are (or at least were) actually drain cleaner products that contain aluminium turnings in addition to sodium hydroxide. Probably to both heat the area around the clog and agitate due to gas formation.
I tried using that type of drain cleaner a while back, and it’s absolutely useless if the clog is far down the pipe. With other drain cleaners, you can just let it sit in the pipe and slowly diffuse to the clog. The “fancy” stuff just reacts as soon as it hits water and then is relatively inert.
Great video! If your making videos using simple reacitons that have useful applications, could you make a video on Lime Sulfur Spray?
you're
A very nice video, many thanks for it.
Is it possible to destroy the oxidlayer from the alumium with gallium and than let it react only with water and the gallium you can get back from the reaction?
I have seen a company make a portable microwave as a ration heater. It had a solid state RF transmitter instead of a magnetron and was powered by some powerful Li ion batteries. Talking about shooting sparrows with artillery. Regardless I would really like to get my hands on that transmitter, for science reasons of course
You can get sodium hydroxide from campfire ashes (just mix with water) - not sure how much you get (though, if you already have a fire...). You can also get sodium hydroxide from electrolysis of water with sodium chloride (though, if you already have electricity...), but the electrolysis method also produces hydrogen gas, so factor that in as well.
Nice 👍
We used quick lime and water that is when we couldn't pry the corners of a claymore open to get some C4 to burn that was in 1969.
What is the powder that is used in hand warmer? And would that powder be useful for something like this if combined with anything else?
If I remember correctly, it's very fine iron powder, at least in some of them. It gives off heat as it oxidizes from air slowly diffusing in once you break the seal. While you can make iron fine enough to heat up more quickly and more intensely, I don't think it would be easy to control it. It might be inconsistent with it either going too slow to be useful or too fast to be safe. You would need a way to tightly regulate both the size of the iron particles and the rate of air going into the pouch of iron powder.
"Private! Why are you cutting the hand off that corpse‽"
"Sir, I'm just following instructions sir."
"What? Who's orders? Why‽"
"I'm hungry sir, I need to feed."
"Jesus Christ private, you're looking at a full investigation over this."
"Ahh geeze sarge, over a MRE?"
"...What?"
"Well I couldn't find a rock sir."
I've always wanted Sci-Fi's favourite food technology to be more popular. I've also often wondered if the air ones for pockets, or the "Hot Ice" could be used in a similar way
You could use anhydrous epsom salt! That's what I was thinking :)
I tried making sodium acetate but idk if it worked. Im pretty sure it did it tastes like pickles but it like turned into thick layers when it dried and idk what to do now is it ready or do i resolve it with water to supersaturated solution idk what i did wrong but i used like a gallon of vinegar and maybe 2 boxes of baking soda and don't want to throw it away.
14:08 - 14:29 .. So hypnotic
I make my own MREs with retort bags, but mylar bags could be really good. I'm going to start making them to sell.
There's a coffee brand out there that has uses thermite heaters inside their coffee cans to warm up their coffee before you open up
Thankyou, this is AWSOME!! I currently am doing some experiments with the sodium hydroxide and aluminum version trying to refine it. I decided to use Food Saver vacuum seal bags for my FRH bag being that these bags are designed to cook with the sous-vide method of cooking (IE you can boil food with it). So far it’s working like a charm. I was trying to find a way around the separate storage problem, would the sodium hydroxide and aluminum react with eachother dry if the sodium hydroxide was put in a paper container similar to a tea bag or napkin material?
paper slowly reacts with sodium hydroxide, even when dry. So probably not a good idea.
@@NurdRage alrighty, another way of separating the aluminum from the sodium hydroxide until use I found is to put the sodium hydroxide on the Verry bottom of the bag, suspend the aluminum half way up the bag, and vacuum seal it like this, the tension of the vacuum seal would keep them separate until you tear the seam on the top for use. If I were to go with the previous method tho, what alternative material would be better suited for the job?
How would you propose to get rid of the resulting substances after use? Is it environmentally safe to just pour it out? Or do you need to haul the spent bags until you can safely dispose of them? If you're using these while camping, it's an interesting tidbit to know.
Have you tried mixing magnesium and iron powders in a ball mill?
great idea! when i get a ball mill i'll give that a try.
Ball milling Mg is known to be quite dangerous, unless you can reliably keep the inside flushed with argon. There was a documented case of someone's ball mill exploding as the suspended Mg dust self ignited.
@@TheBackyardChemist Hello? 911? My balls exploded and now my house and face are on fire. Please send help.
@@TheBackyardChemist Filling the ball mill with pure argon or otherwise sealing off air flow completely creates a dangerous situation. You need the inside of the ball mill to have some air flow so the particles will slowly make an oxide layer instead of flash oxidizing when the ball mill is opened. You also need to monitor the temperature inside the mill to make sure you're not building heat from that slow oxidation faster than it escapes.
[Rock] + [Something] = [All]
Could you plate a little iron onto the magnesium by adding iron chloride or sulphate to course magnesium turnings in water?
could you use magnesium turnings and sodium chloride with a small amount of iron salt that will get reduced by magnesium and deposit small amount of iron on turinings that speeds up the reaction?
Love your content. I started watched watching your videos while working with the military. Mres were pretty interesting and wondered about the chemistry. For fun we used to dump the contents into an empty water bottle pour a little water in watch it explode.
I also understand that soldiers in the field are not allowed to used the ration heater because the smell can alert enemies to their presence. What is the gas you smell? And is there a way to make a flameless heater with little to no odor?
". . . soldiers in the field are not allowed to used the ration heater because the smell can alert enemies to their presence." -- That is false. The gas evolved is hydrogen, which has no odor.
If you get elements that are extremely opposite on the PH scale you will always get an energetic reaction. Magnesium is not cheap . Thanks for the share . NERDS ! :O)
Maybe try adding a small amount of a low melting metal (Bi, Ga, Hg) to the Mg and Fe mixture and heat to amalgamate.
Nurdrage thank you for this video and others. I want to ask you a question.
The thermocouple you as using, is it good for kiln? I am planning to melt aluminum and make Anodized aluminum for stable tops
Yeah it seems to be good enough for aluminum. Go for it.
If i not have to move the stuff, the quicklime heater sounds reasonable. For bunker use, where air is precious, having a method, that consumes nothing and if, it's CO2, that sounds profitable.
When you seal the top , Mr Heater is no longer our friend .
good thing is that the ziplock would probably burst before the bag. probably.
Hello sir, is it possible to make white glowing chemical it's glow long lasting time
You could use a cut up disposable aluminum pan in place of the foil. To slow the reaction! And last longer.
What about using a powdered AZ91 magnesium alloy?
I work with one of the inventors of MRE heater packs. They call it "super corrosive alloy". I went and got the the mason jar of 90% Mg / 10% Fe blend he gave me. The note taped to it says the two metals are in close contact to make a battery in water and promote corrosion. Salt further promotes the galvanic corrosion. IIRC, he told me once that they made it by ball milling the metals together. The elements in the alloy are mechanically mixed in solid phase, not liquid.
Somewhere there is the patent on this alloy. He also tried to promote it as convenient source of H2.
On a side note, this was invented for the military. Which puts symbols on everything. A symbol for food. A symbol for poison. Etc. MREs initially had both symbols, which did not go unnoticed by soldiers told to eat them.
whoa that's amazing! thanks for sharing! I might try and ball mill my own now :)
I would like to know how to prepare ammonium perchlorate without chloric acid
Could we dissolve both magnesium and iron in something and then crystalize it out? That could produce the 95%/5% mix and get rid of both the hydrogen and it-eats-my-camping-gear problem.
I recall a random reaction I did involving urea sulfate where it's crystallization produced an absurd amount of heat, and several ion exchange reactions with calcium chloride that produced a lot of heat. Both get around the hydrogen issue. Not sure if they hit boiling, though, and the urea sulfate one was crystallizing in diluted sulfuric acid, which can't be great for food prep.
Could one of these gasless options work for food prep?
not a bad idea, but crystallization methods aren't good because they're metastable and can go off while in storage, so when the user uses them they're already spent. I do like the ion exchange reaction, might be worth looking into.
@@NurdRage turns out I was also completely wrong on the reaction between urea and sulfuric acid. Urea sulfate apparently doesn't form from the direct reaction between the two; ammonium sulfate and CO2 are the products. I'm not sure if the heat produced was a result of ammonium sulfate recrystallizing in a very low PH system or if it was a function of two very dry things, one of which reacts exothermically with water, sucking water out of the atmosphere and the salt is just there for the show. The latter would explain why the crystals redissolved and could not be reformed.
...I really wish I took more chemistry classes in college.