Apparently, Wolverine does "% of max HP" damage with his basic attacks on top of a flat damage. So a target with more max HP takes more damage than one with lower max HP. Which means Vanguards who have tons of health, get shredded HARD by Wolverine. It's no joke how quickly you can burn through their HP if done right. Go in, use your charge/leap to grab the tank and pull them back to your team or behind something so they can't be healed, then attack. It is obscene how quick you can burn through those tanks. Wolverine is to tanks what Black Panther is to healers.
@@louisalex98No, most people understand that, it’s just not that impressive compared to how bad he is against everyone else, and even within the category of tanks he’s supposed to beat, there are some that counter him.
map design also plays a part, there are plenty of nooks and crannies, and choke points and melee accessible high ground that makes it possible for melee heros/villains to stay out of view or behind cover until they want to engage or disengage that limits ranged options to either respond or gain the advantage when the area isn't wide open and they can't shoot their opponent down b4 they reach them Melee options becomes a lot more viable when you can hide around the right corner and jump someone i'd argue while none of the melee characters NEED more than numeric adjustments, they might appreciate some QoL mechanica adjustments But a hero who NEEDS mechanical adjustments is Storm, regardless of where they wanted her to end up too many aspects of her kit are in contraction with each other meaning she PAYS for power she cannot always use or fully optimize.
Add to that destroyable terrain, allowing you to (for example) deny enemy their high ground, or to punch your way trough a wall to ambush the enemy. opens up possibilities.
they really need to buff wolverine, man. maybe giving him a bleeding effect on his attacks when he is at his full rage meter would be pretty nice. an actual healing factor would do wonders as well.
The way to fix Wolverine is changing him into a vanguard. Give him more HP, slightly reduce the damage%, increase flat DMG and adjust his damage reduction skill. Wolverine isn't a character that attacks from behind, he throws himself into the battle head first - they should allow him to do that
I would say it's a bit more. Mobility plays a part. But so does map design. It needs verticality for that mobility to be interesting and require skill. Additionally, a lot of the melee characters have some way to reduce or negate damage in their own way. Captain America has a shield that can reflect projectiles. Hulk has a team wide barrier that grants him ultimate charge. Venom has a self barrier that is bigger the more he is hurt. Thor gains a barrier whenever he uses an ability that uses his Thorforce. Iron Fist has a short window of damage negation that grants him a larger shield the more damage he blocked. Magik is invulnerable during her portal dash and gains shields when she hits people. Black Panther has higher than average duelist health, and gains a barrier every time he uses his dash through a marked target. Wolverine has higher than average duelist health, a damage reducing ability, and one that basically lets him instantly resurrect if he dies while it's available, gaining more shields the more rage he has. Pretty much only Spider-man doesn't, and he's the most mobile character in the game. I would argue that Deadlock gets a lot of this right also, giving a lot of mobility through stamina and wall jumps, and highly vertical maps. But as a game that relies on item building, it's the player's decision to make their character more mobile, or stronger in melee. Most characters can be built melee, so that's interesting, but because it's more based on the items there's a bit less uniqueness to the melee combat. Though the parry system is pretty cool.
trust me, i do not mean to undervalue rest of character's kits, i know they make a difference, just not as big of a difference as mobility does. And also I'm living room for deeper dives into specific kits if people are interested to see such content.
The problem with rpg shooters is that must of their characters are meant to be played the same: Stay Behind and shoot. So anyone with a dash in those games is nerfed to the ground as just a handful of their roster got movility. However, in Marvel Rivals, things are MEANT to be more aggressive and fast passed. Besides, a quarter of their heroes are divers, so defensive comps are much more manageable. (Double barrier/GOATS meta ptsd)
I’m still not really sure how you’re supposed to break a strange + peni comp though especially if they have heroes that can put out serious damage behind them like Hawkeye.
I agree, the game balery having any typical guns makes it more interesting, as a reinhard main capitan america feels incredibly good to play, for as much i hate marvel slop this game is really good
Great video, especially agree with your take on temporary stat buffs for the season particularly on tanks. As a tank player, I don't think they all necessarily need buffs, I think they just don't feel satisfying to play because of how broken healers are. We don't put out the damage to kill anything, unless an ult is being used to make a play tanks just feel like meat shields.
While I agree with most of what was said, I still think some Tacticians need more ways to FORCE a melee unit off of them with no counterplay on the melees part. As it stands playing healer sucks as bad as OW because most melees can combo you from full HP to dead or if they whiff part of the combo chase you down with no possible counterplay since they have better mobility, damage, and for some odd reason many have better sustain. Personally I think some Tacticians need to function as anti-flankers on a pre nerf Briggitte level. and to stop the Super agressive people from playing these champs as flankers, make it so the hard CC and bonus damage only applies on your side of the payload/objective
Rivals is giving overwatch players what blizzard never offered and its pure insanity they really took their time well as old publisher of blizzard in CN before blizzard cut their ties in 2022 (and microsoft forced blizzard to fix the ties in 2024)
I wish they'd make Wolverine a tank that could deal damage well rather than a DPS that sometimes has an ok self heal, hell Iron Fist does what Wolverine should be doing lol
@@stephanfouche9208 i know everyone wants this but i feel like it would either just be too good or do nothing depending on the situation and he should maybe just get a low healing per second but the number would need to be tweaked a lot to be balanced probably, maybe it increases based on how many enemies are near or allies that are dead
@@halcyonrain2209 Just tell yourself that 2025 is the year of GW2, and you'll be fine. When the year is approaching its end, remember to begin hyping 2026 as the year of GW2.
I assure you, none of those games you mentioned have escaped my attention. I was just positively suprised this game managed to actually desighn melee heroes this well day one.
@@captaincrapface7337 Oh yeah, I'm a little shocked that the marvel slop game is actually enjoyable this time. I just wanted to put more stuff on your radar that I personally really enjoy and by keeping a diverse list of games on my dish I can stop being mad at guild wars 2 all the time and instead be mad at multiple diverse genres at once!
Iron Fist is not the entire lineup bro. Go try getting a kill on Spiderman or Black Panther, and see if its easier then clicking on someone twice as Hela.
@@captaincrapface7337 Black Panther basic kit is literally Genji ultimate, must be so hard to play lmao, especially when you can sneak behind anyone because game has no footsteps audio
@@Turned2Ice except you don't have deflect or any other defensive skill. Assists or primary fire kills don't give you restets. You don't have 2-shot damage to begin with and need 2 resets to kill squeeshiest character in the game - even if they aren't being supported. You can kill enemies faster by clicking people's heads twice (or once) lol, while never leaving safe cozy spot in the middle of your team, while EVERY mele character needs to risk death to deal damage in the first place, let alone get a single kill, by putting themselves grosely out of position.
most of clunkyness i expierienced was fully fixed by turning off all settings ment to "help" player, like "Easy Swing". Hit the settings, mess with them and see if it helps. - it did the trick for me.
@@captaincrapface7337 it legit looks like a mobile game. all net ease makes is mobile games. the honeymoon phase is gonna wear off fast with this game. it's clunky, unpolished, and the movement isn't good.
All that you said applies to Iron Fist, that I'll agree with. To say that all mele characters are desighned poorely, we do not have either evidence of any mele character being mechanically or desighn-wise mismanaged. Most have steeper learning curve than ranged DPS, and are more difficult to stick their damage in - especially mele vanguards, and there is some clunkyness spread around the nine of them. But it would be great exageration to say that either of mele characters is desighned worse than Hela. (Excluding Iron Fist - fuck Iron Fist)
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Finally a hero shooter that lets me shoot a Hero
*Yeets Wolverine*
Apparently, Wolverine does "% of max HP" damage with his basic attacks on top of a flat damage. So a target with more max HP takes more damage than one with lower max HP. Which means Vanguards who have tons of health, get shredded HARD by Wolverine.
It's no joke how quickly you can burn through their HP if done right. Go in, use your charge/leap to grab the tank and pull them back to your team or behind something so they can't be healed, then attack. It is obscene how quick you can burn through those tanks.
Wolverine is to tanks what Black Panther is to healers.
shame he still kinda sucks despite that
Too bad punisher, bucky, hela and hawkeye shred tanks better
Yeah, that's something pretty good that most people do not understand
@@louisalex98No, most people understand that, it’s just not that impressive compared to how bad he is against everyone else, and even within the category of tanks he’s supposed to beat, there are some that counter him.
@LeemVonNelly yeah his leap is impossible to hit on anything other than tanks
Range advantage loses meaning when every character has a button to skip through it 🗣
Good snipers find good Sniper perches and relocate after killing
They don't though.
It often takes skill to get in.
And many ranged characters have mobility also.
It's funny becuase netease is also behind Naraka a melee fighter BR with really hard techs.
map design also plays a part,
there are plenty of nooks and crannies, and choke points and melee accessible high ground that makes it possible for melee heros/villains to stay out of view or behind cover until they want to engage or disengage
that limits ranged options to either respond or gain the advantage when the area isn't wide open and they can't shoot their opponent down b4 they reach them
Melee options becomes a lot more viable when you can hide around the right corner and jump someone
i'd argue while none of the melee characters NEED more than numeric adjustments, they might appreciate some QoL mechanica adjustments
But a hero who NEEDS mechanical adjustments is Storm, regardless of where they wanted her to end up too many aspects of her kit are in contraction with each other meaning she PAYS for power she cannot always use or fully optimize.
Add to that destroyable terrain, allowing you to (for example) deny enemy their high ground, or to punch your way trough a wall to ambush the enemy.
opens up possibilities.
Marvel Rivals with the homies and Path of Exile for the fantasy itch and nice atmosphere have made me appreciate something more than the usual.
1:04 “which pulled me in for obvious reasons” “Piss” 😂😂
they really need to buff wolverine, man. maybe giving him a bleeding effect on his attacks when he is at his full rage meter would be pretty nice. an actual healing factor would do wonders as well.
The way to fix Wolverine is changing him into a vanguard.
Give him more HP, slightly reduce the damage%, increase flat DMG and adjust his damage reduction skill. Wolverine isn't a character that attacks from behind, he throws himself into the battle head first - they should allow him to do that
Just increase his leap hitbox. Making him a tank would make him terrible
@krazanas Noone in the game can just rush and 1v6. Him being able to hunt someone and separate them and kill them is cool
It's rare that a Timmy speaks sense. He's right.
@@krazanas just buffing his overall damage a lot would be enough, i think his playstyle is good as it is, they just need to make him do more damage.
I just like how all the melee characters have unique strengths and weaknesses and counterplay and dont feel like punchy guy #4.
I would say it's a bit more.
Mobility plays a part.
But so does map design. It needs verticality for that mobility to be interesting and require skill.
Additionally, a lot of the melee characters have some way to reduce or negate damage in their own way.
Captain America has a shield that can reflect projectiles.
Hulk has a team wide barrier that grants him ultimate charge.
Venom has a self barrier that is bigger the more he is hurt.
Thor gains a barrier whenever he uses an ability that uses his Thorforce.
Iron Fist has a short window of damage negation that grants him a larger shield the more damage he blocked.
Magik is invulnerable during her portal dash and gains shields when she hits people.
Black Panther has higher than average duelist health, and gains a barrier every time he uses his dash through a marked target.
Wolverine has higher than average duelist health, a damage reducing ability, and one that basically lets him instantly resurrect if he dies while it's available, gaining more shields the more rage he has.
Pretty much only Spider-man doesn't, and he's the most mobile character in the game.
I would argue that Deadlock gets a lot of this right also, giving a lot of mobility through stamina and wall jumps, and highly vertical maps.
But as a game that relies on item building, it's the player's decision to make their character more mobile, or stronger in melee.
Most characters can be built melee, so that's interesting, but because it's more based on the items there's a bit less uniqueness to the melee combat.
Though the parry system is pretty cool.
trust me, i do not mean to undervalue rest of character's kits, i know they make a difference, just not as big of a difference as mobility does.
And also I'm living room for deeper dives into specific kits if people are interested to see such content.
The divinity music made me a little emotional, i see you brother
The problem with rpg shooters is that must of their characters are meant to be played the same: Stay Behind and shoot.
So anyone with a dash in those games is nerfed to the ground as just a handful of their roster got movility.
However, in Marvel Rivals, things are MEANT to be more aggressive and fast passed. Besides, a quarter of their heroes are divers, so defensive comps are much more manageable. (Double barrier/GOATS meta ptsd)
I’m still not really sure how you’re supposed to break a strange + peni comp though especially if they have heroes that can put out serious damage behind them like Hawkeye.
@elfireii328 Psylocke
I agree, the game balery having any typical guns makes it more interesting, as a reinhard main capitan america feels incredibly good to play, for as much i hate marvel slop this game is really good
Most of the Marvel stuff is good though.
@@kamikeserpentail3778 current MCU give Marvel a bad name
@@kamikeserpentail3778 that could be true , i am just not into it.
manlet missile is crazy 😭
If you are an old meleeheaded Vidmaster like me, you're gonna love The Finals.
What tremendous, intelligent analysis and thoughtful praise this is! Man, if I had more money than rent, I'd give it to you
I think tf2's melle sistem is also pretty good. It gives chance to everyone
yes, random chance XD
Hurray for viable melee!!
Bro, Gigantic is right there
Great video, especially agree with your take on temporary stat buffs for the season particularly on tanks. As a tank player, I don't think they all necessarily need buffs, I think they just don't feel satisfying to play because of how broken healers are. We don't put out the damage to kill anything, unless an ult is being used to make a play tanks just feel like meat shields.
While I agree with most of what was said, I still think some Tacticians need more ways to FORCE a melee unit off of them with no counterplay on the melees part. As it stands playing healer sucks as bad as OW because most melees can combo you from full HP to dead or if they whiff part of the combo chase you down with no possible counterplay since they have better mobility, damage, and for some odd reason many have better sustain. Personally I think some Tacticians need to function as anti-flankers on a pre nerf Briggitte level. and to stop the Super agressive people from playing these champs as flankers, make it so the hard CC and bonus damage only applies on your side of the payload/objective
Manlet Missile 🚀
I FUCKING LOVE RIVELLON
Im just surprised you arent dying every 2 seconds
I'am just not in game.
Croissant
Rivals is giving overwatch players what blizzard never offered
and its pure insanity
they really took their time well as old publisher of blizzard in CN before blizzard cut their ties in 2022
(and microsoft forced blizzard to fix the ties in 2024)
I wish they'd make Wolverine a tank that could deal damage well rather than a DPS that sometimes has an ok self heal, hell Iron Fist does what Wolverine should be doing lol
They should make his hp heal back after a few seconds of not taking damage back to full
Nah Wolverine isn't techincally supposed to be doing what Iron Fist does, because Wolverine is made to dismantle frontlines and shred tanks
Iron fist is severely overtuned, he's the best melee in the game by miles.
@@stephanfouche9208 i know everyone wants this but i feel like it would either just be too good or do nothing depending on the situation and he should maybe just get a low healing per second but the number would need to be tweaked a lot to be balanced probably, maybe it increases based on how many enemies are near or allies that are dead
Rip Titanfall 2
Now imagine being one of those 1 game andys that play nothing but gw2. Misery.
HELP ME, I CAN'T ESCAPE
@@halcyonrain2209 Just tell yourself that 2025 is the year of GW2, and you'll be fine. When the year is approaching its end, remember to begin hyping 2026 as the year of GW2.
If you like decent melee I'd recommend vermintide 2 and darktide.
Maybe mordhau if you want PvP and can cope with the brainrot of its playerbase.
I assure you, none of those games you mentioned have escaped my attention.
I was just positively suprised this game managed to actually desighn melee heroes this well day one.
@@captaincrapface7337 Oh yeah, I'm a little shocked that the marvel slop game is actually enjoyable this time.
I just wanted to put more stuff on your radar that I personally really enjoy and by keeping a diverse list of games on my dish I can stop being mad at guild wars 2 all the time and instead be mad at multiple diverse genres at once!
@@rain8478 "(...)be mad at multiple diverse genres at once!" - Based
idk, melee seems kinda weak in rivals
sounds like a skill issue
Anti spiral
Lol looks like the devs finally fixed gw2 😂
I cannot deny, I enjoyed my pvp expierience this week XD
tldr: finally a "shooter" where melees more braindead easy to play than ever in history
Iron Fist is not the entire lineup bro.
Go try getting a kill on Spiderman or Black Panther, and see if its easier then clicking on someone twice as Hela.
@@captaincrapface7337 Black Panther basic kit is literally Genji ultimate, must be so hard to play lmao, especially when you can sneak behind anyone because game has no footsteps audio
@@Turned2Ice except you don't have deflect or any other defensive skill.
Assists or primary fire kills don't give you restets.
You don't have 2-shot damage to begin with and need 2 resets to kill squeeshiest character in the game - even if they aren't being supported.
You can kill enemies faster by clicking people's heads twice (or once) lol, while never leaving safe cozy spot in the middle of your team, while EVERY mele character needs to risk death to deal damage in the first place, let alone get a single kill, by putting themselves grosely out of position.
bro this game is clunky.
most of clunkyness i expierienced was fully fixed by turning off all settings ment to "help" player, like "Easy Swing".
Hit the settings, mess with them and see if it helps. - it did the trick for me.
@@captaincrapface7337 I did. game just feels like a mobile game.
@@imanoobtuber ok, now you lost me.
No idea what you mean by that.
@@captaincrapface7337haters come with any game just gotta laugh and move 😂 mobile game is crazy
@@captaincrapface7337 it legit looks like a mobile game. all net ease makes is mobile games. the honeymoon phase is gonna wear off fast with this game.
it's clunky, unpolished, and the movement isn't good.
Melee characters are terrible they're designed poorly for anyone except the lowest ranks. But do go off with the video lol
All that you said applies to Iron Fist, that I'll agree with.
To say that all mele characters are desighned poorely, we do not have either evidence of any mele character being mechanically or desighn-wise mismanaged.
Most have steeper learning curve than ranged DPS, and are more difficult to stick their damage in - especially mele vanguards, and there is some clunkyness spread around the nine of them.
But it would be great exageration to say that either of mele characters is desighned worse than Hela. (Excluding Iron Fist - fuck Iron Fist)
Bro, Gigantic is right there
bro...
steamdb.info/app/1924490/charts/
I was there when it died, both times T_T