My Kubota dealer told me that my tractor does not have a locking differential. BX25-D. I knew differently. I had concerns that it was not always locking in. You answered the reason why in you video. Thank you.
hey Stan! Excellent documentary. I support your commitment to improving the inferiority of a standard expectancy of what a differential should be. And to all those bitching that you multi post about it. Screw them and get your design copyrighted or endorsed by manufacturer or caster. Your enthusiasm for a stronger reliable build is inspiring to many. Will continue to follow in your development Thanks
Thank you. I appreciate the support. More importantly, it would be nice if this will resonate all the way to Kubota, so future buyers of new tractors and replacement parts for existing models are provided with a simple upgrade.
Exact same situation in my tractor. Wouldn't have been able to do it without this video. I decided to just replace with facory parts though, but I now have the "old" case and collar to modify. VERY nicely done, thank you so much. I feel like I should send you a case of Molson :)
All donations graciously accepted. It pleases me when people do their own work, and appreciate the effort required to post free information for the benefit of all. I look forward to your video and information concerning your diff-lock modification process. Thank you for the comment.
@@ThisOldMan-ya472Just over 650 hours on my BX2370 (non-backhoe version). I had been using the diff lock off/on throughout the day. Clearing brush and leveling off a plot to plant grass. Also moving a large pile of wood chips that I had just finished running through the chipper. The ground was very uneven, and smeary from rain. 4WD wasn't enough, as I kept getting stuck or couldn't get the traction to scoup. I did hear a loud "clunk" noise that I suspect was the pins breaking but didn't give it much thought. It wasn't until I was mowing later that day when I noticed the wheels were sliding in my yard and leaving tracks (becasue the diff lock was still engaged). It was surprising to me just how many people experienced this same problem. I had about 5 hours disassembly and another 7 to re-assemble. Again, great video.
@bastardsbrewery9497 You didn't have heavy rear ballast? It annoys me when certain know-it-alls, including Kubota employees say this is operator error, when clearly, as in my video, the diff-lock is functionally defective.
@@ThisOldMan-ya472 I have my rear wheels filled with beet juice. I think that is supposed to add something like 100 pounds? I 100% agree with you though about it being a poor design. I showed the differential to my father in law, who owns a metal fabricating machine shop. The first thing he said was "is that all the farther the pins go in?" Not only are the pins inadequate in size, there is too much play and they don't engage the gear far enough.
Thanks - very informative - only ever use the lock when all else fails with mud (and of course the concept of using discretion in going into goopy places) - will use it very sparingly now I know what is involved in fixing it. Great video to show what is involved in getting the body work off too!
Thank you. I was frustrated that much of this information was not available when I first tackled the diff-lock, so assumed by the response, others also appreciate the knowledge. Kubota isn't willing to share information as it might cut into their Dealer profits? I would think if consumers have appropriate information, they are happier, and it is easier to swallow the huge bill when having their Dealer do the work.
Thank you for sharing. I am going through this failure now. I wish Kubota would at least cover the parts. This is a big hit to my very small business at a bad time with our economy.
I assume you are having the Dealer do the repairs? It would be interesting for you to view my other videos, where I modify the differential lock. A machine shop should be able to copy my process to increase the locking pin size, if the diff-lock is something you need. Increasing the pin size by 2mm increases the strength by 40%.
@@ThisOldMan-ya472 I have a BX 23S and was watching another channel with the same Tractor. Unfortunately his diff lock went out and I was curious to see how to fix.
I was dumb and did not use a puller, as I don't think I have one that would fit, and I didn't think of it. I first tried hammering on the shaft(very dumb) then I used an air hammer to push the lever off. Dumb, but it worked. I has to reweld the arm because it was damaged so bad. Sometimes, my ideas are not the smartest, but I keep trying better. lol.
The B series is a larger tractor than the BX, so I have no experience. However, I might guess the HST is the same, at least the differential carrier is, I believe, and I would assume the case is aluminum. Messicks has a website and parts lists, so if you explore that, maybe you will get a better idea. You could also phone a Dealer to get clarification?
If the differential carrier is the same as the BX, I imagine, depending on the location of the crack, that perhaps the differential lock shattered and caused this issue?
Thank you for the acknowledgement. Even if people do not attempt repairs, I am hoping they understand the complex process to pulling the BX apart and see for themselves what is inside. I will be starting repair and modifications soon and hope to post those videos.
I would have taken it to a machinist and had them make 2 to 4 more pin holes, ordered billet pins ( they are harder than hardend pins, right?) and be done. doing that once is bad enough, but, twice????
What you mention was seriously considered, and then discounted. First, more holes would weaken the differential carrier. Second, harder pins would be more brittle. Grade 8 bolts are considered stronger than grade 5, but are not useful in certain situations where there is shock loads. Grade 8 bolts will snap, where Grade 5 can handle more impact because the metal is more elastic. Consider what I either said or explained; the four 10 mm pins are almost functional, but in cross-sectional area and strength, the 12 mm pins are 40% stronger and more durable, and require minimal modification to the stock parts.
The first failure was fixed with stock factory parts at 1500 hours. The second failure of stock factory parts motivated me to find a way to improve on the existing system. Engaging the diff-lock is only about10% cause of failure, and DIS-ENGAGEMNT or lack of fast and smooth operation is cause for the other 90%. I now have added 550 hours after the diff-lock modification, and it is still working perfectly and used extensively. As I also explained, most operators and Kubota Dealer employees DO NOT KNOW how to properly use the BX diff-lock.
I would believe Kubota is quite aware of the design shortcomings, but production costs must be maintained. It frustrates me though, that Kubota has had ample opportunity to remedy this little issue with the BX23s, but did not. Perhaps they do not realize increasing the pin diameter by 2mm is all it would take???????
This is why I blocked mine so it can not be activated at all ! It’s not worth the risk to use the diff lock. Use the front wheel drive and if that doesn’t work get someone to pull the tractor out. Much cheaper than repairing the transmission !
Why I stay away from kubota! I really try to stay away from all new tractors. They are over complicated and the weakest things go and break. I buy simple, old tractors. The old hydrostatic transmissions are really good. Especially my sundstrand in my IH. The new ones are cool but they just don’t last nearly as long as the old ones do.
Well, I understand your point, however all the old tractors that did not last, have been recycled, and the new tractors have not been around as long to prove that 10 of 1000 will last a long long time. :-)
@@pauldecker9797 Mine broke twice, so the third time, I posted videos where I installed 12mm pins in place of the 10mm pins. The 12mm pins provide 44% larger cross-section area, so I am more confident they will operate smoother and last 'forever'. The new pins were also 4mm longer, which seat better. I also spent time cleaning up the machining on the engaging shaft mechanism, which is also in the videos. I also made a pedal stop to take the abuse of pressing down with the heel, so the engaging shaft would not. Also in videos.
@@pauldecker9797 Facebook has two popular Kubota BX Forums if you did not know. What model is your tractor, and what do you think caused the failure? If you document your progress and post in the Forums, it would be appreciated.
My Kubota dealer told me that my tractor does not have a locking differential. BX25-D. I knew differently. I had concerns that it was not always locking in. You answered the reason why in you video. Thank you.
Awesome. Thanks for the feedback.
hey Stan! Excellent documentary. I support your commitment to improving the inferiority of a standard expectancy of what a differential should be.
And to all those bitching that you multi post about it. Screw them and get your design copyrighted or endorsed by manufacturer or caster. Your enthusiasm for a stronger reliable build is inspiring to many. Will continue to follow in your development
Thanks
Thank you. I appreciate the support. More importantly, it would be nice if this will resonate all the way to Kubota, so future buyers of new tractors and replacement parts for existing models are provided with a simple upgrade.
Exact same situation in my tractor. Wouldn't have been able to do it without this video. I decided to just replace with facory parts though, but I now have the "old" case and collar to modify. VERY nicely done, thank you so much. I feel like I should send you a case of Molson :)
All donations graciously accepted. It pleases me when people do their own work, and appreciate the effort required to post free information for the benefit of all. I look forward to your video and information concerning your diff-lock modification process. Thank you for the comment.
How many hours on your machine and what do you anticipate caused the failure?
@@ThisOldMan-ya472Just over 650 hours on my BX2370 (non-backhoe version). I had been using the diff lock off/on throughout the day. Clearing brush and leveling off a plot to plant grass. Also moving a large pile of wood chips that I had just finished running through the chipper. The ground was very uneven, and smeary from rain. 4WD wasn't enough, as I kept getting stuck or couldn't get the traction to scoup. I did hear a loud "clunk" noise that I suspect was the pins breaking but didn't give it much thought. It wasn't until I was mowing later that day when I noticed the wheels were sliding in my yard and leaving tracks (becasue the diff lock was still engaged). It was surprising to me just how many people experienced this same problem. I had about 5 hours disassembly and another 7 to re-assemble. Again, great video.
@bastardsbrewery9497 You didn't have heavy rear ballast? It annoys me when certain know-it-alls, including Kubota employees say this is operator error, when clearly, as in my video, the diff-lock is functionally defective.
@@ThisOldMan-ya472 I have my rear wheels filled with beet juice. I think that is supposed to add something like 100 pounds? I 100% agree with you though about it being a poor design. I showed the differential to my father in law, who owns a metal fabricating machine shop. The first thing he said was "is that all the farther the pins go in?" Not only are the pins inadequate in size, there is too much play and they don't engage the gear far enough.
Thanks - very informative - only ever use the lock when all else fails with mud (and of course the concept of using discretion in going into goopy places) - will use it very sparingly now I know what is involved in fixing it. Great video to show what is involved in getting the body work off too!
Thank you. I was frustrated that much of this information was not available when I first tackled the diff-lock, so assumed by the response, others also appreciate the knowledge. Kubota isn't willing to share information as it might cut into their Dealer profits? I would think if consumers have appropriate information, they are happier, and it is easier to swallow the huge bill when having their Dealer do the work.
thanks for documenting and sharing this. much respect to you for doing that.
Thank you for the support dave.
Thank you for sharing. I am going through this failure now. I wish Kubota would at least cover the parts. This is a big hit to my very small business at a bad time with our economy.
I assume you are having the Dealer do the repairs? It would be interesting for you to view my other videos, where I modify the differential lock. A machine shop should be able to copy my process to increase the locking pin size, if the diff-lock is something you need. Increasing the pin size by 2mm increases the strength by 40%.
Great job,and great video!👍🏻
Thank you. And thank you for your comment. What are you doing that brought you to view this video?
@@ThisOldMan-ya472 I have a BX 23S and was watching another channel with the same Tractor. Unfortunately his diff lock went out and I was curious to see how to fix.
@@jamesharless5357 You might want to check out my Modify Differential Lock video too.
@@ThisOldMan-ya472 I definitely will! Thanks!👍🏻
Good info! Thanks for sharing!
Thank you for watching. I am hoping this will help other BX owners.
What kind of puller did you use to get the DIF Lock Lever off? Thanks.
I was dumb and did not use a puller, as I don't think I have one that would fit, and I didn't think of it. I first tried hammering on the shaft(very dumb) then I used an air hammer to push the lever off. Dumb, but it worked. I has to reweld the arm because it was damaged so bad. Sometimes, my ideas are not the smartest, but I keep trying better. lol.
Is the rearend housing aluminum? Going to pu a b7800 with a cracked housing
The B series is a larger tractor than the BX, so I have no experience. However, I might guess the HST is the same, at least the differential carrier is, I believe, and I would assume the case is aluminum. Messicks has a website and parts lists, so if you explore that, maybe you will get a better idea. You could also phone a Dealer to get clarification?
If the differential carrier is the same as the BX, I imagine, depending on the location of the crack, that perhaps the differential lock shattered and caused this issue?
Stan ! Where did you disappear too?
I exited Facebook for a few months to clear two accounts, and finally restarted a new Facebook, nice and fresh. I joined the Ai2 (?) BX forum.
@ good Stan glad you are alive and kicking
Had me worried
Thank you so much for sharing this.
Thank you for the acknowledgement. Even if people do not attempt repairs, I am hoping they understand the complex process to pulling the BX apart and see for themselves what is inside. I will be starting repair and modifications soon and hope to post those videos.
I would have taken it to a machinist and had them make 2 to 4 more pin holes, ordered billet pins ( they are harder than hardend pins, right?) and be done. doing that once is bad enough, but, twice????
What you mention was seriously considered, and then discounted. First, more holes would weaken the differential carrier. Second, harder pins would be more brittle. Grade 8 bolts are considered stronger than grade 5, but are not useful in certain situations where there is shock loads. Grade 8 bolts will snap, where Grade 5 can handle more impact because the metal is more elastic. Consider what I either said or explained; the four 10 mm pins are almost functional, but in cross-sectional area and strength, the 12 mm pins are 40% stronger and more durable, and require minimal modification to the stock parts.
The first failure was fixed with stock factory parts at 1500 hours. The second failure of stock factory parts motivated me to find a way to improve on the existing system. Engaging the diff-lock is only about10% cause of failure, and DIS-ENGAGEMNT or lack of fast and smooth operation is cause for the other 90%. I now have added 550 hours after the diff-lock modification, and it is still working perfectly and used extensively. As I also explained, most operators and Kubota Dealer employees DO NOT KNOW how to properly use the BX diff-lock.
Wow, at 21 min. Never expected that weak design. Hope you send the end of this vid to kub corporate.
I would believe Kubota is quite aware of the design shortcomings, but production costs must be maintained. It frustrates me though, that Kubota has had ample opportunity to remedy this little issue with the BX23s, but did not. Perhaps they do not realize increasing the pin diameter by 2mm is all it would take???????
This is why I blocked mine so it can not be activated at all ! It’s not worth the risk to use the diff lock. Use the front wheel drive and if that doesn’t work get someone to pull the tractor out. Much cheaper than repairing the transmission !
Yes, it is an expensive risk. Even worse, the replacement parts are not an improvement. Both the pins and collar are just mild steel, easily filed.
Crappy design for sure. I have a BX23S and I avoid using the diff lock and to date have not had to use it. 4wd has been enough so far...........
Each operator has their own needs. Hopefully your machine accomplishes everything you ask of it.
Why I stay away from kubota!
I really try to stay away from all new tractors. They are over complicated and the weakest things go and break. I buy simple, old tractors. The old hydrostatic transmissions are really good. Especially my sundstrand in my IH. The new ones are cool but they just don’t last nearly as long as the old ones do.
Well, I understand your point, however all the old tractors that did not last, have been recycled, and the new tractors have not been around as long to prove that 10 of 1000 will last a long long time. :-)
Just broke mine.
Ohh no. :-(
Thanks for documenting it. About how many hours did it take?
@@pauldecker9797 I spent a lot of time cleaning and exploring, but others have done it in about 8 -10 hours.
@@pauldecker9797 Mine broke twice, so the third time, I posted videos where I installed 12mm pins in place of the 10mm pins. The 12mm pins provide 44% larger cross-section area, so I am more confident they will operate smoother and last 'forever'. The new pins were also 4mm longer, which seat better. I also spent time cleaning up the machining on the engaging shaft mechanism, which is also in the videos. I also made a pedal stop to take the abuse of pressing down with the heel, so the engaging shaft would not. Also in videos.
@@pauldecker9797 Facebook has two popular Kubota BX Forums if you did not know. What model is your tractor, and what do you think caused the failure? If you document your progress and post in the Forums, it would be appreciated.