The gearbox controller has its issues which is part of the reason for the slow shifts. It functions as a proof of concept as I was told on numerous occasions that “it’s impossible to do, you won’t be able to do that”. The MSS52 DME is also unable to deal with torque cut over Canbus to allow a snappy fast gear change. To work round this issue, there is a hard ignition cut on gear change (which is why it stalls outside Devils Diner after the lap due to upshift selected by accident) to allow mechanical sympathy on both engine and gearbox. The engine and gearbox will be controlled by Maxxecu when the next major update to the setup is done. There’ll also be some other major changes too, but that’s for a future video. If I was to go back to 2019 when I started this project knowing what I do now, I’d of not bothered wasting the money and left the 420G box in instead. It’s been enjoyable, but financially a mistake but I don’t regret it as it’s opened up a whole different game of track enjoyment. Cheers to Misha for jumping in as it was seeing him in an E36 with DCT conversion around 4 years ago that inspired me to do the project - zero regrets on that front 🫡🥳
brilliant for sticking with it and building something that you wanted to, its so different ! well done and ignore any negative comments you never know how these projects will turn out, it may have been plain sailing and worked unbelievably well out of the box but that would be just boring. great work
Yes, DCT aftermarket is a difficult road but at least you tried and with projects that should be part of the reason for doing a project in the first place.
@@allanhumphries6941 sry but working out of the box is much more satisfying, than always scaring to either experience a lock-up with everything that follows or broken parts on transmission or even engineside. Actually this "controller" once was advertised as "at least as good as oem". This it actually isnt. And despite the fear this big need of tuning/dialing in and so on is what makes it a POS because it burns money in big amounts.
@@rosskidd7243 It's an old car, not much of electronics to begin with and DCT has standalone aftermarket controllers. DCT is just a "robotized" manual transmission so it's easy to adapt to anything. There's more and more stuff you can do with a DCT.
Great engineering exercise. What I would like is a stock interior and ride quality of the stock M5 with the DCT. Very nice project. I have also read/ heard the conversion was impossible. Bravo!
Very cool car, but it seems like a bit of a gimmick. A well sorted E39 M5 with weight reduction and the stock manual transmission would be a much better car overall in my opinion. Loving your content Misha!
So many people in the comments too eager to have their opinion’s heard, all saying the same thing instead of watching to the end of the video. 😂 Judgmental people… so many!!!!
Loving Adrien's wide screen slow mo shots great improvment to your chanel Misha👍👍 and great work Adrien😁 hopefully I spelled your name right lol ...i used french spelling fyi
Somehow a 4 door with a rear seat delete and a rollcage just feels wrong. You get a larger and heavier vehicle than a 2 doored alternative with shorter wheelbase and strip it out to make it light and put aerokit on it to make it faster to drive it with 1 or 2 people. Might as well just buy a 2 doored alternative that is a lot lighter. What I love about the caged Apex M3 is that it has 4 seats, still keeps the cars ethos.
Couldn't give a monkey's about the 'slow' shifts. The work which must have gone into this is really impressive, not to mention the way it sounds, which is AWESOME! Great work.
Probably I didn't hear it, if they said that is with HTG. I'va just have watched in the past few months a lot of videos with HTG with both 8hp and DTC, and the results looked very good. Shift were like sequential.
Yes, I saw that it is not shifting as it should be, and that's why I mentioned those two. Because, as I said in the last couple of months I've seen a lot of videos with them with very brutal results. I've just haven't heart that they use HTG on this car. I suppose that with some more tune of the tcu/gcu, that one will be shifting much better. After all swaps like that are not just plug and play solutions, and many times requires a lot of head baning until all works as expected.
This reminded me there is a an M3 E46 with the V10 from the E60, mated with a DCT. If only it would visit the Ring and you could have a ride / drive in it..
@@n.shiina8798 I was referring to the one tested by Auto top NL ruclips.net/video/fHPAUnz68XQ/видео.html&ab_channel=AutoTopNL . Driftworks' one is in the process of getting a crazy exhaust at the moment..that is going to be a nice build as well when completed.
Nah bro he is wrong, the car ain't slow fam 😅 The car is very very quick for a E39 M5! 200kg out of it like 😬 It will be a beast once the proper ECU for it is installed, can't wait to see it again!
Maybe its just from viewing and inside the car its different,.. but for me it seems like the combination of engine and gearbox ist not so good. But the car itself is mega!
That is not always true. There are some s62 examples who do more then 400hp or just on point. It is Always some good amount of the status of maintenance and so on...the racing version of the s62 is capable of 650hp...I dont think the engine is the problem here or better i pretty exactly know the owner and his journey....
Expected it to be quite a bit faster, especially in a straight line, given the power and being stripped of so much. Cars with less power hit higher speeds at many sections. Hopefully the owner finds someone who can put it all together to works smoothly and in synch and putting all the power down.
What’s the black car with the wing directly in front at the end of the video around 14:09? A Radical, or an Ultima? Something from England I assume with the yellow plates.
Interesting Lap. His corner entry was a bit wide in a few sections, the car was always in the power band, but it didn't sound like iit gave a two shits, reminded me of a truck engine. I feel like with the proper gear box settings he can drive it a be more aggressive and will be able to put a quicker lap down, i dont feel like he maximized the braking zones, but i wasn't driving, can't feel what the brake is doing.
I Always take it a bit easier with a passenger onboard, it’s not just my life if something goes wrong. Misha has been in enough crashes as a passenger and i do T want to add to that tally. I respect his trust and confidence in getting in my car and for that very reason I wasn’t going as quick as I would if I was on my own.
I noticed that on the downshifts the gearbox seems slow and doesn’t respond that fast. Makes me think if it was worth it swapping to DCT. Definitely a cool car though, if the owner loves it then fair play do what makes you happy brother!💪
@@fohatadridialing it in without risking the crappy gcu to lock up inbetween shifts or loose all gears, this was one of the only kinda stabel/consiatent maps they came up with. Actually all people i know that git bought by barteks false promises have left the dct train...or at least headed for maxxecu or cantcu
Just a tip, but I'd like the picture on the video to Only be the M5, I think the video would do better. Too much for my little phone screen to see what's going on :(
Sure you actually listened to what was said in the video? It's a dct out of an M4 and the owner said at the end that there's still a lot of work to be done with the gearbox ECU.
He takes some odd lines through some corners, and that car is capable of going around the track so much faster than he is doing.... he's braking way too early on many occasions.
Ha @Misha, ik zie op jullie website geen taxi ritten meer staan? Of kijk ik niet goed? Enkel het zelf rijden, helaas durf ik het risico op schade niet te nemen, vandaar de vraag… Fijne dag
Wow. And they can't put DCT in E60 still. What a shame.. PS Yeah, I heard about Gintani and England' shop, but where's results? Where's videos? Where's races?
@@romanjacobs1794 as I understand the guys in the US decided not to pursue marketing the conversion. So there are no finished projects or marketing videos.
The gearbox controller has its issues which is part of the reason for the slow shifts. It functions as a proof of concept as I was told on numerous occasions that “it’s impossible to do, you won’t be able to do that”.
The MSS52 DME is also unable to deal with torque cut over Canbus to allow a snappy fast gear change. To work round this issue, there is a hard ignition cut on gear change (which is why it stalls outside Devils Diner after the lap due to upshift selected by accident) to allow mechanical sympathy on both engine and gearbox.
The engine and gearbox will be controlled by Maxxecu when the next major update to the setup is done.
There’ll also be some other major changes too, but that’s for a future video.
If I was to go back to 2019 when I started this project knowing what I do now, I’d of not bothered wasting the money and left the 420G box in instead. It’s been enjoyable, but financially a mistake but I don’t regret it as it’s opened up a whole different game of track enjoyment.
Cheers to Misha for jumping in as it was seeing him in an E36 with DCT conversion around 4 years ago that inspired me to do the project - zero regrets on that front 🫡🥳
brilliant for sticking with it and building something that you wanted to, its so different ! well done and ignore any negative comments you never know how these projects will turn out, it may have been plain sailing and worked unbelievably well out of the box but that would be just boring. great work
better to get 8hp, a lot simpler
Yes, DCT aftermarket is a difficult road but at least you tried and with projects that should be part of the reason for doing a project in the first place.
make a conversion / swap kit once you have it all sorted out and im sure many people will be interested in buying….
@@allanhumphries6941 sry but working out of the box is much more satisfying, than always scaring to either experience a lock-up with everything that follows or broken parts on transmission or even engineside. Actually this "controller" once was advertised as "at least as good as oem". This it actually isnt. And despite the fear this big need of tuning/dialing in and so on is what makes it a POS because it burns money in big amounts.
They look like pretty slow and rough shifts, I hope the owner will be able to dial it in a bit better still. But a very impressive conversion!
Try watching it to the end where he explains what he will do.
He says at the end 'The gearbox controller is a piece of sh*t, I'm waiting for max ecu to finish doing their f series control'
@@1993jtry Lamik tcu controler
Its sounds likes Mw m3 gtr
@@paweltodudek No worky with DCT
The explanation about the gearbox issue was a good one because the entire lap i was like whatsup with that thing 🤔😉😎
I saw DCT E39 and said "Wait, what?" too.
That must have been an absolute nightmare to get working properly
why'?
@@TopiT23 Because the gearbox and car are will be extremely different electronically. Not to mention mounting then together.
@@rosskidd7243 they do sell kitts for almost every bmw out there the be fitted with that gearbox
@@TopiT23 your right. Just a manual transmission with a hydrolic shifter thats electronically controled
@@rosskidd7243 It's an old car, not much of electronics to begin with and DCT has standalone aftermarket controllers. DCT is just a "robotized" manual transmission so it's easy to adapt to anything. There's more and more stuff you can do with a DCT.
She sounds good, and as the tires warm up, rock solid. Excellent build.
Transmission and gear changes might be slow from my point but its sounds remembered me Nfs most wanted m3 gtr
Perfect video
Did well managing the weight of car! Lovely pace too.
Great engineering exercise. What I would like is a stock interior and ride quality of the stock M5 with the DCT. Very nice project. I have also read/ heard the conversion was impossible. Bravo!
I may be a 70's kid but I still find this the best looking M5 with the angel eyes. Postercar.
Oh my that red Porsche at the beginning was such a treat 😍
Those look like some jerky shifts, needs that upgrade
absolut! so slow!
You guys watch to the end.
Bro. my grandma can shift more smoothly
probably the original gearbox computer :)
@@JT-ry5ei Do you know what humor means? Jeez
Love the sound........and the view......THX!!!!!
Great job....keep it up
From Argentina...
Changes and sounds like the old SMG Box, Which everybody hated.
Very cool car, but it seems like a bit of a gimmick. A well sorted E39 M5 with weight reduction and the stock manual transmission would be a much better car overall in my opinion. Loving your content Misha!
You have to actually finish the video and here him talk about the trans
This reminds me of some E30 M50 turbo with the E92 DCT awd.
So many people in the comments too eager to have their opinion’s heard, all saying the same thing instead of watching to the end of the video. 😂 Judgmental people… so many!!!!
Loving Adrien's wide screen slow mo shots great improvment to your chanel Misha👍👍 and great work Adrien😁 hopefully I spelled your name right lol ...i used french spelling fyi
HTG really invested some time to make a DCT gearbox shift like the awesome Smart Fortwo gearbox, you gotta leave them that🎉
Only Lamik tcu comtrollers
at first i thought it was an SMG 1 conversion
Somehow a 4 door with a rear seat delete and a rollcage just feels wrong. You get a larger and heavier vehicle than a 2 doored alternative with shorter wheelbase and strip it out to make it light and put aerokit on it to make it faster to drive it with 1 or 2 people. Might as well just buy a 2 doored alternative that is a lot lighter. What I love about the caged Apex M3 is that it has 4 seats, still keeps the cars ethos.
Misha certainly got content value from the circuit days track days lol
Same Geoff Steele Racing rear wing as me! But a bit more in proportion on this car 😂
Couldn't give a monkey's about the 'slow' shifts. The work which must have gone into this is really impressive, not to mention the way it sounds, which is AWESOME! Great work.
That gear change lag is annoying
Wow, I've never seen someone stall an auto 😂 this build is gonna be insane
mmm, the e39 m5, imo the best m5 ever made and definitely the best lookin bmw
There are 2 very popular external GCU options lately for 8hp and the DTC. HTG and Turbolamik, with both the results look insane.
You meant can tcu...with htg gcu it just is crap as it is now because it has a htg gcu.
This car has the HTG, it's just bad and a POS, you can't compare it to Turbolamik
Probably I didn't hear it, if they said that is with HTG. I'va just have watched in the past few months a lot of videos with HTG with both 8hp and DTC, and the results looked very good. Shift were like sequential.
@@s.argirov if you watch the videos carefully you see that there are some harsh shifts(unintentional) and sometimes even some lock-ups.
Yes, I saw that it is not shifting as it should be, and that's why I mentioned those two. Because, as I said in the last couple of months I've seen a lot of videos with them with very brutal results. I've just haven't heart that they use HTG on this car. I suppose that with some more tune of the tcu/gcu, that one will be shifting much better. After all swaps like that are not just plug and play solutions, and many times requires a lot of head baning until all works as expected.
This reminded me there is a an M3 E46 with the V10 from the E60, mated with a DCT. If only it would visit the Ring and you could have a ride / drive in it..
are we talking Phil Morrison's E46 from Driftworks?
@@n.shiina8798 I was referring to the one tested by Auto top NL ruclips.net/video/fHPAUnz68XQ/видео.html&ab_channel=AutoTopNL . Driftworks' one is in the process of getting a crazy exhaust at the moment..that is going to be a nice build as well when completed.
@@n.shiina8798 no his is manual.
@@randomsurfer3963 that one is also getting rid of the HTG and is putting in a solution from Howell Engineering.
Nah bro he is wrong, the car ain't slow fam 😅
The car is very very quick for a E39 M5!
200kg out of it like 😬
It will be a beast once the proper ECU for it is installed, can't wait to see it again!
still smooth riding :D not exteme on loudnes just smooth nice
lets see the updated version at the end of the year ?
E39 M5 🤩👌
Very surprised how slow the up shifts are. Seems like a lot of money spent the just to have the same speed as a torque converter.
Very surprised you did not watch to the end where he discusses these things ;)
You have never driven an auto e39 then.
Meestal is de swap andersom, maar voor circuit gebruik snap ik dit wel, nu nog de software op orde krijgen.
Maybe its just from viewing and inside the car its different,.. but for me it seems like the combination of engine and gearbox ist not so good.
But the car itself is mega!
The E39 V8 normally makes around 370 horsepower instead of 400. As seen on the Halle77 videos. That might make it feel 'slow'.
That is not always true. There are some s62 examples who do more then 400hp or just on point. It is Always some good amount of the status of maintenance and so on...the racing version of the s62 is capable of 650hp...I dont think the engine is the problem here or better i pretty exactly know the owner and his journey....
Expected it to be quite a bit faster, especially in a straight line, given the power and being stripped of so much. Cars with less power hit higher speeds at many sections. Hopefully the owner finds someone who can put it all together to works smoothly and in synch and putting all the power down.
The best 🏁💙
When I see that, I'd rather keep my M5 E39 in stock with manual.
It's still slow, even after this conversion, but in stock it's at least useful 😀
E39 very beautiful car
what the hell i was just looking if this exited or not and this pops up
All those modifications to get a racecar but it felt like a sunday cruiser 😅
What’s the black car with the wing directly in front at the end of the video around 14:09? A Radical, or an Ultima? Something from England I assume with the yellow plates.
Ultima!
sick car!
I would go for 8hp70 with turbo lamik controller
defenetly needs more tuning. cant quite get behind this project cuz in the end you could just get a e92 m3 and dont molest this e39...
Please tell me you're having a go in that Ultima at 13:30 :D
Love you Misha #noHomo
People seem think swapping the DCT and make it work the same way as stock is easy work
You are correct, it´s alot harder than people think.
Definately an E39 M5 CS!
Uploaded at the perfect moment
Impressive how it hides its speed on video Misha...did the ride feel effortless?
Interesting Lap. His corner entry was a bit wide in a few sections, the car was always in the power band, but it didn't sound like iit gave a two shits, reminded me of a truck engine. I feel like with the proper gear box settings he can drive it a be more aggressive and will be able to put a quicker lap down, i dont feel like he maximized the braking zones, but i wasn't driving, can't feel what the brake is doing.
I Always take it a bit easier with a passenger onboard, it’s not just my life if something goes wrong. Misha has been in enough crashes as a passenger and i do T want to add to that tally. I respect his trust and confidence in getting in my car and for that very reason I wasn’t going as quick as I would if I was on my own.
@@WestinghouseProductions respect
Yes, yes and Yes!!!!
I noticed that on the downshifts the gearbox seems slow and doesn’t respond that fast. Makes me think if it was worth it swapping to DCT. Definitely a cool car though, if the owner loves it then fair play do what makes you happy brother!💪
It's just poor tune on the TCU. If configured properly, it's faster than M4 stock TCU tune.
@@fohatadri takes time to dial in. I’m all for manuals but dct on these older M cars make a lot of sense especially for track specific builds.
@@fohatadridialing it in without risking the crappy gcu to lock up inbetween shifts or loose all gears, this was one of the only kinda stabel/consiatent maps they came up with. Actually all people i know that git bought by barteks false promises have left the dct train...or at least headed for maxxecu or cantcu
Alex Roy likes this (probably)
First i was like why he is going so slow and then i looked the spedo and it was 195 damn that car is solid.
Looks like an SMG vs a DCT. Sweet ride though for sure.
How can it look like an smg 😂😂
Um.. Yes please 🔥🔥🔥
works like an SMG more than a DCT
Good . 😂👍😎 no bad . Like Legendar model E39 BMW coupe M5
Them down shifts take like forever and a week to change
Not sure how they converted the DCT into the E39 but it seems it needs some refinement on upshifts, it now looks very clunky and SMG'ish?
No, watch to the end.
Is this car aligned properly? It looked and sounded wrong to me..
only one with the dct ever, i imagine its the e92 m3 gearbox
Hmm looks slow but still an amazing lap and a wonderful build props to the owner
Миша, почему мне показалось, что я его на красном гольфике обгоню?)
Too much wing and that DCT needs more revs for a faster and smother shift - or needs some serious re-calbration to suit the E39.
Why he didn't use 8hp?
next time go with ZF 8-speed transmission
What's the point of the DCT if it's shifting that slow? Should've just tried to swap in a ZF 8 speed auto.
Is it even worth swapping to DCT and still shifting like an SMG? Might as well leave it as a manual or change it to a sequential instead
Watch the video to the end.
Just a tip, but I'd like the picture on the video to Only be the M5, I think the video would do better. Too much for my little phone screen to see what's going on :(
It was like him against the Car.
Rev it 7000!!!!
It doesn't shift very smoothly, does it?
Nope. The gearbox controller is crap. It’ll be much crisper and snappier once I install Maxxecu control 👍
what about an M3 e46 with dct and a e60 M5 V10?.... i am waiting
@@ThordurMagnusson i know that they exsist, but i wanna see Misha in one on the green hell 🥰
I wish the front view was larger. 👍
🤘💯 very nice
Is that the e60 m5 smg🤔🧐
Is the speedo off or was he just taking it easy in corners?
Sure it’s not the SMG box…? ;)
Sure you actually listened to what was said in the video? It's a dct out of an M4 and the owner said at the end that there's still a lot of work to be done with the gearbox ECU.
@@bunter6 Irony/humor is not always easy. I heard very well what they said.
@@timessix8434 Im sure your dumbass can make it shift faster ?
I think he needs a lot of better tires
Full roll cage, interior delete, stand-alone ECU, race seats, DCT gearbox swap and the owner says, “it’s not really a track car…” 😂😂
Meanwhile German TÜV about changing from Manual gearbox to automatic (i know it called differently) : NEIN NEIN NEIN NEIN NEIN !!!!!!!😂😂😂😂😂
Actually no. The kind of gearbox is not important to get TÜV. Its the overall gearing and honestly the dct isnt too far off the 420g...
Wow 🤩
He takes some odd lines through some corners, and that car is capable of going around the track so much faster than he is doing.... he's braking way too early on many occasions.
Yeah, HTG life 😂 you know for sure it will be an awful day at your life when driving something with that controller
E39 and E46 era //M cars have a stunning profile and stance to match. That M5 though does make current gen M3s look so HUUUGE
Ha @Misha, ik zie op jullie website geen taxi ritten meer staan? Of kijk ik niet goed? Enkel het zelf rijden, helaas durf ik het risico op schade niet te nemen, vandaar de vraag…
Fijne dag
i love the e39 m5, and i also love modified cars, but this is just too much
Wow
Good video
commenting before watching on how good the video is? 🤣
Not so sure about the dct 🤨
Wow.
And they can't put DCT in E60 still. What a shame..
PS
Yeah, I heard about Gintani and England' shop, but where's results? Where's videos? Where's races?
They just didn´t want to market it. But now you have the Howell Engineering solution.
@@ThordurMagnusson I heard about Howell, that's why I wrote about England - but where's finished projects, where's results? Where's videos?
@@romanjacobs1794 as I understand the guys in the US decided not to pursue marketing the conversion. So there are no finished projects or marketing videos.
@@ThordurMagnusson that's why it's a shame and tragedy for e60 enthusiasts
@@romanjacobs1794 we should see some customer cars soon with the Howell Engineering solution
.
This BMW E39 is great but it looks like is from GTA 5
you sure it's a dct and not a easytronic? :))
This gearbox seems super laggy and slow
Any specific reason to why he took that path through adenauer forst?
This is smg Not dual clutch Transmission