I loved reading the Richard Laymon novels on my kindle back when I used to work nights by myself in a gas station..one night we had a power cut and I was in the middle of a Laymon book, I forget which one but I was jumpy for the rest of the night having thoughts about people creeping into the gas station...when a friend of mine showed up at 4am and I was still jumpy I hadn't seen him enter the store so I literally screamed as I turned around and there stood this hulking 6ft 4 Icelandic Hells Angel with long hair....kindest soul you could meet but my word did my heart nearly stop. We had a good laugh about it afterwards but I'll never forget how terrified I was.
@@citycrusher9308 hold on… the Handmaid’s Tale is a feminist work about male oppression. Laymon’s books are cheesy horror thrillers that get off on descriptions of T&A and stalking. The two things couldn’t be more different. Like I literally can’t think of two things that touch on male/female relationships that are more different.
As a german I was laughing out loud about the statement about the phonetic similarity between the german word Insel and the english abbreviation Incel which condenses to a revealing and fitting description of Rupert and with that Laymons obvious sexism.
Are we sure the woman being stalked trope is misogyny though? The final girl is the hero, not the villain. You could just as easily interpret the psycho stalker as a manifestation of male self loathing, which I suspect is closer to the truth. As for Laymon, In the Dark is a good one. Somebody actually made a low budget movie adaptation of it shot on some lofi consumer camera. It's actually pretty good and has a way better ending than Laymon's book. It's on RUclips
I was trying to describe Laymon's books to someone recently...best I could come up with was: Remember those movies you used to get in video shops back in the day with lurid gory and pornographic covers? Imagine that, but books.
Stephen King without a conscience is the tagline that’s stuck for me. I’ve read a few now and it looks like his mid career stuff is what I like. The earlier titles I read have been a bit of a mess. Enjoying bite currently and it’s an enjoyable read.
The video nasties as they used to call them? Yeah, I think Laymon was attempting to mimic that in book form. He wasn't a hack; he had a BA & MA in English literature and was a high school English teacher and president of a horror writers association where he tutored up and coming writers. His nonfiction book A WRITER'S TALE is fantastic; it's a shame it's so hard to find.
Maybe I'm a creep lol, but he's becoming one of my favorite authors. I don't have much to go on, I've only read Night in the Lonesome October and am making my way through The Cellar, but I still don't know if I've had as much fun with a book in the "splatterpunk" realm than with what I've read so far by him. Juan and I swapped some books and he gave me both Savage and Island, so I'm curious to dig into those soon.
I do think The Cellar is pretty great - he just keeps pushing and pushing with it. The problem with him (and to be fair with many writers) is that he's uneven (some great books, some awful ones) and his own personal obsessions often take over his books and end up dominating them. I love Savage and hate Island so will be interesting to hear what you think of them
I have long held the opinion that Laymon wrote, to some extent at least, like a 14-year-old boy (albeit a talented one). He was frequently fixated on sex in his books, often to the point of derailing the story in places and his characters are wacko, often quickly descending into depravity at the slightest push, but most frequently just not acting like anybody I have ever met. I remember reading a message board years ago and someone (who was a professional writer, although I don't remember who, but he was a primarily small press horror writer) posted about Laymon and mentioned that Laymon had the most realistic characters he had ever read. That left me wondering what Laymon novels he'd read because those were certainly not any that I have read. As an example, in his novel Body Rides, the main character comes home to his girlfriend and tells her that he has been having sex with the woman he brought home with him. Her reaction is to then have sex with him and then all three of them get it on. All criticisms aside, Laymon was a fun writer. A Laymon novel from time-to-time is enjoyable, but reading a few in a row will tend to become one giant blur of weird homicidal guys and people who do things that people in real life just would not do.
After reading the title of this video, I was prepared for a very shame inducing kind of video. I’m so glad, that it turned out to be a very interesting opinion on Laymons books. I have to agree on almost every point you laid out. I couldn’t even finish the island (Die Insel). However, every once in a while I take one of his books from my shelf and have a good time with it. Even though I have a problem with most of his characters, their motives and their questionable behaviour ( especially towards women).
Thanks for watching! I think some commenters just read the (admittedly inflammatory) title and then waded in to tell me I was wrong. I've actually (re)read a couple more of his books since filming this and thoroughly enjoyed them. I stand by my assessment that he is awful, but he's also great
@@PunkRockLifer interesting - now I’m torn as to whether or not to subject myself to the book. So there’s a different twist other than the one he talked about?
Ha. It's important to be awful in art sometimes. It's important to say " I am a criminal. I am not a decent human being that wants to be a part of civilization. I dream dreams of sexual and violent atrocity. " I started with James Herbert and followed the path to Jim Thompson, Richard Laymon and Jack Ketchum, etcetera. So many pervert writers. So little time.@@CriminOllyBlog
In my opinion, Laymon is good when you don’t binge read him (like I did). I had to put Flesh away for a while since I am so sick of reading only Laymon. Now, I notice how similar his books are and they types of phrases he uses and to me, it gets a bit tiring. But overall, Laymon is a pretty good author. Especially if you’re horny 😂😂😂
I'm not in the least bit ashamed about my fandom of Richard Laymon. I barely read a word of any books from between the ages of 9-14, and King and Koontz did absolutely nothing for me. But Laymon provided horror with absolute VISCERA 🔪👹 And thus, my reading motivation returned with a vengeance, and trained my resolve for the likes of more advanced horror fiction. For that, I'll always be indebted to him. Not all of his books were good, though. Allhallows Eve was my least favourite one 🙄
Any writer who motivates a reader like he did you is a treasure! For all my (hopefully fairly good natured) criticism of Laymon, I do have a fondness for him, cheesy as his books can be.
I have read the 4 Beast House books and I thought they are quite good in terms of being completely (weirdly) different to almost all other things I’ve read. Not of any particular high quality at all, but interesting enough none the less. And I thought the thread and characters running through the books was satisfying, if not particularly clever. Tried following those up with The Travelling Vampire Show which has stalled, I just can’t seem to stay interested. So not sure what I’ve learned about Laymon. Maybe the beast house books just held my attention at the time of reading, the right book at the right time.
I think there is something about the right book at the right time with everything we read. I also think Laymon is quite hit and miss, so maybe you just got lucky!
I think you made some great criticisms of Laymon’s books, and put in perspective the odd fixations of his characters. (and perhaps him, but I try not to analyse people I’ve never met) I’ve read Darkness Tell Us, Body Rides, Cuts, and Island. Darkness… was incredibly difficult to put down and very pulp-ish - probably my favorite. Body Rides was a prime example of his rambling, but the concept was excellent and would be a great idea for a movie.
Thank you! I do wonder if part of his rambling is because publishers inflicted page count demands on him so he ended up having to pad his books out to make them long enough.
I absolutely LOVE Laymon... Switch off my brain and away we go.. "Out are the Lights" was the first book i ever read as a 15 year old... Im now mid 40s and re-reading a lot of his work and i still love it haha.. Just a fun fun ride...
My first Layman book I read was Island hooked ever since. Although, I usually read one a month of his books. I will read The Traveling Vampire Show next 👍
I’m speaking only from having read two of his books, neither of which are infamous for being his worst, but still contained plenty of his… trademarks: I did notice he tends to include the interiority of his main characters quite a lot, and that interiority is quite imbued in dodgy politics (lots of strange, intrusive, and irrelevant thoughts on gun control, women’s rights, and sl*t shaming), so he is definitely a strange character in that regard. I have found, however, that there’s plenty of female readers who have in a sense “reclaimed” his work and read it with amusement and intrigue as a way of maybe disarming the horrid politics going on underneath the surface. I believe that is a great power that readers hold. Lydia from Typical Books left a really eye-opening and fascinating comment on my video, where she explained that even in such skewed and stereotyped femininity as the one in his books and the burlesque nature of its exaggeration, there is something that she as a woman can recognize herself in, and such characters are a nice fold to the usual “strong female hero,” and I think it’s the same with us male readers when we read about hard-bodied, chauvinistic killing machines, for example. Anyway, we have devoted perhaps more time to Laymon than he merits 😂 but he really is a fascinating subject, so I guess his writing may be worth it if only just for that. That being said, I’ll probably never read Island now, so thank you. 🙏🏽
Does that two include The Halloween Mouse? That's really interesting about female reader reclaiming his work. I love the idea of disadvantaged or underrepresented groups taking control of the narrative in mainstream media and shaping it into something that works for them. I guess in any media the consumer is just as important as the creator and has their own part to play in the meaning of the work.
I just rewatched this video because I finished Island this week. I totally get why you view the book and Laymon's work in the way you do. Now that I'm finished with this particular book, I must say that the ending actually helped justify everything else that takes place. So, Rupert is clearly a repressed incel type and it seems we're supposed to be rooting for him the entire time. Laymon writes him as if he does just enough good that it's okay he has some terrible character flaws, and maybe we can hope that he will grow out of them one day. The end confirms that there is a true darkness to him and that he is a very deeply held misogynist. It's funny because he's so honest through the story and Rupert makes it seem like that makes him a decent person, despite his many flawed thoughts and feelings. He's so honest that he even writes in how he has kept these women caged up by the end. He has justified it in his own eyes. So, of course he wants us to think he's a good person, but we know by that last admittance that the red flags he displays throughout really are a sign of just how dark he can be. I didn't view it as Laymon justifying his actions, rather it seemed even Laymon thought of Rupert as a bad guy. I could be wrong. I have the disadvantage of only having read two books of his now, and the other was pretty mild in its creepiness compared to this (The Woods are Dark). Maybe after I read more I'll change my mind, but I had such a blast with this book and I couldn't help but laugh at how ridiculous Rupert was. I never liked him, but I definitely felt justified in that feeling by the end. -Brandon
Hey Brandon - that's a really fascinating take on Rupert and looking back I think you're probably right. I think my problem with Island is that it's so long and so that message gets diluted. In a 250 page book it might have worked better. I definitely think Laymon's shorter books are more successful on the whole.
@@CriminOllyBlog that makes sense too. I did like how quick The Woods are Dark was, it didn't meander and waste time with pointless red herrings like Island did.
I read three of Laymon's books back in the day: The Stake, The Traveling Vampire Show, and The Island. I agree with your assessment of him: easy reads, interesting ideas at times (The Stake was a great idea), but absolutely obsessed with sexualizing everything. The Island was too much for me, and I think was the last Laymon book I read. I felt like I was reading torture porn, but I wanted to know how it ended. When I finished it, I closed the book and thought, "What is wrong with this guy?" LOL.
i just found this video and you are so spot on with this. i won't lie i consider him a guilty pleasure author, because his characters and points INFURIATE ME every time, but they are just So Damn Readable. they are so good for distraction, because i get so annoyed at the book that i can't be annoyed by anything else going on in my life. anyway, i had to comment because of that german title. after getting through my first book of his "into the fire" my first thought was "this man writes books exclusively for incels".
Thank you! I'm glad you get it (especially as I get lots of negative comments on this video!). You're right, he's really trashy but compelling and fun as well
I like some of Laymon's work though I prefer the short stories to the novels. To me, he's like a '30s pulp writer trapped in an '80s slasher writer's career. When he sets about writing simple, pulpy tales of private detectives, domestic murders, and Tales of the Unexpected-esque material, he can be very good. He's a magazine-y writer. Not up to much in the way of characterisation or style, but good with a plot twist.
@@CriminOllyBlog If you feel so inclined, try Dreadful Tales. It's my favourite book by him. Also Fiends, which collects a few of his early crime stories published in the '70s and '80s.
I live in the U.S. and I discovered him after he died ... I read a lot of his books in my early 20s and then kind of moved on to other authors. Regarding the sex ... I think he understood his target audience and the lurid material they wanted to buy. His books seemed to have followed the successful formula of Horror films of the 70s and 80s ... Lots of Blood and Lots of Sex.
I think that's a very fair comment and the commercial drive probably played a big part in shaping his books. That said, I think he was into it himself at least a bit - I doubt his themes would have been as consistent and heartfelt otherwise.
That was pretty spot on. Ive only just started reading his books and they are very much like b-movie or 70s porn/horror in book form. - I do agree that there is far too much r*pe in these books, but again, like you, they are kind of enjoyable and just enough crazy, too make you want to read another one. Definately a guilty pleasure author I feel. Side note - Ive watched interviews with him and he does come across very odd!
Great video. Cant disagree with your criticisms. I went through a big Laymon phase about 15 years ago. I cannot put one of his books down when I start reading them (with the exception of Funland and Travelling Vampire Show). They hook you in, there's always a cliff hanger at the end of each chapter and you have to keep progressing. They helped me forget about my life when I was going through a very rough patch in a job where I was encountering a lot of bullying and harassment, which is ironic when you think about it. That being said the content is highly disturbing and you wonder why you read it and what the author was thinking. Mind you I've felt that about Game of Thrones aswell. Laymon actually has alot of female fans on the online boards, which shouldn't be a surprise if you see how many women queue up for the Shades of Grey novels. Some of his ideas are great. In the Dark was a compelling suspenseful mystery thriller that had the worst ending that looked like he rushed it out. Body Rides is a great concept as is Night in the lonesome October. I agree with you about the demonisation of the homeless, which even 15 years ago disturbed me.
Thank you. I think escapism is really important and agree that there isn't always much rhyme or reason to it. What matters is that the books take us out of ourselves for a while. It is something I struggle with myself a lot, as many of the books I enjoy are pretty awful in many ways.
Night in Lonesome October along with Traveling Vampire Show were my favorites of his. Interesting that you loved the former but couldn't get into the latter. To me they are both excellent. His books are disturbing and they surely have their sexist misogynistic threads that were, as Olly points out kind of a sign of the times but his plots are I think often quite interesting/engaging and he often has 2 or 3 interwoven in his books, and you are not disappointed to move from one to the other because they all hold your interest.
When I first read Laymon I hated it. The Woods Are Dark is not a good place to start with Laymon. I gave him another shot and 3 years later I've read all his novels. There's 5 things I look for in a book. Characters, Fun, Ideas, Story and Style. If you fail in one of these that's okay, but if you hit all it's almost great. And going by these 5 things... Laymon kills, man. His books are fun and with great ideas (The Stake has a great premise, One Rainy Night, Night On A Lonesome October, Funland...). His style is simple but well thought out (he uses few well placed words to make his sentences declarative and at the same time provide the information needed for the reader to get what the character is either feeling, thinking out, seeing, smelling...) and makes for a quick read. His characters are generic but they serve the story. In the word of pulp horror no one does it better than Laymon.
@@CriminOllyBlog Funland has a goofy ending but again the idea, the characters and the style makes it very interesting to me. Boleta Bay is an awesome location, characters like Cowboy and the girl with the banjo are among Laymon's most memorable and the style is again very simple but thought out. At first I did not understand why writers kept mentioning Laymon and then I got it. Take Ray Garton for exemple. I read a few of his books and enjoyed him. He has the sex and the violence to go along with Laymon, but his style kept bothering me. Way too much exposition and telling. Laymon shows what's going on. And he does it with declarative sentences and well placed adjectives. Island is a fan favorite but I don't really like it. Laymon had a few good first person books like Lonesome October and The Travelling Vampire Show, but After Midnight and Island are not that good. Allhallows Eve is fun but I don't remember much about it. I think Laymon took a while but his best stuff is later 80s, early 90s. Starting with Funland or maybe a little earlier with Flesh. He had however a great run with the sequence Funland, The Stake, One Rainy Night and Darkness, Tell Us and then starting with Endless Night, Savage and In The Dark.
My RUclips homepage put this and a video with a title in Japanese and a thumbnail of 2 anime girls making out right next to each other. I feel like the algorithm is psychoanalyzing me and I don’t like it.
Richard Laymon is awful and this is why we love his books. I call his books "feelgood extreme horror" and this is a strange niche that he covers a lot better. I discovered him while in the UK in 2010, where horror shelves on bookshops were King, James and Laymon, then got all of his books I could buy over time. His books are horny, simplistic, tropey and I don't agree with his politics. To me his books read like everything a conservative family man fears the most and it is an interesting dive into his headspace Some of his books are also downright bad. Funland was the first book of his I have read and made me a fan. But he had a nice ear for dialoguethat make his characters interesting and the B-movie quality of his works that scratches an itch in many horror book fans and, when you read a lot of the Nasties from UK in the 80s you see that there are far worse authors in that lot than Laymon (Mark Ronson comes immediately to my mind). PS: Also, mentioning Gor (which I have not read) there is a trending series of books right now called "ice planet barbarians" which is somewhat similar and quite popular with women today so whatever rocks people's boats.
There are certainly worse authors 😂 The fact that Laymon had such a long career is proof he was doing something right. I do agree there’s something strangely appealing about his books, even when they’re awful. I’ve heard about those Ice Planet Barbarian books, maybe I should read one and do a comparison between them and the Gor books
That has do be a men thing, becouse there is nothing do feel good about his books, it Made me angree. There is much better out there, that is not sexist and unrealistic.
Just found your channel and really enjoy your reviews and commentary. I loved Richard Laymon as a teen in the early 2000s. I also remember his books being very prominent in Waterstones. I remember particularly enjoying A Night in the Lonesome October. I didn't realise it was one of his last books, but it did seem a little, dare I say, more mature than some of his schlock. It certainly had some of his most well-developed characters, from what I can recall. He'll always have a place in my heart, if nothing else because his is probably the largest collection of physical books I had when I lived at my parents', and before I shifted to reading pretty much everything on Kindle. I'd be interested to revisit some of his work over 20 years after I last read it , but at the same time I don't want to risk ruining the good memories I have of it.
When I was younger (late teens early 20's if i remember correctly) I read almost every Laymon book I could find at the library within a period of a year or something like that. I remember enjoying them at the time for being reliably entertaining trashy junk foodesque horror novels with lots of over the top violence. Though out of the ones I read I don't remember which I enjoyed most. Recently I've wondered about how I'd feel about these books now if I revisited them. I'm not super well versed in his brand of horror and he was a bit of an outlier amongst the Stephen King, Dean Koontz, and Clive Barker stuff I read in my earlier years. The only other author I've read that I'd say compares to Laymon in style is maybe Brian Mcnaughton. But now I'm exploring more 'splatterpunk' style horror and would like to see how he compares to other writers within this style of trashy and crude fiction.
I agree he's definitely an outlier in that he's unapologetically trashy and fun in a way that the other authors mention aren't. He definitely falls into that splatterpunk tradition, but I think he's also a bit different from other authors in that area because he's deeply uncool. Interested to see what you make of him when you revisit his work!
@@CriminOllyBlog I think from memory the first novel of his that I read was 'funland' on recommendation from a friend if I recall. I'm going to revisit that one first. As a funny side note. I remember my local library (I grew up in a small Australian country town) having more laymon novels than any other horror author I looked for at the time bar stephen king lol In hindsight that strikes me as odd
@@NOopulence he was really popular in the UK as well in the late 80s/early 90s. In fact I read somewhere that he was much more popular abroad than he was in the US.
Yes I do remember his books being very visible in book stores in the 80s and 90s, my first encounter with his books is in a Manila book stores in the mid 80s only one title (I forget which one) , then saw more of his books in HOng Kong book shops and even in the airport book stores. (found the UK edition books to be much better in presentation than teh US editions). and in US bookstores. Then his books disappeared form the bookshelves by the late 90s.
Awesome video! I agree with you about Laymon. I went through a phase about 15 years ago and read his books one after another. Then I stopped and just last week I started re-reading The Travelling Vampire Show which is my favorite. My second favorite is The Midnight Tour which I plan to re-read as well. I don't know if this mean a repeat of 15 years ago, but luckily I hung on to all the Richard Laymon books that I had purchased. Cheers!
Hi! I've been wanting to read Keene for over 10 years but was never able to do so (long story short, life intervened). I am now able to start reading again and downloaded a bunch of previews for his books on my Kindle but the problem is, I like them all and don't know which one to chose! I have always been between Dark Hollow and Castaways. Any suggestions?
There's a squirrel that lives in my roof and he's like twice the size of a regular squirrel, (like the Vin Diesel of squirrels) so I've named him Bighead. As in: 'The Bighead' by Ed Lee. Love his books, Keene as well. I'm currently on 'The Darkness On The Edge Of Town' and it's probably going in my top 10 reads of all time. Highly recommend it.
I was writing short horror stories many years ago and Laymon was an influence on me. Personally, many may not like his books, but I enjoy them. Wink, wink, wink :)
Hi all. I want to read all of Laymon's published works but am falling short with a lot of his fastback books. They appear to either be unavailable or only at exorbitant prices. I would greatly appreciate a fan pointing me in the right direction!
I wasn’t even aware of those, but I just looked them up and agree they do seem to be crazily pricey. Other people may have better suggestions, but my tactic with things like that is to set up saved eBay searches covering all the possible bases and be patient.
Just read my first Laymon book. I enjoyed "The Woods are Dark". Not high art i know. I think of it as a great trashy B grade horror with a smattering of sex.
I can skip Laymon, since I have never read any and don't have any. Gor is a different story. I read the first 8 in the late 70s, early 80s, and accumulated 25 of them. I enjoyed reading them back then and am not sure why I stopped reading them. Probably because I found more hard SF to read and never got back to the Gor books. I enjoyed Edgar Rice Burroughs in the early 70s, when my choices were limited to what I could find in the school library. I moved to the city in 76 and started visiting bookstores. A school friend who moved to the city at the same time, told me about the Gor books, and I started spending my student loan on paperbacks from the science fiction section of the bookstores that I was visiting. Gor books felt like more of the adventure that I loved in the Edgar Rice Burroughs books.
Yeah, it’s that fantasy adventure side that I really enjoy about the books. They’re just great escapist fun, full of action and colour. Thanks for watching!
Ive only read one book of Richard Laymon’s and I was a teenager. I quite enjoyed it and finished it in one night. Years later I never understood why people hated his writing but maybe I didnt because his book was an introduction to Horror genre for me and now its all I read lol. I am interested in reading more of his books with my adult eyes just to see what maybe some others are so upset about.
I took Dark Mountain and one of his short story books on holiday to read recently. I've had these books years and thought I'd re-read them. I don;t usually part with books but I left both of them in our apartment for someone else to 'enjoy' as I found them to be pretty cringeworthy reading all these years later.
I've heard about you and your 100 books challenge from Michael K. Vaughan and I should have hopped over much earlier than now! Michael said that my review of Laymons Midnight’s Lair is one of his favourite reviews ever 😄 it's the only Laymon book I've read and it was terrible. Before I read it I had bought a kindle copy of another of his books and just afterwards I received a 3rd of his books so I might read more of him. And when you mentioned Savage I thought I might give that a go because the 19th century is my favourite thing, Dracula etc. Laymon used to work for a law firm and has other credentials that suggest he should be better than the account he gives of himself in his books
Michael does like complaining about the challenge, which apparently I "forced" him to take part in. I'll have to check out your Midnight's Lair review. I find Laymon an interesting writer in that as bad as he is, his books have a definite entertainment value.
Excellent review. I read Richard about 15 or so years back. I was tired of King and Koontz so I went back to him a few months back. Some of his books 📚 aren't great but some are a brilliant read like Savage. Night in the lonesome October to name a few. I still have 20 or so of his books 📚 to read cos I think he wrote 35. My local library is helping me cos I live in Dublin Ireland and can't buy them anywhere. And don't read the cellar cos even i was pretty offended with some of the writing in that
Last year an ice storm took out the power lines in my area, so I was without electricity for a few days. I was bored out of my mind after 12 hrs without technology. My ex had left a box of books, so I grabbed one off the top and started reading it. It was Night in the Lonesome October. I have to say I thought it was pretty good. I can picture it being a really good movie with the right director.
I consider Glory Bus his best. He actually developed characters beyond "hero bad ass" "vulnerable heroin" "rape demon villain". Island, beast house trilogy, endless night, funhouse, body rides were all unique. But Glory Bus came from nowhere and left me hoping for a Boots & Duke spin off! And then he passed away.
Everything about Richard Laymon book experiences I have had can be summed up as: rape. Genuine scares? No, but we have rape. Morbid gore? No, morbid rape. Suspense? No, you already know they get raped. Hideous monstrosities? Yeah, and they mainly rape. Dark atmosphere? Not really, most of his books take place in California, and then rape happens. I don’t enjoy rape in any media so I’m not exactly a fan, it’s a truly despicable act and that should go without even saying it. But rape is horrific, so his place as a horror writer is genuine. I consider myself an avid horror fan, so I gave Laymon more than a few chances with his books. Not my cup of tea, but I don’t judge his fans. People experience horror differently, I engross myself in the atmospheric aspects. Some people revel in the revolting details. More power to them.
Very balanced and thoughtful assessment. I've read a few and feel pretty much the same, one mate once described it as 'reading for kicks' (not a comment on the the sicko side !) And another really bigged up the island to me once and this now makes sense because that guy WAS like laymon, harmless in real life,but a total perv. You're right is symptomatic of the time, to be fair to him tramps as villains and subhumanoids is a bit of a staple. Thing of the ENDLESS 80s 90s horror pics, with the bum by the oil drum. have you seen STREET TRASH?!! now that is a un pc movie. (For me so unpc that it kind of cacels itself) but yes it is good that the language has shifted. We are one and all only one degree from being them. Into the lonesome November is atmospheric, bit when I reread when I was older I noticed that on one level the whole thing is a rape fantasy! 😂 One thing you neglected to mention is that EVERYONE who ever knew laymon said he was the nicest man in the world!
LOL at that last sentence! I guess it's the nice guys you have to watch out for. I have seen Street Trash and love it, but yeah agree it goes so far that it ceases to be offensive about any one particular thing
I still find laymon to be quite fun almost as a palate cleanser from time to time. But even as a teen I got sick of seeing the word "rump" and every man being an opportunistic rapist. Honestly though, I found shaun hutson and was much more enamoured with his work than I was with laymons.
Normally I like horror, gross horror even. However, I really am not a fan of his writing. Just his prose and his characters are a bit shallow. The way he describes anatomy is boring I think. The way he writes human emotion isn't great. Like I feel his characters are bland. Emotion is such a huge part of reading horror and I felt bored. Good video, sir. You summed up most of my thoughts. PS- Your accent is really cool :)
Just finished listening to the audiobook of The woods are dark, having never read or heard his books before. The man seems obsessed with sex. It is ridiculous how the protagonists are all as horny as hell even though they are being pursued by insane cannibals. Sex would be the last thing on their mind in that situation. It is ridiculous. He is no Stephen King.
The little speech about breasts gave me "disappointed dad finds his sons grubby magazine stash" vibes.😆😆😆. As a woman who grew up reading horror/ sci fi, I'm probably a bit desensitized to the misogyny in its different forms of writing, I just sort of roll my eyes and keep reading. There are some I gave up on😆😆
In America, we have freedom of speech and of the press. Many authors write horrible books on subjects that are distasteful and we either have the right to read them or not read them. I do not believe in book banning. However, I do in school libraries. Put it back into the parents' hands. As a society, we have progressed in what we are willing to accept happening in society as a whole. From the seventies to the now, these things have changed. Does that make the books less important? No. You have a choice, either to keep going or stop. Laymon wrote of unacceptable things, and he was also writing horror. There is a difficult line to follow. Somehow some people want to put the same societal judgements on literature that is hundreds of years old and making judgements based on today. Not good nor is it smart. It is narrow and closed minded because really, it's not about you.
I feel similarly about Stephen King. I've read quite a few of his older classics, and while they are very fun and scary, there's also an undertone - sometimes an overtone - of misogyny, racism, and homophobia that I just can't stomach. It's put me off reading any more of him, and I don't know whether his more recent books are better in that regard. However, I recently read some Joe Hill, and found the same thing, so I'm guessing it doesn't get better - and he definitely should know better! While in his short stories the good at least balanced and outweighed the bad, I had to stop reading "Horns." Both of them will put really offensive words in the mouths of the "bad guys", not in order to actually address issues of misogyny, racism, and homophobia, but as a way of showing these are "bad" characters. I really don't like that, and won't read more from either of them.
It’s basically just 70’s , 80’s slasher/horror. If someone gets offended I guess they’ve not seen many horror movies. Gore and teen sex is part of the parcel. They would freak out reading American Psycho, now that’s descriptive
I'm currently reading and struggling with Endless night... I'm pretty sure I would have thought it was great when I was 14. Hard work at 46. I'll finish it though
I am a big fan of Resurrection Dreams. Really good book, very different from any horror or thriller I have read. Super memorable villain, and yes, he is a sexist creep, though that is NOT what is memorable about him. Great stuff. He may have missed the mark or been too misogynistic overall, but I feel he got this novel right.
I like that you mentioned how besides being dodgy and weird in content, his descriptions tend to be, plain and simple, BORING! From a stylistic standpoint it is so often terrible and unenjoyable writing. I might try Savage since it sounds quite different, but having read two of his other books which were full of jiggling rumps, I think I’m good otherwise. 😂 A fantastic takedown of his work, Olly!
Thank you! I do think there is something fascinating about writer's whose inner self is on display as much as Laymon's is, but yeah, it does get a bit tiresome after a while.
I became a horror fan in my 20s. Throughout the '80s and '90s it was VERY hard to find horror that was actually good! Laymon's work is typical of the time, i.e. lurid, unpleasant and awfully written. I think modern horror is a vast improvement.
Less than 5 minutes in, and I feel so seen. Let me preface this by saying I don't think writers believe everything they write, and horror gets to be horrifying, but that misogyny and portrayal of women in Endless Night felt too telling. Everyone in Endless Night sexualizes the two female characters, they sexualize themselves, and at least one of the sexualizes the other. So, when the villain does it, it feels like "join the crowd." I will never think of Laymon without thinking about the jokes around men writing women badly. He loves to have them breast boobily. Or to have one woman -- girl, really -- notice what the recoil from a gun does to the cleavage of another woman. Oh, and the kid who liked to stick his crotch in the main character's crotch and breathe in deeply for comfort. His family is dead -- hey, happens early on -- and his first impulse is to crotch sniff. And let's not go into when he is tempted to do the wrong thing. Then, the bad guy does drag and sexualizes himself, and that figures. Then, a dog rips his face open, and I really loved that part. 😐
Laymon for me has always been an uneasy blend of the enjoyable and the icky. He can write fun scenes of horror and suspense, but yeah you do feel like you’re seeing more of him on the page than you might want to
I like The Stake. Richard Laymon seemed to be in a state of sexual arrested development, with his obsession with topless women and/or submissive adult females and dominant male adolescents (Island).
I used to read Laymon, not my cup of tea now. Bentley Little is much better, I have all his novels The Consultant is my favourite one. Forgot how bad Laymon was.
I've only read his first book, The Cellar. I'm baffled it was ever published. His writing is sloppy, the story telling is lazy, and he's gleefully cruel towards women and children. I won't be reading any more from him.
I don't mind misogony in characters not rl of course, but they have to be written well. If someone is a bad writer the plot can be flawless I won't be able to read it. the first time I read his and he wrote in an entire page of screaming noises, "arghhhhh" I just lol I was done.
Glad to find your channel today thanks to Mr Steve D. I also read Laymon and share similar opinions on his works. Now to explore more of your videos.. Its nice to discover a fellow Brit on Booktube.
I doubt anyone will read this but I read only one of his books. I can't really say I read it because I never finished it. The book was called a long night in October or something like that. It was really boring. The whole story was just about a college guy walking around the he town meeting few people including a weird chick who breaks in house and now and than weird shit happened. It was like there was no plot. And it was just badly written. I have to admit I was use to reading King who has things like plots and characters with depth not to mention he gives you real personal drama between said characters.
I think that was one of his last books and I don’t think it’s one I’ve read. In my experience his books quite often don’t have plots in the normal sense. And his characters are rarely fleshed out at all. I do have a fondness for his work, for all it’s flaws though.
@@CriminOllyBlog I wouldn't mind the whole plot problem if there was something interesting going on. I have read Philip K Dick and his books feel plotless often, in fact they feel like slice of life only if that life was in some nightmarish future, but he gave you something. I might try him again but I can't say I will jump to read another one pf his books.
@@CriminOllyBlog If he is hopefully next time I spot his books it is going to be one of his better ones. Still he has to get behind Joe Hill Fireman (I have but still have not read) Bentley Little's The Store which I just started Robert McCammon's Sawn Song that might be my book for the fall and whatever King is bring out this September. That all said I will do my best to keep a open mind.
i am fairly new to Laymon books, only having a few read. I do find his horror to be a bit over the top, and the endings to his books for the ones i have read are cringe worthy honestly lol. The Woods are Dark , I actually liked the book quite a lot, but the ending for lack of better terms, pissed me off lol I dont mid the sexual stuff because i grew up in the 80s watching horror movies and thats pretty much all they were as well , a stalker/killer after teenagers that seem to always be sexual involved at the time of their deaths lol
Ha! Isn't the world strange. I watched this video and not two days later came across Island, in hardback in a local charity shop. I thought long and hard about it and decided, no, I don't need that in my life, thanks Olly!
Excellent vid, sorry I missed it when it came out. The way that I look at it is that Laymon is the proto extreme horror writer. The idea seems to be to create the dirtiest most horrible scenario with the worst characters kinda like grim dark before grim dark. Horror movies of the time did the same. If you look at the chronology, after the satanic panic the religious/paranormal thing was overdone and there wasn't much left that could offend. In the US in particular compared with the UK and Europe sex is taboo; I think that Laymon is a product of the time in that he represents the male fantasy taken to the extreme that would have been present in such a sexually repressed middle class part of America. Also in the 80s and early 90s due to the economic problems in places like NY there was a rape and homelessness epidemic and no police to sort it etc, I think that Laymon was good at finding current the fears of middle class America and putting them into a story that is so extreme that it makes you reconsider your views/realise how narrow or wrong those view are (like describing young girls in the same way as adults etc). If you look at modern extreme horror, most is just shock value but the earlier stuff like Edward Lee's Header etc. although disgusting does start to challenge the readers views on sexuality, violence and class. With regards to his descriptions of breasts etc. I agree it's overdone but I think that this is clever marketing more than anything. Horror at the time was pulp and the movies had scream queens that you would literally go to see just them because all the films were the same anyway; Linnea Quigley basically made a living showing her breasts (and fair play to her) and it's my opinion that Laymon's books try to be more cinematic than literary if that makes sense. If you can grab that reader looking for that kind of thing and at the same time challenge their views that's a good thing although not to everyone's taste. I love that you had a view on his writing and yet still went back and took the time to re-read his work etc. That is something rarely seen nowadays, most youtubers just pick someone to rant about and cannot justify it whilst I agree with many of your points and they are clearly well thought out. Overall I think that Laymon is a better short story writer as, like you said, 500+ pages of this can be a tad too much! Top vid!
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed the video. I think your take on what lead to Laymon's success is spot on - he definitely taps into the appeal of the kind of the b-movies that Linnea Quigley featured in. I'm working my way through one of his collections at the moment and agree his style suits shorter work really well.
Great video! My take on Laymon: I first read Funland years ago in my teens, barely remember it other than I didn't like it. I then read In The Dark, and liked how it started at the idea behind it, but quickly realized Laymon was more focused on sex and cheap thrills than he was plot and substance. I THEN read Dark Mountain, earlier this year, and I enjoyed it more than my previous 2 books by him, but I was also a bit put off by how much unnecessary sexual content was included and lack of a coherent story. However, there were moments where Laymon's writing really captured me, a couple of scenes in Dark Mountain, where I was just pulled into the story and felt like I was right there. I certainly think he does have some talent as an author and I love how.fast paced his books are, generally, but I can't see myself ever becoming a fan and I've always wondered if he may have been a bit perverted or chauvinistic in real life, due to the nature of his books. I mean no disrespect to the author but I wholly agree that his obsession with the human anatomy(female, specifically) is a bit discomforting to read about, page after page. However, I have the Traveling Vampire Show which I've heard is one of his best so I plan on giving him one last shot. I really do enjoy some aspects of his books and writing style even if I'm been mostly.letdown overall.
Thank you! I totally agree that he can be really quite good, I think the issue is that he has no filter at all, and doesn't seem to have employed an editor to temper his more ridiculous impulses. I suspect in another universe there is a Laymon who has written 5 great books rather than 30 so so ones.
Island, classic murder mystery unfolding with the under dog surviving with horrific things happening weighting up against his own desires. A lot to unlock there. ....
Brilliant video. I’ve only read four of of his books, one of which he wrote under the pseudonym Richard Kelly (Tread Softly) which was to be honest marginally better than the previous one I read (Bite) which was dreadful!
Have you read any David Sodergren? It's basically Laymon but infinitely better written (in my opinion) and with equality for sexes. I'd suggest The Forgotten Island or Night Shoot or Satan's Burnouts. Fun, quick, powerful. Love all of them! Love your vid, I can feel myself becoming tired of Laymon, but like you say, there is enough bizarre entertainment value for a quick read of his every now and then.
I have! Really enjoy his books - I haven't read all of them but have read the 3 you call out. In fact there's a review of Satan's Burnouts on the channel
Laymon is one of my favorite horror authors ever. He gives people what they want and doesn’t over complicate things. If you’re triggered by him you shouldn’t be reading horror anyway.
I just finished Savage. I enjoyed it. It was adequate 😊 he did talk about breasts a fair bit😀 Looking at his other books, I wasn’t sure I would like them.
I remember a conversation with Laymon on the threads for the Richard Laymon Kills! site circa 1999-2000 & he was definitely a right-wing nutjob...he was pro-Reagan and thought that police powers should be expanded to allow them to get away with murder and brutality more easily and was vehemently antifeminist, pro-life and always going on about "family values" and the preservation of suburbia and the like. In a way, his books reflect his worldview: monsters constantly intruding upon white-bread lily white suburbia and the necessity of defeating them. Stephen King argued in his DANSE MACABRE that horror is a fundamentally conservative genre and Laymon is definite proof of that. He'd definitely be a MAGAT if he was around today. FWIW his non-fiction book A WRITER'S TALE is fantastic, has great writing advice and goes into graphic detail as to why he wasn't popular in the states as he was in the UK. I think that Laymon's publisher and editor likely forced him to include lots of the graphic sex, rape and sexually deviant psychopath characters as it was his "trademark" if you will and it's what his audience. Not saying that justifies it, but likely a factor.
Laymon is a nasty treat. He has a couple of clunkers and only one book I outright HATED, which is ISLAND. A particular favourite is IN THE DARK, which is kind of like THE DA VINCI CODE if written by the Marquis de Sade.
I just read the stupidest Richard Laymon book last night. It was called The Wilds, a short novella and it was about this guy who had broken up with his girlfriend and decided to go to the wilds to do some camping. Then he is spying on women (10 per cent of the book is about descriptions of women) and a really hot one (of course) catches him and you know what he does when he gets caught? Shits and pisses himself. I am not joking. How was this published? I hated this book. I have a review on it on my channel but it has spoilers but seriously, that book sucked
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I loved reading the Richard Laymon novels on my kindle back when I used to work nights by myself in a gas station..one night we had a power cut and I was in the middle of a Laymon book, I forget which one but I was jumpy for the rest of the night having thoughts about people creeping into the gas station...when a friend of mine showed up at 4am and I was still jumpy I hadn't seen him enter the store so I literally screamed as I turned around and there stood this hulking 6ft 4 Icelandic Hells Angel with long hair....kindest soul you could meet but my word did my heart nearly stop. We had a good laugh about it afterwards but I'll never forget how terrified I was.
😂😂 that does sound like an alarming experience! Glad you got over it and it didn’t take away your love for horror
@@citycrusher9308 hold on… the Handmaid’s Tale is a feminist work about male oppression. Laymon’s books are cheesy horror thrillers that get off on descriptions of T&A and stalking. The two things couldn’t be more different. Like I literally can’t think of two things that touch on male/female relationships that are more different.
@@citycrusher9308 why do you spell women with 2 vs instead of a w?
The 6ft Nordic biker sounds like a character in his books who'd be a temporary hero/saviour before the killer/monster takes him out.
As a german I was laughing out loud about the statement about the phonetic similarity between the german word Insel and the english abbreviation Incel which condenses to a revealing and fitting description of Rupert and with that Laymons obvious sexism.
Are we sure the woman being stalked trope is misogyny though? The final girl is the hero, not the villain. You could just as easily interpret the psycho stalker as a manifestation of male self loathing, which I suspect is closer to the truth. As for Laymon, In the Dark is a good one. Somebody actually made a low budget movie adaptation of it shot on some lofi consumer camera. It's actually pretty good and has a way better ending than Laymon's book. It's on RUclips
I totally agree that it doesn't have to be misogynist, but (for me at least) Laymon often makes it feel like it is. I'll have to check out that movie!
I was trying to describe Laymon's books to someone recently...best I could come up with was: Remember those movies you used to get in video shops back in the day with lurid gory and pornographic covers? Imagine that, but books.
😂😂😂 that’s pretty perfect
Agreed 😎👍
Sanitised version.
Stephen King without a conscience is the tagline that’s stuck for me. I’ve read a few now and it looks like his mid career stuff is what I like. The earlier titles I read have been a bit of a mess. Enjoying bite currently and it’s an enjoyable read.
The video nasties as they used to call them? Yeah, I think Laymon was attempting to mimic that in book form. He wasn't a hack; he had a BA & MA in English literature and was a high school English teacher and president of a horror writers association where he tutored up and coming writers. His nonfiction book A WRITER'S TALE is fantastic; it's a shame it's so hard to find.
Richard Laymon books are depraved! He is my favorite author!
Ha! They really are
This dude has a stick planted firmly up his ass about "sexual details". 🤭🤭🤭
Same!
Maybe I'm a creep lol, but he's becoming one of my favorite authors. I don't have much to go on, I've only read Night in the Lonesome October and am making my way through The Cellar, but I still don't know if I've had as much fun with a book in the "splatterpunk" realm than with what I've read so far by him. Juan and I swapped some books and he gave me both Savage and Island, so I'm curious to dig into those soon.
I love him. I’ve read over 20 of his books and most of them are great
I do think The Cellar is pretty great - he just keeps pushing and pushing with it. The problem with him (and to be fair with many writers) is that he's uneven (some great books, some awful ones) and his own personal obsessions often take over his books and end up dominating them. I love Savage and hate Island so will be interesting to hear what you think of them
I agree that when he's good, he's a lot of fun!
Savage is pretty good, it has a bit more depth to it than his other stuff
I have long held the opinion that Laymon wrote, to some extent at least, like a 14-year-old boy (albeit a talented one). He was frequently fixated on sex in his books, often to the point of derailing the story in places and his characters are wacko, often quickly descending into depravity at the slightest push, but most frequently just not acting like anybody I have ever met. I remember reading a message board years ago and someone (who was a professional writer, although I don't remember who, but he was a primarily small press horror writer) posted about Laymon and mentioned that Laymon had the most realistic characters he had ever read. That left me wondering what Laymon novels he'd read because those were certainly not any that I have read. As an example, in his novel Body Rides, the main character comes home to his girlfriend and tells her that he has been having sex with the woman he brought home with him. Her reaction is to then have sex with him and then all three of them get it on.
All criticisms aside, Laymon was a fun writer. A Laymon novel from time-to-time is enjoyable, but reading a few in a row will tend to become one giant blur of weird homicidal guys and people who do things that people in real life just would not do.
After reading the title of this video, I was prepared for a very shame inducing kind of video. I’m so glad, that it turned out to be a very interesting opinion on Laymons books. I have to agree on almost every point you laid out. I couldn’t even finish the island (Die Insel). However, every once in a while I take one of his books from my shelf and have a good time with it. Even though I have a problem with most of his characters, their motives and their questionable behaviour ( especially towards women).
Thanks for watching! I think some commenters just read the (admittedly inflammatory) title and then waded in to tell me I was wrong. I've actually (re)read a couple more of his books since filming this and thoroughly enjoyed them. I stand by my assessment that he is awful, but he's also great
Island has one of the best twist endings ever so you missed out
@@PunkRockLifer interesting - now I’m torn as to whether or not to subject myself to the book. So there’s a different twist other than the one he talked about?
Ha. It's important to be awful in art sometimes. It's important to say " I am a criminal. I am not a decent human being that wants to be a part of civilization. I dream dreams of sexual and violent atrocity. " I started with James Herbert and followed the path to Jim Thompson, Richard Laymon and Jack Ketchum, etcetera. So many pervert writers. So little time.@@CriminOllyBlog
In my opinion, Laymon is good when you don’t binge read him (like I did). I had to put Flesh away for a while since I am so sick of reading only Laymon. Now, I notice how similar his books are and they types of phrases he uses and to me, it gets a bit tiring. But overall, Laymon is a pretty good author. Especially if you’re horny 😂😂😂
Yeah I think he can get samey quickly!
Flesh was the first for me. And Glory Bus was the final!
I'm not in the least bit ashamed about my fandom of Richard Laymon. I barely read a word of any books from between the ages of 9-14, and King and Koontz did absolutely nothing for me.
But Laymon provided horror with absolute VISCERA 🔪👹 And thus, my reading motivation returned with a vengeance, and trained my resolve for the likes of more advanced horror fiction. For that, I'll always be indebted to him.
Not all of his books were good, though. Allhallows Eve was my least favourite one 🙄
Any writer who motivates a reader like he did you is a treasure! For all my (hopefully fairly good natured) criticism of Laymon, I do have a fondness for him, cheesy as his books can be.
King is the greatest horror writer
@@CriminOllyBlog aren't most horror books cheesy especially if written in the 80s
@@Infamous41 Many are, but not all by any means. And I think Laymon takes it to another level 😂
@1st responder I couldn't disagree more with that statement, respectfully. Jack Ketchum is my candidate for the best horror writer of all time 😈
His best book is The Traveling Vampire Show, probably because it’s so much different to everything else he wrote.
I have a copy of that one somewhere, can't remember if it's one I read back in my teens or not
It is his best book indeed
I have read the 4 Beast House books and I thought they are quite good in terms of being completely (weirdly) different to almost all other things I’ve read. Not of any particular high quality at all, but interesting enough none the less. And I thought the thread and characters running through the books was satisfying, if not particularly clever. Tried following those up with The Travelling Vampire Show which has stalled, I just can’t seem to stay interested. So not sure what I’ve learned about Laymon. Maybe the beast house books just held my attention at the time of reading, the right book at the right time.
I think there is something about the right book at the right time with everything we read. I also think Laymon is quite hit and miss, so maybe you just got lucky!
Read the first Beast House book and really enjoyed it
As a teenage boy I LOVED Island. Need to read it again as a 40yr old.
I'm a similar age and I read it again a few months ago.... Just as good 👍🏼
He is very detailed with his character's movements. He really wanted to put the reader into his stories, like a trailing shadow.
That's a good observation - yes he's very voyeuristic
I think you made some great criticisms of Laymon’s books, and put in perspective the odd fixations of his characters. (and perhaps him, but I try not to analyse people I’ve never met)
I’ve read Darkness Tell Us, Body Rides, Cuts, and Island. Darkness… was incredibly difficult to put down and very pulp-ish - probably my favorite. Body Rides was a prime example of his rambling, but the concept was excellent and would be a great idea for a movie.
Thank you! I do wonder if part of his rambling is because publishers inflicted page count demands on him so he ended up having to pad his books out to make them long enough.
I absolutely LOVE Laymon... Switch off my brain and away we go..
"Out are the Lights" was the first book i ever read as a 15 year old...
Im now mid 40s and re-reading a lot of his work and i still love it haha..
Just a fun fun ride...
My first Layman book I read was Island hooked ever since. Although, I usually read one a month of his books. I will read The Traveling Vampire Show next 👍
Cool! Glad you enjoy his books - I'm going to be reading more soon!
Travelling vampire show is one of my favourite novels by any author. Brilliant coming of ages novel.
This video isn’t even available to watch yet and already it’s the best video of the month.
I AGREEEEEE
Tbh it’s just me rambling as usual. 😂
I’m speaking only from having read two of his books, neither of which are infamous for being his worst, but still contained plenty of his… trademarks: I did notice he tends to include the interiority of his main characters quite a lot, and that interiority is quite imbued in dodgy politics (lots of strange, intrusive, and irrelevant thoughts on gun control, women’s rights, and sl*t shaming), so he is definitely a strange character in that regard. I have found, however, that there’s plenty of female readers who have in a sense “reclaimed” his work and read it with amusement and intrigue as a way of maybe disarming the horrid politics going on underneath the surface. I believe that is a great power that readers hold. Lydia from Typical Books left a really eye-opening and fascinating comment on my video, where she explained that even in such skewed and stereotyped femininity as the one in his books and the burlesque nature of its exaggeration, there is something that she as a woman can recognize herself in, and such characters are a nice fold to the usual “strong female hero,” and I think it’s the same with us male readers when we read about hard-bodied, chauvinistic killing machines, for example.
Anyway, we have devoted perhaps more time to Laymon than he merits 😂 but he really is a fascinating subject, so I guess his writing may be worth it if only just for that. That being said, I’ll probably never read Island now, so thank you. 🙏🏽
Does that two include The Halloween Mouse?
That's really interesting about female reader reclaiming his work. I love the idea of disadvantaged or underrepresented groups taking control of the narrative in mainstream media and shaping it into something that works for them. I guess in any media the consumer is just as important as the creator and has their own part to play in the meaning of the work.
@@CriminOllyBlog Shit! You’re right! 😂 3 then! The Halloween Mouse is truly his masterpiece.
I just rewatched this video because I finished Island this week. I totally get why you view the book and Laymon's work in the way you do. Now that I'm finished with this particular book, I must say that the ending actually helped justify everything else that takes place.
So, Rupert is clearly a repressed incel type and it seems we're supposed to be rooting for him the entire time. Laymon writes him as if he does just enough good that it's okay he has some terrible character flaws, and maybe we can hope that he will grow out of them one day.
The end confirms that there is a true darkness to him and that he is a very deeply held misogynist. It's funny because he's so honest through the story and Rupert makes it seem like that makes him a decent person, despite his many flawed thoughts and feelings. He's so honest that he even writes in how he has kept these women caged up by the end. He has justified it in his own eyes. So, of course he wants us to think he's a good person, but we know by that last admittance that the red flags he displays throughout really are a sign of just how dark he can be. I didn't view it as Laymon justifying his actions, rather it seemed even Laymon thought of Rupert as a bad guy.
I could be wrong. I have the disadvantage of only having read two books of his now, and the other was pretty mild in its creepiness compared to this (The Woods are Dark). Maybe after I read more I'll change my mind, but I had such a blast with this book and I couldn't help but laugh at how ridiculous Rupert was. I never liked him, but I definitely felt justified in that feeling by the end. -Brandon
Hey Brandon - that's a really fascinating take on Rupert and looking back I think you're probably right. I think my problem with Island is that it's so long and so that message gets diluted. In a 250 page book it might have worked better. I definitely think Laymon's shorter books are more successful on the whole.
@@CriminOllyBlog that makes sense too. I did like how quick The Woods are Dark was, it didn't meander and waste time with pointless red herrings like Island did.
@@buyahhhhrooo4418 I think like a lot of authors his books got more bloated as he went on
I read three of Laymon's books back in the day: The Stake, The Traveling Vampire Show, and The Island. I agree with your assessment of him: easy reads, interesting ideas at times (The Stake was a great idea), but absolutely obsessed with sexualizing everything.
The Island was too much for me, and I think was the last Laymon book I read. I felt like I was reading torture porn, but I wanted to know how it ended. When I finished it, I closed the book and thought, "What is wrong with this guy?" LOL.
i just found this video and you are so spot on with this. i won't lie i consider him a guilty pleasure author, because his characters and points INFURIATE ME every time, but they are just So Damn Readable. they are so good for distraction, because i get so annoyed at the book that i can't be annoyed by anything else going on in my life.
anyway, i had to comment because of that german title. after getting through my first book of his "into the fire" my first thought was "this man writes books exclusively for incels".
Thank you! I'm glad you get it (especially as I get lots of negative comments on this video!). You're right, he's really trashy but compelling and fun as well
I like some of Laymon's work though I prefer the short stories to the novels. To me, he's like a '30s pulp writer trapped in an '80s slasher writer's career. When he sets about writing simple, pulpy tales of private detectives, domestic murders, and Tales of the Unexpected-esque material, he can be very good. He's a magazine-y writer. Not up to much in the way of characterisation or style, but good with a plot twist.
I don’t think I’ve read any of his short stories, but I think that your characterisation of him as a pulp writer is spot on.
@@CriminOllyBlog If you feel so inclined, try Dreadful Tales. It's my favourite book by him. Also Fiends, which collects a few of his early crime stories published in the '70s and '80s.
@@jackheslop2367 thank you! I’ll look out for those
I live in the U.S. and I discovered him after he died ... I read a lot of his books in my early 20s and then kind of moved on to other authors. Regarding the sex ... I think he understood his target audience and the lurid material they wanted to buy. His books seemed to have followed the successful formula of Horror films of the 70s and 80s ... Lots of Blood and Lots of Sex.
I think that's a very fair comment and the commercial drive probably played a big part in shaping his books. That said, I think he was into it himself at least a bit - I doubt his themes would have been as consistent and heartfelt otherwise.
That was pretty spot on. Ive only just started reading his books and they are very much like b-movie or 70s porn/horror in book form. - I do agree that there is far too much r*pe in these books, but again, like you, they are kind of enjoyable and just enough crazy, too make you want to read another one. Definately a guilty pleasure author I feel.
Side note - Ive watched interviews with him and he does come across very odd!
Thank you - I might have to look up those interviews!
Great video. Cant disagree with your criticisms. I went through a big Laymon phase about 15 years ago. I cannot put one of his books down when I start reading them (with the exception of Funland and Travelling Vampire Show). They hook you in, there's always a cliff hanger at the end of each chapter and you have to keep progressing. They helped me forget about my life when I was going through a very rough patch in a job where I was encountering a lot of bullying and harassment, which is ironic when you think about it. That being said the content is highly disturbing and you wonder why you read it and what the author was thinking. Mind you I've felt that about Game of Thrones aswell. Laymon actually has alot of female fans on the online boards, which shouldn't be a surprise if you see how many women queue up for the Shades of Grey novels. Some of his ideas are great. In the Dark was a compelling suspenseful mystery thriller that had the worst ending that looked like he rushed it out. Body Rides is a great concept as is Night in the lonesome October. I agree with you about the demonisation of the homeless, which even 15 years ago disturbed me.
Thank you. I think escapism is really important and agree that there isn't always much rhyme or reason to it. What matters is that the books take us out of ourselves for a while. It is something I struggle with myself a lot, as many of the books I enjoy are pretty awful in many ways.
Night in Lonesome October along with Traveling Vampire Show were my favorites of his. Interesting that you loved the former but couldn't get into the latter. To me they are both excellent. His books are disturbing and they surely have their sexist misogynistic threads that were, as Olly points out kind of a sign of the times but his plots are I think often quite interesting/engaging and he often has 2 or 3 interwoven in his books, and you are not disappointed to move from one to the other because they all hold your interest.
I actually really liked Funland… not positive why.
When I first read Laymon I hated it. The Woods Are Dark is not a good place to start with Laymon. I gave him another shot and 3 years later I've read all his novels. There's 5 things I look for in a book. Characters, Fun, Ideas, Story and Style. If you fail in one of these that's okay, but if you hit all it's almost great. And going by these 5 things... Laymon kills, man.
His books are fun and with great ideas (The Stake has a great premise, One Rainy Night, Night On A Lonesome October, Funland...). His style is simple but well thought out (he uses few well placed words to make his sentences declarative and at the same time provide the information needed for the reader to get what the character is either feeling, thinking out, seeing, smelling...) and makes for a quick read. His characters are generic but they serve the story.
In the word of pulp horror no one does it better than Laymon.
I have to say I read Allhallows Eve recently and I did enjoy that a lot more than Funland and Island which I'd read just before I made this video
@@CriminOllyBlog Funland has a goofy ending but again the idea, the characters and the style makes it very interesting to me. Boleta Bay is an awesome location, characters like Cowboy and the girl with the banjo are among Laymon's most memorable and the style is again very simple but thought out. At first I did not understand why writers kept mentioning Laymon and then I got it. Take Ray Garton for exemple. I read a few of his books and enjoyed him. He has the sex and the violence to go along with Laymon, but his style kept bothering me. Way too much exposition and telling. Laymon shows what's going on. And he does it with declarative sentences and well placed adjectives.
Island is a fan favorite but I don't really like it. Laymon had a few good first person books like Lonesome October and The Travelling Vampire Show, but After Midnight and Island are not that good.
Allhallows Eve is fun but I don't remember much about it. I think Laymon took a while but his best stuff is later 80s, early 90s. Starting with Funland or maybe a little earlier with Flesh. He had however a great run with the sequence Funland, The Stake, One Rainy Night and Darkness, Tell Us and then starting with Endless Night, Savage and In The Dark.
Richard Laymon is like the patron saint of the subreddit r/menwritingwomen.
Ha ha indeed!
My RUclips homepage put this and a video with a title in Japanese and a thumbnail of 2 anime girls making out right next to each other. I feel like the algorithm is psychoanalyzing me and I don’t like it.
Ha! it does sound like it might be...
Richard Laymon is awful and this is why we love his books. I call his books "feelgood extreme horror" and this is a strange niche that he covers a lot better.
I discovered him while in the UK in 2010, where horror shelves on bookshops were King, James and Laymon, then got all of his books I could buy over time.
His books are horny, simplistic, tropey and I don't agree with his politics. To me his books read like everything a conservative family man fears the most and it is an interesting dive into his headspace
Some of his books are also downright bad. Funland was the first book of his I have read and made me a fan.
But he had a nice ear for dialoguethat make his characters interesting and the B-movie quality of his works that scratches an itch in many horror book fans and, when you read a lot of the Nasties from UK in the 80s you see that there are far worse authors in that lot than Laymon (Mark Ronson comes immediately to my mind).
PS: Also, mentioning Gor (which I have not read) there is a trending series of books right now called "ice planet barbarians" which is somewhat similar and quite popular with women today so whatever rocks people's boats.
There are certainly worse authors 😂
The fact that Laymon had such a long career is proof he was doing something right. I do agree there’s something strangely appealing about his books, even when they’re awful.
I’ve heard about those Ice Planet Barbarian books, maybe I should read one and do a comparison between them and the Gor books
That has do be a men thing, becouse there is nothing do feel good about his books, it Made me angree. There is much better out there, that is not sexist and unrealistic.
Just found your channel and really enjoy your reviews and commentary. I loved Richard Laymon as a teen in the early 2000s. I also remember his books being very prominent in Waterstones. I remember particularly enjoying A Night in the Lonesome October. I didn't realise it was one of his last books, but it did seem a little, dare I say, more mature than some of his schlock. It certainly had some of his most well-developed characters, from what I can recall.
He'll always have a place in my heart, if nothing else because his is probably the largest collection of physical books I had when I lived at my parents', and before I shifted to reading pretty much everything on Kindle. I'd be interested to revisit some of his work over 20 years after I last read it , but at the same time I don't want to risk ruining the good memories I have of it.
I can't stand Laymon. But I also can't stand being told what I can and can't read (or write).
Good job I didn’t do that then
@@CriminOllyBlog Your video was very thoughtful. Sorry I came off so harsh. I'm still suffering from recurrent Laymonitis.
@@unstopitable no worries 😊
When I was younger (late teens early 20's if i remember correctly) I read almost every Laymon book I could find at the library within a period of a year or something like that. I remember enjoying them at the time for being reliably entertaining trashy junk foodesque horror novels with lots of over the top violence. Though out of the ones I read I don't remember which I enjoyed most.
Recently I've wondered about how I'd feel about these books now if I revisited them. I'm not super well versed in his brand of horror and he was a bit of an outlier amongst the Stephen King, Dean Koontz, and Clive Barker stuff I read in my earlier years. The only other author I've read that I'd say compares to Laymon in style is maybe Brian Mcnaughton.
But now I'm exploring more 'splatterpunk' style horror and would like to see how he compares to other writers within this style of trashy and crude fiction.
I agree he's definitely an outlier in that he's unapologetically trashy and fun in a way that the other authors mention aren't. He definitely falls into that splatterpunk tradition, but I think he's also a bit different from other authors in that area because he's deeply uncool.
Interested to see what you make of him when you revisit his work!
@@CriminOllyBlog I think from memory the first novel of his that I read was 'funland' on recommendation from a friend if I recall. I'm going to revisit that one first.
As a funny side note. I remember my local library (I grew up in a small Australian country town) having more laymon novels than any other horror author I looked for at the time bar stephen king lol In hindsight that strikes me as odd
@@NOopulence he was really popular in the UK as well in the late 80s/early 90s. In fact I read somewhere that he was much more popular abroad than he was in the US.
Yes I do remember his books being very visible in book stores in the 80s and 90s, my first encounter with his books is in a Manila book stores in the mid 80s only one title (I forget which one) , then saw more of his books in HOng Kong book shops and even in the airport book stores. (found the UK edition books to be much better in presentation than teh US editions). and in US bookstores. Then his books disappeared form the bookshelves by the late 90s.
Yeah those Steve Crisp covers in the UK were really great
Awesome video! I agree with you about Laymon. I went through a phase about 15 years ago and read his books one after another. Then I stopped and just last week I started re-reading The Travelling Vampire Show which is my favorite. My second favorite is The Midnight Tour which I plan to re-read as well. I don't know if this mean a repeat of 15 years ago, but luckily I hung on to all the Richard Laymon books that I had purchased. Cheers!
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed it!
I really got into Laymon back in 2015. Along with him, I was reading Brian Keene. Followed by Edward Lee. Loved your perspective about Richard 😊
Thank you! Keene and Lee were never as big over here as he was, but I’m starting to pick up their books now.
Hi! I've been wanting to read Keene for over 10 years but was never able to do so (long story short, life intervened). I am now able to start reading again and downloaded a bunch of previews for his books on my Kindle but the problem is, I like them all and don't know which one to chose!
I have always been between Dark Hollow and Castaways. Any suggestions?
@@island_girl in my opinion...both those titles are good...but out of those two..."Castaway"
There's a squirrel that lives in my roof and he's like twice the size of a regular squirrel, (like the Vin Diesel of squirrels) so I've named him Bighead. As in: 'The Bighead' by Ed Lee. Love his books, Keene as well. I'm currently on 'The Darkness On The Edge Of Town' and it's probably going in my top 10 reads of all time. Highly recommend it.
Jack Ketchum, RIP.
I was writing short horror stories many years ago and Laymon was an influence on me. Personally, many may not like his books, but I enjoy them. Wink, wink, wink :)
They're certainly fun when you're in the right mood. There's no one quite like him LOL
Hi all. I want to read all of Laymon's published works but am falling short with a lot of his fastback books. They appear to either be unavailable or only at exorbitant prices. I would greatly appreciate a fan pointing me in the right direction!
I wasn’t even aware of those, but I just looked them up and agree they do seem to be crazily pricey. Other people may have better suggestions, but my tactic with things like that is to set up saved eBay searches covering all the possible bases and be patient.
Just read my first Laymon book. I enjoyed "The Woods are Dark". Not high art i know. I think of it as a great trashy B grade horror with a smattering of sex.
Yeah he definitely captures that b-movie vibe
I've only read The Cellar and it was fucked up.
Ha! Yeah it really is. I reread it recently and I’d forgotten quite how far it goes
I can skip Laymon, since I have never read any and don't have any. Gor is a different story. I read the first 8 in the late 70s, early 80s, and accumulated 25 of them. I enjoyed reading them back then and am not sure why I stopped reading them. Probably because I found more hard SF to read and never got back to the Gor books. I enjoyed Edgar Rice Burroughs in the early 70s, when my choices were limited to what I could find in the school library. I moved to the city in 76 and started visiting bookstores. A school friend who moved to the city at the same time, told me about the Gor books, and I started spending my student loan on paperbacks from the science fiction section of the bookstores that I was visiting. Gor books felt like more of the adventure that I loved in the Edgar Rice Burroughs books.
Yeah, it’s that fantasy adventure side that I really enjoy about the books. They’re just great escapist fun, full of action and colour. Thanks for watching!
I know there are better writers but he is my favorite. Reading all his stuff in order again.
He's definitely fun!
@@CriminOllyBlog looking forward to watching more of your videos to get into some new authors
@@wheeljack0 Fantastic - hope you find some more that you like
Ive only read one book of Richard Laymon’s and I was a teenager. I quite enjoyed it and finished it in one night. Years later I never understood why people hated his writing but maybe I didnt because his book was an introduction to Horror genre for me and now its all I read lol. I am interested in reading more of his books with my adult eyes just to see what maybe some others are so upset about.
Is it the character that is misogynistic, or is it the writer? or does both bother you? im genuinely curious. sorry for bad english.
The writer. I don’t necessarily have an issue with misogynistic characters
I agree, I have read many RLaymon books and I believe the sex is forced on the reader. Most of it is really not important to the story.
Yeah it definitely feels gratuitous
I took Dark Mountain and one of his short story books on holiday to read recently. I've had these books years and thought I'd re-read them. I don;t usually part with books but I left both of them in our apartment for someone else to 'enjoy' as I found them to be pretty cringeworthy reading all these years later.
Yeah, I think he's best enjoyed as a teenager!
I've heard about you and your 100 books challenge from Michael K. Vaughan and I should have hopped over much earlier than now! Michael said that my review of Laymons Midnight’s Lair is one of his favourite reviews ever 😄 it's the only Laymon book I've read and it was terrible. Before I read it I had bought a kindle copy of another of his books and just afterwards I received a 3rd of his books so I might read more of him. And when you mentioned Savage I thought I might give that a go because the 19th century is my favourite thing, Dracula etc. Laymon used to work for a law firm and has other credentials that suggest he should be better than the account he gives of himself in his books
Michael does like complaining about the challenge, which apparently I "forced" him to take part in. I'll have to check out your Midnight's Lair review. I find Laymon an interesting writer in that as bad as he is, his books have a definite entertainment value.
Excellent review. I read Richard about 15 or so years back. I was tired of King and Koontz so I went back to him a few months back. Some of his books 📚 aren't great but some are a brilliant read like Savage. Night in the lonesome October to name a few. I still have 20 or so of his books 📚 to read cos I think he wrote 35. My local library is helping me cos I live in Dublin Ireland and can't buy them anywhere. And don't read the cellar cos even i was pretty offended with some of the writing in that
Thanks Ed. Agree that the Cellar goes to some very messed up places!
Love Night in the Lonesome October.
@@dianevanderlinden3480 I thought the exact same. Reviews I've watched people don't rate it at all. But it's in Laymon top 5 book 📙
Last year an ice storm took out the power lines in my area, so I was without electricity for a few days. I was bored out of my mind after 12 hrs without technology. My ex had left a box of books, so I grabbed one off the top and started reading it. It was Night in the Lonesome October. I have to say I thought it was pretty good. I can picture it being a really good movie with the right director.
The start of savage was (from memory) great, but the final few acts on the island were absolutely awful.
Oh I quite like it all the way through. It’s weird how it seems to change genre at times, but I still think it’s a fun book
I consider Glory Bus his best. He actually developed characters beyond "hero bad ass" "vulnerable heroin" "rape demon villain". Island, beast house trilogy, endless night, funhouse, body rides were all unique. But Glory Bus came from nowhere and left me hoping for a Boots & Duke spin off! And then he passed away.
Everything about Richard Laymon book experiences I have had can be summed up as: rape. Genuine scares? No, but we have rape. Morbid gore? No, morbid rape. Suspense? No, you already know they get raped. Hideous monstrosities? Yeah, and they mainly rape. Dark atmosphere? Not really, most of his books take place in California, and then rape happens. I don’t enjoy rape in any media so I’m not exactly a fan, it’s a truly despicable act and that should go without even saying it. But rape is horrific, so his place as a horror writer is genuine. I consider myself an avid horror fan, so I gave Laymon more than a few chances with his books. Not my cup of tea, but I don’t judge his fans. People experience horror differently, I engross myself in the atmospheric aspects. Some people revel in the revolting details. More power to them.
Very balanced and thoughtful assessment. I've read a few and feel pretty much the same, one mate once described it as 'reading for kicks' (not a comment on the the sicko side !) And another really bigged up the island to me once and this now makes sense because that guy WAS like laymon, harmless in real life,but a total perv. You're right is symptomatic of the time, to be fair to him tramps as villains and subhumanoids is a bit of a staple. Thing of the ENDLESS 80s 90s horror pics, with the bum by the oil drum. have you seen STREET TRASH?!! now that is a un pc movie. (For me so unpc that it kind of cacels itself) but yes it is good that the language has shifted. We are one and all only one degree from being them.
Into the lonesome November is atmospheric, bit when I reread when I was older I noticed that on one level the whole thing is a rape fantasy! 😂
One thing you neglected to mention is that EVERYONE who ever knew laymon said he was the nicest man in the world!
LOL at that last sentence! I guess it's the nice guys you have to watch out for.
I have seen Street Trash and love it, but yeah agree it goes so far that it ceases to be offensive about any one particular thing
I still find laymon to be quite fun almost as a palate cleanser from time to time. But even as a teen I got sick of seeing the word "rump" and every man being an opportunistic rapist. Honestly though, I found shaun hutson and was much more enamoured with his work than I was with laymons.
Yeah I love Hutson to this day!
Normally I like horror, gross horror even. However, I really am not a fan of his writing. Just his prose and his characters are a bit shallow. The way he describes anatomy is boring I think. The way he writes human emotion isn't great. Like I feel his characters are bland. Emotion is such a huge part of reading horror and I felt bored. Good video, sir. You summed up most of my thoughts.
PS- Your accent is really cool :)
Yeah I know what you mean, it all just feels a bit too superficial
And lol re my accent - I don't really think about it tbh :D
Just finished listening to the audiobook of The woods are dark, having never read or heard his books before. The man seems obsessed with sex. It is ridiculous how the protagonists are all as horny as hell even though they are being pursued by insane cannibals. Sex would be the last thing on their mind in that situation. It is ridiculous. He is no Stephen King.
Yeah he certainly didn't self censor at all!
The little speech about breasts gave me "disappointed dad finds his sons grubby magazine stash" vibes.😆😆😆. As a woman who grew up reading horror/ sci fi, I'm probably a bit desensitized to the misogyny in its different forms of writing, I just sort of roll my eyes and keep reading. There are some I gave up on😆😆
Yeah it was so very prevalent back then I think it was easier just not to worry about it
@@ladyowl8732 Not sure why a dad would be disappointed as pretty much all lads have a porn magazine at some point.
In America, we have freedom of speech and of the press. Many authors write horrible books on subjects that are distasteful and we either have the right to read them or not read them. I do not believe in book banning. However, I do in school libraries. Put it back into the parents' hands. As a society, we have progressed in what we are willing to accept happening in society as a whole. From the seventies to the now, these things have changed. Does that make the books less important? No. You have a choice, either to keep going or stop. Laymon wrote of unacceptable things, and he was also writing horror. There is a difficult line to follow. Somehow some people want to put the same societal judgements on literature that is hundreds of years old and making judgements based on today. Not good nor is it smart. It is narrow and closed minded because really, it's not about you.
Thanks, Denisa
I feel similarly about Stephen King. I've read quite a few of his older classics, and while they are very fun and scary, there's also an undertone - sometimes an overtone - of misogyny, racism, and homophobia that I just can't stomach. It's put me off reading any more of him, and I don't know whether his more recent books are better in that regard. However, I recently read some Joe Hill, and found the same thing, so I'm guessing it doesn't get better - and he definitely should know better! While in his short stories the good at least balanced and outweighed the bad, I had to stop reading "Horns." Both of them will put really offensive words in the mouths of the "bad guys", not in order to actually address issues of misogyny, racism, and homophobia, but as a way of showing these are "bad" characters. I really don't like that, and won't read more from either of them.
It’s basically just 70’s , 80’s slasher/horror. If someone gets offended I guess they’ve not seen many horror movies. Gore and teen sex is part of the parcel. They would freak out reading American Psycho, now that’s descriptive
I'm currently reading and struggling with Endless night... I'm pretty sure I would have thought it was great when I was 14. Hard work at 46. I'll finish it though
Yeah I first read a lot of them as a teenager and they were great 😂
I am a big fan of Resurrection Dreams. Really good book, very different from any horror or thriller I have read. Super memorable villain, and yes, he is a sexist creep, though that is NOT what is memorable about him. Great stuff. He may have missed the mark or been too misogynistic overall, but I feel he got this novel right.
I think I've read that one, but absolutely ages ago. Will have to give it another try
I like that you mentioned how besides being dodgy and weird in content, his descriptions tend to be, plain and simple, BORING! From a stylistic standpoint it is so often terrible and unenjoyable writing. I might try Savage since it sounds quite different, but having read two of his other books which were full of jiggling rumps, I think I’m good otherwise. 😂 A fantastic takedown of his work, Olly!
Thank you! I do think there is something fascinating about writer's whose inner self is on display as much as Laymon's is, but yeah, it does get a bit tiresome after a while.
I became a horror fan in my 20s. Throughout the '80s and '90s it was VERY hard to find horror that was actually good! Laymon's work is typical of the time, i.e. lurid, unpleasant and awfully written. I think modern horror is a vast improvement.
Things are definitely a LOT more nuanced now!
Quake was a banger. What people are capable of when circumstances change. Horrible, awful stuff it seems if Laymon writes it. But you believe it.
I have never even heard of him but the looks of his paperbacks remind me a lot of Dean Koontz books so that can't be a good thing.
LOL he's more like early Koontz than late Koontz, but yes there are some similarities
Less than 5 minutes in, and I feel so seen. Let me preface this by saying I don't think writers believe everything they write, and horror gets to be horrifying, but that misogyny and portrayal of women in Endless Night felt too telling.
Everyone in Endless Night sexualizes the two female characters, they sexualize themselves, and at least one of the sexualizes the other. So, when the villain does it, it feels like "join the crowd."
I will never think of Laymon without thinking about the jokes around men writing women badly. He loves to have them breast boobily. Or to have one woman -- girl, really -- notice what the recoil from a gun does to the cleavage of another woman.
Oh, and the kid who liked to stick his crotch in the main character's crotch and breathe in deeply for comfort. His family is dead -- hey, happens early on -- and his first impulse is to crotch sniff. And let's not go into when he is tempted to do the wrong thing.
Then, the bad guy does drag and sexualizes himself, and that figures.
Then, a dog rips his face open, and I really loved that part. 😐
Laymon for me has always been an uneasy blend of the enjoyable and the icky. He can write fun scenes of horror and suspense, but yeah you do feel like you’re seeing more of him on the page than you might want to
I like The Stake. Richard Laymon seemed to be in a state of sexual arrested development, with his obsession with topless women and/or submissive adult females and dominant male adolescents (Island).
Yeah he certainly had adolescent fascinations!
I used to read Laymon, not my cup of tea now. Bentley Little is much better, I have all his novels The Consultant is my favourite one. Forgot how bad Laymon was.
I've never read Little. I really should
@@CriminOllyBlog He's fantastic
I've only read his first book, The Cellar. I'm baffled it was ever published. His writing is sloppy, the story telling is lazy, and he's gleefully cruel towards women and children. I won't be reading any more from him.
Read Funland, really liked it as a younger man. After that Laymon's books seemed very formalic for me, not revisited Laymon in many years.
Read One Rainy Night when I was 15. I thought it BRILLIANT.
That is the perfect age to read Laymon!
I read The Cellar when I was 16. My parents messed up.
😂😂
I just discovered Shane Stevens (By Reason of Insanity) and came across this video. Laymon seems right up my alley. Thanks for the heads up!
Laymon is VERY different from Stevens! Stevens is great though!
I don't mind misogony in characters not rl of course, but they have to be written well. If someone is a bad writer the plot can be flawless I won't be able to read it. the first time I read his and he wrote in an entire page of screaming noises, "arghhhhh" I just lol I was done.
That's very true, good writing can make me forgive a lot of things!
Glad to find your channel today thanks to Mr Steve D. I also read Laymon and share similar opinions on his works. Now to explore more of your videos.. Its nice to discover a fellow Brit on Booktube.
I find Laymon fascinating in that he's objectively awful but lots of fun - hope you enjoy the channel!
I doubt anyone will read this but I read only one of his books. I can't really say I read it because I never finished it. The book was called a long night in October or something like that. It was really boring. The whole story was just about a college guy walking around the he town meeting few people including a weird chick who breaks in house and now and than weird shit happened. It was like there was no plot. And it was just badly written. I have to admit I was use to reading King who has things like plots and characters with depth not to mention he gives you real personal drama between said characters.
I think that was one of his last books and I don’t think it’s one I’ve read. In my experience his books quite often don’t have plots in the normal sense. And his characters are rarely fleshed out at all. I do have a fondness for his work, for all it’s flaws though.
@@CriminOllyBlog I wouldn't mind the whole plot problem if there was something interesting going on. I have read Philip K Dick and his books feel plotless often, in fact they feel like slice of life only if that life was in some nightmarish future, but he gave you something. I might try him again but I can't say I will jump to read another one pf his books.
@@stephennootens916 some of his books where he packs more action in can be fun
@@CriminOllyBlog If he is hopefully next time I spot his books it is going to be one of his better ones. Still he has to get behind Joe Hill Fireman (I have but still have not read) Bentley Little's The Store which I just started Robert McCammon's Sawn Song that might be my book for the fall and whatever King is bring out this September. That all said I will do my best to keep a open mind.
@@stephennootens916 I completely agree with your ordering!
i am fairly new to Laymon books, only having a few read. I do find his horror to be a bit over the top, and the endings to his books for the ones i have read are cringe worthy honestly lol. The Woods are Dark , I actually liked the book quite a lot, but the ending for lack of better terms, pissed me off lol I dont mid the sexual stuff because i grew up in the 80s watching horror movies and thats pretty much all they were as well , a stalker/killer after teenagers that seem to always be sexual involved at the time of their deaths lol
Yeah he definitely taps into that 80s slasher vibe! Thanks for watching, Chad!
I've only read/listened to The Woods Are Dark and Savage. I didn't mind them.
Savage I really liked
Ha! Isn't the world strange. I watched this video and not two days later came across Island, in hardback in a local charity shop. I thought long and hard about it and decided, no, I don't need that in my life, thanks Olly!
Ha! Happy to have been of service!
Excellent vid, sorry I missed it when it came out. The way that I look at it is that Laymon is the proto extreme horror writer. The idea seems to be to create the dirtiest most horrible scenario with the worst characters kinda like grim dark before grim dark. Horror movies of the time did the same. If you look at the chronology, after the satanic panic the religious/paranormal thing was overdone and there wasn't much left that could offend. In the US in particular compared with the UK and Europe sex is taboo; I think that Laymon is a product of the time in that he represents the male fantasy taken to the extreme that would have been present in such a sexually repressed middle class part of America. Also in the 80s and early 90s due to the economic problems in places like NY there was a rape and homelessness epidemic and no police to sort it etc, I think that Laymon was good at finding current the fears of middle class America and putting them into a story that is so extreme that it makes you reconsider your views/realise how narrow or wrong those view are (like describing young girls in the same way as adults etc). If you look at modern extreme horror, most is just shock value but the earlier stuff like Edward Lee's Header etc. although disgusting does start to challenge the readers views on sexuality, violence and class.
With regards to his descriptions of breasts etc. I agree it's overdone but I think that this is clever marketing more than anything. Horror at the time was pulp and the movies had scream queens that you would literally go to see just them because all the films were the same anyway; Linnea Quigley basically made a living showing her breasts (and fair play to her) and it's my opinion that Laymon's books try to be more cinematic than literary if that makes sense. If you can grab that reader looking for that kind of thing and at the same time challenge their views that's a good thing although not to everyone's taste.
I love that you had a view on his writing and yet still went back and took the time to re-read his work etc. That is something rarely seen nowadays, most youtubers just pick someone to rant about and cannot justify it whilst I agree with many of your points and they are clearly well thought out.
Overall I think that Laymon is a better short story writer as, like you said, 500+ pages of this can be a tad too much! Top vid!
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed the video. I think your take on what lead to Laymon's success is spot on - he definitely taps into the appeal of the kind of the b-movies that Linnea Quigley featured in. I'm working my way through one of his collections at the moment and agree his style suits shorter work really well.
The Island is somewhat related to the Beast house books (The Cellar, Beast House, etc)
Is it? I didn't realise that
MST3K did a Gore movie
Yeah I need to see that! I think there are two of them
Didn't MST3K do both? Loved them too, very fun, Oliver Reed was in one I think?
@@malachidrake7777 they probably did - only one was fresh in my memory - I’m sure you’re right
@@christopherrichardson2945 the good old days of MST3K!!!
Great video!
My take on Laymon:
I first read Funland years ago in my teens, barely remember it other than I didn't like it. I then read In The Dark, and liked how it started at the idea behind it, but quickly realized Laymon was more focused on sex and cheap thrills than he was plot and substance. I THEN read Dark Mountain, earlier this year, and I enjoyed it more than my previous 2 books by him, but I was also a bit put off by how much unnecessary sexual content was included and lack of a coherent story. However, there were moments where Laymon's writing really captured me, a couple of scenes in Dark Mountain, where I was just pulled into the story and felt like I was right there.
I certainly think he does have some talent as an author and I love how.fast paced his books are, generally, but I can't see myself ever becoming a fan and I've always wondered if he may have been a bit perverted or chauvinistic in real life, due to the nature of his books. I mean no disrespect to the author but I wholly agree that his obsession with the human anatomy(female, specifically) is a bit discomforting to read about, page after page.
However, I have the Traveling Vampire Show which I've heard is one of his best so I plan on giving him one last shot. I really do enjoy some aspects of his books and writing style even if I'm been mostly.letdown overall.
Thank you! I totally agree that he can be really quite good, I think the issue is that he has no filter at all, and doesn't seem to have employed an editor to temper his more ridiculous impulses. I suspect in another universe there is a Laymon who has written 5 great books rather than 30 so so ones.
Like he said we should all be ashamed of ourselves. I like the ratio by 2 bouts of shame per book.
Island, classic murder mystery unfolding with the under dog surviving with horrific things happening weighting up against his own desires. A lot to unlock there. ....
Brilliant video. I’ve only read four of of his books, one of which he wrote under the pseudonym Richard Kelly (Tread Softly) which was to be honest marginally better than the previous one I read (Bite) which was dreadful!
Ha! Thanks for watching! I think there is definitely something appealing about Laymon if you're in the right mood, even if he is pretty terrible
I've read 2 of his novels. Come out Tonight features what is arguably the dumbest female protagonist in the history of fiction.
LOL if anyone was going to win that award it would be Laymon
Have you read any David Sodergren? It's basically Laymon but infinitely better written (in my opinion) and with equality for sexes. I'd suggest The Forgotten Island or Night Shoot or Satan's Burnouts. Fun, quick, powerful. Love all of them! Love your vid, I can feel myself becoming tired of Laymon, but like you say, there is enough bizarre entertainment value for a quick read of his every now and then.
I have! Really enjoy his books - I haven't read all of them but have read the 3 you call out. In fact there's a review of Satan's Burnouts on the channel
@@CriminOllyBlog ooooh, I'll check it out! :)
This may be extremely petty of me, but I find the overuse of the word “rump” in all his works offputting and distracting.
I don’t think it’s petty at all!
This thumbnail is killing me😂
I can’t claim credit for it, a friend made it for me
His stuff is like the book equivalent of sleazy italian horrors. Very comfy.
I would love for you to do a vid on piers anthony
Laymon is one of my favorite horror authors ever. He gives people what they want and doesn’t over complicate things. If you’re triggered by him you shouldn’t be reading horror anyway.
That suggests quite a narrow view of the genre
Another great video from way back. Thanks, Olly, for your quality content!
Thank you!
I just finished Savage. I enjoyed it. It was adequate 😊 he did talk about breasts a fair bit😀 Looking at his other books, I wasn’t sure I would like them.
Ha! Yeah Savage is really pretty mild in terms of his breast obsession 😂
I remember a conversation with Laymon on the threads for the Richard Laymon Kills! site circa 1999-2000 & he was definitely a right-wing nutjob...he was pro-Reagan and thought that police powers should be expanded to allow them to get away with murder and brutality more easily and was vehemently antifeminist, pro-life and always going on about "family values" and the preservation of suburbia and the like. In a way, his books reflect his worldview: monsters constantly intruding upon white-bread lily white suburbia and the necessity of defeating them. Stephen King argued in his DANSE MACABRE that horror is a fundamentally conservative genre and Laymon is definite proof of that. He'd definitely be a MAGAT if he was around today.
FWIW his non-fiction book A WRITER'S TALE is fantastic, has great writing advice and goes into graphic detail as to why he wasn't popular in the states as he was in the UK.
I think that Laymon's publisher and editor likely forced him to include lots of the graphic sex, rape and sexually deviant psychopath characters as it was his "trademark" if you will and it's what his audience. Not saying that justifies it, but likely a factor.
Really interesting! I might have to check out that non-fiction book. Thank you!
@@CriminOllyBlog It's long out of print & hard to find but online PDFs files are out there
Laymon is a nasty treat. He has a couple of clunkers and only one book I outright HATED, which is ISLAND.
A particular favourite is IN THE DARK, which is kind of like THE DA VINCI CODE if written by the Marquis de Sade.
Yeah Island is probably my least favourite too
Sounds like proper horror. I shall read it.
Hope you enjoy him
I just read the stupidest Richard Laymon book last night. It was called The Wilds, a short novella and it was about this guy who had broken up with his girlfriend and decided to go to the wilds to do some camping. Then he is spying on women (10 per cent of the book is about descriptions of women) and a really hot one (of course) catches him and you know what he does when he gets caught? Shits and pisses himself. I am not joking. How was this published? I hated this book. I have a review on it on my channel but it has spoilers but seriously, that book sucked
Didn't realise you'd started posting videos - subscribed!
That does sound very dumb, although that's kind of the appeal of Laymon!
@@CriminOllyBlog thanks so much for subscribing, I really appreciate it. A ton! :)
Laymon is my favourite author and I read his books quite often